Proceeds back to the texas book festival. That fun not only this festival but our Texas Library grants which helps rural libraries in texas cities. Also, for a very limited time your local library is running a great promotion, free books. So i encourage you to take advantage of that. And then they also help us with raeing rock stars, a program where we go to inner city schools, have authors read their students and then give the student their hard copy of their book which is often the only book in the childs household. Thank you again for coming. Let me introduce to my left, an lees vans, at Bloomberg Business week and in the author of the opea elon muck, tesla spacex and the quest for a fantastic future and to his left, kevin ashton, cofounder over the auto i. D. Center at m. I. T. , and perhaps most notably moan for coining the term the internet of thing. A book holiday how to fly how to fly a horse. Join me in welcoming both gentlemen. [applause] kevin, your book, the photograph fast start widths as all Great Stories do, the story of map named wolfgang. And this case, though, mozart, not myself. The book beef weaves the historical and contemporary tales of innovation, and guy that sense how important setbacks and difficulties were to these folks. Could we at least start with what is the inspiration for the book originally . Well, so i found myself at m. I. T. Through a very kind of random path, actually. I studied scandinavian studies at university. I know how to reibsen 19th 19th century norwegian. I was hired by Procter Gamble and then found myself at m. I. T. So i felt like a complete fraud, but a i was leading a group of amazing, creative people, and i assumed i guess as many people do, they were kind of having ideas in the bathtub and things were coming to them spontaneously, and all my ideas were the rule of trying and failing and trying and failing. So i felt like a fraud when i first got there it was about the same time that everyone was getting into harry potter, actually, that i kind of felt luke i was a hogwart except i wasnt a wizard. Then i realized they w. Doing any magic. They were actually better at it than i was but they were also trying and failing and going through steps. And then they started asking me to talk about their Creative Process and how to innovate because i was leading something that m. I. T. , and so i started telling the story about how i wasnt magic, it was work, and that really resonated, and eventually someone said you have to write a book and thats the book. Very good. Very substantial. And the book covers brilliantly many of the historical thinks when you think of innovation, mozart, galileo, the muppets, which i did not see coming but what a happy accident. You weave so many different the all have a dissimilar arc and narrative. How did the muppets in there and you were able to draw on so many sources. How did you decide what to grab and what to leave in the cloud . So, the big point here is that the way human beings create is basically the same no matter what theyre creating. I talk about mozart in the book, the way you create a piece of Classical Music if youre mozart is not that different than creating bert and ernie if youre jim henson and bert laws. So youre looking at apparently different creative works. I think i was able to show the fundamental process of creation is the same no, matter what the discipline. And the stories were some cases one had already heard, ones i was curious about, and a lot of the book is about one thing leading to another, and also how i came across in some of these stories. Any of your own personal background or experience that mirrors or matches that. My experience is very mitch dish reads book about what people call creativity, which is not a word i like to use. S a younger man. And bought into this myth of genius and solving problems without really thinking about them, and ahha moments. And then for experience, thats not how it works and that forms the book. And the thinkers and creative innovator toes we think of, this goes back 50,000 years and evolution and ban to evolve. How did you draw on that not . Did you go through an anthropology track . Thats something that really intrigued me, is human evolution. Its incredibly relevant to the process of creating. This is not something we hear often enough, but the thing that makes us unique as human beings is that we have the ability to improve our in our own lifetime. If you look at a birds nest today and a birds nest from 20,000 years ago, it will be exactly the same. There isnt a meeting going on right now where theres a bird in a black turtleneck striding around on a stage, unveiling bird nest 6. 0, its thinner and faster and has a bigger screen. So there are quite a few animals that use tools and were discovering more all the time. The difference between us and them is their tools are the products of instinct, and so as their tools change, they change as result of evolution. Now, human beings have this unique capability to manipulate symbols. Im doing it right now. Right . So are you. Im using language. The interesting thing about language, bit the way, is it a actually not prime primarily for speak budget for thinking. We have this ability to imagine and represent things symbolically, to manipulate those symbols, and then consider what might happen if we put these two things together before we do it. That is creating. So, the ability to be creative is uniquely and inflately human. We have all it. Which is innately human, which we wall have it which is why we became a successful species in the space of 150,000 years, when humans started displaying this symbolic language, we all have the his innate ability to be creative. Now, its not equal in everybody. But it is present in everybody, and the way we do it is basically the same no matter who we are. Made me think of the biologist that said something to the effect, im not into much disturbed by the harm and violence man has visited upon himself over the years but how many geniuses and Creative Brains were lost in those processes during whether it was genocide, slavery, how many had it in their blood or never got the opportunity. You touch on that. The spark is not so much being born with the genius, its the process of overcoming adversity, of dealing with setbacks, believing in themselves, innovation and support systems and that seems to be prevalent theme. This is fundamentally important, and its worse than that in a way. Everybody can create. I dont care if youre male, female, black, white, straight, gay, whatever, you have this innate ability to be creative, and as a species, we depend on our creative ability, all of our creative abilities to survive and thrive. And right now we live in this society which has this mess of genius, which is generally code for a white man, and we have other people with creative able whoing being oppressed and by oppressing them were ditch minimum issuing our own potential as a species. So its important to wreck fries creativity in everybody and tournure temperature that because we all benefit from it ultimately. In your opinion, what are ways we can do that . Sort of get more societal and political. We have to get rid of this myth of the creative genius. The unicorn. And you see it. Actually this book is excellent about elon musk, and you see it there. You have ostensibly a book about one guy who is achieving incredible things but there are tens of thousands of people working with him, and he may be the most important among them but he is nothing without them. And so my crusade is really to have us all recognize our own humanity and our own potential and help one another develop that. That is how we slay the myth of the one like i who is the genius who can do something we cant do. Just not true. Well said. Well, mozart and muppets i smell sitcom. I do. I also forgot to mention kevin is native now lives in austin. Spends most of his time driving up and down the road to make it more crowded. Youre here and out of curiosity, what it keeping you busy. Im writing my next book. I have interest in a few austin based companies, and i travel the world speaking. I just got back from monte carlo, which was lovely, but its good to be home. I had a great time and living the austin dream. If youre not from here, im supposed to tell you to go home, but actually i welcome you and want you to stay. This is one of the best places on earth. Well said. Shameless plug for austin. I want to move on the elon musk and i will confess i do have man crush on elon, and he is actually has intent a few number of hours in the Texas Capitol lobbying for removal its cspan, it political ashlee has some ties to texas so well give him some street correct. This book is a fax, the only real in depth look at elon musk that elon permitted, or maybe it was follow per met mitted. Well find out movement a fantastic read into elon and his background and a biography but touches on the entire innovation process and what he sees sees for our future and a lot our future will be rick indicated by this guy, and to kevins point another rich white guy, but i he is special. Ashlee, start with a cliche question, what was the inspiration or the impetus for riding the book. Sure, well, been a Technology Reporter in Silicon Valley for 15 years now, and in a lot of ways this would have been a really unlikely book for me to do. Elon was never a guy i was that interested in. He seemed like i have had these beat company is would cover regularly, and elon seemed to me lick the guy who was frankly sort of a blow hard in Silicon Valley. He would also promise fantastic things and they auld seemed to take much longer than he said to deliver and they were very expensive, and then around 2012, it changed for me. He for people who dont follow what he does, spacex, his not his Space Tourism company. More of a commercial satellite launching company. They docked with the International Space station and replaced the Space Shuttle and gave us a chance to get to space instead of depending on the russians, tesla, his electric car company, came out with the model x sedan, and as compared to his first car, which was seen as more of a toy for rich people, the model s still caters to rich people but viewed as maybe the best car ever built, and even people in detroit who were very skeptical of tesla, gave the Company Credit for that. Then solar city is his Third Company where he is chairman, and its a solar panel company, and it filed for a Public Offering and became the United States largest installer of solar panels. This happened in the span of three months, and i thought, as far as industrialists go, theres really even though he still has a lot to prove, theres nobody in hoyt that has been in those diversesive fields and accomplished that much in that span of time. I dade cover story on him and ended up i went to at the tesla factory, which is in silicon vole, and then went to spacexs rocket factory in inclination that blew me away. Were in this time were told we cant make anything in the United States and this guy was building these complicated things and the most expensive city inside in the United States, and its not for show that spacex rocket factory is about four miles from lax. I thought they would be handmaking one rocket but theyre mass producing rockets with thousands of people. So kind of blew me away. Then elon, i had a chance to interview him for the cover story, and he was much more interesting than i thought. I sort of pigged him more as a teak know utopian kind of guy but he was authentic, a good interview, surprisingly down to earth, not a lot of handlers, just me and him. So i thought this was the guy. He was running counter to so much of his stuff in Silicon Valley which is quick hits, entertainment, consumer services, and here was a guy who was building stuff, and thats what was interested in. Backtrack a moment. How did you original pitch it to him . What were the initial conversations like . Those were difficult. I had done the cover story and we had a pretty good rapport coming out of that. He has a controversial relationship with journalists but we have gotten along okay, and so i went to him and said, look, i think id like to maybe do a book on you, just to feel him out and see what kind of response you would get and he said sort of come include he was going write his own book, even though he is run throwing running three companies, but he definitely brushed me off. And i took a risk. I went and i sold the book in new york a couple months later, and i thought that would really force his hand. I sold the book and came back and told him that, he would cooperate. So we had this big meeting at tesla, on one saturday, and teslas office, their factories in fremont, california, on them of Silicon Valley, and their office is in palo alto, and this is saturday, and these days in Silicon Valley to be totally honest, most people do not work on the weekends like they did 20, 30 years ago, but at tesla the parking lot was full of cars and i walked in and he has everybody working on saturday, and in typical elon fashion he made me wait an hour for our meeting, and he comes in, and the first sits down i made small talk and said, this is so impressive. All these people here on a saturday, and the first thing he said was its funny you say that. Was just about to send an email to everyone telling them how soft we have gotten and i expect more people to be here on the weekend. Thats teetering or jeff bess bezos. We got off to a rough start and i told him i sold the book and he told me he was not going to cooperate. So there was this moment where i decided, can i do this or not . And i decided to go ahead, and i spent the next 18 months interviewing about 200 people, exemployees of tesla, spacex, elon also cofound paypal so paypal people issue found his exgirlfriends, his worst enemies, and after 18 months that seemed to wear him down, and one day i was at home and got a call from elon muck in the evening, on my caller i. D. , and he decided we would have a chat. But he end up cooperating with the book after that. So i interviewed him for eight months and got access to the company. I dont want to give too much away but this is the on access ive seen to elon. So the become is out, a New York Times best seller. Has there been any feedback from elon directly or bad, good, indifferent . Its been a built of a rollercoaster. He he was not he wanted to see the book before is was published did he pick out the cover photo. Thank me for that photo. Its flattering. What his standing in front of . A spacex engine. Im sorry. You were saying. So, he didnt get to he wanted to read the book. Actually wanted to put footnotes in the book and i would not let him do that. I dead lit hem see the book before he didnt have to buy it on amazon. I gave it to him ten days before it came out. And sew his initial reaction, it was very elon fashion. I woke up one morning, and i had about 50 emails waiting for me. He started reading the book at 3 30 a. M. , this guy never sleeps. He works 24 hours a day. Just about. And he had been going paragraph by paragraph through the book, but to be honest most of that was like a mix of good and bad but nothing too controversial. And then a couple days went past, and then he came back and said, look, i think the book is accurate. He gave me a 95 accuracy rating. Thats pretty good from elon. For elon, thats very, very good. [applause] and he said it was well done. And then the press got ahold of the book and started sort of building up the more mostly focusing on what a tough boss he is and he can be very hard on his employees, and it was funny. Once you saw the reaction, it was very strange. Then he had a bigger reaction after that. So hes been a bit upset about those parts. Youch on his work regs who is people who have been with him early on, paypal, startups before that, his brother, through spacex, solar city. I hate to make comparisons but were talking about tech giants. What is similarities or differences did you have from the jeff bezos and steve jobs . Seems to me to stand out and be a little bit different bit what is your opinion . He is definitely different but there are comparisons you can make. Sort of like steve jobs, he is running the company but gets down to sort of the product layer of things. He is deciding i would walk around with him at teslas Design Studio and the is looking at the sun visors of the car, and this is very elon way, he would we like this is crap elm want the best sun visor in the world, and things like funny the door handles on the model s, they sort of retract in and go flush with the car. That is absolutely something that elon wanted and that his engineers fought him on and that he they knew it would be difficult to do, and he insisted on, and its become while it did have problems for the car, its one of its signature things. So seemed to have an eye for heres things. Spacex is the same thing. This guy taught himself aero space by reading textbooks at the Hard Rock Hotel in vegas, and actually makes sometimes good, sometimes bad decisions busy the design of the rockets, and so he goes down to that level. I think i mean, i tend in the book i probably draw more parallels Something Like an edison mostly for the reasons you outlined. He has assembled engineering armies. He is good at getting huge quantities of people. At tesla, talking about up weird 10,000 people, at spacex, 505,000 people. Getting these very bright, ambitious, capable people, to dedicate their lives to what he wants them to do, and you theyre very ineastbound are ventive companies inventive companies. Taking ideas and productizing them. And the one thing that, like jeff bezos and other guys obviously thinks longterm and tries not get caught up in what investors care about. From quart for quart exwith space next particular he wants to create a colony on mars, and thats a tough thing to sell on wall street. So he has been very determined not to take spacex public, and so thats something our you have to convince your employees and everybody else. And he has a little built of everyone. I would say having interviewed most of these people, i would say he is more capable across a broader set of things. So, business strategy, product design, marketing. Very few people are adept at doing bits in each one of those areas, and elon makes plenty of mistakes but actually quite good. He plays at high level across to the parts. Is a understand it every at spacex is at a compulsory watching party on sunday, so we do want to thank elon for putting the spacex facility in browns vick texas. One last question. You mentioned this to me earlier today. You were on a flight from San Francisco with a guy reading the book, and talk first the happy coincidence and then what he decided to do because of you. Kind of curious. I dont want to this guy it was interesting. Reading the book, and then he told me i tapped him on the shoulder near the end of the flight and i said i wrote that book, and he is he said, ive ive got an few emails like the he was a guy who was mid contrary and decided to quit his current job and has to go do something that was more risky. He had been in sales and wanted to go to a kind of identified two startups in Silicon Valley he thought were doing something more radical. Thats what he wanted to do. And its been funny since the book came outespecially with twitter. You see the same thing where you get this wonderful feedback from people who actually read the book, and theres people who this is sort of what i wanted to do, too, is you have mbas and people going to law school and theyre all dish dont know. Maybe theyll curse me but they were chucking it in and wanted to get jab at spacex or get an engineering degree. Some of that is rewarding. All right. Well, kevin, his book does such a wonderful job of weaving together wonderful narratives about the process, the individuals behind it, but more importantly the process and the life experience. Of course elon is a penultimate example of that. Let me put it tout you both. I particular particularly thinking of elon, a lee case of malaria, lost a child as a young man, but those types of things and kevin you talk about similar setbacks for some folks. Want to get you in conversation about the process, particularly overcoming obstacles and setbacks. Seems to be not really generous but overcoming adversity, persistence seems to be the common thing. I want you to talk about that in more depth. I spoke in the book, my book, a lot about the importance of passion, and passion is a probably one of this powerful source oses personal energy we have and its difficult to be passion not about something superficial. What are you passionate about . Probably not passionate about your drapes. You are passionate about your chin or family or some higher purpose that motivates you. What waugh see with creative people, the most successful ones, they are passionate about something very meaningful, and one thing i elon musk is one of nose important innovate temperatures alive today, and the reason is what he is passionate about. He is probably of all the billionaires in the world, the one least interested in my. Thats the first thing. He was practically broke a few years ago. Does a good job of complaining this. He made money and put it into his businesses. Why . Well, he kind of gets it. We depend on technology for our survival. Its made ace successful speech there will come a point when this planet is not big enough for the human race anymore. One thing that my job is a futurist, i say often the future is actually very easy to predict. Its very hard to believe. One thing i can predict about the future is at some point, probably not that far from now, we actually do have to live on another planet. If were going to continue to thrive and grow. So, musk praise for this, we have to become an interplanetary species. Thats why he wants to colonize mars. That sounds incredibly unbelievable but also incredibly predictable. Its true. We need to solve this problem. So what you see in great creators is the ability to overcome terrible obstacles because theyre passionate about something greater, and musk epitomizes that. The biggs risk for musk is hi may die young because he is working incredibly hard and its not good for his health. The reason he is doing that is because he has a higher purpose. You anyway not agree with it but thats motivating him to work longer hours to work harder. One reason he gets mad at employees who want to take one sunday a year off or something ridiculous like that. So, that is what i see as the reason that some people are able to suffer the terrible experiences like losing a child or rebound from a really bad illness or do other crazy things that people like him do, because theres something more important than themselves driving them forward. I would totally agree that theres thing about elop that are both refreshing and sort of probably would be disturbing to most people. Depressant think most people would want to live their life like he does. Completely to kevins point, elon has this is a kid. As a kid he by the time he was 14 he may have read every Science Fiction book ever penned, and where some kids would sort of revel in the fantasies of those things, he took this as his lifes calling and internalized and it said, im the guy who will do this, and lives his life really on a level like nobody ive ever seen. He is very utilitarian. Basically i have a finite amount of time on this earth and im going to maximize my time going after my goals, and if that mean is have to bet pretty rough on my employee, my family life is going item blowed, have to lose every dollar, then so be it. When he sold paypal he made 220 million. And i dont think theres anyone near here who would sacrifice every last penny, which is what he did. He burned through the entire 220 million, building rockets and electric cars exessentially like taking all of your money and lighting it on fire. Two worst things you could possibly do if you wanted to keep your money. And he in 2008, both companies are going bankrupt. He is going through a divorce. He lost a child. And he basically, through sheer force of will and chicanery gets through the period, and theres vary few people who would have walked out of that, let alone end up with 10, 13 billion a few years late. Thats why i wrote the book. To me he is passionate on a level you rarely experience. Theres chapter that reminds me of the scene in the graduate with dustin hoffman, have one word for you, benjamin, rockets. But how to fly a horse, literally does take your on a tour of 50,000 years of innovation. Elon musks story, 50 years of a remarkable rise to future shaping. And i wanted to touch you both do a magnificent job on the past. Elon musk is part of a grew called the long now foundation. And many others are involved with it. Jeff bezos is one of them. Your book touches on their putting of heads. One project which is going to sound strange, strange is a flying to mars, 10,000 year clock that will be selfwinding and will exist for ten years, something to remind is to think more in the future as we objects did as a species and it will be housed here in texas in west texas in a cave. But where do you see these future of creativity, the future of innovation . Its in all of, in a story like elon, but what are themes or evolutions as you sea coming down the pike . And how we create . Yes. How we create. How we foster creativity and incue bade that. One thing interesting about the human propensity to create is how it keeps accelerating. You look at the first 50,000 years of human history, from the arrival of modern human beings to today, its like about ten thousand years ago only that we started look offering animals and domesticking animals. Another 5,000 years before we had agriculture. Writing emerged about that time. And now we have gone through seven model odd iphone in last four years, and lon musk has selfdriving cars all over the world, and is flying rockets to space and back. Right . So what is driving the acceleration . There or two things. One is population. There are far more of us now than there were 5,000 years ago. And everybody is creative. So the more people creating, the more things get created. The other one is were building on the knowledge of previous generations and taking advantage of the innovations of previous generations. So, if you take that to the future, were going to be at about 10 billion people in 2100. Thats more than twice as many people as now. That a lot of creating. Well be benefiting from innow vacations. Were able to communicate with one another globally in a way we werent before. So well have unprecedented creative ability. The other thing is the tremendous social progress we are seeing. The ability of more and more different types of people to contribute creatively. Thats going accelerate our creative ability. And were raising up in parts of the world where people have not been able to create very much before in china and africa, india. So its an incredibly Bright Future for the human race actually, which you dont get to hear very often. Its so much easier to be pessimistic. The Zombie Apocalypse is nearly here. Everything is terrible. Thats traffic. Thats not the whole story. I want to leave that on an optimistic note. Kevin, ashton, how to fly a horse, ashlee vans, how to fly a horse. Please help me in thanking the two of them. [applause] id like to turn it to the audience for questions and answered. Theres a microphone in the center. Please direct your question 0 the ear of both of them. And well try to keep us on schedule. Kevin, when you look at people if a ahha moments do you see pattern that make them might lead them up to that moment . Or what they do when they have that moment. Sure. The great question. The pattern is they dont have ahha moments. We mentioned mozart. Mozart is alone in a good mod and sudden lay symphony appears in his head and he writes it down and is done. That is a myth based on a letter that is a formry. We have nope its a forgery for 150 years but you still see it in academic papers about creativity as if it were true. People like the myth. The reality is step by step process, someone with skill and experience, trying and failing. And until they finally finish something. Its like a jigsaw puzzle. The 10,000th might feel the best but you have to put the others in first. Thats the truth about the ahha moment. A feeling that comes at the end of a long series of steps. This is a question for both authors, last night i between see the new steve jobs movie and it was brilliant but theres a theme for people leak steve jobs, elon musk, to try to change the world. They seem to be assholes. This is public television. There is a way to change the World Without being an asshole . Is there a benevolent asshole. We get it. Three times. Kanye west and steve jobs, the only time theyll be in the same sentence. I get asked this question a lot. Elon has this seems to rub people the wrong way because he has what i describe . The book as strange sort of empathy. He is not very empathetic towards what is going on in his employees daily lives. If they come to him and say, they have to miss some work fungs because their defend is going to go to a soccer game, he doesnt care about that at all, and you may well get fired because of it. He when we would talk, he would sort of honestly he would break down almost completely in tears when he would Start Talking about building a colony on mars and how important this was for mankind, and he seems to viscerally feel the peril of the human species from some kind of unforeseen event. So he is wired in such a different way that its hard to draw huge parallels. I think since steve jobs theres been this tendency to glorify people that are jerks but getting things done. Ive interviewed most of these guys in the valley, and there doesnt seem to be a there does seem to be a propensity to be really lard on people and and push them forward. Id say like gandhi, jesus christ, abraham lincoln. There are plenty of examples of people who changed the world who have had great charm and great social skill. Thats the first thing. Second thing id say is, sadly, youre talking about a bunch of privileged white men and privilege can make you less than polite sometimes which is something we have to fix. This third thing is i dont want to say ive head the misfortune or working for quite a large number of i dont know the politically collect word noncharming people and many of them were not changing the world. Theres a proliferation of noncharming people in the world. Good way to put it. I would say its coincidence. Well putment very diplomatic. Yes, sir. Yeah. Another question for both of you about elon musk. Can you talk a little built about how they are how he put together his team for tesla. How many people did he fire himself, and then after you got all these people emails prom them having read the manuscript, did you make any changes ican answer the second one quickly. The book was already print bit the time he read it so, no, i didnt. There was nothing factually i would have to correct. On the second question, i dont know if its going to be as fulfilling because theres a different story for tesla. Tesla was founds by two other gentlemen other than elon hitch was the only money map and they with responsible for hiring the initial team, and i would say what was remarkable about that was that it was a very small group of people on the order of 40 engineers in Silicon Valley who had can the valley had never done a car before so there were all these gearheads waiting for this opportunity to arise for an interesting car company to show up and so they ditched their jobs and went in there and worked crazy hours and there was a mix of middle aged engineers and guys straight out of stanford who were solar car aficionados so they dug inch at spacex that is elons baby and he gets full credit for he interviewed every single employee, up through the first 2,000, and he would coldcall he would call people at stanford in their aero space division, call the professors and say who are your best guys and then call the kid thursday their dorm room and say i have Space Company you want to join help would say this is not elon musk him wasre famous from paypal, no one believed him he said i am. He went to space raves in the desert would chat up kids and say come by and do an interview in the book i go through some of these things and then also his interview process is sort of famous for being very torturous, and so he was very good at finding what he always looked for he doesnt like too pay people much money so he does not go to harvard and yale and get the best people help tries to find people at technical universities, engineering schools, who built something in high school or college, who worked on a team, helped a project grow to true and is thats what he looked for. Kevin . Most of what i know about elon i got fork ashlees book. And from reading his emails. Last question, sir. Actually, how important do you feel or did you get into the study of psychedelic experiences. For elon . I know steve jobs experimented with psychedelics and as far is a know elon loves to good to burning man. I dug into this pretty hard. As far as i know, if elon i never found any conclusive proof that he is not much of a drinker, not much of a he likes to go for the experience. He does go to burning man every year, he pays to build an art car he gets to drive around and likes to dance but i never i would just be making something up because i never found any conclusive proof one way or the other. Thank you. Nothing salacious. Well, as most of you know for coming to 20th anniversary hover the texas book festival, we dont do any business book programming. Had the idea to commemorate thard of the deal by the great donald trump but he was busy so we were unable to get hi him. These are engrossing and very engulfing books and almosts makes you feel like youre in a fiction world because theyre so engaging but you realize these are real stores of real inventors and creative thought and these are the folks crafting your future. So both fantastic reads. Please join us at table 21 after you grab a company. Thank you for joining i want to thank you all again for joining us. Thanks again ashlee vance and kevin ashton. [applause] i also put a box of bars on the stage from some of our sponsors. Sponsored. Please, anybody who wants one go ahead. Also lets make cspan and all of our volunteers. [applause] [inaudible conversations] you are watching booktv on cspan2 with top nonfiction books and authors every weekend. Booktv, television for serious readers. Guest now you can stream it, you can stream like an internet like pandora, you can stream on demand whatever song you want to hear on spotify or audio or apple music and on and on. You can do it on m