The ambassador negotiated the u. S. Taliban deal to withdraw forces from afghanistan and testified before the Foreign Affairs committee and says he holds the afghan leadership mostly responsible for the takeover of the country after the withdrawal. By the time President Trump left office in january of 2021 the number of u. S. Troops in afghanistan had been reduced to 2,500. President biden completed the withdrawal eight months later. This hearing is 2 1 2 hours. The committee on Foreign Affairs will come to order. The purpose is to discuss how the Biden Administration handed over afghanistan with refusal to address the doha agreement. It comes into the bidens catastrophic withdrawal from afghanistan. For months after President Biden discussed the withdrawal, his senior military advisers and own Intelligence Community repeatedly issued dire warnings about the damage this would create. At the same time, i along with other republican and Democrat Members of congress urged President Biden to uphold the conditions of the doha agreement. And most importantly, we urged them to prepare for the eventual fallout of our withdrawal. He ignored us and all including his own state Department Personnel who issued a dissent cable in july warning of the dire situation on the ground. Instead as the taliban takeover became imminent he and the leaders stuck heads in the stand and they waited until the taliban captured kabul to request a emergency evacuation known as a neo. As a result of the Biden Administrations failure to plan, the u. S. Military was forced to conduct this emergency evacuation surrounded by tens of thousands of taliban terrorists. Put simply, President Biden and secretary blinken put thousands of american lives at risk through their incompetence and willful blindness and the worst outcome, with a terrorist attack in 2021 that killed 13 u. S. Service members and wounded 45 more and killed more than 170 african civilians. It was the deadliest day of the United States in afghanistan in over a decade. And today we have some of the family members of the Service Members killed at abbygate in the audience. Theyre here because they want accountability for their childrens deaths. Im going to give them the answers they deserve. The other site of the climb will spin it as trumps fault. And that the doha agreement said bide00 no choice. This is false. I want to remind you of two incredible facts. The doha agreement was conditions based. The conditions the witnesses here today negotiated. As he can tell you, those conditions were not being met by the taliban. And theyre still not being met today. The taliban is allowing terrorists like al qaeda to flourish in afghanistan. The truth is President Biden wanted to withdraw from the doha agreement. If he wanted to, he could have. He did just that with many of President Trumps agreements like remain in mexico. Second, President Biden himself said even if the doha agreement had never been signed, he would still have withdrawn all u. S. Troops from afghanistan exactly the way that he did. When asked by george stephanopolous, quote, he said would you have withdrawn troops like this even if President Trump had not made the deal with the taliban. President biden said, quote, i would have tried to figure out how to withdraw those troops, yes. Our witness today, ambassador khaized someone ive known for years served as reconciliation where he negotiated the doha agreement and asked to remain on by President Biden. On december 23, he appeared before the committee for a nearly 12hour closed door transcribed interview. And voluntarily, i might add, and we thank for you that. One thing was made clear it was the doha agreement but the president who refused to enforce it. I want to thank our witness for being here today. Ambassador, khalized, i believe you have valuable information to share with this committee. Youre not forced to appear here but are doing it as a patriot and american and someone who was in it from the beginning with so many facts to share with this committee. We thank you, sir, for being here today. With that i recognize the Ranking Member, mr. Meeks. Mr. Meeks thank you, mr. Chairman. I want to thank for you hearing my call for transparency. That of november 2023 afghanistan hearing. Yesterday your staff sent us a commitment to release all transcripts held under this congress and committees investigation and to the United States withdraw from afghanistan after they are finalized on february 29. This indeed is the right thing to do. The American People have funded our bipartisan oversight work and we owe them full transparency, not just misleading cherry picked snippets. Such transparency is critical for any investigation. I strongly hope your commitment to make transcripts public will extend to the other oversight investigations youve initiated in this congress in which witnesses have been questioned behind closed doors. We must not let this committees activities become another typical move in a partisan gain. And with that, let me thank ambassador khalilzad for appearing before our committee. You served under three different president s in a variety of capacities during americas 20 years of war effort in afghanistan. And your insights on the august 2021 withdrawal and the many decision points that led to the events of august 2021 are important to this committees understanding. A 20year war deserves comprehensive and bipartisan oversight. But the title of this hearing, how the Biden Administration failed to enforce the doha agreement is telling. Its not titled the Biden Administrations failed doha agreement with the taliban. That is because it was not joe biden who crafted the february 2020 deal. It was in fact his republican predecessor that made the agreement with the taliban that committed the United States to withdraw all our troops from afghanistan. Nor is the hearing titled how the Trump Administration failed to press the taliban to live up to its commitments in the doha agreement but withdrew troops anyway. That would require scrutiny of a doha deal since its inception under the Trump Administration. I must say this because for some of my republican colleagues, the challenges of afghanistan began the day of joe bidens inauguration. That is not to say the Biden Administration is not under review or theres not something to learn but thats a eight month snapshot. Its malpractice and is historical revisionism and politically motivated to place a withdrawal which President Biden inherited solely at his feet. Lets be clear, both President Biden and President Trump sought to end our forever war in aching. And President Biden ultimately achieved that goal. Our presence in afghanistan has changed but our core interests have not. And the United States continues to pursue those interests as it has demonstrated with the killing of a key mastermind in 2022 in kabul. This is about grappling with reality with the facts we like as well as the ones we dont and with the sacred constitutional responsibility, we have to oversee the state department and the u. S. Foreign policy. To that end, i want to acknowledge ambassador dan smiths statement, which is submitted for todays record. Ambassador smith served for almost four decades at the state department and returned at secretary blinkens request to lead its independent review of the departments actions over the course of january 2020 to august 2021. Related to the United States withdrawal. The result of his review, drawn from over 150 interviews is not just invaluable but actionable and provide a roadmap we all should consult regularly to support the departments crises management capacity and the single greatest asset, its people. Ambassador, i know youve previously sat for a transcript interview on todays subject that lasted over 10 hours. And we thank you for that. Thats a testimony to both your vast knowledge to share and your deep commitment to america. And to our National Security. So i look forward to your testimony and hope the American People can hear today what weve already heard behind closed doors. With that i yield. Other members of the committee are reminded Opening Statements can be submitted for the record. Were pleased to have here today the honorable khalilzad who served as a representative for the state department from september 18 to october 2021. Your full statement will be made part of the record. I now recognize the ambassador for his Opening Statement. Ambassador. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member and distinguished members of the committee, i welcome the opportunity to talk with you today about americas strategy in afghanistan during my service. Between 20182022. In december 2018 the Trump Administration asked me to help negotiate a Framework Agreement for the safe withdrawal of u. S. Forces. With commitments from both the taliban and african government on u. S. Counterterrorism concerns and sat the stage for afghans to start negotiating an end to the war in their country. By the end of 2018, the president s decision was to bring the American Forces home. Several factors that contributed to this decision. The conclusion that this war had gone on for too long with no end in sight. The opportunity cost was too high. The United States needed to focus on Great Power Competition that is china, russia and the threat from iran. Afghanistan no longer was central to the war on terror. The goal of transforming afghanistan to a Democratic State was a high achievement. They had rampant levels of corruption. That administration recognized the potential risks involved with this policy. The greatest risk was the potential threat to u. S. Forces during withdrawal. The british withdrawal in 1842 and soviet withdrawal in 1988 and 1989 had been very bloody. A second risk was afghanistan once again becoming the big platform for a terrorist threat against the United States homeland, u. S. Interests, and our allies. A third was the loss of gains this policy both inside the government and outside but the president determined the withdrawal was in the u. S. National interests. After more than a year of negotiations on february 29, 2020, we reached two agreements, one was the table and the other with the Afghan Government. These provided the framework for u. S. Withdrawal dealing with terrorism, intraafghan negotiations within the taliban and African Republic, a permanent ceasefire and future relations between the United States and afghanistan. Key features of the agreement were phased withdrawal of u. S. Forces over a 14month period. Afghanistan was not to be used by any group or individual to threaten the security of the United States and its allies, intraafghan negotiations, importantly the taliban committed not to attack u. S. Forces once the agreement was signed. This was critical and the taliban adhered to it, killing no coalition fighter or u. S. Soldier during the entire walt period. The first phase of withdrawal lasted 135 days in which the u. S. Forces was reduced to 8600. By the time President Trump left office, u. S. Forces in afghanistan had been reduced to 2,500. The u. S. Retained the right to come to the defense of the Afghan Forces if the taliban attacked them. We exercised this right as needed. During the negotiations between the African Republic and the taliban, which started on september 12,2020, they did not make any significant process. After the november 2020 election s, president elect bidens team asked me to stay on. That administration had three options, one, withdraw from the doha agreement, two, implement the agreement but with changes such as the extension of the agreed time line linking the withdrawal of remaining forces to a conclusion of a political agreement between the taliban and the african government or insisting on leaving behind an afghanistan a counterterror force or withdraw the remaining forces without such linkages. The president announced in april of 2021 that we would add four months to the timetable for withdrawal for a total of 18 months. The withdrawal was not conditioned on a political agreement between the two afghan sides because it was believed such conditionality with the risk to return to War Without End and entrap the United States into reversing course and sending more forces again. It was also decided that our over the herizin capabilities would allow us to monitor and respond to terror threats of the u. S. From afghan territory on protecting social and political gains, the approach was to advocate for key values in the course of intraafghan negotiations by pressing the taliban on respecting womens rights and human rights. The withdrawal proceeded based on the new extended time line. It was that the u. S. Forces would defend it and fight the taliban during the withdrawal for some time afterwards. This assumption informed our plans. Although reasonable, the assumption turned out to be wrong. The situation on the ground began to shift significantly and rapidly in favor of the taliban. They took over one province after another and by mid august of 2021 were at the gates of kabul. We had the last minute success in per situating the taliban to refrain from entering kabul and instead hold talks with government to reach a political deal for a shared government, a step to which both sides agreed but fell apart when president ghani fled the country which now caused the leaderless Afghan Military and police to instantly disintegrate and these developments led to the taliban reentry into kabul and this abrupt series of events obliged the u. S. To react and improvise as none of this had been foreseen in our plans to withdraw by the end of august. As we all remember, the final two weeks of chaos at the airport and the tragic loss of 13 brave americans in the isis terror attack was difficult and what we mained hotly debated. The events of those final days should not diminish the achievements made. We must all remember that after 9 11 we sent our forces to afghanistan to decimate al qaeda there. This was accomplished and represents a major win for the security of the United States. We all are grateful to those whose sacrifices made this possible and to their families. The struggle for afghanistan is not over and afghanistans final chapter is certainly not written. The seed of the values we planted may well bear fruit over time. It would be a mistake to turn our backs to the country. The american approach Going Forward must take current realities in afghanistan, the region and the world into account while remaining guided elsewhere by our interests and enduring values. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you. Our Veterans Service was not in vain. They protected this nation for 20 years from a major terrorist attack of 9 11 and we thank them for that. We want to thank the parents of Corporal Hunter lopez and marine corps Sergeant Nicole gee who are here today and the lopez family and the rest of the gold star families, we honor sacrifice and your children. In november you testified before this committee in a transcribed interview and restated it. You presented to the Biden Administration and to the president basically three options on the doha agreement. One, to basically ignore it and unconditionally withdrawal and two to tear it up and three to enforce it with the conditions against the taliban. You also 26ed you and secretary blinken both recommended to President Biden that he enforce dohas condition but instead the president ignored your advice or disagreed and chose to ignore the doha conditions and unconditionably withdraw. Is is that correct mr. Was the opportunity for me to brief the president , as you said, correct, and the options that he had. And it was clear it would be desirable the final withdrawal happens after there is an agreement between the government and the taliban. And that was broadly supported. That idea. But upon discussion and deliberation and consultation with allies and others, and the allies favored withdrawal after there was an agreement between the government and the taliban. But there was the judgment that if we did that, it was not part of the doha agreement and that it could result in a protracted delay in the withdrawal of forces in that we couldnt be certain when and if the afghans would reach an agreement. And if there was a risk of going back to war and perhaps sending more troops, the decision was not to pursue that and there was broad support for that decision. Your recommendation to the president was to enforce dohas conditions, correct . That was part of the agreement, yes. We restated that it was a condition based agreement, it was a package deal and there were linkages, what we did dependent on the taliban delivering on their commitments. Right. And the president disagreed with you and chose not to enforce the conditions. Well, i described the discussion that occurred and the judgment that was made. And the conditions were not enforced and as a result the taliban is in control of afghanistan today, correct . Its clear the taliban are in control but i would put the responsibility for what happened largely on the shoulders of the Afghan Government leadership for not standing for their government, for their system and for the values that they set. I agree. I think president ghanis actions were cowardice and fleeing his country is not a good example. Let me turn to the meeting you had in doha between yourself, general mckenzie and the taliban leader. You said the taliban offered to give the United States control of kabul for the purposes of evacuation but that offer was turned down, when asked by my committee at your interview whether the taliban viewed that as a, quote, green light to take over kabul, you said, quote, i think thats clear. You agree with that statement . I agree that we had made an agreement for the taliban not to enter kabul and for a delegation to come from kabul, the president ghany had to agree to it as well to negotiate a power sharing government to take over september 1 in a meeting of 200 afghan notables present. Chairman mckenzie said thats not my mission because his orders are not to secure kabul for evacuation and his orders are to evacuate by july 4 and he didnt have the troops allocated for that. He could have raised that to the president. Was this meeting, to your knowledge, ever reported to the white house . Ambassador it was reported clearly and to the entire government but it was reported after general mckenzie said on the spot it wasnt as you said, chairman, his mission to secure kabul, and the initial goal was for taliban not to be in kabul and in fact presented them with a map of some 2025 miles away from the center, within that area that there should be no taliban present but the departure of president ghany and increased widespread concern by afghans in kabul with law and order and the disintegration of the Security Forces the options were either the talibans offer we take responsibility and your mckenzie you said correctly, chairman, i was present in the meeting, is that that was not part of the mission and then the discussion shifted to where the taliban could go. Chairman mckenzies understanding, the president wouldnt authorize more troops to take over kabul for purposes of the evacuation. Ambassador i cant comment because i wasnt present at any discussion he may have had. Chairman if that had happened wouldnt that be a little different . We take over kabul for purposes of the evacuation and the taliban agrees to stay out this 20mile radius and they dont take over and theyre not part of this chaos at the very end and the suicide ballmer coming out of the prison, im not asking to you speculate but its very foreseeable that may never have happened. And yet this report goes to the white house and nothing is done to change the course of events, correct . Ambassador your account is correct. We dont know what else could have happened if that decision was made. So we were entering speculation now. Chairman you really cant trust the taliban. I see my time is expired and i now resign to mr. Meeks. Mr. Meeks we should not speculate but giving your opinions or paraphrasing of what youre saying and im taking it for what youre saying and not guess on what my thoughts are because we want to do an investigation to determine what we should learn from it. Ambassador right. Mr. Meeks let me join the chairman in saying to our gold star families how much we appreciate you and the heroes that lost their lives. And i know theres nothing we can do to bring them back but they are indeed heroes for our country. And i thank you for your sacrifices, and ill tell you that no matter whether as a democrat or a republic, i truly believe well always hold them dear and acknowledge the heroes that they are. Thank you for being here. Ambassador, youve worked tirelessly over the years to implement the doha deal as many others in our government and i have questions to ask based on your experience. Theyre mostly yes and no and we dont have to get into speculation. But secretary pompeo himself, i have a picture here, had gone to doha to sign the agreement in a photoop with the taliban leader after nearly two decade of being at war with them and despite any criticisms of it, its fair to say concluding the doha deal was a significant event, is that correct . Ambassador yes, signing it was a significant event. Mr. Meeks with the conclusion of the doha deal the taliban stopped attacking u. S. Forces inside afghanistan fulfilling the top position placed on it in the deal, is that also correct . Ambassador correct. Mr. Meeks and the United States committed in the doha deal to, quote, withdraw from afghanistan all military forces of the United States, its allies, coalition partners, including all nondiplomatic civilian personnel, private security contractors, trainers, advisers, and supporting services personnel, is that not correct . Ambassador correct. Mr. Meeks and arguably that withdrawal was well underway in january of 2021 after President Trump, according to ambassador smiths statement, for the record, quote, steadily withdrew u. S. Forces notwithstanding concerns about the talibans behavior, is that correct . Ambassador correct. We were down to 2500, as i said. Mr. Meeks so in your Expert Opinion, what did you think the taliban would have done if President Biden just a few months before the original may deadline that his predecessor had set for a full withdrawal, had just walked away entirely from the doha agreement in your Expert Opinion . Ambassador if we had walked away from the doha agreement, we would have been back, in my opinion, now im offering an opinion. We would have been back and fighting the taliban. We would have been back to where we were before the agreement. Thats my opinion. Mr. Meeks you spoke in your Opening Statement of the belief that imposing further conditions on the taliban at that time, as youve just stated, would risk a return to war. And you hold to that belief today, correct . Ambassador i do. Mr. Meeks had President Biden sought to maintain the deal with small troops in afghanistan, did the risk remain the taliban could resume attacks against them . Ambassador very likely. Mr. Meeks im sure, mr. Ambassador, you agree that the highest priority of the United States president should be to protect american lives, correct . Ambassador correct. Mr. Meeks and even over other development or National Security objectives or even over the allies and partners . Ambassador before we get to a complicated discussion, we put lives at risk in defense of our interests and values as we did in afghanistan for many years. Mr. Meeks so mr. Ambassador, in your own belief, do you believe that President Bidens completion of the u. S. Withdrawal of afghanistan in 2021 was necessary to protect american lives . Ambassador certainly american lives in afghanistan in terms of military forces, yes. Chairman the chair now recognizes mr. Wolfeson. [ mr. Wilson. Mr. Wilson its time to appreciate the success of the American Military for 20 years they stopped terrorist attacks in our country. So as people look back, we should appreciate the success of the American Military, very personal to me, my former National Guard unit, the 218th mechanized military led by general Bob Livingston served for a year across afghanistan and developed great affection for their afghan brothers. I was there four times and seen first hand the success of what they were doing. Im grateful my youngest son, First LieutenantHunter Wilson was an engineer serving with the army guard for a year in afghanistan. Its very personal to me the absolute disgust i have with president joe biden. His appeasement and surrender and abandonment led immediately to the death of 13 Young Americans at kabul airport even though the sniper had the mass murdering individual bomber in his sights which could have saved the 13 lives and could have saved indeed hundreds of poor African Citizens who were murdered, yet the biden rules of engagement came into play and 13 Young Americans died. With that, too lets also give encouragement to what were into now which we did not choose and that is a war, dictators innovating the democracy with rule of law and we saw that february 24, 2022 when war criminal putin innovated ukraine and we saw it october 7 when hamas, the puppets of iran innovated israel and we see it today with the threats being made against the 24 Million People of taiwan by the Chinese Communist party. All of it goes back to the shameless, shameful decision i think is the most catastrophic in the history of the United States in terms of National Defense and security and Foreign Policy and theres no excuse, however they rewrite history, god bless their hearts. But additionally we should always remember america was in afghanistan and liberated afghanistan from taliban terrorists because of the terrorist attacks of 9 11. History should not be rewritten. What happened was Osama Bin Laden was operating out of a cave in afghanistan. So for 20 years indeed our military was successful to protect but sadly by abandoning afghanistan, the global war on terrorism is not over and coming to america and the f. B. I. Has identified that were at great risk of attack imminently here in america what could occur and is shameful what occurred. Additionally the question i have is that when on august 26, 2021 when President Biden excused his appeasement and right in the middle of his speech he was explaining his advisers said abandon, leave, now, and then threw in, not on the teleprompter, i have letters. I asked for coppies of the letters for advice he received to abandon the people of afghanistan. I should not surprise you but every two months i send a letter to the warehouse asking for the letters. There are no letters. Theyve not been revealed. But what advice was given by his advisers on leaving the people of afinogenov to fall off jets, as the abandonment took place . Ambassador i believe our military under the leadership of the president and the chain of command did an admirable job in a variable set of circumstances to get as many people out as 125,000 people were brought out. I aassociate myself with your praise of your military and i had the honor of serving with them in afinogenov and iraq and theyve done an outstanding job for the people of the United States for our security. With regard to what you mentioned, sir about the letters and advice, i dont have direct knowledge what it is that was involved there. But the advice was to bring out as many people as possible, to reach out to as Many Americans and those that have worked for us or for organizations that worked for us to bring them out and a huge number was brought out. Mr. Wilson thank you. Chairman the chair recognizes mr. Sherman. Mr. Sherman throughout the period we had two choices, keep the force there particularly with airpower and be prepared to incur modest casualties or pull out. The Foreign Policy establishment wanted to stay. The dissent cables said stay. The politicians promised the American People we would pull out. Not because our casualties were particularly large but because they were on top of 20 years of war. We were defeated militarily of achieving our full goals by afghanistan, not by the taliban but the phrase forever war. Once that phrase was coined, the American People demanded we withdraw. Now, i know theres pressure on the chairman to politicize this committee and achieve the political objectives of his party but this hearing is going to give politicization a bad name because its the worst issue for the republicans to bring up because ambassador, this doha agreement is the worst agreement i can imagine. I dont blame you. Because President Trump well, you had testified in your testimony by the end of 2018 it was well known President Trumps decision was to bring all American Forces home from afinogenov. In 2019 on the anniversary of 9 11, he invited them to camp david and just before the november 2020 election, President Trump stated, we will have the small remaining number of our brave men and women serving in afinogenov home by christmas. So the only leverage you had over the taliban is maybe we will take that foreign follow approach and keep our air force capacity there and you have President Trump saying theyre all home by christmas every single one of them. So this is the worst agreement i could imagine. Ambassador, is there anything in the agreement where the taliban commit themselves to allowing 13yearold girls to go to school . I didnt find anything like that, is it in there . Ambassador the taliban, theres nothing in the agreement. The issues dealing with afinogenov was to be with afghanistan was to be negotiated. Mr. Sherman why didnt we enforce the agreement . When the taliban treats 12yearolds like sex slaves and when they kill members of the lbgtq community and when they kill anyone who converts from islam to christianity, theyre not in violation of this agreement were having a hearing saying why are we enforcing, theyre not in violation. You cant enforce it. We entered into an agreement in which they agreed to do nothing more than talk to the Afghan Government. They talked, they decided they wanted to kill lbgtq community, they wanted to kill what they call apostates and wanted to basically enslave half the human race, the female half. This agreement was so bad the chairman attacks President Biden for not withdrawing from it. This is an agreement entered into by the man who claims hes the best negotiator in the world, President Trump. I will say we did achieve one objective. Afghanistan is not uniquely situated to serve as a base for terrorism against america. And in fact theres been more terrorism coming out of afghanistan killing iranians in iran than killing americans. Theres no such thing as an easy withdrawal. Russia, as the ambassador pointed out, russia and britain had messy withdrawals from afghanistan and the withdrawal from vietnam was messy as well, particularly true when every English Speaking afghan i had any acquaintance with was trying to leave, the idea of average grunt in afghanistan would stay and fight is absurd. I have one more question and that is the republicans have said that somehow we should have gone all over afghanistan and collected our 85 billion worth of weapons, presumably from people who knew they could keep them for their own selfdefense or sell them to the taliban. Could we have by force taken back our weapons everywhere in afghanistan on our way out without casualties . Ambassador thank you, sir. As you know, the weapons that were left behind were weapons that we thought was safe to leave behind for the government of afghanistan. Mr. Sherman even if we recognized the government was useless could we have seized them without casualties . Ambassador now were speculating because the government, we assume would not mr. Sherman its more a rhetorical question. If people have weapons they want to hold on to them you cant take them away unless you want to incur some casualties. Chairman the chair recognizes mr. Perry. Mr. Perry in september of 2020 you appeared before the House Oversight committee and testified the u. S. Troop withdrawal would be based on conditions on the ground and delivery by the taliban on their commitment. Did you or secretary blinken advocate for an extension on the withdrawal considering the poor planning behind the final evacuation as it occured. Ambassador already added to the timetable, moving from 14 to 18. But as i said again, and the decision was made to withdraw at the end of august and not to link it to any conditions that you might have in mind. That was your question, conditions, the americans would have in mind it would be a condition based withdrawal, which makes sense. You provide some kind of when i say you our adversary, so to speak, you provide some level of compliance with the agreement we can see and then well give you a little. But thats not what occurred. Im just wondering if you can name a single concession made by the taliban during the time period between the april 14th announcement by the president , President Biden of a total withdrawal in the fall of afinogenov. What concessions . Ambassador one concession was that they acquiesced to the addition of four months that we demanded. Mr. Perry four what . Ambassador four months was demanded of additional time, they could have rejected it and gone back to fighting. They didnt. They acquiesced. Two, they agreed not to enter kabul. When we asked. They agreed to a government that would include members of the republican side. Mr. Perry they took more and more of the government under their control which was not in the doha agreement which was not considered which was not what was agreed to. And they did invade kabul. Ambassador they did because they agreed not to and then mr. Perry so they lied to us and the withdrawal was not based on conditions on the ground and im wondering did you convey these concerns to President Biden during the continuing negotiations about the blatant violations. They were blatant and the whole world saw them as they were occurring. Ambassador certainly im not here to defend the behavior of the taliban. Mr. Perry none of us are, i get that. Ambassador but i believe that insisting on additional conditions mr. Perry were not asking for additional conditions, just the conditions they agreed to. Im trying to determine knowing that. You knew that, the world saw that. The president saw that. Im assuming, maybe i shouldnt be, but im assuming you advised him of that. The secretary advised him of that but he proceeded anyway. Ambassador he proceeded to withdraw forces because he believed if he persisted, it will be back to a fight. And he didnt want to do that. Mr. Perry just out of curiosity in the remaining time, who chose the 20th anniversary of 9 11 as the final evacuation day . Ambassador i actually do not know that. Mr. Perry did you ever question that . Maybe its not as important and impactful for you and the rest of americans but thats pretty significant. Ambassador i agree with that. Therefore an adjustment was made to the end of august as the final date of withdrawal. Mr. Perry but it was september 11. Ambassador initial announcement, you know as well as i do. Mr. Perry you dont know who made the decision. Ambassador the president obviously made the decision. But i dont know who advised him on choosing that day. Mr. Perry the president is the commander in chief regardless who advised him. It was said that the president wanted to withdraw and you even kind of just reminded us because it was to protect american lives and to lessen the loss of american lives but you would also concede that the time coming into that during the Previous Administration there had been no loss of american lives. And once the decision was made and the plan executed, mr. Was a horrific loss of american lives ambassador the loss of life that didnt occur under President Trump. Mr. Perry we dont know what didnt occur. But what did occur. The Previous Administrations plan coming into it during that period of time, a long period of time, there were no loss of american Service Members lives. Ambassador because of the agreement. Mr. Perry it wasnt because of the agreement, the taliban wasnt abiding by the agreement is because the president let the taliban know that if they killed any american lives, it was going to be over for them. I yield the balance. Some news from capitol hill, John Bresnahan of punch bowl news posted that the bipartisan ukraine, israel, taiwan Border Security proposal will come from house centrists and will have eight cosponsors, four from each party. The republican negotiators will be representatives bacon, fitzpatrick, lawler and chavezderemer. And the democrats include golden, case, perez and costa. Read more at punch bowl. News. Cspan is your unfiltered view of government. Funded by these Television Companies and more, including cox. Koolen devries syndrome is extremely rare. Hi. But friends dont have to be. This is jo. When youre connected, youre never alone. Cox supports cspan as a Public Service along with these other television providers, giving you a front row seat to democracy. Today watch cspans 2024 campaign trail, a weekly roundup of cspans campaign coverage, providing a one stop shop to discover where the candidates are traveling across the country and what theyre saying to voters. This along with firsthand accounts from political reporters, updated poll numbers, fundraising data and campaign ands. Watch cspans 2024 campaign trail. Today at 7 00 eastern on cspan, online at cspan. Org or download as a podcast on cspan now, a free mobile app or where you get your podcasts. Cspan, your unfiltered view of politics. Sunday on cspans q a, don scott, the newly elected Democratic House speaker of delegates and the first black speaker in 405 years talked about his life, including spending almost eight years in prison. I had never been in trouble before. Id served my country. And i was hoping i would get a little more grace and maybe getting the judge to have some attitude to go with the law. He probably could have gave me more time than he did. But i remember hearing my mother when he said 10 years, she couldnt believe it and that yelp of pain stays with me and is always motivated and always lets me know how fragile our freedom is and how perilous is it is and if you make one wrong move sometimes it can be literally the end of your life as you announcer virginias Democratic House speaker sunday night at 8 00 q a p. M. Eastern on q a q a. Listen to q a and all of our podcasts on every cspan now app