Booktvs live coverage of the Los Angeles Times book festival continues with the next author panel which is a panel on history. You will hear from jeff quinn, annie jacobson, and Douglas Preston talking about their books. Here it is. Good afternoon and welcome to the panel. I am gary glastner the author of seven non Fiction Books myself including the culture of fear, why americans are afraid of the wrong things. I am delighted to host and moderate todays discussion with these three highly accomplished authors each of whose current book i highly recommend to you, by the way. Here is how it will work. After i introduce the panelists, i ask a couple questions of each of them and then one question for the entire panel and then we will take questions from the audience. So, to allow maximum time for conversation i have asked our three authors to answer their each questions and i will ask those of you who ask questions if you are with us in the audience to keep your questions short. First, let me introduce your three authors. Jeff quinn is an awardwinning investigative journalist. She is the best sell authors he whose books include go down together; the true untold story of bonnie and collide. And manson, the life and times och charles manson. His new book is the road to jones town. Besides him is annie jacobson. She has had three books on the New York Times best seller list. One of them the the pentagons brain was a Pulitzer Prize finalist in history. Her new book is phenomena the secret history of the u. S. Governments investigations into extrasensory perception and psychokinesi psychokinesis. And Douglas Preston is the author of 35 books both fiction and nonfiction many of which have been New York Times bestsellers. He is also the founder of the organization authors unlimited or authors united, sorry, which has battled monopolization in the book industry. His latest book we are discussing today is the lost city of the monkey god. Let me start with you, jeff. If jim jones were alive today and we assume he is still fixiated on power and fame and all these kind of things fixated do you think he would still chose to be a minister or chose to be Something Else . If jim jones were alive today he would follow the path of a demagogue. First to declare he could be the only one to solve the problems of our time. Second, to say to his followers all are only two groups in this world. Those of us who know everything i say is true and then the lying enemies. The third thing he would do and this is true throughout his life, please read the book, uld be to try to shut off to else but me. And fourth, as a demagogue he would lead his followers inevitablely to doom. I dont think he would want to be a minister anymore. I think he would seek political office. Probably the highest political office. [applause] moderator i might have to rephrase the question. I think i will rephrase it slightly. So, in your book, in the road to jones town, you describe jim jones as unique among demagogues i will say almost unique among demagogues but quite seriously what makes him, would you say and the people who follow him, different from other such leaders and also from their foll followers . This is what is important to know about jim jones and those who remember peoples temple. While jones was a typical demagogue in one way he was completely different. Most demagogues appeal to the negative personalities of those who might follow them. Someone is going to take away what you have, we cant let them. Or others have more than they deserve, you dont have your share, join me and we will get more. Jim jones appeared to the best nature of others we need to have a world where there is complete racial and economic equalty, where everyone regardless of race, gender, what they own or dont deserves to be treated with respect and dignity. People believed this and joined peoples temple to work toward the best of end times not simply out of selfish goals. Moderator so then the obvious quick followup. In that case how did it come to end the way it did . Jim jones brought people in incrementally. As his mania and fixation that he must be powerful grow and this is typical of demagogues. The stronger they get the more erratic their behavior becomes meanwhile followers have dedicated their lives and it is hard to get out so ultimately you begin forgiving things you would not have previously until it is too late. Moderator okay. Annie, couple questions for you. The government has been working on socalled anonymous phenomenon programs for seven decades now despite the facts most scientists, and professional magicians consider extra sensory and psychokinesis not to be what it is. Is the governments quest a fool quest or do they know something others dont . That is a great question. We are talking about demagogues and esp and these touch upon these age old ideas of science versus superstition. What i find interesting looking at the long history, not just the modern era and federal government, but aristotle was writing about this at the oracle of delphi in the agent world and you had president reagan talking with astrologers and now in the modern era we have the Defense Department using advance technologies. These engineered systems that didnt exist ten years ago. The government and Central Intelligence agency is looking at the sixth sense sometimes calling it the spidey sense using technology that falls under the rubric of nano bio technology. This didnt exist ten years ago. To your question, i think the answer is more will be revealed meaning we are at this new era where technology can perhaps look inside the human body, into the brain, and determine if esp is fact or fantasy. Let me ask a little bit more about this distinction you made in the book between the science and Center Natural and this being a battle between them. Can you talk more about how the battle has progressed aside from the technology and what kind of response those folks who investigated for the government get and what kind of response you get from believeers . As a National Security reporter, i write about war, weapons, security, and secrets. There are always battles and two sides of every story. This one is super intriguing to me and i chronicled the narrative in phenomena because you have subset within that of people who are scientific skeptics who say this kind of work is absolute nonsense and should never be funded by the federal government. Then you have a group on the ort side who says there is much to len and e book in many way becomes what are the far reaches of wt is comboeknowable. It is enormous today and is enormous inside and outside the book. People arguing about what they think how this money should be spent and i love it. I love reporting on it because it is hair raising. I have always as a reporter tried to write neutrally down the middle and let the reader decide what they conclude on these very insinidary subjects i write about. Moderator let me ask you about a different incidents in your book. One of your apollo astronauts experienced what you call a conversion event on the way back from the moon; right . Why dont you talk about what a conversion event is and also why you made this central to the story of what happened to this person. So a conversion event is which an incident happens to an individual that fundamentally alters their perception of the world and they in essence have such conviction about what happened to them it colors their future and thinking. That is what happened to Edgar Mitchell on apollo 14 as he came back from the moon as i learned in my interviews with him and i think it is a remarkable story supported by the thousand page transcript. But what is interesting, the subset of those who have conversion events and have extreme convictions about this on the side of the scientific skeptics they call foul and say this person is no longer being a science and being influenced by there placebo effect or philosophical idea and god gets thrown in the mix. This creates more debate that i think creates more interesting conversation about what it is that people believe, why they believe that, and why and how they find conviction. Great. Doug, in your book you write about the search for and the discovery of a precombian city in the honduran jungle. Can you tell us how you went about finding it . I didnt find it myself personally. It was a 20year quest by a fellow named steven algon who became obsessed with the lost city of the monkey god which is a legend that goes back some 500 years. He finally found the technology that could actually find the city in some of the thickest jungle in the world. In the mountains, you have the thickest jungle in the world laying on top of rugged mounts and the anterior are valleys that have never been explored and remain some of the last unexplored places on the surface of the earth. In 2012, steve found or learned this technology called lidar which is extremely powerful and he brought down a Million Dollar plane from the university of houston and a team of engineers and they lidared three valleys, three unexplored valleys in honduras and found two lost cities. One in target one and one in target three. So, that is the story that my book tells. And then, of course, the exploration of those cities. Moderator what was it like standing there when nobody had been in this city for a long, long time . It was incredible. It is hard to believe in the 21st century you could find a lost city. Every since i was a little kid i thought i was going to grow up and find a lost city until i was 12 or 13 and realized all the lost cities had been found. But going into the prestine environment where the animals had never seen people before and they were just wondering around was an amazing experience. Although the jungle is so thick you could not see much. If y puthis jungle down in time square and stood in the middle of it you would not know you were in a city. We did find magnificent artifacts like sculptures and all kinds of things. It was absolutely mind blowing. Talk about a conversion. I did have a conversion there. I have never experienced anything like that. Standing at the base of the pyramid with the heads of these sculptures peeking above the ground and jaguars and snakes and sfeel feeling a connection to the people was a conversion experience. Moderator can you talk about the myan communities there . What was their relationship with the builders to now . The great mya city is 200 miles to the east. But this civilization was not y mm myan. When the city collapsed during the great mya collapse this civilization experienced a tremendous flowering and took on a lot of aspects of the culture building pyramids and built the ball court the same as native american ball games or losers were sacrificed. They took a lot of aspects of mya culture and the big question that hasnt been answered and will take many decades is what was exactly the relationship between these people who occupied this enormous 10,000 square mile area of eastern honduras and the mya who occupied western honduras. Moderator great. I want to ask a couple questions for all of you. First off, annie mentioned trying to balance when you do thisind writing and the conflicting views and approaches; right . In your book they are pretty stark; right . But i would assume it is true for the other two of you in your current books and definitely in previous books; right . So, why dont we start with doug or jeff if we have something to say about that. How do you deal with it . The covering of the story and in the case of the covering of the lost city story which i followed for 20 years and write for the new yorker on archeology after going into the jungle and coming back out, two thirds of the team, both hondurans and americans because it was a joint expedition came down with an incurable and deadly tropical disease. I will not ruin the digestion of your lunch by saying what it does but suffice to say it is similar to leprosy. In finding i had this disease, which along with most everyone else, i thought wow, i am going to get a much bigger book advance now. That is what i thought. This is great. It is going to be a bestseller. It shows you how twisted the thinking of a writer s. But it turns out it is a very interesting disease. The oldest disease known on the planet. Dinosaurs got this. They found a piece of amber with a sand fly in it that sucked dinosaur blood and in the blood were the parasites. Hundred million years old. So very lucky i got that disease instead of a boring old disese like malaria. Disease. I dont know if that answers the question. I think for all of us, probably annie most of all, when write about a topic where the readers aralready forming their own very strong opinion and that makes it more of a challenge. When i started to write my book about jim jones and peoples temple the one thing i knew for concern was because one line entered a language. Everybody says at some time or another dont drink the cool aid. All are so many things wrong with that beginning with it wasnt koolaid. Beyond that it has taken on its own meaning. If you are saying that you are saying dont be an idiot or follow a leader who is telling you do to something wrong. At jones tone that wasnt the case nor always with peoples temple. What i try to do in my books is i dont believe if you are asking readers to invest a lot of money for a book and hours of their time it is not enough to say what happened. If you want that, there is a reason why dont keep our High School History textbooks which are just lists of things. I have read the books of these two folks up here and they are such wonderful writers and each time they give context the idea is not only to say what happened but why it happened. Set it all out objectively and give the readers an opportunity to make an informed decision as to what they want to think. There will always be those who say oh, you are wrong, you are an idiot. One man told me at the signing i was incompetent and i said why what did i get wrong . And he said it is indiana university. Not the university of indiana. This proves you dont know how to do research. But again, if it is a controversial subject the context is most critical. Moderator annie . You know, i deal with this in all of my books always. I find it i try to take the humble approach that i dont know. I approach by work on a quest to try and learn something and try to present both sides. When i was writing phenomena, i went to the british and looked at what is left of the king form library of the king who was the most powerful ruler in the world in 615 bc. He, you know, believed that he had all the worlds knowledge. He collected it all in this library, what is left of it is at the british museum. What is left is texts about prophecy and very important to the prescience world. He believed he had all the knowledge then. And also, if you look at how technology, you know much of my books deals with military technology and how advancing technology and advancing knowledge go hand and hand. So, i think it is incredibly important both as professional and person to keep a very open mind to the idea that i do not have all t worlds knowledg and neither do you. And as great as my copanelists books none of us do. And so i balance what i know with what i think i know. Moderator okay. So, each of your books, all be it about different topics and in different ways, at least on my reading, feel free to disagree, and i want to give you all a chance to ask each other questions, if you want, each of them to my mind explores the enduring power and the allure of magical thinking and of charismatic leadership. Generally people who are very charismatic. I will start with you, jeff. In the course of writing these books, or since, have reflections on why these have so much sway . You know, this panel i believe is called quotes in culture and i think those two words are inexstrickable. All of us are bound by there past and the things that shaped and influenced us. In the books i have written even those people who are representing themselves as the cutting edge of mordernism smng they are saying they believe will arch back generations or thousands of years. Jim jones, at time to pull his people closer, would say he was the incarnation and some days it might be lenin and then he would tell people i was lenin and you were trus ski. Always trying to bring in the past as an adhesive to bind together today. In religious cults, almost everyone who has been successful trying to organize and lead a cult point out biblical references from things that were written thousands of years ago to say this fulfills this prophecy. It shows we are coming to the end times. You literally cannot try to freech try to bring about and in view of the belief without basing it on something that will resonate with the past. That is wie if we are going to write about these things we spend a lot of time studying the history before whatever topic we are writing about now. So, there is the term magical thinking and there is the term selffulfilling prophecy i write about going back to ancient greece. The placebo effect is an idea that was created by a cia doctor. All of these ideas about what is generating peoples thoughts are inherently interesting to me, to my work, to general thinking but in the book i write what is most important to the narrative i think is something called the thomas theorem. It is less known. But it is this idea that if men define situations as real they are real in their consequences. When you are talking about the Defense Department and the Central Intelligence agency defining things as real there are very real consequences. That is fascinating. Thomas theorem . I will have to look at up. I write about archeology and it turns out these stories, even if remote and involve people that are different for us, have lessons for the world. I am thinking of the mya collapse which is caused by a great complex phenomenon. There were a bunch of independent city states that collapsed at the same time because the same things happened. It was the combination of two factors. The first one was a the increasingly paracytic role the itclasses played in society where previously the religious lords and nobles had a role in mayan society. They became disconnected and had many children like the growth of the Saudi Arabian family to 15 princesses. The group grew and grew and became paracytic on the people who did the work. The working class and the soldiers. At the same time because of the desperate need for resources they degraded their environment. The interplay of these two cycles brought down all the mayian scities. Myian. Let me ask you why these subjects for each of you right now . Well starting with me because they found the city last year. So, i wrote about it as quickly as i could. If steve who by the way is in the audience over here. He is that Southern California and if he had found the city five years ago my book would have been published five years ago. But you know, in general as a journalist, i sometimes follow stories for 1020 years before i hit the jackpot. It is a random. So, for me, my last book, the pentagons brain was about darpa which is in charge of the American Military science but really it leads technology. That is called hard science. And i found by the time i got to the end of the book where wa actually frightened. Again, artificial intelligence, synthetic brains, it was really shocking to me to be aware of what the Defense Department is moving forward and the sort of unawareness by the general either if you will. I wanted to take a moment och pau of pause before i get back into the hard science and write about squishy science that has a more eetheral idea that focuses on philosophical thinking and magical thinking. I am on my same axis that is allowing me to think and report further but i did need to take a break and now it is back to the hard stuff. All of my books are about different years in american mist history. My previous book was about the 1960s. I try to pick an era i want to study more and then select an iconic individual or event that most readers will have heard of to sort of draw them in. Having written about the 60s and segueing into the 70s i wanted to write about that how happened. When you think about the 1970s and i know i am probably one of the few in this room old enough to have actually been there so take my word all you young people the two things that seem to me that have resonated and lasted in poplar member are watergate and there have been 4,000 books about that. I didnt think i could bring anything knew and dont drink the kool aide. I knew nothing about jim jones or the peoples temple beside what i read in Time Magazine in november of 1978 and i wanted to know more about it. This is more not a question but i just curious about what you think about this i was thinking about American Culture and even though were very, very mixed at this point, for the people even who are born here, they carry their culture with them but also become americans. On facebook there was a big controversy recently about the United Airlines thing, and my husband who is italian from venezuela, said that the ceo should have come out right away and said something which he did not. Dont he said it immediately. He got into a disagreement with my nephew, who was also on there, he said something below the poor guy that was dragged off. Sure, my husband did not think that was bad, but he said to in nephew, you need to go to another country and get a world view and understand how other people think, and because i had done a lot of traveling when was younger i understand. Its not dish dont know how racism is no that right word. My culture is better thannure culture and this is the way we do things. Has that caused wars . I want to say one more thing if realize when it called to my husband he called my names and he said that means someone who likes to be pet. I doubt theres no word. In english that means the same thing. So, i wanted to see im a fir generation mesh owe american you geed to get to a question. I wanted your feedback about American Culture and how they might need to be learn more about other people before they say things. Any comments . Well, one of the prime axioms of the study of anthropology is that all cultures are equal. And it wasnt always that way. In the 19 century, the goal of anthropologists was to categorize cultures, which better than others and there is would huge elaborate categorization ranking cultures from the most sophisticated and the as man who said, wait a minute, all cultures are equal. Theyre all equal. Theyre just different. Some or more complex than others and so forth. So this and that is the view that now prevails today in an throw polling, and i anthropology and it would be niles if it became a more popular view as well. [applause] all right. And that reminds me to ask you to stick to questions and keep them brief. Now we have a lot of hands. The gentleman back there bac there back there. Thank you. Well get around to a lot of you. The gentleman with the glasses who had his hand up. Right there. I have a quick question for, like mr. Ginn. You said that it was like you said earlier that jonestown was not exactly drinking drinki. What do you mean by that . The situation like im sorry, just nervous. You said jonestown was dont drink the koolaid is not what happened. N you elorate on that . Sure. I would be happy to do that. What actually happened. When i say that jonestown wasnt that one last horrific moment. Its not all that happened there. We have to remember that one of the goals of peoples temple was to set a perfect socialistic example that we will awe treat each other with dignity regardless of race and gender, and the feeling was not that we are going to have an armed rebellion and force everyone to believe what we do. It was not going to be that we are going to have our beliefs, anyone who disagree is is going to hell. The idea was we seem my offer an example how everybody can wok together and see that each other person is worthwhile. Jonestown was meant to be that and some ways it did become that for a while. Certainly it tee year youre rated deter deteriorateed towards the end but jonestown was in existence for other four years in some form or another. Didnt just appear in november 1978 and wasnt gone in a couple terrible hours. Theres much more to the story and i think if youll study that, youll see what i mean when i say we cant just judge it by that last moment. Thats part of what i found fascinating about the book, that part of what i write about the only thing that anybody hears are the little blush or five blurbs and this place had a long history i didnt know about. There was a question in the front. Wake for the microphone and well ask your question. Ask you what you think about the idea, the connection between the cults and culture, which is really the essence of human being, which is the desire to be superiorversus almost [inaudible] ho wants so, cults and culture and the desire to be god, a great question. It certainly touches upon everything i write about in phenomena because youre dealing with this idea of the super natural or the supernormal as some of thebiologists look to say about. The analogy that the cia science who it worked on the psychics during the programs i write about in my book would say to me, when i would could, tell me more about homosapiens and they would say think of the mows sadr analogy. I, appearishing cannot sing in the shower. Mozart was a surgical normal and perhaps those who have a six. Sense, enhances intuition, are somehow super normal. Where it goes off the rails and i write about individuals that do go off the rails and become demagogues and sort of per sue pursue this idea to be gates of hell, often touches been your question. They become infused with this idea that they are somehow more powerful than others around them, and that this supernatural thing theyre getting is godly, and then of course we have the downfall. Well, the word cult has a very dispager can tone and kell tour does not but if you look at how cultures develop, cults often turn into cultures. Christianity was a roman cult, and i dont mean that in a disparaging way, a historical fact. So i think that maybe one of the lessons of the of jones that was one that went very much awry but lot of times very strange ideas labeled as cults can grow into mainstream ideas and take over entire become cultures. So i thinkn knowing at i ink it is its for to look at cults with a more sympathetic eye than we do sometimes popularly. Great. Thank you. Right next to you. Question for each of you. When youre setting out to do a book about such sprawling topics, what is your absolute first step in reporting . Great question. The first thing i do is try to realize how much i dont know at all. My sense is always to try to go back to genesis, to begin. If im writing about jim jones and peoples temple, where was jones born, where did he grow up . Try to go there and try to get some sense of him as i try to begin to understand. Id also like to point out and i think douglas and annie would agree with the, none of us claim we are she absolute expert on our books. One thing that is exciting is we get to learn, hour vows broaden and we sometimes fine out we believed one thing and were dead wrong. As authors were not experts. Were factgatherers and we try to present those in a way that others can share those facts with us. You know incooperate agree more. And also i try to report the breadth of the story. In other words, when i wrote area 51 i interviewed the pilots and planes and also the Security Guard who looked over area 51 found that readers responded most to his story. He was standing there, eyes on the ground, and what he saw was remarkable. Was different from the birds eye view and ive done that with all of my books since. I go with the ground warriors and then the smartest men in the room, the president s science advisers and i try to create a narrative that serves not only both sides but this way as well. I think what ani just said is important. If your looking for with monkey god stories had thousands of pages and it was important to find the story. But just as she found that guy in area 51, its about people doing something. This is what this is exactly what we do. We write about people doing things. If were not doing that, then were not even writers, i dont think. So, yeah, define the story and define the people that bring them to life. But about the map right there. This is primarily for you, annie. A lot of the topics you deal with are highly classified, the work is done in secret. My son works on darpa grants and i have no idea what he is doing. I seek out wise old men, and i mean that seriously because often the declassified programs occur at time in someones life when theyre an older person, and so the world perhaps lost interest in not everything is jones down and so the world lost interest in some obscure program that i might bring to the, fore but have not interest and they have not either and sources help me find where declassified adults are, what the key words are and they otherwise might be lost to history. And so in that manner im able to report on programs that people say, like, my god, this is all classified and how could we have not known about it and youre exactly right. It was meant to be classified, perhaps forever. Its often who is these thick troves of documents are declassified and shunted under some other program. That Security Guard i told you about at area 51, i had been trying to find out for months about a dirty bomb program that we did. Set off a dirty bb outside of area 51 in area 13. Cooperate find theocuments. Department of energy claimed not to know where they were. The Security Guard said to me, you mean project 57 . And i found them. Right back there. Mr. President , in your month can i monkey god book you write about people who are clearly concerned how they were going to be presented, and what the consequences of that might be, and i was curious about how you navigated that and how you built trust with those people, and then how you honored that trust when you told the story. For people who dont know, that was dougs earlier book. Are you thinking of the monster florence . No, no. Oh. That is actually one of most difficult problems any nonfiction writer faces. Im sure my colleagues have the same problem. You have to tell the truth if youre 0 nonfiction writer and the truth is sometimes very ugly and damages other people. And that is your first responsibility, but you also have to be absolutely fair as well, and you have to balance these things. Ive written books, nonFiction Books, and had people who will that was it, never going to speak to me again. Hate my guts. I feel terrible about it. But your first loyalty is to the truth, but you also have to be kind. I thought i saw someone right there. This is a question for jess. I was just wondering if you have been to the former people temp location up the street on hoover. I have not only been there, i have been taken therby one of the best researchers in nonfiction and all of america. I dont know if its true of annie and douglas but this is a good chance for me to say on behalf of a lot of nonfiction writerred, we all rely on folks to help us track down facts and dig through. Sitting in the front row is a woman named an collier who has, we with me on four books and made them better. Go everywhere the people im writing about went, and that includes from the little tiny farm communitiy jim jones was born, to going into the jungle in guyana and discovering to my great surprise ask dismay that the roads into jonestown have been completely reclaimed by the jungle, and someone handed me a machete. When all of us say we practically kill ourselves to bring you these stories, that is a lot truer than you might think, but i certainly have been there. Right over here. I have a question for doug. Have there been any astronomy related findings in the city . Thats a very interesting question. Not yet. Ill say not yet. But only a very small portion of the city has been excavated. They only excavated 200 square feet of over a mile square of city, and i would not be a bit surprised if there are astronomical, and this culture so close the maya were very much interested in the stars but the jungle is so thick bit they created a garden of eden. But going to be another hundred years of excavations and research there. Jeff, i have a kind of miner version of the same question. What happened to the compound . Jonestown, when the Guyanese Defense form came in was still and quiet. They could hear the sounds of the animals but nothing else and there were bids. There will over 900 of them in three layers. In the next few days, first the Guyanese Defense force, then the American Government went in to try log everything to take another out the bodies. So of the soldiers participated in looting. The indians then took almost everything that was left there that might be useful to them. Two things in particular you might find interesting if was able in my research to find a woman who had been part of the Financial Network for jim jones and peoples temple, and she told me that jones had in his possession in his cabin in jonestown, a bible, and written along certain chapters of the bible, in pencil, along the spine, were a series of numbers which only jones and a couple of his top lieutenants knew where the numbers for Bank Accounts in foreign banks, and she estimated, since she was one of the ones who helped set up over 16 million just in those accounts. That bible disappeared when the guyanese soldiers were in jonestown. Its assumed some soldier looted it and to this day i wonder in that country if there isnt some old man who used to be a soldier who takes out his bible, turns to revelation, and says to himself for the millionnt team, what damn fool wrote thing. So go home and check your bibles. But die think since i gave you this hint we should split the ney. Right here. So, you all write about what could be received as absolutely controversial topics, especially annie and area 51. Have there been unexpected consequences after your books have come out . I mean, only good ones, reporting leads to more reporting and there are devoce ol men Security Guards who then agree to talk to me based on the reporting did earlier to work with me to try to pursue the next story and tell the next story. The one phenomena was interesting because the subject is so controversial. Really respect the physiologists and the scientists and the physicists who worked with the psychics who didnt have a conversion moment but over time and the experiences they witnessed, the psychics would do things like find lost aircraft, find hostages, find big loads of cocaine coming into the United States, and over time scientists who had been skeptical shifted their position toward being open to the idea that there was an unknown, and those individuals who revealed that with me honestly, really was grateful for because they kind of put themselves on the line. This is such an incendiary topic. [inaudible question] i guess thats what im asking. When you books come out and then youre sharing this knowledge that nobody else had, did unexpected things happen after the book came out. I think my fellow panelistis always behind the scenes drama. Not only drama but when you go out on the tour for the current book, at just about every stop somebody will always come up and say, do you know what you ought to write next . And every ce in a while its a dam fine idea. Well, i did have i published a book in italy. This is not the monkey god book but a called the monster of floshes, and i had an Italian Journalist who was any coauthor and just as the book was being published, i was living in italy and got a phone call and a cinderellas said is this mr. Preston. I saidey. They said this is the police. Where are you . Were coming to get you. Thats hey they arrest you in italy. They call you on your cell phone. The book whereas two days from publication and the police got theyre hands on it and it was not a pretty scene because my then writing partner was arrested some accused of being a serial killer. And put in jail and i was accused of being an accessory to murder but thats a whole other story. Or another book. Hi. Im a survivor of peoples temple. Im not sure if you know, jim jones used to speak about socialism and communism. Do you think that the cia or the fbi had something to do with the murders in jonestown besides jim doing what he did . Well, thank you for sharing so openly and honestly about that, and i write in all of my book, assault roads lead back to nazis. Thats where i the defense depth goes for weaponries and i say that as a matter of origin story. So in many situations where paranoia is involved, which would be the situation with the peoples temple, it is very easy to pull in as an origin story the cia and the Defense Department. Also in each of my books, particularly in phenomena you see that somof tse threads of conspiracy or paranoia are actually factbased. As a journalist what i do in the narrative in addition to telling the actual story of the people doing things, do pull in the analysis of what others think about conspiracy and paranoia. Its a great question and a big conundrum. Get to see you again, herbert. Thank you for coming. What jim jones and most demagogues do is they take Current Events and exaggerate them to make people feel theres even greater danger for the moment. In jonestown, james jones was the only voice reporting the news from the outside world. And he would say things like by the way, lots of tapes on the internet and i would listen to all of them and he would go on for three or four hours and say things in jonestown like, ive just learned that the American Government has opened its first concentration camps for blacks. Now, we good, oh, how is that upon . 1978 he has a lot of older africanamerican followers who remember from their lifetimes, not only the cross, and the linkings but during world war ii the internment camps for japaneseamericans. He would tell the young people issue did you hear about kent state . The u. S. Army came in and murdered all these rich young white kids who were protesting the war. Then hell say to the young people, of peoples temple. Whenow poor and mostly minority, what do you theyd do to you . Her bet i went through foia acts and studied all the government documents pertaining and i have not found one eye ota of evidence there was a conspiracy and im sure the military would be glad they made him uncomfortable and im sure they tried to get defectors to get information. What happened there rested solely on the shoulders of jim jones. One of the more amazing or unacceptable thing is, the more conspiracy theories work with people. Time for onemer question. How about in the front row. In your book almost done i was fascinated by the role in and the manipulation by jim jones of the press and this was a great failure by the press in uncovering the story, especially with the issues now. How can the press become more aware of these situations and note be tricked . Always the problem for the Mainstream Media is that they are owned by corporations that rely on advertising dollars and have to turn a profit. And leaders, politically, religiousry leaders, business leaders, know oh thank you bring pressure the form of we can pull ads and bring lawsuits and it takes guts, not just for reporters but the editors they report to, to stand up to this. It doesnt happen as often as we want to. If it happened earlier in the case of peoples temple, maybe it would have helped mitchell personal opinion is jim jones was damn sure determined to go out with one final gesture and it would have happened somewhere sometime. But if wetruly want a press that is determined to tell the truth and to dig for matter what the consequences to anyone, theyre just out for the truth, then what we have to do is make sure the readership strongly supports that. Dont just sit back idly and say this paper is worthless, havent seen a good story. Get on the phone, write a letter and make sure voice heard. The only voices they have from the big advertisers. Readers count. Do something, just dont bitch about it. We have time one or two of you can tell us what youre working on now. And one or two cant. Im writing a novel. Im writing about the cia and i cannot say anything more. Im writing about henry ford and thomas edison. And their text to the cia and ancient temples. [applause] thank you all for joining us here and ive been asked to tell you theres a book signing immediately following this. She signing for this panel is signing area 1, noted on the festival map in the program, and also one of the volunteers in the room can guide you there thank you all for joining us. Thank you. [applause] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] book of there on cspan2s live coverage of the 22nd 22nd annual Los Angeles Times festival of books continues. Were here on the university of Southern California campus, on a beautiful california day. Now theres another author panel coming up this afternoon, this evening, and thats a panel on slavery and genocide, starting in half hour. After that, conservative author David Horowitz will be their talk about his most recent back and take your calls. Thats called big agenda president trumps plan to save america. Now we want to introduce you to a stanford law professor, mugambi jouet. Professor jouet, tell us about yourself before we dive intoure book. Well, unlike barack obama i was actually born in kenya. My father is kenyan and my father is france and i moved to paris where i grew up, and when i was 17 i decided to move to the United States for college, going from paris, france, not to paris, texas, but to Houston Texas and i decided to stay in america and write about how i compares to france and other nations. Host how did end up at rice university. Guest my parents win to universi in america. My roots american because my parents met at Columbia University in new york and i had that influence about the great education available in american institutions and want tote have a chance to broaden my horizons and move to the United States for college and the first time i came to United States i was eight years old. Came to california, to visit my father who had become a professor here, and i fell in love with the United States and going back to france, i kept thinking about america, its culture, history, politics, literature, art, so definitely when i finished high school i was very keen on moving to the United States. Host why did you say. Guest so many Different Things lovou