Transcripts For CNNW The Lead With Jake Tapper 20181218

Yes, the same trump family thats now leading the nation. Welcome to the lead, im jake tapper. A stunning turn of events today. Former National Security adviser to President Trump, Michael Flynn, was due to find out today if he is going to prison for lying to the fbi. And, in fact, based on the comments coming from the presiding judge, it looked to many observers as though flynn indeed was going to get locked up. But flynns attorneys requested a delay, and that can was kicked 90 days down the road. It was a dramatic hearing today with judge Emmett Sullivan telling flynn, quote, i am not hiding my disgust for your criminal offense, and even pressing on whether they considered charging flynn with treason. After a recess, sullivan tried to walk back some of those harsh comments, including saying he was merely asking about treason, not making an accusation. Sullivan had also inaccurately asserted that flynn had served as an agent for turkey at the same time he was National Security adviser in the white house. Thats a falsehood that the judge corrected. Noting that flynn stopped serving as a Foreign Agent once he started officially working for the Trump Administration. But beyond the theatrics today, flynn asserted in court he was not going to challenge the circumstances of that interview he had with the fbi. That he was aware lying to the fbi was a crime when he was interviewed. Directly rebutting claims from the white house that investigators had been trying to, quote, ambush flynn. Press secretary Sarah Sanders even stood by that assertion that he was ambushed a few minutes ago. The Trump White House once again sidi siding with the fbi and department of justice. Flynn, of course, a key player in the special counsels russia investigation, and he will, we are told, continue to cooperate with robert mueller. Cnns Jessica Schneider joins me now. Jessica, i have to say, it sure sounded as though judge sullivan was going to send flynn to the clink for at least some period of time. It did, jake. The judge stressed that prison time was not off the table, even though thats what flynns lawyers and muellers team essentially agreed to in their sentencing memos. This was really a hearing that went off the rails for flynns team with that rough rhetoric coming from the judge who will ultimately sentence flynn sometime next year. Michael flynns sentencing is on hold after a dramatic twohour rebuke from the judge. Federal judge Emmett Sullivan scolding President Trumps former National Security adviser, telling flynn, i am not hiding my disgust, my disdain for your criminal offense. The next president of the United States, right here at one point, the judge noted that flynn was lobbying for the turkish government at the same time he was working for the Trump Campaign. Flynn even wrote an oped on election day, attacking a cleric living in pennsylvania home the turkish government accused of creating a coup against president erdogan. The judge said you sold your country out. Judge sullivan later acknowledged flynn stopped lobbying once he was named National Security adviser. Judge sullivan asked twice if flynns conduct rises to the level of treasonous activity, but walked that back, too. Saying he wasnt suggesting flynn committed treason. Muellers lawyer said the special counsel did not consider charging flynn with treason. This election is about the heart and soul of the United States of america. Reporter sullivan also questioned why flynn would plead guilty when his lawyers have accused the fbi of tricking flynn into lying about his contacts with the former russian ambassador, sergey kislyak, during a january 2017 interview with agents at the white house. Judge sullivan saying, i cannot recall any incident where the court has ever accepted the plea of someone who maintained he was not guilty. The judge even giving flynn several opportunities to rethink his plea, but flynn told the judge he wanted to proceed. The judge then asking, because youre guilty of this offense . Flynn answering, yes, your honor. But because flynn continues to cooperate with Robert Muellers team, meeting with them 19 times so far, according to the special counsels prosecutor, the judge suggested delaying the sentence until hes done cooperating. Telling flynn, the more you assist the government, the more you arguably help yourself at the time of sentencing. And after a 30minute recess, thats ultimately what flynns team decided to do. They acknowledged that flynn might be called to testify in a virginia case against his two former Business Associates and then flynns lawyers formally asked to delay the sentencing. Prosecutors then agreed, and, jake, now were looking at a march 13th date for a status update with a sentencing that could follow some time after that. Jake . All right, Jessica Schneider, thank you so much. Lets chew over this wild and wacky day with our panel. Mary kathryn, ill start with you. Do you think that the prosecutors just read the room and said, boy, this judge is going to throw the book. Lets get a few more months of cooperation with mueller under his belt and well give it again or maybe get some new evidence . Why does it always have to be this wild, man . Everybody has go the to play up to the drama level of everyone in the Trump Administration. Yeah, they read the room, probably, and were like, maybe we can appeal for a change of judge. Because this guy was mad. And its important to note, he was the one who asked for the fbi interview papers. The 302, yeah. So he has presumably seen those. And is still this angry. That might tell us something about how that process went down. And i have to say i said this in the open. But he said some things that were inaccurate, the judge. Judge sullivan. He said that Michael Flynn and you can get mad at Michael Flynn for what he did while he was a Foreign Agent for turkey and didnt disclose it and working for a president ial campaign and all of that. But he said flynn was a Foreign Agent while working as National Security adviser, and that was not true. It seemed like everyones ego was getting in the way. Flynn, im guilty of lying, but maybe i was entrapped. And that made the judge made. And then the judge says maybe youre guilty of treason because he couldnt figure out when flynn was registered as a Foreign Agent. I would have had much more confidence in this system if the judge knew the facts at least as well as i do, because thats a pretty basic mistake. So maybe at the end of the day, this is all for the better, to give everybody a pause for three months. Because i would feel better if everybody could read the full sentencing memo unredacted by the time that flynn is sentenced. Im glad the 302s came out. That gives more clarity to how that conversation went down. So maybe Everybody Needs more time to get the facts straight, including the judge. What did you think about when the judge asked the prosecutors, the special counsels prosecutors, if they had ever thought of charging flynn with treason . I was one, to be honest, its clearly a question i had on my mind. I just didnt think i would hear it not hear it, because we clearly dont have the cameras in the courtroom. People want the cameras. But when i heard that, i was a little taken aback. But, again, its a question i definitely had on my mind, which maybe its a question millions of other americans had on their mind. What i find so interesting about this in the commentary round, what we saw and what we heard and saw from pictures in the courtroom today, is that there are a few things that are not debatable. Michael flynn did not change his guilty plea today. He still pled guilty. This is not a question of if he did it. The question is, what will his consequences for doing it be . So there is no there is no question on the table if he is guilty. He is. In fact, the judge was hot, and maybe out over his ski tips. I will say, you cant ascribe a political motive to that anger. He was put on the d. C. Bench by Ronald Reagan and then on the federal court by bill clinton. So if you can find a political agenda, i think he was honestly angry that general flynns supporters were pulling this line of bologna that somehow he was entrapped. Hes just a babe in the woods, a threestar general who has no idea that you cant lie to the fbi. And the crime occurred in the white house. Which is a sacred space and it was by a threestar general in whom we ought to have the highest standards. And so i can understand why he was angry. Should have not said treason. Treason is not anywhere in the ballpark. The bar is very high. Im just asking questions, man. But just to be a lawyer the only crime defined in the constitution. Punishable by death. Anybody criticizing the government in britain was accused of treason. To commit war against the United States or provide aid and comfort to the enemy. Turkey, russia, they may be countries we have complex relationships with, but were not at war with them. Im glad the judge zoned in that it is disgraceful that flynn was acting as an unregistered agent for turkey during the campaign. That is a big deal. And i dont think people that gets emphasized enough. We get caught up in the lying. But he was acting as an agent of turkey during the campaign, writing opeds, and just, you know, freelancing on this you know, what did trump know . There are so many questions that stem from that. Yeah. That are unanswered. And one thing i think is interesting, mary kathryn, a lot of flynn supporters say he was ambushed and entrapped by the fbi. But if you read the notes, actually, the fbi bent over backwards for flynn who they considered, im sure, like a colleague and a fellow intelligence sort of wanted to jog his memory. Yeah, and in a way they would not do for anybody around this table. No, they would take me hand in cuffs. Especially at the airport. Well discuss that later. But in one of the exchanges, the agents asked flynn if he recalled any conversations with kislyak. And flynn responded, yes, good reminder thats the kind of, like well, what about thats not trying to entrap him. Bottom line, he copped to it. Thats the corner he finds himself stuck in. That hes painted himself into. Which is why the judge got mad when he suggested there was Something Else going on here. I do not understand why so many figures who end up on the other side of the Trump Administration, such as this judge, seem determined to convince his supporters that there is, in fact, a giant, like, politically motivated and emotional you think the judge sullivan is feeding into the deep state narrative . Calm professionalism gets you a lot further in this situation and does not feed that sentiment. I think the fact of the matter is, its the judges courtroom. So the judge can the judge can exhibit whatever type of temperament the judge would like to exhibit in the judges courtroom. Hes entitled to his emotions, but not as we say, his own facts. But there is still a question, why did flynn go down this route of bringing up entrapment when he had lowest sentencing recommendation. Im not a lawyer, but that seems like a bad idea. When youre already in the best position, why do you screw that up . Is it because his ego just got in the way and he was looking for a fox news con contract or something after . And the claim of entrapment is a lie. Hes confessing to a lie. So its probably a bad idea when youre going to be sentenced for lying to lie, going in to see the judge. But why did Michael Flynn lie . Thats the big mystery we dont know. I thought i was going to get that clarity in the courtroom today, jake. I dont understand why Michael Flynn lied, even after the jogging of the memory, he still lied. So what was Michael Flynn trying to protect . And is there still more . I dont think thats as we said on this table before, there is nothing wrong with an incoming National Security adviser talking with a foreign diplomat about their plans for what theyre going to do when they take power. So why lie about any of it . Weve got a lot more to talk about. According to the president , Michael Cohen is a rat. But Michael Flynn, he deserves good luck. But theyre both cooperating with robert mueller. So whats the difference . Stay with us. Its the time of the season for loving for a limited time, 50 for them 10 for you. Applebees. Now thats eatin good in the neighborhood. Not long ago, ronda started here. And then, more jobs began to appear. These techs in a lab. This builder in a hardhat. The welders and electricians who do all of that. The diner staffed up cause they all needed lunch. Teachers. Doctors. Jobs grew a bunch. What started with one job spread all around. Because each job in energy creates many more in this town. Energy lives here. If you have moderate to thsevere rheumatoid arthritis, month after month, the clock is ticking on irreversible joint damage. Ongoing pain and stiffness are signs of joint erosion. Humira can help stop the clock. Prescribed for 15 years, humira targets and blocks a source of inflammation that contributes to joint pain and irreversible damage. Humira can lower your ability to fight infections. 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Press secretary Sarah Sanders now claiming that none of flynns admitted crimes have anything to do with President Trump, despite the fact that flynn committed those crimes while working in the west wing and was fired by President Trump for lying to the Vice President about the very same subject, his conversations with the russian ambassador. Cnns Kaitlan Collins is live at the white house. How can he argue that flynn was ambushed when flynns lawyer said this was not a case of entrapment by the fbi and flynn himself today said he knew at the time that lying to the fbi was a crime . Reporter yeah, the judge made a point of having mike flynn saying he lied to the fbi, knew it was a crime and took full responsibility for it today. But thats not what the white house entered for that hearing thinking was going to happen. They thought that judge was going to be much more critical of the way the fbi interviewed mike flynn. But instead he told the president s former National Security adviser he believed he had sold out the country. In the First White House briefing in weeks the Trump Administration was on the defense. After a wild twohour sentencing hearing for fired National Security adviser, Michael Flynn resulted in him taking a federal judge up on his offer to delay the sentencing until he cooperates his investigation with the prosecutors. The delay is something between general flynn and the courts. In the meantime, we wish general flynn well. Reporter when reporters raised questions about the president s morning tweet wishing flynn good luck in court, sanders said she saw no problem with trump praising someone who has pleaded guilty to the fbi and worked as an unregistered agent on behalf of another government during his campaign. Its perfectly acceptable for the president to make a positive comment about somebody while we wait to see what the courts determination is. Reporter sanders arguing that flynns lies on white house grounds had nothing to do with trump. Maybe he did do those things, but that doesnt have anything to do with the president. Reporter in recent days, the president and his allies have suggested misconduct by the fbi during flynns interview last january. Well, the fbi said Michael Flynn, a general and a great person, they said he didnt lie. And mueller said, well, maybe he did. Reporter but not even flynns legal team used that defense today. Instead, telling the federal judge he was not entrapped by the fbi, and was fully aware lying to investigators is a crime. But the white house was hoping the judge would focus on the fbis behavior in court. Are you arguing that he was entrapped . Look, were arguing that he was certainly ambushed. Reporter asked this afternoon if she wanted to amend that statement made this morning we dont have any reason to want to walk that back. Reporter now sanders also argued today that calling someone a rat is appropriate for someone who has been dishonest and is lying. Michael flynn lied to the fbi, to the Vice President , to the former chief of staff, to the former press secretary, yet today the white house wished him well as we await his sentencing. Jake . Sounds like youre suggesting theres a different standard there for Michael Flynn and Michael Cohen i dont want to put words in your mouth, Kaitlan Collins. Thanks so much. Lets talk about it with our panel here. First of all, let me just talk about the idea that the white house is calling Michael Cohen a rat because hes a liar. And let me just say, Michael Cohen is a liar. He is. So is Michael Flynn. And President Trump tells so many lies that the Washington Post actually had to invent a new category in their factchecking department, the bottomless pinocchio. So im wondering what you think as somebody who has written a book about how often they lie. I think theres one statement thats going to come back to haunt Sarah Sanders from that briefing. She stood at the podium and said that Michael Flynns lies have nothing to do with President Trump. Really . Lets push back on that a little bit. He lied to the fbi about the conversations he had about sanctions with the russian government during the transition. Why did he lie . Well, let me ask this. What are the chances he was freelancing that conversation . Would general flynn go to the russian government and say, dont worry about retaliation if he didnt have some kind of authorization from trump . I think not. That has not been proven. But we keep going around these circles saying why did general flynn lie . Well, if he was directed to have those conversations with the russians by President Trump, that would be a pretty big reason to lie. Interesting. The other thing, mary kathryn, the president is saying that flynn was ambushed today, and theyre siding basically with flynn, even though hes not even making the assertion he was ambushed, against the fbi. Last december President Trump tweeted, i had to fire general flynn because he lied to the Vice President and the fbi. So President Trump at one point, a year ago, was upset that flynn had lied to the fbi. Now hes basically denying that flynn lied to the fbi. Is there a strategy here . I dont really understand why they would change on this. I dont believe theres ever a strategy. And a good strategy would be to hush your mouths. Hush. Because weve been saying this for three years. I know, but i feel the need to say it yet again. The reason that sanders is talking about it is because trump is tweeting about it and your legal strategy should be lets keep it very minimal. But we cannot do that. Is this setting a stage for a flynn pardon . Whats the purpose . Potentially, it could be. Again, im i dont think there is a strategy here. When it comes to Michael Flynn. I think that press briefing today was extremely problematic. I think Sarah Sanders not surprising to anyone at this table, told many lies during the press briefing. One of which, that it had nothing to do with what Michael Flynn is doing had nothing to do with donald trump. The press gave her an out to go back on what she said oh this morning on fox news, saying that flynn was ambushed. He said in court today he was not ambushed. There was no entrapment. So i dont really understand what the strategy is. But i will say that we are looming in front of a Government Shutdown. With everything that happened today with Michael Flynn, the Trump Foundation now having to dissolve because they were nefarious and just downright wrong and now Senate Republicans not being able to reach a deal with democrats on the hill. This is a real issue for the president and this press briefing didnt help. President trump tweeted good luck to Michael Flynn in court this morning. Subsidiaries was asked by josh dawsey of the Washington Post, why would he do this . He is pleading guilty to federal crimes. Listen to this. Why is the president making these comments, given these things . Its perfectly acceptable for the president to make a positive comment about somebody while we wait to see what the courts determination is. He loo i had to tied to the. And we werent waiting for the courts determination. He was pleading guilty. The determination is made. By flynn i am guilty, i am a felon. So there is no finding of fact here at issue that the president should actually state out of. But hes obviously communicating with flynn. And its always trumps self interest. I do think there is a strategy in that trump always talks about himself and refers you think hes communicating, im with you, stay with me. I think he is. But dont you think Sarah Sanders and the rest of the white house were expecting to take a victory lap today . Everybody thought that general flynn was going to get no jail time. That blew up in their face when the judge essentially accused him of treason, called him a disgrace and other things and still had to go to the podium. Couldnt cancel at that point. So they miscalculated. This is a gross miscalculation. I think what we saw today is the fact that Sarah Sanders, many people when she first got the job said shes inexperienced, she hasnt had the experience. But i would venture to say what we saw today is another example how she is not only inexperienced, but unqualified. You can be inexperienced, but i dont think shes qualified. I think it can be as simple as self interest and his affinity, right . He has an affinity for generals who like trump. And general flynn is a general who likes trump and therefore he is going to just going to root for him . You dont think there is anything along the lines, stay with me, ill stay with you . Im rooting for you . Its a combination of the two, and, again, if you just hushed your mouth President Trump clearly bothered by this before 9 00 a. M. This morning. Tweeted about the mueller witch hunt, flynns court appearance, the fed, about social Media Companies being unfair to republicans, about immigration, and about Christopher Steele and the steele dossier. This is a hot mess. Let me tell you what. There is no chance theres going to be a Government Shutdown, because they are trying to fend off 17 different investigations that impact the Trump White House, the trump family, every which way. They are just hoping for something to change the narrative and for something to break their way. Well, lets talk about one of those investigations. Forced to fold. The Trump Family Charity shutting down after the president and his kids are accused of using the charity as a personal piggy bank. So where does all that money go now . Stay with us. And just like you, the further into winter we go, the heavier i get. And while your pants struggle to support the heavier you, your roof struggles to support the heavier me. [laughter] whoo. [crash] and your cutrate insurance might not pay for this. So get allstate, you could save money and be better protected from mayhem like me. Mayhem is everywhere. So get an allstate agent. Are you in good hands . Discover card. I justis this for real . Match, yep. We match all the cash back new cardmembers earn at the end of their first year, automatically. Whoo i got my money hard to contain yourself, isnt it . Uh huh let it go whoo get a dollarfordollar match at the end of your first year. Only from discover. Ato be there. For the good. And not so good. For the mundane. The aweinspiring. The heart racing. The heart breaking. Thats what life is all about. Showing up. Unless migraine steals your chance to say i am here. Thats why, we created aimovig. A preventive treatment for migraine in adults. One dose, once a month. Aimovig is proven to reduce the number of monthly migraine days. For some, that number can be cut in half or more. The most common side effects are pain, redness, or swelling at the injection site and constipation. These are your days what will each one bring . Doesnt matter, as long as you can say. I am here. Talk to your doctor about preventing migraine with aimovig. And be there more. Theres no place likargh e im trying. Yippiekiyay. Mom. In our money lead today, another investigation is coming to a head for President Trump and his family. The president and the Trump Foundation today cut a deal with the new York State Attorney general to shut down the Charitable Foundation after allegations that the president and his family were essentially using it as a personal piggy bank during the 2016 campaign, taking Charity Donations to pay off debts and more. Lets bring in kara scannell. New York Attorney general barbara underwood, a democrat, came down hard on the Trump Foundation today. Thats right, jake. A victory lap today, announcing the dissolution of the Trump Foundation. And in that statement, she said this amounted to the Trump Foundation functioning as little more than a checkbook to serve mr. Trumps business and political interests. She went on to say, this is an important victory for the rule of law, making clear that there is one set of rules for everyone. And, of course, underwood sued the Trump Foundation this year, alleging they were basically using the foundation for Donald Trumps personal business expenses, including, you know, raising money before an iowa caucus and having money go to payments there. They also alleged that he had used money raised in the foundation to settle legal issues, lawsuits, involving maralago and a trump golf course. And the one we all remember, i think, is that they also used the foundation here to pay for a painting of donald trump that he had that was hanging at maralago. So underwoods lawsuit is alleging that this was all Illegal Campaign finance violations, and misuse of funds from this charity, jake. Despite this deal, the lawsuit is ongoing. Prosecutors are still after 2. 8 million in restitution, and they also want to ban President Trump and his family from serving on any other Charity Boards in new york. The trump attorney called the new York Attorney generals Statement Today misleading. On what basis are they saying that the new York Attorney general is being misleading . The Trump Foundation is taking issue with this, because of since trump won the nomination, the foundation essentially said it was shutting down. So since december of 2016, they signalled to the new York Attorney Generals Office they wanted to shut this down. And its effectively been doing nothing since january of 2017. But as this legal issue has gone through, the lawsuit involving the foundation, the Trump Foundation has asked the judge repeatedly, can we please resolve this, and the ags office didnt want them to do that because they were still investigating the foundation. So even at one point at a hearing, the judge said, well, shouldnt we get to the point where we dissolve this . So that leads us to where we are today, jake. Finally dissolved now, even though it has been essentially a shell for the past 18 months. Thank you very much. I want to bring in anne milgram, former attorney general for the state of new jersey. Thank you so much for being here. When this lawsuit came up, the president denied his foundation had done anything wrong. If this agreement goes through, if its approved by a judge, does that mean that the president is essentially admitting they had done wrong . No. I dont think its an acknowledgment that at least from the Trump Campaign and trump organization, its not an acknowledgment, per se. But to you and i and to normal people who read what is happening, the short answer i think is yes. So in the legal sense, its not going to be a formal apology or acknowledgment, but the fact that theyre dissolving, its very clear that they could not beat this lawsuit. That there was ample evidence that they had when you have a c3 charity, you cant use it for political actions or pay legal settlement. So they have taken a number of actions that violated Campaign Finance laws and other laws. And so here i think the bottom line was that it would have been shut down, had they continued to fight it. And so they have agreed to dissolve it. So as you note, this is an acknowledgment by the attorney general, at least, if not by the trump team, that the president and others violated Campaign Finance laws. But unlike the president s former attorney, Michael Cohen, who committed Campaign Finance fraud and felonies in addition to other crimes, no one is going to prison or facing any sort of criminal penalty that i can see. Might that change, or is that pretty much where it is . Well, for what we know right now. This was brought as a civil suit by the new York Attorney general. They largely only have Civil Authority in new york. They have a few criminal laws and statutes, but dont have full criminal jurisdiction. So this kind of an investigation into Campaign Finance, it wouldnt be done by them. It would be done by one of the federal prosecutors offices or if there were other allegations of wrongdoing, could be done by a local prosecutor. So i think its too early for us to say whether or not there are other charges that potentially could stem from this. But its certainly, you know, the questions you would ask for combine finance, is it over the amount of a donation to a candidate would likely be were talking about millions of dollars. Depending on the payment. And then it could also potentially be a question of did the president was it knowing and willfully done by him. And so thats the kind of thing they would ask. But the new York Attorney general is still pressing forward with other parts other punishments that she is seeking, including a restitution. So returning money that i guess people had given to the foundation. And also banning President Trump or any of his children, anybody who had served on the Trump Foundation board, from serving on any other charitable board in new york. Is that normal . I think its extraordinary. And lets start there. Because i do think its extraordinary. Basically, what the ag is saying is they have failed in their fiduciary duties to the Nonprofit Organization in such an enormous way, they are not qualified to sit on the board of any Nonprofit Charity in the state of new york. And new york is all that the new york ag could control. Shes basically said these people have no business overseeing any of the funds or activities of any nonprofit in the state. Thats a pretty extraordinary thing to say and to go after donald trump and all three of his kids. And as to the money, youre right. Basically, the ag has alleged extensive amount of harm and said theres 2. 8 million that needs to be paid back, because that money was inappropriately spent by the foundation. Wow. To be continued, i guess. Because that case goes forward. Anne milgram, former attorney general for the great garden state, thank you so much for joining us. Appreciate it. The president said he would take the blame for a shutdown, but ynow he says its up to the senate. Stay with us. Maria ramirez . Hi. Maria ramirez mom maria Maria Ramirez. Mcdonalds is committing 150 Million Dollars in tuition assistance, education, and career advising programs. Prof Maria Ramirez mom and dad Maria Ramirez to help more employees achieve their dreams. In our national lead, more confusing messages from the white house today over the Government Shutdown that the president said he would gladly force, if not given 5 billion in funding for his border wall. This morning, the White House Press secretary conveyed the president had blinked, saying they didnt need congress to give money for the wall, after all. Then this afternoon, sanders asserted that the white house is frustrated that there hasnt been a vote yet in congress to avoid the Government Shutdown, as if the holdup has not been almost entirely the president s doing this whole time. Cnns Phil Mattingly joins me from the hill. Phil, were four days away from the shutdown. The white house is saying to congress, send us a bill, maybe well sign it, maybe we wont. Whats Congress Going to do . When i relayed what Sarah Sanders said to a republican senator, he said, thats amusing. And the reason why its amusing, they have been frozen over the course of the last week, waiting to find out what the president wants, what the president is willing to sign. Jake, heres where things stand now. For all intents and purposes, biggerpicture negotiations have broken down. And republicans and democrats acknowledge that at this point the only way to avoid a shutdown on friday is likely a shortterm continuation of funding at its current levels into january or perhaps early february. Both democrats and republicans are amenable to that, according to sources im talking to. The real question right now as it has always been, remains, is the president willing to sign that. He obviously wouldnt be getting any wall funding for that. Is he willing to say yes to that . Thats what Mitch Mcconnell said he would try and find out this afternoon. And once they get an answer to that, people on capitol hill should know the pathway forward. Republicans did pitch an idea to democrats about how to fund trumps border wall, but it sounds like democrats think they dont have to go along with anything when it comes to the border wall. Yeah, look, for a brief moment this morning after days of nothing really happening, it seemed like a biggerpicture deal, a sevenbill kind of appropriations process to translate that, a large funding bill, was actually a possibility. The white house and Senate Republicans putting on the table that they would come down from the 5 billion wall funding request the president had, settle for about 1. 6 billion. But they added on another billiondollar fund they could use to pursue their immigration policy. Leader nancy pelosi, Democratic Senate leader chuck schumer, both rejected that, and thats why we are where we are right now. The only solution, both sides say on the table if they want to get out of town friday night is a shortterm solution. And that means if the president agrees to that, we will likely be back in the same place in a matter of weeks. Phil mattingly on capitol hill, thank you so much. Lets talk about this with my experts here. Sanders also commented on other alternative that the white house is looking into to fund the wall. Listen. The president has asked every one of his cabinet secretaries to look for funding that can be used to protect our borders, and give the president the ability to fulfill his constitutional obligation to protect the American People by having a secure border. As i understand it, the only way the president could do that is to go to congress and get the appropriations committees to go along with whatever cabinet secretaries say in terms of heres a billion for you here, a billion for you there. Is that realistic . He could also ask them to fund an older bill from 2006, where many of them did actually vote for physical borders. And then, of course, it was sort of gutted later. Never funded, really. Yeah. So there are some options here. And accident lolook, he was eles not an unpopular promise. A lot of democrats have backed this kind of thing in the past. It would be not a terrible deal to make if they had a strategy for putting this line in the sand and making that deal. But they have no strategy for doing that. So just sort of dances around. Hell get a deal that he doesnt like and then campaign about it on twitter. And by the way, it will be done by friday because they want to go home. We can make this very simple. You dont need to threaten a shutdown fight to do this. You have had money in the bank, a billion or so dollars, you need to put that money to use today. Go down to the border. Show some fencing, show what its going to look like. Rather than threatening a shutdown. Especially when you have Sarah Huckabee sanders at the podium saying we can find the money. If thats true, find the money, dont shut down the government. To be clear, its not true. We have in our government appropriations for a reason. And so if the United States Congress Says this is what you have to use the money for, that is what the department of Homeland Security has to use it for. They dont get to arbitrarily decide where the money goes. Thats why im saying Sarah Huckabee sanders is unqualified. But the president during his Campaign Said mexico was going to pay for the wall. Now all of a sudden we have to find taxpayer dollars to pay for the wall. There are two good faith offers on the table from democrats. One, that the government can pass the six bipartisan proposition bills and pass a resolution for one year for the department of Homeland Security. Or two, pass one continuing resolution for all of the proposition bills for a year and then well still be back here. Those are the options on the table. He aint about to get that wall. And paul, you heard phil said Phil Mattingly said that a republican senator said he found it amusing that Sarah Sanders said they were impatient. Take a listen to Sarah Sanders suggesting theyre tired of waiting for congress to act on the government funding. At this point, the senate has thrown out a lot of ideas. Were disappointing in the fact they have yet to vote on something and pass something. So when they do that, well make a determination on whether or not were going to sign that. To be clear, the republican senators, republican members of the house, have been waiting for President Trump to say what hes willing to sign. Because hes been demanding 5 billion for a border wall. Right. The republicans still control the senate and the house and the white house. And yet theyre sniping at each other. It is simone makes a good point. To your point, mary kathryn. The president cant put up a wall that mexico would pay for. It was so wellknown that the people at his rallies would chant it with him. So we dont have to worry. We, the American People, dont have to pay for it. And the notion that he can somehow impound funds from other agencies is unconstitutional. Article 1, section 8, makes it really clear. Only congress can spend money. Congress appropriates money. He cant say, well we dont need quite so much for veterans or Law Enforcement or disabled children. Im going to take that and build my wall. You cant do that. Congress can spend the money. President s cannot. And he didnt even understand that. I think he has to go back to schoolhouse rock. There are things that have been authorized in the past. This is why you can ask for them to be appropriated. But this is part of the problem with the trust breakdown for anyone who is to the right of center on this issue. Is because these things have been in law before. Authorized, but not funded. They never materialized. Chuck schumer brought this up last week. We gave you 1. 2 billion last year. Where is it . I as a fiscal conservative am somewhat bothered by the fact no one knows what the wall should cost. They asked for 5 billion. I would like to see the 1. 2 billion be put to work now. I dont know why youre waiting. Can we also debunk the notion that somehow americas borders are not secure . I dont know if youve ever left the country, but i leave the country quite often. And every time i come back we have a crisis at the border. There are detention centers. The crisis at the border never forget. Part of this is a manufactured crisis. We can talk about our immigration policy, yes. We have a crisis in terms of our immigration policy. Sure. But its broken in america and needs to be fixed. But the idea that we just have open borders and folks are running up and through the United States of america is not true. They are. Thats how families get separated and we have that whole other crisis. That is not true. What do you mean . There are undocumented immigrants. There are undocumented immigrants. But the idea that there is nothing happening at the border and there is an influx of people there is are you yes. The vast majority people here are here because they overstayed their visa. But ive been to the border and you see people crossing illegally. It does happen. I want to be clear. Im not saying there are no illegal crossers. Theyre saying there are child prison camps and people are at the border in crisis being housed youre saying its not the crisis that President Trump is portraying. Yes. That is exactly what im saying. And every time a republican operative or member of Congress Gets on television and says the democrats are calling for open borders and they just want our borders to be open, im telling you thats not true. Were not going to be able to resolve this problem on this show, because i have to take a break. So thank you so much, one and all. President trump we almost had a deal. We were right there. We were right there. But President Trump promised to help americas veterans at any cost. A new government report out today shows the president is not making good on that promise. How . Stay with us. [speaking in italian]. I just got my ancestrydna results 74 italian. And i found out that im from the big toe of that sexy italian boot calabria. It even shows the migration path from south italia all the way to exotico new jersey so this Holiday Season its ancestrydna per tutti order your kit now at ancestry. Com for a limited time, 50 for them 10 for you. Applebees. Now thats eatin good in the neighborhood. [narrator] meet sharks newest robot vacuum. 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Citizen, as is the boy and the mother is from yemen, one of the seven countries from which travel to the u. S. Is banned. Those close to the mom say shes excited for this win, but, of course, devastated that shes coming to say goodbye to her 2yearold son. In our national lead, ever since the president announced he was running for office, he promised to protect veterans and fix the v. A. With an emphasis on preventing veteran suicides. But a brandnew federal investigation reveals when it comes to one major multimillion dollar effort to reach out to struggling veterans, the Trump Administration has beender el dt in its duty. Reporter 24yearold Army Veteran Jared johns used a handgun to take his own life on september 11th this year. His hometown newspaper reports he left a message saying, im sorry, i messed up. This isnt what i wanted. Like too may others, whatever v. A. Support he sought was not enough to save him. That support for veterans in pain. The commanderinchief has long promised, first on the campaign trail these are our greatest people. Committing suicide. Its not going to be that any more, folks. Were going to take care of our veterans. And then from the oval office. We will not rest until all of americas great veterans receive the care they have earned through their Incredible Service and sacrifice to our country. Reporter but today, a new government report shows a lack of leadership from the Trump Administration is directly impacting the v. A. s ability to reach suicidal veterans. An average of 20 veterans take their own lives every day, according to the v. A. s own findings. Yet the Government Accountability office found that as of september, the Veterans Health administration has spent less than 1 of its 6. 2 million annual budget for Suicide Prevention outreach. My biggest takeaway was the overall decline in effort across multiple lines of effort and their Suicide Prevention media campaign. Reporter the reason . Nobody was around to lead the effort. In a statement to cnn, the v. A. Says, quote, the Suicide Prevention office had no permanent leader for nearly nine months until secretary wilkie arrived as acting secretary in april. Adding, quote, Suicide Prevention is v. A. s highest critical priority and every death by suicide is a tragedy. There are efforts to make aware. Not spending more than 99 of its budget meant there were fewer ads from the v. A. Such as these. Sometimes even the smallest act has the power to change a life. Reporter ads that provide outreach, ads that alert struggling veterans and their families about the existence of programs that could save their lives. In 2015, the v. A. Budget yielded 58 online ads. 30 billboards. 19,000 radio ads. And much more. This year, dramatic decreases, with radio alone plummeting to just eight advertisements. Just that one text. Be there. Your call, your presence. Reporter not only are there fewer commercials to reach veterans, the v. A. Has no clear measure of its campaigns effectiveness, according to this study. That rests with v. A. Leadership, to make sure they have the right people in the positions to make those decisions and carry out the mission. Reporter the v. A. Says its new Suicide Prevention director, dr. Keita franklin, is, quote, reviewing the spending for this Important Program as part of her duties. Dereliction of duty. Before we go, remembering a comedic genius, who with a cursive l on her sweater won the hearts of millions of americans. Today we bid farewell to actress and director penny marshall, who died from complications of diabetes. She had the hit sitcom laverne and shirley. Well, we did take no from that one guy who sicced his dogs on us. They were just poodles. Poodles are mean. How would you like to go through life with a tuft of hair here and there. Penny marshall as a director was a trail blazer, becoming the first woman to direct a film that grossed more than 100 million with the film big in 1988, starring tom hanks, of course, with that famous giant fao schwarz piano and hitting a home run with a league of their own in 1992. The new york native with her characteristic heavy accent overcame a battle with lung cancer. When asked about her legacy, marshall said, quote, i hope i gave you some enjoyment. Penny marshall, you did. And today there is crying in baseball. Penny marshall, gone at the age of 75. Our coverage on cnn continues right now. Thanks for watching. Happening now, breaking news. Justice delayed. A courtroom shocker as a judge lays into Michael Flynn, castigating the former National Security adviser and postponing his sentencing for lying to the fbi. Not concerned. The white house reacts by dismissing flynns crime, and appears to suggest the fbi entrapped him with the president wishing flynn good luck. Crumbling foundation. President trumps personal Charitable Foundation agrees to dissolve under Court Supervision as it faces a lawsuit alleging mr. Trump and his oldest children use the organization as, quote, little more than a checkbook. And too early to tell