Suggesting the failure is something trump knew he was doing. In his first primetime town hall since winning the democratic nomination of course right here on cnn joe biden says trump knew how deadly covid was and did nothing and that that is, quote, close to criminal. Now, biden got an eye popping endorsement today from one of mike pences former top aides. A former White House Coronavirus task k force member who was working there just a month ago. And she is letting loose on President Trump. We have some of her sound and well talk about the impact of all of this with our power team. David axelrod, abby phillip, and miles taylor. Good to have all three of you. Lets start with net effect of the night, abby, for biden in the town hall. Needle mover or not . I think one of the things that you saw in this is bidens ability to just stand there and answer questions. In a coherent fashion. One of the reasons the bar is that low for joe biden is because President Trump made it that low. He spent several weeks talking about how joe biden isnt mentally fit to run for the presidency, complaining that he thought biden was taking performance enhancement drugs. I think what the American People saw tonight was a joe biden who could answer a wide range of questions and actually in a great deal of detail. He took a question from, a tough questioner, who was a trump supporter about regulations and about environmental regulations. And he was able to handle those questions. I think that is probably one of the more significant things to come out of tonight especially as were going into a period of the debates. Under the you cant make it up category youve got a president who pronounces yosemite yosemite and thailand thigh land questioning his opponent. Crazy days certainly. Important and in crisis. Do you think joe biden moved the needle with anyone that matters, any of the paucity of undecided or galvanizing his own group or fence sitting trump voters . You know, that is really hard to say. I did notice one thing that was very pronounced which was a real p populist edge to his rhetoric. He described the race between scranton pennsylvania where he grew up and park avenue. He talked about guys who inherit their money and squander it versus the hard working people who grew up in the town that he came from and, you know, i think this was very deliberate. I think youre going to see more of that. It is an appeal to the White Working Class voters who are very much the core of trump support and biden is getting more of them than hillary clinton. He is trying to cement that support. And this is part of that effort. I want to play you a piece of sound from mike pences former aide who was working with the Coronavirus Task force. I want sound bite number two in the control room. Toward the middle of february, we knew it wasnt a matter of if covid would become a big pandemic here in the United States. It was a matter of when. But the president didnt want to hear that because his biggest concern was that we were in an Election Year and how is this going to affect what he considered to be his record of success . The truth is, he doesnt actually care about anyone else but himself. Lets deal with just the premise of that. One, do you know troia and, two, that understanding of in the white house we knew. Everybody had it wrong. Fauci and everybody else was surprised in january but then moving into february they started to develop a different understanding that was met with hostility at the white house and certainly president ial level. Yes, so, chris, ill tell you this. First on olivia, she is, honestly, one of the most hard working, honest Public Servants i have ever met in my entire career. So when the Vice President s office asks the department of Homeland Security, do you guys have anyone you would recommend be the Homeland Security adviser to the Vice President of the United States, the one person in a department of 250,000 people we recommended was olivia troia because her background was immaculate. Her service was extraordinary. Her qualifications were unmatched. So when they say she hates trump, she is just another deep, embedded statist, part of the conspiracy against him. Never liked him. Now she is out in the middle of a crisis. Shows how much she cares. What is your response . Im going to tell you my response. I had lunch with the Vice President of the United States in the west wing of the white house and he told me to my face olivia troy is doing an incredible job. As my Homeland Security advisor. Today they sent out the president S National Security adviser to say olivia was a disgruntled employee. Keith keller told me this year olivia troia is doing an incredible job. I am so glad dhs referred her to us. So it is bogus. This is what they do when someone criticizes them, chris. Bigger picture i would say this. Look, when we talk about accountability in american society, we think about things you should think of olivia troye as the body cam in the west wing of the white house giving you a real time testimonial to what is happening in this administration. She is the body cam for the American People of how this president is making decisions in a moment of extraordinary consequence just like when a Police Officer does something that is very important in a moment of extraordinary consequence as this president made the most important National Security decisions of his tenure olivia troye was there as the body cam and now she is telling us what she saw and america should listen. Abby, weve heard this before that the president was worried that the pandemic would get in the way of the strength of the economy and thats why he didnt want the pandemic to get too much attention early on, played it with the hoax line and Everything Else right up to the resistance to masks. No . Well, he said it himself, chris. The president told bob woodward on tape that he wanted to downplay it because he didnt want to cause panic. And it wasnt just panic among individuals. It was panic in the markets that at the time he was saying publicly he was very concerned about that. He talked about it all the time around that same period of time. So it is very clear based on the president s own statements that this was a driving force for him. In fact, when he repeatedly said he didnt want to bring americans off of ships offshore where there was coronavirus present on those ships because he didnt want the numbers to go up so that he would look bad these are all things that are in the Public Record that are out there that he said himself that point to the president being very concerned about the impact on the economy, about the impact on well, frankly the economy being the biggest thing that is important to him because that is what he knew he needed to run on. It still actually is based on the polling. He still has an edge there but that edge is eroding and that is what he was principally concerned with. Does this matter to his base or any republican voter . What olivia troye has to say . Yeah. You know, i dont think i think his core base is implaquable. There arent that many moving parts in politics. The fact is, chris, the president is behind. He is seven points behind on the average nationally. He is behind by less but significant margins in many of these battleground states, and time is running out. He needs to move voters. When stories like this surface, it only creates more difficulty, more head winds for him in trying to win back some voters hes lost and win some voters that hes never had. So i think its problematic for him. I just want to say one thing in reaction to what was said. It was an interesting analogy to call her the body cam of this operation. The difference is of course she is a human being, not a piece of equipment. And she did something very, very courageous. She is sophisticated enough to know that by coming forward she would make herself a target and she has made herself a target and felt it was enough consequence to take that risk and in my view it is a heroic thing to do, because it is unpleasant to be a target of the abuse that she already has begun to take and will continue to take because they have to try and discredit her. Her testimonial is too powerful. No matter how hard you work the president was going to do something detrimental to keeping americans safe. It was awful. It was terrifying. That is powerful, powerful stuff. There is another piece of sound from her that i think is actually going to make it easier to discredit her in this bizarro world were living in right now. Lets play the first sound bite. When we were in a Task Force Meeting the president said maybe this covid thing is a good thing. I dont like shaking hands with people. I dont have to shake hands with these disgusting people. Those disgusting people are the same people he claims to care about. Now, miles, people will hear that. He will say exactly what he said after the atlantic reporting which is, i would never say anything like that. They know i love them. And that shows you everything you need to know about her. It may actually hurt her with his team where ordinarily if someone comes out and talks about joe biden like that hes got a real problem on his hands. How do you analyze that dynamic . Well, two things, chris. One, i want to echo what david just said and that is what olivia did was brave. In no way is this going to be ben beneficial to her career, to her future, to her personal life. I think that what she did was very impressive. Second in terms of the quote, itself, i think olivia has said what many of us have heard. In the oval office with donald trump, in meetings with donald trump, or in events with donald trump, and that is he shows callous disregard for the people that he claims to represent and to support and he shows callous disregard for human life. And weve seen that when it comes to migrants at the border or american lives that are under threat from natural disasters. Donald trump cares about one person and one person only and thats donald trump. I dont say that lightly, chris. This is the president of the United States. I went in to serve with him. I went in as a republican, but i left feeling that he was the least compassionate leader i had ever worked under in my entire life. And olivia troye had that same experience. And davids right. She is not just a body cam. She is a human being. And you watch that video and the emotion you see in that video is not coached. Its not from a director. That is from a woman who had a very real experience in this Administration First hand, saw this president , and left feeling like they werent doing enough to protect the American People and the president didnt care. Abby, do you think there was anything tonight that showed a potential avenue of future strength for biden or potential vulnerability for biden . Well, i do think that the there were a couple of questions about the economy, about peoples wages, about health care workers. And, you know, theres so much talk right now about social issues and, you know, all kinds of ancillary things. But the central issue for Many Americans remains the economy. Their Economic Future and their economic stability. I did feel like biden was able to turn a lot of these questions back around to that core issue repeatedly in a way that i thought was pretty effective. The second thing that i thought was effective and will become more important is when hes asked about how do you work with people across the aisle . He had an answer for that. He said, you know, i dont judge peoples motives. He basically said i dont burn bridges with people. Ive been able to do a lot of deals over the years in my career by being able to work with people across the aisle. I think the American People are going to be looking for, what is the alternative . If trump is the one thing what is the antithesis to that thing . I think biden has began to articulate that case for himself with these questions. Final question, with a little bit of shading does biden get hindered in that effort by being part of the Biden Obama Administration when you had such a culture of opposition from the right so it was very difficult to get things done . That is something hell have to defend. Yeah, look. I mean, you cant have it both ways. He very much is running on that record and legacy. In washington at the time that he was serving he was known among legislators as someone who they could talk to. He did have a relationship with mcconnell and others. Whether the politics will allow them to cooperate with him if he gets elected is another question. But he spent 36 years in the United States senate. He understands the art of dealing with fellow legislators and understanding what their needs are and what their perspective is. I think that could be very helpful to him if in these very polarized times they feel they have the room to maneuver. I dont do a lot of panels on primetime. I like you three. This was very helpful. I honestly can say i couldnt anticipate any of your answers. So thank you. These are all big moments, man. As we get down now you get fewer and fewer at bats so they matter more and more. Thank you for the perspective and the analysis on an important night. All right. So obviously all of this is happening under the cloud of what . The pandemic. 20,000 more of us could die from covid in the next few weeks. Remember, you can politicize that number as much as you want. Oh, but theyre mostly old people. Theyre mostly 55 plus. For young people, for most people it is all okay. Tell that to the families. That people by the way in that age range happen to be the fathers and the mothers and the centers of the family and the matriarchs and the patriarchs and the people you want around as long as you can have them. Thats where we are. Director Robert Redfield of the cdc said, wear your mask. The president never says it to you. He said it once, its a patriotic duty. Never said it again. Now when redfield said it again he is trying to shut him up again and shut up science. Our special guest tonight his own former hhs secretary. Straight from dr. Tom price, next. Unitedhealthcare medicare plans offer more. Like the visit a doctor anywhere our rv takes us plan. And the zero copays means more money for rumba lessons plan. Find the right plan for you from unitedhealthcare. Get medicare with more. Find the right plan for you from unitedhealthcare. When you think of a bank, you think of people in a place. But when you have the chase mobile app, your bank can be virtually any place. So, when you get a check. You can deposit it from here. And you can see your transactions and check your balance from here. You can save for an emergency from here. Or pay bills from here. So when someone asks you, wheres your bank . You can tell them heres my bank. Or heres my bank. Or, heres my bank. 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The same thing that the cdc head was talking about. The same thing tony fauci and the other Task Force Members have told you. What you hear from lawmakers, even republican ones, who arent within ear shot of the president. You can wear the mask. Socially distance as called for. Deal with hygiene. Lets ask somebody who understands the Trump Administration from the inside. In fact, the very agency that could be helping lead the way during this pandemic. Tom price, trumps secretary of health and Human Services before leaving in 2017 amid controversy. Mr. Secretary, thank you for joining us. Hey, chris. Good to be with you. Lets look at the past through this lens. Had you not gone through that scandal and having to admit what happened with the planes and paying it back, you probably would not have been dismissed certainly from the Trump Administration. Youd be there now. Is that a source of regret for you . Theres a lot more to that story and that is not why i was called, to be honest, on this show this evening. I dont know that i would still be there. You know, there are a lot of individuals who come through the administration. I think whats important about this issue right now is that the incredible privilege that i had to work at hhs and lead hhs with 80,000 employees literally across the world, the American People, your viewers can be incredibly proud of the remarkable work thats being done. Cdc, nih, fda, throughout the entire globe on health issues. And so it was a remarkable privilege for me to be able to serve at hhs and it will be one of my highest honors. The spokesperson there until very recently Michael Caputo suggested Something Else. He suggested scientists within that agency and others were working to thwart the president to keep people in the dark, to keep this pandemic out there to help political ambitions of getting rid of the president. Do you buy that . No. What i saw were incredibly dedicated people whether they were political appointees or career individuals. These are folks that especially who have been there for a long time could be doing all sorts of other things but what many of them dedicated their lives to is making certain that the health and well being and the safety of the American People are improved. And so it was a great honor for me to be able to serve with them. And the cdc was right at the top of that list. Do you agree with dr. Redfield in his recent analysis of the plus minus on vaccines and the absolute Science Behind masks . Well, i thought dr. Redfield was very clear and i commend him for what he said. We are dealing with a new Infectious Disease. You remember chris when it came out it was called the novel coronavirus. Yes. That was because its new. All of us, all of us in the world literally are immunologically naive because our bodies havent seen this before. When you have a new disease we are watching Public Health 101 play out in real time before the American People and before citizens of the world. And when you have a new Infectious Disease one thing you have to do initially is to mitigate the spread of the Infectious Disease. You need to be able to detect it. That is the testing. But the mitigation is key and one of the major mitigation activities you can do is to socially distance, physically distance, and wear a mask. This is not rocket science. This is something Public Health has known for year. If you look back at the pictures from 1918 they have masks on. Thats right. Why do you believe the president has taken such an opposite tack having the rallies, sure, his Campaign Staff will say, hey. You want a mask . He never encourages people to wear masks. He did once in public but since then hes been quiet about it and intentionally so. Why does he take that tack . Yeah, i dont know. But what i will tell you is the role it matters, right . It is incredibly important. The role of physicians and scientists is to provide the best information that they have and the most honest and candid information that they have. Thats my goal at this point. Do you think people should be Wearing Masks . When theyre unable to physically distance and not within their cohort if you will, that they know is safe, absolutely. If they go to a rally should they wear a mask . I if they go to a rally, if they go to a protest, if theyre in a group of individuals that they dont know and theyre not able to physically distance, then its Public Health 101 to wear a mask. Would you hold a rally right now if youre going to have a book come out or whatever and they say hey were going to pack this house for you tonight. Masks are optional. Would you be okay with that . I havent attended an event since the beginning of this that hasnt respected the imperative of this disease and making certain that there is mitigation activities going on whether it is wearing a mask, social distancing, whether its just a few people in a certain area. This, again, is not difficult stuff. This is stuff weve known for over a hundred years i agree. And it is imperative. And the American People understand this in their gut. And thats why i think youre seeing some of the good trends. Were seeing decrease in hospitalizations, decrease in transmissions. Decrease in deaths. That is because folks i think are paying more attention now. Were having a little difficulty on the University Campuses and we need to get our young constituents to be able to recognize the imperative of their role in all of this. Right. A lot of personal responsibility needs to be held but were doing better as a nation. I think we need to celebrate that. Yes, except we are doing better despite the constant messaging of the president of the United States, doc. I get that you dont want to Talk Straight politics. I understand that. I know the truth demands it. We all know that the science says we should wear masks. The president says otherwise. So telling the truth to the American People says, science 101 says medicine 101 says wear a mask and it is wrong for the president to suggest and encourage otherwise. I think you need to say both parts if you want to tell people the truth. Do you agree . Well, i think what im inspired by is the work of the Surgeon General. Im inspired by the work of the cdc director. Im inspired by the work at nih and the individuals there and the folks who have been very clear on this. Theres been no end but they have been frustrated and silenced by a president who gets upset when they say what you are saying right now which is why redfield got slapped down. Im asking you again. Do you want to point out that the president shouldnt be doing that . And that he shouldnt be discouraging mask use . Im past the days of trying to decide why individuals in the political arena do what they do. Not the individuals, doc. The president. What i want to do is be very, very clear. The president , doctor. I want to be very clear that this is a new Infectious Disease. We need to mitigate the challenges of this disease. And one of the major things we can do, everybody, in a personal responsibility standpoint regardless of what the president says, regardless of how can you say regardless of what the president says when you dont even want to say, doc, i got to tell you. You know ive known you for a while. I have respect for you as a clinician. What i am saying is this. I get you dont want to get in the political morass but if you dont want to get people to a better place then you keep playing the game where you dont want to get in trumps face about this. But people dont wear masks because they believe he doesnt think you need them to. You have an odd political symbiosis between people who dont want to wear masks and who support the president. Why wont you say he shouldnt say it . Which is precisely why i am on the air right now and that is to encourage individuals to recognize the science, follow the science. And the president tells them they dont have to. So now what . To do the things they need to be done to mitigate the challenge of this disease. The president says you dont have to. The mask is optional. Come to my big rally. It is going to disappear by the way. The virus is going to disappear even if we do nothing. If i were at that rally, if i were at, i told you, if i were in an area where there was no ability to physically distance and there were a lot of individuals there, i would wear a mask and would encourage every Single Person to do so. What would you say to the person who is telling people to do otherwise . Im not letting it go, doc. It is too important i think, chris, that is belying science. The science dictates the Public Health activities dictate i agree with you but you wont say trump is belying the science and his people respect you. They need to hear. Okay. Now ill wear a mask. I get it. He says trump is wrong to tell me. All right. I get it. I think theyve gotten that message, chris. One other thing for you u the president is saying that he is going to have a great plan. You were at hhs where a plan would have had a significant home in generation. Why three years in should Trump Supporters and other voters who are thinking about voting for him have trust that he is going to come up with a plan when hes had all this time and hasnt . I think the contrast to where we find ourselves right now is that there are real challenges in the health care system, and the question is what is the answer . How do we get ourselves to a better place in terms of our Health Care Systems . What the administration has been working on and i know individuals, my old friends, former colleagues in the u. S. House and in the u. S. Senate, theyve been working on issues to make certain that we dont put the government in charge of things because we know when that happens then people are further removed from being able to communicate with their doctor and get the treatment. Fine. That doesnt mean you dont have a plan. Why doesnt he have a plan three and a half years in . You have to ask folks who are there now. If i had the privilege to stick around i believe wed have moved forward. They should have had a plan right . I had a plan as you and i talked about before. But he didnt make that plan your plan and he hasnt come up with any other plan except to say he has a plan. That is not enough is it . No. You got to have a plan. You cant beat it with nothing. So i encourage my colleagues to talk about the imperative of greater choices. Weve been working on a plan through Job Creators Network and physicians for reform called a health care for you to make certain we contrast it with medicare for all. Medicare for all is a one size fits all program. I got you. What we want is health care for you for individual patients all across this land i get it. This is what we need to do. When the president puts out his competing plan then well have two plans to compare. I want you to come back on the show and help me go through both what you see as pluses and minuses. I appreciate you, dr. Price, coming on. I appreciate you as a clinician. That is why im chasing you about the accountability because we need to start telling people the truth and what to believe and what not because we are getting sick literally. Doc, thanks for being with us. Thanks. Take care. They are not easy conversations. I am sorry it has to be difficult but it doesnt have to be difficult. The truth should be simple. If the science is wear a mask and the president is ignoring that you have to say he is wrong to ignore it. I get it is upsetting and hurts your partisan standing. It is making us sick. Doesnt happen here. That is how it is. The department of justice is doubling down on the idea of charging protesters with sedition. Okay . Sedition is not a catch all. It is a specific thing. It requires specific elements and it is a big deal. In a memo sent to u. S. Attorneys nationwide, deputy a. G. Jeffrey rosen writes, the attorney general and i recently discussed with you the need to consider the use of a variety of federal charges when they may be appropriate including seditious conspiracy. Seditious conspiracy. Lets try that out on former u. S. Attorney who was fired by President Trump. Good to have you right now. Let me ask you this. What do you see behind this move . Do you see this as a logical legal move or Something Else . I see it as Something Else and that is based on the track record of not just the president but the attorney general of the United States who doesnt work for the president but works for the public for the American People trying to in some ways echo through his position and through legal positions the rhetoric of the president. Sedition is a big deal crime to bring. As you say a very specific statute that has specific elements and it is not typically used in this fashion. In fact it is almost never used in this fashion. I havent done all the research and i plan to go back and take a look. More likely it seems like this is another example of the attorney general doubling down on what the president says and does and in effect on some occasions tries to help the president s allies. On other occasions tries to make war on the president s adversaries. And his hope talking about these protests and rhetoric about them and who is at fault he over emphasizes one group of people and under emphasizes another group of people namely white supremacists. It seems to me it is part and what happens next . Thats a great question. But i know you volunteered your services to one of the municipalities in question. Why . Well, you know, again, i dont know if the report is true. There there is a report that the attorney general asked people in the civil rights unit in the Civil Rights Division of the Justice Department to look at potential charges against a former u. S. Attorney, current mayor of the city of seattle. That strikes me as preposterous, and so i hope it is not true. It would seem not to be true because its not based on any fact or principle that im aware of. There is also confirmed evidence i think confirmed by the Justice Department itself that the department had been looking at figures, political figures, officials in portland, oregon. Right. And bizarre to me because ive seen rhetoric coming out of the attorney general and the gaslighting form where he says, you know, heres a problem in america today. You cant just say you dont like your adversary. You have to say that they need to be charged with a crime and put them in jail. Number one, thats what the president does. Thats what the president says on a regular basis going back to 2015 talking about hillary clinton. And thats what it appears that his own Justice Department has been contemplating doing with respect to political adversaries and enemies and thorns in their side in portland. And potentially in seattle. Well, you know, its another promise made another promise made, promise kept. He used to say lock her up. Maybe now a. G. Barr will find a way to make that promise kept. Preet bharara, i got to run. Thank you very much. Appreciate your time. Well be right back. I cant wiat to share at ts big 5g news. shouting through the glass at t has nationwide 5g . Yup and thats faster . Faster, yea but is it reliable . Ah huh and secure you should consider making a big deal about it bigger . I said bigger oh, bigbigger deal bigger than what im doing . Its not complicated. A 5g Network Needs a 5g device. Now everyone including existing customers can get a free Samsung Galaxy note20 after tradein. Its totally not the same without you. We miss your lets do this look, the sound of your laugh cry screams, and how you make every day here the best day ever. We cant wait to get you back so weve added temp checks, face coverings, social distancing and extra sanitizing to get the good times going again. Were finally back. And cant wait until you are too. Buy now and get two days free at the parks. Restrictions apply. Cnns champions for change series shows you people making positive changes, like a young man who is reshaping harmful narratives. Watch this. The United States is in a place of reckoning, in that what some people interpret as rising racial tensions that are recent are actually things that have been present in our country for a really long time that i believe are actually woven into the fabric of what this country is. Black students are dealing with something especially stressful right now. They see pictures and videos of people that look like them being killed and assaulted by police around the country. When i think about kids right now, it makes me realize that theres a lot of work that needs to be done. When i was younger, i was dealing with a lot of bullying and i wanted nothing more than to not exist. I cant rest knowing that there are kids like me that exist that want nothing more than somebody to look at them and say, i believe in you, youre worth something, and they dont have it. When i started weird enough in 2014, i was struck by the fact that media portrayals of Michael Brown were having a tngably negative impact on the way that i as an individual was treated on a predominately White College campus. So i had a thought process that maybe media representation can have a positive impact as well. My work is rooted in creating a new worse of diverse and original that stories featuring characters and heros that help young people find the hero in themselves. Im really excited to see everybody. The weird enough team is scattered around the globe. Our thought was, what if we could take that same amazing feeling that you get when you watch an anime and translate it scientifically to the way that young people behave in school and the way that they develop . So we have a program where we take an original comic series we created called the uncommons and partner it with lesson plans and curricula that can be used in school but also any parent or caretaker can access from home, too. Roman has very, very, very great power. What i like most about the uncommons is that is it about black heros that save the day. My favorite character is iris because she is mostly curious and funny. She is a black girl and a hero. Kind of like me. Our characters do fight giant monsters, but theyre not the type that are the size of buildings. Theyre different types of monsters. Insecurities, fears, past failures, things that people spend their entire lives running from. This doctor approves of tony weavers message. When we have books that can speak to what messages we are trying to encourage in our children, there is one thing for me to say it as a mommy, but there is something completely different when my daughter can look at a book and see herself. Awesome job. The messages speak to some of the challenges that she has as a little black girl growing up in this country. There has not been, in my experience, a curriculum that represents our black and brown kids in a positive way. When tony introduced his Literacy Program in 2017, he also just spoke to the kids about being a young black entrepreneur. So they were inspired that this young kid with a cape who is super cool and has a high top, you know, haircut, looks like them. For me, my cape is a way to unapologetically bring myself into any space i enter. My way of saying that im not gonna allow any people to minimize who i am. But whats a cape for me might be different for a different young person, so i encourage them to find the thing that makes you feel empowered and dont let anybody take it away from you. Be sure to watch champions for change this saturday at 10 00 p. M. Eastern. Here on cnn. Thanks for watching. Cnn tonight with big star d. Lemon right now. I thought you were going to say not all heros wear capes, but they certainly do wear yellow ties. Yeah, that is what i was gonna say. How did you know . Because i know you. Interesting show. Your show was great. And the town hall was fantastic, too. Inj