Transcripts For CSPAN American Indian Stereotypes In Sports 20150410

You from time to time so i can see which slide we are on. I am at the National Museum of the American Indian. One of the things that interest us greatly is the persistence of stereotypes. Our visitors dont come as blank slates, they come with a preconceived set of ideas, not uninformed but misinformed. As you can see, just a couple of years ago at the vatican. This is a man there at the vatican celebrating as she understands native american culture. This is one of those examples where we can hardly alter at fault. She does not know any better because this is what she has been taught. This entire notion of Cultural Appropriation and taking from native people of their authority to define who they are emerged at the end of the 19th and beginning of the 20th century. This is part of the imagery that laid the groundwork for what would later become this business of using indians as mascots. Really, abusing our history in more significant ways. This is the end of the trail them in, a famous one. It indicates defeat but also the disappearance of native americans. In fact, the very object of a government policy at this time was the disappearance of native american tribes. What they did not want was for people to act like indians and be part of indian tribes. That is when the mascot business began. This mascot was adopted in the 1930s by a particularly vicious racist. The owner of a team that at the time was in boston. The team was initially called the boston braves, the same as one of the baseball teams. But, later, in order to distinguish the team from the baseball team, the owner chose this particular name. Theres a lot of mythology around the name. They each have an origin myth for their mascot. They are very elaborate and fantastically untrue. A fellow who went by the name of lone star gates, there were a couple of problems. First, the owner himself not time is quoted in the newspapers saying that is not why we named it that. It is kind of a name like red sox. Except, it is this. That is alive. The other lie is that one star gates himself was an indian. He was convicted of fraud for pretending to be an indian because he was trying to dodge the draft. Yet, the team maintains on its website that is the origin of the name. Similarly, this team has an origin myth. They say it was a fellow named henry who was a baseball player for the team. They say they named their team and order to honor him. If you really begin to dig into that history, what we find is henry was treated incredibly badly by the fans. Second, he was not that good. He was not the kind of guy you would name your team for. He was not bad, but he was not that good. He was not a very nice guy. All of this sort of suggests that they made that up. This is part of what goes on when dealing with indians and the public discourse. Things get made up and indians become very malleable and they are formed in order to fill whatever particular role the institution or entity or state or country needs them to fill. This is the logo for the chicago hockey team. There actually was a man named black hawk. He turned the team into the blackhawks is a little strange. The team has made efforts to reach out to the chicago indian community. If you really wanted to honor black hawk, why isnt it and everyone of her game programs . Why isnt there a biography of backtalk . A description of the war and how he was betrayed . This is a retired mascot. This of course is the former mascot of the university of illinois. This involved a fairytale about an incident that took place in this part of the country where the illinois indians died very noble yet terribly tragic demise. The ending was their leader. It did not happen. Once again, they made up things in order to suit their need for a mascot for their sports teams. This fellow is particularly outrageous. He is the mascot for the Florida State Football Team. There are too many things wrong with this picture to describe them all. I am fairly certain that the seminoles who were very formidable fighters did not fight on horses and did not carry flaming lances. Who would do such a thing . Yet, before every game, this guide will write out to the center of the field, throw a flaming lance into the ground as if this is some sort of accurate portrayal of a real and formidable seminole leader. This business of playing indian goes way back. It is something that has been done from the very beginning. Back in the early 1800s, they formed societies, for example in new york city. You may have heard of them because they were central to the corruption in the 1920s. It ended up with a lot of of people going to jail. The tammany hall scandal. This chief was a real person who dried is very best to form stable relationships with the surrounding nonindian community. He Tammany Society was created to honor him. They did the strangest inks. They would have secret meetings where they would dress up again the ends just up like indians, assign each other indian names, beat drums and carry out rituals in order to channel the spirits. When the nation came to new york to negotiate the treaty of new york with George Washington, they were greeted by the Tammany Society in full regalia. The Tammany Society paraded them down the streets of new york to the capital where George Washington awaited. Imagine what those leaders must have thought when these guys showed up. Playing indian is something that has gone on. You may recall the numbers in philadelphia. That was another offshoot of the type where they would just up like indians. There is this weird kind of need in some way to establish yourself as an american by connecting an pretending to be a native american. This is the result. I dont know what this guy is but, it is a real thing at the washington football stadium. This is a wellknown figure in washington. One of the problems with the mascots is that even if we educate the supporters of a team to be a themselves and express themselves in a respectful manner that does suggest there out to honor the native American Heritage of the country or their community, what do can really do is control the conduct of the opposing team. Back when north dakota might very well in good faith claim theyre honoring the souix people by having the mascot. Scalp the souix from the other teams. This is a philadelphia fan expressing his appreciation for washingtons Football Team. These fellows showed up at the last time Cleveland Baseball Team managed to make the playoffs. That is the sort of conduct that does notion of a disappearing native american to be replaced by mascots leads us to. What has happened is indians have been made imaginary. The indians that most washingtonians are mostly minor with are not the kind of indians that are in the room tonight. It is this imaginary indian they have constructed. He is noble, brave, strong. We keep having to remind them that he is imaginary. That is not a real person. To put us on the side of a football helmet is no particular honor, thank you very much. To refer to us by that name is the exact opposite of an honor. Yet, they have a hard time accepting that. We have even heard them say that this is their tradition. What, mocking indians is your tradition . There are very serious about that. This is our tradition. This is how we express ourselves. This is our team. Breaking through that and getting them to consider how a native american person might experience that sort of conduct has been very difficult. The ultimate rebuttal to my mind is to say if being made into a mascot is such an honor, why is it that our africanamerican and asianamerican and Latino American people have not been similarly honored anyplace in the country. Surely we are not the only ones worthy of that honor. The answer is very simple. It is simply that there are so few indians and a few of the folks in that part of the country have had direct experience with them that it never occurs to them that this is generally destructive conduct. We are dealing with people whose information about indians has come primarily from two sources. First is our formal education system, which is billing rather dramatically in teaching history in general and teaching history involving native americans particularly badly. The second place they get their information is from the Popular Culture, including this sports mascots coulter. When they come to us culture. When they come to us to learn something, they dont come through the door without already reformed ideas about what indians are. You would be surprised how many people come in and look at this array of different tribal cultures presented and say yeah, but where are the indians . Because their notion of what an indian is supposed to look like is that guy on the set of the football helmet. We dont happen to have any indians like that on display in the museum so they are puzzled and they dont realize indians are everywhere. And that one indian tribe can be as different from another as china is from france. It would never occur to them that indians are many different things. In fact, there is no such thing as an indian. Indian is a something that was made up. Yet, when we see the imagery associated with the mascots, they all tend to look alike. That in itself tells us people are being misled. We begin a series of exhibitions at the museum. Patient was guest curated by suzanne harjo. Part of this is that we simply want people to gain a simple understanding of history. We dont want them to think of it as strictly native American History, it is American History. In many respects, World History. It is just history. Not American Indian history. When we teach about a situation like this, that is the point where trying to make. This is everybodys inheritance. Its not just an indian thing. We talk about the treaties of c anandaigua. The central figure of a house is on either side of it. The figures represent the mohawk nation as the keepers of the eastern and western doors. Then, the 13 figures associated with that represented the 13 colonies. A belt like this was commissioned by none other than George Washington to mark the entry of the United States into this treaty relationship with the tribes. This was no small matter. This is not a trinket, not jewelry. This is a diplomatic exchange. This was protocol. This is how one nation entered into an agreement with the tribes of that part of the world. We go into the removal policy and focus specifically. Most people have heard of the trail of tears. We come back to that. A lot of people dont know that the policy was quite thorough going. It extended to the great lakes and ohio valley and it was intended to remove all indians east of the mississippi to west of the mississippi. We tell them about this removal journey referred to as the trail of death. We then go into the civilization regulations. The creation of boarding schools. This is a class of Indian Students at carlisle, about 100 miles from washington dc. They would take these children from all over the country, remove them to carlisle, pennsylvania, and many of them would never see their parents again. That was the objective. They were not to return home. They were to be educated and released into society. We then say after this narrative arc, first there was real diplomacy, then there was a betrayal. Then, a restoration. And, a resumption of a more respectable relationship between the tribes and the United States. But it did not come simply from the largess of the United States. It was something many people fought for. That is the only reason it happened. These are great lakes fishermen challenging state regulation of their treaty fishing rights. The great lakes nations also won Supreme Court litigation. Now, we see policy made in a much different way than it was when progress was basically congress was busily telling the end and this is the way you should be. There was an effort at the beginning of it want your century to eradicate native american culture, to eradicate native americans, to break up the family, the tribe, the reservations with a very specific objective of having no tribes remain. They suppressed tribal religions. They prohibited some tribal dancing. They prohibited these children the use of their language in the boarding schools. They suppressed the tribal government. Basically anything that made them indians, the government tried to make them stop doing. They failed because of course they were going to fail. But they really thought that was something they could do. Policy was being made, the United States was saying, we know what is best for you so here is how we will do this. I included this picture to show that that is no longer how policy is made. While it would be a stretch to say that we resumed a treaty relationship between the drives and United States, it is certainly moving in that direction and much of the Business Done now is on a negotiated basis where both sides consent and agree on how things should move forward. We basically say now we are on the right track. Since this policy was resumed, this policy of bilateral negotiated, friendly arrangements was resumed, Indian Country has begun to drive again and the results are indisputable that Indian Country has recovered during this time. One of the great myths of our formal education, of our Popular Culture is that the americas were wilderness prior to the arrival of the europeans. New Research Shows the americas were a happening place in 1491. There were literally hundreds, thousands of different cultures that were operating in the two continental the western hemisphere. There was no part of this continents this continent that was unknown to the Indigenous People at the time. There were 2000 different languages being spoken, all neutrally unintelligible to the others. That suggests a long time in which they were evolving separately. The latest research has some of the scientists believing there were as many people in the americas in 1492 than there were in europe. That overturns the notion of an american wilderness. There was no wilderness in 1492. The americas were fully occupied, they were owned. Every part of these continents was owned by somebody. It is important to the american origin story to refer to the americas as being wilderness at that time because that makes it ok. That others tame and displays the people already there because those but displaced the people already there. This is the depiction of a city which was near current day st. Louis. This city in 1100 was larger than london. London was the largest city in england. There were cities throughout the western hemisphere that rivaled in size of their european counterparts. There were people here, a great many people here, perhaps as many as 40 million on the two continents. Have many of you have been to peru . In the end is, the current estimates are there were 10 Million People living in that part of the world. They were selfsufficient. They were growing a variety of food. Hunger was unknown in the inca empire. We want people to know that. We are working on some exhibitions that will bring forward this genuine history of the americas. This is cahokia. This is a smaller empire. Several hundred years before the emergence of the incas, they were building a vast civilization throughout mesoamerica. The aztecs as well. This is a city on the lake. This culture in the american southwest was elaborate. The park ranger in ms. Ever day mesa verde said there were more People Living in the area then there are now. This is my favorite slide. We have to return to basics in our Educational Program and make sure people understand basic propositions. Even bart simpson gets it. Now i would like to get to this idea of American Mythology and the imaginary indian. We are deeply in the american dna. Every major american myth, major american origin story has to account for the indians in sunlight. Here we see columbus arriving in the new world looking remarkably fresh. But hiding in the righthand corner are the indians who were there when columbus arrived. We want to get into this business of the Columbian Exchange. Indians have not only then he raised from American History they have any raised from World History not only have the indians then he raced erased from American History, they have been erased from World History. Massive amounts of technology, wealth, labor, food left in the americas for europe and asia. Meanwhile, they were sending back to the new world many things of their own. A lot of animals, different plants. Of course, disease. Disease was the most devastating factor. It was the decisive factor in the confrontation between the indigenous and the new arrivals. The estimate is that the population, the native population of the americas was reduced by 90 in 100 years. There is no precedent, no similar experience anywhere in known human history. Yet it was the wealth that existed in the americas that made the explosive growth of europe possible. The calories that were being entered into the european diet from the food that had been developed here in the americas it did not go wild, it was cultivated, grown, bioengineered by indigenous scientists. These foods were so much more healthy than the troops europeans had been than the foods europeans have been eating that there was a population explosion in europe as a result of the introduction of these foods. Many varieties of corn potatoes, and beans enter diets throughout the world and radically increased the population. The spanish armada was built with inca gold. It provided the revenue for the Spanish Government to build the armada. The consequences here were absolutely catastrophic. Another result of this Columbian Exchange was the introduction of the slave trade and the arrival of africans in the new world. We are back to this American Mythology. There is an interesting set of murals in the capitol rotunda. This is one. This is the embarkation of the pilgrims. It is part of the american origin story. The journey and the arrival and the aspirations of the pilgrims. This is another capital merrill mural. The baptism of pocahontas. Why should that be significant . We will come back to that. Keep for in mind, pocahontas was a teenager. This was the soto desoto discovering the mississippi. Thank god he found it. [laughter] this is the archetypal image of what europeans brought to the new world and what america was accomplishing as it moved across the continent. American progress. We are working on next vision an exhibition im very fond of. It is called americans. Inf you look in the Oxford English dictionary, you find that when the word americans entered the lexicon, it was referring not to the european new world, they were referring to the indigenous americans. Indigenous people were the americans. Of course, that term has undergone a great deal of change. As the oxford is very dictionary is close to point out. We want to talk about these american origin stories. One of them is the first thanksgiving. Everybody heard of squanto . He was a friendly indian who taught the pilgrims to grow corn. As opposed to the other indians who were not so helpful, squanto was a good indian because he wanted to help the white men civilize the new world. How many of you knew that when the pilgrims landed, and they did land, but there really is no limit Plymouth Rock in the 1900s. They thought they had a pretty good forest thing going tourist thing going. But, they needed an iconic theme. The pilgrims never talked about Plymouth Rock. It is a good origin myth. It also turns out, how many people knew squanto, spoke english when the pilgrims arrived . Yeah. He spoke english. The pilgrims are there, they are kind of cold. It is november, a lousy time to arrive in new england. This indian guy comes walking in and speaks to them in english. And that is weird, right . Imagine. It turns out, squanto had twice been to europe. On one occasion, he had been kidnapped. Two times come the managed to make his way back to the new world. The second time, he went back to his village and it had been absolutely wiped out by a smallpox epidemic. He had nowhere to be, no people to be a part of. He went to talk to the pilgrims. That is a different story than squanto the friendly indian who taught them how to grow corn and communicated by sign language or something. It is a better story for in my opinion. We have been taught the pilgrims squanto taught to them how to grow corn, they planted their corn, worked their fields hard had a good crop the first year. In 16 21, they wanted to have a feast to celebrate and give thanks and play a little football. That is how all of this began. Our modern understanding of thanksgiving is very much a 20th century invention. It is not a holiday marked throughout the first 300 years of europeans being permanently settled in the new world. Now, it is very firmly in American Mythology as true. Squanto is a central part of that myth. What is not so much a part of understanding of this time is king philips war which followed about 40 years after the arrival of the pilgrims. It was absolutely devastating between and among the various indian nations of new england and the english and that. Dutch. It was ferocious. Probably the greatest population of all of these peoples was killed more in any other american conflict. It was defining. King philips head was severed and placed on a pole that was planted at the entry to plymouth for 20 years. That gives you a sense of how strongly they felt about indians. Many of the indians were allies but they fared no better for having been allies of the pilgrims and not of king philip. In new england, dated indians and yet, 100 years later, when they took the Boston Harbor to challenge the authority of the king, they chose to express their desire for liberty and their identity as not englishmen, as americans, by doing what . By dressing up as indians. Isnt that interesting . You see how indians become defined and made into ever whatever people need at that time. This is the best example. We are fascinated by that. We think it is important that people make these connections and try to understand this story along with us so we can figure out just how all this works. Why do we remember what we remember . Why do we forget the things we forget . Because the more significant event was really king philips war, not the first thanksgiving. We dont learn about the war in our formal education. We learn a sanitized version of the first thanksgiving. We want people to set, i did not know that. And then we want them to set why didnt i know that . Why wasnt i taught this . It is kind of important. It is more important than knowing they had dinner together one day. Similarly, pocahontas has a lot of mythology associated with her. She was gossiped about throughout the world. Like a kardashian or something. [laughter] this is a depiction of the game story where she saved john smith of thing executed by her father, a powhatan. There is but one source for this story. Everybody has learned this one right . This was in the disney movie so it has to be true. [laughter] there was one source for this story and it took hold. The source was the highly fictionalized biography of john smith. Autobiography of john smith. John smith thought, i have to sell some books. Lets see. This would be a great story. Most historians agree this never happened. Think about the role pocahontas fills. Why do we like pocahontas so much . Once again, she was the friendly indian who realized the need for civilization and did her level best to accommodate it. Pocahontas was a real person. Actually she had a very short and tragic life will stop she died at 23 in england. She and john rolfe had a single son together in virginia. They had jim crow laws. They did not acknowledge indians at all. If you were indian, under virginia law, you were colored. If you had they had the one drop rule. If any of her ancestors were african or africanamerican, you too were colored and subject to the segregation laws of that jim crow embodied. There was a single exception to that. It was the pocahontas exception. If the indian to whom you were related happened to be pocahontas, you were not just white, you were like, extra white. It did not get any better than being related to pocahontas. All of the first families of virginia spent enormous effort trying to establish they too were descendents of the one child of pocahontas. That was embodied in the laws of virginia. It is right there. That is really weird, right . Once again, we want people to say, why on earth would they do Something Like that . They had taken pocahontas, a real person, and made her into something they need in order to establish just how american they are. That is what has got us intrigued. There she is. Im going to skip through these because we are just about out of time. What i do want to point out is this stereotyping starts early and we start propagandizing our children at a very early age. This is a common play item. You would be stunned if you were to Google Indian cost him, you will be amazed at cost him costume, you would be amazed at how many there are. Blue indians. These kids can be forgiven for not having a particularly good idea, especially kids in parts of the country where there are not a lot of indian people where they are unlike to encounter indian people in their day to day or school lives. They do get confused. They can be forgiven for not knowing that indians dont look like that and that there still are indians. This is a wellintentioned teacher somewhere who was teaching her students about thanksgiving. Because thanksgiving is required content in almost every state in the union. Teachers are expected to teach about thanksgiving in sunlight. This is what they have been teaching. About thanksgiving in some way. These are kids and they are pretending, which is what kids do. It seems innocent enough. A couple of things. First of all, it is rather unlikely they would pretend to be people of any other race in what they are. Out of the understood almost immediately as inappropriate. But not when it comes to indians. The other thing is that this that innocent play turns into this, a group of Sorority Girls dressing up like indians or frat boys dressing up like indians or a little later, hipsters dressing up like indians. These guys. I mean, i dont know what that is all about. What is this thing with dressing up like indians . Then it turns into this and becomes commercialized. Victorias secret every year. And of course, this. We want to understand the deep roots of this. It is not as simple as some mean man choosing a mean name for his Football Team. It really is much more deeply cultural, much more embedded in the way we have been taught to understand history. We absolutely believe at the museum that if we can teach history properly and to give teachers the proper tools to teach in the material that we wont have to worry about this sort of thing in the future because it simply want to be acceptable. I am going to stop there because we had a very distinguished panel of people who i would like to call upon to come forward now and join me and we can begin a discussion of the issue together. [applause] we are going to resume now. We have with us a very distinguished panel i want to enter this briefly and i will begin the conversation before we begin taking questions from all of you. To my right is Amanda Blackhorse. Amanda is a social worker and citizen of the Navajo Nation. She is known as an activist in this controversy over the name of the Washington Football Team. An assistant professor at Arizona State, a citizen of the cheyenne nation. This edition is an epic is story of governance and leadership systems. Please welcome professor ki llsback. To my left is jim warn, and he has a bachelors of science from Arizona State university and an ms from san diego State University. He earned a postgraduate certificate in rehabilitation administration. He is the training coordinator for the san diego State University enter work institute. He administers the postemployment threatening American Indian rehabilitation Postgraduate Certificate Program and tace trainer at interwork institute. He is president of his own Consulting Firm and significantly was a Football Player for Arizona State university when they want the rose bowl. [applause] and played in the nfl. [laughter] last but not least, dr. Suzanne rharjo, an advocate for American History rights, poet, writer, lecturer, curator, and policy advocate who have helped recover more than 100 acres of tribal land. [applause] after a career in media, she moved to washington dc to work on National Policy issues. She served as Congressional Liaison for Indian Affairs in the Carter Administration and later as a director of the National Council of American National congress of American Indians. Suzanne is president of the morning star institute, a National Native American Rights Organization and most recently was the recipient last year of the president ial medal of freedom, United States highest civilian honor. [applause] lets start with one of us who has dealt with this issue face to face. That is jim. You spent some time as a professional Football Player. What are your memories and how do you remember this mascot and this name coming up and how did you feel about that when you are playing . Jim warne first of all, thank you. Is this on . I dont see an off or on button. That is as far as i go technology was. Again, thank you kevin for an excellent presentation and for providing a quick history regarding mascot and Indian Country. I can guarantee that some of our nonindian kids for the room in the room in these two hours will probably get more and in history than in their entire history curriculum. Ignorance by design. How would they know unless they want outside of the curriculum . As a player at Arizona State university, i have some experience with tampa bay buccaneers. I call they call them professional journeyman. I call myself a professional refugee because i played in three different professional football leagues. With that experience with the different mascots and i as i have grown older, it has been even more so with the efforts of the many of the panelists here trying to get the truth out there. I did play against Florida State at Arizona State and they did have the horse on our field at sun devil stadium. As a young person, a product of American Education for naturedly of American Education. My mother made sure my brother don and i knew the truth and we were always getting in trouble for countering our teachers. Many of my teammates, what do you think my nickname was . Yep. Cheif. With some of the nicknames i was given, i gladly took it because others were pretty bad. No one else in this world can come be chief other than can other than my teammates. I got a lot of attention. Sports illustrated wrote an article on me called urban indian. They said, his hair flew from his helmet. I said, well i wish i had waist length hair. [laughter] when i saw the young man throw the spear in the middle of our field, i said, that is not his seminal guide. That is a very euroamerican guy. Only once did i have an issue with a player on the field regarding race. I had a great game, i will admit. I got an extra element of anger. It was usually the fans. That was a very depicting picture. How many of you are insulted by this . How many of you would allow this to happen in your homes or in in front of your children . This is not right in america today. Why are we still discussing this now . It is allowed. It is racism. We are still allowed to use the r words. This is something that is very insulting to me but fortunately, i was too busy on the field. That is something that was a result of that. Fortunately, i was a good player and people did not want to irritate me on the field. True racism is ignorance. Ignorance by design. Kevin gover you teach native american studies at asu. Is this an issue to discuss in discuss in your class . Leo killsback we discuss this in the introductory course. There is so much to cover in american studies. A lot of people enter these classes ranking they will learn about rather shallow topics about indians like buckskin and beads. I ask students what they expect and some of them are very honest. Sometimes they are naive about the fact they are enrolled, i commend that effort because it shows they want to learn something about indian people. In the introduction class, we cover a lot of the topics already discussed. Not in depth, but the other classes i teach, the film class i offer focuses directly on the development of stereotypes of indian people beginning with the culmination of america. We talk about mainstream movies. American sniper. A lot of articles have been published of about how he viewed the iraqi people as a savages. A scholar has an entire book dedicated to the language of savagery. We introduce that concept of this seemingly endless battle between civilization and savagery. The indian wars, the indian conflict. A lot of times, i get students who perceive history as if it were a football game, as if it were two opposing teams playing. When you deconstructed the paradigm and introduce a different paradigm, American Studies Center paradigm, and you focus on the issues of colonization around land, it shifts the causation very quickly. Everyone in america is from some indian land. A project i like to do is to ask my students where they are from and what indian tribe or nations live there now, which ones were there before. Surprisingly, a lot of nonIndian Students dont know too much about their local histories. After we iron out the initial discussions about stereotypes, we can move the conversation forward. But, there are still people who want to remain for in this mode of study where we talk about stereotypes because it is such a huge issue. I encourage them to dig deeper to examine some of the origins of these images. We get a lot of good discussions and presentations about scalping , the bounties of indian people, the images of indian people drenched in red blood. My experience as a professor has been initially very positive. Give or take a few experiences where students is are at first very standoffish that their indian studies professor is actually an indian with long hair who speaks an indian language. Some students really appreciate it. Some are concerned that i may be too biased and would rather learn from a white person. [laughter] kevin gover amanda, how is it that you came to be the lead plaintiff in a suit challenging the trademark for the Washington Football Team at your tender age . Amanda ok. Hi. I became involved in this case in 20052006. I was just learning at the university of kansas about the history of our people. I did not receive that education when i was in middle school or high school. I received the education that there was thanksgiving, columbus discovered america, and pocahontas, and sacajawea. That was pretty much it. When i went to college, i learned the true horrors of our history. As an american person. I was very shocked. I even cried because it was so horrific. At that point, was when i realized that we are all living a shocked. I even lie. Living a lie. The history is made by the colonial powers and as an Indigenous People, we have a history that is bigger than whatever it is that they are teaching us in school. I got to meet up with some other students and we were all very active in our Little Community there. We were all hungry for knowledge. We were a group of radical Young College students who wanted to learn more about our culture. We wanted to challenge the status quo. We got together as a group, it was called not in our honor. We decided to protest at the Washington Team games in kansas city in 2005. It was there that my eyes saw some very horrific things that i had never seen before. I have experienced racism in the border towns of the Navajo Nation. This was nothing like that. Usually, people in the border towns or in our School System would say these horrible things to you but in private. Everyone was hushhush about it. No one really challenge to those things. I will never going into the store when i was little and a i remember going into the store when i was little and a woman pushing me. I ran into her and i was running around. I hit her accidentally and she said, you effing indians. I told my parents and they made us leave. It was hushhush. When i went to this game and just by simply standing there and holding a sign that says i am not your mascot. People are human beings, not mascots. We were treated in the most disrespectful ways. I was very shocked. I wanted to do something. I wanted to yell back, shout back, but i couldnt. It was a peaceful protest. We just stood there and allowed this to happen around us here it it was socially acceptable to degrade these American People. People walked by and didnt pay any mind to it. I thought, if this is what these games promote, what is this big deal about the nfl and sports . They are actually profiting and making tons of money off of stereotyping native people and harassing and violent behavior that is directed towards us. It was very eyeopening for me to see firsthand. It was after that that i got in touch with suzanne through a mutual friend of ours. I was very young. But i was learning and i want to do help. I felt like after what i had seen, how could i not do anything . Thats how it began. That brings us to suzanne. You have been at this a long time. Challenging the nfl, this team in particular, but challenging mascots in particular in general. Suzanne the very first mascot in sports, that was supposed to be about us, little red in the university of oklahoma, and since then, we collectively have eliminated more than 2000 of them. [applause] there are just over 900 to go. In the meantime, we have created a National Museum of the American Indian, we have more native people doing history books. As we are getting rid of them, we are able to consign them to the museums and to the history books where they belong. Very soon, people will just sit back and say, that happened . There really were those kinds of things . People were so foolish as to believe in these mascots and hold on to them as if they were holding onto a dear relative and try not to dislodge them from their own persona . We have seen time after time that once these mascots are removed, once the names are removed, once that onerous persona is retired, you really have a better Football Team. A better basketball team. A more winning game. My message to the Washington Football Team is we have eliminated two thirds of these in american sports. Most of these across the country with the same name as the washington franchise have been eliminated. They have just chosen to get rid of it themselves. Since the Washington Football Team, once a great and powerful franchise, has not into a super bowl since we filed suit in 1992 [laughter] people in my bank and on capitol hill say you still have that curse . We say no, it is not a curse. It is just karma. [laughter] its their own fault. Theyre doing it to themselves. If they would just throw off the shackles of this name, get rid of it, have a name change contest, everything would be wonderful for them and they would start winning again. I just dont think they are going to win until they do that because this is in the 23rd year. That is an amazing coincidence. 23 years and they have never been back to a super bowl. In the meantime, there has been a case that has my name for 17 years, now Amanda Blackhorse has that privilege and burden dragging around this lawsuit. We are just going to keep prevailing and prevailing and more and more people across the country are seeing the error of their parents or grandparents ways and saying, we dont want that. That is not who we are. More native nations are saying we dont want these false identities, these false personas laid on us anymore. We are not going to take it. That is the root of a lot of our problems. People dont take us seriously because we are not taking ourselves seriously. You have people all over the country, native people, saying enough is enough. We are not passing this burden on to our children and grandchildren. It is going to end now. You have this movement that has just grown and grown steadily. Where are we . We are right up there at the pinnacle. We are looking around at all of these unfortunate souls down in the valley who are saying, what should we do . We are up here saying, we have the answer. Just stop what youre doing. Get some sort of identity. Quit ragging on us and pick something that doesnt offend any other living people. How hard is that . Thats our message. We have already won in societal terms. We have already prevailed because we have a lot of people in society, people of all kinds who understand that this is just wrong. Its just wrong. Host we know that from some of the polling weve seen were overwhelming majorities of people regard it as offensive. They would not refer to one of us to our face by that word. Yet, there is still a majority of people who say, but, the Football Team should be allowed to keep using it. What is going on here . Suzan people in america are so used to being racist. They feel like they have to hold onto it a little bit. Its like people who have been ill for a very long time, they will feel well one day but they dont quite understand it. When they start feeling ill again, they say oh, now im comfortable again because they are not used to being well. What we are doing is part of the maturation of america, we are saying you can live with racism, bigotry. You dont have to bargain for pieces of bigotry. Just dont call us anything. The more we learn about bullying, the dynamics of power of people in authority who are imposing their will and ways and prejudices. The more we learn about all of these things, the more we know about this kind of subject. That is where we are. Its a different kind of thing when you are in a majority population that is used to having people to oppress. You have to sort of wean them off it. Say, this is a societal disease and we are going to help you get well. We are going to help you. We have the answer here. Jim if i may, the history of racism. When you think of the Washington Football Team, they were the last to integrate. They are great history and tradition, here is the nazi party supporting the owner at the time. Their sign says keep the redskins white. Their level of awareness at the time in 1961. When america that same year the nfl leaders wrote a letter in support of this gentleman. They honored him that same year because he was fighting for his rights. All those other teams integrated. The history of the redskins were, they were the last to allow black skinned people in their team. Now we have individuals saying whats the big deal from the africanamerican community. The league is a powerful machine. A lot of the guys that are playing now do not want to talk against the league. There is an individual here, richard sherman, here at the super bowl that has guaranteed money so he doesnt fear to league. He has said that the nfl is a racist league and they are continuing it with the allowance of the redskins name. He is a current player that has the bravery to do that. He has guaranteed money. He doesnt fear the machine of the nfl. It is quite a machine. I have been under it before. When you have this great history and tradition, dan snyder, with the nazi party supporting you in terms of the past owner and keeping black skins out at the time, now we have africanamerican athletes that are prominent. I guarantee you we have an africanamerican president because many of the nonindian fans had pictures of Michael Jordan on their walls and it was ok to idolize sports athletes that were a different color because they were part of sports. Its an interesting dynamic how athletics has addressed the race issue. Again, it is the racist history and for whatever reason, we are the last ones. The nfl tried to stop the use of the n word in the league. Did they try to stop africanamericans from using it . No, because they get fined and suspended. We have a lot of those individuals in all cultures that will incorporate these negative stereotypical terminologies into their daily language. That is what dan snyder is looking for. Where are these guys that are ok with it so i can showcase view as the indian that i know . He said i want the truth and the truth was on a german guy avoiding world war i. That is his truth in terms of a redskin justification. Again, it is untruth, racism. Interesting from his perspective, why doesnt he honor his own people . He could create the mascots of his own people. Then he can go from there. Again, as it was eloquently stated, no other groups are protesting that they are not mascots. We are the only one so far with that honor. They are saying we dont know who we are. I know who i am. 90 of us were eliminated during that last 10 were very strong people. We are descendents of those people in this room. A great point brought by suzan at the history that some are holding onto very dearly. Kevin thats a great point about the machine and the size and scale of this enterprise. Amanda, you have picked a fight with the billionaires club. By the way, amanda is no longer suing the National Football league. The National Football league is suing amanda. Whats that like . Amanda it was expected. I think that the attitude of the owner who says, i will never change the name and you can use that in all caps. Its very dismissive, patronizing, and he acts very much like a bully i feel. With that sort of attitude, i knew this was coming. I feel it is very unfair and it is very uneven here because i am just another native american person out there who grew up on the Navajo Nation, who went to school to be a social worker so she could go back and help her people, and youre going to sue me. I dont feel honored at all. Being sued by a billionaire and the individual that i am, i feel it doesnt make any sense. It is really a bad move on their part i think. Kevin yeah. At this point, i would like to open it up to the audience and ask if there are any questions for our panel. We will have some microphones, is that correct . Ok. While we are waiting for that to set up, suzan, could you give a quick explanation of what the trademark challenge was. What was it you were doing when you initiated that process . Suzan i didnt understand it at all until Stephen Beard came to interview me for a law review article he was working on in 1992. He asked me to questions. He was a patent lawyer from minneapolis. He said, why didnt you use the u. S. Patent and trademark board as a forum as a cause of action as a lawsuit against the washington football franchise . I told him nothing makes sense to me about what you just said. He walked me through it. There is a line of math that says you cant have a trademark license on names for things that hold other people up to contempt it is just against the law. That has worked in all the other lawsuits. I wonder, he said, why you didnt do that . I said because this is literally the first time im ever hearing about any of this. Before i let him out of the space, he became my lawyer. We talked about mounting the lawsuit that we did. It is a pocketbook incentive lawsuit. It really means it doesnt require one thing i like is that the First Amendment champion is that it is that it doesnt require anyone to do anything. What it does is it takes away the federal stamp of approval from these racist images. Once you do that, then you dont have federal protections, then they are not going to keep the name. Its as simple as that. It is not that we are making them do it. It is just that we are removing their support. That is what the federal trademark trial and appeal board judges did in our case in 1999. They canceled the licenses. Then they escaped through the loopholes. It means how long you waited after turning 18 before filing the lawsuit. Thats why, when i organized the black horse case, the plaintiffs i got were closer to 18 then they were to 24 and they werent over 24. So they wouldnt have the same technical problem we had. We didnt lose on the merits. We only lost on this technicality. We resolved that technicality in the second lawsuit. The trademark trial and appeal judges went in the same direction they went in our case and gave the black horse plaintiffs a favorable decision. Again in 2014, they canceled the trademark licenses. They are removing the federal monitor. They are saying, we are not backing you. It is more of society saying, we are withdrawing any support that you thought you had. Thats really the lawsuit. Its Pretty Simple but it has all of the things for the ordinary person like me who never heard of this. This has been going on . No one told me. Kevin even if amanda were to win her case, the team doesnt have to stop using the name. But he will have been devalued globally, sufficiently that they will choose to no longer use it. That is really the strategy behind all of that. Any questions from you all . Yes please come to the mic my name is justin. My comment is that marks indicated that capitalism modifies everything, including human beings. My question is, what is your response to ben shelly at the arizonawashington game . Amanda i think mr. Shelley is a very unfavorable president at this time. Because he has done some very [applause] he has done some things that are very questionable. When we have seen or heard that mr. Shelley was sitting up in the box seats, i knew that this was another trick of the Washington Team, of dan snyder. They had been going through Indian Country and trying to find any native American Group president , council member, or whoever to endorse them. They looked far and wide. It was like a campaign to look for anyone who was willing to do that for them. They got that with two or three code talkers. They got the Navajo Nation president and they got some groups out there. There were also groups who turned down their gifts as well. I think that was just a part of the strategy that they were using and they got been shelley. I said i was very ashamed of him as a president that he would do that with such a controversial person at such a controversial time. I actually got a chance to speak with him about it. He was just as dismissive with me as dan snyder has been with me. It was very unfortunate because i felt like we could sit down and have a conversation about it. I think the Navajo Nation going into a deal with the navajo arts and crafts enterprise is what people say, there is so much poverty on the reservation, this will create jobs and put more money into our economy. But at what expense . At what expense are you going to basically sell out. That is what i think about that. I think he made it is a personal decision on his part to the Navajo Nation council does not support the Washington Team. [applause] kevin yes. Hello, my name is nicolette. Im studying public and administration of policy. Kevin, you had mentioned earlier that indians are malleable to whatever institutions need. The question is, anyone else can answer this too, how are the perceptions of American Indians impacting Public Policy . I think the mentality could be commented on. Afterwards, i have another announcement. Kevin the way you would expect. If people are imaginary, if your youre understanding of indians is based on these imaginary indians that they have been taught about, then they are not going to grasp the depth and complexity of the contemporary issues that native American People are bringing forward. When i speak with tribal leaders about the museum, i say, look, we have all had this experiment experience. Every time there is an election, you get a new set of members of congress or county commissioners or state legislators who know nothing about American Indians because they have been misinformed their entire lives. We always have to start at the beginning again and very slowly work forward to bring them to some sort of understanding of why we are sitting there in their office. You even have to explain very simple things. Tribal governments are not clubs. They are not just a bunch of people who hang out together. They are government. That is a very old idea that they have always been government. Reservations were not given to indians. There is a reason they are called reservations. They were reserved by the indians. You have to overcome a lot of these ideas before you can even get to zero and then Start Talking about the complexity of issues. Thats why we are always in a race where we have to start 200 yards behind and are still expected to win. It affects policy in all of those ways. You would be astounded at how little some people who are in positions of genuine authority over native american nations you would be appalled at how little they know about this history. Naturally, the outcomes are not optimal and not what we hope for. I appreciate that. I want to make an announcement that is ok. Im involved in organizing a vigil that is going to be happening tomorrow night and i believe a lot of you guys have received flyers. The vigil is to draw awareness and connection between how native americans are perceived and the impact it has on violence against women. I hope you guys will help your support by attending. [applause] kevin is jim still here . I cant see him. How much longer do we have . Ok, good. Thank you. I would like to introduce myself. I wanted to mention, i guess living and growing up around the metropolitan area of phoenix scottsdale, mesa, fountain hills, and all those big cities around us, it was really hard growing up, especially with the media that turned us into the european attitude culture thing that we assimilated to wanting cowboys to win over indians in the movies. I would remember, i was a cowboy fan growing up because of the cowboy name. It was tough. I really appreciate you all being Strong Enough and smart enough to get out and tell the truth. I want to say, i worked with the Community Council and the political side of things. I remember when i first got on council in 1998, i was working with some folks from mesa. That was right next to us. It is probably one of the friendliest communities we have. These representatives had never been on the reservation. They didnt know where the boundaries were. They didnt know the people that lived there. They had no idea what the issues were. Yet, they were the ones basically representing us. I say this because part of it is them but part of it is us to. I think the apathy that we as native americans have, i think that needs to be worked on. I am glad that we have people like you and different people around the nation that are doing that. It is going to be important with things getting scarcer, land water, things like that that we know people are already trying to get onto the communities and take. That sent carlos issue that was brought up, we are just considered second citizens. They will be able to conquer and divide us. That has been there and low. M. O. I am really glad you are out doing this. It helps us understand and it will be a big victory down the road. Hopefully communities can take this stuff and really understand and try to put a bigger effort into making sure that we aboard avoid those things coming in the future. So thanks. [applause] kevin that brings them into mind for me. Leo, most of your students i imagine our native students in the introductory course. Do they come with a real working knowledge of native American History . Leo to be honest, no. It is a great disappointment because i wish that a native high schools or in high schools with high populations of indian people, or even just all high schools in states with large part relations indians, had some standardized history or something to connect students to contemporary issues in native country. There is such a huge gap and our goal as professors is to try to fill that gap. Sometimes i feel like we are not doing a good job because when you get at the collegiate level, students dont have to enroll in your classes. They can also take not necessarily indian classes. There is need for improvement. Ok. [laughter] i would like to thank you for speaking your mind and allowing me to speak mine. [banging] why dont you just hold it . Ok. I was watching the news when the march during the redskins game happened. I wondered how people like you guys thought about the people that supported the redskins that were native american. I just wondered what you thought about that. That is a good question. Suzan, jim . Suzan how do we feel about the native people who support them . Yes. Suzan well, bless their hearts [laughter] they will learn in the future and they want to be with winners. They think they are by cozying up to the nearest racist white person against them. They think that means winning. They think it will save them because we are being racist against someone else. It sort of like an abused child. Dont hurt me, you and him thought it. They are not the ones we are upset with. We are not upset with the indians who can be rented or bought or who just willingly go with what they perceive is the winning side. There is no equivalence between the few native people who line up with the Washington Football Team owner and all the major National Native organizations who were on one side saying enough is enough. Get rid of all of these racist stereotypes in sports. Especially you, Washington Football Team. [applause] one navajo official does not offset the fact that the medicine Mens Association and the Navajo Human Rights Commission and the Navajo Tribal council are all on one side. They say, no, we dont like that name. Just one person doesnt offset all of these native people and the people that all of these native organizations represent. We are on the side of the overwhelming native view of all of this and population and presence. Very comfortably so. It is really a happy place to be not just in the mainstream but way and the majority and we are all moving in the same direction the fact that you have a few over here, stragglers who might be limping along or people who want to ride in the wagon of the white people who think they are hurting us, thats ok. Theyll catch up and then pretty soon, once we definitively win everything, then they will be at the front of the line leaning into our pictures saying, look what we did. We will welcome them. They are already doing that. The other thing is, maybe, jim you can comment on this, it feels like when the team is out there with their foundation and trying to generate tribal support and busing indian people to the game, it that they are trying to get us to fight with each other. We just refuse to do that. First of all, thank you my young person for representing us in a good way. This is why we are doing it. This is for you. [applause] i believe you are discussing the oath, the original American Foundation that dan snyder suddenly produced 10 months ago. He is suddenly wanting to do good things for indian people. At least that has happened. He is now providing money to tribes that are willing to support him. Again, those tribes that refused his money, those are the ones that have really gotten that message in terms of where we stand as people in america. When we are on their reservation and we are trying to survive tomorrow, back home and kind ridge, people are trying to survive. This is not a big issue when survival is number one. Overall, when we are talking about how the perspective of us infiltrates our governments, they are also ignorant by design, our senators and Congress People because they are products of American Education. Unless they went overseas to europe or asia where they teach more about American Indian history than we do here, they will not know about it. When we start 200 yards behind as i stated, it is really true because 15 states dont have tribes. Therefore 30 senators dont have to do anything for Indian Country. We are already starting way behind when we are going into the halls. I have walked those holes and talk to those you believefaced staffers that they send out. Pimplyfaced staffers that they send out. Im willing to discuss issues and a high level. What do i have to and talk to do . Act to indian 101. Just so they can understand why am as a person. How much did donald trump give to your family . You are all rich now to. It is that level of ignorance that the frustration. It is happening and the efforts of suzanne and many others over the years is now our young people are getting that information. Keep up the good fight, young person. We appreciate you. Thank you for coming. [applause] my name is donna. This is my son. He is 12. We live here in the valley. My other two children are up there. I want to say thank you for all your efforts. I had a conversation with amanda last friday. I have been a part of this effort since i was in high school. My mother was very much involved. I remember wearing the promotional tshirts and sweatshirts with the penance on it with a different names where it says the new jersey jews and the different names. I wore it for 30 days straight in high school. To make a statement. I got harassed, chased home, i fought almost every day for 30 days. If you think this doesnt impact youth, i am an adult that grew up being impacted by these stereotypes and mascots. I grew up in a small farm town in nebraska where i was probably the only brown person in an eight county radius. I heard it for every single racial group. A lot of people say that this is new. That they havent heard of it. Where is this coming from . I am in my 40s. That happened 30 years ago. It is still happening today. My kids still get teased about their long hair. I just want to say thank you. I really see some momentum with this effort. I am so proud of everybody and everybodys efforts. Thank you very much. [applause] thank you. My name is dan. I am not a native american. I was asked to come here and speak by a friend of mine. He is a president of a Navajo Code Talkers Association and he could not make it because of weather. You often call people of native heritage that cheer for these teams, sellouts and traitors. Amanda, i have seen you chase people into stadiums with their families yelling that they are sellouts and traders. Traitors i wonder, with all the issues that native americans in general suffer from, the last credible Polling Company to take this issue on was in 2004 and they found 90 support behind these names. Isnt the fight kind of being created by you guys . Amanda, why dont you go first. Then suzanne. First of all, i did not chase anyone down, run anyone down or any of that. I am not sure where you got that from. I was there. Sorry. There were a lot of people that were there and to saw a lot. I think the 2004 annenberg poll is outdated, first of all. That was 10 years ago. In the last 10 years, many things are changing, including this movement. A lot of peoples minds have changed. Native American People and nonnative American People. I think when you look at polls we are very misguided because we are looking at numbers. We are looking at several people participating in these things. The validity of them, it is not there. I always ask, would you lead a Civil Rights Movement to a poll . No. Because this is a movement. Its not going anywhere anytime soon. [applause] when i hear terms like overwhelming majorities and things like that. I believe you even mentioned some polling. Im wondering where that came from. Suzanne, why dont you talk about the annenberg poll. We do know how to count. We have given our organizations responsibilities for carrying out their wishes. Since the late 1960s and the early 1960s for some organizations, our major National Native organizations have all been moving in the same direction. They represent the overwhelming majority of native people here it that is how we know what we are talking about. I used to run one of them. The National Congress of American Indians. I ran it in the 80s. We are not new to this. You wonder about all the other important issues. We are the ones who do face the more important issues. People who asked that question dont do anything for my people. Peter mcdonald, for crying out loud, when he was in power, he stole from the navajo people. Thats inaccurate. [applause] he was convicted and went to prison for ripping off the people. I dont call him a sellout. I call him a thief. Thats what he was convicted of. [applause] you, you, you and probably you, are put up to this by billionaire dictators and ceo of United Nation incorporated. [booing] he pays for all your travel and court cases. A social worker cant fly across the country every week unless she is being bankrolled. That is where ray halbert or comes in. This is very valuable. Let him finish. You sir, are the way are the one that recognized in federally as the leader of that nation against his own people. It is not a nation, is a corporation. He is a billionaire up against billionaires. You guys are playing a trick on people trying to act like this is a liberal issue when it really isnt. Im a liberal guy. If i really thought you guys were fighting racism, i would be Holding Hands with you. Thank you. Lets have somebody else speak. Thank you for demonstrating exactly what we are here for. You call my friends ignorant and they are native americans and they are ignorant because they cheer for a team you dont like . This guy went to m. I. T. He is not uneducated. Suzan i see youve come with an indian. I just met him yesterday. The fact is is that a majority of native americans support these names. Thank you. Sit down two more questions. My name is christopher. Proud graduate of a school. Proud redskins fan since i was young. Ive always traveled with the teams. It has always been a part of my life. For someone like me, i identified with the team. I identified with the name and the logo. That has always been a source of pride for me. I am not the only one. We are not ignorant or uneducated. We know why we are supportive of this team. Sports is a big joining factor and for us, this is a sports issue. We can gather around this and support each other and be proud. Theres nothing wrong with that if you are a redskins fan. Im not a fan of another team. The redskins have always been the one i started with when i was five years old. Thats where i started and thats what its always been. To hear a lot of these comments, this is such a divisive issue. Its probably the most divisive thing ive seen. A lot of you guys do a lot of good work. Teaching and your energy is awesome. You are heroes to a lot of kids. You did a lot of great things and we heard that through your introduction. For some reason, i think this issue is such a divisive thing that when you go on to comments on twitter, on facebook, you just hear this back and forth. You are a sellout, you are racist. Everything back and forth. I have never been a part of an issue. You just see natives fighting each other. To me, how do we stop this . How can we unite ourselves to other things . I personally dont believe that native mascots hurt. I went back to my grandpas house. I have always been a part of some type of native community. Im lucky in that way. I have also lived off the reservation. Ive lived in boston for 12 years. I finished at asu but moved back to boston for 12 more years. It was never an issue. I used to wear my redskins stuff and walk around. No one ever said anything to me. There are stereotypes and i have come across them and racism. Ive been called many things. A lot of this and for a lot of other fans for myself, it has never been about the sport. When im coming down to as my question is, what is the end result . It is dividing people now. Thats the scary part of it. It doesnt give you pause that dr. Manley used to be the principal of the school and he was a plaintiff in the original lawsuit against the Washington Football Team or that the Navajo Commission on human rights and the medicine men of association and the Tribal Council are all on one side of this issue and you and Amanda Blackhorse and you are under another . Doesnt that give you pause for a moment . No. This has only been about pride for me. The native mascot thing seems like a redskins bashing thing. I follow joshua. He introduced me to the council. Its never been to the full council and hes never done anything else. They are trying to impeach him through the city because he doesnt do anything. This was his one chance to get into the national picture. There was an article about it today. Thats what im saying. There are some people that try to take advantage and i understand that you guys have your issues and your side. I respectfully disagree with you. Im not trying to change her mind. I want people to know that there are a lot of natives like me that find pride in this team and the name. We see it as a unifier and wait for us to get together and celebrate one thing. We know the greater weight of the people, we know where they fall. Right now, most of our people are moving in one direction. The people on your side of the issue are not as vocal anymore. Its good that you are being vocal about it and you still have passion about it. We simply disagree. But we are going to prevail or it i disagree with that. I dont think there is a majority. There is an overwhelming majority. You may take issue with that. [applause] i know plenty more. We are starting to speak up more i think. The National Congress of American Indians, the National Indian Education Association just go right through them. How many native people they represent, how many people they are. Have you been to a National Congress of American Indians Association Meeting . You go there and not one person is on the other side of the issue. Thats our experience. For those of us to meet and make up these policies, we dont just invent them. We make them up because we all agree on this. Im just saying i disagree. That is fine. You are entitled to do that. You dont scare me, certainly. You wont hear me, certainly you havent heard people talking about sellouts or traders. Or traitors. That is not productive. I am not uneducated or ignorant or needing help. It is like i said, it is such a divisive issue. It is one that i see the most where people are asking each other. Going after each other. Thanks for coming. Thank you. Ignorance by design, that is all i can say. Ignorance by design. [applause] this will be our last. We are out of time. My name is brandon. I thought the presentation and the panel were awesome. I dont think is that the mascots horrible portrayal of an indigenous culture, but what i did see was a lot of misrepresented imagery were of men. I wonder if you also think this affect indigenous women, and how you think they have been portrayed . Let me just point out, pocahontas was a woman. I mean like a mascot. That is a whole other lecture. The answer is yes. Women are stereotyped in a way that invite, in essence, assault on them. It is an ongoing thing. If you look at the imagery around native women that shows up in the popular media, in the Popular Culture, native women are, in a sense representatives of the land itself, right and available for plunder. That was the imagery used about native american women from the very beginning, when colonists were first reporting back from the country. You should see this place and the women, holy cow. That is what it was all about. The answer is yes. I could have done a powerpoint twice as long with outrageous images of native american women that are contemporary. Overall, when you have this level of acceptance in sporting events, everyone is impacted. Nonindian and indian alike. There is none of this racism happening last week, in rapid city south dakota, a group of students who won their way to a free hockey game, academics, nonindian were doused in beer and were called i apologize to my favorite american brothers and sisters, but they used this term back home go home prairie necks. Was anyone arrested or asked to leave the stadium question mark the stadium . No. These things happen a lot. I know i have young women and young men who will always have a different perspective because of what happened to them last week. That cannot be allowed anymore. If you can have this kind of imagery and be ok with it and american statistics pulling that is ok, i say it is not. How many of us does it take to say no more. I guarantee you if this was an africanamerican head, you would find africanamericans that say, that does not bother me. You would also find africanamericans who would say no way i will let this happen to my people. We are asking for understanding. [applause] kevin with that, we want to thank you all for coming here and listening so carefully and participating in the conversation. I want to once again thank Arizona State university, the college of law for arranging this event. To the museum for hosting this event. Thank you all for coming tonight. We hope we will see you here many times. [applause] [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2015] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] coming up on cspan, marks by u. N. Secretarygeneral ban kimoon about the situation in iraq and syria. Then, Vice President joe biden on u. S. 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On friday, cspans congressional freshmen profile concludes with montana republican ryan zinke you. Ryan zinke. Representative zinke i kind of laugh