Enemy. Before you jump to that conclusion consider this, two new York City Police officers were allegedly assaulted by protesters during a demonstration on the Brooklyn Bridge on saturday. Police say lieutenant philip khan and Patrick Sullivan were bruised all over their bodies and lieutenant khan has a broken nose. On average a Law Enforcement officer is killed every 58 hours. It comes from the national Law Enforcement officers memorial fund. What do we want from the men and women sworn to protect us and what do they want from us . Weve got Police Officers and retired officers here with us tonight and were going to be answering all of your questions. Theyll be answering them as well. Join the conversation. Make sure to use copsunder fire. Our Police Experts here. They are david clinger, a former street cop in l. A. And professor of criminology at the university of missouri, st. Louis. He shot and killed a man attacking his partner. Officer stacy lynn whos been with the lapd for 26 years, she trains patrol officers was shot through the heart in a gang shootout. Sandy wall, a retired Police Officer who as a member of the s. W. A. T. Team faced hundreds of lethal threats and shotted three gunmen. Paul hershey also retired shot two armed gunman and kneel bruntrager, an attorney for Darren Wilson, the officer in the Michael Brown shooting and began in 1981 as a prosecutor and the fifth officer we invited, an africanamerican sergeant agreed to join us but we are told he is unavailable now. Welcome, everyone. Lets have a very important conversation, lets be honest with each other. You can ask whatever questions you want. If i get to you but make sure youre respectful. I want to thank you guys for joining us. Many came a long ways. You use your weapons in the line of duty. David, im going to start with you. Your partner was attacked. We responded to a call enbarry gueded gunman was in the house on the north side of vernon. So my partner and i were moving up to button down what we call the west edge of the perimeter and one of the people across the street wouldnt leavement my partner tried to get him out of there. The next thing i knew the people stabbed my partner in the chest with a butcher knife and my partner backed away. He knocked him to the ground and as i run across the street the suspect has his hands like this, going down on my partner. Theyre fighting over the knife. I think i dont want to have to shoot this guy. Try to take the knife away. Didnt work, dennis said shoot him. I shot the guy once in the chest. Dennis was able to lock his elbows out. We fought the guy for another 30 seconds. Some other officers came up and we were able to get him handcuffed and he bled out another minute or two later. Stacy, you are on duty with the lapd. You were critically wounded. You followed your assailant. What happened after that. Well, i was following juvenile gang members. I was off duty so they were trying to steal my car. When i stepped out of my truck he pointed a important 357 magnum at my chest and turn and ran. I fired once at him and then went after him and then when he got to the back of my car he turned and fired five more times. I fired three more at him. He went down. I was losing blood so i tried to get inside my house. I massed out on my driveway from all the blood and paramedics came and defibbed me to bring my heart back the first time. Took me to the hospital. Went into surgery. Found the bullet fragment and shattered my spleen and put a hole in the base of my heart, lung, barely ribs, left about a tennis ball size hole. You told them you were a Police Officer, right . Do you regret doing that. Do you think it made the situation i dont necessarily regret doing that. Part of my training i was trying to say police drop the gun. And when i got police out he fired. So theres not a whole lot i could do about that and just reacting to the action he gave to me and, you know, anyone else would do the same thing. Just try to protect yourself and others. Paul, i understand you fired your weapon twice in the hundreds of times you were a special threat situation in houston. Why do officers shoot to kill . Explain the training to me. Well, its not actually shooting to kill. What were doing is we shoot until the threat goes away. And an example would be the shooting i was involved in. Called by our homicide investigators to serve a warrant, a murder warrant on a man who had murdered a citizen in houston, set his body on fire. They came to us because they felt like this guy was pretty violent and they wanted our the numbers and the expertise that wed bring with us to serve that warrant. The information we got was that the suspect was in a house with his girlfriend and her child. Instead of just physically serving a warrant, kicking the door in and serving a warrant on the house we thought it was a better idea to allow him to separate himself, leave the house. We knew that he would be going to work at some point in the morning. So we set up a tactical situation in terms of we had officers, s. W. A. T. Officers in uniform in marked cars and we had other officers in s. W. A. T. Officers in Tactical Gear who would support an arrest that we were going to try to effect on him. Our plan was to do a felony traffic stop on him. Let him get away from the girl much friend a nd a child. When we did that a small car chase ensued. We used spike strips to flatten his tires. He crashed out. How long did this go on and how did it end up . Literally from the time he left the house until the time i was engaged in the shooting was mabel maybe a matter of 90 seconds. The final outcome. He crashed out in a ditch off the side of the road. My partner, we crashed off into another ditch off to the right side of the road. My partner got out. He was driving. The suspect got out and was tracking my partner with his handgun getting ready to shoot him. I my partner was trying to engage him firing rounds and missed him. By the time i climbed out of the vehicle all i saw was him pointing the gun at my partner and fired six rounds and he fell. At that point i was shooting only to the threat goes away. He fell to the ground and then he still had the gun and he tried to raise the gun, i fired two more rounds and killed him. I can still see its hard for you to say that. Yeah, nobody wants to do that. I thought he was firing rounds at my partner. The whole situation as it unfolds, its so fluid that youre just a reactant to what youre seeing in front of you. As i understand when it happens many times its like tunnel vision. You dont really know whats happening many of the times and you sort of if youre in a corridor, the corridor seeps longer than it is. Time speeds up or slows down depending what happened. Explain what it means to be in a situation like that. You were involved in three shootings in the 22 years you served. You revert back to your training. One thing we were talking about earlier, its more of a conscious thought not to shoot than it is to shoot because you react to what youre seeing and revert to your training and engage. And youre in fear of your life or in fear of another persons life and doing what you have to stop that act. But in one of my shootings i remember looking at the barrel and thinking, thats an automatic or semiautomatic handgun. Its either chrome or Nickel Plated and thinking its a 45. All of that happened in a millisecond and im thinking this while i should be defending myself and i thought i was and its amazing what the mind decides to focus on in those instances and dr. Klinger wrote a book about that. Its amazing what the mind decides to focus on. Kind of automatic. Absolutely. I want to go down to neal. He represents Darren Wilson the officer involved in the mike brown shooting. What is the biggest misconception you think about Darren Wilson in the situation in ferguson . I think people assumed that whatever happened that day happened because darren was somehow angry or had gone out that day in an effort to hurt somebody. When people started to look at the evidence i think that that was dashed but i think that misconception is a strong one and that was at least in part fed by there was such a long period of time where we couldnt say anything because of the Ongoing Investigation and only one side of the story was being told. There were, many misconceptions but that was the worst. Stand by. Before we go further i want to take a look at a day in the life of a Police Officer. Heres cnns kyung lau. Reporter facing off with protesters in the streets of ferguson. A manhunt through pennsylvania. Dangerous duty for americas police, but this image isnt always reality. The average cops job often ordinary. In 2012, 780,000 officers patrolled americas streets. Average pay for those officers, about 57,000 a year. Every cop in america carries on the duty belt a semiautomatic handbegun but youll notice the duty belt has whats called less lethal weapons. In 2007, 60 of Police Agencies used tasers or stun guns. 93 , batons. 97 pepper spray. The officer wearing the belt and badge increasingly female. The latest department of justice report from 2007 shows one out of eight officers is a woman. A majority of Law Enforcement remains white. 75 . 12 are black. 10 latino. 2 , asian. Regardless of race, age or gender officer down. They all face one of the highest rate of illnesses and injuries in america. 76 officers died in the line of duty, 27 killed nearly all by firearms. 49 killed accidentally in car crashes. Nearly 50,000 officers were assaulted while responding to calls and making arrest. What we couldnt find, a comprehensive National Database when Police Officers fire their weapons. An fbi report from 2008 shows 375 officerinvolved shootings. But that data is only a small sampling of the real number of Police Shootings in the united states. The biggest Danger Police face isnt the suspect they confront while on patrol. National data shows officers were twice as likely to commit suicide than they are to be killed in the line of duty. Danger on the job and in their own lives. Kyung lah, cnn, los angeles. Much, much more to come with our Police Experts and studio audience. Next well put you in the shoes of a cop on the beat in a lifeanddeath situation. What would you do . First take a look at what can happen during a routine traffic stop. This dash cam video in middlefield, ohio n. March of 2013 comes from our affiliate woio. [ applause ] welcome back everyone to our live cnn tonight special cops under fire. Police officers face life and death situations every single day from the outright dangerous life con fraptsing gangs to traffic stops. Even those can be daddily. In those situations what would you do . Well give you a chance to find out. David klinger, stacy lim, sandy wahl, paul hershey and, of course, he is a current retired officer. They are neil bru nchbrunrager. We have some videos. Its part of a lab study at Washington State university. They actually partly funded by the Defense Department in a simulation now. Youll be responding in this simulation to a Domestic Violence call and ill rafiqullah you what would you do . First lets watch it. Officers [ bleep ]. Come here. [ bleep ]. Come here. Okay. So there you go. In a lab during simulation you might hear the officer int interacting with a virtual suspect yelling at him to stop it. At this point you cannot see his right hands so we just played it. But the question is what would you do if we rack it back. What would you do where you couldnt see his hands. How many would shoot him . How many of you would shoot . Raise your hands if you would shoot. You would shoot . In that situation you would shoot . Okay. Why is that before we go back to the video. Because youre putting this individual in a room where his hand is hidden, hes already engaged in violent activity. He is going to turn at you and do harm to you or the individual thats there. Under those circumstances the courts have not only can you but maybe you should. Six or seven said she would not shoot or would not shoot. Lets let i play out so that everybody can see it. [ gunshots ] i mean what that shows is how quickly it happens. Everybody in here, the majority of those who would not shoot, the woman ends up dead, the officer could end up dead and the suspect ends up dead, as well, right. Go ahead. Its tough. I mean thats the situation and ive interviewed about 300 cops around the country. Been involved in shootings and some in similar situations such as that and as neil pointed out, the courts would permit an officer to shoot in that circumstance but i think an awful lot of officers would do what most of the audience did and that is hesitate. What wed be doing is giving verbal commands to the individual, show the hand or something, let go of the woman but you have to have your gun up and out and have to be ready to pull the trigger so as soon as you see that gun you have to start shooting. Im going to get up and can i borrow this microphone . So who back here i want to say who would not shoot you said you wouldnt shoot. I wouldnt. You wouldnt shoot. You see what happened. Yes, but i wouldnt assume he had a gun right away so i probably would have been caught off guard. When you paused it i wouldnt have shot. You wouldnt have shot. And you . After watching the video i definitely would have shot. But before you would not have. [ laughter ] this is to see how quickly the situation changed like in a matter of seconds. And she could end up dead. I could have ended up dead. The officer could have ended up dead so after is seeing the video i would have shot. Lets look at it again. [ screaming ] [ bleep ]. Come here. [ bleep ]. Come here. Every guy in the neighborhood [ bleep ]. [ gunfire ] after we are hear about officer involved shootings after looking at that does that change anyones mind do you feel like maybe sometimes the public at large jumps to conclusions about officerinvolved shootings. Anyone here . Right here . Does that . Would that does that change anything. Certainly. That showed us you really cant, you know, you cant know what theyre going through unless youre actually in the situation. Myself, i would have hesitated too because i wouldnt have i would not have assumed he had a gun. That was the last thing on my mind. That he a gun. A lot of this has been race has been brought into it and we talk about race. Do you think do you in that moment think about race to even have time to by if the suspect is white, black, brown, asian. Do you have time to think about that. No, you dont have time to think about if its male, female, adult, kid. Youre looking at the situation itself. Stacy situation what happened. She steps out of a car and saw a gun pointed at her. She didnt even see the kid ha she shot. The officers, you all would have shot . No. You would not have shot. No, no, as you played the video, this is a perfect depiction of action is faster than reaction. Meaning the actions of that suspect its going to be faster than the reaction of the officer. The best youre going to get is a 50 50 draw. Youre going to lose. Youre going to get shot but as the video rolled there was a corner its a hallway so theres a corner in the kitchen. I would have taken a barricaded position on that hallway, making verbal commands. I wouldnt have shot until he pulled the gun out but i would have shot him. Cops are human beings and everyone is going to act differently based on your training and perceptions and personality. Youre never going to go threat this is how all cops would do it. They found while volunteers of all races often view africanamerican suspects more threatening as white ones they were more restrained in shooting africanamericans they were than they were white suspects. Absolutely. I was part of that research and i was a coauthor on a followup study to that and basically what happens is the implicit bias that everybody is talking about where you push buttons. What brian and lois and other states at Washington State was make it more realistic. They found when its more realistic its the social. The entire situation, when that happens race does not play a major role in terms of the decision to shoot and, in fact, the officers are slower to shoot with black suspectss and also less likely to shoot. We talk about that in terms of a counterbias. Scientific research is fact. Its not the end all, be all but this study is pretty powerful. You know where im going. How many of you believe that . [ laughter ] how many of you believe that . I hear you laughing and someone back here. Wait, why dont you believe that. Because i mean what hes saying it just happened that so many black young black men just end up dead when no weapon and nothing. I mean if youre so slow to shoot a black man, most of them would be alive today where we dont have about white mens getting killed without a gun. We have white men with guns and they dont get killed. What i would say is the data shows unarmed white men are killed. Another thing i think is real important for everybody to understand all of us have been involved in multiple situations particularly sandy and paul where we had absolute lawful right to shoot people, white, black, hispanic and we held fire. We dont want to shoot people and so what the Research Suggests is that that notion of being restrained is coming out in this experiment. Okay. Lots more to talk about in our cnn tonight special, cops under fire. Are body cameras the next important tool for Police Officers and would they change anything. Well get answers and opinions from our experts and a demonstration of how body cameras really work. Make sure you stay with us. Celebrate whats new, the bigger, better menu at red lobster with more of what you love try our newest woodgrilled combination maine lobster, extra jumbo shrimp, and salmon so hurry in and sea food differently. Dad,thank you mom for said this oftprotecting my future. You. Thank you for being my hero and my dad. Military families are uniquely thankful for many things, the legacy of usaa Auto Insurance could be one of them. If youre a current or former military member or their family, get an Auto Insurance quote and see why 92 of our members plan to stay for life. I have the worst cold with this runni better take something. Dayquill cold and flu doesnt treat your runny nose. Seriously . Alkaseltzer plus cold and cough fights your worst cold symptoms plus your runny nose. Oh, what a relief it is. [ applause ] i am so glad were doing this and so glad you could join us live here on cnn, welcome back to our live town hall, cops under fire. With advances in technology, are body camera the answer for police . The mayor of los angeles plans to begin outfitting all Police Officers. Were joined by todd morris, the founder of brick house security which makes body cameras and im wearing one now. You probably were wondering what that is. So show us how this works. This is the talk of the nation about outfitting police department. So what youre wear something a Body Worn Camera that at the push of a button can Start Recording from your point of view to show what youre seeing. That one can also scream via wifi back to your car and records on to a tablet or phone and gives you the ability to show whats happening ill walk around and ask you. This is my how does this actually thats your, right . Yes. How does this stay on especially if an officer is in a tussle. How does this stay on these are pretty industrial strong clips and hold on pretty tight so dont fall off. The fact theyre recorded offsite to a tablet or phone that if they fall off you still have. Can we switch . Can i have yours . Is that a big deal to do . Id like to walk around the audience with yours. Lets do that. Here we go. All right. So this is the one. The officer would have there are different sorts. Right. Put that on for me. There are different sorts and i would imagine they would make it a bit sturdier and where it stays on better. Thats good if its better for a Police Officer. If its on a Police Officer. Right. So what do you think . And who gets to see this . Is there a designated person as i walk around here. That depends who buys the camera. When he buys it with his own money it ends up that he decides who gets to see it. When theres a policy in place it can be seen by a variety of policies in the city. That seems to be the big question of what should those policies be. Who gets access, under what situations, because its in the public record. Should anyone be able to get it with a request for any reason. We dont know. Okay, i understand that you have been selling out of these lately with what happened recently. Why is that . Whats going on . What were finding is a lot of Police Departments around the country are doing demos, trials and evaluations but while theyre doing that Police Officers are actually buying the cameras personally with their own money because theyre concerned and they dont want to be the next person accused of something and doesnt have the proof from their point of view that it didnt go down that way. So even if the department isnt buying these for the officers, officers buy them themselves just because they want to be protected. Well, interesting. You said protesters are buying these, as well. Were seeing protesters buy them in new york, as well. Why is that . I think a lot of them just want to make sure they have a record of what happened. Just in case theres misbehavior. Is it possible to tamper with these, with the video or with the outcome afterwards. These encode their video with a time and date stamp that cant be altered. If someone tries to edit the video it will be obvious its been edited. How do officers feel about these . Do they want to wear them or in general or no. I think my experience is generally its going to take a little while for officers to warm up to it because its new technology. Its going to take a little while but once officers learn of the potential benefits, absolutely. The problem is as he was pointing out is the policy about who gets to look at this. When i was a young Police Officer i intervupted two rapes in progress and those women have a right to privacy this isnt something that shows up on youtube. If don, youre having a fracas at your house and sandy and paul show up to mediate the dispute. Its your worst day you dont want that out on youtube so we have to have state level laws to handle the situation so the public cant get a request and have fun at someones expense on their worst day. Do you think this would have helped in ferguson. Part of the activity would have helped but the initial contact in the car wouldnt have helped at all and, don, you noticed it when you walked around the word. You have to be facing it in order for that to be useful, right so turn sideways to me right now. You wouldnt be facing me so the initial contact in the car would have not been reflected at all in the body camera. So, again, it can answer some questions, its not going to answer all the questions. Its not the panacea that everyone thinks it can be. Can it be useful but we have to make sure to tailor our expectations. We saw with eric garner, everything. We saw it. That didnt make a difference. So how is this going to make a difference . I think what testimony do, it will provide one representation in two dimensions from one perspective and maybe sandy wants to comment or maybe stacy but what happens about what you are perceiving and what is being recorded might be two very different things. All right. Do you think these will make a difference . No, i dont. Did you say no . No, i dont think there will be a difference because like you said we did have a camera for eric garner and it was from well, from his point of view it was a Third Party Person recording. And furthermore, what happens you get into a confrontation where its a shootout and then it shoots off or something happens to the camera. Is the data not there, nonexisting or do you only have what was previously recorded. I think its interesting because everyone relies on technology and wants improved technology but when it comes to this. How many do you think it will make a difference if you think raise your hand if you think theyll make a dinse. How many of you think they wont make a difference . New technology. You dont think itll make a difference. I think there have beto bto in place. If theres no system body cams wont help. How many times do you think itll be used against the perpetrator or why do you think that . Let me get over to you. Its kind of easy. You know, over in Staten Island we all saw the exact same thing and somehow what we saw wasnt really what we saw. Yeah. Its interesting because we would think that knowledge is power, right . And by having more cameras even if you hear a scuffle you might think it would be better and more information. But i am surprised so many people are buying these actually. Police officers, protesters, who else . Who else is buying this. Theyre used a lot about Police Officers and the protesters but see them used by other people who are in a position where they could be accused of something. Even People Security guards, private security guards are using them, as well because very often these lead to large legal battles of he touched me inappropriately and spoke to me inappropriately and leads to a settlement. I have to run. What are the costs for an average. This runs about 200, that one is about 400. Thank you very much. Up next, our cnn tonight special cops under fire are local Police Departments coming too mill that rised. First take a look at the tense scene new York City Police faced last week when they confronted an emotionally disturbed c intruder who entered a synagogue. The attacker was shot and killed. Right now, man. Hey, hey, hey. Whoa. Whoa, whoa, whoa. Whoa. [ bleep ]. Whoa, whoa, whoa. Hey. Drop the gun. [ shooting ] oh. The Volkswagen Golf was just named motor trends 2015 car of the year. So was the 100 electric egolf, and the 45 highway mpg tdi clean diesel. And last but not least, the High Performance gti. Looks like were gonna need a bigger podium. The Volkswagen Golf family. Motor trends 2015 cars of the year. [ applause ] we are back, everyone, with our live cnn tonight special of cops under fire. A lot of the criticism that has been leveled at police in the last couple of months since ferguson has to do with militarization or overmilitarization. Do armored car, snipers and police in full body armor keep the peace or do they make things worse so back with me now our team of Police Experts. I want to get a show of hands. Were you watching ferguson . Were you watching it initially . How many do you think with the way the police reacted made it worse . Show of hands. You do. You dont. No, no. But i want someone who doesnt. Because i think weve spoken a lot about people who said it did so i want hear from you why you think it didnt. I feel like theyre protecting us and should look like theyre protecting us and if they need a helmet and a shield and they need an armored car to get behind in case something gets bad, i like the idea that theyre protecting us. What do you think . Well, i think in the situation in ferguson, i think that it wasnt necessary. I think there were initially peaceful protests and i think when you bring guns and people see that and the shields and see everything i think that kind of brings a lot more emotion into the situation and people feel like they have to protect themselves from the people that are supposed to be protecting them. All right. Okay, so some of the officers on our panel believe that. You have questions about what happened initially in ferguson. Is that right . Yeah, i mean since i live there and ive worked with some of these agencies some of the things i dont understand for example there really isnt a need to wear the camouflage. You can a regular you can wear a regular uniform. I still dont understand. Maybe the chief will get upset but should have held a press conference and gone from head to toe explaining what hes wearing. If a brick comes flying he wont get his head tracked and a chest protector like Yadier Molina does. And i think if the we have would have explained that, held a press conference that that might have set a different tone. Most Police Officers serve their entire career and never fire their gun in the line of duty. You spent two decades in a s. W. A. T. If it turns to that it is within an instant. They were coming for worst case scenario. If this turns bad what are we going to do. If someone starts shooting at us we got a place to retreat. We cant wait a minute. Stop the shooting. We have to get more equipment. Even if it hasnt started youre what are you supposed to do. With the expectation that the worst can happen. Yeah, timeout, wait a minute. There is no timeouts. You guys think that is fair . [ laughter ] hmm. I was on a pam with captain ron johnson and i didnt know this until ron told me a few days ago that Armored Vehicle that people saw or one of those Armored Vehicles used it multiple times to rescue people in the kill zone and got peppered with gunfire. Thats what the vehicle is. Neither paul or sandy can talk chapter and verse about how critical they are when used appropriate. When does protect and serve become them versus us. Ive been representing Police Officers for 33 years now. And it is its sad to watch on so many levels because i get to see these men and women and know what they do on a daily level and know what effect it has on their wife, children and i know what they go through and its tragic weve lost sight of the fact they do protect and serve and, again, weve lost sight of it. Andre, you had a question about what you can and cant do when being arrested. My question is, what exactly is resisting arrest . Is it raising your hands . Is it asking the Police Officer a question. Is it backing away. Exactly what is resisting arrest and what we can and cant do. Go ahead. Hes a lawyer. Thats a legal question. This becomes a legal question. Resisting arrest is defined by every state and unfortunately, we have a Legal Definition but its application on the street is really what youre asking, i think is it what can i expect and the answer is, you can expect that if you treat a Police Officer with the same respect that you want, you are by and large going to get that same respect. Oh, youre going to get it. Youre going to get it. Do you guys believe it . No. Thats been my observatioobs why dont you believe it . Why dont you believe it . What did you say. It depends who you ask because i could i mean for some of us who deal with these things every day the reality is we can be sweet as pie and if an officer or anyone has a preconceived notion about me hes going to react based off of that so, again, it depends who you ask. Well talk about this more and talk about you think race plays into it. Absolutely. How many people do . A show of hands. Okay. All right. Were going to talk about that and you can join the conversation at home. Make sure you use copsunderfire. Well be right back with more from you and from our studio audience. First look at this. A Police Pursuit in fortville, indiana. Matt fox was critically wounded in the incident two years ago but he survived and all started because of a broken taillight. Turn it on. The keys off. [ sirens ] music. The getaway vehicle for all the confidence you need. Td ameritrade. You got this. Youre down with crestor. Yes when diet and exercise arent enough, adding crestor lowers bad cholesterol up to 55 . Crestor is not for people with liver disease, or women who are nursing, pregnant, or may become pregnant. Tell your doctor all medicines you take. Call your doctor if you have muscle pain or weakness, feel unusually tired, have loss of appetite, upper belly pain, dark urine, or yellowing of skin or eyes. These could be signs of serious side effects. Im down with crestor make your move. Ask your doctor about crestor. [ applause ] welcome back, our live coverage, cops under fire and with me Police Experts from around the country answering questions. Do you think the protests around the country are helping or hurting . What do you think . Hurting. Hurting. Why . Its inflaming people and its not its hurting the dialogue. Were not talking about the issues. Were talking about the emotions. Helping or hurting audience. Audience helping. This is peoples form of dialogue. Thats the whole issue that people feel like their voices have not been heard until now. This is a greater conversation than for decades. Weve not had any sort of real and the fact people are expressing their emotion. We should be letting that out and should be putting it out there in some form or other and the fact it is a protest and its been peaceful is beautiful. We have no disagreement with you about the peaceful part. The part were concerned about is the people that are going out of control, hurting cop, burning places down, so on and so forth. Thats what my concern is. Well, go ahead. They cant ruin the whole you had 60,000 people in new york city and you had this incident on the Brooklyn Bridge. Thats all im hearing about. Thats some two or three days later. What about the ones there that were expressing themselves peacefully. We have no problem with that, maam. But were focusing on those cops would say the same thing. Were out there vast majority and had one incident and it all blows up. Okay, so, race, how much do you believe race plays into this . Right, do you think race plays into right, 100 you guys say that, okay. Had you a question about race. What was it. Hi, so in light of the one black officer not being here today, i think that blacks are scrutinized more in the media, the judicial system and Law Enforcement so my question is, if black Police Officers patrolled mostly black neighborhoods, do you think that would make a difference . What i can say the Research Shows in terms of use of force at least the answer is no, believe it or not, the first studies on the use of deadly force were conducted by a gentleman by the name of james fife. Jim passed several years ago unfortunately. What he was able to do is look at all the uses of deadly force by nypd officers in the early 1970s and found something interesting. Black officers were more likely to shoot than white officers and looked at who other things. Where did they work and live and what he found out once you control for where an officer works and where he lives because many excuse me, many Police Shootings happen off duty the race effect goes away so the black and white officers confronted with the same situation shoot at about the same rate. Similarly in st. Louis, ive looked at every officer involved shooting for the decade that ended in 2012. About a third of the cops in st. Louis are black. About a third of the shooters in st. Louis are black. And so what we what this suggests at least quite strongly is Police Officers, black, white, hispanic, meal, female respond to the threat presented to them. Do you guys talk about this amongst each other, is it part of your training, race, perception. Yes, absolutely. The houston pliskova department puts Cultural Diversity classes on all the time inservice classes. Mandatory. And its mandatory training. You have a question . In light of what youre saying, though, if we did have black officers and black communities, would there be more respect . Would there be a better understanding between the community and police force instead of this us versus them mentality. Why is there an us versus them mentality. I want to make a comment on the stat, the number of white officers versus black officers. To answer your question, we need more black officers. We dont have enough to put them in all the neighborhoods that youre talking about. They said its hard is it hard to find black officers . A lot of them dont apply and the ones we do in houston we do do have a fairly diverse police department. I just think that nationally its just hard to get that many that want to be cops. Don its a huge issue. I represent the Police Officers association and the department itself is constantly recruiting to have a diverse class and you cant get people to apply. Where is olivia olivia, you had a question, you said. Do you believe elevate the Police Presence. Yes, do you believe elevated Police Presence in lowincome communities is a necessity and if so why or is it more motivated by racial stereotyping or prejudice . Does it hurt or help to have more presence there. I think its good for everybody. For the Police Officers and the people that live there. It creates an officer safety issue or an officer feels a little more comfortable getting out of his car and walking in, being more interactive i worked for the first six years in houston in third war houstd n texas. Do you think theres a race problem when it comes to police . Do you guys feel that . These people most of them here are saying there is. Do you believe that. I dont think theres a race problem so much its an understanding maybe different cultures. I mean race hispanic kid shot me but that doesnt mean i dont like hispanic kids. I was raised by a hispanic lady. We have to train our officers to, you know, prepare for the worse and hope for the best. Because and you showed up here. Half of you looked at it was thinking id shot after but after the effect what are we supposed to do. Expectation people want us to get shot before we do anything . Ive been there. It frickin hurts. I dont want to be shot. I had a question from someone that says why doesnt it get covered when someone white gets shot. The media plays a big part in this. Our experience in houston if we had a huge s. W. A. T. Callup, be out all night long and at the end the media is there and say did anybody get shot, no, we used tactics and took the suspect in without being hurt and, well, it didnt make the news at all. Well be right back. Better menu at red lobster with more of what you love try our newest woodgrilled combination maine lobster, extra jumbo shrimp, and salmon so hurry in and sea food differently. Dad,thank you mom for said this oftprotecting my future. You. Thank you for being my hero and my dad. Military families are uniquely thankful for many things, the legacy of usaa Auto Insurance could be one of them. If youre a current or former military member or their family, get an Auto Insurance quote and see why 92 of our members plan to stay for life. But the comfort it provides is its justimmeasurable. Ece the america red cross brings hope and help to people in need every 8 minutes, every day. So this season give something that means something. Weve learned we can all do a better job. We should continue to have these conversations. Thank you, everyone. I appreciate it. Im don lemon. Good night. Good evening, thanks for joining us. In pakistan the death toll is rising and sense of shock and loss is deepening as they try to understand the act of terror against chilling. A 911 bloodbath coming soon to a theater near you. The question is who is behind it and is it, in fact, north korea and if so, whats next . Plus, with the horror still fresh in sydney, australia, well profile the heroes that came forward and saved lives and tried to their best to save the day. We begin tonight with that terror attack in pakistan