Transcripts For CSPAN USAID 20240705

The group she alleges, this documentary, are you familiar . Guest i have for the families name but i have not met them before. Hello, and welcome to this special pride addition. I am the senior director of engagement and external affairs at the Atlantic Council and we are delighted for todays conversation featuring usaid admin Samantha Power is important to me and the atlanta commission. Todays conversation will be led by pulitzer winning journalist jonathan k parts that head of his own show on msnbc, at the head on the washington Editorial Board and a commenter on pbs. We welcome participation by those joining us today in person and those joining online you think the ac front page. Administrative power, thank you for joining us here today. We are very eager to hear from you about the Biden Administration and usaid priorities. Now i will turn it over to jonathan to lead the discussion. Jonathan thank you, this intake for the end vicente. As a sum in every teleprompter for a living, i felt for you because the script is so small. Thank you for that introduction. Administrator powers, thank you for being here to be a part of this conversation. Within the first months of taking Office President biden issued a memorandum that directed various parts of the u. S. Government responsible for Foreign Policy such as usaid to prioritize efforts to advance lgbtq rights around the world. Follow those efforts going . What have been the Biggest Challenges . Adminstrator power thank you everybody for turning out. We harness the energy to try to do the work in the world. Usaid is one of 15 agencies being responsive to president bynums direction to promote and protect and respect the rights of lgbtqia plus individuals around the wound. I feel fortunate every day to be at usaid because we have a toolkit. We have programming in Public Health on maternal and child health. We work with the state department and cdc that has, of course, made a major difference saving 25 million lives and 5. 5 million babies is the estimate for the good done overtime. That has had a particular effect on lgbtqia plus communities around the world. Beyond that we do agriculture and Economic Growth and inclusion, livelihoods work. In many parts of the world, if you are lgbtqia plus, coming forward to seek social services may risk something near and dear to you depending on the Legal Environment in which you are working. When the fallout from covid occurred and you saw such economic devastation around the world, given the fact lgbtqi had less people are often working in the Informal Sector and may have had, in some instances, less backup, the kind of crises that have befallen the planet have a disparate impact on marginalized communities and those that have in a sense faced. Does preexisting conditions including discrimination, violence, etc. We went forth. We tripled the size of our staff. We have the great jay gilliam that many of you work with as our lead lgbtqia plus coordinator. That position was filled in the previous administration. This fiscal year we had a dedicated pool of resources around 60 million doing everything from spot Emergency Assistance to people that need Legal Defense because they are being rounded up in some cases or addicted to working really closely with the state department to identify people that would be eligible for asylum or to become refugees because of their Sexual Orientation or gender identity. I would say you see a massive surge in programming and attention. For me, and i think the thing that jay has helped us so much with on the team, if you believe in the event met in 2023, actually, Scene Development outcomes which matter and reversing development setbacks that have occurred, it is not enough to have a little pot of money, or, a big pot of money, even, dedicated to lgbtqia plus. All of the program and we do on food security, education, health, b2b attentive and intentional about going out of our way to make sure that we are not just practicing development, but Inclusive Development. The Biggest Challenges, i am sure we will get into them and i know that many in dalliance in the audience are involved with them is criminalization. Even in countries that have already criminalized lgbtqia plus status, new moves desire to render more salient laws that might be on the books. Being ignored by work in places like uganda, because of the introduction of the antihomosexuality act, vigilantes and citizens and others taking what is happening in the legal space or parliament and getting signed into law and viewing it as license to do whatever they want, to vulnerable people. Its not just having uganda, of course, something that has happened very recently. We see the instrumentalization of the human rights agenda that so many in the world aspired to see progress being turned on its head and in places where antidemocratic forces are ascendant or are getting either support or supported or abetted, or at least not counteracted by authorities, you see those voices getting louder and even when there is not a law for legal ballast behind the voices that itself is terrifying and exclusionary. And a deterrent for communities to come forward and access the programs at the very time where we are seeking to make sure we leave no one behind. You brought up uganda. Also, your point about usaid having all these programs. But, there are countries where just presenting yourself to make yourself, to avail yourself of these programs could put yourself in danger. The question is, what is the u. S. Government doing or can it do to push back on what is happening in countries like uganda . Administrator power i would start with what i consider a statement of the obvious that nevertheless i believe needs to be set. You start from the proposition of nothing about you without you. These questions of tactics and how to prevail or how to counteract are super complicated. Imagine being part of the Biden Administration and tactical questions about how we move the Inflation Reduction Act and convince joe manchin to be part of that. When we are operating in someone elses country. Understanding the complex ecosystems from which we were drying, at usaid, very heavily on the expertise of our local staff, at least two thirds are nationals of the country in which we work. But fundamentally it is the communities that will be affected by laws that provide cues to us on how focal to be, how much to signal in a deterrent way in advance of the movement of a piece of legislation that risks putting the u. S. At the center of a National Drama potentially triggering nationalism and other forces are some historical dynamics, lets put it that way. But even what i have said is kind of simplistic because there is no one view. Even in an organization, people are debating at a fever pitch what the right approach is. This is really hard, but we do come in with humidity as humility and come in with humility and try to be in lockstep with groups we have funded in the past or are funding currently. In the case of the antihomosexuality act uganda has moved forward with, president President Biden was very clear that the law should be repealed. He came out with a public statement. He has talked, and this is one of the approaches we have taken not only in uganda but in other places threatening to put in place similar laws, talking about the effects, jonathan, on this incredibly Successful Partnership we have had combating hivaids. There is one report in uganda that shows Service Utilization is down more than 60 since the law was introduced. That is a people that are afraid of coming forward for Vital Health Services because they are afraid it could lead to their arrests or eviction or vigilante violence. Here we are trying to get this epidemic under control by 2030 part of this grand global coalition. And at the same time steps are being taken that would set back not only the health of lgbtqia plus communities but the health of all you bond ends. In this sense, looking at what the practical effects are of being seen to license Community Involvement in discrimination stigmatization and even law enforcement. You see citizens again taking things into their own hands. Trying to find also arguments that have broad appeal in services or programs that a broad swath of the societies in which we work are enthusiastic about, showing the link between those, for example, private sector investments. There is not one country in which usaid works that is not interested in fielding Economic Growth, recovering from covid and getting young people to work. The Multinational Companies we in the Congress Department and state department have been working with to try to encourage them to invest in these countries, their own antidiscrimination policies and values are not going to make that an attractive place for investment. So its a combination of the state Department Taking steps now, potentially, to sanction individuals involved in the measure in uganda. That is something that has been measured publicly and again these practical effects that will extend practical harm that will extend beyond if the law is not repealed. Lets talk about another country. In response to my question about uganda, talking to groups on the ground getting their input into what usaid and the u. S. Government should do. Lets talk about ukraine. There is a war going on. Hopefully at some point the war will end and reconstruction will begin. Where does the Lgbtq Community come into the conversation about rebuilding, both from making sure they are hold in ukrainian society, but also, that their rights are protected and respected . Administrator power well this is a complex issue i could come at a couple ways. First let me say that part of putins motivation for invading ukraine was watching ukrainian society, the Ukrainian Government move at a really rapid pace to integrate itself into europe. Yes, that carries with it a lot of economic benefits for young people in ukraine. But, much of the impetus behind what was between 2013 and last year, such a shift, right . In an orientation that went in one direction then shifted into another direction. Much of that was valuesbased. That does not mean everyone was with all aspects of the european agenda or programmer convention on human rights immediately. We have seen that, of course. But, part of what ukraine is fighting for and part of what russia is trying to squelch is liberalization. Its a broad understanding of who human rights protections apply to. Now, again, that is a kind of general statement. What we do, shall i say, in of course following russias invasion, ukraines work to liberalize and build checks and balances and build in human rights protections, although not making headlines in the american or european media, that work has accelerated. Which is, frankly, remarkable that a country fighting for its life and people can walk and chew gum at the same time. Meaning, you see lgbtqia protections progressing not only through legislative measures and regulation, and, as the ukrainians have had, programs to vet judges. Their human rights credentials being assessed in a much more comprehensive way, but also, again, as parts of the economy flourish, and this is hard to believe, but the Technology Sector grew by 7 or 8 last year. That itself, young people being out and integrated in the world, there are just things happening in society that i think will put ukraine, above all, it in a much more supportive legal and social ecosystem as the whole rationale for the war is about integrating into europe and the criteria by which ukraine will need to meet, the roadmap and so forth, that will entail much stronger protections that have existed in the past. Point about reconstruction, that is incumbent on the intentionality i was talking about. Usaid is a critical partner. I was just meeting with the minister of finance yesterday talking about reconstruction out of the recent conference in the United Kingdom thinking about procurement and nondiscrimination. How are those checks and protections built in . Now we think about Health Services and making sure that those are restored every place we can, even places close to the front line or territories liberated. How does usaid support flow in a manner where we are constantly vigilant to how inclusive those services are and whether or not they are provided . We have managed to distribute like 16 million antiretrovirals in ukraine just since the war has started. So, in terms of the mainstream programs, those have continued. We have managed to keep those afloat and that took real intentionality on the part of our health team and our ukraine team. Again, i think the principle we want to bring to everything we do in terms of Inclusive Development is just that it is a design feature of any program we do that we are looking to make sure we are going out of our way, just as we would for religious minorities and on behalf of religious freedom or for women in countries where women are discriminated against to make sure we are reaching the full spectrum of beneficiaries and any kind of social deterrent door deterrent or normative factors are 12 circumvent to make sure that we are being inclusive because that will be in the interest of all individuals living in a country economically and in terms of their ability to, in this instance, integrate into europe. Jonathan what you say to people who question my supporting lgbtqia plus rights should be part of american Foreign Policy . There might be people around the world or in our own country that say, i am down with the community, but why make that part of our Foreign Policy . Administrator power one way to take that question here a lot and even increasingly in certain quarters is to imagine the counterfactual, you know . Imagine a world in which u. S. Taxpayer resources are expanded expended in a manner that in essence perpetuates or deepens exclusion of individuals that are really vulnerable. I mean, that would be bad. But only that, not only that, it would have the flavor in many other countries where we work, for a country that for all of our imperfections has long stood for human rights, it would have the effect, i believe, as being seemed to kind of legitimate some of the rhetoric and actions and legal measures that are being put forward. So, you know, there is not someplace of neutrality here, right . We are the United States. We for many years in a very bipartisan way have stood for human rights. We have stood behind the universal declaration of human rights that does not have exceptions or footnotes excluding particular communities. We stand for implementation of the Sustainable Development goals that explicitly say no person should be left behind. Again, without footnotes or caveats. So, i think there are really hard questions about tactics, about, in some places, how vocal to be to not put ourselves at the center of a narrative. Because that is in some senses just what people who would seek to repress or terrorize vulnerable communities would like to see happen. Again, its very difficult on the ground to find the right balance of tools. Look at the antihomosexuality act in uganda. We spoke out with 31 countries. We spoke out with the United Nations independent expert that u. S. Diplomacy when i was at the u. N. As ambassador was critical in securing the creation of that position. The fact that position has been renewed three times now including most recently last year speaks to, again, changing norms. The fact that International Instruments more and more are including, sometimes explicitly, sometimes less so, would you be to q in rights as human rights lgbtqia rights as human rights. We saw samesex marriage legalized last year in estonia and slovenia. And also, decriminalization in places as varied as barbados and singapore. That means these principles are getting traction and these International Instruments that are a critical part of President Bidens agenda are really important, jonathan, because it gives citizens in a country where, on the books, there are lots of happy talks about human rights, it gives lgbtqia organizations and individuals something to hang their arguments on. Saying this individual says this. When we can act in company i think that is always advantageous and something we speak to do. The norms themselves, when i was condemning the targeting of individuals based on Sexual Orientation that had never happened before hearing from around the world what it meant for the United Nations Security Council to have done this. This was a consensus document. Of the Russian Federation, a number of african governments had laws that were not respectful of these human rights on the books went along with that. Thinking tactically about how to do that and how the norms coram become more salient in International Law is i think very important. But it is in our interest to have maximum economic inclusion consistent with our economic objectives as a country and our Foreign Policy interests. Its in our interest to fight repression against whomever it is being carried out. And it is in our Foreign Policy interest to stand up for our values. President bidens pulling i think reflects broad approval, surging pool numbers. A tripling in global balls, with the question is posed, do you think joe biden will do the right thing. A tripling from his predecessor. When you talk to people around the world and get a sense of why the fact that human rights are so central to President Bidens argument and the importance of democracy delivering, that is a major distinguishing factor not only for this administration but u. S. Foreign policy from the biggest geopolitical actors. If we go quiet, in the same way we were to go quiet on the rights of questions christians in societies where they are being persecuted and just a for to prevail in what is taken as prevailing popular sentiment, i think that we would really shortchange what is distinguishing about american Foreign Policy. Jonathan one more question from me before q a. Everything that you say is, you know, terrific and wonderful in terms of what the administration is doing, american values. But i wonder, when you travel around the world and talk to counterparts, particularly those in say, uganda, and elsewhere, how do you respond to what they might say . Such as, well, your home country is, you know, no garden party. You have book bans and a drag queen that story hours band and dont say gay laws and we are awaiting a Supreme Court decision possibly tomorrow, definitely by friday on whether a cake direct greater cake decorator can say i will not decorate your cake because your samesex marriage goes against my beliefs. How do you deal with that when that is thrown back in your face from foreign leaders . Administrator power we have a policy j has helped shepherd through that will be the first of its kind lgbtqia plus policy out soon. One of its many important features is it speaks of the importance of going forth in a spirit of humility and ally ship. I have already spoken a little about the ally ship point. But in general. What i mean is in general, we are standing up for democracy and human rights as we are facing, domestically, very significant challenges. I would broaden the aperture a little bit from your question, though your question is very valid as it focused on our discussion and topic today. But i would not even think we can think about lgbtqia plus rights outside of the broader context of the antidemocratic movements that exist all over the world. Including not recognizing results of elections. Including resulting to violence resorting to violence. Including in some cases partnering with outside repressive factors that would seek to widen divisions within democracies. The statistics, i think 16 years of freedom in the pot around the world. What we see is a tax and on minorities generally, sometimes religious, a gbd qi a plus communities lgbtqia plus communities are often the canary in the coal mine about a broader set of measures and a broader consolidation of power away from the people and in the center. Certainly, a diminishment of checks and balances. I think that is the abiding feature. Minority rights and the rights of marginalized communities are fundamentally checks on majoritarianism in our country and globally. And i am not saying that we do not think have thrown back at us things happening in this country. But i think that since president obama, and very much President Biden, we tend to preempt that moment by, as situated in the dialogue about lgbtqia plus rights in our own struggles, not leaving the elephant in the room over here but to say, look, we are in the midst of many of the same challenges. There are forces in our country that would also wish to go back to what is remembered as a simpler time. Often i think that sets the stage for a more productive conversation because it is not about finger wagging. You may condemn something that has happened and use of the leverage of the United States to demand a repeal. But, its not from glasshouse that we are having conversations like this. I was just in africa and i will be traveling again. The dialogue we have is a humble dialogue. But it is one that has a northstar that i think can animate us both that is rooted fundamentally not only in american values, at their core, but in International Instruments and universal values. Jonathan there is a microphone. We will open it up to questions. We will go until about 3 45. The microphone is there. Short questions, so we can get more answers in. Ryan my name is ryan eric and i am an assistant director at the Atlantic Council. I want to ask a question related to u. S. Development assistance to ukraine, specifically how we are looking at the lgbtqia plus angle as far as assistance during the ongoing war. I would appreciate your thoughts. Thank you. Administrator power in brief, at one of these you will see again in the forthcoming policy, a broad emphasis on thinking within usaid and within our humanitarian emergency programming about inclusion and about proactive outreach and services. I think there has been we have always of course been, for an inclusive process to find and serve beneficiaries, but, to think, you know, to think that all beneficiaries will come forward equally in all communities is not accurate. So, you know, how this plays out in any specific crisis area again, that is going to be fundamentally up to our engagement with our and limiting partners like the World Food Program the icrc and others. But, there is a broad embrace of inclusive response and a broad recognition that gravity alone will not get you there. Again, we are quite far along in ukraine because i think the government has every incentive, not saying there is not discrimination in ukraine, or, some of those fears do not still exist, but there are a lot of incentives pulling policy and enforcement in a constructive direction given the european journey that they are very committed to. Imagine in other parts of the world where there is not the Legal Framework or that political will at high levels. That is why crisis will be very important. The other thing i would say, continuing our hivaids work full speed ahead, any work we do in human rights, thinking, again, there is a dedicated lgbtqia plus work than making sure that all the programming in these other areas is inclusive of that. Finally, we have done a lot with hotlines. There is so much trauma, so much need for Psychosocial Service and care. We work very closely with misses zelinski as well. She has really pushed Mental Health and so forth. You will see in our Development Programming and emergency measurement programming, the recesses resources are there to work with congress to continue to mobilize a significant allocation there as well recognizing the trauma and the unique traumas that may apply to different communities including this one. Jonathan we have six questions and 10 minutes. What i will really try to do is two questions at a time. Madame administrator, if you could. A little more brief. The first two ask questions and then the administrator will answer. Katie my name is katie and i am a graduate or graduate student at dupont sites. My question revolves around other countries we have not talked about. We have talked about ukraine and uganda. What should usaid and other people in the United States, what other countries should we focus on for Human Rights Violations especially in the community . Administrator power my name is divya and i am in undergraduate at stanford university. My question for you is how and if you have handle data talked about text governance in regards to lgbtqia plus rights and information regarding hivaids, vaccines, and more. Jonathan ok, two simple questions and nine minutes. Administrator power on the first question i would say that there is a spate now of laws, particularly in subsaharan africa, but not only that our at various stages of legislative movement, lets put it that way. Now, what the focus entails again, i think, filtering it through what our partners on the ground think would be most advantageous for any particular individual, entity, or institution to do. Figuring that out is no easy proposition. The New York Times recently did a study that did a laydown of how many countries would stage for the passage of these laws. It kicked up what happened in uganda. Even our response to it has kicked up more vocal leadership to push through further exacerbating criminalization measures and, by the way, really important positive decisions that have been made in africa that in turn have generated backlash. We saw something very similar here, of course, over many decades. Where antidiscrimination ordinances, for example, in florida, decades ago. Then kicked off major, very pronounced counter reactions, massive fundraising, etc. That is happening too. For a step forward, it then ignites certain forces and antibodies. Then you see proactive moves that really can setback those rights. Again, the tactics, i think we would have to be very case specific. But, where i would, especially for those of you in Civil Society or not in the government per se, the actual support for the organizations. You will have the chance as well in this country, those of you active in the lgbtqia plus community through the welcome core at the state department. This is a very exciting development. That we will have the chance, in addition to processing people persecuted on the grounds of Sexual Orientation or gender identity, we will have the chance as Community Members to welcome these individuals. That infrastructure is being built. Its not you know, its not yet where there is a number for you to call, but well, there is a number to call for the welcome core. But specifically for. Ok. I was told we were still some weeks away from that. What is the number people should call . What is the link . Ok. The state Apartment Program . No. Ok. Great. Rainbow railroad. Org will refer you. At the state department piece we are still moving on to make sure these partnerships can be ignited in rapidfire. And then the second question, jonathan, was . Jonathan i wrote in my notes. Tech governance. Administrator power yes is the short answer. Jonathan we have five minutes and five questions to go. Administrator power i have engaged them on text generally. Discrimination, the amount of disinformation including deepfakes showing President Biden vilifying og pdq ia plus people. These edifying lgbtqia plus people. These things are exacerbating an already challenging situation. Jonathan we have 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 questions. Five minutes. Lord jesus. All right. Here is what i want to do. I want you to each ask you to each ask your very brief question so your question at least gets articulated and then administrator power will answer. Real quickly. All five. All five. Thank you. What would you say to all of the countries that stand on a principle of noninterference . We dont get to tell other governments how to treat their people. Very briefly, thank you. Domestically in our country white supremacy, one can argue, is cradled by the far religious right. These actors are also responsible for the racial as i shouldve homophobia across africa. Are there whole of government conversations about how to hold these actors accountable for their racialized efforts . Jonathan great question. Im from the human rights campaign. Nondiscrimination is a touchstone of equality. The administration now is reviewing requirements for grantees and cooperative agreements across the foreign assistance agencies. Can you speak to the needs of doing that and usaids role in helping other agencies doing something and applying it across the board with other agencies on any quilt bases . And equal basis . Mark bromley from the council of global equality. You spoke about the value of lgbtqia plus funding and integrative funding. We are excited that 15 million increased to 25 million this year. On the integration point, how are you thinking of measuring integration for lgbtqia plus persons particularly in places where being lgbtqi might be criminalized or it is difficult or dangerous to measure. How do we make sure that integration is happening . My name is bryce dawson from counterpart international. You mentioned the difficulties of minimizing intrusion and tactically advocating for lgbtq ia plus rights in other nations and potential procurement policies to ensure og pdq ia plus protections lgbtqia plus protections. You have any in the pipeline or anything you are working on for the future . Jonathan i want to thank all of you for your questions. Madame administrator, you have two minutes. [laughter] administrator power in general on our engagements over human rights issues we hear a lot about noninterference. There is no question i heard a lot about it at the United Nations. We hear it often from countries like the Russian Federation that have invaded another country and tried to take over the other country. We hear it from countries that are providing surveillance technology. You know, to other countries, or, that are fueling this information in the countries in which we are working. So, you know, its a shield. Its an important one to take seriously because we also of course respect sovereignty and territorial integrity and so forth. Usaid is active across sectors and involved in these countries. This agenda i think is, by the outcome of the human rights agenda more broadly. Its central to how we believe we will get the most out of the programs we are doing across sectors. And this brings me this is the kind of conversation we have. I was using uganda as an example about making sure we are also making a pragmatic case for people that are very skeptical. Again, there is a seamless nest to the way our work across governance and human rights in citizens purity and in the broad suite of development from agriculture to education, health, etc. , they do come together in the service of development objectives. That is what the fdg is also enjoying. I will not be able to do justice to the other questions in full beyond i think the point about measuring integration is very important. For those that are not making their identity known to us, that will not be something that, you know, we will be able to measure in that sense. But, i think these are the kinds of things we are working through through this policy to make sure that this is not just, here is our standalone programming. But Everything Else we do operate in the weight we have always done it. It will not be instant where everything is happening all at once. But, all of our missions have to have Inclusive Development advisers or somebody and this will be evident out of the policy. Somebody that is the focal point for working on lgbtqia plus rights and programming. We hope that plus our new office of chief economist will help us develop a methodology thats responsive to these concerns. That this will somehow be invisible and not done. That is certainly our objective, for it to be done. And when appropriate, visible. At least, visible to us so we know whether we are achieving what we set out to achieve. Lastly, i would say, because it is coming, the point about nondiscrimination among beneficiaries is really appointed. Important and we hope that guidance will be forthcoming soon. Jonathan do you have anything about the racialized religious efforts on lgbtqia plus rights . Administrator power all i would say on that, because i think there are others in the government working on the kind of conversation asked about, is, this is just another part of the response to the noninterference charge. That we do hear from people that do not want to be engaged on human rights issues. That is that there are a lot of actors from outside that are very active actually in pushing certain forms of legislation that would have these discriminatory and that exclusion or exquisite tory and dangerous effects. Again, the noninterference claim is usually made in a selective white. Way. Jonathan with that two minutes overtime, Samantha Power administrator of usaid, thank you very much for being here. 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