Sarahs work is specifically targeted to addressing a range of harassment and discipline issues in elementary and secondary schools. Prior to joining the division, she worked for the new Jersey Institute for social justice and the American Civil Liberties union. She received her ba from the university of virginia. We have a jefferson scholar in the room . You guys need to connect before you leave. Her m. A. From the university of cambridge. Robert listenbee. I just call him bob. The administrator for the office of juvenile justice and delinquency prevention. He washis appointment, the chief of the juvenile Defender Association for philadelphia for about 16 years and was a trial lawyer with the association for 27 years. He was instrumental in creating the juvenile Defender Association of pennsylvania. He has served on multiple state and National Organizations and commissions of that advocate for gender, race, and ethnic fairness in the treatment of juveniles and improvements the juvenile justice policies and juvenile defense including the National Legal aid and Defender Association and the National Juvenile defender center. A cochair of the attorney generals National Task force on children. Exposed the violence of a member of the juvenile justice which advises the president and congress. He received his ba from Harvard University and his law degree from the bold hall school of law at the university of california berkeley. Can we welcome our two panelists . [applause] as i was already introduced, i am jonathan brice, Deputy Assistant secretary. I spent 20 years in k12 education as a High School Social studies teacher, a middle assistant high school principal, District Administration where i was responsible for student safety in three large districts and three states. A bunch of degrees, including a doctorate from Harvard University with a focus on the urban superintendency. My first question to my panel i would like you guys to give us about 30 seconds to a minute of some sort of, sort of overview of what you think are the big issues for bullying and how it fits into your current work. Wow. The big issues for bullying. I guess what i would say is speaking about bullying and harassment and their relationship with discipline i think the Biggest Issue is really addressing School Climate holistically. I think that there may be a addressing itt effectively is difficult to do while also a dressing discipline appropriately and keeping in mind, trying to avoid desperate or excessively harsh discipline. I think, in fact, in our work when looking at those issues, we are looking at addressing them effectively using the same. Creating a positive School Climate will address bullying issues. First of all, i would like to say thank you to the last two panels. You guys are just outstanding. The knowledge i gained was very insightful. My colleagues from 4h. Considerableovides funding for 4h and other mentoring organizations. Wow, you guys are really knowledgeable, powerful. I think with the last two panels show us that first of all, this is happening in youth space. They are experts in this issue. Researchers at the universities and at offices like mine may be able to gather data and analyze it and give us a clear idea to the extent of Cyber Bullying that is going on and other kinds of bullying. But, if we are going to be able to develop in this environment, we need to turn to young people much more that we have in most other spaces. That is my first take away from this. It is a learning lesson because i just learned that within the last hour and a half. Unfortunately, cannot not be here the whole time so that is my first take. Federalnd is at the level, we are going to have to continue to expand our collaborations across agencies. Of the health and Human Services with the department of education and justice and many other agencies ur that we can pull o resources and collaborate more effectively and have Common Schools that are more excessive bowl to communities across america. A lot of it is so obscure in it into that most people do not find it. When we get everybody together, we have to figure out how to work in this issue over the long term rather than do a short time we have. Let me flag something. The attorney general eric holder and the secretary of education arne duncan started the support School Initiative to address the issue of School Climate and problems within schools involving suspensions and expulsions. I think we need to applaud them for the extraordinary work that has happened under their leadership and the private center. Over 50 million has been dispensed to develop bulls in understanding the whole phenomenon of expansions suspensions and expulsions of students. The various apartments working on civil rights guidance, new gathering tools that make it awesome over communities to gather information that what is happening at their local schools. If we have a situation where he wants to go back to his school or will want to go back to his school and find out what is happening with suspensions and expulsions or you want to go back to the school he was at the 40 became older before he became older. We have a baseline for figuring out what we are going to do. What struck me by the last panel was the idea the fight doesnt start it didnt start in schools. The flight actually started last evening on twitter because everybody was chiming in and school is the place where kids meet up and settle it facetoface. Means well, sometimes sometimes they meet in the neighborhood and settle it. The real issue for School Administrators and teachers is about having a connection and being able and having those relationships so that they either are on sort of the twitter feed or they are close enough to some student in the entlding or their par and they get the information early enough so they can intervene. It really means that their job has become that much more difficult, but also that building those great relationship is much more paramount because without them, they not going to get the information they need. It leads to the second point. Bob, you started talking about the work of the supporters of school boost of an Initiative School discipline initiative. Can you give us in your opinion as you have looked at this work over the last couple of years, what i am interested in is why this fits in a conversation about bullying. Right . What is the connection between it and i think sarah earlier alluded to this idea of we are not necessarily targeting bullying, we are now starting to talk about having safe and supportive environments. Can you just talk about it from that perspective. Part of the question i see again, let me celebrate all of you that are here on the second day of summit after 5 00. Part of what i want to stress is the support of School DisciplineInitiative Focuses on the bully. When we talk about bullying, how we prevent it, how we address it, how we recognize it but how do we really treat the person who is the bully . How about one of those young. Eople who have been bullying we have to recognize that suspensions and expulsions are not the only answer. We have alternative schools, alternative programs within schools. We need to somehow get to the root causes of what causes a young person to bully. One of the things we know is that young people who have been exposed to violence, web been traumatized who have been traumatized may have had the normal developmental processes derailed. We know that because we have done many studies that show 60 of our children in america are exposeto violence in the year prior to our study. Violence on the streets, in the home. Althoughany of them some are resilient, many are derailed from the normal processes and involved in fights in schools and in up in the juvenile Justice System because we havent figured out how to develop the appropriate assessment tools to assess their trauma and where to get care for them. We know that. The attorney generals task force recommended is that every child who comes into each one of our schools as an opportunity for a proper kind of assessment that will determine whether that child has been exposed to trauma and give that child if that child has been exposed, we need they are given proper care so the child doesnt act out in school. The messages if you are a bully, lets find out the reason why. Lets see if we can find a way to address your underlying issues of which may be substance abuse, Mental Health issues. If we can address them, we wont have to put you into the delinquency system or the criminal Justice System. The caveat is some of our children need to go into a dealing with the system. And need to go into really wellqualified delinquency systems that can address their needs. Many if not most of our systems do not address those needs yet. We are working on them but they do not. I know that because if i were to do a survey in this room of how many of you trust our juvenile intice system at via done many situations left than 1 are willing to trust our juvenile Justice System with their children. Anybody here want to celebrate that one . We have some significant work. Sarah, your work focusing on harassment issues, discipline issues at the elementary and secondary level. What are you seeing in terms of steps that or the districts are taking are they addressing bullying in ways that would help to protect children that are being bullied . Do they have overarching plans to prevent acts of bullying from taking place . Yes, this is something we think about when we are working h a district to implement Settlement Agreement in most cases and enforce that agreement. One of the first things we look for is training and creating Educational Programs for the school as a whole. Those sorts of things can prevent or reduce the likelihood by teaching all the students in your school about respect, diversity. Getting students thinking about those things even before they perhaps engage in bullying behavior. Getting teachers prepared to respond to an incident if one occurs. To face thatefore situation could really help to ensure that the response is effective. As we heard on the last panel, most kids are not doing the bullying. Sorts of educational schoolwide programs can help kids to be effective bystanders as well. Just as bob said, i think it is really important that when a student is engaging in bullying or harassing behavior, discipline may not always be the most effective or sufficiently effective as a response. Engaging with that student whether it is through counseling, Early Intervention so that you can address more minor behaviors and catch them early can assist not just the student who is being bullied, but the student that is engaging in the bullying. I think that was really helpful. One of the things that i would also add is the need on the part of adults in schools to respond quickly. Prettyfind it problematic that in some cases the delayed response allows the issue to grow when if the response had been quicker, you couldve really sort of ousted the situation and allowed people to move on. Because it wasnt responded to as quickly as possible, we see bigger problems. That would be one thing for School Administrators that i would suggest. Thinkuestion and then i we will take some time to see if we can get any questions from our ordinance audience. In terms of support of School Discipline initiative, are there any recommendations you would make to our audience for things that they can do one or two things they can do that would make a difference in their communities, in their cities or School Districts that would really be helpful so that people would understand the connection between building better School Climates, helping to prevent bullying as well is the work we have done around reducing out of School Suspensions and expulsions. It seems like it is a counterintuitive argument, right . Madison,e i was in wisconsin speaking to teachers and administrators before the start of their school year. I have to admit folks, when we talk about reducing suspensions and expulsions, we talk about limiting the disparities between different subgroups. Those issuesaid with the issue of bullying, it sees that what really we need to do we want to take that bullying, get the kids out of the building. That is not always the right decision. Two things wer might be able to share with the audience that would be helpful for them to think about as they go back to their communities . One thing i think is if you ean look up on either th website or the council or State Government website, you will find there was a consensus report that was produced. The report is an extensive report developed based upon interviews across the nation for the last several years. We have spent a lot of money one good recommendations to all folks involved in addressing issues with School Climate. We would like you to take a look at it and see if some of the recommendations might apply in your specific area. I think that would be one major recommendation i would have. Stressond thing i would is going back to where i started. The one thing i have learned is that every time i go to a panel or discussion and you hear the adults talk for an hour and then youd have 10 minutes of young people you are feeling like the young people have the answer, maybe they shouldve had the main part of the program. It is not that they steal the program, they are the experts in a lot of cases and i think we as adults are going to have to do a number of things with young people. We have to recognize their importance in the process. We have to develop inappropriate institute appropriate institutional structures that helps them learn how to talk the language of professionals and be leaders in the context of these issues because they need opportunities to be at the boardroom tables, but they also need to be informed enough in detail about the issues so they can offer concrete recommendations and be taken seriously by a lot of folks who typically bring young people in and showpieces. And then ignore them. We need to figure out how to institutionalize youth voice and policymaking around these and other issues that are directly impactful on young people. I think this one is critical. We hear about youth courts in schools as one of the mechanisms. We need to have young people help us really work towards developing these longterm solutions and begin to communicate with each other as leaders across the country. That may be hard because we have not done it yet but i think we really need to figure out how to do it. There are some institutions within health and Human Services that i admire. We need to make this a bigger issue and go forward. Bob has great points as usual. A couple of specifics that really follow along the same lines, i think just starting those conversations i think is really a helpful and important starting point. Having students involved and participating in reviewing school policy, incorporating expectations about bullying and aboutment, and thinking discipline models that are positive oriented together at the same time could really be an effective starting point. Involving student in creating that School Climate and responding after an incident may occur. For example, some of our agreements we have had student panels and created to develop curriculum around diversity. Antibullying really taking ownership for the programs that will go on in their schools. Some of them started justice practices that could be implemented. Really giving students ownership for that process in their school is critical. I guess the last question we have and i probably shouldve asked if a little earlier. This is like a real practical on how weund question for deal with it at the federal level. In what looks like at the school level. Incident of bullying occurs on facebook or twitter over the weekend, not on school property. Kids come back to school on monday. There is distress. Administrators and teachers and up spending a considerable amount of time interacting and diffusing the situation. From perspective of all the things we have done trying to reduce out of School Suspension and expulsion, to restore the community and have schools be places that are safe and supportive environments, what do you think administrators can do if they can resolve the situation if no physical altercation took place but there was still the issue of bullying . What would you its the thing that keeps me awake at night. No two situations are alike and every response should be specific to the school and the context. Again, not to hit the point too strongly, but thinking of these things ahead of time about how your school could deal with these things, what is the response thats going to work. Some examples would be making sure there is time in a homeroom or weekly discussion at the start of the day where if there are issues coming up emma there is a point at the start of the day were those things can be acknowledged, look for, making sure students know who they can talk to in the school if they are experiencing bullying issues, if they know about Something Else thats happening, have that be a safe space thats not that students are not feeling like they are tattle tailing, that there is a disciplinary mechanism put in place that encourages students to feel comfortable sharing that will enable a more successful response. I think thats an interesting perspective. I dont know. Having been responsible for a large district, two hundred schools, maybe 5000 kids, i do wonder how much time administrators have. I do think there need to be structured meetings and advisories. The end of the day, you want adults to have relationships with children to the extent that they can come forward and say i am about to have a problem with someone. We got into it last night, and if you dont resolve it, i think its going to get physical. I think that sort of the answer most administrators are going with. I think student code of conduct in most districts talk about things happening on campus as opposed to off campus as if the things happening off campus dont come on campus, and i would strongly encourage those folks responsible to start thinking about the responsibility they have for events that occur off campus that impact the educational environment that require them to spend resources, time, attention. There has to be a way for them to make parents and students aware of, yes, even though this happened at home, its going to be addressed at school. I think there needs to be a restaurant of the restorative process, but i think it is difficult as heck in the middle of the day for School Administrators to deal with this. Let me go back to her, and that was made by some about facebook. Someone said we are at the beginning of introducing our norms into modern social media. Think we have to recognize that we have a long way to go and it is going to take us years and years to introduce Community Values into the social media said. It is not going to happen easily. We have to work very hard at it. The basic provisions we have now say if it happens outside of school you cannot hold students responsible. I have held suspension hearings an awful lot and i have one because it did not happen on school grounds. It happened at the mcdonalds a block away, and therefore my client was not suspended or expelled. But the impact on the School Climate, we have to think differently about this. We have to grapple with issues of what the new norm should be. We have to recognize the First Amendment rights we have for freedom of expression. Because those things are real and part of our culture and basic, fundamental values, we have to develop a mechanism for recognizing that there are not going to be any hard and fast issues. The way to develop understanding is on a casebycase basis, developing over time a new culture in social media. It is going to take a lot of time for us to grapple with this for many, many years. You and i will have gray hair, or for some of us no hair, and we will be in our rocking chairs before this is worked out. What i heard here today was the curry jimmy enthusiasm to grapple with the issue. And if we can grapple with that, if we can transmit that to folks that yes, we have to work hard at it, i think that would be a big success in one of the many successes coming out of the summit. We are going to try to take two or three questions. Someone has approached the mike here. Lets start right here. These summits keep Getting Better and better. I am a 30 year teacher, and i work with an urban academy of 842 people on facebook. I am so pleased with what facebook is doing. What i want to know is how can we diversify the voices of children to include minority children and parents. This is a pretty white audience. I dont mean any harm, but if you want us to be part of the conversation, what can we do . Im going to take that and im going to take responsibility. I know those of us at the Attorney Generals Office and the department of justice certainly want to be as inclusive as possible. I think we have to make even the extra, extra step to make sure we have distributed information to communitybased organizations that are interested in this issue that may not necessarily be on that first cut. I think bob mentioned this or even sarah, that a lot of times the audience we pick tends to be long on academic credentials. It becomes a very academic focused conversation. I think we can increase the conversation by making sure we have diverse constituents that are academically credentialed, that have experience dealing with young people who are being bullied, and can offer some experience on that. We do this, you should see more diversity. There is a mantra that says that all behavior is communication. I think we have to intentionally and purposely connect the dots between bullying and bullying behavior that takes place in school, and quality of instruction happening in the classroom. If kids are meaningfully and intentionally engaged in the act of learning, we know their behavior decreases. I have been here since this morning, and i was here last year at this summit. We have not talked a lot about the quality of of instruction and really saying it out loud. We think we are doing it, but i would encourage all of us to revisit it and be very intentional and purposeful in connecting those dots because we know they are completely, inextricably linked. I wanted to say it out loud. Its a question, not a statement, but thank you for the opportunity. Youre welcome. And i think all of the educators in the room would admit that the quality of instruction and classroom management helps to prevent student unrest. It however does not solve all problems. Some students have experienced trauma in their homes or communities. The best lesson plan that day is not going to deal with the trauma when they saw someone outside in the community shot and killed. Its not going to deal with the gang that is creating havoc or the people saying dont live in our neighborhood, get out. Schools really become that place that have to deal with all students, and i think part of the issue is good instruction takes care of kids that are generally not dealing with those issues or have not whose issues have not manifest. For kids were those issues are manifest, it is about intentionally connecting the wraparound supports and related service to help them be successful. So duly noted. So the kid who is tweeting something unpleasant or nasty at night is home with someone. And i am wondering what your thoughts are about reaching and teaching parents and partnering with parents in this effort. I think its essential. Some of our agreements to include provisions to have errant or Community Committees that are involved and participate also in reviewing discipline or general school policies, bringing parents in, whether it is at the start of the school year or in other ways to make sure they are all though aware. We deal with a lot of cases where we reached the point where unfortunately we are invest to getting us the full rights violation. In that case, if a Minority Community has been the target of harassment, we may have a committee that involves folks from the community youre there as representatives of the minority student as a gobetween between them and School Officials for whatever issues might come up. Those are some of the ways we have looked at involving parents and the broader community. Let me take a quick crack at your question. The president has made mentoring youth a critical component of moving forward. There is big gap between the young people who have a supportive adult in their life and those who dont. Its anywhere from 10 million16 million kids do not have a supportive adult in their life. Now, whatever teachers may want to do in their classroom, and of course, we always want to give them whatever extra instruction they need, there is also the problem of helping the millions of Young Children who do not have a supportive adult in their lives as a mentor. My colleagues, the baby boomers, are retiring at high rates, and many of them still want to give to society. I think it is incumbent on us to find ways to encourage people to give back to millions of young folks in constructive ways that may be just an hour or two a week over a year minimum. I think we need to think about how we do that, because we can ask parents, but the one parent household or the twoparent household were the parents are working three jobs, they may not be able to get that help. We need to go beyond our standard answers to these problems and create movements of folks who are trying to answer these questions. The other thing i would add is i think rate schools find time in their academic programs to teach young people acceptable uses for technology. I think they then connect and bring parents in and give parents a variation of that. I think technology is so new that young people and parents, Everybody Needs to be educated. There is some app that you can used that you can send a text editors appears off your phone. And it disappears off your phone. Part of this is about educating children about what is acceptable and what is not, educating parents about what they should be looking for, and then building like bob mentioned, it is going to take us time to incorporate societal norms into this new digital space, but we can do it. One more ok, i see a few people. We are going to make it quick because we need to close this out. Its friday. Take a deep breath. I appreciate everything that has been set on this panel, but one overarching thing i hear is that these approaches are addons, right . We buy a bullying program. We have an assembly. We are about Youth Empowerment but kids are kids and we cant put too much pressure on them to be the changemakers in schools. Now that we have the research that shows the children and adults who learn social emotional skills live healthier, happier lives, when will policy take place so that all children are learning these skills and teachers are learning them in their preparation programs . Im going to Say Something that is going to sound like i am a heretic. I dont think its policy thats going to lead this effort. I think its going to be practice. I think in schools and School Systems all over this country, there are people that realize the social Emotional Development of their students is good for a couple of reasons. One, it is the right thing to do to help children grow and become successful, contributing individuals in our society. Number two, there is a strong correlation to students becoming academically successful. What i think is going to happen is that practice is going to lead School Systems and schools into doing this and them policymakers are going to followup with oh, you know what . It would be a good idea of schools would build really supportive climates and cultures and focus on things like normal childhood and adolescent development because if we do those things, we help children to be safe and secure, then we can really sort of build him up with the algebra one and the physics and chemistry and all of the music and the fine arts, all the other things we want them to get. I dont think its policy thats going to lead. I think its practitioners. Can you say that again . I have to add i agree that practice will help, the best practices will be the role models for the education system, but how long will it take for all of these practices to turn into something more formal . I am not a fortune teller, but i would say if you look over the next four or five years, i think youre going to see some dramatic improvement, and i think one of the reasons why is that over the six years of this administration, there has been a real focus on removing structural obstacles that make it difficult for young people to be successful. The release of discipline guidance. The release of the Civil Rights Data collection. 8000 children between the ages of three and five were suspended or expelled from Public Schools in this country in 2012. Thats what the Civil Rights Data collection tells us. That release has led to school diricts saying, you know what . Guess what we are going to do . We know that sometimes young kids might have bad days at school, but we are not going to suspend them. The district i was in yesterday has a rule that children from kindergarten through grade three cannot be suspended. That is developmentally appropriate, and i think youre going to see more of that. It is going to take four or five years. All right, last question. This is a good segue from your last one. This is from one of our viewers on cspan. She is currently a fulbright scholar but also a teacher in brookline, massachusetts. She asked what should a teacher do when they catch students bullying other students . Youre welcome. Great. I think it is a great question. I thing number one that all teachers, all members of school faculty, whether it is the custodian, the lunch line person, the school bus driver, any time they find or somebody brings it to their attention, i think they have to stop what they are doing, address the situation, and refer where appropriate to the next person that can intervene. Here is why. If they see it and they see the student committing the act of bullying and they dont do anything about it, it sends two signals. One, you got away with it in front of an adult. That means you can do it again, multiple times. To the child who is being bullied, who sees the adult in their peripheral vision, it says to them i am all on my own. No one is helping me here. I am not afraid of the bullier. I am very concerned about the children being bullied because that child may become so fearful they decide, you know, i am being bullied. There is no adult in this building that is here looking out for me, protecting me. I need to protect myself. Then they decide to go get a weapon, and now i not only have a bullying situation, i have a kid in a building with a weapon thinking about doing harm to themselves or others. My answer is anybody, any adult in a school should be tasked, charged, empowered by the principal to react to an incident immediately and then refer it to the next person to make sure it is handled appropriately, that the community is restored, that the child apologizes and gets the appropriate support and intervention. I am not talking about sending them home, but they need the appropriate intervention so they dont do it again, and the other child being bullied needs to feel they are in a place where they are having their Educational Opportunity protected. That would be my answer. A brief answer i would add is simply this. One of the most important pieces of new knowledge we have an hour in our society is about trauma. Every child who comes into our School System needs to be screened for trauma. And if we find a child has an traumatized, we need to get them appropriate traumainformed care. If we do that in the beginning when they start school, we will be able to help those children who might otherwise become bullies and who will be in the halls disrupting classes and disrupting school. There are indepth studies we have done at the department of justice that show that children who end up in our juvenile centers and Justice System in most cases have been traumatized. 56 of them have had four or more traumas. We know from the study we did in chicago that only 25 of children who were traumatized received any kind of care for it. If children in the delinquency system are not getting care for it, imagine how much children in the School System are not getting it. We must recognize that, use developmentally appropriate ways of addressing it, and if we do that from a proactive of view, we will diminish the number of kids being disruptive in school and coming into juvenile justice. This is new knowledge, and we need to incorporate it in everyday practice as rapidly as we can. Otherwise, we know from studies that they will have detriMental Health effects well into their 40s, 50s, 60s. Knowledge is powerful. The research is rigorous. We need to use what we know to keep them from having the same problems as adults that they have as children. Trauma doesnt leave you if it doesnt get cured, and we know that for a fact. Lets leave on that note. Can we give our panelists a hand . As we close out, i would just like to number one say thank you to everyone who had the opportunity to either look in online or on cspan, the folks here in the audience. As we reflect on todays summit, we recognize that it was an opportunity to have a great dialogue. We were asked and hopefully able to answer some difficult questions. Most importantly, we have identified some potential avenues moving forward. I also think today was a great opportunity for folks to network and engage with new and old colleagues in the field. Maybe you have even come up with new ways to Work Together and collaborate on some ideas. Today was also about sharing what we know about bullying prevention and recognizing that while we have ideas and some answers, we still have many challenges we have left to face. As bob mentioned, we are going to do this over several years to really get it right, to incorporate those societal norms into this new digital space. We heard from a variety of individuals who represent a variety of organizations, state, local, federal. They and you, our audience, have come together to discuss what is working and what is not. Today also provided us the opportunity to view bullying prevention efforts through the broader lens of School Climate, which broadens our focus, and i think one of the questions was about buying this program or that program. We are not talking about a specific program. We are talking about changing the overall climate and culture of school buildings. If we change the culture then a natural byproduct is that kids are going to do better and when kids do better they do better academically. That is what we hope to get from this, so broadening our focus, including related to disruptive behaviors, School Climate is essential. It is essential to keeping kids safe and engaged and it plays a key role in their academic performance. Targeting this is the key to changing dangerous behaviors. I would like to give a heartfelt thanks to our speakers, panelists, audience members, contractors, federal partners and the Summit Planning Committee without whom there would be no summit. Although this is what they gave me in my notes, i have two other people i want to thank. I want to thank david, the director for the office of safe and healthy students. Can you give him a hand . I dont know if she is in the room, but sarah, one of davids team members, stand up, give her a hand. She wrote my notes. I can tell you the office of safe and healthy students, the program in the office of the elementary and secondary education, did a great job trying to pull this together. It is critically important. With that, thank you for being here, thank you for participating. We look forward to the great work you are going to do as you move into the community. Everybody have a great evening and a great weekend. Thank you. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2014] cspan,re watching created for you as a Public Service by americas cable companies. Next, a debate on evolution versus creationism. Then british Prime MinisterDavid Cameron has new measures and raiseing the u. K. The Terror Threat from substantial to severe. Onn remarks from robert ager the importance of nonprofit organizations. Safety, look at food issues and the potential dangers posed by pesticides and genetically modified foods. Now, a debate on evolution versus creationism with evolution vs. Creation debate. This is to announce hours. Good evening. I am pleased to welcome you to legacy whole at the Creation Museum in Northern Kentucky in the metropolitan area of cincinnati. I am tom foreman and i am pleased to be tonights moderator for this debate. This is a very old question, where did we come from . My answer is from washington by airplane but there is a