Road map. What was going through your mind, first to move you to write the book and then as you were writing it, to sort of take that approach where you were doing all these thing at one time imim going to teach you something, show you something, tell you something. Guest first of all, thank you for being here. Nor one of my back book cover quotes so that means a lot to me. We have been friends for 25 years. I dont want to talk about how old we are now. Just teagueing. But to answer your question two things happened in 2015. That for me were gamechangers. The first one was the riots in baltimore. Stephanie rawlins blake was the mayor. I was in shock eye. Born right after the riots and i never saw that so seeing an American City burn was shocking. The second thing that happened was the charleston shootings. The issue over the confederate flag, seeing nine africanamericans shot in a church by someone who to this day doesnt think he did anything wrong, doesnt feel bad about it, actually a white supremacist. I was in shock my country was in this state and i thought, i got to do something. So what i did was i i write books for women and normally womens inspiration, womens redefinition, transformation. Thought, im going to write to help the country, selfhelp book for america. Host its exactly that. Guest thats really what inspired me. The two events in 2015. I had no idea we would end up here. Wow. Host it is really telling in the book. Lets deal with how we end up here and what do we do in the space we are here because the book really takes us into that space you need begin to understand. In the in here you talk i think this us is one of to core argument you make. You talk about reclaiming our founders vision and you talk about three codes. The first code, we the people must engage be edge gauged in keeping vigilant watch over the government. We have seen citizens begin to do that going back really to 20042005. A lot of peek focused on tea party but we know this idea of citizens being vigilant. Keeping watch on the government, began to matter a few years ago if the courts are our most precious source of justice on many levels. Were seeing now an american president , as we see with barack obama, challenge the Supreme Court during the state of the union, President Trump challenging the rulings of a justice. Or a judge. We must educate our children and their children about the constitution. These are when i read the i was like, this is core. A key part of this book. Walk us through how those elements are important to not just this chapter about reclaiming our founder vision but what we as americans from this moment forward must be doing and thinking about these kinds of issues. Guest thats excellent. E pluribus one is me translating the phrase, e pluribus unum. Out in acin god we trust but the founders 3. Unity doesnt men we dont agree. But the Founding Fathers understood was that if they were going defeat the British Empire the 13 colonies could not be divided. They had to come together under this one ideal, liberty. The best defense against tyranny is, to my fellow americans out there marching, upset, on social media acting out, if you think this president is going be tyrannical or your government is headed in a tyrannical direction, unity is the way we beat it and how we keep liberty. So that is the first thing. The founders didnt agree on a whole lot. But what they did agree was a vision of unity, of purpose, unity of liberty, and unity of freedom. The thing theres you brought up. Core and essential to our government function is the three separate branches of government. The executive, donald trump. The judiciary, the courts. The thin to authority, the Supreme Court. And then the congress. Which is your article 1, your article 2 and your article 3 powers. Tried to break this book down so that anybody could read it. Didnt want it to by too High Maintenance and too up here. Its kind of the constitution in america and your republic for dumbies, me the biggest dummy of all. So i spent time. Im a lawyer and studied the constitution and worked on capitol hill, et cetera. So, yes, i probably have a better understanding as do you because your an attorney in government. Were nerd us but i wanted to break this down for people so they understood that your kids have to know about their country and their government. And to the republican for which it stands, we take a pledge, right . Our money says certain things on it. In god we trust. The spiel. There are symbols and thinks in our founders put forth that have stayed with us for 240 years. Theres no other country on earth, michael, that is still a republican, standing the way we. Rome was the last Great Republic and we know what happened to rome. But i think that this notion of the separate of powers and being vigilant. Paul revere talking about i i have heroes in every chapter and the reason i brought people into the book is i want mid fellow americans to connect with this notion of who and what made this country great. I dont think the country needs to be made great again itch thinks its still great. What im saying is the vision of being selfgoverning and vigilant and watching is the most sack row sank core thing to hey. Paul revere, chose separated by 100 years who really they called thunder countrymen to arms they were watcher and rabil rousers and provocateurs and so i think that we have that now. And i think thats a good thing. The court in my opinion, michael, is the most powerful branch of government but a they interpret the law andern force the law. So this travel ban issue we have right now, theres going to be a ruling very soon, the appeals court, it will good to Supreme Court because itself is a classic separation of powers issue. Does the president have the authority under article 2 and section 8 of the u. S. Code 1182 or does the power rest with the congress to create some type of legislation or make it more clear and change it or does the court have the final say this is unconstitutional, or mr. President were going to send it back to you and you need to tweak this itch dont have the answer for you. What die know is we are living out some that happens rarely, a fight between the executive and judiciary in a classic separation of powers. Host lets stay with that a little bit, and tie it into this idea of unity. You touched on unity. This book is all about unityert not just from the title but throughout the book. Thats the underlying we theme, that this works because were unified. We disagree but were still unified. How does that play out in this environment that we have seen, particularly in this recent president ial election . This book is probably one of the best timed books in america because, as i said, not only it is it a History Lesson to help you understand constitutional prims and values and ideas of the Founding Fathers, but it relates into what exactly is happening to you right now, right before you eyes, realtime. So, how does the unity piece work when there is so much disunity on the day after the president s inauguration, hundreds of thousands of people protesting that president. Guest and marching. Host the womens march and many others. Two weeks later were still protesting. You have a president who agitates. Who will go guest twitter. Host and go after his opponents. How is when does unity come into play and how does this book void prescriptions for turning that important corner to recognize how important unity is . Watney what i tried do is give us a road map you can read this book if youre in high school, college, starting life, middle age, older, whatever. This book is a refresher of civics but i wrote it in a way of we need also help. Were a little messed up. America is a great country but were a little confused right now by who we are and what we want. Thats what we are wrestling with. This unity piece we have to break this down because the problem that you saw in the last election is that half the country literally feels one way and another half of the country feels another. The people who live in rural america, working class, blue collar people who have been hit very hard over the last couple of decades with poverty, loss of jobs overseas, that is largely White America of a certain class, and then you have urban america which lives a whole different experience of unemployment and crime and donald trump had talked beside the hurt about the murder rate but we live disexperiences but we dont talk about that. Unity comes in that we live our country. Not we agree with each other or experience life the same. Does that make sense. Host it does but how do you reconcile that historically in the context of history . I mean, we can talk about the condition of africanamericans in Eunited States today and relate it back 400 years. We can talk about the mindset of White America today and relate it back to that same period of time. So, can you say that the Founding Fathers game a damn about unity when they owned slaves and treated women, they couldnt vote or participate in economy or couldnt participate civically. Guest i talk about that iyou do, and so help us understand how that is a Foundation Guest a great question. Moves us into guest the Founding Fathers are often seen as white men who were rich, land owner host they were. Guest they were and let me finish. They owned slave but theres a whole other context. Look at jefferson. The man had a slave he had a relationship with for for decades and had children and it took 200 years before we validate it happened. So Thomas Jefferson was the man who wrote, we hold these truths to be selfevident that all men are created equal endoweled by their creators with certain unalienable rights. How do you wrote those word do about we how . They were men of thunder times s and at the time these men lived, slavery was rampant across the whole entire globe. Not right, immoral, wrong, ultimately got abolished but the way shay saw unity particularly here was were unified against that crown. We have to be unified in that we dont like the taxation without representation. We believe in liberty. I know that their vision was correct and ultimate my what i love about my country is that the vision gets perfected over time. Women eventually do get enfranchise with the right to vote and own property. Sojourner truth, rosa parks, fighting for civil rights. Ultimatum mat these provocateurs in the book, these agitators they provoke and push to us live up to who we say we are. Host but that guest thats how is works. Provocateurs lets stay with that. I love where you talk about that in the book, you sort of alive that out and give example of it and hone it down but then you have to ask yourself, those provocateurs were provocative in a way that was consistent with the underpinning of the country. Guest absolutely. Host can with stated guest dr. King. Host mall malcolm x. Always found in modern american history, two figures that, while diametrically opposed were intertwined and that was king and medical come x malcolm x. I am always about getting it done by any means necessary. Guest absolutely. Host king was about getting it done. Mr. President , he said to Lyndon Johnson, you need to do this. Just want prepared to go by any means next. Guest duty dont you income malcolm made kings role easier. Host absolutely. Guest they looked at mall con and were like if i have to pick one of these two ill dill with king. Host this one because he is less volatile and less provocative. But even in that provocation is walt relefted back to our history. Can we say that today . Guest absolutely. Host show me how the provocations that we see, say what we hear about guest i dont light the burnings or lootings host not just the agitators on the street. Guest the president host the agitators in positions of power holm does that relate to e pluribus one. Guest there are two points in history, 1860, which is where were about to go into a civil war. This country is really at odds and then i would say the civil rights movement. Eye ironically revolving around race. Host one we dont want to have right now. Guest i bring those two points in our hit up to say they were times where the union, the republic was in real trouble. Ripped apart by the type of provocation we saw, whether it was hosing people or whether it was brother turning against brother on the fields of gettysburg. We saw a real ugliness but we ultimately survived and it we rose above it because we were unified, not maybe how we lived or want to do life but we were unified in that liberty, liberty is the core of everything about americans. Youve get nothing else i say today, liberty is the core of who we are. Makes is different from any other place on earth. The unity piece machine president of the United States fits on twitter and says the socalled judges all of us get upset because something in us knows that isnt right. That is a judge, duly sworn and confirmed judge. So lets not undermineunder unmine our powers and i was upset and into an argument over the social media that people dont want to go to white house hawse because they dont like trump. The presidencies i givinger than trump. Its aning constitution. I didnt it was right when brady cant want to go because it was president obama, and when theyre out of line we challenge them. That makes us different. Host thats true. But you still have the issue of how you just gave two good examplesbrady doesnt want to go because obama there and some new england pate at any rates dont want for goo because patriots dont want to go abuse trump there the undermines the core principle that we set out here. Get going back to code one. Guest if wouldnt have happened 2505 years ago. Reagan. Host i wouldnt have happened during the bush era. Guest i agree. Lets go back to president reagan to people were concerned about him. He was so conservative. But the end of the day when president reagan when co rate to Coretta Scott king had to get the Martin Luther king day he signed the bill. So i think your point is really great, were seeing us move away thats why i want told write this book. Im trial to real reel us back in to understand we dont have to like things, we dont have to agree but were losing resuspect for each other, were lieuing respect for institutions and what i found on social media in particular because as you know that changes the game we didnt have social media 15 years ago. Much less 25, 50, 100 years ago. People are not educated about their documents. So this notion of fake news now and all these things were talking about, people get on and they dont know what theyre talking about. And thats my big pet peeve. Know you document, know your history, know how your country is formed, and that is when youre armed for liberty. That is your best defense. Host sow you talk well get into the topics that your book raises, that are contentious on so many leveled today. You saw some believe that the framers of the bill of rights south to balance not just political ball but also military power between the people, the state and the nation, a. L. Lexer alexander ham continue explained if circumstances oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude the arm cannot be again the light the people while thirst a large body of citizens, infear you to them in discipline and the use of arms. Stand ready to different their own rights and those of their fellow citizens. Guest thats what he said. Host that is a Second Amendment argument made consistently and yet as a nation we still struggle and i think in a without understanding this principle how it relates to liberty. Walk us through your discovery there and how you write about that. Guest you know in this particular code, which i the last of the citizens codes the one place where i raise my own personal voice. Everybody else i host you say that. You say, look, this code is the one place in this book im going raise my voice and attempt to sway you as my fellow americans to come to some fundamental agreement. What is that. And its. Guest its because i understand, as you understand, as we should all understand, heat go back to 1770. Okay . And the sam adams, paul rev vehicles he veer they formed the sons of liberty. They theyre talking to each other and understand they have a problem but the one thing they understand is their guns are everything. And the irony is its the very thing that defeated the crown. The crown made it mandatory for every boy of a sirred time have a musket. It was mandatory. The crown did. The crown wanted to take it away. What they gave and what they realize it was we have a problem here. We must keep our weapons so i need the American People to understand that we all sandy hook makes us sick. Dont understand that. We weep for charleston and recognize there are people with mental illness, with issues we have to figure out a way i level live in the commonwealth of venezuela. Im a gun owner and group up in a mail tear house and aim a lifetime, nra member, bottom line is, i believe fundamentally in this principle because its what keeps us free, and if as hamilton was saying you ever allow the government to erode that particular liberty of that Second Amendment youre walk downing a dangerous path. I dont knee if for some reason our government went rogue and that would a coup detat, we have tanks and if it ever turned on the citizens our see movies like red dawn and others. People think that cant happen here. It can happenner here. It can happen anywhere. The second amount is fundamental to liberty and freedoms because people with guns, people with the ability to protect themselves, is really what the founder were talking about empeople like to bring up the militia argue. It the militia would was the mail tear. We have department of defense now. Jefferson and washington and adams were sitting here with us they would be like what did you people do . How did you every have stang army this anything we understand that times change but are you serious. Thaw would by afraid of that because in their cob text and their time thats king george. Host makes a lot of sense. Goes to in their view the idea of a militia was more people orenned and Less Government ordinary ore gleaned it was your neighbor, i can boyer borrow some gun powder host the government havingsing this Standing Army guest violatesviolates the e principles. Host the first bridge is from benjamin franklin. They that, guy if liberty to obtain safety is near liberty nor safety. Guest one of hi favorite quotes. I love these guys and that rattles people but i keep it 100. Host you do. Guest but what im trying to say is these men understood oppression because they had been oppressed. They understand religious percent accuse. They ordinary per accusation, thats understood a government taking more and more a crown taking more and more. After 9 11 happened i was a young attorney working on capitol hill and had gone into law practice and i practiced Homeland Security and cyberlaw which was a whole new spails at that time. One of the big argument when John Ashcroft was attorney general, this big arm argument between how much are we giving up of privacy and how much liberty do we give up now . Does the government need to spy on us . That is the boy who the boy that would host oh, yeah. Guest the. Snowden. Guest and some people see him also a patriot. Im seeing him as a traitor. I dont know. Theres fine line there. Maybe he was supposed to tell us that the government was looking at things they shouldnt be looking at and so i think theres this tension that the Founding Fathers understood and Ben Benjamin Franklin says saying if you give up youll lose everything you have. Host so we talked about core principles. We have touched on how we sort of reconcile these principles in light of what our Founding Fathers did and what i thought on the Second Amendment, for example, and what we are doing today. Militia versus a Standing Army, the role of individual citizens right to bear and the government owning that military industrial complex. Pursuit of happiness. What talk to us about that and why is that why is that important in this book . This idea that all these other things are going on. You take time out to break down guest host talk about that. Guest i think the struggle of any great nation is that when it evolves from particularly being our constitution is 240 years old. Right . Plus. And we still have a document that was written in the 1700s governing us in the 21st 21st century. Thats a little complicated but the notion of happiness is the root word hap mend Something Different than you and i hap was core value and understanding a way of living, morality, virtue, which i spend a lot after time on, family, god, the notion of being able to put food on the table to have my farm, my freedom to go and walk about if i wanted to, to serve my country, all these Different Things income passed happiness. The pursuit of happiness is the pursuit of life. Its a bit philosophical but jefferson wrote, among these are lifeliberty, and he pursuit of happiness so equated life and liberty and happiness and happiness being your ability to pursue the life you want the life michael and sofia wants the life any of our fell he americans want and thats critical because many argue in the 21st century, government has become more and more intrusive. Whether you agree with that or not, im okay. But more and more intrusive and regulations and limitations what we can and cant do now. We all respect the rule of law. Laws are important. But this notion of happiness is becoming when people are on antididnt depressants in america. Antidepressans in america. You. You. Host you talks about happiness but seems the comparison you just did to me is a little bit i dont if its troublesome or outside what i think you were touching on here. You say in this section, we americans love our freedom. We love our happiness. But in our pursuit of freedom and happiness we neglect other things. How does that what are those other thing that we neglect that gets you to be point that you use that example about mental depression and et cetera, et cetera and the impact on happiness. Guest well, ill take both of us conservatives grew up in a different time in this century. Africanamerican. Lets talk about our community for a second. Ill pick on my own community for a second. No community in the United States, if we break it down by racial demographics has suffered the breakdown of the family the way the black community has. When my parents got married in 1965, 87 of black people in the country got married. In 1965. I was born in 1967. That number hovers around 37 now. Depending on where you are, it can be less. Thats staggering. 70 of africanamerican babies in this country are born out of wedlock. Im not making a judgment. Im stating a fact when you begin to break down the institutions we have neglected. Were pursuing happy dismiss could get into a whole argue. Im ail big christian and feel certain ways but what im trying to say is that weve gotten aaron from fundamental core thinged that they talk about if you cant have sons there was nobody to work the farm. There was core fundamental struck their with a we did live for a long time. What we have seen since the 1960s, a disnotion of freedom. Freedom just didnt mean liberty, freedom meant i can go to wood stock. Anthony Justice Kennedy and essays happiness meant the that feeling of selfworth and dignity acquired by contributing to your community and civic life. To the last point, is that the piece that is missing now in this sense othesense of contribc life and contributing to the community as a whole happened to be about selfinterest . Guest i talked about this last night about those that dropped the f. Bomb routinely and i said come on, youve got small kids. This notion of Civic Engagement asks not what your country can do for you but for what you can do for your country. We dont ask that any more. Military service isnt compulsory as it is in other countries. We have gotten away from the time this movie hated figures was just out. John glenn and the African American women who helped put a man on the new committee was a time in the country everybody stopped and looked at a tv to watch the man on the moon. We watched baseball games. There was a time when we felt this cohesiveness even though we had struggles and issues there was something about us as a people that made us want to be engaged in our government and we were proud to cast our vote. 50 percent didnt vote in the last election. Something is wrong with that picture. So, call me crazy or whatever you want, ive got to Say Something because i dont like what i see. I dedicated this book to my my nieces that are teenagers and i see it in their generation if it isnt on the text or device, they cant have a conversation. Smart kids but they dont know how to engage. There is no interest whatsoever. They think its a joke. Host so this idea because of how we are pursuing happiness we tend to take more for granted then prior generations perhaps. But we dont connect it to any Civic Responsibility or engagement. So although people get jacked up crazy if you Start Talking about a law that says you need a voter id, so the first question i ask is when did you vote and it was a silence after that so to your point having engaged in a way that would justify the outrage, the beauty in america you are allowed to do that. So, how does that then turned if so, how do we turn that corner as a nation to get my nieces and the next generation that is going to inherit this great land iand all of its promise. My challenge with the cord they struck as they wanted the free call bridge and this notion. They are ugly. Youve got to pay your way. I came from a workingclass background. Not only a middleclass family we didnt have money or anything like that but i worked at the highest levels of education as a girl of color and i have to help my family and others come everybody pitched in. But it was important to see me graduate. Everyone was investing because they knew i wanted to serve and give Something Back so it wasnt just about getting a job. Thats fine if thats what you want to do with what we want to teach my nieces and your sign is that nothing is free. And at th the thought that somew somebody else should work hard and give you something for free is something youve got to get out of your mind. I get a little crazy about this because we are a republic, not a democracy and i will keep saying this. Fundamentally a different form of government, representative government. We are not socialist and i love canada but i dont want to be canada. I loved europe but i dont want to be in europe. What they did by leaving was profound, and i think it was a precursor to what we saw here. Not that people are tired of being told what to do. I think people feel like that pursuit of happiness is and what it once was which is what i was quoting Justice Kennedy that people want a good job, they want to be able to put their kids through school and have a vacation. They want to own a home and have pride about who they are and what they are doing. Host all of that for me as we walk through the book i wanted to try to give a sense of the elements in the book of how you structure this and i thought it was incredibly structured. Its not the last part of the book but for me its sort of stood out you started talking about the key leadership co. Points. You start with this definition meaning the ability is obliged and obligated to serve. But the French Academy defined this way whoever claims to be knowable must conduct itself nobly. One must act in a fashion that conforms with ones reputation that one has earned. The Founding Fathers clearly understood that was their bearing. There is an environment in which we have a president that could be a counterpoint to some of this particularly when we talk about presenting power to officials. Power cannot be absolute and should be checked and it cannot rest on one individual. It must be shared and balanced. How does this as a philosophy and a principal work with an Administration Aide to president that is an asymmetrical actor and has no bearing in the structures if you will end comes from outside of it and presentst it in many respects as he is known publicly to bring that down. Is there a concern that power does become absolute and is unchecked but more importantly to serve and be knowable do not conduct themselves in that way. Guest is a phrase i chose john kennedy as my people i thought exemplified this the best and that is because they were very wealthy and get john f. Kennedy is asking ask what you can do for your country. These are the kids that teddy roosevelt, wealthy, franklin roosevelt, wealthy. These are people in the book that didnt have to do anything. They saw the government as a calling and a purpose in a way to give back the value in it was seen as noble. To the commend president i do not support him but i am wanting to give him a chance and want him to succeed because he is the president of the country now. He is an outsider and is super wealthy that he wanted to serve. So i give him credit and i would love to have a conversation with him. I dont know that he thought he was going to be a provocateur to Say Something but he one. You could see the moments when there is pride and arrogance and i dont know what it is, but i think the fact of the matter is donald trump is still in a line of people with wealth. Absolute power is the issue people are struggling with now. Its not just this book that the constitution of rights and documents the news is taking power is going to be hard because we have to coequal branches of government and we can impeach. The systems as we have seen rhetorically host if you talk about the free press in the constitution, we talk about the free press and the Founding Fathers were clear about that, but then you have the leadership that says it is fake news. They are bad, they are not telling you the truth. But again, that undermines the ability so that is one aspect and the other wont be taken easily. The other branch of government, the judiciary is under fire. It is being undermined because you dont like the way does it begin the ground beneath . Guest they have consequences and so you say the American People wanted this . Guest you think . A good part of america i a am seeing serious when i say they have a conflict, so when i look at who voted for President Trump and i reject the notion they are racist and its lazy to throw that out there i think people were tired, theres a good group of people who dont know their documents. When you are informed and you understand what it can do you look at things very differently. I heard him say this morning and i am lauding myself guess if they are going to come into the process yes it would be irresponsible not to take the curious or take measures to protect the homeland but on the other hand, how do we do it . It does undermine the credibility plan she gets on tv and says these are alternative facts. I am a lawyer and i dont even know what that is. Host lets dive a little deeper. As i said at the beginning of the conversation, this is a howto as much as anything else and nah, you give some requirements a few virtues to adhere to. A leader walks his talk and is willing to stand on principles and if needed and governance of the nation and the principles do we see that in the current leaders . It can be President Trump or the leadership in the congressional house and senate. When we look at leadership do we see anyone doing that . Guest there are always a few, profiles in courage is one of best books written. Every generation will have a link like truman. In this generation i do not see currently are presently because we pursue happiness differently. We look at life differently. Breaking it down simple when you and i were kids and their wouldbe block parties and the neighbors knew each other and if so and so down the street was a widow and people knew she couldnt pay her electric bill he would take it a collection to pay her bill. We dont have that now like that isnt my thing and what i see is the leaders reflect who we are. Lets get real with this conversation. Donald trump reflects who we are as a people. Folks that dont like that im saying that, the reality tv culture, we want to fire people, we wanted to protect us then again, ghost people, we do all kind of things now that i see in the leadership that does not surprise me because it reflects us. Host lets continue on. A leader inspires hope, vision and character. Desperate for some but not enough. Cory booker gave a speech last night. I have known him forever but i do not agree with his politics, but i think that he is inspirational. Host a leader protects and defends his nation. Guest its hope they all do. Host a couple of memos we need to send out. A leader is a good and open communicator. Guest well, you know, whether you like what he says or not he will tell you what it is and he is out there with the rest of the masses so he would get marks on that. He is an open communicator, not effect of that grouping. Host a leader sets an example for people to follow and as a model citizen first before he can lead others. Guest he feels that one badly but he did during the election and we voted for him anyway. Host you noted at eas noteds the five building blocks. We talk about how this ties into these qualities of leadership. Where do we go from here . Youve touched on cory booker. Where is the future for the leaders in the country quite do they succumb to this realitybased culture where we respond to the lowest common denominator just to be cool and hip, or do we find ourselves, do the next generations of leaders lined themselves inspired beyond themselves in other words the willingness to sacrifice and election because principally this is the point that we have to make . Guest when people ask me about this it is profiles in courage meets courage, two of my favorite books. Both of those inspired me because they do exactly what you say. They call on us to something higher, sacrificial. The lines are blurred now. I dont think there is right or wrong anymore. In my household there is but in the country at large people are the lines because 25 years ago there were things we would talk about that now there wasnt marriage 25 years ago or a discussion about transgender people and that is now on the table. What i dont like as an american and i talk about this and i feel under assault sometimes as a christian and a person that is more conservative that if i believe in something and i say if i get attacked because i wont go with the rest of the crowd and that is problematic for me. I can see u us the roving ourselves more and more. That goes for the left and the right. I dont want people picking on the blacklight smatter folks because you dont understand their experience or like what they are doing. Host lets expand on that because after laying out these virtues, you then ask the question on leadership and certainly someone thats been an elected official who has spent time in a monastery with a religious background, morality mattered. It mattered to my public service. You ask the question do the mortals still matter what our wr leaders, do we see that as something that is important to a leader today that they look out on the landscape and say yes, i cant do that because my moral compass moves me in a direction . Guest i think President Trump changed again maybe forever. It could swing back that bill clinton was the first in my lifetime that we saw a president walk down the road. He took us down the road. But donald trump i dont know where we are or how to answer the question because i think it is too early to tell. I think we will have buyers remorse depending how some things shake out but the whole issue during the primary as you remember and during the general election about Sexual Assault or whatever, we looked at bat after hearing something so graphic and it was dismissed as locker talk and again i am a former republican as you know. As a woman, that bothered me and im still bothered that he is my president now. I see the hash tags not my president. Okay. I think we have a problem and its not just him. I dont think that matters anymore, and that is problematic because our founders, john adams he would be jumping up and down. Mortals matter a lot. We are not talking about failings, all of us do. I am a christian and i believe in redemption but i believe i need to live my life a certain way. My peers look at me and say that is an honest person, that is a moral person, she is an ethical good person. That matters to me. Host lets bring this home with my favorite president , lincoln. For so many reasons and in so many ways, he defined so much about what is in this book and he put it to test and lift it out. You look at the passage nearly all men can stand up to adversity that if yo but if youo test a mans character, give him power. You look at what he did and the country that he was president over, the times he served, that is how this book for me its summed up because a lot of the things you touch on in this book he lived out in some form or fashion. He had to deal with the adversity of his fellow men and women pushing back on him, those that opposed him and his leadership and he had been trying to get to the presidency. He ran up against the constitution, habeas corpus. We got the man now we are going to keep the body. So, he lived all of this out. How do we create a moment for the nation now where our leaders understand fundamentally and principally that what our Founding Fathers gave us was when the posts along the way. And they lit the way. He was closer in time for sure but he understood that. Guest for diversity is our strength. Always has been our strength, always. They understood the fundamental principle of unity. He made it clear and i talked about this, whatever i have to do to make the union to stay united i am willing to pay the price and bear the burden of whatever. That is leadership because he understands at some point he is going to perish as we all well and the union has to go on. What we do not understand in all of this bickering and fighting, i dont disagree. I have to destroy you now. That is a problem. We need to be able to disagree and six like Lyndon Johnson did and say we are going to hammer out the civil rights legislation and we are on different sides of the aisle. Someone was telling me at my hairdresser the other day. Host where you get the best information by the way. Guest she said Barry Goldwaters office was nextdoor and they would walk to the train and work on things together. They would have a drink together. That is what lincoln understood and why once we defeated the south he could have put them up for treason but he pardoned people and built the reconstruction because he knew we had to show grace and mercy to those that had been treacherous but they believed they were fighting for liberty and believe that their rights were under assault as long as you might think they were understood so that unity was the vision of the Founding Fathers and that it must live on in order for this public to stand. Host said he talked about being engaged in a great civil war. Are we in a civil war today is guest we have not come to blows yet, thank god. Nobody has fired the shots in a way that is bad government. South carolina hasnt risen up and said we are going to fight iran onyou on one of these. Host im picking on South Carolina because they started the civil war but the point is i thought South Carolina taught us a powerful lesson when those shootings happened. The unity that was displayed is an amazing place and segregated in many ways that people came together and they were humbled in a way they thought baltimore was burning, South Carolina across the bridge, blackandwhite power. My point here is we are different in the way we talk to each other and speak to each other. Its bad and its got to stop. I am all for us to be for free speech but you can respect and disagree at the same time. Host sophia nelson, you knock it out of the park with this one. This is a compelling reclaiming americas founding vision as you say. It is a pleasure to break this down with you and get a little bit behind the curtain if you will. Host you are just like a professor. Host appreciate it, take care. [applause] ladies and gentlemen welcome to the National Constitution center. Im thi am the president of this wonderful institution which is the only institution in america chartered by congress to give information about the u. S. Constitution on a nonpartisan basis. That wasnt as enthusiastic as the last time time so the patric devotion to the mission i expect