Such of bushehr, staff attorney for lambda legal, here to talk about the president s intention to ban transgender people from the military. As a transgender woman who served in the marine corps, what is your personal reaction to what you heard from the president . Guest i am really stunned and disheartened. These are brave men and women who are defending our country and living openly and proudly and i it was a disservice to them and their service and the secretary of defense and all the diligent work that has gone into crafting the existing policy, which has been in place for over a year without disruption. It has been implemented smoothly. Many women are so are serving proudly. When i was in, we lived in the shadows. We had to hide who we were. This move from the administration is seeking to step us back into that era of hiding. We are confident that at lambda legal and our service our sister organizations, we will be able to beat this attack on our community back. It is important that the people who put their lives on the line for this country are protected. Host you think it is disrespectful to the defense secretary and the military brass who put this policy in place. How long was it considered . How long did it take . Guest it took over two years to put in place and it was put in place, last june and the with the the way that the policy was structured was the right way. They went through an extensive study commissioned by an independent corporation, who looked at all the factors, medical costs, questions, they interviewed medical experts. They talked to the Transgender Community and discuss the issue with top brass band after carefully considering all of the different variables, issued a policy allowing people to openly serve in that has been a successful policy. I might add the question about cost comes up and that was raised in the president s tweet. It is a disingenuous argument. It has been disproven many times. Moreilitary pays 10 times for viagra than it would to Cover Health Care for the brave men and women who are serving openly as transgender. Host we will talk more about the cost. The legality of this. Against is the president doing anything that could be prosecuted or could be by gettingin court rid of this policy . Guest absolutely. Women who are openly transgender and serving our country are relying upon this policy that has been in place that they have already invoked and stripping that away would violate their civil rights. Not just that, in after court has held that discrimination aainst transgender people is form of sex discrimination that would violate the constitution. Host what is the legal argument from lambda legal and other organizations that are watching this . Guest a number of different causes of action. A policy move from the administration, and we certainly stand ready to respond. Would rangef action from constitutional to statutory arguments. Host the pentagon has deferred all questions to the white house and the general has said he is not doing anything until he gets more guidance. Guest we feel the tweets are very disrespectful and the way they did notnd take the Defense Department and discuss it with them. We are expecting the Defense Department to stand strong and not make any move and we have been really heartened by the bipartisan support from many different senators, including senator mccain and senator hatch and over 50 senators, recently. We wrote a letter to secretary mattis explaining that chan Center People should not be stripped of their protections and should move forward on the policy front. Host take a look at the numbers on transgender personnel personnel numbers. Only a small number seek transgender transitional treatment that could disrupt their ability to deploy. Health care costs would increase by between 2. 4 million and 8. 4 million annually. That is a big number. Guest you have to contrast that with the entire Health Health care budget of the military. It is less than 1 10 of 1 of the entire budget. The military spends 10 times more on erectile dysfunction medicine. And your what was your personal experience like . Were you serving in the military when you came out . How was the process for you and what kind of support did you get . Ago. i served a while i am a very proud marine. I was a scout sniper. It was a great experience for me and i loved it. When it came time to think about reenlisting, i knew that i would eventually be outed. You cant hide who you are. I knew that eventually it would catch up with me and the worst thing in the world for me at that time would have been to ,ave been discharged dishonorably or however they would do it because that would have been a disgrace for me. Instead of being able to bring my. To work and bijou im and serve my country and defend freedom, i was forced to leave. You decided to leave. Over you doing before you made that decision . What was your responsibilities . Guest i was stationed in camp lejeune. In the marine corps, they ship you all over the place. I served as a scout sniper. I love my job, loved my colleagues. It was an amazing experience the top me fundamental values of courage and stick to itiveness. Is shocking to me that this administration wants to turn its back on folks that want to serve openly and take advantage of those kinds of learning opportunities. Host for those that dont know, what does Scott Stieber mean . Scout sniper mean . Guest you go out and you obtain onormation, reconnaissance different operations and you are charged with surveillance and target acquisition. Informationnd get or you go on missions where you might have to use your sniper skills. I am really sad to see this step backwards that the administration is seeking to take in stripping the rights of being able to serve openly. Host we have divided the lines by those active and retired in the military, 202 7488000. All others, 202 7488001. Stephen is in pennsylvania. Good morning. Caller i understanding i understand what he is talking about. As a taxpayer, i should not have to support a political agenda that is not really part of the military as of now. It seems like this agenda has been pushed for about 10 to 15 and has becomee president as an attack on the way america presents itself to the world. If we get into a combat situation and it is a known fact that when females are on the combat field, men generally combatant oroman run to her aid, which i have no discretion on or no problem with it, but when you get into the point of pushing an agenda that is a persons choice, whether they are in the military or not, you are asking the taxpayer to provide the Healthcare Services to a person such as your gender or whatever it is. Mentally, certain areas are becoming very unstable in our military because of these issues. There is going to be a point in time where this is going to come to a head and everyone is going to start to think about what the constitutional decisions have to be, when it comes down to a persons choice of their life. You have that choice, but to force it upon a taxpayer is to say that you are going to do this whether you like it or not and we will take it to the courts and let them decide. If they decide the wrong way, you are tearing apart the fabric of the military institutions of the past 246 years. Host lets let sasha respond. Guest thank you for calling in. Just a couple things. Trans folks are already serving in many parts of the world, including israel and france and the united kingdom, with distinction and without incident. The argument that somehow allowing trans folks in the u. S. To serve openly would create some kind of disruption has not been proven. Desegregating our military was the same argument made with race at that time. The myth of creating disruption has never been proven. Host our next caller in maine. Caller i served 23 years in the army. It is extremely disruptive. It was disruptive at camp shelby when an incident happened there. York, there was a problem with one of the female troops when they found out that one captain was trying to put the moves on his female sergeant. I have seen it all. It is extremely disruptive. I served in special forces and you have to have type running units. I also served as a drill sergeant. It is definitely disruptive and controversial and it affects the smooth running of any unit where we require smooth cooperation between everybody and to have a gay or transgender person around is extremely disruptive to us. I respectfully disagree with your opinion. When dont ask dont tell was removed, the disruptions just never occurred. It just does not happen. Host andrew in north carolina, active or retired military. Caller good morning. I am a retired marine. This butant to belabor like the previous caller said, i had 20 plus years. Yount to start by saying to , thank you for your service, double dog. Devil dog. With regard to your point about the viagra. The only issue i have with everybody bringing up that number is, a lot of that is prescribed to people who have ptsd and that causes erectile dysfunction. That being said, i am fully behind you and what you guys are saying. Personally, i think it is a , trying to stop transgender people from serving. Anybody who wants to serve who is physically able, we should support them and trying to do their service. In trying to do their service. Thanks again. What goes through your mind when you hear comments like that . What does it mean for your effort, personally but also as a staff attorney for lambda legal . Aest i think it reflects diversity of opinion throughout the country. People are still getting to know who trans people are and there are a lot of misunderstandings and a lot of humanizing that needs to happen. We are just people, we want the same things, we want to serve our country, we want families, we are just human beings. There is a lot of work that needs to be done to move the ball forward and strip away some of the bad ideas that people have in place. It is really gratifying to hear the last caller, support from folks who have served or a longtime. I will add to that list, senator mccain and so Many Republican legislators who have come out in support of transgendered service. Host what can congress do, what can those members do who disagree with the president on this . Can they stop this man this ban . Letterthe senate set a send a letter to secretary mattis, asking him not to enforce this policy. The positive defense asked for a little more time. They had implemented the policy to allow the transgenders to serve openly. They wanted to do their Due Diligence and talk to all the stakeholders and develop a concrete policy on how that would look and folks from the senate sent a letter to the secretary of defense asking him, just for you advance in a policy that will harm openly serving trans folks, give the study sufficient time to look at all the different pieces and make a decision. That comes up in january. That is what the senate has done and i think the house is looking at a similar letter that would ask the department of defense to hold off on making any decision. Is reminding them of their constitutional obligation. It would violate the constitutional protections that trans people have. Host a congresswoman tweeting out the President Trump decision has the best interest of the military in mind. You got groups like elaine , founder and president of the center for military readiness. I want to show you what she had to say about this issue. There is no science, no biological science will say that by changing appearance, you can change gender. It just isnt possible. People who attempt to do that have a psychological issue. We can have sympathy for them families,sion, their to be supportive in various ways but the military should not be bullied and having to extend very expensive lifelong benefits to make these people feel more comfortable, even though for large periods of time, they would not even be available for deployment. Buchert, respond to the first part of her statement . Guest it is unfortunate. This is part of unpacking a lot of misunderstandings. We are who we are. Medical treatments health, but this is who i am, no amount of medical care is going to make me more or less of a transgender person. Thent know where congresswoman was going with that. Medical treatments to not make you a transcendent person. Do not make you a transgender person. Host welcome to the conversation. Caller good morning, and thank you. Sasha, i just want to say god bless you and and transgender out in theactually armed forces trying to serve their country. And the peopleat in the United States appreciate that. President trump did everything he could to get out of service in the armed forces and in this country, they call that being a coward and he still is a coward for picking on people that are trying to serve in the armed forces and he didnt. He didnt want to. I think it is ridiculous that he would make comments like that on twitter and that is really sad that we have a president that is a coward. You might not put this on, but i really appreciate it. Host any thoughts on what you heard . Administration has gone after many different vulnerable communities. Transgender people are not the first they have gone after. The muslim communities, women, immigrants. It is just in line with all of their other steps, attacking vulnerable folks. We will resist, we will stand up and protect our community in solidarity with those other movements and we will fight this. Host hampton, virginia. Caller i have to be honest. I have mixed views on this. For a transgender person to serve, that is ok. If they are finished with all the treatments and they have, i guess you would say, converted over, i guess it is fine. For a person to come in and then received the treatments, i dont think that is right. As a former recruiter, i can just imagine people coming in just for that purpose. You come in and get all the surgeries and that stuff and me personally, i dont think it is right. Host let me ask, what other health care does the military provide . Guest health care is a important discussion and there is a lot of misunderstanding about the care that not every person wants surgery or can have surgery. Thatpectfully disagree in people who owe openly want to serve the military want to serve the military. They are not seeking to obtain health care coverage. That are already 20 states. Xclude it it is not a question about whether or not it is medically necessary or helpful for trans cost isand the issue on not a good argument. , its not just the military is not just in the military where it is less than 1 10 of 1 of the budget. Businesses,true for for states who have added transitional aid health care treatment. Anywhere where trans care has been covered, it is just not an issue. Host greensboro, north carolina. You are on the air. Good morning. Let me move on to terry in san diego, on our line for active and retired military. Caller good morning. We have many that military bases in san diego, and they have a lot of transgender and gay in our military and the witnessed, i have they are having a problem because in the middle of the night, they closed down certain spas and things because they have too many inappropriate actions or parties and i dont like it. Ive hurt my knees and i have , i only get partial see transgender wanting to come into the military, and then after they are here, they want us, me, to pay for them. Im offended because i cannot get the care that i need for my knees and hes talking about viagra and that thing. Retired navyd person and i still cant get the care i need and why would we want to pay for transgender care . That makes no sense. I think you should get the care that you need and deserve, as a veteran and i hope you get it. I think that the central question here is whether the care that trans people need is medically necessary. I would argue that it is medically necessary and it has been effective and it has not been costly, in any way. Going back to the larger argument, or the issue at hand, it is important to restate that people should not be discriminated against for who they are. People that want to bring their full self to the Armed Services and defend freedom should be allowed to do that and should not be categorically prohibited from serving. Host the Justice Department says rights laws do not protect gays. The Justice Department filed papers saying a major civil rights law does not protect employees from discrimination based based on Sexual Orientation, taking a stand against a decision reached by president barack obama. What is your reaction to this . But that have any impact on this would that have any impact on this ban . Guest last week was a rough week for the lgbtq unity. Lgbtq community. Looking at the question of whether title vii, our federal civil rights statute, whether that protects against discrimination based on sex, including Sexual Orientation and the department of justice, uninvited statement of issue in this case, arguing that it doesnt, that people are not protected under the law against this termination based on sex or Sexual Orientation. It is disheartening to see this administration targeting our community. People should not be discriminated against. People can agree that people should not be judged should be judged on the merit of their workplace performance. No one should be judged on whether they are gay or transgender or whatever. That is not what the attorney general is asking. They are saying employers should be allowed to discriminate because there are no protections for discriminating against people based on Sexual Orientation. I think we can agree that that thatfundamentally wrong is fundamentally wrong and that the department of justice is just on the wrong edge of this issue. The law is the law, regardless of what position the department of justice takes and we are confident that this will eventually be won in the second set Second Circuit court of appeals. Host lets go to chicago. Caller i think that it is wrong to have to allow transgender people in the military because of the same reason is wrong to allow them in certain sports like professional boxing. Men are inherently stronger than changing their genitals or taking hormones is not going to make them week, they will still be stronger than women. Or a womanave a man doing the things that a stronger man would have to do and that is what you have. And i thinka woman it is wrong. Host what impact would that have on the military work . Guest it wouldnt. Transgender women are women and transgender men are men. Will come in different shapes and sizes. I play on a womens Softball League and i am nowhere near the best player on the field, so i think that is just not the case. There is always this argument raised the people are going to take advantage of the system, so we should just discriminate against people based on their gender gender identity or Sexual Orientation. These protections are already in place and have been, for many years. California has had nondiscrimination protections and all that has happened is nothing has happened. Participating consistently with their gender identity without incident. To learn more, our viewers go to lambdalega. Org lambdalegal. Org. We will take a short break. When we come back, Bloomberg BusinessweekNational Correspondent joshua green will be here to talk about his new book, devils bargain. Discussesathan turley the latest on the investigations involving the Trump White House and russia. Sunday on indepth, american educator, author and attorney chris is our guest. For different reasons, everybody has an idea that the federal government is out of control. And then the most asked question i get, as we teach, what do you suppose that is . What do we do about it . Have we been teaching the constitution properly . If we were, we would know what to do. Essential stories for jr. Patriots, in defense of liberty and sovereign duty. During our live threehour conversation, we will be taking your calls, tweets and facebook questions. Live from noon to to from noon to 3 00 p. M. Eastern. Sunday night on q a. I had never heard of him. I wanted to know how this man who had been told from the time he was a young child that he was not worth any thing could have had the courage and determination to find a way out of slavery and i was intrigued. Journalist and author Kate Lineberry looks at the life of when on to become a member of the u. S. Congress in her book, be free or die. He served five terms in the house of representatives. There was a bribery charge against him at one point in his career and he never fully recovered from that. That is one of the reasons why he is not better known. At 8 00 p. M. Ht eastern on cspans q a. Washington journal continues. Host Bloomberg BusinessweekNational Correspondent joshua green at our table and author of this new book, devils ba rgain. Meetdid steve bannon first donald trump . Guest a lot earlier than most people realize. I tell the story of how they were actually introduced in 2010, by a veteran republican activist. Trump had begun turning to tutor him and give some political advice on the idea that he was going to run for president and one