The ceo insisted there was no massive fraud. We will ask you today about the Banking Industry. If you think it needs more oversight in light of the new revelations at wells fargo. Different lines you can call us on. If you work for a bank, 2027488000. If you are a wells fargo customer, 2027488001. Ll others, 2027488002 if you want to give your thoughts on the Banking Industry , you can go to twitter or facebook. You can see this on cspan. This shows the backandforth nature of what took place. The headline and senatorrgo ceo Elizabeth Warren. Heres the story again, that hearing before the Senate Banking committee. You can watch it on. Ww. Cspan. Org heres a portion of that hearing from yesterday. [video clip] Elizabeth Warren the wells we believeent says in values lived, not phrases memorized. If you want to find out how strong a companys ethics are, dont listen to what its people say, watch what they do. Lets do that. Since this mass of years long scam came to light, you have said repeatedly i am accountable. But what have you actually done to hold yourself accountable . Have you resigned as ceo or chairman of wells fargo . The board have you resigned . I have not. Have you returned one nickel of the millions dollars you were paid while the skin was going on this scam was going on the board will take care of that. Have you returned one nickel of the money you earned by the scam . The board will i will take that as a no, then. Host your thoughts on the Banking Industry. If you work in the Banking Industry, 2027488000. Wells fargo customers can call us at 2027488001. Everyone else, 2027488002. Member of the Banking Committee with an op ed taking a look at the situation we start with john this morning. Rom jacksonville, florida a member of the Banking Industry. Caller good morning. I want to congratulate Elizabeth Warren on her performance. Tohing is going to happen bankers. The bankers and Corporate America pay the salaries of these politicians paid they own them. Washingtonl sit in these politicians. Is guy will sit in washington. N getting rid of glasssteagall it continues with obama bailing the banks out. What do we have to do to get these people to go to jail because they broke the law . Host why do you think nothing happens . You mentioned the funding or compin Campaign Contributions. Caller somebody needs to go to jail and the need to pay back the american citizens they ripped off. Host what do you do . Caller i would rather not say. Being on the very bottom of the Banking Industry, we have to work. , they needat the top to pay the price. Host gabriel in North Carolina on our line for others. Good morning. Go ahead. Caller good morning. Thanks again for this program. Thatn is one of the jewels keeps this industry of things moving in the right direction. Elizabeth warren is the champion. She is the only one that stood up to what really happened. Five years i want people to know that. Anybody just tuning in this morning, five years this went on. Their stock prices went up tremendously. They made so much money off the idea of just adding simple , what is most me frustrating is that people dont realize the connection that is there. You dont realize the Campaign Finance system, which seems at first glance like its not related, it absolutely is, 100 , largemoney a large amount of the conglomerate Campaign Contributions being made to even those members that were on the Senate Committee and oversight those people were taking a very dos ill approach. Docile approach. , with thetors exception of Elizabeth Warren, was the only one that called for legislation actual removal of ,his individual, mr. Stumpf everyone else was tiptoeing. Scandalsee all the candl stuff they put on hillary . Everybody listening this morning, there is an organization that has been rted between each state five states have signed onto it. This is a group aimed at trying to reverse citizens united. Go online and type in wolfpack. Hollywood, florida, a member of the Banking Industry. Rachel, hello. Caller i want to thank you for what youre doing. Voicing this problem that is going on. A bank in florida as a teller for three years. I left and went into marketing and got laid off from my job with 200 other people, so i went back to the branch. I spoke to my colleagues and said i would like to come back. You dont want to come back to our company, it is not the same company we were working here. If we were you, we would stay in marketing. Pressureyou think that came from the additional regulation that banks received after the financial crisis . Caller im not sure where the pressure came from. Its obvious its the tellers and the bottom floors of the bank that have all this pressure and are responsible for making all this money while the executives sit back and collect off of our labors. Host lets hear next from mary lou. Shes on our line for others. Caller it makes me mad when it comes to the financial institutions. Tried to go to court when it came to mortgages and everything because wells fargo tried to scam a lot of the blacks down been as well angst have banks have been profiting off of the poor. There is a website i had found over a decade ago, maybe around peopler 2000, about talking about wells fargo and other businesses that were ripping people off. I found wells fargo at the clinton bureau i did not even know who they were. They been corrupt for so long, destroying a lot of peoples credit. I would not trust banks with a 10 foot pole. Host three lines today. 2027488000 for those of you in the Banking Industry. 2027488001 four wells fargo customers. All others, 2027488002. It wells fargo customer calling us from east petersburg, pennsylvania. Jim, good morning. Caller good morning. Todaymotivated to call because i have some experience with wells fargo. The latest news is disheartening thenot only myself who longer does business with wells fargo because of 2008 meltdown i was one of their best customers, i had a large real estate portfolio. I was looking for a bit of relief because it was getting incredibly tight, especially for those folks that dont live in the 2 category. Just by a mere question, not only was i mistreated as a didon, but then they something to my account, they moved it over, reached out, did something i could not even control and it took months to figure it out. I was struggling to stabilize my portfolio. Up navigating through that situation. The deception and corruption is not at the level of Customer Service. It is at the heads of that corporation. Thew a little clip about ceo getting asked some basic questions and he was avoiding over doing the typical governance host in light of all the regulation banks get now, would you see more of it being a solution to this . Proponentthink im a for regulation, but the problem always is not the rules, not the laws, not the regulations, its the awareness and enforcement of them. When we have something, we see it is blatantly wrong, we get lies and deception. The board will take it, the board will address that and then it goes to the board and it gets washed into nothingness. Scapegoatthey find a and very rarely do we get justice. Is for real americans to make decisions with their dollars like i did. Do not continue to support wells fargo. The wall street journal with whipping wells fargo. The editorial this morning it was john stumpf who appeared before the senators has become a talking about this issue in his Opening Statement and offering his thoughts on the matter. [video clip] our entire culture is centered on serving our customers. In this case, we let our customers down. I Retail Banking practice issues and sales issues are not a reflection of our hardworking whotalented team members deserve thanks for helping our customers with their financial needs. I want to make very clear that nor wanted oured team members to provide products and services to customers that they did not want. Not good for our customers and that is not good for our business. It is against everything we stand for as a company. , i accept full responsibility for all unethical our retailices in banking business and i am fully ,ommitted to fixing this issue strengthening our culture and taking the necessary actions to restore our customers trust. Host gloria in phoenix, arizona on her line for others. Our line for others. Caller im calling in reference to my daughters account with wells fargo. She has apparently been caught up in this problem that has recently become public. She does not know who to contact to remedy the losses she received in her account from wells fargo. She does not even know where to begin. Can you tell me so i can let her know who she can contact about her account . Had aare you saying she fake account created . Host she had an original caller she had an original bank account and all sorts of things started happening she started receiving all sorts of charges. Now, we understand why. She has no idea where to start. So she the information can be reimbursed and remedy her situation . Host maybe someone else in the audience might have an answer. Robert is a member of the Banking Industry. Caller this is my first time calling cspan. I want to thank you for the program. Ive been in banking for 20 years. Congress i think the will find more banks that do this. As a banker come every day i go simple my job is you either make your goal or you. Ut the door i seen this coming. Oryou either make your goal you are out the door. Ive seen this coming. You eitherim told make your quota or you are out of a job. You have to produce a certain number of checking savings, whether it is investment referrals or credit card sales. You have a scorecard upper management gives you. If you dont make those quotas, you are held accountable for it. Theres something systematically wrong with saying to your staff if you dont make these quotas, you lose your job. Or your incentive is based on how high above your percentage your goals you make. You create this system of what has happened at wells fargo. I dont think wells fargo is the only bank that does this. Ive seen it at other banks have worked at. They use terms like this comes with the product and all of a sudden, you find that someone has a credit card. It happened to my son. My son got a credit card in the mail that he did not apply for. This is systematic and banking. Banking. They will find other banks doing this. They should not restrict themselves to the larger banks. Its being done at the smaller banks. Arrogancedo with the that came from and run that said we can do whatever we want and we will not pay the price for it. That came from enron. A wells fargo customer in pennsylvania. Hello, loretta. I think they all do that. They use money your money to make a profit. Everything is based on money. It doesnt cost anybodys life, but of course, nobody wants to lose money. If you regulate them, that doesnt mean they are going to follow it. The man did apologize. Who is going to listen to Elizabeth Warren . Shes as bad as Hillary Clinton the assassinate her. Or. The assassinat if you regulate them its just like they tried to tell you, dont smoke cigarettes, dont think alcohol, but people are going to do it. Host this on twitter you can participate on twitter and facebook or give us a call. From illinois on our line for others. Arlen is up next. Caller i was with wells fargo and they did me that way. I left them and went to bank of america. They sold me a credit card. Meeposit 300 and they told keep it for one year and you can and they reimbursed my 300 back. They aret trying to charge me 5,000, card o 5,000 for a i owe 5,000 for a card. They are messing up my credit. Im a Senior Citizen on disability. Host what should be done . People in office ought to be forced to return all that money. Should be going to jail for what theyre doing because they are stealing and robbing people without using a gun. Host that is arlen from illinois. A couple other stories continue to call in if you want to talk about banking regulation and the situation at wells fargo. This is a story about john boehner, a new job for him. That is in the New York Times this morning. At the race racery looking at the w in indiana. Here is that add. Washingtonts back to he voted to ban any mission. Ammunition. Antigun justices on the Supreme Court. I am not sympathetic if he wins, you can kiss your gun rights goodbye. Host one more story about fundraising. This is an the wall street journal was good this morning this is in the wall street journal this morning. Organizers say other donors have pledged support and their goal is to raise 25 million. There will focus on states with Important Senate races where mrs. Clinton has been far more than donald trump. Do banks need more regulation . Clearwater beach, florida. It wells fargo customer. Carolyn, good morning. Caller absolutely. The largest donors to the Campaign Members of the senate and hascommittee finance committee are the banks they regulate and the Insurance Companies and the stock companies. Until there is some sort of wall put between the fact that they are the largest donors to the campaigns of the people that regulate them, this problem is just a joke. If that happened in the real ,orld outside of planet d. C. That would be called bribery. If they are packing your campaign fund, you dont regulate them too hard. Person inl estate clearwater beach. Ive seen banks, mortgage companies, again with the same they are flowering all over the place. Ultimately, we just know that the public will bail us out again. Are saying the same thing we dont learn anything, we dont set of laws set up laws. The problem will go on. Calling Larry Summers the banking guru he was right at the beginning of the last fiasco. Next up, jeff in baltimore, maryland. In the Banking Industry. Good morning. Go ahead. Caller couple of quick points. First, great show. While this was happening at wells fargo in the retail space, i will stress that it probably is happening on Different Levels. I started in the retail world. Right now, working in the small corporate world. This is across the board. ,ou can see it more in retail but you can find us on Different Levels within the banks. There are still banks out there that care about relationships. About find a bank that drives on relationships. This is 100 driven by these regulations that came down the pipe in 2008. You look at liquidity premiums, the capital requirements, the rule, dodd volcker frank. There need to be regulators focused on making banks safer. Host larry in virginia. A wells fargo customer. How are you . One of the things i want to have ao note here, we home project credit card they give out, which is a subsidiary of contractors that wells fargo only lets you use. Sometimes i wonder when we use , we had their contractors come out wanting to charge 3000 or 4000 and we could not use a subcontractor which we did pick, it anyway and the price was like 500 to put this well pump in. Wells fargo has these little contractors that use for masquerading to get kickbacks. Host less than a week until the first debate between Hillary Clinton and donald trump. Hillary clinton is preparing. She is preparing for two different foes some of those advisors listed in the story today. Also participating, john podesta, jake sullivan, joe simpson and jennifer palmeri. Joyce from new york. A member of the Banking Industry. Good morning. Caller good morning. Host go ahead. I worked for a bank for 20 years as a bank teller. Slips where we would prefer a customer to Customer Service and they will open the accounts. The tellers did not have anything to do with opening the accounts. I dont understand why the tellers were fired. Mr. Stumpfsstand position. He hasnt done anything for the company. I think he should step down. If he was the head of the board, he should be answering the questions put before him. I appreciate it. Host from mississippi, this is larry. On our line for others. In january of this year come i purchased a new vehicle here in mississippi. The salesman told me i could get 1000 off if i would finance at least 5,000 through wells fargo. I jumped on that deal. I did not have any problem. , the payment was due and i called them both and they told me it was 5,127 and i paid it off and i received my title for weeks later and everything went great. Theres no need for more becauseons to the banks all that will do is reach members of congress the banks Congress Lobbyists to and American People will continue to be screwed. Thank you for receiving my call. Host carl in new work, new jersey. Carl is a wells fargo customer. Ark, new jersey. Pressure for justice i have does go different views. Two different views as an employee. I used to work in a certain aspany here that provides an employee, we would get a reward if we would practice a Certain Company policy which worked on referrals from customers. One of the biggest things with the scandal, they set the goals too high for employees. As a customer, i think more regulations will not affected. It will not affect it. Same applies to me host that is carl in new jersey. Another house race to highlight. Scott powers writing a new Television Commercial from the claims theity pac thes to pass budgets campaign responded by declaring they would pursue legal action. Here is the ad. You had one job, congress. Every year, there is one requirement. Pass the budget. Congress has not done its job. Took a 30 increase. Stephanie murphy, and you approach to get the job done. A new approach to get the job done. From california, a member of the Banking Industry. Here is john. Caller referring to the lady in earlier, therel is a law called the fair credit reporting act that allows consumers to challenge anything on their credit reports. The creditcopy of report and write a letter of explanation of why that information is erroneous. Hearings,the senate weve been in trouble since the glasssteagall changes in 1998. ,e need to have the enforcement the people responsible, like this lady that was in charge of all these employees, she needs to do Bernie Madoff time. She needs to do seven or 10 years. That will it their attention. Get their attention. The banks have gotten too big. Theres too many things going on in a Corporate Bank now because of the changes that have gone on since 2008. We need a lot of reform their. A lot of reform there. Congress gives the will and the power from the people of to ,et the right people in there it can get changed and hopefully we can catch this stuff before it gets to this outrageous level. Host colleen in florida. A wells fargo customer. Caller good morning, pedro. I was totally victimized by wells fargo. About eight years ago. I had an International Transportation company. Had the products i needed to run my business. I had in the test of 30 Bank Accounts and the assigned me a banker. To do was i needed supposed to go through this banker and he kept opening up crazy accounts. It was online, so i could close them up as quick as he could open them. The Corporate Office and requested another banker because i thought i had a crazy man. They said i could have another banker but they never gave me one, in spite of many calls. , it wasy had enough taking half a day every day dealing with banking. I transferred my accounts to bank of america. Which did not have the products that wells fargo had and it was more difficult to use bank of america, but as far as this opening accounts after i i had toll my accounts, the direct deposits from all over the world that some of the people did not get the notice that id change the bank account and they deposited the money into a closed account in wells and wells fargo accepted the money, reopened my accounts and was just sitting on my money. By the time i tracked the money down, they said you can come and get it host lets hear robert from michigan. On our line for others. Lets go to joe in connecticut on our line for others. Caller how are you . Wells fargo customer, my mother was a customer. She has passed away. She got a reverse mortgage through wells fargo. After she passed away, we were told that we had to settle our almost, which was 300,000 that she had spent. We were raised in a poor family of 10. She struggled really hard for us. She did not want to spend money. We could not figure out where she spent 280,000 and wells fargo could not show us. They never supply that. They put the house in foreclosure and the house has since been sold. No, i see whats going on here. Wells fargo scammed my mother. These people should go to jail. Host on twitter Marilyn Thompson in the pages of the Washington Post this morning talking about jill stein and contributions to her Campaign Efforts made by taxpayers. 10, good morning to you. Tim, good morning to you. In ohio on our line for others. Caller i bought a house here back in the mid1990s. I was making payments and everything on it. This in a letter saying i owed twice as much on my mortgage payments. I called them up and said wait a minute, i got locked in at 6 interest. They turned around and said no and i said if you are going to im like that other guy that called about losing his house, i said put it up in foreclosure and i will live there as long as i can and then move out. Is wells fargo going to from whenme the money i bought the house . Host the wall street journal overtime pay. Group of 21 states sues u. S. Over new overtime payroll. Mary is up next from piermont, New Hampshire on our line for others. Caller good morning. Thanks very much for cspan. I wanted to make a comment and ask a question. My comment is, seeing what happened in congress yesterday with Elizabeth Warren reminded me so much of the tobacco liedtives who stood up and to congress. Cspan makeis, does available the whole congressional hearing yesterday that stumpf took part in . Is there some way we can watch this again . Exactly if you want, go to our website at www. Cspan. Org , the hearing there is featured on our front page. There, click on various links, watch it in total as well as other hearings that take a look at banking issues. When it comes to yesterdays hearing, yes you can. Host thats great caller thats great. Has donald trump made any comments about Elizabeth Warren and her questioning of mr. Stumpf . Host good question. Maybe we can find out before we move on from this segment thanks for the call. Susan is up next. s bro, texas. Ottsborough, texas caller. Caller my daughter had a wells fargo debit card. It was given to her by the state of texas for her child support. It was deposited into this account and she could access it. Last year, when my daughter had moneyard, she noticed keeps disappearing out of my account. Its not a lot. I know i did not spend this money here. I cannot get Bank Statements from them. They are refusing to get a Bank Statements. I keep calling and they will not give me a statement showing where the money went and how it was spent. I wanted to make that comment, sir. Host susan from texas will be the last call on this topic. To members ofy, Congress Talk about various topics including funding of the government passed september 30 and other things. Xavier becerra joining us first. Later on, charlie dent of pennsylvania. First up, the president yesterday went to the u. N. To give his final address as part of the opening ceremonies at united nations. With therk times report. You can see this whole speech on cspan. Here is a portion of it from yesterday. [video clip] the number ofa democracies around the world has nearly doubled in the last 25 years. The world,orners of citizens are demanding respect for the dignity of all people, no matter their gender or race or religion or disability. Or sexual orientation. Those who deny others dignity are subject to public reproach. An explosion of social media has given ordinary people more ways to express themselves. And has raised peoples expectations for those of us in power. Indeed, our International Order has been so successful, that we take it as a given that great powers no longer fight world wars. The end of the cold war lifted the shadow of nuclear armageddon. The battlefields of europe have been replaced by peaceful union. Path and india remain on a of remarkable growth. I say all this not to whitewash the challenges we face or to suggest complacency. We need to write knowledge these achievements in order to summon the confidence to carry this progress forward. To make sure we do not abandon those very things that have delivered this progress. In order to move forward, we do have to acknowledge that the existing path requires a course correction. Often, those trumpeting the benefits of globalization have ignored inequality within and among nations. Have Left International institutions illequipped, underfunded, under resourced to handle transnational challenges. As these real problems have been neglected come alternative visions of the world have pressed forward. Both in the wealthiest countries and the poorest. Fundamentalism, the politics of ethnicity or tribes or sects, aggressive nationalism , a crude populism, sometimes from the far left, but more often from the far right, which seeks to restore what they see as a better age free of outside contamination. We cannot dismiss these visions. Washington journal continues. Host our first guest, xavier becerra, democrat of california. Good morning. Keep thean effort to government funded by september 30. Is that going to happen . What is the hold up . Guest weve seen this movie before. We continue to watch as we approached the deadline with the government will shut down. We have done this for several years now. Republicans are having an internal fight about where they should go. We had an agreement that was reached last year. Through a process just like this where we came close to shutting down government. That agreement was to take us through this years budget so we would not have a showdown on government budget, but here we are again. Within two months of the , republicans in the house said no deal, we dont want this deal anymore. Asts why we are here today republicans come close to shutting down government. Host what were the specifics laid out . Wast the agreement that reached last december, we would reach an agreement on the numbers of the budget and fill for eachmbers department. The republicans said we dont like the number we agreed to anymore. We want to change it. Senate republicans were saying we got our agreement on the budget. Lets do our budget and get it done. Republicans in the house said no. Thats where we are today. Now, very little has been done in this years congressional session. We have other things that are pressing. Like zika funding. Dounderstand what we have to keep our government from shutting down. Take care of emergencies lexi got. Like zika. Host theres an argument as to whether we pass a shortterm deal. Which works best . Guest did you had a Small Business on main street, would you do budgets on a weekly basis or two or three months basis when you have to make payments in advance considerations for what youre going to do in the yeaa year . Usually have fiveyear deals with local or State Government can try to finish up the remainder of the years budget. You would not run a business this way. Why would we run the largest economy in the world this way . Reached andgreement signed by the president or battle it out and see if we come close to seeing republicans shut down the government. Host 2027488000 for democrats. Republicans, 2027488001. Independents, 2027488002. What is the general proposal coming from the senate . Guest it looks like there is a greater chance for bipartisan agreement there. There are enough republicans willing to stick close to the previous agreement and also take care of emergency funding for zika. , the health cdc care experts are telling us they need, but its something. It keeps us from watching more american women from contracting more american women contracting zika. They are thinking because it is a must pass bill, they can sneak their stuff in. There are enough senators saying lets have a clean bill that does not mess with all these political items. Zika. E to stop host do you think democrats and republicans will come together on the house side . Guest i dont think its clear yet where it goes. The senate is getting ready to force the house to vote on something. That may be the only alternative. You still have a faction on the republican side saying no deal. Host you mentioned zika several times. Senator thom tillis put an oped out there talking about zika funding. Obamas while president rates congress the rates andess to do its job pass zika funding do you think about the argument he is putting out there . Have money in your pocket, part of it is to pay your mortgage, part of it is to pay your gas and electricity and part of it is to pay for your kids school. What he is saying is you can take the money you are using to pay your kids tuition and use it to pay the mortgage. We dont have to help you with the mortgage payment. You could, but at some point you will have to tell your daughter or son that you cannot go to college anymore because used their funding to pay the electricity bill or mortgage. Of course the president has money to do different things. We have money for our troops, money for homeland security, money for education. He is saying take that out of those other things because you havent spent it. You go down the line. You need to fund your government the way you need to fund your familys operations. Dont take money from the ebola account to help pay for zika prevention. Theyre proposing we take money tom the ebola account prevent it from spreading to take care of the zika virus. Host linda in pittsburgh, pennsylvania. Independent line. Caller hello. I would like to ask for you to answer this question. The president is the only person that can shut the government down. When you say the republicans can t the government down guest you have it reversed. The president does not have control of the first string the government shuts down if it cannot function. The president cannot execute the orders of government without the resources to pay for those to execute the orders. We are nine days from watching republicans in congress shut down the government because republicans have refused to without aa budget budget on october 1, legally, by law, the president does not have money to pay all those government workers to undertake their tasks. Shutovernment would only down if it doesnt have the resources to move forward. Only congress can provide resources. The president cannot order people to do something without it is as unless National Emergency and then it is recognized as something we need to do. It didnt mean our troops were no longer going to protect us. The president can order the troops to continue to operate. We can pay them back. Every other aspect of government would shut down. Host milton, florida. Ron is next. Is my first question you mentioned Family Businesses. We are 20 trillion in the hole. What kind of Family Business can continue to run in the red like that . , we have 1. 7 billion to control zika with an open border. How are you going to control a disease coming into communities here in america when they are walking across . tis been money with an open border makes the sense. To spend money like that with an open border makes no sense. A debt is to accrual of all those years of spending. 18,000, 18 children ratherbeyod dollars and youre right, we cannot continue this way, and that is why this budget impasse, playing out in congress is just terrible because not only does it affect the operations of our government, a keep he keeps our economy from being able to move forward, because businesses not know what theyll be pay by our government to fix that road, or repair that bridge. There is a Ripple Effect for the entire country and we create this chaos. I also want to make another point. When we talk about the 18 trillion national debt, we always forget to talk about our assets. You balance your debt against her assets. I dont think anyone would deny that our country is not only wealthy in terms of money, it is wealthy in terms of its mass resources and talent. I dont want to dismiss the national debt, because you cannot continue to spend that , i would takeber america over any country in the world. Our debt is a sign that we are not being as fiscally responsible as we could be, and we will start to reduce the surplus of our assets over our debt, and that is what we need to be careful of. Zika is being transmitted in this country not because of our southern border or northern border, it is being transmitted because people are returning or coming to this country, legally, from countries where zika has already affected a large number of people. You are not finding at the southern border, a lot of people transmitting zika. It is coming from people who have been in places like puerto rico where unfortunately, a lot of u. S. Citizens have contracted it. Over 15,000, coming from puerto rico. It gets transmitted from those who had it before or are returning from places where it is infecting individuals. That is what we have to deal with. The reason we have to deal with it quickly is unlike other viruses or infections, zika is deadly and devastating to a lot of people, including newborn children. In august,bo predicted that the deficit was going to rise to rise by 49 billion. What does that number suggest to you about the governments ability and congresss ability to pull back on those rising figures . Again, that if we dont get a grip on what we have to do, if we dont stop playing with the budget, things will get worse. You cant believe that you will spend money and not incur deficits. In that budget deal i mentioned to you, last year, there was another bill that road through congress that essentially gave away 600 billion in tax breaks over the next 10 years. Part of the reason that the deficit, that projection you mentioned is because they factored in the unpaid for spending that occurred through that tech spending tax break bill. You cant give away 600 billion in tax breaks and not have it show up next year in the budget by showing a bigger deficit. Was of that deficit growth the result of a bill that Congress Passed without paying for the cost of tax breaks. When you give away 600 billion in tax breaks, so with you and i would probably support. If they are good enough for us to want to support them, they should be good enough for us to try to find a way to pay for them. Does it factor in things like federal programs, like obamacare . Think of direct spending like departments and agencies. The money our government spends on education, one our troops, that held pretty steady for several years. What we have seen is when you give tax breaks, those cost money. When you are spending money through the tax code and you dont pay for it, that increases the size of the deficit. Much of the deficit can be attributed to so many of these tax breaks that have been provided the special groups of people, not all americans, without paying for them. Host democrats line, maryland. Caller good morning and thank you for having me on. I would like to speak to our nations budget. Contrary to what i am hearing, the budget the budget should be managed as we manage the budget within our own family. The difference is, and our families, we have discretionary and nondiscretionary income. The second point is there are two limits on our budget as we manage the funds. Number one is a soft limit which is our income. Number two is the hard limit, which is our debt. I believe that we should have debt, because debt is one of the disciplines in budgeting. Debt itself is actually the storage of the difference between your income and your spending. Going back to my first point, spending is discretionary and nondiscretionary. And if ie it around allocate a certain amount of money for vacations in my budget and i find out that i have a nondiscretionary expense, such as a medical expense, i will move it. Thinking about ebola versus zika, it is a good idea as a nondiscretionary concept to support ebola. Priorityave a higher nondiscretionary spending, it makes common sense. Host we will that our guests respond. Guest if you are comparing your vacations to paying your your daughters education, if you are running short on paying your Daughters College education or your mortgage, you will shave away some of the money from your vacation. I get that. I see ebola and zika as different from a vacation. There are few people who are looking forward to becoming infected with ebola. I know everybody would love to say they could take a vacation. It is easy to transfer money from a vacation pot to pay for your mortgage or your Daughters College. It is difficult to say you will take money from continuing ebola to spread to make sure zika does not spread because you know ebola is still out there and that americans could americans could still contract it. You are simply playing a shell game because you know you will need money for ebola. You dont necessarily need to take that vacation. I agree with the gentlemans point. You can shuffle your money around, but there are some essential activities. When republicans shut the government down, our troops continue to operate and that is because you have a Central Service of activities. Funding to prevent ebola, funding to prevent zika is an essential activity because the lack of funding tells people dying of ebola sorry, the people in congress had a fight. When he to keep funding essential services and those that are truly discretionary, yes, you can suffer the consequences of having some money taken from your pot, temporarily. Host independent line, tony from texas. Question is to the representative. Would he be willing to yield or at least listen to the idea of some of the young men like our friend in wyoming. When we talk about the budget, do consume do kent do some conservative things, yield the lawmakers and turn texas blue . You have a presidency, lets balance the budget. It all starts with a balanced budget, which is why found trump screw the whole thing up. There are a number of people who would be willing to listen to different ideas. That was sort of the idea behind the december agreement, last year. We agreed in advance on what we would have put forward for the budget for this year. We would avoid this constant shutdown of government or threat of a shutdown. That is where people yielded and said ok, you are not sure of exactly how things would proceed over the next nine to 12 months, but what we are willing to do is see the argument that we have to fight on a budget for next year. Lets at least agree on the number, and then we can figure about the details of how we spread the money, but lets agree with the overall numbers so that we dont have the potential for another Government Shutdown. There is a willingness to go there, the fact that he saw the senate move forward on a bipartisan basis with the that is of a deal and sort of where they are trying to go, but there is no consensus in the house. Host 202 7488000 for democrats, 202 7488001 for republicans, and 202 7488002 for independents. Guest that is a rough way to plate politics, by making others suffer on political acts in congress. I dont think we should use our government as a tool to run our politics. American people understand, if you cant do your job, a bu should not have it. Rather than shut our government down, i just hope the American Publics attention and recognizes this bickering going on, we are nine days away from having our Government Shutdown, not because we cant have an agreement that what level we should fund, its because some people decided to break the agreement that had just been reached. That is why we are having this fight and it is unfortunate that this internal civil war that republicans continue to have, plays out in our budget process because it can be dangerous. In august, you see the potential of Congress Going back to grad hands. Do you still think that is a possibility . Guest it is a high climb because 30 seats is a lot to win. I sense the American Public is interested in change and they want to get things done. Its not as if the American Public wants to have revolutionary change where they turned the whole place upside down. I think what they are asking for is change so we dont constantly see this discussion of a Government Shutdown because people cant agree on what to do with our government budget. The end of the day, november 8 will be important. I hope you vote however you feel you must, but vote. My sense is that most people will have had an opportunity to see what is going on, make a Fair Assessment and cast a vote based on their best judgment. Host you see as many vulnerable seats, today. What are chief among them . Some states are far easier to win reelection in, that others. At least 50 to 60 of those 435 ts are in the realm of they are really close, so they could go in any direction. That is where the public can make a difference because if they want change, if they want to have a congress that works for them and gets things done, and talks about making a stronger and secure america and not fighting the little political battles, i think there is a good chance that november the eighth, we have a different congress, which will hopefully, finally try to work with our president instead of constantly being a obstacle. Host is there a race you are particularly interested in . ,uest i was just in minnesota i was down in florida, weve got some great races going on. A young woman named Stephanie Murphy who is a dynamic person who will bring change. You mentioned her at the beginning. A very talented could do very well without running for office. Thankfully she has decided to give it a shot in Public Service. In minnesota, there is a young woman who has a really good chance of becoming a new member of congress. Two dynamic private sector leaders who said they would like to see the government do better. They are replacing republican incumbents and they would have opportunities to help us change. Host the Democratic Caucus chair joining us. Kathy from delaware, republican, go ahead. Caller the next thing that is going to happen is the government is shut down is that the liberal media is going to be all over it, complaining about all the Government Employees not getting paid and it is such a tragic thing for them. Most people dont realize, all of that back pay is made available to them as soon as the government is back in place. The democrats are so worried about the issue of money. Maybe they should be diverting the millions of dollars that are going to bring immigrants into the country, paying for their food, their clothing, their housing and medical care. Immigrants that i believe, most people are opposed to. We dont need them, we dont want them, and we cannot afford them. Maybe they should reevaluate where the money is being spent and divert the money where it is needed. Respect, youll due should look a little closer at what you just said. If our government shuts down, those federal employees do not go to work. If they dont go to work, they dont get paid. When the government shut down a few years ago, those employees that did not come to work ultimately then, when it did come back, they got paid and some of them did get back paid but that was because Congress Passed a bill authorizing it. Otherwise, they would not. Any federal government worker who is part of the shutdown will not get that pay for those days when the government to shut down, unless they are part of that indispensable group that must come in, our troops and so forth. Even though the government does not have the dollars to operate, we do pay them because they did come in, but we have to pass a bill that authorizes it. Under the constitution, our government cannot provide resources to people without having have the authority to do so. Check your facts on that, because our federal government workers, i will defend them because they do such hard work, you should recognize that the only get paid for the work they do, and the bad apples should not stain it for the rest of the hundreds of thousands of americans who work, keeping our federal government open. Point, i and the son of immigrants and i take offense to the way you put trade that because my parents never asked our government to do anything for them. They worked very hard on all their lives. My father when he was a u. S. Citizen could not walk into restaurants or other places because of signs saying no dogs or mexicans allowed. Maybe there are people who come to this country to take advantage of things. We know that there are people who come in and commit crimes. I will agree with that, but for you to categorize all those have lived in our country like my parents, i think it is unfortunate. I know and you know that immigrants are what made this country great and i know that your parents could trace back and ore to immigrants fog your forefathers came to this country to try to make it better. Immigrants that come to this country do not get benefits, they do not get free things. Folks who come in as refugees or people seeking asylum, we do grant them certain benefits because they are coming in under circumstances which demonstrate that they probably came with nothing but the shirt on their backs. Most immigrants who come in and get their green card dont get those benefits. If they get benefits, they could be reported. Deported. I respect your views, but you should get your facts correct because i will not sit here as a son of immigrants and let someone talk bad about people who make our country great. Host south carolina, independent line. Manyr there are too republicans and democrats in this country. We need to have more independent thinkers. Thing is the budget. One thing the democrats and republicans have is the funding for israel. How talking about [indiscernible] deny that there are people who end up doing bad things in this country, whether they were born here or came into this country and we thought they would do the right thing. I would agree with that, there are bad characters and if they came into this country representing themselves a certain way, we have the right and we should deport them as quickly as we can. No argument from me on that. What you see is that the majority of people who make a real effort to come to this country and give up everything they had back home, try very hard. On the issues of the budget, and of the gentleman engined israel and other aspects. Those are the debates we have in congress and the are robust debates. Whether were about should even keep our government operating or not, but hopefully we get back to those kinds of debates because you and others are entitled to hear what your present us choose to do with the dollars that you and others divide from your taxes. I appreciate your call. Host Campaign Politics from cbs news showing battleground states. A closeness between donald trump and Hillary Clinton. Are you surprised at that closeness . Guest it is a president ial election, i cannot think of one of my lifetime that has not run close, where one candidate is up , a week or two later, the other is up. We want to have robust debates. Money, too much dictates how much these debates take place, but it is good to see real competition. At the end of the day, what we see is secretary clinton is ahead of donald trump. Will that continue . I believe you will begin to see people make clear decisions. The undecided voters will start is set start to decide where to go. Host how do you think Hillary Clinton handle the basket of deplorables statement and the revelation of her pneumonia . Guest when you consider donald trump, she said let me apologize for having used the word half. She said some, and i would echo what she said, that they were clearly people who are whooyable deplorable have said deplorable things and are definitely supporting donald trump. In terms of her condition, i will say have you ever come to work knowing that you are kind of sick and that maybe you should come maybe you should stay home . Host sure. Guest me too. That is all she was trying to do. If we typically work through things, secretary clinton who was senator clinton who helped families of victims and First Responders got the support they needed after being there for some many families and victims. She was going to be there, so she tried to work through it. She said she should have been a little smarter and taken it a little easier. Host she found out on friday and kept it from the press. Guest she continued working, and you and i did not notice a thing. Host to be fair, we are not running for president. Guest that is more the point, she is running. On friday, she was told she is kind of sick and she thought she could go through it. Saturday, she continues she continues to work. Sunday, when she is out there for an hour and a half in the hot sun for 9 11, we find out. It fored to work through two days and you and i did not know. A lot of folks did not know. She says my bad, i should have taken the advice and menu by sunday i would have been well enough to go out there. Withinnd out, she always 24 hours. We knew she had pneumonia on that sunday. Know about Hillary Clinton more about Hillary Clinton than any other president. How much do you know about donald trump . How much did he pay in taxes this year . We know nothing about donald trump. How did his wife become a u. S. Citizen, because she is an immigrant. How did she gain her status to become a resident, legally in this country . We dont know. Donald trump said he and his wife are going to have a press conference to tell us, but they never did. How do we know donald trump is going to defeat isis . He says he has a secret plan. We dont know anything about donald trump. We are starting to know that with his socalled nonprofit, he has been using the nonprofit money to do private, forprofit activities like use a nonprofit dollar from his Trump Foundation to pay for his bills from his lawsuits. Host that was in the papers, today. Tost he used his nonprofit buy himself a portrait of himself. We did not know that because donald trump told us. We only know that because somebody is trying to do some digging and find out about a guy who is as secretive and unknown as you can find. We know that Hillary Clinton has pneumonia. We know a lot of details about her. We know very little about the altra. Host what is your confidence in her health . Guest she is a fighter. I am confident in her health, her leadership when she becomes president , because this woman she hasn more licks, been knocked down more times and gotten right back up. Not just by foreign enemies, but by political enemies. She just gets up and that is what i want, a fighter who knows how to bring change and will get things done. Host florida, democrats line, tom. Caller good morning. Making a quick comment about Hillary Clintons health. I agree with the senator, i am not concerned. I have had pneumonia. I dont think she needs to tell everybody right away every time she gets a hangnail or a cold. Guys are thinking how can we get both sides of the house talking again like we used to, prior to when george bush jr. Came into office. Ever since then, everything has gotten polarized, and nobody will agree on anything. Everyone seems to have forgotten, they were elected to do what is best for all the people, not just the people in your district, and i think it is really sad that anyone would suggest that we should let the government jet shutdown for political gain, just to just for whatever political ends. Anil think anyone listening right now would appreciate it if suddenly their paychecks stopped andyou call the creditors host we appreciate it. Guest the point top has made on the potential public and Government Shutdown republican Government Shutdown. Not everyone is a soldier, but if we shut down our government, air Traffic Controllers must stop working. If they stop work, then planes cant fly. If planes cant fly, americans can travel for business or pleasure or personal reasons. Down, government shuts food safety inspectors cant work. If they cant work, they cannot go into meat and poultry plants and inspect beef and chicken. If they cant do that, then that meat or chicken does not get delivered or gets delivered without having been checked to find out if it has a strain of a particular virus or e coli or something that is dangerous. If that happens, that americans might not buy that before chicken. There are important parts of our government which must shutdown if congress does not provide the resources. Not everyone is considered a soldier and worthy of being paid regardless of whether the government is operating. That is important to know. I agree that we should not be playing games with our government. The reality is a majority in congress and the senate, i believe, is ready to vote to pass the budget. Republicans and democrats, i partisan. The difficulty is the leadership , and it could be democratic or republican. The leadership will say, especially in the house, we will not put a pillow on the floor as we know a majority of our public and colleagues are willing to vote for this bill, even though there may be a majority in the house between democrats and republicans, combined. Until they have a majority of their republican brother and ready to vote, they will not do it. That is when the partisanship, the politicking gets in the way instead of having the majority rule. Host independent line. Caller good you please explain to me could you please explain to me why are we wasting billions of dollars paying government workers to take a weigious holiday off when are supposed to have a separation between church and state . Guest government workers would not be able to take that they off unless Congress Passed a bill saying that they will be considered a federal holiday. Bill, we ared the not saying to make it a holiday because you want to abide by or follow that religious tenant, we simply say we will have a federal holiday. It happens that we pass bills that allow holidays around religious holidays. That is why they become federal holidays federal workforce holidays. Not because of the religion, but because congress decided to pass the bill to make that they at all to make that a day off. Unless you make the distinction, it looks like what we are doing is using our government to provide a religion with more recognition. It is just that christmas, easter, but we also do president s day, fourth of july, but we do is we dont have a day off on the fourth of july because its independence day, its because Congress Passed a law saying we will take that day off. Clearly it is in recognition of the fourth. Head of the Democratic Caucus, thank you for your time. We will continue our conversation with republican charles dent from pennsylvania. Spot, it is our magazine with the problems of that is of Scientific Research and whether they can be corrected after this. Both bush and obama were prisoners of the situations that they did not create. On the other hand, they were both willing participants in the existing budget gang. This sunday night, on q a, author and Washington Post talksist Robert Singleton about his columns and the u. S. Economic performance under president obama. My opinion is not high, because he pursued policies that essentially were aimed at buttressing his reputation, his legacy and it seemed to undermine general confidence in the economy. Sunday night at 8 00 eastern on cspans q a. The Smithsonian National museum of African American history and culture opens its doors to the public for the first time, saturday, and cspan will be live from the National Mall for the outdoor dedication ceremony. Speakers include president obama and Founding Museum director. Also in attendance will be first Lady Michelle obama, former president george w. Bush and mrs. Laura bush, Supreme Court supreme Supreme Court chief Justice John Roberts and others. Watch the Opening Ceremony for the Smithsonian National museum of African American history and culture live, saturday morning at 10 00 a. M. Eastern on cspan, cspan. Org. Cspan, created by americas Cable Television companies and brought to you as a Public Service by or cable or satellite provider by your cable or satellite provider. Washington journal continues. His our secondguessed representative charles dent, a republican from pennsylvania who serves the fifth district. We just heard from the previous congressmen about the status of funding for the federal government and if it will stay open past september 30. What you think about the possibility of it not staying over staying open . Guest i think it will stay open. I am on the Appropriations Committee and we have been heavily involved. As of now, it appears that bill will be included and we hope that the compromise on zika funding will be reached. I remain optimistic that it will. I also believe the senate will likely launch the cr and send it over to the house. There may be other items included. I have been comfortable with adding a provision to allow the export import to fully function. That is something that is under consideration. There are other issues that could be attached. I am reasonably optimistic. I do believe the senate is going to move too quickly and i know Mitch Mcconnell but like to get out of town and harry reid would love to stick around, longer. This could get slow rolled a little bit in the senate, that i believe there will be an agreement. Why cant a bill just be a clean bill dealing with the cr . Guest i am very supportive of a clean bill, but a provision i mentioned would likely gather votes for passage of the bill. There was always a challenge, finding votes. Sometimes you have to add a provision to secure votes. A clean bill would be fine with me, but the Export Import Bank is a technical change we are making. One senator is holding up an appointment, it is not able to fully function, so changes to make it comply with the wishes of the house and of the whole congress, including a majority. Approach,ar as the the hammerson was talking about when discussing budgeting issues, he said it is better to have a longterm plan. Is the cr more of a shortterm plan or would you rather see something into next year . Guest it would be a huge mistake to take the continued resolution into the new year. From a republican perspective, in the event that and there is a chance, that Hillary Clinton could become the next president , and the senate could go to democratic control, why would us republicans then want to negotiate with majority leader Chuck Schumer with other clinton as president . Out rather deal with a shortterm basis. We should not let the next we should not leave this leftover business for them. We should finish our work now, into december. We should finish the balance and appropriations. Bill isary construction largely agreed to. We can get that now in the cr and then finish the other 11 before or around december 9. We can do one omnibus bill or break this out to a series, where you have disco or three Appropriations Bills two or three Appropriations Bills. That forces us into this yearend launching were we have to marry up these bills into a broader omnibus. Host you can ask charles dent questions at 202 7488000 for democrats, 202 7488001 for republicans, 202 7488002 for independents. Guest the United States senate has a much more difficult time passing bills on their own. It is a much more timely process. The house can move an appropriations bill fairly quickly. The senate, it takes a lot longer. The senate moves slowly. There are some members of our house who have difficulty with some amendments that get inserted into the bill. If you are republican, you are in the majority, so there is an expectation you should pass an appropriations bill. You cant count on democratic votes to pass them. There are members who can always vote for the Appropriations Bills because they may not like they have or objections or they cannot agree to the overall spending number, which has been agreed to. That is an issue, so we cant get 218 republican votes and that sometimes stops Appropriations Bills. That is an issue, and so many democratic votes to pass and that complicates it. Host our first call comes from pennsylvania, public in line, kevin republican line, kevin. Caller good morning and thank you for cspan. I am a republican and a donald trump supporter. I think one of the primary issues driving the campaign is the immigration issue. Not just ilLegal Immigration, but the whole Legal Immigration issue as well. I think there is a cognitive dissonance from the media. The media tells me one day we are making tremendous progress with respect t two robots and mechanization. Ubers going to be self driving cars, amazon is doing all kinds of things to mechanize their factories. Far mechanization, taking crops without workers. Tremendous advantages. On the other hand, the next day, the Washington Post tells us we need doing new immigration, unskilled and skilled workers. We need to increase it. It does not make any sense, because we are importing future dependency. Guest let me try to address your issues. The immigration system is broken, and i think regardless of your views, everyone agrees that the system is broken. , interiorurity enforcement are central to any kind of immigration reform. Since i have been in congress, we have added more Border Patrol agents to deal with enforcement. We have included additional scanning devices to help detect movement and allowed for greater secular and pedestrian barriers to keep people from coming in. The idea was to have at least 700 miles of barriers on the southern border. Mention there are critical labor shortages in the agricultural sector. Despite automation that has occurred, it is hard to find ag workers. We have to make sure the people who can come in to work, seasonally or on a temporary basis can do so, so that is a part of the system. It is to simply deal with border enforcement without while also addressing the visa issues. We may have to develop some kind of yes worker program. We have over 70 70 different the second is visa categories. Many people who are in this country unlawfully entered lawfully, they are overstating. Host from michigan, democrats line, lester. You are on with our guest. Caller good morning. My question is about the International Affairs budget and i know that right now, it is at 21 billion. I wanted to know if there was going to be any expectation of before thethe budget budget is done. Also, is zika funding part of the budget as well . Guest good questions. The serve on the Appropriations Committee and we deal with the state department and foreign operations. Essentially level funded for the fiscal year 17, the bill was reported from both the house and senate and it will likely be done with at the end of the year as part of an omnibus. I expect that to happen. We have done some things in that we made some targeted increases were necessary. For example, the peace corps received a bit of an increase. Ondont spend a lot of money the peace corps, to be honest, but there is value in that organization so we wanted to expand their mission where possible. See theine is, you will state Department Funding bill likely close to level funded by the end of the year. I believe that the zika funding issue will be dealt with in this continuing resolution that will be completed by september 30. We are talking about 1. 1 billion worth of funding for zika. I anticipate zika funding will be available to help the nih develop a vaccine, as well as the cdc to develop better diagnostics and other prevention methods, mitigation to eradicate these areas were 12 madewell may dwell. The we talked with previous congressmen who talked about the president already having a pot of money. Guest i agree with him to the extent that what we are talking about is creating a fema for disease. We understand when a tornado or hurricane hits or some other natural disaster, we expect government to respond. We dont say there is money for earthquakes but not tornadoes or hurricanes. One we provide money for zika, we should make it somewhat flexible, for zika or other particular diseases or pathogens. That is how we initially dealt h zika, we had access excess ebola funds. Tomay want to create a fund simply deal with whatever the disease is at the moment so the immigration will not have to run the Congress Every time any funding to fight a particular outbreak. Fund, becauseal these things can spring up at any time and we dont know what the next pathogen will be. Host on our public in line, tennessee, ray. On our republican line, tennessee, ray. Does Hillary Clinton and bill clinton say that they in six years, they go from broke to 250 million . Not only that, when she became theseary of state, speaking fees more than quadrupled. It does not take a Rocket Scientist to look at this and see that its wrong. This country is going in the wrong direction. Im not crazy about donald trump, but i sure do not want a crook in office. , andd that a few years ago he had the guts to get out of the way. If we put this lady in, we will find out that things are not going to go in the right direction. Guest new kind of tapped into our frustration. You said you are not crazy about either candidate. Of americans a lot are, we have two for the two candidates who are pretty high in unfavorable ratings. I cannot speak to it, i have heard the same things you have , like when the clinton said they were broke when they came under the white house, and now they have tremendous wealth. I think that is part of the reason why the unfavorable of the ratings unfavorable ratings of her candidacy are so high. People are skeptical and they see that cashing in on their service and they raise those questions. Obviously that will be an issue that voters will judge her candidacy on. There is not much i can add for that, but thank you for the comment. Host this publication had this, you saying you would not vote for donald trump and with the quote, he has crossed a bridge too far. Guest i said i would not support Hillary Clinton under any circumstances with the way she handled classified materials. Other issues like what the gentleman just mentioned. I have expressed my concerns about some of Donald Trumps comments over the past year or johnhether it was about mccain and pows, the disabled, mexicans, muslims, comments about women, the david duke debacle. , plusthings cause concern the lack of policy specifics and the contradictory nature of some of the policies just give me too much pause and that is why i said what i said. Host nothing could bring you around . Guest i think a lot of americans like myself neutered either need to be persuaded or are just not happy with the state of the election. Highcandidates have record unfavorable ratings. I think the mood right now is most want to make sure, some are supportive, some are less so. We are not monolithic on that issue. Most of my colleagues see the president ial race tightening, and that it will likely be a competitive race. It is fair to say that most of my colleagues would say that other clinton has an easier path. Donald trump a more narrow path, but that said, it is very competitive. Host have you gotten pressure from house leadership to change her mind . Guest not at all. I think many of our leaders are also conflicted. I was never part of the never trump movement. I was for john kasich. Not one of those people who was against a candidate, i supported john kasich. We are where we are. Host river representative charlie dent joining us from pennsylvania. Independent line, go ahead. Caller with the senators and congressmen now, it is nowhere near where our Founding Fathers envisioned. They did not envision someone going into office for 20 or 40 years. Thats crazy. But theyard it said, have to spend that time to make changes, thats a bunch of bullcrap. I would like to ask a question of the people listening, the actual working people. How are we going to look our kids in the eyes when we realize we allowed the government to drive this country off a cliff . You talked about members of congress serving for a long time and back when our country was established, back in the 18th century, a twoyear term was a very long commitment. Longevity was not what it is, today, we did not have transportation or to Medication Systems that were nearly as sophisticated and allowed for easy mobility. A twoyear commitment was a very long time. I suspect that the founders writing the constitution, today, they mightve written in a term of office of four years for a house member, but i dont see the constitution being change anytime soon. Some members to serve a long time, there is a fair amount of turnover. We have had a fair amount of turnover in the years. I have seen a heck of a lot in a fairly short period. I am on my 12th year and my seniority has risen quickly in 12 years. I have seen elections were dozens of members were swept out of office on at least three occasions. Host congressman becerra envision a scenario where the house could be regained by democrats. Do you see that . Guest in this cycle, no i do not. House republicans already High Water Mark with 247 members. You will likely see some erosion, but the question is how much. On a good day for the democrats, they might pick up 10 seats. Excuse me, thats a bad day. Pickgood day, they could up 20 seats, still short of a majority. While the presidency remains close, i do not see a path for the democrats to regain a majority in the house. I believe the president ial race will likely determine the outcome of the senate races to a certain extent. Many of the Republican Senate candidates are outperforming donald trump in swing states. Host democrats line from california, jennifer. Caller good morning. I am hoping your day is going well. That, i have lived through this recession that was recorded in 2008, only i suffered job loss starting back in 1996. For the working stiff, as a lot of us are, we felt the recession long before Congress Said one existed, or before the news said one existed. We have a serious problem with immigration in this country, mostly illegal. We do not enforce the laws of immigration, does cheap labor is what fuels capitalism and everyone points the finger at mexico. They dont point the finger at asia. There are a lot of illegal asians and even legal europeans in this country working at higher levels in the Science Field and text field, the same with india. This is the cheap labor you are bringing over here, and surprisingly, real estate is not going down. T suffered losses here, whorking person works 40 hours a week, someone some working 50, some working two jobs, they cant buy a house. A whatrage rent for rebecca one bedroom apartment is somewhere in the range of 1800 a month in california and with wages, the job im working now, i was lucky to make this kind of money in 2008. If my costofliving can go up, but my wages dont, how do you think that makes me feel as a person living in this country when i watch them bring in a legals to eventually do my job for half the cost and im supposed to be looked down upon because i like indoor plumbing . Thank you for your comment, and i think you expressed the frustration that many people share. Wage growth has been largely stagnant, although in the last week or two, we have seen recent reports that say for this last year, wages seem to go up by a higher percentage, although wage increases are still below what they should have been since before the recession began. Bottom line is, the way we are going to put an upward pressure on wages is through a dynamic and robust growth in the economy. I think that is the simplest way to do it. As long as the economy is growing at a subpar rate, that is not creating enough demand for work. To get the economy growing at a rate greater than 3 . There will be more demand for workers and when there is a greater demand for workers, it puts upward pressure on wages. Ahave been critical of this administration because many of its policies to not lend itself to grow. At times, some of these tax policies are also impeding growth, so bottom line is, we will need a major tax reform. We will need sensible regulation. I can go down a laundry list of regulations that are impeding growth in this country. Not by themselves, but cumulatively, they are having an effect. We are all against ilLegal Immigration. That is why i support border security. I also realize we have to fix the legal system of immigration. We have to have a system that works. You are right, there are people taking jobs. I should also point out in the industrial and manufacturing sector, we have jobs that are unfilled. I am told because people dont have the skills to fill them. We have to do a better job of training people for the jobs that are currently in the industrial sector. I see it, every day and that was the case during the worst of the recession. We saw such a large number of unfilled jobs. Host charlie dent is a republican from pennsylvania who serves the 15th district and the chair of the military construction and Veterans Affairs appropriations subcommittee. Republican line, harry is up next. Caller i am a donald trump supporter. Ont know if the and everything else. It is time we take a pause and i with pausing, thank you. Thank you, hope everything is well up in mount joy. Of the about the state manufacturing economy. Fewerthere is no question manufacturing jobs than 30 or 40 years ago, thats a fact. We have lso tell you, fewer job necessary agriculture than we did 100 years ago. My Congressional District, about 100 years ago, my district ep nel were working in production agriculture. That probably 22 . Agriculturaleatest power the world has ever known, the world od supply has ever known. Weve seen transition in manufacturing. Technology has caused islocation, that is very true, but i will tell you, every year i hold a job fair in my district we hading the recession, great turnout. This year we didnt have as great turnout. Economy is better, i have employers there, 50 to 60 have jobs, many in the manufacturing sector. They post jobs, they are jobs. Time quite often they cant fill the jobs. Some , its true, Manufacturing Companies are hiring on a temp basis, i can you a number hiring on a fulltime basis and people. Ing for so again, i continuing gets back to skills. Better job of training people for jobs that are available. That is not a function of immigration. I agree with you. We have to crack down on ilLegal Immigration and make sure the secure, as well as enforce the interior. Overlook the nt fact that we are not training people as well as we could for jobs that are available. We need to do a better job people working who are already native born in that way. Host santa fe, texas, independent line. Good morning. Good morning. Try to get it all in one word, im appalled. People up there in congress have lost their value of the true americans, where how they were founded, where they were out a re working, trying to make dollar. Who is paying for all these refugees . Am. Im 57 and ive been doing, farming and construction and everything. Who is going to pay for these refugees and their medical . I am. These people in congress have american ight of people, their founders, we came way back. Know, where have yall been . all have lost the perspective of true americans. How can you support not trump . I guess there is a lot there, john. Not much i can add to what you said, i guess. Say to you, ld youre talking about true i think youou know, talk about refugees. I represent Congressional District with largest number of syrians of any in the country, most syrians in my district happen to be christian. They have family members who are anileation from isis. I will tell you syrian necessary they havet and again, been in my district for a long time, this predates the civil war, for a long time. Will tell you, too, the take resffug does refugees. We took similar number of efoojees from ukraine, nationwide, 1800. The numbers have gone up in recently. This is not europe, we dont have their particular problem. Any refugees coming into the that part of from the world have been through a process, in camp for a few years prior to coming here. Understand your frustration, but the same time, i want to be honest about the vetting process about the people coming from the middle east. They have largely been in camps predated ars and they mamigration you are witnessing going into europe right now. Way, those arent all Syrian Refugees going into some are from middle sxeeft north africa. Thank you. Ost with recent announcement of the white house announcing 110,000 Syrian Refugees, are you okay with that . Guest i would be concerned about that number. I do k we have to be support greater vetting, we have process, but tting needs to be much stronger than it is. I would argue, too, particularly after what were see nothing europe, so many people coming in and they are finding out too are affiliated with bad sis and other groups, i take t the need to refugees, but think we have to be careful about the number. Host greenville, north hi. Lina, wesley, wesley from greenville, North Carolina . Hear me . Es, can you host go ahead. Caller good morning. People, in order to form union. Perfect what im trying to say, sir, why ant the republicans and the democrats Work Together . It is just a simple question. The people. We, the people. Hat dont mean whether we are country, black, white, whatever the case may be. Nderstand that this is a democracy, that means everybody want it to work. Of can we, be critical everything going on in the United States, if we are not working toward it, congress, of representative, senate and president. He told you how to think and work. Our countrynvest in and then bring it outward to countries. Guest the only thing i would say about working together, that in art of what i do congress. Serve in oppropriations and work to solve problems everyday. Some of my colleagues maybe try work well together, i to. I would let you know that i think there are a lot of people in good faith to find solutions to problems and often time necessary bipartisan nature. You are right, there is not enough of it, though. Annette on the republican line. Caller thank you for taking my call. I love cspan. I am so disappointed with you. His name. , i forgot i turned the t. V. On 10 minutes ago. So many problems in america, we have factories leaving america, taking thousands of jobs, weve got angcontrolled inner cities that are failing, poor citizens heroin g in the cities, epidemics, failing schools, 20 debt, at least 15 visa n illegals, many are overstays and yet no democratic stop any can plan to future illegals. Down ure trying to take the one person who actually is bringing all this up and talking him, slamming him with nonscandals, like david duke, he didnt denounce him strongly enough. Grip. Kahn family, i praise him for his son and all this stuff, with a ook trump apart chainsaw and had no right to do convention. Mocratic he has every right to his opinion, but when he slammed way he did, im sorry, himself very low key. Host okay, thanks, caller. Greekt thanks for your comments. You talked about a lot of i can add. Much else you talk about manufacturing, i care deeply about manufacturing family was in manufacturing for 100 years in this country. Understand and am sympathetic to people who make things. A manufacturing company, my sister and her late husband had a manufacturing business. Sympathetic. I dont like being told im unsympathetic given that is my familys origin has been for decades. We dealt with ups and downs and it all. S of my dad was at a Steel Company for years, one of the greatest in america, the company no longer exists. We went through that. Hear you and appreciate your comment. Host well be hearing later in front of the house judiciary at the e taking a look issue of irs, and the commission the you tell us what hearing will center around and how we got this this point . Guest sure. The irs commissioner, there was week to place privilege resolution on the floor of the house to impeach him immediately. I expressed reservations about that kind of approach. The subject ofis an impeachment should be allowed to present evidence and witnesses on his behalf. Process o provide due for anybody subject to impeachment. I believe there have only been impeachments of executive branch employees. Andrew johnson and bill clinton believe a cabinet secretary in the 19th century and that individual committed i recall. Imes, as the point is, we should go hrough a process with the judiciary committee, you know, weighs this matter, consider its arey and if they find there grounds for impeachment, present rticles of impeachment, this should not be on the house floor. T would set a precedent, not a good precedence. Donald trump wins presidency, i go tot want democrats to the floor and impeach an or we e they do not like think have done terrible things. That is not the way any should proceed. The hearing this week was result last week. Cussion out. Hat process play the chairman of the committee, concerns , expressed about the case. And that is why hes been to advance impeachment proceedings. If there will be impeachment proceedings, go through formal process and not simply on vertly mriticize this on the house floor. Deal with it in a deliberate manner. You want to see the hearing, 10 00 it starts, watch at cspan. Org,te irs commissioner. Understand the fact politicians on your houses, ou spend millions and millions tearing each other down, linging mud when it comes to issues like energy, regulations, business and executive branch that spitos congress with executive decisions and opening the borders. Guys are paper tigers, while obama goes around tearing down on your you sit back heels and are worry body keeping our own seats warm, spending millions of dollars on your madison avenue slick get reelected energy, education, i kissing the heels of teacher unions. Local. Itics is guest james, you said a lot there. I expressed my concerns and voted to override what i executive branch overreaches. I have a long list. Fiduciary rule, overtime rule, joint employer rule. The war against call or administration, the clean power that they are forcing that ill obviously shut down coal plants. I could go down the waters of the usa, i have been there. I understand your anger on that matter, but to suggest we havent tried to do anything is unfair. Pass the bills out of the house, that is the system. Sometimes bill gets through the senate, sometimes to the president s desk, he might veto dont have the votes to override it. That is the system we have. Executive to change order and im not being flip bout this, change the executive. Many executive order consist go away rather quickly in that manner. Change executive order, we have to pass a law. House, senate and president signs it. The president sign a law changing executive order that he had written . I doubt it. Sign a law. It would need override. I hear and understand the james. Tion, host pittsburgh, pennsylvania, line. Lican hi. Caller good morning, thank you for taking my call. Today . You host hi, tony, im good, how are you . Caller good. About, i need g someone to explain to me how sympathy for ch ll the refugees from syria or wherever, but there is be any sympathy americans. Tive before any more refugees could into america on american soil, why dont we doing something for native americans, who host toni uest there is refugee crisis in the middle east. I believe we have to deal with the issue there, first and foremost. I didnt say that in the previous call. He assistance we are providing refugee system largely going to that part of the world. We need middle eastern policy refugees from nt being created in the first place and when these people are displaced, we need to deal with them there in that part of the world. Nd i think there is partly failure of the middle eastern policy, to the extent the united as having washed hands of the middle east and created that, we vacuum, filled by actors who maybe dont share our interests now weve got refugee crisis. Simply ignoring what is going on of the world isnt going to make this problem get any better. Rethink our ally policy in the middle east and syriand for all end this civil war, which is largely e crisis. O much refuge host call on the democratic line. Hi, how are you doing . Ith all due respect representative dent, there is a law in canada that you cannot on media or any form of huge fine being hit you. And i think that is a law that in your position, you know, needs to bring forth is defining america big time. Im a political junkie and i see people telling true. S that are not i go back to eisenhower, 68 ears old, and i love this country and i think she can be ost beautiful, but like president roosevelt said, divided we fall, together we stand. We are not together, even on the facts. Something about that and i think that will be i t of the big cure because have wonderful republican friends and im sure you have democrats and the thing is, divides us. That host thank you, caller. Mentionedcomment, you canadians have a law prosecute people for lying, i wouldnt now, but we have First Amendment in this country that allows people to say a lot of protected. They are a lot of speech is in many cases cases untrue, e that said, in the political process, we have elections and out that way. It i cant really say much else you know, her than, a lot of ht about get their information from sources they are comfortable with and there is at times a lot of disagreement on basic facts. That is troubling to me f. We cant agree on the facts, its reach a solution or a compromise on a given issue if cant even agree on something so basic. Im not sure i have an answer, a lot of people get information from sources they are comfortable with. Rue on the right and left, people go to sources and it reinforces their positions, position on both sides and makes consensus harder to achieve. Call. You for the host charlie dent of pennsylvania, thank you for your time. To be with you. Host coming up, weekly segment, on magazine this week were going to look at piece by Daniel Sarewitz of new atlantis tackling the issue on money spent on Scientific Research and the quality of that research. Up after this. We were faced with heavy we were , over 12 , faced with the potential the last 24, but in months, weve turned the economy around. 500,000 more americans out of work three months ago. Weve had 50 increase in employment. Debate with Ronald Reagan and president jimmy carter. Decision to e my stop all trade with iran, as a taking hostages, i announced then and consistently then, if since hostages are released safely, we on items delivery which iran owns. We had adequate warning that there was a threat to our and could have done what other embassies did, strengthen remove our re or personnel before the kidnapings took place. The 2000 president ial debate between george w. Bush and Vice President al gore. Ill balance the budget every year, i will pay down the national debt. I will put medicare and social a lockbox and protect it. I want to take one half of dedicate to nd social security. One quarter of the surplus for i want toprojects and spend one quarter of the surplus ack to people who pay the bills. What past president ial saturday night on cspan. Cspan radio app and cspan. Org. Washington journal continues. Ost it is time for spotlight on magazine segment. We look at a piece found in new atlantis, journal on science and technology, a contributor, Daniel Sarewitz, joining us for topic. And hes a professor at Arizona Consortium fory, science, policy and outcomes codirector. Good morning. Morning. Od host the piece is called saving science. Say, science, one source of in deep knowledge is trubl. Why is that . Host indeed it is. Complicated reasons, but the evidence that were seeing suggests that huge amount of peer review literature is not reproducible, ot not particularly useful, wrong. Mes flatout this has become headline news, ut it is really not been taken seriously and it is obviously incredibly difficult problem for depend on ause we science to tell us what is real about the world and what isnt. Ost what is wrong with the research being done on science, the way it is collected or presented . With it . Rong guest the problem in terms of the academic system, mostly what m talking about, the incentives are not to do careful work over the longterm, to make sure that your results are valid and to focus on problems that matter. Incentive is to get publications grants in. R, bring it is bitterly competitive, difficult to make your way and the result, huge amount of bias toward trying to find things that seem headlines and get nupublication. It might or might not withstand test of time or more scientific investigation. On the u focus much science being done by the federal government, at least the research being done by the federal government. Can you explain to viewers how federal government invest in and Science Research . Guest great question. T is done in the private sector, appropriate, where technology and innovation happens. Has to be Knowledge Base upon which they can build and traditionally, that knowledge provided by government, which is appropriate because it wont you wont investment from the private sector. The government invests in all types of research, fundamental science, curiosity driven, it in developing knowledge around things the private sector wont, for example, support reth reth national defense, public goods types of things we cant expect from the private sector. About 140 billion a year, this is real money. Research at is for that is aimed at creating new knowledge to solve problems. The federal government says here is a pot of money for research, does it say this, does itr to say, look and see what you find . About doing that . Guest a dozen agencies have r d budget and range in the nature of the organization from the National Really foundation, which is focused on allowing academic scientists to do their own thing advancing knowledge, to the department of energy, which has Asic Research in physics and also attempting to help develop nolgs eNational Institute of health and National Institute in standards and technology, which focusos making sure industry has shared tandards it can use to act efficiently. Many different functions. Funder, e said, biggest biggest absorber of federal dollars for r d, department of has long been the case. Host we want to invite you to alk to our guest about the nature of research being done by the federal government. Quality of that. 2027488000, 2027488001 and 2027488002 for independents. How research is done . Does it improve it over time . Guest this is the right question. If you stand back and look at the world today that we live in in think of how its changed the last 40 or 50 years since the end of world war ii, think depend on thing you in terms of technological gps, to ucture from computers to satellite, to technologies emerge from Investments Department of efense made in focusing on military technology to win the cold war. It very much did steer science, scientists are uncomfortable acknowledging. Because it is really at odds of scientist n that is a free, intellectual launder launderer. In fact, the department of defense had huge influence on moved in, f science including invest nment university and creating fields ike Computer Science and material science and so we really, you cant understand and cantnce is going understand the problems of science today if you dont played nd the role dod in the first 50 years after the end of world war ii. Dod approach how they o science is a good model to follow . Guest i wouldnt say to follow it or expect dod to solve our problems, but i think there are important lessons not learned, lessons of agency that had a coordinated approach. It did everything from funding funding al research to the private Sector Development of the technologies, to research, in particular areas to solve specific problems. Allow s not they didnt scientists to have enormous freedom in solving problems, but focused in particular ways and connected knowledge to developer of technology in sector, to users in dod and elsewhere in ways very having lost that model allowed science to go adrift in many ways. Uncomfortable lesson because of course military Industrial Complex and we dont ant to think that is a good model for something that we hold in such esteem as freedom of to nce, but there is a lot be learned and i think we failed to learn the lesson and part of the problem today. Research was al done using dod as example as ood model or model to follow, where do we lose the model . How do we lose the model . Happened, end of the cold war, dods role in science become less important. Also, many of the technologies from dod ally largely investments dont require more dod focus. Valley, it no longer requires dod to keep advancing, software advanceing and so on. Many other areas, everything to health research, to environmental research, dont dod rules, by the more driven by the idea that scientists make great those will solve our problems. That is not a very viable model thinking sts are not about and working within the context of the problems, there is little likelihood the science created will be used. This is a difficult and controversial lesson. Calls lined up for you. William, new york, republican line. With Daniel Sarewitz. Go ahead. Push the button first. Go ahead and restart the question. Go ahead. Caller yes, i was apprentice scientist in 1990. An assistant doing yes n1990 i was working for a rofessor when i was an undergrad and we were putting together a grant proposal and him, hey, were ot synthesizing these compounds. He gave me sideways glance, hey, the way the system really works. E explained to me overhead charges and it really disturbed me out of the field. Pretty high Medical College admission scores and i real estate nto because i just didnt see much in it for me. Okay. Aller low salary and everything else. Host thank, william. Guest i think your experience is not an uncommon one. I talk to many scientists, dozens a year actually who maybe werent as clever as you getting early, end up with phd and wonder what they got into. System with a al importance to have your name out there. It is important to build teams to figure out how to compete against people in getting grants of there is a lot gamesmanship. What i dont want to suggest is explicitly tem is dishonest or corrupt. That would be too easy. You were ives, as suggesting in your example from undergraduate research experience, do everything you to get the grants and to get nto the peerreviewed publications and there is no patience in the system for care, things wrong, which is part of science, as well, and your way along. Host New Hampshire, democrat line, go, paul. Hello. Good morning. Is i am background phd in physics. I spent six years getting a phd in the u. S. And once i finished phd in physics, i couldnt get a job, even though im is i am back legal citizen a here. The first offered me 7600. To go ntive for anybody into fundamental research there are no se jobs. Host let me take that and run with it a little bit. Guest your experience reflects i think another problem with the system that i didnt discuss, growth of the scientific population, even as the leadership of the scientific says we continually dont have enough scientists. His is a theme that goes, i used to work as staffer on house committee, we had investigative in the early s 90s. The Community Wants more the tists to bring into scientific World Without really thinking about what theyre going to be used for. To a large extent, the reason is our graduate education forem is driven by the need labor as graduate student postdoctoral level. Paul, i think your experience not an uncommon one and reflects pathologies in that im concerned about. Host federal research and development for those working in the projects are kind of a the ing ground for scientists of tomorrow, arent they . Guest yeah, it is a great model. A graduate student, it is not just enough to learn about your field, you need to and to be a researcher that is a skill, a craft. You need too learn to do it, how o collaborate with others, write publications and that is what graduate research should be about. The problem is twofold. One, the system has grown far oo big in terms of Resources Available to fund scientists. Nd, i think, frankly professors, people like me, were too dependent on graduate work. Ts to do our we dont have incentive in scientific birth control, new nting the number of scientists in the system. People have these experiences that the last two callers talked it is discouraging. 2027488000 for democrats, republicans. For for independents, 2027488002. Denton, texas,om independent line. Go ahead, you are on. Good morning. I have a couple questions for you. Lac was supposed to be built in texas, we decided to not go couldnt deal with the retired veteran and though not worker, a scientist whatsoever, although everybody doing their part for humanity. What are we going to do to get back here and how are we coming along with nanofibers to with guest so the super conducting collider is the product you are talking about slated to texas and a lot of money was put into and cancelled by congress i think in 1994 or 95. A problem ofhat is two things going on. One, it was really only going to benefit small proportion of the Scientific Community, the rest know community wanted to what do we get out of putting this huge amount of money into one project. Successful collider that was believe, switzerland, i was international sxrkt one insufficiently international. The other thing is that, you simply there were politics behind it and when a particular going to gain all the jobs from a particular project cost en it is going to untold hundreds of millions year after year to keep this thing politics ou get local involved. Well, so e not handled the project, whether you think ood or not, fell prey to bad politics on the part of the department of energy in terms of their not making the case well, international partners, but local politics. S far as nanotechnology and fibers, i cant speak to the state of the enterprise. Think in the u. S. , this is an area weve had effective coordinated technologyled initiative around the nanotechnology smchlt ways it is example of the do of thing we dont enough. Ost from paul in maine, independent line. Caller yes, i might ask your i recently saw omething about europhysics magazine concerning the three buildings on 9 11, the world rade center, concerning they were like basically controlled demolition. That something that science is trying to iron out . Your comments. R guest i dont have anything to say about that, except i think of thing that, you know, having confidence in our scientific institutions is that we can ant so in fact trust the conclusions of experts. Ost when it comes to trust, you write scientists have been buffered at major bodies of scientific knowledge, published papers may be wrong. You have examples . Guest yes. Of t of examples are out biomedical science. I will mention a couple examples. I dont think this is only true biomedicine, i think the reason were finding out in stakes are high there. Were seeing, for example, 90 f Clinical Trial necessary oncology and cancer research, or brain roScience Research are failing at the commercial level. For a long time we thought it just hard to do research in those areas and it is. But the Companies Began to what is going on, and began to look at the science itself and found they couldnt replicate it. Is the thin end of the wedge that led to a lot of large bodiesf such of poor science. Were seeing a lot in iomedicine, it is failing to pass the test of technological validity. The science gets done, moves the private sector, the private sector realizes they cant do anything with it and turn i think allowed much greater degree of scrutiny o fall on academic science and why the science is in fact poor quality. So this trust point is really central to my concern in this dont have trust in the results of science, not hat we can expect all science to always give us absolute truth, but it can give us reliable knowledge, good basis for acting in the world that we cannot face in that, we are in big trouble as modern society. Oversight, if federal government gives money to cademic or otherwise, is there tugofwar between the government who wants to see what is being done with the money and saying, let us do what we have to do and dont get in our way. Fantastic question. The whole notion of science body rested on the idea accountability came through the peer review process, with who are entific peers capable of judging the technical validity of your work that keep the system honest. Turns out, that is not working. The same under pressures as the scientists producing the work, they dont things. Ugh time to do they have to trust the scientist whose work they are reviewing, redo the experiment. The whole thing is corrodeing from within. This is me time, important point that gets missed. We learned Biomedical Research establish cemetery having problem, is because were ee whenning time for application, the science isnt muster. In technology tis more difficult to know if science is any good in those areas of research, we have the same pathologys and biases that we biomedical science. Again, i think the trust is looms large. O simple answer, but part of it, we need institutions that hold the Scientific Community as whole, not individuals, as a whole, accountable for we vering the things that expect it to deliver f. They dont deliver those tis not enough to say, it is a hard to hold them ve accountable for making progress or explaining why they are not. A federal body do that for federal money being sent out . Too big of a system thas to be in institutional structure. Why dod wasdod, and able to successfully motivate science was was the very tightly connected to the applications. Fundamental basic science, science done around physics that created resistor semiconductor revolution, of society today. That Research Went on in universities, was still tightly connected to the industrial labs ibm and xerox and and so on. Ou knew if the science wasnt going in good direction, feedback from application into the science system that allowed course. Ay on i think we moved away from that in many areas. A this cant be done by particular regulatory or oversight body. It is a matter of institutions that conduct science and connectedness to each other. Point is often lost. Host saving science in the new atlantis, new atlantis dot the website. Daniel sarewitz is our guest, professor at Arizona State maryland, baltimore democrat line, bill, hi. Caller hi. Eah, i have something quickly to say. Think diagnosis here is entirely wrong. Difference between being technologist and scientist. Technologist does experiment based on best ideas and it doesnt work. Frustrating. On the id nt based be , there is something to discovered and it said the bjective examination of asuftion that leads to advances. Ith the introduction of translational motives in nih and programs, basically youve deince deincentiviced Peer Research for what is going on. No better example than the human project. The underlying premise for the genes works is wrong and were spending money doing be gs that are not going to productive and there is no room discussion in the community ecause everything is driven by motivated onally premise. Host got you. Me just say this is obviously a familiar argument to me. I want to make a subtle here, because i dont disagree with bills point bout the human genome project, but it is one thing to say that you have to justify every piece f research that you do on some application, whether or not there is reasonable justification for that or not. To say that thing science should be completely institutionally to do case er it wants n. Some its should. If we are spending on research to advance toward a solution of problems, we know how to organize science to do this. Itching s teeth are because he thinks we are telling scientists what to do. Im not saying that. Example, the r discovery of the transister bell lab, wonderful, bAsic Research. It was really done through exploration of phenomena not ell understood at all in the context of trying to advance the Communications Industry and done with very close alliance and ignificant funding from the department of defense. So we can have, you can have oth worlds satisfied, the worlds of scientists doing things that are fundamental on the one hand. On the other, in context where chosen are being those responsive to the types of problems that we need to solve. Be done, things can part of the problem i think in going on in what is science is that i think bills quite understandable conviction scientists should be told what to do does not necessarily cant all that science be usefully steered. It has been and weve kind of given up on that. You can end up with weird hybrids, the human genome many ways led us astray. Louisiana, rouge, barbara, hi, republican line. You . R hi, how are daniel, i wanted to talk to you i want to say, ive been applied research for many years in the area of science and Technology Policy and served as advisor to the National Science on these , as well, policies. You about want to ask today is your feeling, i agree with you on your historical dod, and the revolution of the policies. You about to ask today was your sense of the politicalization of science. Nd in particular, it is disturbing to me in terms of Academic Freedom in the that we find thought these days about scientists for their resear research. For example, Bernie Sanders wanting to investigate who dont agree with change and climate also corporations. Just want to get your comments on that. Thanks, barbara. Guest barbara, fantastic question. Really important. Is your thing to say observation is correct, scientists becoming increasingly politicized. Clear, both sides do it, okay. There is a reason both sides do it. Veryone wants science on their side, right . If science really s the source of legit mat truth, than other sources of truth, each sides wants to be is theirs. Im it part of the problem, this is longer conversation, but part of the problem, were asking to answer the types of questions science really isnt cut out to answer. Guidance, it us can provide guidelines, it can maybe suggest how to distinguish things, crazy ideas from sensible ideas, but when it difficult problems were trying to deal with, everything from Public Health whether youobesity, should get mammogram to climate hange and energy and toxic chemical regulation, these hings cannot be addressed in extremely precise predictive ways by science, we want to do that. Science has been driven in many directions, really not capable of handling very well. Too much from it. The result also is then youll often flicting, contradictory peerreviewed publication, each side get what wants to advance its own argument and the result is what for ay, mriticization, bad science, bad for democracy and it is integral part of the discussing today. Host yuma, arizona, odd ra, hi there. Caller i want to make two points. Multiple myeloma, when the doctors dont document enough to be reproduced by another doctor, that is the with. Method to begin as therapist, we have been limited by what is called therapies, where they wont pay for anything that is not evidencebased. Therapy, mes down to we havent had a of researchers oing sxout doing research and deciding this Therapy Works better than this therapy, so do this therapy. Cut back so much to where most therapies are cut year. To 1500 a in that 1500 a year category, not going to be willing to let do practice sxout for doing research. But it is just interesting dont have the Scientific Method being followed through, all the way through the to where one doctor can pick up a chart and follow regime, you ncer know, other doctor retires, should houldnt die, it have been documented. It is not being documented, merica, and nobody cares, not multiple myeloma people, not scientists, it is for money, paef parties and fundraising. Thanks for your comment. I hear you. I think that what you are seeing on the downstream end of the science, the problems with the biomedicine, are not unrelated to the upstream problems of research. That does of a group care. One of the people i interview in article is fran disco, head of National Breast cancer coalition. They care about one thing, they want to keep women from dying from Breast Cancer. They got so frustrated with the set of problems from the ones ou discuss to the most basic science being done by scientists and academic settings, that they have taken on organizing research themselves in a very much dodish way. Gotten scientists together, mostly on volunteer basis, to work on particular problems, like creating a Breast Cancer with e, and dealing cancer, is in breast which has not been addressed successfully in most cases. They are organizing their own agenda, including how to commercialize things and how to give patients affordable prices. The system cant do that because storys point, as your sad tells, there is no motive for doing that. In this case, interesting of how the patients did take charge and they really are trying to do Something Different the other of all problems. Host tiffany from oakland, democratic line. Caller yes, my question is, i dont know if is more of a statement. R it is a statement and a question. Y concern is the merging of like government and the defense universitiesnd the and technology and all of this money. Not forget about all this money, talking about hundreds of dollars, okay. And the guest said something interesting, he said, he just named a few people in talking only care about one thing and thats finding a cure and all this other kind of stuff. I find it very interesting level do ke on what like are these people infringing on other peoples right . Ok okay. Breaking laws and doing the things they are doing, people s holding these accountable. Guest in the terms of the roblems im looking at, these are not about illegal actions and it is not even about dishonesty, just the system is not organized to needs. Meet public your point about all the money is true, there is a lot of money out there. Say, im tists will not getting it and it is true, scientists y more than can possibly be served by the amount of money we have. Dont have to say we plenty of money to solve the problems we need solved. Organize knowledge creation . The National Breast cancer is example of an organization doing it themselves. Host any example to be found in nasa where they hire private companies to handle space flight issue . Guest that is an example of an nteresting and promising Public Private partnership, where i think it seems like private ing toward contracting with private things like to do deliver satellites and i think this is actually very for priate area Public Private collaboration and here cusee more perhaps of the science and the explor tory work being handled by nasa and the which will have government function, even though they are trying to move to the private sector. Yeah, this is a great example. Largely technological. In many e see that other areas, as well. Vehicles, great example coming together to allow things sector to do new couldnt have happened without the dod system that provide technology. Host norman is in massachusetts, independent line, hi, norman. Caller hi. Quickly, i know you are low on time. Six years ago, pentagon announced by this year the free and ld be ice wed need more ships to sail around the arctic. Year London University in sweden released a study the United States could stop emitting Greenhouse Gas by using clean hempen fuel that could be produced from biofarms. Gate wereme, secretary invested in fossil fuels and you see which way we have gone. There . U pick frup guest yeah, the only part i make in expanding on the issue if you have raised, want to look at an area, at a Government Agency or government ody that has not really politicized the science around climate change, which everyone dod. Has, it is this gets back to my point about dod, the reason is their mission makes them have to be clear sighted about what is going on. At sea ave dry docks level and you have to be able to as threats r ships mount in ways that are to be ctable, have you concerned about understanding what is going to happen to sea next 50 to 100 years f. It turns out there are new roots through the Northwest Passage because melting of ice, you have to be able to focus on that. Focused thinking longterm about security threat. The only thing i want to say, i dod has been oddly and urprisingly very forward thinking in terms of both technologies and understanding with climate on change. That is it tells you something about what happens a mission that forces you to get beyond the politics and think instead about what has to done. Host angela on the republican line. Caller my question is about why are we putting so much Money Research for cancer, societys and institutions, when there that the a lot of nutrition that people are eating is a large cause for cancer . So were putting our effort in area, in my opinion, youre eems like misguiding the public on were doing all this funding and research, when it is different as, we should take as far you know, quality of nutrition, this fast food, essed, you know, gmo guest got you. Thanks. So i think that the first thing be said, personal cancer is not one disease, it is many, many diseases. Secondly, there are clearly many causes, including lifestyle and nutrition. Do think weve loaded too much of our Research Molecular genetic approaches to understanding cancer at expense of and standing environmental preventative approaches. Overall point that we have not really had a and diverse broad approach to doing research on cans sxer that is again part of problem here. Host jason in via slae. Independent lines, were running jump right in. Caller yes, i was calling to anda question about eastern western medicine in the United States, when it will come auto er as far as for immune conditions and when i guess thyroid conditions will be more seriously for auto immune conditions . On that . The science i know when you test patients can easily useou somebodynt pill to fix up and they wouldnt know, but you cant necessarily put somebodys plate and test placebo, they would know it was broccoli. Quarantine testing herbs for allergys to see if they could do something synthetic. Opposed to guest two quick things, there is increasing realizization ways of thinking about treating conditions can be ubject to analysis to see what works. Eastern and western medicine, to years ings up, last nobel prize was shared by chinese researcher who iscovered traditional cure through looking at ancient text malaria used by the north Vietnamese Army during the war. Just a great example and now that is mainstream part of the western arsenal about malaria, great example of how we need to be openminded about the ources of knowledge and be careful about making sure we test them rigorously to see if they work. Strayed away from best practices what is the best way back then . Complicated problem, so much is in the culture of the institutions and i think for me, the best way is lets look for the places where were doing it right and really focus attention those as examples that should be replicated. Sciencelso try to is about honestly and openness, needs ientific community to take ownership of this problem and some ways fight back by saying we will not play the anymore. That is hard to do, it means, especially senior scientists who mostly hing to lose, tenure and secure petitions, they can afford to do this and some are doing it. But maybe more importantly, look for where interesting experiments like the breast things roup, are doing right and thinking about how to build on what we learn there to eally move the system in a new direction. Host the piece is called saving science, in the journal our guest Daniel Sarewitz is contributor to that teaches at he also Arizona State university, consortium of the for science, policy and outcome. Again, if you want to find more piece go to new atlantis dot com. Sarewitz, thanks for your time. Were about to go to the house of representatives, well take you there now. The speaker pro tempore the house will be in order. The chair lays before the house a c omnication from the speaker. The clerk the speakers room, washington, d. C. , september 21, 2016. I hereby appoint the honorable reid j. Ribble to as