Days to slow the spread, initially it started at 15. Were you part of the decision to implement that decision . I was very much involved in that. Did that decision save lives, dr. Fauche . I believe it did. Then when President Trump met with you and dr. Birx to extend that another 30 days, do you agree with that decision that President Trump made to extend that . Yes, i was very much involved and i agree with it. Did that decision save lives, dr. Fauche . I believe it did. So i know weve heard a lot about disagreements, clearly there are many decisions made. In fact, there is are many very internationally respected doctors that are involved in each of those decisions, is that correct . Yes. By and large would you say that President Trump has been in agreement on most of those decisions. We were in agreement on virtually all of those. I appreciate that. Now i want to ask you, dr. Giroir, admiral giroir, on the testing that youve been involved in to help carry out parts of President Trumps plan, you just talked about over a million testing machines, is aminute machine, that will be brought into Nursing Homes across this country. I know ultimately its going to be 15 n. O. W. Over a thousand machines that are going to be delivered already. The is that plan in place in moving forward based on President Trumps guidance . It is. And that money in part was taken from the cares act, the bill that we worked with President Trump to pass in a bipartisan way through this congress, is that correct . Yes, sir, thats correct. And i have heard specifically from nursing home directors who have told me that this decision will save more lives in Nursing Homes. Have you heard the same . There is no question. I dont think any single decision has had more positive feedback than that one. And i know early off cms put out guidelines back in march. These were part of many of the guidelines that cms put out on guidance to prevent covid spread in Nursing Homes. We know that 45 governors followed this guidance. Five governors did not follow this guidance, and we saw in those states tens of thousands of seniors in Nursing Homes died who shouldnt have died if this guidance was followed by those governors. Do you think that would have saved more lives . As i have testified here before, i think its a very concerning practice to send an infectious person back to a nursing home. Well, thank you, and i wish those governors would have followed the guidance that President Trumps team put out as part of a major overall plan. Now, dr. Redfield, i want to talk about you about reopening schools. I know youve been very involved in this. Cdc has put out multiple documents for guidance of reopening schools, here, checklist for parents and for teachers, guidance kthrough 12 administrators on the use of cloth face masks in schools. I know some people want to make that controversial. This is President Trumps plan, part of his plan to safely reopening schools, talks about the use of masks. Here youve got school decisionmaking tool for parents, caregivers and guardians. Are these all parts of the president s plan to safely reopen schools . Yes. Have you been involved in developing that with President Trump . Yes. Do you think that schools should safely reopen this fall with inperson learn . Yes. I think its important to realize that its in the Public Health best interest of k through 12 students to get back in facetoface learning. Theres really very significant Public Health consequences of the school closure. El, for example, they lack the ability to detect child abuse that occurs and is detect often in schools. Do you know how much child abuse will not be detected if children arent returning to the school . Clearly were seeing less reporting of it it, and, again, i think its a direct consequence of the school closures. 7. 1 million kids get their Mental Health services at school, two traditional support as we mentioned from schools. Were seeing an increase in drug use disorder as well as suicide in at less ent individuals, so i do think its really important to realize its not Public Health versus the economy about school opening. Its Public Health versus Public Health of the kthrough 12 to get the schools open. Weve got to do it safely and be able to accommodate. I a that and know were out of time. I hope the School Systems follow President Trump and the great medical doctors guidance and help the kids in safely reopening. I thank the witnesses and, mr. Chairman, i yield back. The chair now recognizes mr. Maloney for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman and thank you, mr. Rank member marx and i want to thank all of our witnesses today, particularly dr. Fauci who was born in the great city of new york in the beautiful borough of brooklyn. New yorkers are very proud that you were a new york raised and new york doctor before you became americas doctor, and i must say that as the chairman mentioned when we had our hearing on march 11th which i was privileged to chair when i asked you how was it going to go, you say its going to get worse and worse and worse, and the next day everybody started closing down. Sports clubs, museums and treating it with the seriousness that the disease had to be treated with. At that hearing when asked about testing, you said, and i quote, that were not really geared up to do what we need right now. In fact, you said, and you called it failing. Now its five months later. Where would you rate us now in our efforts . I know my city and other cities have worked diligently trying to respond. Where would you put us now with testing, and what do we have to do to continue to get better . Well, i think you can get a more detailed response from admiral giroir, but ill comment. I think that things are considerably different and improved now than it was several months ago, both for the numbers of tests that have been improved as well as for the efforts that are going into to expand our capability. In other words, to more prudently have screening testing done in one segment as well as testing to determine diagnosis and followup in others. Dr. Giroir is much Better Qualified to give you the details of that have. But i would like to now move to vaccines. Thats the challenge now. The and i recall reading are one of your reports on aids and you said i will never retire until we have a vaccine. We still dont have a vaccine for aids. Ebola took five years. How realistic is a vaccine . Is it dreaming or is it a reality or are the protocols as safe as they probably could be as weve always had for vaccines . Can you give us an honest assessment of where our country is in Vaccine Development. Its reality, congresswoman maloney. I think it will occur. I think the difference between hiv and coronavirus is so different that i dont think you compare them because the body does not make a have good i municipal response against hiv so it makes Vaccine Development very difficult about the body does make a robust immune response against coronavirus which tells us that i believe that we can get to that goal. I know to some people seems like it is so fast that there might be compromisinging of safety and in scientific integrity it, and i can tell you that is absolutely not the case. The rapidity with which were doing it is as a result of very different technologies at getting from the time we recognized this pathogen in the beginning of january to the time we were able to get into a phase one trial to the time we were able to do phase two and then, as i mention just this past monday, we started a phase three. That was not reckless rushing. That was technology and doing things in a way that does not compromise any of the steps. So i believe that its realistic, as i mentioned in my Opening Statement, that the early data from the phase one trial shows that this candidate and im sure other candidates will do it also. This is not the only vaccine. There are more than one. There will are about a dozen, five or six that the federal government is actively involved with, is going into phase three trials over the next few months, as i mentioned, one of which is already in. The response that was induced is really quite favorable and ive said off and will repeat it for the record now. Theres never a guarantee that youre going to get a safe and effective vaccine, but from everything that weve seen now in the animal data as well as the early human data, we feel cautiously optimistic that we will have a vaccine by the end of this year and as we go into 2021, so i dont think its dreaming, congresswoman. I believe its a reality, and it will be shown to be a reality. Thats a very good news. The second step is how do we distribute it, and also reports are that china and russia are involved in their tests and that they have advanced tests across the recalled would. They are testing in brazil, indonesia for their vaccines. Should they develop one earlier, would we manufacture it here . When we develop, it how do we plan to distribute it . We also have to think about the world because if we dont cure it in the world, then we havent cured it, so the steps forward after the vaccine is developed. Sure. A couple of questions there. Ill try to answer them quickly, congresswoman. So, the first thing is i do hope that the chinese and the russians are actually testing the vaccine before they are administering vaccine to anyone because claims of having a vaccine ready to distribute before you do testing i think is problematic at best. We are going very quickly had. I do not believe that there will be vaccines so far ahead of us that we will have to depend on other countries to get us vaccines. I believe the program that is being sponsored by us right now and being directed and implemented by us is going at a very rapid speed, prudent but rapid. Now, with regard to distribution, already right now there are plans as was mentioned i believe by Ranking Member ask a lease, that were taking at risk, financial risk, not safety risk, but financial risk the development of doses of vaccines right now as we speak so that they will be ready by the time we do show safety and efficacy well be able to dust beaute it, and it will be done by a number of mechanisms, the standard mechanism working with the recommendation by the acip together with the cdc now being complimented by recommendations from the National Academy of medicine and in collaboration with the department of defense and the cdc working together it will be distributed. Thank you. My time has expired. Thank you very much, dr. Fauci. The chair now recognizes miss walowski for five minutes. Thank you, gentlemen, for your service. Arguably the most important thing that the federal government is working on, and im an optimist, still optimistic that well use the term when if not when getting through a vaccine and that we have manufacturing and distribution to get it across the country quickly. I believe that. President trump has announced operation warp speed to achieve the goal of offering 300 million doses of a vaccine by january 2021. Its leveraging the public and private partnerships that are there and becoming partnerships, unprecedented in this country and i salute that. Astrazeneca told the energy and Commerce Committee that this deal with the federal government stipulates that it will sell 300 million doses to the government at no profit. Johnson johnson similarly said it will provide its vaccine at a notforprofit price and other companies have offered low prices. Between the promises of low prices and existing Government Programs that cover the costs of a vaccine, is it safe to say that every american will will be able to get a vaccine once its approved . Given what youve mentioned which i agree, the promises of the company about hundreds of millions of doses, i believe ultimately over a period of time in 2021 if we have and i think we will have a safe and effective vaccine, that americans will be able to get it. I dont think that well have everybody getting it immediately in the beginning. It probably will be phased in, and thats the reason why we have the committees to do the prioritization of who should get it first, but ultimately within a reasonable period of time the plans now allow for any american who needs a vaccine to get it within the year 2020. Right, and that is the plan. Staying on the topic, dr. Fauci, its my understanding that operation warp speed enabled Clinical Trials for the most promising vaccine candidates to be run multily which will get a vaccine to market much more faster than normal. My understanding from listening to you a few minutes ago, we have eliminated no safety steps in the vaccine approval process, correct . That is correct. Again, just to be clear, so the folks that are watching there are hearing this clearly, concisely and truthfully from you, the fda is not compromising Safety Standards in order to speed up vaccine process approval, correct . Well, i would say it a different way. Okay. We at the nih are doing the vaccine studies with the companies. The fda will look at that data and on a sciencebased decision will make a determination as to the safety and fkase and whether or not it will be approved so the fda is a sciencebased decisionmaker. But as far as you know in that, i agree, but the fda is not compromising Safety Standards . No. No way, no how is the fda compromising Safety Standards and their answers and approvals are based on science. Historically the fda have based their decisions on science. They will do it also, im sure. Appreciate it. Thanks for the a i insurances well have a safe, affordable and widely available vaccine for america. All of america is praying one of these promising candidates comes through. Thats why im so disappointed weve seen some on the other side of the aisle speculate aloud that the Administration Much rush an unsafe vaccine to the market before the market to help President Trump politically. This irresponsible rhetoric only serves to plant irrational fears in the minds of americans. Im worried that enough of these types of attacks could result in people avoiding an approved vaccine when it does come to market, when it is available for americans. Dr. Fauci, can you address this once and for all. Would the administration approve a vaccine thats not safe, and do you share my concern about the danger of undermining faith in the Vaccine Development process . The commission of fda dr. Stephen hahn has assured me and spoken publicly that he would make sure that any decision on the part of the fda will be based on sound Scientific Data proving the safety and the efficacy. Hes told me that and hes been very public about that. Given that, i think the American Public should be assured that in the process of determination the safety and efficacy the proper steps have been taken to determine that it, and when a vaccine becomes available its important for their own health and for the health of the country to take that vaccine. Appreciate that. Thank you, gentlemen. I cant let this moment pass without bringing to all of our attention again and to the chairman that just last week the Justice Department indicted two chinese nationals for hacking had companies that are working on a vaccine. We sent a strong message to china that this will not be tolerated. Im glad the administration took action by naming and shaming those involved as well as closing down a chinese consulate that was a hub for intellectual property and trade secret theft. We must hold china accountable, mr. Chairman. We have to. Mr. Chairman, before i close, can you commit to holding a hearing on the threat of chinese espionage on chinese products, vaccine producers, mr. Chairman, whoever is sitting in for mr. Chairman . Will you prompts me that we will hold a hearing on the threat of chinese espionage on vaccine producers . The chairman is not here to answer the question. You have a few seconds left. Your time has expired. Mr. Chairman, this is a grave threat. Thank you. For the record, this is a threat of Chinese Companies hacking our country and i seriously hope the chairman will take my recommendation. I yield back. I will now recognize myself for five minutes. On july 10th the Trump Administration ordered hospitals to change how they reported hospitalization rates, testing numbers and other data related to the coronavirus. Instead of reporting to the cdc, which hospitals have done for more than a decade, they were instructed to start reporting data to the Trump Administration directly, specifically the department of health and human services. They were given just two days to prepare for this drastic change leading Health Groups warned that the changes in data reporting will worsen our ability to mitigate, suppress and recover from our national Public Health emergency, unquote. The other experts are concerned that this decision may have been made so that the Trump Administration could control and hide data it finds politically inconvenient. Dr. Redfield, when did you first learn that the administration planned to move the data from cdc to a different portal run by hhs . Well, congressman, we werent directly involved in the final decision, but what i can say is that cdc then and now continues to have access to all data, does all Data Analytics so theres no restriction of any of the data, and that data will continue to forwardface the American Public. Dr. Redfield, when did you first learn . When were you first told . When were you first notified . Again, as i mentioned, i wasnt involved in the decision. So you were never am i to understand reclaiming my time. I dont report exact date. Am i to understand that you were not told at all . Well, i was told actually once the secretarys office made the decision that that was the decision, and the we worked together. So how long was that . I dont remember, but i can get back tout exact date. Okay. But we did work in cooperation to help make sure. Reclaiming my time. Did you agree with this decision, dr. Redfield . Again, i think it was an important decision in light did you agree with the decision . Yes, i said its an important decision. Thank you. Did you discuss this change with Vice President pence or with secretary ail czar . Not directly. Indirectly . I talked directly with the individuals responsible within the secretarys office. Did you discuss it with Vice President pence . No. Did you discuss it with secretary azar . No. Who told you about the reasons for this change . Well, i think we collectively understood the reasons, if i can answer, is there was substantial advancements in therapy petics with remdesivir which made it really important to be able to understand who was newly hospitalized in realtime that day so allocations of remdesivir could get to that hospital. I thank you very much for that. And so you developed the reasons. No one dictated the reasons or told you the reasons for the change. You came up with the reasons . Congressman, yes, i think it was important that we were able to in realtime be able to know where remdesivir needed to go, and the system that we had developed, the National Health care Safety Network that we do for so were you told about the changes, why they were being done, or did you and others develop the changes . Who told you . We worked together cooperative we work cooperatively, the members of the hhs and cdc in recognizing. Okay. I only have so much time. The Trump Administration has threatened to cut off the supplies of remdesivir to hospitals that do not follow the new reporting mandates. Dr. Redfield, this is the only drug known to successfully treat the coronavirus. Should a patient be denied access to it potentially a lifesaving drug like remdesivir because a hospital was unable to comply with the sudden change in hhs reporting requirements . Is it. My understanding is we continue to do everything to make sure remdesivir gets to all patients that would potentially benefit from it. But do you agree that they may not be able to get it to patients because of the way that the information was given and the time frame that gas given in . Congresswoman, i would disagree. I think the reason the changes were made was to ensure that patients could get access to remdesivir in a timely fashion. Would you agree that we basically well, this is the only drug known to successfully treat the coronavirus. Should a patient be denied access to a potentially lifesaving drug like remdesivir because a hospital was unable to comply with the sudden change in hhs reporting requirements . And, again, im trying to say i think the intent and the consequence of what was done was to ensure that patients arent denied access to remdesivir, to make sure we get timely distribution to the hospitals where these the patients are. Thank you very much. Im exhausted my time. Next, we will hear from mr. Foster, i believe. You are recognized for mr mr. Lukamire. Right now were saying far greater suicides than we are deaths from covid. Seeing far greater deaths from Drug Overdose than are above excess than were seeing deaths from covid. Since the pandemic began chal sales have increased by more than 25 and suspected Drug Overdoses have climbed 18 . Ive said this almost every hearing. We need to make sure were looking at both sides of this health care issue. Were targeting our approach to take care of those with covid but we also need to make sure we look at the severe unintended consequences like drug abuse, Domestic Abuse and child abuse that is taking place because of the shutdowns taking place around the country because these incidents will be around far longer than the virus itself. Dr. Redfield, do you believe the blanket shutdowns happening throughout the country are contributing to the drastic increases in suicides and domestic and drug abuse and the lack of cancer screenings and other things like that that weve sort of left out of the picture here as a result of our total focus on covid . Congressman, i thank you for the question. I think it is really important as we reopen america now that were much more surgical about those situations that are curtailed, so as you mentioned we clearly have consequences for the decrease in immunization in children, clearly consequences for the lack of cancer screening. There are clearly consequences for delayed surgeries that were elective that now are semielective. Clearly are consequenced, Substance Abuse and Mental Health services so it really is important as we reopen our nation that we really ensure that theres not these unintended consequences that i that i think the reality is did occur during march, april and may. You know, there was an article that appeared in one of the local magazines with regards to trying to quantify that figure, and they did, and they came up with a figure of around 65,000 people per month that were dying because of the lack of health care that was either being postponed, denied, waived, whatever, versus our total focus on covid. Dr. Fauci, i have watched a number of your press conferences and ive seen you articulate a lot about covid, but ive never seen you talk about this other part of the health care spectrum that we need to be concerning also. Would you like to comment on that and give me your position on that, please. Yes, i i actually have commented on that when ive said most recently talking about schools that i think that a default position, despite the fact that we have to have flexibility, would be to try as best as we possibly can in the context of the safety of the children and the teachers to open the schools for the very reasons that i think you mentioned and that dr. Redfield mentioned because of the negative consequenced on children from a psychological standpoint as well as the downstream unintended consequences on families. You know, one of the problems that we all have here on this committee is were sitting here looking at the consequences of a problem that we have with covid. Were looking at the consequences we have of not attending to the Health Care Needs of the rest of society and we have to sit here and figure out how do we manage this . How do you we look at both sides of this . How do we from 30,000 feet make sure that everybody is taken care of and our position, what would what would you recommend, dr. Rhettfield, in how we should approach this problem . Again, i just want to echo what dr. Fauci said earlier. We think that if you dr. Five things we can accomplish as much as we did in shutting down this nation, wear a face covering. All of those things will be able to put us back. Will put us back and we can address the other part of this as well. We can get back without these unintended consequences, face pavks, social distancing and hand heij im, staying smart about gatherings and staying out of crowded bars and restaurants. If we did those five things. Weve done modeling data. We get the same bang for the buck as if we shut the entire economy down. Okay. Now youve commented quite a bit this morning already on the School Openings and your comment was, you know, its not about the economy or Public Health, its about Public Health versus Public Health. Ive got some grandkids and i want them to go back to the school. Think for their own health we need to be doing it. I think you made the comment that you have grandchildren and would like to see that as well. Would you like to comment on the other part of this, again, the unintended consequence of the problems with child abuse thats not being reported because most of it a lot of of it is reported by teachers. Weve seen that go down. Weve seen emergency cases in Emergency Rooms go up as a result of this. Can you comment on that, please . Congressman, thank you. I want to reemphasize because i dont think i can emphasize it enough, the director of the centers for disease case, its in the Public Health interest in the k12 students to get inperson learning. Mental health care, children get it in school, reporting of sexual abuse and Domestic Abuse, mandatory in schools. The isolation that these adolescents are feeling that is now associated with increase, as you mentioned increased Drug Overdose deaths and now increased suicides, i think it is really important as a grandfather, 11 grandkids, i want these kids back in school. I have one grandchild with cystic fine circumstances i want it done smartly, but i think we have to be honest that the Public Health interest of the students in this nation right now is to get a quality education and facetoface learning and we need to get on it. The gentlemans time has expired. The chair now recognizes for five minutes miss velazquez. Thank you, mr. Chairman, and Ranking Member. Gentlemen. It has been six months since this crisis yet new infections are taking place. Thousands are dying. I am concerned about widespread delays and test results are contributing to this problem, and the test and positivity. They have been in delayed for up to 16 days. In florida, many hospitals are near or at capacity and results can take over a week n. Georgia, some companies have reported average times of five to ten days. Dr. Fauci, youve said in a recent interview, and i quote, if youre going to do Contact Tracing and test come back in five to seven days you might as we will not do Contact Tracing because its already too late. Dr. Fauci, if a fiveday testing delay is too long, then is it fair to say that a 16day delay is absurd. What are the consequences from these delays . I believe you can get a more detailed answer from admiral giroir, but as i said before, that is a delay that would interfere of the effectist Contact Tracing, and were trying to decrease that but the exact numbers of delays admiral giroir has more precise information on that. Yes, sir. What are the consequences . Yeah, thank you, maam. As i talked about it, about half the tests are done at either point of care or within hospitals which are pretty rapid. The current data we have from the large commercial labs or that 59 of all tests are reported within three days. 76 within five days and im sure theres an outlier at 12 to 16 days because that happens because thats very atypical and in the cities you talked about sir, that the not what we are hearing from places like arizona, florida and georgia. So i get the data every single morning from every single state and can tell you specifically what that is, and we have surge testing. We have brought federal resources to massively surge in phoenix and thats why its totally gone down, miami, totally gone down and jacksonville. Reclaiming my time. Dr. Redfield. Would i like to turn to you. Cdc has comprehensive information about the wait times for test results in all 50 states. Does the cdc have comprehensive information about the wait times for test results in all 50 states . I would remember that question back to the admiral. Sir . Yes. We have we have comprehensive information on wait times in all 50 states from the large commercial labs. And do you publish this data . We talk about it whenever always, i mean you dont think it would be important i was with 69 journalists yesterday and we talk about that frequently so if you would like to see that im very happy to do that. Well, it would be great so that those that are making decisions at the state and city level, that we would have access to that information. They do. It is important to understand. They do. They have that information. In fact, from the commercial labs when they place an order they are told exactly what the expected wait time is for that order. So we cannot expect to reopen the economy safely if the virus is spreading unchecked. Testing, Contact Tracing and isolation will not be effective unless we cut the turnaround time for tests, and i dont want to talk about puerto rico. Thats another story. Chairman powell said this week that the path of the economy will extend on the course of the virus and on the measures that we take to keep it in check. He said the fed will use its full range of tools to steer the economy out of resession. Gentlemen, is the federal government using its full range of tools to get the virus under control like other countries have . Many states are reconsidering their reopening plans after experiencing a shocking increase in new cases and being unable to stop the spread. Dr. Fauci, what roles does the lack of sufficient testing it and Contact Tracing play in states inability to control the virus . Testing and Contact Tracing is one of a number of tools that i used to control the kind of surging weve seen, but i would also like to point out, congresswoman velazquez, to reemphasize what i said again in my Opening Statement that we could do a really good job of controlling it if we paid attention to five fundamental principles, one of which is what were doing here with masks, crowds, distance, bars, washing hands. That is critical. Testing is absolutely an important part of it. And i understand that, but the largest and most important pulpit in the one on pennsylvania avenue. It doesnt matter what you said if what you said is undermined by the president of the united states. Gentle ladys time has expired. The chair now recognize for five minutes mr. Jordan. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Dr. Fauci, do protests increase the spread of the virus . Dr. Protests increase the spread of the virus . I think i can make a generally statement. Well, half had a million protesters on june 6th alone, im asking that number of people, does it increase the spread of the virus . Crowding together particularly when youre not wearing a mask contributes to the spread of the virus. Should we limit the protesting . Im not sure what you mean should how do we say limit the protesting . Does the government limit the protesting . I i i dont think thats relevant well, you just said if it increases the spread of the virus, im asking should we limit it . Well, im not in a position what a government can do in a forceful way. You make all kind of recommendations. You made comments on dating and baseball and everything you can imagine. You just said protests increase the spread. Should we try to limit the protest . No, i think i would leave that to people to people who are more in a position to do that. Government stopping people from going to church, dr. Fauci. Yeah. Last week in the cavalry chapel case five liberals on the Supreme Court said it was okay for nevada to limit Church Services, i mean, Justice Gorsuch said it best, theres no world in which the constitution permits nevada to favor Caesars Palace over calgary chapel. Is there a world where the constitution says you can face one Group Protesting over another practicing your faith . Im not favoring of anybody over anybody. Im just making a statement thats a broad statement that avoid crowds of any type no matter where you are because that leads to the acquisition and transmission, and i dont judge one crowd versus another crowd. When youre in a crowd, particularly if youre not wearing a mask, that but its a simple question, doctor. Should we limit the protests . Government is obviously limiting people going to church. Look im not theres been no violence that i can see at church. I havent seen people during a Church Service go out and harm Police Officers or burn buildings. Right. But we know for 63 days, nine weeks its been happening in portland. Right, yeah. One night in chicago, 49 officers were injured, but no limits to protests, but but, boy you cant go to church on sunday. I dont know how many times i can answer that. Im not going to opine on limiting anything. Im just going to tell you youve opined on a lot of things, dr. Fauci. Yeah. This is something that directly impacts the spread of the virus, and im asking your position on the protests. Yeah. Im well, im not going to opine on limiting anything. Im telling you what it is the danger, and you can make your own conclusion about that. You should stay away from crowds no matter where the crowds are government has stopped people from going to work. In fact, just in new jersey, four days ago, is ian smith, Frank Trombetta for opening up, for trying to operate their business, their gym. They were arrested, but i my bet is if these two individuals owned this gym were outside just in front of their gym and all the people who were working out in the their gym were outside protesting, they would have been just fine but because they were in the gym working out, actually running their business, they got arrested. Do you think thats okay . You know, im not going to opine on who gets arrested and who does not. I mean, i you get where im going . Im telling you as a Public Health official i said crowds do you see the inconsistency though, dr. Fauche . Theres no inconsistency, fauci. So youre allowed to protest millions of people on one day in crowds yelling, screaming, but you try to run your business and you get arrested and if you stood right outside of that same business and protested you wouldnt get arrested, you dont see any inconsistency there . I dont understand what youre asking me as a Public Health official to opine on who should get arrested or not. Thats not my position. You can youve advocated for certain businesses youve advocated for certain businesses to to be shut down. Im just asking you on your position on the protest. I havent seen one weve heard a lot about hair salons. I havent see one hairstylist who between haircuts goes out and attacks police or sets something on fire but weve seen all kinds of that stuff during protests and we know the protests actually increase the spread of the virus. Youve said that. I said crowds. I didnt say specifically. I didnt say protests. So the protests dont increase the spread of the virus . I didnt say that. Youre putting words in my mouth. No, i i just want an answer to the question. Do the protests increase the spread of the virus . I dont have any scientific. I can tell you crowds are known particularly when you dont have a mask to increase the acquisition and transmission no matter what the crowd is. You dont have a position on whether the protests increase the spread of the virus or dont increase the spread of the virus . Im saying that crowds, wherever the crowds are can give you an increase probability that theres going to be acquisition and transmission. But do you understand americans concern . Protesting according to particularly according to the democrats is just fine but you cant go to work, you cant go to school. You cant go to church. Theres limits placed on all three of those fundamental activities, but protesting is just fine. The gentleman e the gentlemans time has expired but i would just ask the gentleman to think about his question and put it in reference to crowds that gather in political at political meetings, at fundraisers without masks, on an oil rig in texas, nobody wearing a mask, nobody social distancing, but a fund raiser. Right. Would that be problematic . With that i yield five minutes to mr. Foster. Well, thank you, mr. Chairman. Dr. Knoche and dr. Redfield. Im a scientist as you are, and so you know how important it is that when a great scientific breakthrough reaches the public and the proper credit is given and not to shows who show up and claim credit at the press conferences but for the long list of federally funded researchers who make this possible and also to the enlightened federal employees and the politicians who funded that research. I remember back a few years ago when we had newspaper head lyons about all the miraculous concerns in cancer immunotherapy where i gave a floor speech on the u. S. Health, saying this is equally great with the federally funded researchers and the researchers who made the clinical breakthroughs possible and also frankly that some of the credit goes to the democratic and republican members of congress who resisted the proposals for massive budget cuts to science that were propose the by republicans for years, paul ryan budgets and trump and mulvaney cuts since then. In the case of the mnra vaccines so much in the use, the story does not start with operation warp speed. It does not even start with the historic 63day sprint from the publication of the viral genome to the first patient injected about the mnra test vaccines. The sprint began i believe when President Trump well, this sprint actually began when President Trump was still ridiculing the idea of the pandemic. The sprint actually started when dedicated employees at nih and moderna who understood the danger of covid19 and began working day and night. The story of federal investments in nmra vaccines actually starts i believe back in 2009 when president barack obama who was at the time unhappy with the speed of response to the h1n1 swine flu epidemic convened his scientificic Advisory Committee pcas which they did back in the days and famously asked them if you guys are so smart how come you still make vaccines with chicken eggs . One year later pcas put out a report on reengineering vaccine production for pandemics which emphasized the potential of new technologies to make vaccines and therapeutics available far fastener a pandemic. Heeding the vision of his Scientific Panel which they did back in those days in tweernt the Obama Administration awarded a 25 million grant to a startup called moderna to very many their mnra vaccine Pandemic Response platform. This was followed in 2015 by a 125 Million Investment by barta so that by the end of the Obama Administration moderna had mnra vaccines and therapeutics under tests in both animals and humans so why is it that the Obama Administration priortized mnra vaccines an therapeutics . Well, first off its their speed of development which we saw realized in the 63day sprint. Its the speed of manufacture which has to do with the high yields of in vitro fertilization transcription reactions and their potency. The exciting news of the last few months is that a potent human response comes from doses as low as 30 micrograms of mnra vaccine so 30 micrograms, what does that mean . What it means is that this oneliter bottle if it were full of mnra vaccine would contain over 30 million doses. This is enough to vaccinate every one of americans, doctors and First Responders and all of its seniors over 75 years old and thats why the Obama Administration invested in mnra vaccines and therapeutics starting back in 2009 and without those investments frankly project warp speed would not have squat. Now, dr. Fauci, would you agree that when there are great medical breakthroughs that the public needs to be reminded about the long line of federal r d thats led to vaccine and therapeutic successes that were anticipating . Yes, congressman, and it even goes beyond what youre saying. Everything you say is very well taken, and i think maybe its a good time to recognize the fact that the generosity of the congress through multiple administrations, both democratic and republican and whether or not the congress was controlled by democrats or republicans, the support for Biomedical Research that goes back decades leading to everything that youre talking about but even before then. Some of the Monoclonal Antibody work, some of the work thats being done with the molecules that are directly antiviral molecules. I think we often forgot that when we think of the product and often fourgame, as i think youve appropriately pointed out well, what are the scientific investments we should be making now to make sure were better prepared for future pandemics and how can we support the process by the kind of budget cuts were seeing in the trump and mulvaney budgets . Well, they have been proposed again and again. Anyway, looks like my time is up. Mr. Chairman, over here. I ask unanimous consent to enter into the record story from june 5th, 2020, underscoring what dr. Fauci wouldnt answer today. Dr. Fauci says large protests taking operation across the country are a perfect setup for spreading covid19. He said that a month ago even though he wouldnt say that today, a story from Business Insider and want to enter into the record a june 12th state to abc powerhouse politics that attending rallies, protests is risky even though today his position seems to have changed. Obviously his position has changed on many things many times over the last several months, but i would like to enter those two articles for the record. Ill yield to dr. Fauci. Like i said, any crowd, any crowd whether its a protest, any crowd in which you have people close together without masks is a risk, and ill stick by that statement. Its a Public Health statement. Its not a judgment on why youre there in the crowd. Its a statement related to the fact that youre in a crowd. Thank you, dr. Fauci. Mr. Chairman mr. Chairman, i didnt ask him a question and you let him respond. I was making unanimous concept. And im going to run this meeting. I would like a chance to respond to what he just said. Im going to chair this meeting. I understand youre the chair, thats why i said mr. Chairman. Without objection your statements, whatever youve got there, will be entered into the record, and without objection. In a gathering whether youre protesting are or whether youre politicking, any gathering would be risky, and thats what the man has said. But thats not thats not whats happening. Thats my point thats not whats happening. People cant go to church or to work mr. Chairman, that gentleman is out of order. But they can protest all they want. That goes for the democrats and republicans. Ill make the decision as to who is out of order. Im going to be as gentlemanly as you will allow me to be. I appreciate it, mr. Chairman. Well, thank you. And with that, five minutes to mr. Green. Thank you, chairman and Ranking Member and witnesses for your Amazing Service to our country. Thank you. First, dr. Fauci, there was a bit of an uproar about a picture of you at the nationals game without your mask on. I think you were seated with your wife. You had a close friend there with no one else nearby you and that gentleman who was with you had his mask on. I think you have said in the press since that you were you took it off to take a drink of water. I just want to point out according to an article in the new england journal of medicine and i quote significant exposure to covid19 means facetoface contact within six feet with a patient with symptomatic covid19 that is sustained for at least a few minutes and some say more than ten minutes or even 30 minutes. The chance of catching covid19 from a passing interaction in a public space is, therefore, minimal, end quote. The science seems to be pretty clear we should absolutely wear masks when were in close contact with those outside of our household. I think that was just the conclusion of that discussion. Its not a crime to pull your mask off to take a drink of water in 100degree temp are tour when youre seated next to your wife and someone else, is there . I guess i make the point to show how the media has created all of this hype which has led to some officials across the country making decisions that are not based on science, and there are real consequences to those. If people are hot, they shouldnt get heat stroke and not take their mask of course, so i would like to move on to some other troubling actions that were done this week. This week the chairman of the committee sent four letters all to republican governors in red states demanding extensive documents related to coronavirus response. The White House CoronavirusTask Force Report has 21 states listed in the socalled red zone. The this isnt about transparency. Its about ridiculing four states including my home state of tennessee and it distorts the truth. The letter singled out four gop states but, you know, what about the other 17 states. Why why didnt california get included in the letter . They have seen an explosion in positive cases. They are in the spike. They are in the 21 listed red zone states. Targeting only republican governors when clearly 17 other states,age of whom are democrat, are also experiencing the spikes and in the red zone shows this effort has nothing to do with getting answers, and is, as the chairman has said in his opening comments, politics over science. No scientist who wants the truth samples just republicans. Honestly, its a laughable partisan strike. It also compounds the insult to all americans for the failure of this committee to look at the real culprit. As i said in previous testimony, Columbia University study showed that 60 66 of american deaths could have been prevented if china had spoken up one week earlier. Thats thousands of american lives that could have been saved so instead of addressing the cause of 66 of our casualties, the select committee on the coronavirus picks on american businesses, the Trump Administration and now four state governors all republican when we know other blue states are in the exact same situation. This is the definition of partisanship, but i i can hear it now. Didnt the right send a letter to certain governors and yes we did, we sent it to every single governor who refused to follow the trump plan, emphasis on plan, and sent covidpositive patients back to Nursing Homes killing patients we didnt slight just a few of those. I applaud congressman foster who approached me as a physician and asked me to join a bipartisan partnering with the administration to assist in this the execution of operation warp speed plan. Thats how we should be functioning. That kind of bipartisan action. Finally, on a positive note, i wanted to mention the swedish study and then ask dr. Fauci some questions about that because i think it really illuminates some of the exciting findings in science. Tcells are a type of white blood cell. They regulate immune response. The swedish study found that many people with mild asymptomatic covid demonstrates socalled tcell immunity to the coronavirus. The study furs found that twice as many who tested positive for antibodies had tcell immunity. So we know there are tons of people out there with immunity that we arent testing, and i would love for you, sir, if you could comment, educate america and educate all of us a little bit on tcell immunity and what the ramifications are to the plan. Thank you. Thank you very much, sir. Ill very quickly try to answer that. There are two limbs. I mun response. One is an antibody which is a protein that is made by the cells of the body to bind to the virus and is usually the hallmark of protection against infection. Theres another limb. I mun response called the cellular immune response of tcells, and those tcells have the capability of essentially suppressing or killing cells that are infected and preventing the cells that are infected from making new viruses. So there are two parts of it. Even though one is generally felt to be protecting against the initial infection, the other is an important complement, and youre right. The swedes came out with a paper and also a paper from nih grantees from la jolla just came out in the journal cell showing the same thing, that an individual who was infect the and recovered had tcell responses and there was tcell activity detected in nonexposed individuals which means that maybe theres some memory from other coronaviruses that are benign cold viruses that youre exposed to that might, and i say might, explain why some people, even children, might be protected that they had exposure thats not measured in antibody but measured by tcells. This is work that we really need to pursue. Were just at the cusp of understanding the importance of this type of response in covid19. Thank you. Thank you. The jets time has expired. About as i yield to mr. Raskin for five minutes, may i address the letter which i have responded to. You have an answer from me. You have not seen the answer. Just okay. Well, just be sure since you put the lacombestettler on the record here, let me put my response on the record. My response had to do with the four states that have refused to comply with the critical recommendations from the task force and all four have governors who have publicly stated that they do not plan to comply. In contrast to that we did not send the letter to those states that did indicate that they were that they will comply with the task force and thats three of those states had republican governors and they did not get a letter from us, so this has nothing to do with partisanship but with political response rather than responding to the science and i respond to that. With that i yield to mr. Raskin for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman, for calling this hearing on the urgent need for a national plan. The a stack of paper is not a plan. A large and unwielding stack of paper is not a plan. A plan is a comprehensive and coordinated strategy for victory, and we havent seen anything like that a plan. No one has shown us anything. Blaming other countries is not a plan. Blaming china is not a plan. Blaming china is not even a good excuse for the heathal incompetence and disinformation of President Trump. Chinas early coverup of the disease only deepens the responsibility and complicity of President Trump who on 37 different occasions, as ive demonstrated by submissions to this committee, defended and excuse asked and praised the Chinese Government and president xi. A plan is a plan, and we havent heard what the plan, is and this is what has bedeviled us from the beginning. Mr. Chairman, weve got 4. 4 million cases. We lead the world in case count. We lead the world in death count. More than 153,000 americans are dead right now. The 54 Million People filed for unemployment benefits. Weve seen a onethird drop in gdp, a onethird drop, unprecedented in economic activity. The chart behind me demonstrates the astonishing and terrifying growth of this disease. It took us 88 days to reach 1 million cases, it took us 44 days to teach 2 million cases can. It took 26 days to reach 3 million cases and it took us only 15 days to reach 4 million cases. Director redfield, when do you estimate were going to get to 5 million cases . Whats next . Thank you, congressman. I think one thing ive learned about this virus is its not predictable. I will say one thing thats important, that what happens next is really dependant upon if the American Public fully embrace what weve asked. If they fully embrace those five steps, well get control of of this pandemic. Well, i thank you for that and i thank both you and dr. Fauci for restating the absolute imperative importance of everybody wearing their masks when they are out in public and everybody maintaining social distance and following the other Public Health protocols but the Public Health officials have been subjected to harris president and weve seen some today, have been subjected to ridicule and subjected to ludicrous absurd contradiction, so i want to go through some of the propaganda and disinformation quickly just as a Public Service announcement because america is watching you, and dr. Fauci, why dont i start with you. Are children almost immune to the disease . Just why or no because ive got a lot to get through. Are children almost immune to the disease . Okay. Be a little more prosise, almost immune, do children get infected . Yes, they do . Hundreds of thousands of children been infected . Hundreds of thousands of children infected, so children are not immune to the disease. Is covid19 going to magically disappear, dr. Fauci . I do not believe it would disappear because its such a highly transmissable virus. It is unlikely that its going to disappear. Does wearing a mask give people covid19 . Does wearing give it, no, not to my knowledge. Okay. Is covid19 a hoax . No. Should people take hydroxychloroquine as a cure for covid19 . The overwhelming cumulative evidence of properly conducted randomized controlled trials indicate no therapeutic efficacy for hydroxychloroquine. Can people cure themselves of covid19 by injecting themselves with disinfactant or bleach . No. Are you safe for the disease if you go to one of the aforementioned large assemblies, crowds, demonstrations without a mask on and not observing social distancing if you sign a waiver that you wont sue the sponsor of the event . Im not so sure those things are connected but ill repeat what ive said multiple times, that being in a crowd particularly without a mask is a risk for acquisition and transmission. Okay. But signing a waiver doesnt confer any kind of immunity on you from being infected by the disease