Transcripts For CSPAN2 Book Discussion On Broad Influence 20160515

And the Charlie Hebdo and november 2015 terrorist attacks in paris. Just interviewed numerous heads of state including president barack obama and george w. Bush as well as senators, governors and foreign dignitaries. Before time, she was a small for bloomberg or she covered the white house, congress and the 2004 president ial campaign. She received an m. S. In journalism from columbia and an undergraduate degrees in International Relations and art history from tufts university. She was a 2015 Harvard Institute of politics fellow at the 2016 new America Foundation fellow. Welcome. [applause] tonight second panelist is the honorable kay hagan who serve as United States senator from North Carolina from 20092015. Prior to her time in the u. S. Senate she served and the North Carolina senate from 19992009. After taking office in january of 2009 senator hagan served on four committees the Armed Services, banking, housing and urban affairs, Small Business and not a partnership, and Health Education labor and pensions them hell. She introduced legislation to train workers for the jobs of able right now by bringing businesses together with Community Colleges to great credential program. Shes been a champion for education throughout her career in public service. As a member of the senate h. E. L. P. Committee she were to include legislation to the Financial Literacy first and ask and for education reform. To assure this remains competitive she led the fight to update technology and our Public Schools to meet the needs of todays students. Senator hagan was born in shelby north collide and is a graduate of Florida State university and we could force law school. Please join me in welcoming tonights panelists. [applause] spent force i want to say thank you so much to nyu and you guys are coming. Thanks having to talk about broad influence. I want to thank kay hagan, senator hagan for doing this. Its awesome to have your to talk with me about this. To give you a bit of background, we were fellows together at harvard. And so she saw lots of drafts of broad influence adobe, was one of people who help a right to some of the things. Its great to have her here to talk to a lot of the issues in the weve known each other, more than a year now. Shes really familia for me with other stuff having served in the senate as well as work in a lot of industries that i talk about in my book. Did a bit of background about broad influence, i first got interested in doing a book after i did a story for Time Magazine and 2013 during the government shut down about the women of the senate coming together during the Government Shutdown to restart the negotiation, to reopen the government when none of the men would talk to each other. I have a lot of interest in writing a book about the women of the senate but the women of the senate were already writing for books. What interested me in that episode was it was the first time that that was 20 women. They ended up having a huge impact into session. They ended up producing 75 of the legislation in that session. It was tangible difference. I covered the senate and congress on and off for almost 14 years and it was such a tangible difference that session. You could really see the impact women were having. Having written a story i started getting cards and emails and notes from friends and from perfect strangers from all across the country saying that this sort of phenomenon of critical must exist elsewhere. Critical mass is somewhere between 2030 of any institution, whether its a legislature or Corporate Board, a navy ship or an Appellate Court and women begin to change the culture of that institution. It comes from science. Its the point at which Chain Reaction cannot be stopped. Thats the point of which in a Nuclear Reaction that you cant make the thing not go boom. So in this case sociology issues Critical Mass in terms of gender but really any minority. It was used for example, in integrating africanamerican students post Civil Rights Act and the south. There was a quoteunquote Critical Mass 20 mandated in the school. But in term terms of gender thet hundreds of study on this issue. So whether, that looks at, sorry, this phenomenon. Its summer between 2030 because a lot will depend on critical actors. The reason why the senate was the threshold of 20 , based on a lot done with this it so many powerful women, critical actors in that senate. They ended up chairing i think nine of the committees 11, right . Ended up chairing a Ranking Member levin committees. They control more than half the committees. The same sort of thing happens with navy ships. When you integrate navy ships you need a minimum, you start always with offices and go down to the rankandfile. It is why its important to get female ceos, female president. Because theyre the ones who uplift of the women up and help create Critical Mass. When you have a critical actors you need less overall to reach Critical Mass. Thats the idea of the book and theres lots of chapters about the city, about the house, about wall street, different areas. So until be fun to chat with kay in with you guys is what about the chapters where kay has so much expertise and shes amazing it. So we are going to start and i would like to ask kay to talk a little bit about being innocent in the 113th senate and what it was like being one of those 20 women. Did you feel a tangible difference . I want to go back to what you said about the 20 . It was so true and so evident that when i got elected, we had at the time 20 women and the city. Obviously, weve hit the 20 threshold. When you look at what that means, that really does mean we were able to pass significant legislation because we came together. Went 11 of the 20 committees were chaired by women, but what took place. We got a transportation bill. We got a farm bill. And agriculture bill which was long in coming. We got a Water Resources bill. We got a budget. Barbara mikulski chaired the appropriations committee. All of those things tentatively. When you studied you wonder why. I think that as your book really analyze a great deal in of the people especially sociologist, they say women bring to the table something different. And ability to compromise, and ability to stay active until you get the job done. Through the power struggles, the austin kelly is put aside. Whats in it for everybody. That means youre not going to get everything you want, otherwise its a winlose situation. How can we compromise, how can we come together to understand what the prevailing issues are. At the end of the day get something done. I think that one is what our country want it is demanding, but at the same point who is doing it . The women at the table arent getting it done. But you cant get it done unless one thing, you run for office. You get the education that makes you available to become that ceo. Go through the navy to get to be the first weapon and on a submarine. All of these things dont just happen because you are a woman. They happen because you are welltrained, well educated and united do the job. Ive got to always focus on that. Historically if you look at women running for office, women tend to be recruited. So whenever i am speaking to a group of students and in particular male and female, i always encourage everybody to consider one day running for office. Im giving this shtick to you right at. We need young people. We need women and men who are well educated that understand how the government offices work, have city council, education and all of those things. It really, really is important to but then i take it one step further and i look at the women, and many times young girls and i say, i am recruiting you particularly to run because girls need to be recruited. I will have to admit i was going to do it no matter running for the state senate, but when you have the governor calling me up and saying by the way, kay hagan, we we would like you to run. It gives you that extra little impetus to say im planning on. Lets do it. Lets talk about this. They say takes asking a woman seven times before she will run for office. Was that true for you . I think it certainly makes it easier, not seven times. But once again i knew i wanted to do it. But when you have a governor, we have the president of the senate, we have the majority leader come to you can sit down and say we really want to come and by the way, were going to help, it helps a lot. What was your experience running for office in terms of, is a different for a man, for a woman running for office dg few more prepared . Women want to wait until its the perfect time. I tell people theres never going to be a perfect time, effort. Whether its the business youre in, what is your family situation, whether you young kids were old kids or your parents are now ill, you will never have a perfect time. Please got to just i call it we will jumping into this. I say we, because if you have a family, let me tell you, its a family event. In my case i have an incredibly supportive husband. When i first ran, and this was back in 1998, of the kids, the first commercial we failed was the driving a minivan with all the kids in a soccer close run into a soccer fan, the minivan and mom takes off. They loved it. It was a 30second at and pick out the stopwatch is out and said we are all in for three seconds. Wheres our part . And then the more you do it, when i ran for the u. S. Senate my kids are heading to college campuses, who were still in school, took a sixmonth sabbatical and then went back so they could give speeches on college campuses. Its fun. When i ran the second time after the Citizens United case decision, all of a sudden you this unlimited amount of money, which means 30second ads that are the worst things you can possibly imagine. I had my team can overcome the whole family, and sent show was the worst commercial that youve seen. To be sure, my family was geared up and ready to go. There were some terrible ones out there. So sure enough they said we are behind you, mom, whenever said. And off we went. You were the first woman who ran against another one for send it. In 2008 she beat Elizabeth Dole for send. Talk about terrible commercials. There was one she reckoned she where she called you god bless i believe the. It was historically this think is probably one of the best retorts to a commercial. God bless. And individual hosted a fundraiser for me was a humanist atheist. They use that as if i was a godless person. And i am an elder in the church, sunday school teacher. The furthest thing you can imagine from an atheist. I really dont think that should focus in on running for Political Office the way weve seen so much of it today. I ended up having a press conference on the lawn of my church the very next morning after that ad ran, and i had my Bible Studies clash. I had a jewish rabbi who was there, a catholic priest, as well as a retired minister of my church. I was going to ask the actual we have a bright the people in a religious or position as you can imagine. But what my report was was an ad that said thou shalt not bear false witness against my fellow christians. Bam. I ended up winning by close to nine points, so it was it didnt work out the way it was there hail mary pass. There hail mary pass. One of the things that fascinate about this and what it got so much done is because they got together abroad. They had these monthly dinners where they would talk about not necessary legislation, like anything that was going on and theyre actually friends. It used to be in washington once upon a time in those able days when washington was functional, like you had Ronald Reagan and tip oneill. They used to call each other for friends and have drinks every night in the house and senate used to move th the fellowship d would later and they would become friends. That began to change under Newt Gingrich are basically changed the house rules in order to allow more recesses, longer weekends, to send a resume for we he that is a corrupting influence the people inside the beltway too much. Winchester in a different way. But it actually ended up depriving a lot of members from friendships across the aisle, or even friendships within own party. Able just didnt have time and a few days of the weaker to get to know each other, and so when things became more and more dysfunctional as a lot of people who were friends with each other retired, were not many friendships left in order to rely on each other when this sort of official leaders broke down and talks ended and stopped. In the democratic crookroom there are telephone booths. She has her own telephone booth for being honored as the longest serving woman, which is a big deal. She would convene sever e every sick weeks wes have dinner together, democrats and republicans. And at some points we would rotate. A lot of times the din were be held in the capitol in what was called the Strom Thurmond room, and its a very elegant chandelier. I dont know Strom Thurmond was a renowned, lets me say, female grabber, and the female pages were warp not to come within arms helping length of him. He was ladys man, you could say. So the fact they were having this women dinners and lunches in at the Strom Thurmond room, the irony is not lost on many of the women. Then i can remember when senator we got an email saying she was going to have a potluck dinner and she said her team said you cant have a potluck dinner and ask u. S. Senators to bring something . She said, yes, i can. And sure enough, everybody brought something from their home state. Not and she sort of said, you bring the entree, you bring this, and she had the entree of salmon that her husband had just caught the week before. And we had it at her home. It was wonderful. We had a ball. And women, we talk, we have a good time, talk about our families, business, and everything is like Claire Mccaskill had it at her place one time, at her condo, down this long narrow hallway, and youre looking at yourphone saying, whats the address . Whats the apartment number . Outget out of the elevator and its the din of the womens voices. You know right where to go to find it. I hosted it one time, several months before my election, and its i wouldnt have not to do that. We had it at the library of congress, and we asked the some of the anymore charge i asked them to pull together some historical facts about women, and we just had an incredible night. One of those times, you had many, many multiple things going on so if you cooperate make the dinner, every woman showed up for part of it. So, i think anythinges on the senate . You mentioned about the shutdown, the Government Shutdown, one of the i dont know if it was the Washington Post or which paper that said the men shut us down, we them got us out. Because of the women coming together, to forge and craft a compromise to open the Government Back up after 16 days. So, my books grew from here, and one of the main things i found was actually that the Public Sector is doing a lot better for women than the private sector, and so all three branches of government are reaching Critical Mass about the same time, 20 in congress, you have 30 of the administration in terms of high Level Civil Service and political appointees, and you have 35, 36 now percent of the federal bench. 40 parse of state judges are women as well. Its striking when you look at the private sector which has been solid for the last basically decade at 17 Corporate Board representation. And about 20 to 21 representation in executive suite work forces and theres a lot of factors. Some women select to go into public service. They will miss the soccer games and better be for the greater good. The path is sometimes easier. A state legislature in 35 states are parttime job, and Public Sector unions are stronger in protecting jobs for women. So theres a bunch of different reasons. You chose to go from private from a private practice at the time or working in the Financial Sector. Financial sector. The Financial Sector is by par the worst except in silicon valley, which i have chapters on both. On wall street and on silicon valley. Theyre the farthest apart from Critical Mass for women and thats because women dont are not as strong as men in Stem Education which i science, technology, engineering and math. And then both of those professions tend to be very tesss testosterone driven and dont have a lot of opportunities for women. A great theory called where the idea is if Lehman Brothers had been lehman sisters the Global Financial crisis would not have happened because women take less risks. And so i look at this and i think its a really interesting question. Do you think its true . Hmm. I have to think about that one. When i worked for a bank, one of the predecessors to bank of america, and i can remember when we were at that time we would actually go over loans and credit risks, and i can remember there was one male in particular that was making tons of loans, but lots of them didnt work out. And i can guarantee you the documentation i did was so thorough, and i think when you im not an expert on how many people and what their analysis of all of this is, but i could i can document in my own experience that certainly was the case. When i first got hired, i was right out of law school, and going in my first job out of law school, and going into the trust and Estates Division and i was the first woman in this Certain Department in this certain city, that had been hired to work in the for that part of the bank, and i remember i was told by the head of the department that the woman that they had assigned to be my assistant said no because she wasnt going to work for a woman. I said, wait a minute. Shes never met me. You dont acquiesce from that. This is a long time ago. And so, sure enough, met her. We got along great. But that what it was like a long time ago. I also remember they pulled together one of the mba recent hires, and me, and we worked together to open up a new division in a different city. That mba grad was also a woman. And when we went to this new city, we were going to host a local community in the business lunch at a place where all the men went. There was no opening for a woman to join the club. So the president of the bank at that time. A man who is probably credited with making bank of america the kind of place it is today, said, are you kidding me . If they want us in that community, you better let us in, and these are like the two women who represent us. Sure enough, we now were able to join and serve lunch and be in the main dining room they finally said go around the back door. No, no, no. So, those are the kind of crazy things that truly happened. I want to give one other story, and that is in the senate when i first got to the u. S. Senate. This is in january of 09. If you recall, too in january of 09 we were hemorrhaging 700,000 jobs a month in this country. And when i went for training in late december for a parliamentary issues and they brought us all the new senators, democrat and republican, together to say this is the rules of the senate, things like that. I remembered at the meeting, nobody mentioned one thing about healthcare or a gym. Thought, certainly theres a gym around here. So they said, oh, senator hagen, come back next week when youre here and well take you to see it. Went back, sure enough, they said, theres a gym. We went in, the rules committee met me and they said this is the womens part. Which isnt that big, but then i said, my husband has always said i have a great sense of smell. She does. So i said, i smell a pool. And the people said, oh, yeah, theres a pool. But its for men only. I went, i i see your faces. Yes. I said, really. And so i didnt make a big deal about it. I went back to my office, told my female chief of staff and my female comes director, its for men only. They wanted me to talk about that at some event, and i said, no, were hemorrhaging thousands of jobs a month. Were got going to talk about a pool. Well, fast forward, the news media found out about it, they talked to the rules committee. The rules Committee Said senator hagen doesnt know what she is talking about. We had a meeting of the minds, well, after a couple of weeks, that pool is now open to women, and in the womens locker room, there is a sign that says, pool coed facility. Wear appropriate attire. I always wondered about that. Thats all im going to say. Were like some of the male senators swimming naked. So, the idea of risk is really interesting because women you cant say that women are monolithic, always going to be women two take more risks and dont conform to rules or ideas but studies show that women are inherently more risk aver than men. So 97 of mikeow finance lending in the world is done to women because theyre more risk averse. They spent me money more conservatively than their husbands and theres been tons of studies that show that female financial analysts, plannersten to be much more risk averse and concerned about the few dishear responsibilities than men are. And thats the idea of lehman sauers. One of lee lehman sisters. Theres a book by a guy named dr. John coats who is a neuroscientist in cambridge, who talks about who actually did a study of banker in london and tested swabbed their cheeks for testosterone, and the more testosterone they had, the riskier the bets were. And they posited this whole theory that financial bubbles are created by men, because there are too many men in wall street and not enough women to balance them out. So when men are around other men theyre tesss toker to testosterone compounds, and the gets get riskier, and the whole thing explodes and the bubble bursts and me market classes, men secret a hormone, i guess and so when they should sell they dont. They freeze. And women actually produce the antidote to that. So just by having physically more women in the room, you could actually theoretically, according to the doctor at cambridge, solve financial bubbles because you have not so much testosterone and not so much freezing agent and the markets would be easier. So, it is interesting thing, though, and i think remarkable to say that washingtons response to this was to appoint almost unilaterally across the board female regulators, which whether it was Elizabeth Warren to head up t. A. R. P. Or keeping on sheila bayer in the fdic and help write doddfrank or mary shapiro and Mary Joe White at the sec, it was washington and they they were new sheriffs of wall street. Time magazine did a cover. They were all women trying to tell watt wall street to get your bank in order. I saved the issue with the three women on the cover. The sad thing is in the wake of this financial crisis one of the results has been that wall street has used the excuse of the crisis to actually get rid of a lot of the women who are considered outsiders so they have even less women now an wall street than before, at least in the last few years. So thats again a problem that needs to be addressed. One of the places that also has a big problem with women that okay is very familiar with, having served on the Armed Services committee, is the military. The military has varying rates but roughly between, depending on which branch, 14 and about 19 women in the Armed Services, depending on the branches. Think the worst is the marines and the best is the navy . I think its the navy air force. And thats in large part because of the huge problem of Sexual Assault in the military. And so i was really amazed in 2013 when we the women of the senate started looking into the issue. The women i had spoken to before that, olympia snow and others said theyd been trying to rates this issue for years and people never paid attention to them when they did this, and yet the women on the Armed Services committee were like, this ridiculous, were going to do something about it. The first time there was seven women on the committee. Right . So id love to ask you about that and what was it like haul thing generals in and getting them to answer . Well, i come from North Carolina, a Strong Military state. I come from a Strong Military family. Ive got nephews on active duty right now. One is a air force fighter pilot, one is a navy seal my husband was in the navy. My fatherinlaw was major jenna the marines. So i look at this as to what we need to do to be sure we continue to have the Strongest Military in the world, and one thing is we have to integrate women into each and every place within our military. I went to whats called the fob, Forward Operating bases in afghanistan, iraq, a lot of the places where there was when you go to a ford operate a Forward Operating base you were out where the ie ds and you we are in the throes of war, and i talked to a number of women, talked to female translators, and what is difficult if you were one of two women on a Forward Operating base, or one woman on a Forward Operating base, its something i think we really need to have focused on in a better way to be sure you need to have that 20 but youre not going to get 20 but you need more than one or two. I can remember people that i talked to quite a bit, one woman in particular that said when she was on a Forward Operating base she would leave her name tags on her tent, her dog tags so in the middle of the night, it wasnt the enemy coming into her tent issue it was her fellow brethren coming into her tent to scare her, harass her, attack her no matter what, and that left her no and then be able to say, get out of here, or she stopped drinking fluids late in the afternoon so she wouldnt have to end up going to the latrine in the middle of the night. Think about that. Here you are fighting for your country and youre also worried about your brethren. So, we had to do something. And im pleased with one that is the recognition that this was a problem. Openly saying, not just to the women who knew it but to the whole military complex, this is something that we cannot condone, we will not condone and theyre going to be huge repercussions about that. One of the big battles how do we do that . It really was the women who brought it up, talked about it, talked to the generals about it, talked to their fellow senators, and we have seen incredible progress in this area. And a lot of it is being sure that the women know theyre supported, they know that if they bring this allegation up, that theyre going to be not be the ones that get kicked out. Theyll have an attorney representing them, theyll have an advocate from day one going forward. Theres still a big debate whether or not the commander on that base has the ultimate authority to bring the charge or not bring the charge, and theres a lot of discussion about that. But its certainly something that i really think that puts the women who think women who understood what was going on to bring up and get something done. I encourage you to look. Theres a great cspan hearing of the seven women the committee but includes the seven women calling these generals in and its like a row of generals and theyre just like, pounding them. Why have you not done anything about this . Why is thats not happening . Its a great video to see. And some people describe it as the anita hill hearing in reverse. You have all these women sort of pounding these men. It was great. I dont think its the women being afraid of sexual attacks that keep them out of the military. Think most of the time its their decision, die want to go into this, whats my background, what is the family situation . And i look at what the secretary of defense, ashton carter,ing do right now and that is being sure that maternities benefits and time off is greater and being sure that in opening up every position for women to join, as long as theyre fit and have the background for that duty. So, i think were seeing a lot more positive growth in that area. You saw that in the military. The jobs look like how the navy in particular, when they first started out, they were ordered by the Supreme Court not 1973 to integrate women on the ship and their first attempts were disaster russian one woman with disastrous. One women or ten woman and a thousand men and every woman was missable. Made everybody uncomfortable. The men and women were very up comfortable. Didnt work. So the navy came to this sort of through trial and error, Critical Mass, essentially, and now theyve mandated on all shapes integrated, theres a minimum of 20 , their develop their goal is 25 and they start with the officers and integrate from there on down and thats the submarines. Theyre just integritying for the first time in the last two years. Im proud to say, two women from North Carolina, from nc state were two of the first women, nuclear engineers, to start training to be on a nuclear sub. And so the same is sort of going for like Forward Operating bases and as they open up, women into i guess combat situations, dont want it to be the same kind of one or two and make it such awkward and doesnt work. Theyre trying to make an effort to integrate it in a very Critical Mass way, where it operates as smoothly as possible. So be really interesting. Its maizing to me always hollywood that dreams of breaking these Glass Ceilings before we do them, and i do have a chapter but its interesting that they dreamt up the first female president and the first female surgeon and everything else. For female defense secretary, which we still havent had, but they somebody who heads up the air force is a woman. Yes. The first female fourstars. So, the g. I. Jane, remember that really terrible movie with demi moore. It was about the First Female Navy seal and that was made in i cant believe this 1996. 20 years later, this year for the first time they will open up navy seals for women to try out. Theres so much backup that goes into all of that. That our seals couldnt do the jobs they do without the intelligence, without their surveillance. Much of that is being conducted by women. So you have to have a team approach. Thats very true. They work very closely with women already in terms of intelligence and other areas. So, the military was a fascinating area and one area where you have done work as well is judiciary, where women have made huge amount of progress. So thats one of the places where you actually have women who have, like, changed things by leaps and bounds. We when you think about women come bog the work force in the 1940s, it was rosie the riveter because the economy demany it but it wasnt until the 1970s that banned women from working without their husbands permission were repealed. There was a whole movement of women in the law that went about the country and it was spearheaded Sandra Day Oconnor talk busy houston she was not a feminist but when the somewhats in the state legislature there were women in the government and in the law who did nothing but go through every single state residents laws and try to purge these ridiculous laws from the books and say you cant, like, be jury duty isy not optional for housewives. Theyre equal citizens. You cannot have you cannot bar your daughters from working in bars just because you think theyre morally debraved areas. So that would whole movement in the 70s that was amazing and its been the growth of female judges that has changed the law enormously. The body of law in the last 30 years. You think about how 30 years ago or 40 years ago women couldnt like, divorce naturally favored men are men got custody of the kids and hard for women to get custody. And divorce courts were horrible places. Now you have family courts with play pen pens and now we have conscious uncoupling and all these things that really prioritize the children. Those are all female touches to the courts that have changed things over the year. And certainly changed in your time. Certainly. Lets look at Sandra Day Oconnor, the first woman nominated to the Supreme Court of our country. In 1952 when she graduated from stanford, she interviewed with she was editor in chief of the law review at stanford. 40 firms she interviewed at, none of them gave her an offer. She ended up accepting the job of i believe the City Attorney in san mateo, but she did it for free and she had to share an office with her secretary in order to get in the door. And look what she became. What hero. One other story after i graduated from law school and went to work for the bank, i remember my first week, i went into one of the senior male Officers Office and said you want to go to lunch today . And you could see this paralysis, deer in the headlights. It was lining, what your husband say . And i said, he would probably want to know if i was hungry. It was like so, it was just yes, we went to lunch he wasnt mortified that my husband showed up. If you look at the judiciary, right now there are six states in our country that have female governors. There are 20 states that have a female chief justice of the Supreme Court in those states. I think that says it all. There are 20 , once again i mean, 20 states that have these female justices makes a huge, huge difference. Let me give you the numbers. Thats why i have thats paper. Three women on the u. S. Supreme court. 35 of our federal bench now comprises women. Way over the magic 20 number. President obama has nominated and appointed 130 female judges in our country. A third of the District Court judges are female. 40 of the state courts are run by female justices, and then the 20 chief justices in our country. So we really have made great progress, and once again this is in the pub sphere and this really shows the significance and what has changed with our laws. I want to backtrack one more time and that is looking at the difference in legislation the first several women brought to the u. S. Senate. When patty murray was first elected into the u. S. Senate from the state of washington, 1992. The year of the women. After those six women got into office in 1992, look at the law us that were not only the books at that time. Anything having to do with Domestic Violence of a husband or a partner. We had 100,000 in funding going to Breast Cancer research. There were no women studies in the nih for medical studies. No women. It was all based on men. There was no child health insurance, called the chip program, available at the federal level. You can go on and on. No family medical leave. No family medical leave. Always to me incredibly important areas that had been neglected until you had that cohort of women realizing, we know how important this is. Lets work on it. I think im going to finish our conversation. We didnt talk about this earlier. Sorry. But on this discussion of women these days, the president ial race, because it is the hardest Glass Ceiling to break and it is interesting. Theres less than five percent of fortune 0,000 ceos are women. As okay said, only six governors so 12 of governors are women, and 18 of mayors, major mayor tuesday the United States just just 18 . Yes, so, that is particularly for a reason. As kay said, talking about the senate, when people elect women to legislative office or to group benches, a lot of judges are elected, they are Corporate Boards, they imagine women or think of women as being more collaborative and being great at winwin situations, as you said, and really kind of working together in groups to create good outcomes for people. The problem with executive offices for wimp is that the skill set needed or perceived to be needed for those offices is winlose scenario. You need to have executive making authority where you make decisions on your own, not with a group of people and you make those decisions and youre to the tatetive about it authoritative and women are perceived to be weaker. So to overcome this they have to prove in a toughness test that men candidates dont have to prove. So male candidates i cant remember the last time if the male candidate was asked if they were tough enough to be commander in chief. So it is a very tricky needle to thread for women running for executive office because you want to prove your tough but you also have to be likeable. And thats not easy because its very easy to crossthe bword thresholds, and so its also hard for hillary and embodied in the last few weeks and carli to some degree, Carly Fiorina, on the republican side. How do you show passion . When you are running for office and youre a woman, and all men here, all people here, frankly, is screaming. Everybody is used to their mom being a disciplinarian and when women raise their voice, people cringe, and whereas Bernie Sanders can scream for 40 punts and everybody like, thats awesome. And youre never going to see that happen with Hillary Clinton. So, theres really interesting challenges to breaking the final Glass Ceiling. Wouldnt you say . I keep looking back to my runs and things like that, and its about one you just got to think about what youre going to wear, you have to be sure you got your hair done, you have to just its how you look. You have to get that under control. And then youve got then put it aside, and then its all about the issues. All about what your message is, all about what you have to say. But yet it does seem like people are sort of obsessed with what the women are wearing, what their families are like. How many times do you hear about a woman in the first question, what about your children . What about your husband . Those questions are not asked of the men, especially early on. Its just assumed that theyre taken care of, and they dont have to position one of those initial questions, how are you doing this . Because of and i think the more we have elected women, the more we have corporate ceos and i look at the ceo of yahoo. She had friends and then she is pregnant again. How can this be . And they made front page news and still does. So, we have to have a lot to go on before that continues to be front page news. I read the other day that somebody said im not sure exactly who it was poor hillary, she has to put an extra hour in her day because they dont have to get up and get their hair done and get all that other stuff done, but it is what it is. When i first got to the senate, i noticed there were two kinds of senators. Youre getting ready to do a floor speech or press conference and very concern about your hair and your makeup. And then the other kind of senators, then there are the women. So its the men who do that. Remember the whole thing with marco and donald talking about the makeup and see sweating so much. Thats the men. They spent a week talking about why hi was hearing highheeled boots. Welcome to womens world. I do have to say the reason for the boots is because of womens highheels, and what are called sour gum balls in North Carolina that fall from the trees, this big, you step on it on a high heel, down you go. I interviewed 200 women for the book, including kay and a bunch of others, Hillary Clinton talked about what it was like running a second time, things like that, and so i guess i would love to just hear your questions if you have any. Someone right there already. As we all know today you have got to raise money and you have to be willing to raise money. You have to realize that its part of the job nobody really likes but something you have to do. And when Citizens United, when the Supreme Court made that decision, i think that is totally changed the dynamics of elections in our country. My 08 senate race versus my 2014 senate race was night and day. The 08 was about a 40 million race. Both sides. The 2014 was 128 million. The most expensive u. S. Senate race in history. This is not good for democracy. I tell you that right now. Lillians lift, other organizations likelians lift lillian was the first elect woman in the state house in North Carolina so its named after her. It is on how do you its this group that says were going encourage women to run, and if you do run, women across the state will magic cli mail you checks because they analyze who is capable, and recruitment and people who have a chance to win. Very targeted. Tell you, when i first ran this is back in 1998 youd open up this envelope in your mail box and be this thick and check after check, 100, 50, 25. Paid to my come pain campaign. Gave you a great sense of confident that i dont know these people but anyway know mow and they are supporting me with their financial contributions. The other thing is, women i dont have the exact numbers in front of me but women tend to give a very, very, very small percentage of the financial contributions towards elections. Very small. That is a major dynamic that needs to change. Realizing that if you want to get in the game. If you want to be part of this, if you make a 25 contribution, youre going to talk about it, going to tell your friends and you damn well are going to go out to vote, and that is why we have to encourage more women to get involved in that process. Thanks, abigail. Actually democrats have an advantage here because democrats have emilys list, you have a lot of builtin female donors and funders. Almost always the i wouldnt say we haved a an advantage. The male are you runs give unlimited amounts of money. I would advantage over republican women in the sense you know, rip rip women dont have the same republican women dont have the same infrastructure that Democratic Women do. Very few republican female donors. Its none. A tiny percentage. There are but tiny. , but theres no female Koch Brothers or no sort of female super donor funder on either side, and what i think the more you can cross that barrier and get more people to give smaller individual contributions, i cant tell you how much that means. Thats true. You do need women giving on both sides. Thank you both for doing this. I had a question if jay is your real name. Its actually jennifer. People expect you to be a man. So my kind of funny story. I was born my dad was he was told it would be a really long labor and he had a couple of sleepless nights and they sent him off to a cot. The went to sleep and they did an emergency procedure and i came out quicker. They were sure i was going to be a boy and theyd only picked boys names and my mom picked the name jennifer without consulting my father. My father hated the name. And so my fathers name wag graham was graham and everybody called him gray and he called me jay from when i was a baby so ive always been called jay by everyone on the planet except for my mother, and its true that most people look at my name and think i am a middleaged white guy, frankly, and including Rush Limbaugh and glen beck, some interesting, choice words for this guy, to some of the stories id written. What do you hope readers take away from the book . Like me personally. When im done reading it what would you like me to either know or feel or see differently . This is a great question. Its a bit unusual. Im not used to having a partner here. What i usually tell people is i was really surprised that Critical Mass existed. Thought we would have to get to parity and parity just seemed like a million years away to me. Like something wed never reach. I was delighted that Critical Mass is actually really close and its closer than you think it is. So, as i mentioned it was economic necessities that broughtwoman into the work force, that first brought women into the work force, and were at the cusp of bringing women fully into the work force. By the year 2030 the babyboomer generation will be fully aged out of the work force and well be short 26 million workers. Theres only two ways to solve that. One is to bring in more immigration which, with this congress is hard to imagine, or bring women up to full employment and that almost completely fills the hole no next president will have to deal with this issue because its not going to happen naturally and i write sort of the epilogue about this. A lot of models which we could use. Europe has reached this sort of demographic cliff earlier than we have and theyre solution has been imimpose quotas, japan has abenomic. Canada and the uk have the 30 clause which aims to bring 30 of women into the work force, and upper levels. Middle management, senior management. But i think the best example i found was this program in australia which has sort of an unfortunate name but its very true. Its called male champions for change. And its true that you cannot do this without men. You cant just assume that all these women are just going to help bring up millions and millions and millions of women. You have to get male leaders involved because theyre frankly the leader rights now. So what australia did when they reached this cliff five or six years ago they challenged very publicly their work force to all the ceos to very transparently report how many women theyre they were recruiting and training, which does not happen in the United States. We have almost no reporting of actual fishings of how women are paid, how much theyre paid, what percentage of companies they make up. What levels. Theres some but not a lot. Not that much. And so that transparency is key, and once they had that transparency, they started to be able to essentially mock the people who werent making it, and i dont know if you have been to australia but the Australian Press are pretty vicious and it was a great incentive to do something. So i think something along when i was interviewing Hillary Clinton for the book we talk about howl she would govern differently as president , and i talked to Carly Fiorina about this, too, and both of them cited a kind of Publicprivate Partnership model, since quotas are not likely in our country. That would kind of bring business along, really incentivize and help them hire more women and retain more women. Along that line, and its not really in direct answer to your question but when youre talking about women going into the work fierce, especially the huge numbers that japan needs and we need in our country, its about child care. If we dont do something about the availability and the cost of child cair, were not going to see those numbers. And i think that is something that should be front and center in this election right now, in a much larger way, and ive always told people, whenever we talk about equal pay for equal work. Its not just for women. Theres not a main know of that doesnt want his wife, his daughter, his sister, to earn the same pay that the men that she is working with earn, and so that is why equal pay for equal work is really an economic issue for our country. It is a family issue. And i look at those two issues, child care and equal pay as something that is going to move our country forward. I do think were really once again, i do think the message i want to leave people with is that im hopeful. Im really hopeful. Look at the millenial generation, im on the front counties hoff the oldest millenials and this is a generation that that was the first generation ever born assuming equality of the sexes. The hallmark of our generation, and you millenial men standing up and saying i want paternities leave. Want equal paternity leave as my wife. Want work Flexible Work hour size can be involved any familys life. First contact for kindergarteners in America Today are men. So i think that thats really what has to change as well. You cant have a work force you cap change the work force unless you bring more men into the home life because you cant do it all. So i think thats i wanted to ask you a question about North Carolina politics. Is that okay . Sure. You mentioned former senator jim hunt. He was governor. Governor. Excuse me. Nor jim hunt. Who was a leader in the field of education and civil rights, and just thoughtfulness of the country. And many of us i happen to be from up north, in michigan. We viewed North Carolina as the lighthouse of the south, educationally, politically,. It seems to now have gone in a tremendously conservative direction, and unfortunately where you sit today, rather than being in the senate, is one indication of that. The schoolboards have become conservative, the state legislature. Can you define or pinpoint what has brought that about in North Carolina and changed that scenario. Id love to. I think when you look at North Carolina there have been books and many, many articles on this. Jane myer, who i guess writes for the the new yorker also written a piece that focused on North Carolina and looked at if you go back probably 15 years, there was a very small group that first concentrated on School Boards and then on local City Council Races and if you think bit it, those are very cheap places to invest money that you can make a difference in who you elect. And when you get control of the School Boards, guess what you control . When you get control of even in the state house, concentrated on the state house. Once again, 120 house districts. You can invest mall amount of money and really pour it on to several house races so that then you control the majority of the state house in North Carolina. This went on sort of behind the scenes, and all of a sudden its like, theyre in charge. And you couple that with targeted races with money, couple that with what happened every ten years when we do the census. Then you get new districts being drawn to conform with the new numbers for the census. Then what happens in this country, once you have total control, you can jerrymander it. We just had a case that went up to the Supreme Court that said, oh, by the way, North Carolina, you have messed up so badly, you have to go back and redraw your congressional districts right now. The new openings for the primary, opened up this week for our congressional races and yet we had may 15th be were part of the primary, these ballots candidates names were on the ballot but they were not counting those now. So, once you look at jerrymandered districts and then if you control the house and the senate you have what is called the veto proof of the governor, whether its be a democrat or republican, and youre in charge. So, that is what has happened in North Carolina. And alex, which is the american legislative Exchanges Council is a very, very conservative group, they put out legislation called model legislation, i believe our state, North Carolina, has passed more alex legislation in the country. You look at voting i. D. Requirements. The right to vote in North Carolina now has all these things subjected to it. That is alex proposals. And those are the kinds of things that i think that people have got to wake up to and realize, this is not what the majority wants. We now have so many gerrymandered congressional seats. More democrats voted in North Carolina for congressional races and yet we still heal ten republicans and three democrats. What that says to us is that we have to look at a different way to take the politics out of these gerrymandered district. There are so few contested congressional house races in this country because theyre all gerrymandered. So thosing theired i think the president will be focused on as well as hopefully elected officials. Its a problem for democracy. In our country. [inaudible question] Koch Brothers and so much pressure has come to bear that a number of appropriations have actually withdrawn from alex because it flies in the face of what we consider democracy in this country. Most definitely. And Democratic Politics with a small d. But theres a big movement in North Carolina and well see significant change. Any other questions . Back to your question again, education, i think, is one of the most important things that government can do. Because it is our whole future. And when you are 48th in the nation in teacher pay as North Carolina is, thats terrible for education. And its finally gotten people really riled and thats one of the main reasons youll see a difference. Im a k12 Public Education i work for the National School Board Association and we were trying to be as helpful as we could to North Carolina, and its. Its working. To fight this unkindness that goes on. Thank you. Hi, thank you for being here. Right now i can see two different ways of achieving gender equality. On the one hand theres women coming together and fighting for their rights. And on the other hand theres programs like he for she for the u. N. That want men to stan up and say im a feminist. I want to get gender equal, like the canadian Prime Minister just did. How much do you think we need men to step up for gender equality . What strategy is more successful . Is it women fighting for their rights coming together or how much do we need men in the leading positions to step up and say, im a feminist, and how like lie too you think it is that men would do that or ask their female coworkers, how much too you get paid . Is it like the same amount as i do . How likely is it that this will happen . Do you want to take that first . Go ahead. So, i do think its really important to involve men. Women already make up 47 of the work force now. But the problem is they make up twothirds of the minimum wage earners and threefourths of shift workers. We need to get them in senior and middle management. We make up 50 of College Degrees and more than 60 of graduate degrees so we have the training, just not using it. And there arent frankly enough women in executive positions, less than five percent of ceos in fortune 1,000 companies expected to bring all these women into management work forces you have to get men involved, especially in the private sector to do that. It took very much seeing men involved in the Public Sector do and it that is in large degree because women vote. And in the private sector you dont have the power and the threat of female voters voting you out n order to get you to do what you head to to do and is appoint women. For the white house and for congress, they have to answer to female voters who vote ten percent more on average than men do. Theyre a huge power. The most powerful voting force in america so men who are elected had to prove they were empowering women. Had to appoint women to cabinets and senior levels in the administration, to judgeships, and so i think when you have that kind of public voice that really brings to bear this urgency and the voice of women, then thats when you see women make progress more quickly. And you need that same kind of public voice echoing in the private sector in order to achieve that, and that involves bringing in and empowering men the same we we have empowered president s who have been men, to hire and promote women. Your comment earlier about millenials, about how it is the men who are saying, i want that paternity level. Want to take my kid to kindergarten. I want to be very involved in my family situation. Its wonderful for women and men, and as we talk about a lot, women tend to come together with compromise. I think the more we can work together, the much better off we will be, and when youre talking about women voting, i read an interesting book a couple years ago, my College Thesis was on the suffrageet movement, and one of the main reason women got the vote is prohibition. People who were focused on prohibition knew that women would support and it they wanted women to get the vote so that they could get support on getting prohibition passed, and i dont know whether that is all fact but id love to hear somebody really do some research on that. But that was a way to use women for a very different reason but look how it turn out. Theres such compelling economic cases. It is tons of studies, catalysts and research to look at their web site, a lot of great stuff, Price Waterhouse coopers, women matters series, a bunch of different studies but women private companies with women, at least 30 women on their Corporate Boards, theyre 26 more efficient and restate their earnings 55 lets. 45 more profitable. All this amazing Compelling Research about why you should have women on your boards. Sort of a nobrainer and its amazing there arent that many women in the Corporate Boards. Although talking to ernst and young im helpful that will change. A number approaching 70 , 60 , of the current Corporate Board members in america are over the age of 70. So youll see mass retirements soon and theres a really big push to make sure those people are replaced by women. I want to pick up the opinion about millenials. So you jay, you talked about how millenials are the first generation that is born expecting equality. And i think thats really illustrated in polls about support for Hillary Clinton among Democratic Women. Women over 45 are overwhelmingly supportive of clinton, women under 45, majority support Bernie Sanders. So is this fact ultimately good news or bad news for the Equality Movement . If women expect equality but are not necessarily dont have the same drive to put women in positions of power because their college peers, work force peers, roughly 5050. Are we going to see some kind of plateauing of the push for women at the top . So its a great question. I think hillary certainly has had a lot of problems with women, appealing to younger women and its being something she admits she had to work on. Im covering the campaign for time. I went the young woman who put it to me best, woman at a Bernie Sanders rally whos eloquent why she was voting for bernie. She talked about how if you consider going to a political event, going on a first date, bernie really sweeps you off your feet and its like, revolution, and romance, and changing the world, and its like, awesome, and yell to you, and yell more, and thats great. And you go to a Hillary Clinton event and its like going on a date with an actuary and youre talking about your mortgage payments and saving for college and all these things that are like uno are really important but are really boring. And its not inspirational, and a large part of her role, which i think to some degree is is a female role. She admits she is not a great candidate is that she is almost become the mom, saying no, we cant afford this, we cant afford this, and bernie is like issue want to buy the jet ski. And its like so he is the one always saying no, always limiting the dream, the one always saying, no, this is what the she is a practice ma tis and thats a very e pragmatist and thats a very female role but not tear my inspirational for an 18yearold looking to cast their first vote for president and they want to change the world and set the world on fire. Asen older millenial, president actuary doesnt sound bad to me, but it is something that is interesting. Millenials do very much assume there will be a female president anywhere lifetime. Why they dont understand is why it has to be Hillary Clinton and thats the case she is failing to make to them right now. And to some degree, if the nominee on the other side is donald trump, i think the potential is that he ended up making that case for her, and that certainly has been if you look at the polls, in recent the last five states that voted last week she won all five and in a surprise sweep that even her own campaign was newscasts expecting and that was based off of women moving much more towards hillary and away from the republican primaryes, frankly. So, i dont know. Well have to see if she can make the case. Hasnt been made yet. The bottom line is if youre willing to good for the jet ski, how are you going to pay for it . Theres nothing that is outlined things from an Economic Policy standpoint that connects all those dots in bernies case. Does the millenial exact addition are they going to be giving up more than the older generation . Thats an interesting question. This generation is frighteningly doesnt run for office. They dont vote. They tend to vote less. They definitely do not get involved in running for office. Theyre cervix minded generation and thats another theyre very civicmind end but dont get involved in Public Policy so theyll do nonprofit stuff, a lot of working for Green Companies or working for things like that but they dont they really disdain washington. They disdain offers and thats a real problem for the gains that women have gotten in washington because if you dont have the next generation to leave that to, you will see those gains retreat. They are much stronger in the private sector, mill letchans, that in the public sect youre so perhaps they might represent on a macro level more gains in that sector. I think certainly they are much more vocal and much more up and coming. You look at silicon valley, you look at hollywood, for example, hilary swift, stand tub grammys saying i want my recognition, or Jennifer Lawrence saying issue want equal pay there are women in those sectors finding voice voices that are powerful but it is striking there are so very few millenial women in public life. Millenials in general. I think millenials in general, especially college students, have been anathema to go and vote. Thats why theyre a fundamental shift right now looking at the ones actually interested. Which i think is really encouraging, but i say, stay involved. Stay tuned. Volunteer on campaigns because if you get that bug, especially early on in a campaign, you are going to be hooked, and you really can make a difference. Any other questions . Or should we call its night