In 1999 sheriff martinez was promoted to the rank of sergeant of Narcotics Service in eagle, texas. Served in this capacity until his retirement, 2007; 2009 elected sheriff of val verde county. Of rank elected sheriff of elverde county and the sheriff of yuma county, arizona and Law Enforcement in yuma for over 30 years. Since service in the United States marine corps and electe mr. Leon wilmot is the sheriff of yuma county, arizona. Worked in Law Enforcement for the county of yuma for over 30 years since completing his service in the United States marine corps, and was elected to sheriff of yuma county in 2012. Continues to serve in this capacity. Final witness is the honorable eddie trevino, who is judge for Cameron County, texas. Hes served in Cameron County for 15 years. Hes a partner and founder of trevino and bodden law firm; was then elected as brownsvilles mayor from 2003 to 2007. And in november 2016 elected to Cameron County bench, where he currently serves. I want to thank all of you for being here today. Full statements will appear in the record. I know many of you have flights to catch, so with that the chair recognizes mr. Mccraw for his testimony. Well, thank you, mr. Chairman and Ranking Member thompson. Texas has, as you know and weve heard testimony already about how big texas is, and, congressman hurd, thank you for pointing that out. But its i think its obligatory to note that 1,200 to 1,900 miles belongs to texas, and thats very important and it does impact what happens on the border doesnt just stay at the border; theres consequences throughout texas and the nation. , thank you for pointing that out. It is obligatory to note that 1200 to 1900 miles belongs to texas, that is very important. It does impact what happens at the border, doesnt just stay at border, there are consequences throughout texas and the nation. We have talked to the secretary who did a great job to testify and some of those consequences of the heroin epidemic happening in the northeast than congressman fitzpatrick was worried about mp in 2014 when he was overwhelmed by the search and influx of central americans, it was a threat from a texas standpoint, governor, state legislature, proactive about doing something when it comes to protecting people and they are concerned about the influx of gangs, transnational gangs, cartel operatives, members, cocaine, methamphetamine and marijuana. And the other things that hasnt been talked about today, is sex trafficking. We are sent down there to do something, work with our federal partners but importantly coordinate with local and state partners. National guard, also texas game wardens. In direct support of the u. S. Border patrol to border Border Patrol between the points of entry. As we have seen in doing so, you cant influence the amount of drugs coming in and the amount of illegal aliens coming in. Theres no question about it. Border patrol cant control physics. Can you go back to fitsback to when they were taxed by ocmpd and said, it can be done. But they recommended what kelly was talking about today. Rather than wait for it to come in, prevent it from coming in in the first place. Theres many positive aspects of doing that. Thats the texas way weve been obligated to work with Border Patrol at the river. Not inward. And we have looked at fence and height, stack it, with water to sensors, cameras, towers, balloons, helicopters. And of course weve got 14 aircraft dedicated specifically to support Border Patrol agent on the ground. We have a tactical marine runity which i never thought we would have the opportunity to have the navy there and we do now. Thats what Border Patrol needed at the time. We dont need yesterdays technology for tomorrow. Those sensors are archaic. The private sector, expert in developing, technology and making it work, thaents what weand thats what we did in terms of making it work. We have 4,000 detection cameras, that are infrared, that they installed, not us. Border patrol installed them. We support them and help their capacity. But because they dont have that technology and they need it. Ive got no question whatsoever. I understand and the governor has been clear about this and so has legislature. We know Border Patrol can secure the u. S. Border. And the new chief named was an outstanding border chief. No question that he can do it. If given the resources to do so. And we look forward to working with the brave men and women of Border Patrol until that time. Can i tell you this, on behalf of the state legislature, i get to speak for them a little bit and governor as i talked to is chief of staff last night. Theres a concern that the amount of money we continue to spend at the state level and to a federal mission, it is right now, weve theres a price tag over 1. 4 billion. But our leaders and legislators have said we can provide money for the Border Patrol. Last thing we want to do is diminish or degrade what is out there. Im concerned as i report tomorrow before the Senate Finance hearing is what im going to say. How am i going to explain. We are hoping strategically to get out of this. We have 732,000 deaths on texas highways. Not to mention Trans National gangs. Not to mention rescuing children who were victims of predators on our highways by troopers and another 626 by special agents. We have a lot to do inside the state of texas, including Trans National gangs. Texas is a hub city for ms13. Simply because of an unsecure border. We must deal with those things. Right now our directive is to continue to support Border Control as we are and do everything we can as secretary kinley said, how fast can they do it . How long will it take to get those resources in place . With that, mr. Chairman, i conclude my testimony and questions. Thank you, steve. Chair recognizes sheriff martinez. Distinguished members, thank you for the opportunity to address you today on issues that affect every citizen in my border county. The state of texas and the United States of america has spent 39 years as career Law Enforcement professional. As immediate past chairman of the Texas Border Coalition and current chairman of the coalition i dedicated my Law Enforcement career to serving the citizens of the state of texas right on the texas mexico border. Both at the state level and as a member of the Texas Department of Public Safety of local Police Department of city of del rio and now sheriff of vel verde county. The Texas Border Sheriffs Coalition is comprised of 20 borders all within 20 miles, 25 miles of the mexico border sharing approximately 1254 miles of texasmexico border with the republic of mexico. Vel verde county shares approximately 110 miles of border with a mexican state. The southwestern Border Coalition concludes the state of california, arizona, new mexico and texas combining for a total of 1989 miles of border between the United States and republic of mexico within the 1900 miles of border from san diego, california to brownsville, texas lie 31 counties. The terrain throughout much is from rural rafrm land, high desert to desert like valleys to ranges and most belong to private land owners. Some are national or state parks. So the need for each of these individual counties is unique in its own way. The coalition was founded in 2005 to find an effort to a regional solution to national problem. We all share common issues but there is no one issue more important than making sure that we secure our communities and which the people feel safe in homes and surroundings. Sheriffs have a vested interest in the Law Enforcement, social Impact Health and overall quality of life of those that we serve. Sheriffs are unique in the understanding of the pulse of their communities and public that evaluates during election time that determines whether they stay employed every four years. The Texas Border Sheriffs Coalition was organized and prep and is represented by chief Law Enforcement office ef of each respective county. Texas sheriffs empowered by the state constitution are committed from National Security perspective to protect the lives and property and right of the people by maintaining order and security in the United States, along the republic of mexico border and enforcing laws impartially while providing Police Service and partnership with other Law Enforcement agencies and community partners. The consequences of unsecured border are failed throughout the United States. Each county sits the the gateway into our country and is the first line of defense in dealing with Law Enforcement, social Economic Issues for both first line of defense in dealing legitimate and illegitimate trade and travel. Fshlegitimate trade and travel. Immigration responsibility lies within the federal agencies. Agencies we work with everyday have had a difficult job in carrying out duties due to administrative policy issue answers changes and not laws on our books. Sheriffs only encounter immigration issues as a buy product of other criminal acts which are referred to the federal government for their actions. Which are referred to the federal government for their actions. Wee of the problems encounter most are drug smuggling, murder, rape, Sexual Assault, Trans National organizations, and the list goes on. As many of you know, the lower population and Property Values most counties lack a sufficient tack base to support a multifaceted needs of the Sheriffs Office. Each and every one of us are affected directly if one way or the other by what happens on the protectedt is as national safety. The problems here are manpower, travel and training, equipment, direct operatingen and answers contract services. Texas sheriffs Border Coalition have a more effective and less expensive approach base owned partnership of action. The solution by the Texas Coalition is one of cooperation and being at table to discuss issues that affect all of our commune oints a daily basis, all federal state and Law Enforcement need to Work Together as we move forward in finding a solution and securing borders and our future. No one single form of government can go it alone. The plan for security in the communities along the border with mexico as presented by members of the Texas Border Sheriffs Coalition is to provide a regional solution to a national problem. Plan is based on partnership of action and not rhetoric. It is based on cooperative agreements and willingness to watch Lessons Learned and put into place best practices. We have ownership in the respective communities and they understand how from a Law Enforcement, economic, social, health and environmental perspective. In support of the men and women working on the front lines each and everyday. The differences in solution on Community Impact and policies ad enacted by people 1000 miles away. Thank theke to community for this opportunity to address the needs of border sheriffs. God bless the United States of america and every officer on the front line. We appreciate your work on the border with all of the sheriffs. Afternoon chairman mccall, Ranking Member thompson, members of the committee. Geographical perspective we are at the southwest border on the state of our zone a border of the state of arizona. We have 110 miles of International Boundary with the state of mexico. From a historical in 2005 the plus illegal injuries. The occurs of effective drug and organizationsing in yuma county not only diminish the quality of life of county placed strain on budgets and resources of private and government agencies. The community, unfortunately, experienced a spike in crime such as rape, robberies, theft of property, home invasions, tractor and vehicle theft, assaults on Law Enforcement officers, military incursions by the mexican army, and ransom holding those who cross the border for additional moneys. The organizations along the was International Boundary the explained eloquently when he testified in his own words they are highly sophisticated and innovative in transportation methods. Aside from our normal use of human backpackers, which we refer to as mules, clandestine tunnels, vehicles, trafficking organizations have resorted to old for a light aircraft in gps controlled drones which cannot be detected with normal radar. They have been using cloned vehicles of Law Enforcement and legitimate companies. Recently they are utilizing catapults, tshirt launchers, as well to get bundles of marijuana into the u. S. Awaiting coconspirators. I witnessed the escalation of violence on our citizens and can been successes that accomplished through a quarter enforcement responses with local , federal, state partners working in cooperation with the prosecuting agencies. In fiscal year 2008 the number of illegal injuries was 50,900 in comparison to the 270 something on thousand in in 2006. Fencing to the vehicle barriers, camera systems, upgrades, border manpower,increased the implementation of operation streamline, a Program Designed for 100 prosecution of illegal injuries caught in italy entries caught in a legal activity. We were able to have a force multiplier along the border area that could not be done within agency budgets. Operation stone garden assisted with the overtime and a quick read we needed. The comprehensive recommendations are linked to federal leaders. Need to redefine the plan and build upon those successes. Need to have the political will to make Border Control and mandated program. Border security first, Immigration Reform second. To embrace those that work the border and our federal partners. Jobs and the dangerous their frustration is high based on the unknown complexities in their assignments. They have great ideas to share, and it was refreshing to hear the general speaking about how he would go to east geographic locations and sit down with those areas to see what was best for that geographic area. Continued funding for operation stone Garden Program is vital to our success, but we need to remove the funding from fema. They are cumbersome to Law Enforcement in being able to do our job. Move it into Homeland Security where they know what is best for our mission as we partner and work alongside federal partners. Reimbursement of state criminal alien apprehension program. It has been devastating to our budget every year. Sheriffson is with the of arizona had to swallow as we centsnly regime first fivby on the dollar for housing illegal aliens that had committed crimes in our counties. Partnership has proven to be beneficial in bringing overdue solutions to our unsecure border. Fortunately Border Security is a Discretionary Program or federally elected leaders that have been interested to protect freedom of liberties. One would hope that securing our border would not become about a , but a legal and moral requirement to safeguard all americans. This addresses committee and instills fresh hope that our voice matters. I agree on all counts. Judge . Good afternoon. I want to thank secretary Kelly Service totinguished our country and his visit south of the border. I hope it was productive and many were to come. Cameron county borders the gulf of mexico and is part of the rio grand valley. We are also home to the south daughtry island, a Tourist Destination for many in the United States and mexico. This hearing could not have been timelier. Facilitation of legitimate trade and travel is a reality we live with every day. As a locally elected official i have an obligation to try to inform this panel to make costeffective decisions that will work longterm and be effective for all of us. On the border we have endured many policies, many Unfunded Mandates. Ou just heard several of them after 9 11 we understood the sudden changes to life on the border. We believe in the rule of law and what our country to be safe and secure. Any resident answered the call to defend our country and many of our veterans were injured or killed. Today the Rio Grande Valley continues to prosper. The claims of violence is wrong and nothing more than an attempt to paint it as something it is not. Mexico and its people and the immigrants legal and undocumented. I come before you to request alternatives than the border wall proposal put forth by president trump. The border wall concept is ineffective and creates a false sense of security that will not alleviate the problem with the criminal element, drug cartels, and other elements seeking to harm our country. The frontline is doing an incredible job with the resources they have. We must help them but not at the expense of a relationship with our second largest trading. Artner utilizing a 14th century solution for 21stcentury problem makes no sense as it is the most expensive of all possibilities. If we provide a virtual wall of stateoftheart technology, we armed federal agents with what they need to perform their job s. Improving road conditions, removing barriers, other nonnative plants that allow for cover and mobility will also give agents of better chance of controlling and surveying the border. I learned that Border Security has yet to be improved. 20 million onng equipment, road infrastructure, and more boots on the ground. The natural barrier of the Rio Grande River can also work. There have then extensive studies on the dam project which the surface area of the river up, making it difficult to cross. When immigrants are detained there needs to be Additional Resources to address processing. The judicial system is undermanned, underfunded, and there is not enough immigration judges, which should be unacceptable. Also on the touch for american need for workers. Most fieldworkers are desperately needed. Estimate state the u. S. Needs 650,000 workers annually to keep the economy growing. The lack of Human Capital for socalled basic jobs is something we should be concerned about if we want our country to grow. On trade in the socalled border tax i hope this is studied in a more rational manner. Do we want to harm businesses because of the negative impact these policies will cause . And i for an eye policy will leave all of us blind. General averitt said to kelly that we want safety and security, but also to promote economic development. We have made progress with nafta and the Trump Administration wants to make changes. There ar channels there are channels to get that done. Business officials from all sides are the same. How can we tell our story to restaurant owners, hospitals, waitresses, and others that will be affected by the proposals. My friends back home i worry. ,he proposal to build a wall reform nafta, build a border wall, no immigration perform will kick this problem down the road without addressing it. It was built on our success by building bridges and not tearing down or dividing with we have built together with outdated proposals such as a border wall. I am happy to answer questions that you have. I recognize myself for questioning. It is hard to believe that over 12 years ago as a federal prosecutor stating that i was going to get the border secure. Im going into my seventh term in congress and it is not done. Time and there are differing issues, but we have the political will in washington to finally, possibly get this done. It is a federal responsibility. I believe the state of texas has stepped up to the plate and taken on this responsibility, instead of the federal government. To thet question is director. As you prepare for your testimony for Senate Finance in austin, knowing that we will have a defense order supplementary bill come down the pipe in the spring, what would ask from texas . The speaker pro tem would ask 2. 3 billion based on what the state has already spent. Going forward, we would have to coordinate with the governor. How do you leverage existing capabilities at the state and local level so that order patrol can gain control and augment Border Security every day. Our concern after listening to secretary kelly was realistic. It takes time to build the infrastructure, the roads, any obstacles as opposed to barriers and technology. 10,000larly 5000 to Border Patrol agents. Dot does the state need to to stave off any incursions, influx, or problems we have already gained . You going forward, ideally would be a better position to say Border Patrol needs 3 sheriffs deputies, game wardens, troopers, 2 aircraft, 3 tactical boats, a swat team. Like the stanford act. Us to captureow not only the cost, but operating costs that go into it. , ourecretary made it clear concern is how fast. Every day matters. If you are involved in sex trafficking investigations, the Sexual Assault that we have seen, the mexican cartels have been engaged in, every day matters. Any Border Security increases, the better off we are. Technology gets smaller and cheaper and provides new metrics we did not have before. How do you measure success . Collectione what the. Osture is every special agents in their vehicle and found has a gps locating device. In operations i can prove what our coverage posture is then and there. One problem secretary kelly will address is Border Patrol needs capability of tracking. You would expect for them to know not only from a security standpoint, but officer safety. Agentsay Border Patrol are threatened along the Rio Grande River. I would like to conclude it is disgraceful the federal government has not prosecuted those that have assaulted federal agents in the performance of their duties. I am confident that well change, but until that time texas border prosecutors have stepped up the plates and Texas Rangers will investigate and prosecute at the state level until the federal government prosecutes the cases. We are trying to move forward. Texas has a unique challenge with the rio grande. You cannot build a wall on the river. You can build levees, but i do not i think it is symbolic. Saying the wall. Physical barrier, multilayer defense using available assets including technology, aviation, and fencing. You best ask from the secretary, best describes the wall to finally achieve control of the border . Texas have a chart that didnt. All legislators demanded a way to measure success beyond numbers. Unsecured minimal control, operation control, substantial control. Different things must be in place before the next level. You canan measure it, discern it. From the texas standpoint, a wall and fence are obstacles working for us against the cartels. Personnel, of the the things the judge talked removal of salt, cedar, and kain, it is an obstacle, not a barrier. The cartels will go under, through, around, and over to for drugs andd commercial sex in the u. S. That is clear and compelling. And obstacle, not a barrier . It is a barrier when you have enough detection technology. When they step over or on the fence you can immediately see it. Today you can see a picture. You dont have to guess if it is a fourlegged creature or a twolegged creature with a bundle of marijuana. You can see that by looking at it. Sheriff martinez . Agree. Barrier. S just a i think, more importantly, the manpower and initially. Get the manpower. In my county there are 80 miles from the lake to the county line. I have one deputy to cover that country. Good day you will have anywhere from 1215 Border Patrol agents to cover that same area consisting of 8000 square miles, going all the way into crockett and sutton county. That is a needle in a haystack trying to find a needle in a haystack. Manpower is not rugged geographical area of texas. With ar in combination physical barrier in strategic locations along with Tech Knowledge he technology will go a long way. In yuma county we had to do a. Onglomeration of all of that your geographic location and what are your natural and manmade boundaries you already have. The Colorado River that goes into mexico, i have 2 tribal reservations which is sovereign land. Range is our military premier Training Center for military forces being shipped overseas. We have the u. S. Fish and wildlife refuge. , much like theon general talked about to the secretary, he needs to go and ascertain from different geographical locations what is needed best. It could be a fence, vehicle barriers, it could be electronic infrastructure such as radaroperated camera systems or lasers. Perceive that from a perspective of a boots on the ground level in order to address that. Would access to federal lands help . That would be a law we would have to change. Yes, sir we encounter that in yuma county in 20052006 when they put in the fence utilizing our national guard. We worked with our tribal partners and were able to do brush clearing along the Colorado River corridor. It has opened recreational areas for human citizens to enjoy, versus the criminal element that was so often exploiting them getting their illegal contraband across the river. Mr. Chairman, just like everyone else i am in a listening phase because i rely on what Law Enforcement has to tell us. I have met with our local Sheriffs Department and Border Control. What was surprising was when i learned they were not able to utilize and be on federal park land in order to do surveillance and investigation. The other part of the equation was that much of the technology is several decades old. While still operational, it is not as effective as technology provided to Law Enforcement. We need to upgrade your the other part they wanted to utilize is allowing boots on the ground in a more direct and quicker response, because the people operating the technology will be any better position to direct our boots on the ground to where the impact will be. There in agreement that resources to upgrade the technology and provide resources to boots on the ground is needed. If i may say, you mentioned 10 years ago when we started, you thought you would have the border secure. Part of the problem is if we really utilize a clear definition for a secure border, i dont know that we can achieve that. As long as there is a criminal element into human activity they will do everything they can to provide the product, drugs, human trafficking, whatever the case may be. The border is more secure today than a decade ago or 20 years ago. That is important for the country to understand. Have a goodto quality of life on the border as a result to the gentleman to my right and the lawn or cement Law Enforcement operating on the border. Given an excellent testimonial as we move forward as to what is effective, what is not, what needs to be appropriated, and what should not be. I now recognize the Ranking Member. Thank you chairman. Thank you, witnesses, for your testimony. It has been a long time since we have a panel of people that live this issue every day. Enlightening. Ite the question that a lot of us come up with a sound policy that addresses Border Security rather than coming up with a product in terms of a fence . , as just about everyone has said, there are ways that fencing might be good. There are other ways that waysology, there are other of using other things that might be good. When you come with a onesizefitsall model, that creates real challenges. The Rio Grande River, lakes, and other areas, tribal land. The question is, what i am anding from the witnesses, i heard from the secretary in his testimony, that you will be involved in the process. So, rather than washington coming to your communities and saying big brother is here, we have the solution we would say what do you think . What suggestions or recommendations that you might have . For us a very good model to adopt, because in washington we can only see one part. , for the record, we are 1500 approvedhort in the allotment for boots on the ground. Been twoyears, threeyears . About twoyears to complete that. If we get 5000 more, we have 6500 vacancies we cannot fill. Part of what we will have to do is work with state and local to figure out, since we cannot put all of these boots on the ground, having trouble filling it . How do we backfill somebody, five, 10, 20 miles away approaching an area come and have the ability to communicate with Law Enforcement we could move assets to that area from an interdiction standpoint. Arethe sheriffs especially, you allowed to train with federal officials in a manner comfort, or are there things he would like to see being done that is not being done . Sheriff martinez . Thank you for the question. We work very well with our federal partners. We do not train with them. If we come across a crime that otm, or mexican national, we were for those individuals Border Control. We work through stone garden. Referralseek we had 8 in our sector. I take it that is from the ourls referring someone to federal partners, and they take over from there. Going on to some of your you are milessay away, but i did like to invite each of you to our communities where we live every day. Show up when we have all of the manpower and resources, visit us in our natural state and you can see all of the deficiencies we have here that will be a big impact on what happens appear on your happens up here on your votes. Our agency trains quite a bit with the u. S. Border patrol yuma sector. We have awesome lines of communications. Most training has to do with search and rescue or narcotics interdiction working sidebyside with personnel. Most of that occurs under operation stone garden. Are running into with sheriffs across the united oftes is getting some sort legal opinion in regards to the in ourhonoring detainers jail. Some sheriffs in the u. S. Are being sued for violation of Fourth Amendment rights. We are being told we have to honor them by federal law, but also being told you cannot honor that because you are violating law, the itthat arizona, texas, and new york, a whole so, sheriffs as need a legal opinion in terms of honoring detainers for the jails. That is one of the things that is a Significant Impact for us our jails. Ividual in typically they are booked into the jail, go through the state process, sentenced to prison, then turned over to the state for doc. That is something that sheriffs across the u. S. , we articulated it to the secretary yesterday. Thank you. Duties,n your everyday what Security Issues would you be concerned about . As an see the law answer to the Security Issues from your stand point . To our regards neighboring county, approximately 70 miles, we have 50 ormiles of fencing in place. We have 1500 vacancies looking at another 5000. How that impacts us locally, these gentlemen to my right, their responsibility is local Law Enforcement to the community they serve. Because of the changing dynamics in our country, they have had to become quasiagents because of the demand in regards to Border Security. The concern that i have, the county judge in texas is an administrative position. I dont want anyone to think i am holding court. It is basically the mayor of the county. The concern that i have, in the Law Enforcement agencies whether it is local Police Departments or the jailers, we have lost those individuals to the federal government because of the demand. Because they pay better than local Law Enforcement. We rely on low property tax for our budget. In addition to the jail costs, we also have medical costs to take care of them in our custody. All of these what i referred to as Unfunded Mandates are concerns because we do not have back load or Rainy Day Fund to help us get through. We are doing the best we can. Intongress takes this account, you have to understand that demands placed on local entities in jurisdictions are so different than the demands elsewhere in the country. And we are asking for funds resources, is because we need them because we are already performing the job. If there is an increase in boots on the ground, which we agree is necessary, we will need additional funds to make sure local lawenforcement positions are well met. The situation where you have one officer patrolling 84 square miles. He cannot be everywhere at the same time. Sheriff martinez, i agree with your point. Go to see it because you cannot understand it until you see it. I always advocate for members to do that. There is no simplistic answer to this multifaceted thank you, mr. Chairman. Briefly, some people do not like the terminology the wall. Fence, it is a wall, unmanned vehicles, cameras, some Protection Security belt along the border that keeps incursions from happening, we need that, attitudegins with an that you want to defend the border of your country and sovereign nation. One thing use a problem with was the federal government was not prosecuting people here illegally that assault Border Patrol agents. Can you talk with more depth . The instances with Border Patrol agents that have been assaulted when trying to make an arrest. When i was in the fbi we worked federal assaults on federal officers. 2 druger was killed by traffickers from mexico. We worked at assault on a the unitedicer, and states attorney would prosecute those things. Over the last several months that has not been the case. There has been no prosecution. Thestate legislature funded prosecutor, they said Border Patrol agents are being assaulted, not prosecuted. Exas is a law and order state if you assaulted police officer, there have to be consequences. We are using state resources. Several months, six months, eight months, i will give you the exact cases we have worked. What do think the impotence of failure to follow through, why would they not . It is inexplicable. I appreciate that information. Also federal park. The governor brought that to secretary kellys point. The first secretary out of all of the secretaries that i have met, and i have met some great ones, he has taken the time to go down there. He has asked questions, very specific, and listened to briefs. I have no doubt that he is going to talk to the attorney general. That will be fixed. I am confident that will be addressed. That has to be a minimum standards of the Border Patrol agents know when they put their life on the line, there will be a penalty for assaulting them, as there should be for any officers in the United States. Turning to federal park lands, i dont think a lot of people realize there is a restriction for Border Patrol agents in those circumstances. Can you give information from your viewpoint on how that affects the ability of the arrow government to safeguard the border . Pockets ofe several refugees along the Rio Grande River. They are havens for hiking. Border patrol is allowed they are havens for hiding. Taking one hour to get to a location or 10 minutes. Allowed the infrastructure you would expect in other parts of the border. We hope that will be addressed. It sounds like something has to change . The judge had a good point. Drought weed sucks out the water and is a security risk. It works for the cartels. , theare from a sheriff operation stone Garden Program and your trouble getting money through fema is something i would like for you to elaborate on. The reimbursement of your scout funding to nonsanctuary cities, which it is important to note, that sanctuary cities are receiving money. They are inviting people to be in their city illegally and getting rural fund i getting federal funds . If you have an entity that runs a jail that supports that, that funding should be given to those other entities that run the jail that are doing the job. We still need to get 100 reimbursement, as well as the medical costs associated. I cannot put in an individual for dialysis three times a week. Att is impact i budget 100,000 for one person. At 117 backpackers that went through my jail, of which i have 19. I sent a bill to the attorney general last year because of the policies of not prosecuting these individuals. Normally anyone would be able to get charged. Normally the attorney general is worth 1. 8 million. The National Government south of you, is this anywhere near the resources that you have going northward . County,ds to the yuma there is great crossborder communication. We worked a lot in regards to wemoting the quality of life did everything we did to curb the criminal enterprise from doing what they were doing in 20052006. Mexican government does not feel as strongly about Border Control or controlling the border, north of the border, as we do. I get that perception. The american taxpayers are paying for this figure out the the american taxpayers cannot pay for it. What they are doing from a tactical standpoint. Expired, but if you could elaborate i would love to hear it. Would you like to respond . I will give you that time. In arizona we have a great cross order communication. Program and Law Enforcement. When those entities come across the border. We trained together and cover the problems we encounter in our geographic locations. To a certain extent they are doing what they can with what they have. Be cooperative arrangement with counterpoints on the mexican side of the border. It is important to have a positive, productive relationship with our neighbors to the south. I would agree with hundred percent. Agree 100 . D made references to state funds across the border and how it may have impacted other parts of the state. And perhaps affected other areas of responsibility that the department of Public Safety would have. Can you tell us how you think the diversion of funds to the border has affected other responsibilities . We were understaffed for the number of troopers based upon the state growth. The last 10 years we have 28 alien people and 313 miles of roadway. Do patrols, able to we need a certain amount of troopers. We have had to do because of the end lucks and because of the mission because of the influx and because of the mission, we have had to surge troopers from around the state. Working 14 hour days. That cycle month after month and wave after wave for two and half years. Ortime you move a trooper ranger engaged in these enterprise organizations, for the border to support border the advantages are most of the trafficking is coming at the border. It less safe and other parts where we take the resources from. Has there been a correlation with respect to traffic deaths . From the talk from other parts of the state there are less troopers in that area. They believe it is less safe. I do not disagree. Seen an increase or decrease in highway traffic deaths . In terms of the rule area, but urban areas as well have had increased fatalities. And have two questions three minutes. In respect to the dam, how would that environmentally impact from Flood Control standpoint. The areas that we live in. What would be the impact from a security standpoint . After decades of study the Environmental Impact would be minimal. Brownsville is the last stop before the rio grande empties out. From el paso south, everyone utilizes the rio grande as their source for water. It was a thought years ago if the river was to ever run dry in certain areas of the state there are trickles. We would be in a bad, bad situation. Brownsville was very progressive in developing a reverse osmosis live the utilization of brackish ground water so the Brownsville Community isnt completely reliant on the river. The proposal would raise a water level. It would not impact the water table, which was initially a concern. Allowing Flood Control to be utilized in the event if we ever had a shortage. At lake falcon, thats our reserve system, it was developed in the 1950s. The longterm goal is it would get replenished by Mother Nature any time we add natural disaster. No one foresaw the growth on both sides of the border. So we have to be more aggressive as far as that goes. What is life like for the 96,000 winter texans from the midwest living in the Rio Grande Valley right now . Safe to say those winter visitors are our life blood during the winter months. They bring a lot of resources. They spend their money in the valley. They are a complete asset to the area. Many from midwest, minnesota, iowa, all those states. They are a huge asset. They spend their money. Good to mexico on a daily basis to shop and to receive medical care. Eat. They spend their money buying refrigerators and cars and consumable goods we rely on. Their Economic Impact basis is huge. If there was any chaos or danger down there, they want keep they would not keep coming. Those numbers continue to grow each and every year. Thank all four of you for being with us today. Mr. Hurdair recognizes from texas. Thank you. I appreciate you being here today. Mccraw, martinez, and trevino, you have helped educate me and. Educate me, thank all of you all. My first question is to the two sheriffs. Maybe sheriff martinez, you first. We talked about stone garden and it was talked about moving funds back to dhs from fema. Is there other uses stone garden is restrictive in how you can use those funds. Are there other areas where you currently cant use stone garden funds. Sheriff martinez, lets start with you. Then wilmot. And director im sure have you opinions, too. There has to be some flexibility. Border patrol, dps, every sheriff is short on manpower. We are talking about hiring all kinds of people. I would like to see that same opportunity extended to the sheriffs to be able to hire manpower to support security our border. Because right now you can only use stone garden funds to pay overtime. Is that correct . You would like to be able to use those initial funds for first year salary or Something Like that . Correct. Congressman, ive been listening to the sheriffs talk about this for a good seven years. They can only eat so much overtime. You can give them all the overtime in the world but to use that money if you allow them to use it, as an agreement upfront. Now all of a sudden they have an increase in resources. Thats better for Border Patrol and for the state as well. There is value in that investment. There are other funding streams that are far more flexible than stone garden. We like what the dhs did with that. Of course the state doesnt get , any use of that at all. Sheriff for month wilmont . In regards to operation stone garden, it is obviously laborintensive just doing reporting requirements, as well as purchasing the equipment that we need. It also restricts the equipment with regard it fema. You can only use so much for overtime, then you have to use so much for equipment and then so much for mileage on your vehicles. It is broken down and you cant change the percentage. This is the one true grant that comes to the sheriffs to allocate out to local Law Enforcement, at least in arizona , and share with other counties along our borders and the state if they can complement our operations. That is where we need to keep it. Dhs is qualified to say this location is where we need this equipment. You cannot paint that brought brush across the whole border. Broad brush across the whole border. And came was elected in last congress, we add lengthy debate about what operational control of the border means. In your materials you provide the texas Border Security level. I have always fought to use dpss perspective on what operational control means because of all of the arguments , and conversation ive had on this it seems to be the most thoughtful. So the first question is, have reticence in federal partners adopting a framework, and do your partner states, do your. Organizations have a similar , perception on what operation of the border means . Do your peer organizations have a similar perception on what operation of the border means . I dont believe so right now. But we have worked with the Sheriffs Office to work on standards. We have worked with federal partners, go back to any study rack in the 1990s, and it the same thing. You cannot use illegal aliens to predict success and fileailure. Now we can actually identify, track out the level of security. The focus we have come up with is simply figure out what levels of security security are. On what those variables are, count them, track them. Unless you can prove it, there is no way to justify we are saying at this point or that point. You cant just prove it too. You cant say im operational in control. The advantage we have is gps. It will allow you to do that. Technology,cture, coverage level, and capacity. Thank you for your leadership on this topic. Again, as we have debates up here, we need to be speaking the same language. I have run out of time, but one thing i will follow up with you all is intelligence sharing. How do we improve that . How do we make sure we are able to extend our defenses. Lets stop the problem before they get to our borders or if we know something that is imminent, and you are called first, not Border Control when there is a problem. Making sure you have access to information, and how to improve that, is something i look forward to talking about that with you all in the future. Mr. Chairman, i yield back. Chair recognizes mrs. Watsoncohen. Thank you. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Judge trevino yes. Did i say that properly . Yes, you did. I have a couple of questions first. You pointed thut Cameron County owns three international bridges and you described how critical , cross border trade is to your economy and how important that travel is to your constituents. Has cpb staffing shortages at port of entry affected bridges in your county, have shortages resulted in increased wait times . What more should the federal government do to support crossborder commerce and trade . Has beene to say there no impact, but the reality is you have hit the nail on the head. Because of short aenls ofages, because of the shortages of personnel, the lines can be much longer. It is not unusual for people to live if brownsville and work in matta morris or live in matta morris and work in brownsville. There are numerous crossborder businesses and industries that rely on each other. If someone is going over there for work, they kind of have to do it. For those looking to either more more recreational to eat, shop, dine or receive health care on other side, the reality is we will have less an less of those weve had that and the impact. Not going to tell you the cartel didnt have an impact. The reality is things have calmed down. Why the cooperation between our two countries at the National Level is critical, because at the local level, that is what needs to be done. The local Law Enforcement relies on their counterparts on the mexican side and vice versa. Whether locating an individual is under indictment or charged with a particular serious crime whatever it may , be. Obviously, Staffing Levels need to be at the right where the wait times are as minimal as possible without sacrificing security and surveillance. It would also allow more individuals that are crossing drugs, merchandise, or whatever the case may be. What is it that you would tell the federal government that you think it should support or do in order to support and sustain that there is this sort of cross border trade and travel that is both sufficient for the economy and safe for communities. In addition to increasing staffing, we would heavily request a reinvestment in our infrastructure. While the county owns a bridge, all of the facilities are oebd are owned by the federal government. Gateway bridge was open in 1960. There has literally been no reinvestment or upgrades to that investment to the present. We moved all of the truck traffic to the gateway bridge. Some of the facilities at gateway are just sitting there. If we open up additional lanes did a recent trip to el paso, we had one pedestrian lane for all three bridges. In el paso, one bridge has 14 lanes. One point oflanes, entry, seven bridges. It would generate more revenue at the local bases and allow us to enhance the relationship between our border communities. Thank you. A very quick question. If mccraw, martinez, and wilmot could answer. My question has to do with the proposed wall. Do you believe that proposed wall is the best utilization of resources to keep our borders protected in the areas that you represent and are concerned with . Ill start with you, mr. Mccraw. Yes maam, as i indicated before and i apologize for not being here. Not at all. The wall in itself is an obstacle, not a barrier. I think secretary kelly did a good job explaining that in some places, he noted, you have a barrier already. A natural barrier. How do you exploit technology and resources on top of it so it is not just one thing for one area. It changes. As the judge noted very well, Cameron County, you build a wall, doesnt make sense. Very good point by one of the congressman today about lake almstead, very good point. You need a barrier between points of entry. Thank you. I have exceeded my time. If i could simply get my questions answered. The ladys time has expired. So you are not extending that very short request and indulgence . Just to make sure i understand that. I will allow them to answer your question. Thank you. The fence in and of itself is not the only answer. Del ray separated by a two mile fence that has made our side of the border a little bit safer when it comes to property crimes. It has rerouted everything to the outside of the fence, but in and of itself, it is not the answer. In regards,oman, yuma county has 110. 5miles of order with mexico. Is fenced. Other areas that cannot be fenced have vehicle barriers. I will tell you that once that was put into place, the humanitarian side, preventing deaths in the desert, has stopped. Ive today process 14 victims that were left for dead on one occasion when it is 115 degrees out. I dont think anybody wants to experience what we have had to see as Law Enforcement when we have to process victims that have been abondoned and died. 14 all at once, just a travesty. To see them what they went through, and to see that fence go up, for me, what skost of ais the cost after life . Thank you, gentle lady. Thank you, gentlemen for your testimony today. Back to the interior of the country. Can you give me your experience and position ou how effected 287g has been at the border and then further away from the border . Is it well utilized within Law Enforcement . Is that your experience . Congressman, depends on the agency. Depends on the locale. It works in jails. They train individuals to look and identify and query some data bases and thats helpful. When they get a hit on priority hit through fingerprints. Certainly from an investigative standpoint. Used to work terrorists it was an advantage or drug traffickers, a legacy of ins expert on the team. It would help in many ways and form, but each jurisdiction needs to decide that. We have a jail population of 1200 plus. Isis in our jails everyday. Detainees are honored in our facility. And in regards to your question, congressman, in regards to the 287g we participated in it at one time but i cant use taxpayer funding to do the federal job. So only on overtime basis, if they had the moneys to be able to pay our officers on overtime to perform that function. What we have done in yuma because they are right there, working with us, is they have access to our facility. And they can screen through all of those documents. They placed a hold on the question for the sheriffs throughout the u. S. That does not that ability to have a twohour sponsor hour response for someone to pick them up is by what legal ability are they able to honor detainers. Thats as far as sheriffs across the whole u. S. Impacted with, they dont have that privilege of i. C. E. In our counties. Most leave our jails and go to prison. I dont believe our local Sheriff Department is involved in that but i have to get a better answer for you. I wish i could tell that you right now. Thank you, gentlemen. Mr. Chairman, i yield back. Now recognize i think the last member, gentlelady from california. Five minutes. Thank you. Ofres been a number comments about the wall not being a barrier. And in the packet i see people climbing over a fence. It appears to be easy for them to hop over. Who is the wall most effective against . Is it most effective against the drug cartels . People smuggling drugs . Or the families that are coming over because they are escaping violence . Who is it most effective against . It is equally effective to either. Frankly. But again, as i testified, and i believe the sheriff testified, unless you have noeblg ji on that fence, unalso someone is observing, unless you have coverage on that fence, unless you have someone to have the interlocution when someone comes over that fence or under or through that fence, it is an obstacle and not a barrier. How often does anyone have any information on how often or how frequently the Border Agents will catch someone hopping the fence or shortly after thatey have . I guess in hopping the fence, i dont think they have that many apprehensions where im located. But for the week of january 27th through february 3rd they apprehended 461 individuals in the del rio sector. Del rio has a twomile fence. Maverick county, eagle pass, texas, has a threemile fence. So all those individuals with that were, my belief, all of those individuals that were apprehended were apprehended outside of that boundary. Were they people that turn them selves in or people that were didnt voluntarily turn themselves in . I believe they didnt voluntarily turn themselves in. Sheriff, wilmot, do you want to add to that . I would have to refer to Border Patrol for those numbers. I dont have that Number Available to me. I can only comment on the facts i know for sure. Right. The only comment i would add is in the fact in speaking with the local border spector chiefs, i know apprehensions have decreased over the years. But i dont have specific numbers. Okay. Sheriff wilmot, i know some people have asked about this, you advocated for removing funding for fema and move it into dhs. Who would suffer by fema fundings that you are advocating that we move funds over . I dont believe anybody would suffer any financial loss from moving those funds from fema to dhs. They started out in dhs to begin with, as i understand. So nobody loses any funding. Do you know what their current funds are used for that we would pull from fema . Those funds were specifically designated from the very beginning for operations stone garden overtime and equipment. To help partner with counter parts. There is no funding removed that im aware of from any other budget for that to happen. Congresswoman, it was administratively changed. It was in dhs, then moved to fema. The funding didnt change, just who administrates it. Thank you. The last question, wilmot, you mentioned a number of deaths in the desert. Can you elaborate on what you said and how that prevention occurred . What was it that caused prevention . As i stated in the beginning of my testimony in 2005, 2006, yuma county was the worst in the nation in regards it cross border traffic as well as criminal element that so much accompanies it. And we were experiencing, unfortunately, having to go out into the desert sometimes on a weekly morely basis to recover those victims that were abandoned by the smugglers out in the desert. We as sheriffs, we are the ones that have to respond out there. Whether its federal land, state land, we have to prs says those crime scenes. And our officers were going out there, as ive stated, if not weekly or monthly, to recover those victims that were left out there abandoned to die. What prevented that . The deterrent factor, between the partnerships with our federal officers, combination of fencing, Law Enforcement and presence on the border and technology with the cameras and sensors to be able to predict individuals crossing the desert was all a contributing factor in reducing the criminal element and those individuals being victimized coming across. Rapes, robberies and homicides. If i could just add, in if i could just add, in Brooks County, since 2006 i think they have worked 563 deaths in that county and they are a hundred miles from the border. Thats the people that have come across. I dont know the makeup, if there is a fence there, but thats what Brooks County suffered since 2006. And all that i think a lot of that is at taxpayers expense. Thank you. I yield back. Thank you. And i want to ask one last question. I know have you flights to catch. Ill make it fast. We hear a lot of bricks and mortar versus fencing. I hear a lot of people talking about they want a brick and mortar wall like israel. It will be most effective. Then people like yourselves who live down there, aep thend the fencing, can you see through it, if donedes an advantage correctly. Anyone on the panel have comments on that comparison . No. But i think secretary kelly made a good point about seeing through it. You like to see whats obstacle type of capability. There is value in that. I tend to agree. Sheriff martinez . Yes. Ive been to israel and ive scent fence there. I see what they go through. Just hearing in d. C. , how many fence jumpers have you had here on this property here . And it took a federal officer to neutralize that situation. The same fence back home will need the same situation. I will agree it helps to see through. We have that type of fencing and it is a plus as far as our Border Patrol agents are concerned. You know what is on the other side. So youre not encountering a threat without even knowing it is five foot away from you. Exactly. Mr. Chairman, from my meetings, conversation with Border Patrol agents, they certainly appreciate the fact that they are able he to see and not necessarily always be seen. The concern behind a more concrete or less visible barrier would give the advantage to the other side. As sheriffs have i lewded to, they have to know what is on the other side to properly effect it is helpful. A lot of these members that, you know, the bricks and mortar have never been down there. You guys are the experts. Thank you for being here today. Members may have additional questions in writing. I would ask you to respond. One last comment . I would like to throw out there, that our priority would be also to add in being able to support the u. S. Attorneys office and getting u. S. Attorneys that can actually handle the caseload. And they built a beautiful federal courthouse in yuma county that only has one magistrate. So all of our u. S. Attorneys have to travel three hours to get to court in phoenix. They could save a lot of money by hiring a district judge in yuma. The secretary discussed that and my counter sessiones with jeff sessions, who will be the attorney general. He agrees. We talked about operation streamline, which is a deterrent standpoint with prosecutions [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2017] cspans washington Journal Library every day with news and policy issues that impact you. Coming up this money, jill lawrence, author and usa today, debtor will discuss her book on uncovering legislative and consensus building in capitol hill. Karen jacobsen will discuss the current screening process for refugees entering the u. S. Us andwood joins talks about u. S. Mexico relations under the current political regime. Be sure to watch live at 7 00 eastern this morning. Join the discussion. Next, Small Business owners outline their recommendations for how rural economies can innovate and grow. A discussed the importance of tax incentives, Community Block grants and job training programs. From the aspen institute, this is an hour and a half. We have more people arriving but they will be uh shereddsherd. Ushered in. I want to thank you for joining us today for this lunch of our lunchtime dialogue series americas rural opportunity. I want to thank all thpe