Yeah, thats for sure. Thats kind of the story of your life and this is part of it. Welcome to the axe files. Good to see you again here in your hometown in las vegas. Let me ask you and you watch the news from washington these days and find yourself saying, man, id love to be back there now. I believe in the Old Testament verbiage that theres a time for sowing, a time for harvesting, reaping. I enjoyed every minute of the senate but thats not where i am now. The senate is not my senate, and its really been damaged significantly. What do you think now as youre watching the story of the moment which is this ukraine story unfold . Are you shocked, are you surprised . No, theres nothing in this administration that surprises me anymore. The answer is no. Its not often in the history of the United States a president selfimpeaches. You cant go to a Foreign Government and have them investigate your opponent. So his answer is, yeah, so i did it and i was investigating corruption. And then came out and said china should do this as well. Theres a brazenness to his response. When you have not one whistleblower and now theres two, maybe three who have alleged with their whistle blowing that crime has been committed, and all you have to do is have a basic understanding of the law in america, and you cant do what he did and go unpunished. Do you think that he was withholding aid as leverage to pressure the ukrainians . Of course. Thats what he did. The evidence is very clear. So you concur with Speaker Pelosi in beginning these impeachment proceedings . I think nancy pelosi when i was leader she was speaker for the first time. Ive never worked with anyone as visionary as she is, and she has absolute control of her caucus. She has set an example for everybody else. The president suggested this week that shes also guilty of treason and called her nervous nancy. But she hasnt looked nervous to me at all. Nancy pelosi is true patriot. I found her to be someone who really understands the issues and somebody who is courageous enough to carry them forward. She doesnt do anything on the fly. She is prepared and has her troops in order before she does anything. The consensus opinion, and trump has amplified this is that if this were to go to the United States senate, that theres almost zero chance that he would be convicted because it would require 20 republicans to concur. Is that your read as well . One of the things that im disappointed in about washington is what the senate has become and also disappointed with what the republican senators have not become. They have not become the republican senators who did what they thought was the right thing to do. And these republicans are afraid to speak out against things he does that are absolutely wrong and they know theyre wrong. The omperson weve gotten to say anything is mitt romney and sasse has said something of nebraska. Other that that, they dont say anything. If there is an impeachment trial and the evidence is compelling do you think there will be some republicans that will vote for conviction . That depends on what evidence that is put forward. Its not that simple. You know, i served as a juror on the impeachment of bill clinton. Its a very formal proceeding and a lot depends on how well the managers do to presenting that case to the senate. So, yes, i think a dees want case can be presented to the sept but unless something changes dramatically, the republicans are afraid trump will question them in a primary and and theyre more afraid of being reelected than doing the right thing for the country. Lindsey graham was someone you worked closely with across the aisle and youve said nice things about him in the past. Hes become a very staunch supporter of the president. I just told you have zero problems with the phone call. To impeach any president over a phone call like this would be insane. Its amazing what happened to him when john mccain died. He suddenly was no longer a john mccain republican. He became a South Carolina i want to get reelected republican. And he is a tote and fetch guy for the president. I said such admiration for him. Im so disappointed in what has happened to him. His whole personality has changed since john passed. Setting aside the substance of these matters you have to acknowledge he has i always call it a ferrule genius but his strategy here is to say im not corrupt, theyre corrupt. Theyre the ones guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors, and its to muddy the waters. Its a cynical strategy but might it be an effective one . I used to think that donald trump was not too smart. I certainly dont believe that anymore. I dont think hes ipt lecktually a powerhouse but hes basically a very, very smart man. No matter what the subject any argument he involves himself in its on his terms. If youre always arguing against him, he never, ever is willing to debate an issue on terms that arent his. So how do you deal with that, if youre a candidate running, for example, how would you advise they deal with that . What i say initially and say it right here on your show anyone who thinks trump is going to be beaten easily should have another thing coming. He is a man who has a stalwart 40 people out there who will vote for him no matter what he does. As donald trump said i could shoot somebody in times square, they would still support me. Thats sad but probably true. So i number one, i repeat he is not going to be beaten easily. Hes going to take a campaign of wisdom and patience but he is beatable for sure. You mentioned the bill clinton impeachment trial in 1998. There is this theory that is somewhat myth and reality that republicans paid a price for that in the fall of 1998 and that they lost seats in their election. They should have gained seats. Are there risks here for democrats . David, ive heard that argument and i dont agree with it. And heres why. The reason that bill clinton didnt get hurt on impeachment because it was such a weak ground. It was a sexual relationship supposedly with a girl in the white house. It wasnt supposedly. He acknowledged it eventually. Yeah, but it wasnt as if he was bringing her to the lincoln room. It was an issue dealing with impeachment people felt it wasnt Strong Enough to bring an impeachment proceeding. With whats alleged against trump it is cleary a crime what hes done. And i think its a tremendous difference. This whole thing at its core an attempt to weaken joe biden as a candidate whos leading him in the polls right now. And he has thrust front and center these questions about hunter biden. These questions of corruption have been debunked by a lot of the media. But there are these questions why hunter biden was even involved in ukraine. Is this going to be a problem for biden in the longterm, this repetitive meme out there . Joe biden has a lot of strong suits. But one of the things that joe biden is admired for is his life story. Hes had a lot of lot of difficult times in his life. And i think for now someone to pick on as remaining son that he basically helped raise after the boys mother was killed, i think theyve gone too far. I dont think anyones going to accept the fact that joe bidens son is some kind of person thats going to drag down joe biden. I dont think so. But you would agree it probably wasnt that prude want for hunter to be accepting large fees from a ukrainian oligarch while his father was vice president. I think its not something thats going to help joe. Coming up on the ax e files. I can remember the first time i heard his name. I said what are you talking about . Barack obama, what kind of name is that . Is your daughter ok . Thats where i felt relief. 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Help stop the clock on further irreversible joint damage. Talk to your rheumatologist. Right here. Right now. Humira. Mom youve got to [ get yourself a new car. G ] i wish i could save faster. Youre making good choices. Youll get there. Were you going to tell me about this . I know i cant afford to go. I still have this car so you can afford to go. I am so proud of you. Thanks. Principal. We can help you plan for that. Start today at principal. Com. Theyre americas bpursuing lifechanging cures. In a country that fosters innovation here, they find breakthroughs. Like a way to fight cancer by arming a patients own tcells. Because its not just about the next breakthrough. Its all the ones after that. I was told to begin my aspirin regimen, blem. And i just didnt listen. Until i almost lost my life. My doctors again ordered me to take aspirin, and i do. Be sure to talk to your doctor before you begin an aspirin regimen. Listen to the doctor. Take it seriously. The lexus es. Every curve, every innovation, every feeling. A product of mastery. Lease the 2019 es 350 for 379 month for 36 months. Experience amazing at your lexus dealer. So i want to talk to you about this 2020 race. Where do you think the race is right now . Well, its joe piebidens ra to lose. She was taking tens of thousands of selfie pictures with people every time she gets a chance, so shes doing very well. You said shes doing well here in nevada. Shes doing very well in nevada. I recall getting a call from senator barack obama in spring 2006 and he came from a meeting with you. He said he inkurmged me to run for president. I can remember the first time i ever heard his name. I was in the house gym. I was a retired member, i was in the senate but i went to the house gym for many years. He said ive got the greatest person going to run for the u. S. Senate. And i said who could that be . He said his name is barack obama. I said what are you talking about . Barack obama, what kind of a name is that . Thats exactly what i said to him. I say this about barack obama, but understand his response to me was not done in a form of being a braggart, being c conceited. He was giving a speech and i walked to his desk and i was standing and i said, senator, that was a really good speech. He looked at me so seriously and he said yes, i have a gift. Now, i know that sounds like who the hell does he think he is, but think about that. This man has a gift of communication. He has that. Before he came to the senate he wrote a couple of books. Who wrote a book about his growing up and they were best sellers. And he didnt have somebody write the book. He wrote it. So i had a sense that barack obama, it was a time for someone as articulate as he, someone who could really command an audience, i just felt it was a time for barack obama he also opposed the iraq war which was an asset. You also had something to do with Elizabeth Warren being where lElizabeth Warren is righ now. You recruited her, head of the Oversight Panel on the bank bail out. You recruited her on the senate race. I read some stuff, basically a couple of reviews of her book and i was fascinated about that. The two income trap about the middle class. So i called her and she said she was doing a party for some of her students at her home. And i called her, you know, i dont have a very loud voice and she couldnt hear me very well. She said whos this, and i said im the majority leader of the sept. I said i want you to come visit me in washington. So she came down, brought her daughter with her. Told her i want to put her on my debt commission, and she said ill take it, and she was immediately confirmed as a chair of that board and did such a good job. She was good. So good that we did the don frank wall street reform bill and she came up an i. D. To have a Consumer Affairs department. Right. And we thought that would be a good spot for her. President obama wanted to put her there. And he did to set the thing up. But we couldnt get her the job because some republicans and frankly a couple of democrats opposed her. Why did they oppose her . Well, she damn sure knew more than they knew and they were afraid of her. She knew wall street, and wall street they were up in arms she mind ruin our country. I think she proved that what they should have done, they should have given her the job. Because they didnt give her the job, we had a run for the senate. She said shed still be there if theyd given her the job. But they didnt do that. I think shes overcome a lot of the concern people had about her. She was in the sen. I put her on the banking committee. Some people said you shouldnt do that, shes a flamethrower. She never surprised anybody, never surprised the Ranking Member of the committee of the bank. Shes a team player. You put her in leadership as well. Sure did. As Linden Johnson said hed rather have them inside of the te tent because its better to have them pissing out then pissing in. And theres a concern as well expressed by some establishment democrats that she is too far left. I think thats lets just wait. For example, medicare for all, asked how do you feel about i said what we need to do first is make sure obamacare is strengthening. Republicans have done everything they can to hurt it. Lets strengthen it. We almost got the public option the first time. Thats not what shes saying, though. I think give her some time. I think shes not in love with that. I think youll wait and see how that all turns out. So you think shes more pragmatic in. I know shes more pragmatic. Do you think the party itself, theres this lament the party is drifting left. You and i have been involved in politics for a long time. I know whats happening now is no different than whats happened in years past. Primaries theyre always pulled to the left, thats what parties to do the candidates. So when you decided to retire from the senate, you said i want to go out on the top of my game, i dont want to be a 42yearold trying to become a designated hitter which i loves a baseball fan. I love the reference and i know youre a baseball fan as well. But joe biden and Bernie Sanders are older now than you are then, and as we speak senator sanders are recovering from a heart attack and we obviously wish him for a speedy recovery. But let me ask you an indelicate question. Knowing what you know about that job, are they too im not really concerned about age. You know, you take president carters now 95 years old, still very active. Im not really sold on a certain age means youre not qualified for the job. I think the race is joe bidens to lose. Ahead on the axe files. Im the only senator in the history of the world that learned to thats some great paint. Thats some great paint. 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Shed gone through some of his belongings and sent me pictures of me in searchlight. I couldnt believe thats how i was raised. I couldnt believe it. I mean, the house was just made out of railroad tiles that had been picked up from the railroad. No running water. And no inside toilet of course. And i didnt realize until i saw this picture, damn, i didnt realize it was that bad. It was a mining town that got down on its luck. The number one industry when i was a boy there was prostitution. At one time there were 13 brothels in searchlight, 13. And how many people in the whole town . 200. Because it was during the time when they had military bases in southern nevada. And on payday that place would be like Grand Central station. Did you know as a kid what was going on . Well, yes, i did. But i thought its not much different there than anyplace else. Im the only senator in the history of the world that learned to swim in a house swimming pool. And they moved the pool in order to accommodate the brothel. Thats true. Tla only had school up to 8th grade. And no kindergarten. But you had to hitchhike 45 miles to go to high school. So i didnt do it every day, but i did do it. As a young kid you came to henderson right outside of las vegas where you 46 miles away. And some things happened there that were life changing. One is you met your wife, landra. Tell me about that. You know, i came over from searchlight dressed different than the other kids. My hair wasnt the same. But people were pretty nice to me. And ive had a lot of elections, but the most important election in my life i was a junior in high school and i was elected junior class treasurer. I know that sounds like nothing to anybody else, but to me id finally been accepted. That was to me the most important election of my life. Before we leave searchlight, i need to talk to you about your dad in particular. He was a miner, he was a brawler, he was a drinker. You wrote you needed to intervene at times to protect your mother from your dad. It sounded like a very, very difficult environment for a kid. Well, my dad was a big tough guy, drank way too much. There were times when it became necessary for my brother and i to intervene. Now, oneonone we couldnt have taken our dad, but poegt of us could so we didnt hit him. We took him down. He was so mad, but he couldnt handle the two of us. Because you didnt want him to lay hands on your mom. Thats right. Thats why we did it in the first place. So he meant well. My dad was never physically abusive to me, but i can remember one of the best days of my life turned out being one of the worst. I had the opportunity to go to Caesars Palace here in las vegas. I had the good fortune of being able to come and spend two hours with mohamed ali. He was in his trunks, had a bathrobe on and was getting ready to go spar. And you were a boxer. Oh, yeah, so i had such a good time with him. And he was so personable, so nice. I left there and wept back to my office. As i walked in joni shay was the receptionist at my office, she said your moms on the phone. I picked the phone up and she said your pop shot himself. And so he was dead at that time, so had to go out and was on the bed there, blood all over. He was still there when you got there. Yeah. So i remember that. Now, suicide was something that happens to other people. And thats the way it is with people who have a loved one that commits suicide. Never do you expect it. Yes. But i learned a lot about suicide. But it took me quite a while to acknowledge that my dad killed himself. Yes. And it wasnt until we had a hearing, we were doing a hearing on senior depression. And during that hearing mike wallace testified, the famous journalist, he said, you know, i wanted to die for years. Suffered from depression. Yes, and he said now and i talk to somebody once in a while, i take some medication, i want to live. First i acknowledged my dad committed suicide, and that hearing was so important. We have done so little to understand suicide. My father committed suicide as well, senator, and i was 19 years old when it happened. I didnt talk about it for 30 years. And it was a terrible mistake because i know. Theres a stigma associated with it that is terribly unfair and wrong. Its not a defective character. Its Mental Illness and it has to be treated like any other illness. And as we look back, if we had known what we were doing, we could have seen this coming because he was a terribly withdrawn, introvert his whole life. And hed been sick and killed himself. You went to law school. Yes. In the east after graduating from utah state. Thats right. And you had what in retrospect is an incredibly ironic job to put yourself through law school. I was a policeman. Capital police. So your job was to protect members of congress. Yes. You came back to nevada and you were practicing law and you pretty quickly got involved in politics. First on a hospital governance board, then the state legislator. And by the time you were 30 you were Lieutenant Governor of nevada. That was a race up and were getting ready for reelection and one of them says to me why dont you run for Lieutenant Governor . And i said Lieutenant Governor, i never thought about it before. And before i had left there they talked about a press release and i was running for Lieutenant Governor. I went home. And i said landra, im running for Lieutenant Governor. That was it. And four years later youre 34 years old, you run for the United States senate. In a year that was a historically good democratic year in the midst of watergate and you lost. By 524 votes. And then one year later you lost a race for mayor of las vegas. Youre on your way up and by the time youre 35 youre a twotime loser. Did you think that was the end of your political career . I thought about it, but one reason i worked so hard to make sure it wasnt the case, so i dywad didnt want those bastards to believe theyd buried me early. So my friend Michael Callahan who was a mentor of yours. Your history teacher, youre boxing coach. He was the only mentor i really ever had. And he appointed me state gaming commission, and i was chairman of that. And that was a time of very, very difficult time in the history of the state of nevada. Organized crime came out of the wood work. We always thought it was here and it was here big time. And i survived through that. Yeah, you survived through it. Youre being modest. Your friend the governor appointed you head of the Gambling Commission and you almost got killed doing it. Oh, yeah, they put a bomb on our car. And as you point out it was your wife who saw some suspicious wires the car wasnt running very well and shes not much of a mechanic and thats an understatement. And she lifted up the hood and she could see these wires down there. So she stopped and the fire truck came, fire engines and police came and i can still see my little boy. He was 5 years old at the time, looking out the window and seeing all the police and everything and i know that had an impact on his life. When you finally got elected to congress, what, 1982 . Yes. There was a new district from the Las Vegas Area and you got elected. Everything must have seemed like childs play after dealing with the mob. I love that job so much. I kept thinking am i going to have to pay somebody . I should be paying somebody. Theyre paying me to do this. It was just so wonderful. Up next on the axe files. I think clooney elected trump. He was afraid to take a stand and fear of peag seen as a partisan and he wound up hurting everybody. Because when youre ready for what comes next, the only direction is forward. What might seem like a small cough can be a big bad problem for your grandchildren. Babies too young to be vaccinated against whooping cough are the most at risk for severe illness. Help prevent this talk to your doctor or pharmacist today about getting vaccinated against whooping cough. Thats ensure max protein, or pharmacist today with high protein and 1 gram sugar. Its a situp, banana bend at the waist im tryin keep it up. Youll get there. Whoahoahoa 30 grams of protein, and one gram of sugar. Ensure max protein. count time for one chore [thunder crashing], ah ahh my mower burke the number one. Seen it, covered it. At farmers insurance, we know a thing or two because weve seen a thing or two. bert mmm. We are farmers. Bumpadum, bumbumbumbum in the preface of your autobiography you wrote about and im quoting now a presidency that tested our values, usurped our rights as americans and issued an a era of crippling partisan rancor and you called the president a liar. These were not the comments about the incumbent president. These were comments that you made in 2008 about george w. Bush. President bush is coming to nevada today, and ive written him a letter. What i in this letter said to him i was the leader, you were president and we knocked heads. I look back with such nostalgia to those days pause i lament the fact youre not there now and thats how i feel about it. Hes going to check thea t n thenticity of the letter. He knows a lot of what we did was partisan bickering. I had a job to do. It does speak to the fact this molt has been building up for some time. Trump did want create this moment. He exploited it perhaps, he exacerbated it. I said this people think trump createed the Republican Congress. Thats not true. The Republican Congress created trump. Look at the senate today. They do nothing. You cant vote an an amendment, and thats why i wrote an oped for the New York Times saying filibuster is gone, might as well accept it. Its not a question if its going to be gone, its when and its gone. The senate as weve known it is gone. The senate is going to come to the house of representatives and its not the end of the world. Instead of having 60 vote threshold, itll be a 50 vote threshold. Its still going to be good but understand its not going to be the way it was. Talk to me about Mitch Mcconnell. He was your counterpart throughout your time as leader. He held up the Merrick Garland nomination for the better part of a year and said you wouldnt take it up. Mitch mccomand i were a lot together in leadership when he was a whip he was a republican leader when i was democratic leader. So i know Mitch Mcconnell very well, and im not going to disparage him today but i have been disappointed. I think what he did with the Supreme Court is something that will go down in history as a very dark time in the history of this country. Hes now said he wouldnt do that if there were an opportunity to appoint another judge. That doesnt say much then, and thats not a positive thing for mitch. Back in 2016 you were briefed as were the other leaders on what russia was up to in our election. You were more outspoken about it than anyone else. There was a time when the president wanted all four leaders, republicans and democrats to sign a joint statement about this and to issue a warning to russia. Why didnt that happen . J. Johnson came to brief us with the fbi and others. The Homeland Security director. Thats right, a very fine man. And he was there to tell us that the russians were interfering in our elections and he thought every governor should reach out to him for help to make sure the elections are protected. And i wanted a letter written by me and mcconnell and mitch wouldnt sign the letter. Did he say why . He said the elections should stay out of it and he got a letter it was so weak, it was meaningless. Do you think he felt that it would disadvantage trump if there was such a i dont think it was trump. I think he believes that it would disadvantage the republicans. One thing you and the president agree on is neither of you were that crazy about the way jim comey handled the elections at the fbi. I think comey elected trump. I think that hes a republican, he didnt want to seem he was partisan, and he was so unfair so hes the cause of her not winning in my opinion. Because the charge from the trump side is he was the one that started this investigation and it was partisanly motivated against trump. I think he was afraid to take a stand for fear he would be seen as a partisan, and he wondd up hurting everybody. It was a really bad move. And every time i see him in a selfrighteous manner talking about people should do the right thing. How much culpability do you feel for some of the partisan rancor . You mentioned earlier you regretted some of the things youd said about president bush but you did what you needed to do in the role that you were in. I dont really i dont go back and lament what i did or didnt do. I did what i did. I dont go back and say i could have been nicer, i could have been meaner. I just did at the time what i thought was the right thing, and thats the one thing about me, david. No one ever had to guess how i stood on an issue. I was always very, very candid about how i felt. The vote you said you most regretted was the vote to authorize the war in iraq. The war in iraq was the worst Foreign Policy blunder in the history of the country. And i feel the biggest mistake i med legislatively was voting for that. Within a week or ten at the most i realized id been misled. General p general powell, my friend misled me and i became a tremendous opponent of the war. I think that what that war did destabilized that part of the world and now its redamaged europe. We have no one knows how many iraqis have been killed but hundreds of thousands, millions displaced. The whole middle east is in a state of turmoil. What do you think of the president s decision earlier in the week to pull out of Northern Syria and leave the kurds to i mean he did this in a tweet in the middle of the night some time. This is one where hes getting Republican Opposition as well. Well, thank goodness. Im happy to hear that because, you know, the kurds have been our allies. The kurds have been people we depend on. Theyre the only good fighters in iraq. And to pull the rug out from under them is just not right. The Affordable Care act there are very few people who had as much to do with its passage as you. There were other issues that people wanted to take up, cap and trade on climate change, Immigration Reform, and you hear in retrospect well they should have taken most things up in the first two years. But i remember getting a call from you explaining why you couldnt and what the Senate Calendar would endure. But i also had to endure barack obama pause this good man told me i would call and say i cant get the Health Care Bill done, and he would say its more important than my reelection. Weve got to get it done so i felt tremendous pressure to get it done. And having been raised the way i was with no health care, my mother had no teeth. I cant haej how she must have worried about it. I did as a little boy. So health care was something we had to get done. And it was one of the landmark piece of legislation in the history of this country. Were the votes there in those two years when you had 59, 60 democratic senators. Could you have passed comprehensive Immigration Reform out of the senate . It was all we could to get the Health Care Bill done. We could not have stuck in there Immigration Reform. We couldnt have stuck in cap on trade. We just couldnt do it. Up next. You were diagnosed in the spring of 2018. Lost my hair. You said when they find cancer in your pancreas, youre dead. 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Thats some great paint. Thats some great paint. Behr, ranked 1 in Customer Satisfaction with interior paints. Right now get incredible savings on behr marquee interior. Exclusively at the home depot. I remember being here in las vegas at the end of the campaign in 2012. You asked to see president obama. I think you wanted him to cut a radio ad for the individual running for senate in hawaii. We met behind the stage in the arena. I remember that. You in typically efficient manner made the case for why you needed him to do it. He agreed to do it. Then there was this moment of silence and you reached out and you gave him a hug. Yes. And, you know, my sense is that youre not that frequent a hugger. That that is not your way. And i was touched by that moment. He, for me, stood for everything good about america. I have been in government my whole life. I never came across anyone that changed the country and the world as much as he did. You seemed to have almost a fillial relationship, a pride in him and maybe part of it is you helped launch the whole endeavor. Well, i dont hesitate to say on this show, i dont care who is listening, and this is something i dont throw around very often, but i love barack obama. I really do. Mantoman, i love barack obama. No one else could do what he did. He did it alone. Of course, he had help. He overcame a lot. From the time he was a boy in hawaii raised by his white grandmother, at the time he was a became known as an intellectual genius at harvard. He did it on his own. Youre someone who has your own extraordinary story. You like people who have a history, who have a story, who overcome things. I love the stories of barack obama. You are wearing a hat. You were diagnosed in the spring of 2018. I lost my hair. Yes. With cancer. Yes. And you said, when they find cancer in your pancreas youre dead. Were hear 17 months later and you are very much alive. Well, you know, one of my friends wrote a very long column for the New York Times. In effect he said hes dead. And i think i sailed at the time, im mark twain, the rumors of my death are exaggerated. You know, in the last three or four years theyve come up with tremendous medical advances that i have the good fortune of being part of now and, you know, my cancer is not in remission but im still doing okay. And the future doesnt look so bad right now. I remember a story you told president obama when he first took office. You said you were a boxer as a young man and you said i wasnt the fastest and i wasnt the strongest. But i knew how to take a punch. Yeah. Thats for sure. That is kind of the story of your life. And this is part of it. Part of it was, david, my nose. I had a great nose for fighting. There is very little nose in my nose so i have been hit in the face so many times. I have never, ever had a bloody nose. Youve been knocked out in other ways in life. Yeah. Ive been knocked down. And losing elections please and a range of other things. So that may have something to do with the fact that youre sitting here with me today. You know after that bad diagnosis. The last time i ran, i said the bastards left me alone i probably wouldnt run again but they thought i couldnt win so i ran and i beat them. How do you hope youll be remembered . David, i have five children. I have 19 grandchildren. I want those children and grandchildren to understand what a love affair ive had with my little wife. She is the most wonderful human being. Im sure there have been marriages as happy as ours, but none happier. I am still in love with my wife after having been married 60 years as i was when we were teenagers when we met. More important than any of your public accomplishments. Oh, yeah. Thats all i want is people to remember that he had a great marriage and that was a good example for others. And i hope that is the case because ive had a love affair with this little woman for a long, long time. You know, one of the things that was your signature, you would finish a conversation and you would be gone. But you never president obama still jokes about that, hanging up on him. But here is the way it is. Im not much for small talk. Conversation was over. Wed done our business. There is no need to talk anymore. I would just say not even a goodbye. No. Not most of the time. The conversation was over. Well, in keeping with that tradition, senator, im not going to say goodbye. Im just going to say thank you and i look forward to seeing you down the line. David, thank you for being a friend. For more of the conversation you can visit luminary podcast. Com. You are live in the cnn newsroom. Im in for ana cabrera. Now, he is the other man at the center of the impeachment saga. The president s personal attorney rudy guiliani. Today he told cnn that he is not aware of being under any sort of investigation despite reports that federal prosecutors are looking closely at his work with ukraine. That of course is the country where he was trying to dig up dirt on joe biden for his boss the president. At one point even President Trump seemed to be trying to distance himself from guiliani. Listen. We