How would your administration protect americans with preexisting conditions to have access to affordable insurance if the Affordable Care act is struck down . Well, thank you, susan, but let me just say addressing your very first question, i couldnt be more proud to serve as Vice President to a president who stands without apology for the sanctity of human life. Okay. Were going to hear from both campaigns in just minutes. Also this morning the president we know has returned to the oval office from isolation in the white house residence despite the fact that hes almost certainly still contagious, shedding the virus wherever he goes. Now cnn has new details about the president s desire to return to the campaign trail with actual rallies being discussed. Would it be safe to hold a rally right now . Almost nowhere. Look at that map right there, you can see the orange, all the states where there are cases on the rise, the beige the states where cases are steady. Scott jennings, a cnn political commentator, and cnn White House Correspondent kaitlan collins. I want to start with the breaking news which comes from the commission on president ial debates which says that the next president ial debate which is scheduled for thursday if it happens will be a virtual affair, which is to say that the candidates will be in separate locations with voters in a town hall format asking them questions remotely. This is because the president is, as of now, contagious. Kaitlan collins, to you. What do you expect the white house response will be to this and just mark the moment. I mean, this in and of itself is a statement of where we are which is it is unsafe to be near the president of the United States. Yeah, the medical experts, i believe, will say this is a wise decision. We had heard back and forth over whether or not that should be held in person in just a week from today, but notably what the statement does not say is that the Trump Campaign or Biden Campaign has agreed to t its hard to say that the president s advisers are going to be enthusiastic about this because there had been some talk about this beforehand or after in the aftermath of that first debate and it was not something that the president s advisers wanted to see and they noticeably have not said a word about this since the statement came out from the organizers of the debate, that it is going to be held virtually because of course the Trump Campaigns argument has been that the president is stronger when he is in person and can respond that way. It will be noticeable. This not only gives the opportunity for less interruptions on the president s behalf, something that the campaign was publicly enthusiastically about but were concerned about how they were going to navigate that in the second debate with voters present, but also it is going to be in and of itself sending this message that the reason this is going conducted virtually is because the president got covid19. Its going to be hard for anyone watching this not to be thinking ba that constantly because thats the reason joe biden and donald trump will not be in the same room together. It changes the entire face of the debate, obviously. President trump has just responded to this for the first time, we have not heard it yet, lets hear what he has to say. I heard that the commission a little while ago changed the debate style and thats not acceptable to us. I beat him easily in the first debate according to the polls that ive seen, but i beat him easily, i felt i beat him easily, i think he felt it, too. He wouldnt answer any questions and he had the protection of Chris Wallace all night long. I thought Chris Wallace was a disaster. But i beat him in the first debate, in the second debate we have a never trumper as a host, but thats okay because i would beat him in the second debate also and but im not going to do a virtual debate. Okay. Well, there was the news. Paul, does he have a choice . No. First lets cut the president a break here. Thats just the steroids talking. Okay . They have to do this. He is diseased. He is sick. He is infectious. Also he has covid. No sense that you could put a person in a room with donald trump. The white house, its 1,100 people on 1,600 acres. More covid cases in the white house than the country of new zealand plus taiwan plus vietnam, 124 Million People. This guy is a super spreader. He is a menace. He cant be out among people. He is a menace to Public Health. Just to remind people what the breaking news is because this is now a thing, the commission on president ial debates has said that if there is going to be a president ial debate next week as scheduled thursday night it would have to be virtual with the candidates appearing in remote locations. We just heard the president , scott jennings, say no. No. Thats not acceptable to me. It is interesting because as kaitlan points out the imagery of it would be you are in remote locations because the president is a threat to peoples health, but to say no, to refuse to debate in this way, which is deemed safe, how risky is that for the president to be seen as dodging this opportunity to engage with joe biden . Well, i mean, a couple things. Number one, if you consider that he didnt win the first debate or that it didnt turn out well for him in the polls its not risky at all. Number two, if you already consider that there are very few persuadable voters left out there it may not matter that much. Number three, i suspect the optics are secondary and the concern is like were having a conversation right now, if you decide you dont like what im saying you could mute my microphone or turn me off. If only. Please dont. Dont thanos me. I suspect what trump is worried about is the concept that he wants to try to engage i will use an industry term they pot his mic down and he wont be able to control it. I dont know if they are going to have this debate or not but i suspect that conversation of who is going to be in control of the mike tones will be front and center. Kaitlan, what a strange moment where the Virtual Reality meets sur reality. It was already going to be a different kind of debate than what we saw, it was a town hall so they were going to be able to address voters concerns. I dont think that President Trump was going to be able to interrupt or steam roll voters in the way that he had done in the first debate, but now, i mean, just the imagine it. We have all been on these zoom calls where the audio doesnt work, the signal goes out, it freezes. I mean, this is what might be happening a week from now. And i honestly dont think it would be that bad of a backdrop for the president to be somewhere in the white house doing this debate with a more president ial backdrop for voters to look at. I think it could actually work well, but the president is clearly opposed to this, he says he is not going to be doing a virtual debate so that is huge. We may not see these candidates do a debate next week as they are scheduled, but if you want to see how the president is viewing this, he also just said in these comments that he felt like he could do a rally tonight. He says he wanted to do a rally last night which was during the Vice President ial debate. That is how the president is viewing his diagnosis with covid. Its not even been one week since the president announced he had covid19 and had tested positive. This is the fateful day last week when hope hicks learned she was positive, the president still went to that fundraiser anyway and he is saying he feels like he could do a rally tonight. If that gives you an indication of how we were talking about the Trump Campaign wants to see the president back on the road around that debate next week, that was something they were already talking about and the president is making clear he not only wanted to get back in the oval office, get back to the white house, he also wants to get back on the campaign trail and return to holding these rallies despite the condemnation that hes faced since he got covid and of course weve seen the trail of events since then, but it is big news, the president is saying he is backing out of doing a debate if its going to be held virtually which i dont think the commission on president ial debates is going to back off of. Yeah, i would be surprised if they backed off after making this statement. And, again, the news this morning isnt just that the Commission Says they want to do it virtually, its that the president says, no, its not going to happen, he is not going to show up. He wont do it. And the politics of that are fascinating, paul. Scott does raise an interesting point which is maybe the president is better off not debating, however, if you are down you have to do something to change it up. Didnt you guys send a guy in a chicken suit around hounding people in 1992 . When you avoid or choose not to debate, usually it ends up being a thing that comes back to haunt you. A lot of trumps appeal to his base is that he poses as a strong man and a strong man shouldnt run away from a fight. Every politician has their strengths and weaknesses, trumps strengths is his rallies, he shouldnt do one because its a menace to Public Health, joes strength is personal intimate connections oneonone with voters. Thats what a town hall does. Joe biden loses more in this format, he is the empathetic guy, trump is terrible at that, hes not empathetic at all. This shift is a big win for trump, he can clothe himself in the grandeur of the white house and he doesnt have to look at what he called disgusting people. Thats what he called his own supporters according to olivia troy who worked for the Vice President on the task force for coronavirus. Actually if he could take a breath, chill, he would see this is actually a big win for him and takes away bidens greatest strength which is his ability to relate to people in a personal setting. I wouldnt say just because President Trump said something at 8 00 a. M. Eastern time on a thursday that we should take that to the bank for whats going to happen a week from now. Do you think he will cave . Do you think he will show up . I think the president often says two things that are contradictory so he can never be wrong. I mean, i think we know that from his style. He might Say Something completely different in his next interview. We just dont know. But that was his we do have his first response, his first blush response was, no, im not going to do that, but we will see after he talks to his advisers and it marinates. I can see its marinating with you, john berman. I dont think it will happen. Scott jennings, kaitlan collins, paul begala, thank you very much. It is time to fact check the candidates, last hour we discussed Vice President mike pence now we take a closer look at senator Kamala Harriss claims and john avalon has our reality check. Hi again, john. Hey, guys. Last nights vp debate was a game of donnell ball, quick pivots, hits and misses. The economy is still issue number one in the election and here was Kamala Harriss attack. Because of a socalled trade war with china america lost 300,000 manufacturing jobs. We are in a manufacturing recession. Relationship status on this one is complicated. Under President Trump we saw an initial gain of 483,000 manufacturing jobs, but manufacturing was in a recession back in january after trade war losses and before covid. Since then weve seen the bottom fall out, giving trump a net loss of 164,000 manufacturing jobs today. Now, pence pressed harris on whether a Biden Administration would try to pack the Supreme Court and she, like biden in the last debate, wouldnt answer. Thats probably because they want to leave the option open regardless its a question for Congress Rather than the president , but its an open question. And then theres this hit. They would impose the Green New Deal. They want to abolish fossil fuels and ban fracking. Biden does have a 1. 7 trillion Climate Change proposal that calls fournette zero Carbon Emissions by 2050 but its not the same as the Green New Deal which he opposes. His plan has no federal jobs guarantees or singlepayer health care, for example and like wise biden does not support a ban on fracking but Kamala Harris did support a ban on fracking on public lands while running for senate. We actually do know what failure looks like in a pandemic. It was 2009, the swine flu arrived in the United States. Okay. If thats got you scratching your head its because there were about 60 million swine flu cases in obamas first year but there were just under 12,500 deaths. I compared that to more than 211,000 in the current covid crisis its just not the same thing. But perhaps the biggest whopper of the night occurred in this exchange. Lets talk about respecting the American People. You respect the American People when you tell them the truth. You respect the American People when you have the courage which weve always done. To be a leader. Weve always done. All right. There are about 20,000 reasons to call bs on that claim. If only there was a quote to sum up the problem with this spin. Youre entitled to your own opinion but you are not entitled to your own facts. And thats your reality check. John, thank you very much for bringing us all of that. I know you had a late night. Okay. Pete buttigieg played the part of mike pence do you recall senator harris debate prep. Did he get it right in mayor pete joins us live next. Ack my now with the ww app, you can use voice commands. Get personalized recipes and more lose weight the way thats easiest for you. Join for free and get three months free hurry offer ends october 12th try optum perks. Its a new way to save up to 80 . And everyone can do it. Its from optum, a Health Care Company thats trusted by millions of people. You dont have to sign up for anything. Just go to optumperks. Com. And get a coupon to use at your pharmacy. Thats it. I opted in. I opted in. You can, too. Opt in and save big today. Breaking news. The Biden Campaign says the former Vice President will participate in a virtual debate. Again, the president ial Debate CommissionJust Announced that if a debate is to happen next thursday night as scheduled, it will be virtual, remote. Both candidates in separate remote locations. Why . Because the president has coronavirus and at least as of now we expect is still contagious, so the Biden Campaign says that the Vice President would do it, but President Trump just moments ago said no. Listen. I heard that the commission a little while ago changed the debate style and thats not acceptable to us. Youre not going to participate . No, im not going to waste my time on a virtual debate. Thats not what debating is all about, you sit behind a computer and do a debate, its ridiculous and then they cut you off whenever they want. Again, that was the statement from the president , the Biden Campaign their statement reads, Vice President biden looks forward to speaking directly to the American People and comparing his plan for bringing the country together and Building Back better with Donald Trumps failed leadership on the coronavirus that has thrown the Strong Economy he inherited into the worst downturn since the great depression. Again, the Biden Campaign says that biden will or would do the virtual debate. Joining me now is former democratic president ial candidate pete buttigieg. He stood in for Vice President pence during the debate prep for senator Kamala Harris. Mayor, thank you very much for being with us. A whole lot of breaking news just happened in the last five minutes. Can i get your reaction . Its a big deal. When a president backs out of a scheduled debate. I know the format has changed, but its still a big deal. Whats your take . Well, you know, the first debate went poorly for the president and maybe its a sign of waving the white flag, maybe its posturing because, you know, they can create a little bit more noise around this. I think the bottom line is what were seeing again and again is that whenever theres a choice between doing something in a more safe way when it comes to covid or a less safe way, whether we are talking about debating or whether we are talking about wearing masks, whether its the president or whether its the American People they always seem to lean toward whatever is less responsible and less safe and thats one of the reasons why we have a less Effective Response than any other country in the developed world. I think weve shown and certainly the Biden Harris Campaign has been remarkably adept at using virtual means to continue campaigning and next that in with safe inperson campaigning and they will continue to do that because this is 2020. You have to adapt, roll with the punches, you cant just say its got to be done the old way forever. The world is changing. I will also note that you and i are speaking right now from remote locations and this is the way that the debate presumably would take place. We are not talking about zoom here. We are talking we are not talking about tin cans and yarn. We are talking about probably technology that would allow it to take place in a more advanced way. The debate last night, you played mike pence in the debate prep with senator Kamala Harris which means you had to get into his mind, learn everything about his record an be him for all intents and purposes, which you have some experience because you were a mayor in a city and a state in indiana when he was governor. What surprised you most with everything you know about mike pence, what surprised you most about his performance last night . Very little, actually. You know, we were prepared for him to say things that arent true and do it with a straight face and very slowly and calmly and part of what i viewed as my job was to help senator chair ris see how that would happen and prepare for that. The only thing that really surprised me was how disrespectful he was towards the rules and toward the moderator, but other than that, you know, it was the same talking points, the same lines, the same evasions that weve been seeing from the trumppence campaign throughout because they clearly did not want to answer for this administrations failed response to the pandemic for the Economic Disaster happening all around us and i think the longer the night went on with him in this impossible position of trying to make it sounds like everything is going along great, the better it went for our campaign, especially with senator harris who is so effective in holding this administration accountable. By the way, you know, doing it carrying the weight of history and it was, i think, really impressive also and a historic moment as the first black woman for her to be for her to really triumph on the debate stage. When you were running for president one of the things that i remember jumping out to me was the way that you talked about the Supreme Court and the filibuster. You were, i think, in my memory is the first candidate who i heard talking about it at length. You brought up the idea of ending the filibuster. You said you might be supportive of ending the filibuster in the senate. You brought up, you raised the possibility of different kinds of Supreme Court reform, but one of them would be to add to the number of justices on the court. This is something that you indicated that you might be supportive of. This is a question that joe biden and Kamala Harris and the Biden Campaign writ large refuse to answer right now. Lets listen to that moment last night. And ive witnessed the appointments for Lifetime Appointments to the federal courts, district courts, courts of appeal. People who are purely ideological and do you know that of the 50 people who President Trump appointed to the court of appeals for Lifetime Appointments, not one is black. This is what theyve been doing. Do you want to talk about packing a court. Lets have that discussion. All right. Thank you. Thank you, senator. Lets go on and talk about the issue of racial justice. I just want so you will note she did not answer the question and joe biden has not answered the question. What she said may be true on other fronts, it is true on other fronts but its not an answer to the question of do you support adding to the number of justices on the Supreme Court. So, mayor, dont people who supported you in the primary, maybe because of that issue, deserve an answer on that question . Why dont they deserve an answer on that question . Well, speaking for myself, i have always been and remain very interested in bipartisan opportunities for reform, but we are also not going to get it thrown. Its very clear that there is an effort by the Trump Pence Campaign to distract from a much more immediate, much more here and now in our face issue when it comes to the Supreme Court which is that they are trying to ram through a justice disagreeing with the vast majority of the American People who think that the winner of this election ought to choose the next justice. This is not a theoretical exercise or something that comes down to arcane points of legal academia, this is about our lives. We just saw two members of the Supreme Court, the other day, write language that basically calls for overturning Marriage Equality just five years after Marriage Equality became the law of the land. The Affordable Care act is coming before the court. If republicans win that case, and this is in a matter of weeks, then preexisting condition coverage and many other needed elements of Health Insurance could be stripped away from millions of americans. Its very important to keep our eye on that and keep the focus on that with so much on the line and with this really remaining a central issue in the president ial election that, by the way, isnt just coming up, its under way, more than 5 Million People have already cast their vote. And youre right, and mike pence did refuse to answer a question on how the Trump Administration would project preexisting conditions, but on the idea that its an academic exercise it isnt really an academic exercise, is it, because if joe biden wins he will be the president. And he would be the one who would have to sign a law that changes the number of judges on a court if congress were to pass that law. So would you be supportive of it . Forget your role in the Biden Harris Campaign, would you be supportive to adding to the number of justices on the court . My position hasnt changed. Im a big believer in exploring bipartisan reforms, especially if we can get out of this cycle where every time there is a vacancy there is a big ideological death match in the senate. Again, we have something much more immediate, much more pressing on our hands and that is a decision that could be made in a matter of days thats going to affect all of us very intimately in our personal lives. November 10th the Supreme Court hears the case on the Affordable Care act. There is no question about that. Mayor pete buttigieg, its nice to see you again. Thanks so much for coming on new day. Appreciate it. Same here. Great to be with you. President trump announced moments ago that he will skip next weeks president ial debate now that the decision has been made because he has coronavirus to hold it virtually. The Vice President s chief of staff joins us next live. Too many are hurting. But despite the rising pain and anguish made worse during the pandemic, Insurance Companies still refused to cover Mental Health and addiction treatment. Until now. Senator scott wiener went to work taking them on. Passing a law requiring the Insurance Industry to cover Mental Health and addiction treatment. Now more than ever, californians need Mental Health coverage. I wont let up until the stigma of Mental Health and addiction is finally over. Announcer this is cnn breaking news. Okay. We have three breaking headlines for you right now in the 2020 race. The Debate CommissionJust Announced that the next debate between President Trump and joe biden will be held virtually with the candidates in separate locations. Then moments ago former Vice President biden agreed to those conditions, and moments before that President Trump refused. Joining us now is mark short, he is chief of staff for Vice President mike pence. Mark, great to have you here with all of this breaking news. Thanks for being up early for us. Why wont President Trump agree to a remote debate . Well, good morning, alisyn. Thanks for having me on. Obviously at this hour we have not yet had a chance to talk to the president but you have heard him speak and explain his concerns about a virtual debate. I think our concern consistently has been the Debate Commission is supposed to negotiate with both sides if they are going to suggest a change in rules and that has not been the case. There are minor rule changes they implemented in the Vice President s debate at the last minute without consultation and i think this continues to have a pattern of them announcing it without discussing it with both sides. We are hopeful they will actually enter into negotiations so we can hear what their concerns are and there can be a negotiation to hopefully reach a positive settlement because we think its important that the American People hear from both candidates. They can still hear from both candidates even if they are remote. If i can speak for the Debate Commission, i think what their big issue is that a week ago President Trump tested positive for coronavirus. Hes supposed to be isolating. Hes still contagious doctors say. Thats their concern. I appreciate you speaking for the Debate Commission, alisyn, but i think the reality is that that debate is still ten days out, its not tomorrow. Its a week out. Theres i think all likelihood that the president would be negative at that point. But, again, i think that the way the commission is supposed to work is they are supposed to negotiate with both sides, i think that would be whats most appropriate here. I think that they get to make the decision. As the president ial Debate Commission they get to make decisions and doesnt it just stand to reason that if one of the candidates was sick they would do what was safest for the Public Health . Again, alisyn, i appreciate you taking on the side of the Debate Commission and representing them im just telling you what the logic is. The logic is that President Trump is sick with coronavirus. The rules are very specific that the sides are supposed to negotiate, alisyn. It was a small issue here, but we asked repeatedly for any sort of medical justification for plexiglas, they never provided t obviously the Vice President conceded and said if thats what makes senator harris more comfortable we will go along with that. What do you think the medical justification is for plexiglas, mark . Well, lets talk through that, alisyn. Both candidates tested negative, the moderator tested negative, cdc rules say you should have 6 feet of distance, we extended it to 12 feet of distance, medical experts have come out time and again and said the plexiglas is meaningless. The university of utah epidemiologist told us the plexiglas is meaningless. If it makes you feel better aesthetically, fine, but it does nothing medically. Thats exactly the point. Hold on. Hold on. Thats your side. Isnt the point also that Vice President pence its not my side, those are the facts, alisyn. Those are your facts. Thats exactly mark, here is another fact how can you say theyre cherry picked facts . What you didnt mention is that Vice President pence has been with people in the past ten days who have tested positive at what might have been super spreader events. Alisyn, its exactly why we did the Contact Tracing, we did that through both the white house medical unit, we did it extra consultation with the director of cdc who all felt comfortable with the Vice President moving forward, its why he has tested every day, he has continued to test negative. Is he tested every day, mark . Yes, he is. Okay. When was President Trump last tested before his positive result . Alisyn, you will have to ask the president s team that. Why dont you know that, mark . You have the chief of staff for the head of the Coronavirus Task force. I am the chief of staff for the Vice President of the United States. Im not privy to access to the president s medical records. You dont know when the president was tested negative before his positive result . You do not know that . I dont know when there is a lot of people that have tested negative. Im talking about the president of the United States. Hes tested each and every day and i work for the Vice President of the United States, hes tested each and every day. Mark, you also just mentioned youre doing Contact Tracing. For what . For what event are you doing Contact Tracing . We did for the Vice President to make sure, again, as we walked back through and said here is where he has been, what he has been exposed to, we had clear guidance from the white house medical unit and director of cdc who said theyre confident with that. Whats most important is the Vice President continues to test negative each and every day. Im happy to hear that. Thats wonderful. But you cant blame us for wondering if thats going to be a constant given how many people in the white house have now tested positive. Every day, mark, there is a new positive test coming out of the white house. And its a fair question. Yesterday it was Stephen Miller. I appreciate you allowing me the chance to answer it. Okay. Let me pose a question first. Its a fair question Stephen Miller go. Im not aware. Im not aware of anybody. Weve been here in salt lake. It was a great debate last night, i think thats why you asked me to come on, we were pleased with how the Vice President did, i think he drew a clear contrast to the divisions of our country what it would look like for the Pence Administration to the biden harris administration. I have a sound bite to play for you. We thought it was a good night. I did want to get your take on what you thought of the debate, obviously. Thank you. Here is a moment. Let me play this for you and get your response. You head the administrations Coronavirus Task force. Why is the u. S. Death toll as a percentage of our population higher than that of almost every other wealthy country and you have two minutes to respond without interruption. Susan, thank you. And i want to thank the commission and the university of utah for hosting this event and our nation has gone through a very challenging time this year. But i want the American People to know that from the very first day President Donald Trump has put the health of america first. Mark, he didnt answer it. He never answered t a lot of people want to know why is the death toll in the u. S. So much greater than other countries. Well, you didnt play the full clip. He never got to it. He never explained that. Alisyn, are you going to let me answer your question or not . Mark, you just said we didnt play the full clip, it was two minutes of him not answering. Alisyn, one more time, the Vice President answered the question if you played the full clip. But the reality is that requires you to trust the information thats being provided by russia, china, iran, other nations that have had the coronavirus and believe their numbers. So you dont think that we have the highest death toll, is that what youre saying . I believe if youre going to be consistent and trust the numbers then you also have to go back and say that when the swine flu broke out during the obama Biden Administration there were 14,000 domestic deaths they said there were 18,000 International Deaths total. So, therefore, the United States was 70 of the fatalities not 20 . Mark, im so confused about this a analogy that you keep using. So there were 13,000 deaths by our numbers from the swine flu, there are now on your screen 211,000 deaths of americans from coronavirus. Why do you keep going back to the swine flu . Coronavirus is so much more deadly and its the Trump Administrations watch. Sure. Sure. Sure, the coronavirus is more deadly, alisyn, but its why the reality is that what the Biden Administration the obama Biden Administration provided opportunities to close down borders to mexico that they did not do when swine flu was coming across and the swine flu ended up infecting 60 million americans. God forbid if the swine flu had been as fatal you would have ten times as many fatalities in the United States and its why the chief of staff to the Vice President said we did Everything Possible wrong in managing that situation. I heard that last night. I just wish that you guys thats good and between the two administrations the way that they would have handled it. Okay. Mark short, thank you very much. We didnt expect all of this breaking news, but we really appreciate you being here and giving us the white house perspective. Thank you. Thanks for letting me talk about the debate. We are getting a brandnew snapshot of americas unemployment crisis. We will give you the breaking details next. Ok everyone, our mission is to provide complete, balanced nutrition for strength and energy. Whoohoo great tasting ensure with 9 grams of protein, 27 vitamins and minerals, and nutrients to support immune health. And nutrients to lets make hand washing andren important one. Ssons. Safeguard is donating ten Million Dollars in hand soaps and sanitizers to families in need. Safeguard your family. Wash away germs. Ythey customize yours lcar insurance. So you only pay for what you need. Wow. That will save me lots of money. This games boring. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. In the tubbs fire. The flames, the ash, it was terrifying. Thousands of family homes are destroyed in wildfires. Families are forced to move and higher property taxes are a huge problem. Prop 19 limits taxes on wildfire victims so families can move without a tax penalty. Nineteen will help rebuild lives. Vote yes on 19. The unfair money bail system. He, accused of rape. While he, accused of stealing 5. The stanford rapist could afford bail; got out the same day. The Senior Citizen could not; forced to wait in jail nearly a year. Voting yes on prop 25 ends this failed system, replacing it with one based on public safety. Because the size of your wallet shouldnt determine whether or not youre in jail. Vote yes on prop 25 to end money bail. Major breaking news, moments ago President Trump backed out of the second president ial debate scheduled for next thursday night. The Debate Commission announced shortly before that that the debate would be virtual because the president , of course, has coronavirus and there are medical concerns. For what its worth, joe biden agreed to the new terms of the debate. Were joined by cnn White House Correspondent john harwood. John, great to have you here. Look, its a big headline when a president backs out of a debate. Its a big headline when the Debate Commission feels the need to make it virtual because they worry the president could be a health threat. There is a lot going on here. John, it dramatizes every way in which the Trump Administration and President Trump as a candidate are behind the eight ball right now. The president is physically sick, his campaign is in terrible shape, trailing joe biden by a large margin that has been getting wider in the last week or two, and in battleground state polls he was terrible in the first debate, all the polls show it. Because he is sick its not safe for joe biden to be in the same room for him and to have a virtual debate that advertises that fact simply dramatizes the failure of the administration in handling the coronavirus pandemic and so the president is now seizing the opportunity not to participate in another debate. Now, i do think, alisyn is right, to say dont necessarily take to the bank what the president says in the flush of the moment because he is rapidly running out of options to change the dynamic in the campaign. A rally instead of participating in a debate is not going to do it. On the other hand, its a town hall debate that puts a premium on showing empathy with your audience and President Trump doesnt do that very well. So the truth is all of the good options for President Trump are gone and hes just got to figure out which is the least bad one and in the moment he thinks the least bad one is not to participate in the debate and to attack Chris Wallace, attack the commission on president ial debates, attack the media, attack the Biden Campaign, he just put out a rambling video from the lawn of the white house in which he was claiming to have, you know, restored the military. Its just its not a pretty picture for purchase right now. And also, john, one more thing, you know, we were sort of joking about, oh, in this age of zoom what would this look like, oh, my gosh, technology is crashing into the debate. It would not actually be that. It would be a real camera, a real tv cam ration like the ones we are using right now, real satellites. It would be the same as an oval office address. When President Trump is alone in his room or whatever with a small crew and he speaks to the camera, thats actually what it would be, and he does he likes to do those addresses and those speeches all the time. And so why not do the debate this way . I mean, hes acting as though its a deal breaker, but he generally likes getting out his message that way. Hes losing. He knows hes losing. He likes attacking other people and so hes seizing on this change to attack the commission. Again, it is possible, alisyn, that you are right and when they reflect and realize what a difficult situation their campaign is in, they could shift gears tomorrow. He could shift gears later today, like i said, the good options are all gone for President Trump and hes just got to try to scramble and figure out some way to make the best of it. You know, we dont know we still dont know what his physical condition actually is. If, in fact, he acquired the coronavirus when the white house says he tested positive, that is, in the middle of last week, he still has a significant period of unpredictability about the course of his illness. You know, its entirely possible he might not bewellenoughto debate on the 15th. We just dont know because they wont tell us when that last negative test was. John harwood, great to have you with us, in the future you dont have to take alisyns side. Yes, you do. We appreciate you being with us nonetheless. Thanks so much, john. Breaking news right now, new jobless claim numbers have just been released, Christine Romans joins us with more. What do you see . I see a job market under stress and i see a recovery at a crossroads here. 840,000 new firsttime unemployment claims in the week. That is a number that has been alarmingly high here, stuck in this 800,000 range for weeks now. There were also 464,000 pandemic unemployment insurance, you add that together thats 1. 3 million for the week. These are continuing claims im showing you here, its almost 11 Million People, down a million, these are people who are continuing to get benefits. Overall in all the different kinds of programs, including special programs for the unemployed because of the pandemic there are 25. 5 Million People received aid, jobless aid, from the government. I want to point out california has put a twoweek pause on processing new unemployment claims, theyre trying to work through some fraud issues, also a big, big backlog there so these numbers could change a little bit going forward. Heading into an election here with clearly the american worker, the american jobless worker under a lot of stress and no aid yet from congress in terms of stimulus. My gosh. Okay. Christine, thank you very much for all of that breaking news. All right. Dr. Sanjay gupta is going to join us with his reaction to our other breaking news, the next president ial debate is set to be no. No. The president backed out of a president ial debate. There is no next debate. Well, okay. It doesnt matter if the debate Commission Says its virtual. That was at 8 48 and their campaign put out a press release saying that President Trump is not going to do it. So im taking your side and im taking my side. All right. Anything is possible is what im trying to say. Sanjay gupta is next. Now is the time for a new bath from bath fitter. Every bath fitter bath is installed quickly, safely, and beautifully, with a lifetime warranty. Go from old to new. From worn to wow. The beautiful bath youve always wanted, done right, installed by one expert technician, all in one day. Weve been creating moments like these for 35 years, and were here to help you get started. Book your free virtual or inhome Design Consultation today. She said it was like someone else was controlling her mouth. Her doctor said she has tardive dyskinesia, which may be related to important medication she takes for her depression. Td can affect different parts of the body. [narrator] in todays trying times, were here to help you manage td. Visit talkabouttd. Com for a doctor discussion guide to prep for your next appointment in person, over the phone, or online. We were so relieved to learn there are treatments for td. Okay. Big breaking news this morning. President trump has just said he will not debate joe biden virtually next thursday. The Debate Commission announced this morning that the candidates would have to be in separate locations, we assume because the president has coronavirus, but the president has just said he will not take part. Dr. Sanjay gupta, cnns chief medical correspondent joins us now. Sanjay, your thoughts. Well, this wont surprise you, but i think from a medical perspective obviously a virtual debate would be the best, safest option medically and that was even before the president was diagnosed with coronavirus. So, you know, its interesting because the sort of policies around these debates went from being a very porous sort of policy, you can be tested, just show your test within 72 hours, any kind of test you want, people inside, audience, not even necessarily masked during the first debate, that was sort of what we saw, to now virtual. Im sure as you point out that this has a lot to do with the fact that the president has been diagnosed with covid, but, you know, we are in the middle of a pandemic here, so its funny, we talk about these issues all the time and, you know, part of me is saying were clearly just trying to make the best out of a bad situation, it feels very incremental. We will test, we will sort of require masks. None of this stuff really makes a difference. There is a virus that is still very contagious, aggravating people indoors like that makes no sense. So, you know, medically and i think you will hear this interest all Public Health officials, this would be the safest way to conduct a debate. It was interesting hearing mark short say it was a political decision not made in consultation with the Trump Campaign. Im not sure you have to consult with a campaign to figure out whether a debate is safe or not. And i will just point out as well the aerosol zags, too, the idea that this virus can be aerosolized makes indoors debating more of a concern. Plexiglas offers some protection, i think that informed some of their thinking as well. Sanjay, we have some viewer questions for you, which is wonderful because it is something i think people find so useful. This question is, is air travel safe if i wear a mask . I think thats interesting as a general question, this specific question comes from someone who is 79 years old and has atrial fibrillation, but as a question question, how safe is air travel at this point . Well, you know, airplanes themselves, you know, a lot of the airlines have done a reasonable job of trying to make them, again, as safe as possible. Kind of like were talking about the debates. We are in the middle of a pandemic, a virus is srk lagt, anytime you bring people together youre going to increase the risk. Airplanes have generally pretty good air exchange four times an hour which is really critically important, especially when talking about the aerosol zags of the virus, but its all the other steps to get there, youre potentially increasing the risk just going through the airport, are you going to a place that may put you in quarantine when you get there, you have to look at that ahead of time and it can change, you know, week to week. I had the same conversation with my own parents, you know, upcoming holidays, they are around that age and we have decided air travel is not going to be the best option for them. By the way, i should point out that dr. Fauci who is also 79 years old has asked this question, people dont realize hes 79, but he said he wouldnt travel right now because of those risks and because of the fact that given his analogy hes considered vulnerable. So still not quite there yet i dont think. I did not realize that dr. Fauci was 79 years old. We have a lot of breaking news on this show in the past hour. That is wow. Thats amazing. Sanjay, thank you. Looks good, yeah. Looks amazing. I want what hes having. Sanjay, thank you very much for all of that. So the big breaking news, President Trump says he will not participate in the next debate if it is held virtually. Which it will be. The debate Commission Says its up to any candidate if they show up. The debate Commission Says if its going to happen its going to be virtual and the president says hes not going. Cnns breaking News Coverage continues next. Hope is the light in all of us that cannot be extinguished. To stir that fire, university of phoenix is awarding up to one Million Dollars in scholarships through this month. See what scholarship you qualify for at phoenix. Edu. They do one of the most deven in normal times. S, our Frontline Health care workers. And when these heroes lack the resources they need, that risky job gets ten times harder. Prop fifteen makes corporations pay their fair share. To invest in our communities, in our clinics, in the essential workers who treat everyone rich, poor, and inbetween. Whether its this pandemic or the next health crisis, vote yes on prop fifteen. For all of us. Now every bath fitter bathbath fis installed quickly, safely, and beautifully, with a lifetime warranty. Go from old to new. From worn to wow. The beautiful bath youve always wanted, done right, installed by one expert technician, all in one day. Weve been creating moments like these for 35 years, and were here to help you get started. Book your free virtual or inhome Design Consultation today. Well, you are all waking up to a whole lot of news this morning, especially in the last hour. Were glad youre with us, im poppy harlow. And im jim sciutto. Were 26 days to an election and you have to listen to the comments on the record from candidates for that election. One note, one headline this morning, President Trump says he will refuse to take part in next weeks president ial debate. This after the commission on president i