Transcripts For CNNW Anderson Cooper 360 20141021

Youre absolutely right. This will sound familiar. Let me preface it by saying if you listen closely to what dr. Frieden said earlier today, he pointed out that the dallas hospital was using the correct cdc guidelines they had issued, but those guidelines were inadequate. Heres what theyre saying now. First of all, anybody who is going to be taking care of a patient with ebola has to be fully tlaned and has to have that training proven, some kind of competency training. There will be people on site who will observe people both putting on and taking off that garb just like the Doctors Without Borders. The most important point, something weve talked about a lot, there cant be any skin showing. No skin exposed when the garb is put on under these new guidelines. Seemingly a basic point with all that everybody has learned about ebola and how it is transmitted through bodily fluids that get on the skin. An important thing would be to cover the skin. Thats whats going to happen now. I honestly dont understand why their guidelines werent like this from the beginning. Again i go back to msf, Doctors Without Borders, who has been battling this for a long time. Every group i know of operating in high beer ya, guinea or sierra leone, theyre all using the standards set by Doctors Without Borders. The idea that the cdc and dr. Frieden was very vocal in saying, yeah, it would be fine to have your skin showing in certain cases depending on the level of the infection that the person had. He was trying to make a distinction. Look, if you dont have intensive contact with a patient, if the patient is not particularly sick at the time, you dont have to worry about it or you dont have to worry as much about it, i should say. If you have much more contact with the patient during the time theyre sick, you need to dress at a higher legal of protection. The problem is, anderson, i think youre alluding to this, its difficult to pinpoint when someone will be more at risk. Someone who is taking care of a patient who is starting to get nauseated, could they be at risk if that person was to have vomiting, that sort of thing . Its too loose. And the point is this, if youre taking care of a sick patient with ebola, you should have your skin covered. This whole sort of distinction they were trying to make made no sense. Surprisingly and i think this will be important, dr. Frieden has sort of conceded that. The guidelines that were existing up until this point were inadequate. I think they were, you and i talked about it, thats now going to be corrected. Sanjay, stay with us. I want to bring in senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen and dr. Seema yazmin. I want to talk to the nurse i spoke to last week, she explained the lack of protective gear they had. Was your neck exposed . Absolutely, yes. Theres a what part of your neck . Well, the zipper ended about here on me, and the hood ended about here on me. And, you know, this part right here made a triangle that was open. It was completely open. And the very first time that they were instructing me how to put this on is exactly the point when i said, why would my neck be exposed . Why do i have on two pairs of gloves, tape, a plastic suit covering my whole body, two hoods, a total of three pairs of booties including the one on my tyvek suit, an apron and my entire body is covered in at least two to three layers of plastic and my neck is hanging out. Elizabeth, i guess i just dont understand why these protocols were not put in place months ago. Doctors without borders, again, has been using protocol like this for years now. Has the cdc said anything about why theyre so late to the game with this . I had the same question. Red cross is also observing these protocols when i was in liberia. Dr. Frieden observed these protocols when he was touring liberia, sanjay pointed out before. Sanjay really hit the nail on the head which is they were sort of looking at this on paper and saying certain exposures maybe youre not that close to the patient and you dont need to be as completely covered. But in practice, once youre taking care of a patient, it can be a millisecond from not so much exposure to a lot of exposure. So i think and here you can see that these folks are completely, completely covered. And this is in africa. And so i think what happened was that they didnt do these guidelines in collaboration with Doctors Without Borders, with folks who had actually been on the ground. Remember, they came up with these guidelines before they started treating patients in the United States. And so i think one criticism of the cdc has been that theyre very smart on paper but that people dont take care of patients on paper. They take care of them in reality. One lesson that i hope was learned is that you collaborate with people who have actually done the work. The minute that emory started taking care of patients, they should have immediately collaborated with them back in august. Look at our guidelines. How did you tweak them . Because emory did not follow these guidelines. They tweaked them so they were more useful. Cdc should have collaborated. Dr. Anthony fauci said that the earlier guidelines were based on a World Health Organization model for care in remote places often outdoors and without intensive training for Health Care Workers. Does that make sense to you . Wouldnt a place like that require even more stringent protocol . Yes, i think so. I heard those same comments from dr. Fauci. What he was referring to were some of the conditions where people were screening patients. I wasnt entirely clear they had ebola. Im not sure exactly what the guidelines are for the w. H. O. But the risk reward sort of relationship is what he was talking about, the idea that you dont want to make these protective gears so cumbersome that theyre challenging to put on and off in remote situations, that you cant train people to do it, so you make it as simple as possible while still protecting people, but again the problem here is that those guidelines here did not protect people, did not offer adequate protection. I think thats why these two nurses became infected. Dr. Yasmin, is this typical to see guidelines revised multiple times . It can happen, anderson, in such a quickly changing situation. Weve worked so far on guidelines for about 38 years. Clearly this is the first time were seeing ebola in the setting of a highly sophisticated American Hospital where things like intunation are happening, dialysis, ebola patients in africa dont get those types of high level, high risk procedures. We do have the change things as the situation changes. I cant speak enough to the fact that its not just the gear. Its the train. You have to have the training. Elizabeth, to dr. Yasmins point, Training Like this it takes a long time. And practice takes a long time. And this hospital, Presbyterian Hospital was unlucky enough to get first patient, but i think a lot of hospitals across the country would have failed this test. Absolutely. I was actually pespeaking with someone from a major hospital. She said, i have to get off the phone, were doing our ebola training. When did you start that . She was like, last week. Wow, youre kidding me. The cdc put out emails saying, hey, guys, get ready, back in august. And here was a big hospital just starting up now because, of course, what happened in texas. Dr. Yasmin is right, the training is crucial. Having them read a pamphlet or watch the video is not enough. It has to be persontoperson training. Dr. Yasmin, how long does how long do you think somebody needs to be trained . Again, it cant just be one session with a Breakout Sessions or something on a weekend. How long is training, you think, necessary . It can take tas, anderson. And it has to be repetitive. It has to be a session where you learn how to do it and then you have multiple times to practice, to be critiqued and to make mistakes. We all make mistakes. Another key point is to make sure that the equipment does fit you. We keep hearing about these masks that you put over your face to protect you. You have to be fit tested for those before you can have them. And when i was at cdc i had to undergo n95 mask fitting. And guess what, the masks dont fit me. Were talking about a situation where these things need to be prepared in advance. You cant have someone like me turn up one day and the m95 mask does not fit them. We have to have many opportunities for Health Care Workers to practice. Sanjay, stick around. I want to ask you about a medical question, a political controversy and what many believe was just simple common sense. The notion of banning or restricting travel out of west africa hot zones into this country. Some call it common sense, others say not so simple at all and may hurt the war against ebola in those countries. Also a look at some of the wilder ebola conspiracy theories that people have been spreading including one by congresswoman blackburns colleague on capitol hill. Set your dvr so you can watch 360 whenever you like. Decay. Its the opposite of evolution. The absence of improvement. And the enemy of perfection. Which is why you can never stop moving forward. Never stop inventing. Introducing the mercedesbenz gla. A breakthrough in design, aerodynamics and engineering. Because the only way to triumph over decay. Is to leave it in its own dust. How couin jellyfish, protein impact Life Expectancy in the u. 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The Ebola Outbreak has done a lot to focus attention on hospitals and the entire Public Health system. Its given people license to let their conspiracy flags fly venting a whole lot of dubious theories, to say the lease, and to be blunt, a whole lot of toxic crazy stuff as well. Youll hear from a doctor on the front lines in liberia doing the real work that people there and everywhere need done. First, though, the ocean far from the action, hitching their theory of the virus to their own pet theories. Theres the antivaccine activist who says the vaccinemakers are behind it. Some people in industry, government and the World Health Organization did not want the Ebola Outbreak to be confined to several nations in africa. Because that would fail to create a lucrative Global Market for mandated use of fasttracked ebola vaccines. Theres also the liberian newspaper saying ebola is a u. S. Bioweapon used to depopulate the planet. Ebola aids manufactured by western pharmaceutical, u. S. , dod . We dont know much about the liberian press and that papers record of reporting, if you call it that, but we do know they dont have a monopoly on crazy conspiracy theories thanks to some representatives here. Like steve stockman. Hes wondering why ebola made it into the country and hes just wondering whether its because president obama wanted it that way. Not enough action up front. Im wondering if thats intentional if thats intentional in order to create a greater crisis, to use it as a blunt force to say well, in order to solve this crisis, well have to take control of the economy, individuals and so forth. Again, thats a member of the u. S. Congress. We asked him to come on the program to expound on that theory. He didnt return our call. Others have a somewhat different twist on the obama loves ebola theory. Rush limbaugh, laura ingraham, take it away. The reason why a bunch of people dont think we should be banning flights is because we kind of are responsible for this. And therefore, if ebola ends up here, well, its only payback, folk, slavery, its only payback. And unfortunately, we have elected people in positions of leadership who thing this way. The president is one of them. Its fathers rage against colonialism as din esh deseuss za wrote about and maybe this is a way to continue to atone for that. You can decide what to make of that and all the rest. What they all have in common is not any have anything to do with the brave people fighting ebola or the People Living with it or dying of it. A real debate is heating up over travel bans and whether theyre needed to stop the further spread of ebola in the u. S. Chief medical correspondent dr. Sanjay gupta is back and joining us marcia black burn of tennessee. Congresswoman, thanks so much for being with us. Sure. Youre not alone in your request of banning travel from nations affected by the Ebola Outbreak. Everyone i talk to, Doctors Without Borders, and other groups say a travel ban will make getting our personnel, meaning Doctors Without Borders and other group, in and out, with the hundreds of people they have moving around and the tons of supplies they have going in and out, will make it more difficult. Charter flights arent enough. To that you say what . To that i say there should be a way to solve this problem. We all know to successfulle deal with the Ebola Outbreak you have to isolate it. The best place to isolate it west africa. Certainly charter flights, military flights, there are other ways to get supplies in and out. I also feel like for those 13,000 visas that have been issued and people in the infected zone are wanting to come to the u. S. , maybe looking at a quarantine there, establishing Something Like a Forward Operating base and individuals who want to exit those countries, the affected area, these three countries, would come in for a 21day quarantine prior to leaving the country and then they, on day 22, theyre free to two wherever they have the confidence that they can move forward that they are ebolafree. I think thats worthy of discussion. Its a good work around. When i was at the cdc three weeks back working with dr. Frieden on some other issues and we discussed ebola, i said, if youre not going to do a travel ban, how about thinking something else, you know, certainly the checks at the airports are one of those steps. We have to give the American People confidence that they can trust us. Right now the confidence is pretty low. I get the idea of limiting visas for people from the affected countries and making it harder for people to do that or having people kind of try to prove that they havent had any contact, but how would quarantining people in liberia, guinea or sierra leone work given that they dont even have enough personnel on the ground driving ambulances and treating people with ebola let alone overseeing a quarantine . How would that work . I fully appreciate and understand that, and i think working with organizations like is a ma samaritans which my Church Organization has supported for years or Doctors Without Borders right, the Doctors Without Borders. In charge there. They say theyre at a breaking point. I appreciate that. I appreciate that. But as i was saying, working with them to say what are the protocols you think would be best. How do we best implement Something Like this . But im telling you what they say is dont do a travel ban. I talked to they say not do a travel ban, but they havent discussed doing some kind of limitation or quarantine there. Anders anderson, were going to have to take some type steps to have a way to more closely isolate this. The news that came from nigeria, no additional senegal, no additional outbreaks. Thats so positive. The good news we got out of texas today sure. That is so positive. But when you look at the total number of people that have been affected, the escalation right there. Sure. The distrust i understand what youre saying. New york city putting up a travel ban, i think its time for us to say how do we address this proactively let me bring sanjay gupta here. Sure. Can you see whats your belief on a travel ban . Would it make it harder youve talked to folks with Doctors Without Borders like i have. They saul seem to say that it would be harder to contain the outbreak in west africa. Until its contained in west africa, thats the number one priority. I think thats true. If you look at the rationale behind that, i think it will make sense. Ill explain that to you. But congresswoman blackburn, what youre saying is a little different than a travel ban. I was listening to your comments the other day and a was very much in favor of a travel ban, asking people to take their temperature for 21 days before they leave is not a travel ban. When we talk about porous borders people think were talking about the United States. And what dr. Frieden and dr. Fauci, head of the cdc and nih Infectious Diseases its west africa were talking about. People would leave west africa, fly out of those countries and be hard to track and trace. They could go to another busy city, new delhi and shanghai. And then the question of are you banning travel from those countries as well . Heres the point. It doesnt really seem to work. These things have been tried before. You can understand the sentiment as to why it seems logical, but it just doesnt work. Simultaneously, and this is perhaps a bigger problem, no matter how much you try to address a problem, if you institute a travel ban, it will worsen the problem in west africa. You wont get the same resources in. Ive been over there. People have said this over and over again. So you are going to make that problem worse. Already theyre talking about 10,000 cases a week, if that gets worse, the whole world will feel the impact of that. Anderson, if i could add something there, one of the reasons you have to look at a travel ban or quarantine is this, it doesnt work. People will get out of these countries anyway. Other african nations have implemented a travel ban on this infected region. To the American People who are listening to this, they say, oh, really . We dont need laws or the rule of law or rules or regulations because not everybody will apply by this . I guess i just dont understand try to break the rules . A, on the travel ban, i havent made up my mind on this, im not taking a position. But every expert i talk to who is actually working on the ground, to a person this is going to make it harder to get personnel in and out who need to get there. Doctors without borders has 300 personnel on the ground on rotating shifts and tons of supplies. Thats just one group. Is samaritans purse are going to somehow oversee a quarantine. I did not say that. Who would . I say im certain they would have ideas that could be implemented just like with the cdc guidance. We should have been listening to them early on for the initial guidance. But theres not enough people on the ground or money that process. Theres not enough but look were sending the u. S. Military. And i have 1500 constituents that are getting ready to go over there. With ft. Campbell. And will be a part of this process. Right. Building these hospitals and serving as a support agency. I can tell you there are a lot of people that are not happy about that. But they do feel like it is imperative that we find a way to limit travel but you dont want u. S. Military personnel quarantining west africans. No. So do you know who will oversee this quarantine . You know what . We supposedly have a czar who is going to be working on this now. We have individuals who are tasked with overseeing Public Health. We have so youre saying let them come up with it. Were talking about assistant secretaries who do not we havent heard anything out of them and theyre supposedly dealing with bioterrorism. This is a problem we can solve. All right. Do i have every working order of it right now . Absolutely not. But i think weve got a lot of good people that can figure this out because all right, congresswoman. Were here to work and solve the problem, the American People need to restore some trust. Thank you. Absolutely. Good to be with you. In a nineyearold case in Hannah Grahams disappearance. Sir, were loaded and getting ready to go. Were going to need you on the runway. vo dont let a severe cold hold you back. Sir . vo theraflu starts to get to work in your body in just 5 minutes. vo theraflu breaks you free from your worst cold and flu symptoms. vo theraflu. Serious power. The getaway vehicle for all the confidence you need. Td ameritrade. You got this. Its monday. A brand new start. Your chance to rise and shine. With centurylink as your trusted technology partner, you can do just that. With our visionary cloud infrastructure, Global Broadband network and Custom Communications solutions, your business is more reliable secure agile. And with responsive, dedicated support, we help you shine every day of the week. Centurylink your link to whats next. New charges against Jesse Matthew who is suspected about the disappearance of Hannah Graham. They are in connection with the alleged abduction and Sexual Assault ten years ago. Police say a case that forensically links him to another female College Student who vanished from the sail area as graham. The 2005 incident happened in fairfax, virginia. The charges one count each abduction with intent to defile. As thats unfolding authorities near charlottesville are working to determine whether Human Remains Found over the weekend are in fact those of Hannah Graham. Joining us from Charlottesville Jean casarez who has been working all the angles on this case from the beginning. What do we know about this 2005 case that connects Jesse Matthews to Hannah Graham . It was fall 2005, ironically these things seemed to happen in the fall. Fairfax county, northeast of here in charlottesville. A woman walking from a grocery store, and prosecutors now are saying Jesse Matthew grabbed her from behind and dragged her and then allegedly sexually assaulted her. But we also had heard in the past that the perpetrator fled. Well, now for the first time, and i think this is a big headline today from this indictment that was returned, attempted capital murder is the first charge. So prosecutors are saying that if Jesse Matthew allegedly fled, that he didnt do so intentionally. That the intent was to kill her, but she survived and she is now an alleged Sexual Assault victim that, if prosecuted, can testify in court that that is her perpetrator. And the Human Remains Found over the weekend, have authorities said when theyre going to know whether or not in fact they are Hannah Graham for sure . No, anderson, this is a very difficult crime scene. This is skeletal remains. And they are working all throughout the day, and i was even told by Law Enforcement if they could work through the night, they would do that, too. Theyre standing guard around the area. But the skeletal remains were amongst the entire field in the area, and theyre basically putting together a skeleton, so it is taking a long time. But the net result will be that it will be processed by the chief forensic medical examiner here in virginia to, number one, determine who the remains are and then also the cause and manner of death if they can determine a cause of death. Very difficult when youre dealing with remains like this. Jean casarez, appreciate it. We wanted to try to learn more about efforts to identify remains as well as other investigative work and tying together what could be several Different Cases right now. Were joined by forensic scientist lawrence cob linski. We know Hannah Graham disappeared five weeks ago. Is it possible for remains to already be skeletal at five weeks . No question about it. Depending upon the environmental conditions, depending upon temperature, for example, depending upon insect and small and large animal predation, no question a body can be fully skeletoni skeletonized. Thats if a body is left out on the surface. Not only that, we heard jean casarez talk about bones scattered all around. Good indication of animals. Large animals, theyll take a bone, move 400, 500 feet away from the site of the body. How long does identification like this take . The anthropologists they know just from the skull and whatever they have, they know the gender, they know the ethnicity, they know the approximate height. Theres a lot you can tell just from looking at the bone. But if you dont have i dont want to get too gory, but if you dont have the soft tissue, isnt it harder to determine the cause of death . Theres no question about it. Exactly, exactly. So yeah, its going to take a little time. Ultimately it may be dna from bone. Thats been done. Thats not a problem. It could take an extra couple of weeks till we get results. The other question, of course, is if the environment has, you know, already caused whoever it is to become a skeleton, if it is in fact Hannah Graham, after just five weeks, that other dna from the perpetrator, would that be gone . I mean, would there be dna under fingernails, any any clothing. If she had been sexually assaulted, we wouldnt know it, not from the skeleton, clearly. If she scratched her assailant, there might still be dna attached from the fingernails. Because they found these black pants which were consistent with what she was wearing, there might be a semen stain. So clothing lasts longer much. Than human tissue. Dna in any body cavity deteriorates rapidly. On clothing, outside of the body, it stays around. Lawrence koblinsky, thank you very much. We have details about forensic evidence in the shooting of Michael Brown by officer wilson. And how officer wilsons reported account of that shooting is different than what witnesses say. This is charlie. His long day of doing it himself starts with back pain. And a choice. Take 4 advil in a day or just 2 aleve for all day relief. Honey, you did it baby laughs a wakeup call. But its not happening out there. Its happening in here. [ sirens wailing ] inside of you. Even if youre treating your Crohns Disease or ulcerative colitis, an occasional flare may be a sign of damaging inflammation. Learn more about the role damaging inflammation may be playing in your symptoms with the expert advice tool at crohnsandcolitis. Com. And then speak with your gastroenterologist. With the expert advice tool at crohnsandcolitis. Com. What are you doing . The dishes are clean. I just gotta scrape the rest of the food off them. Ew. How is that clean . uhhh. Dish issues . Quiet them with cascade platinum. It powers through your toughest messes better than the competition the first time. Clean squeak, squeak, squeak stop it. Cascade. Now thats clean. Crime and punishment tonight, newly leaked details into the investigation of the shoot of Michael Brown are adding to the already high tensions in ferguson, missouri. As you know a grand jury has been hearing testimony in secret about what happened when the unarmed teenager crossed paths with officer Darren Wilson in august. The details of that were leaked and they contain crucial forensic evidence that the jury will weigh when deciding whether to indict officer wilson. Browns family and others in ferguson have made it clear they wont rest for anything less than an indictment of the officer. Reporter this is the new normal in ferguson, protests night and day for the past 73 days. Their number one demand justice. And to them that means the indictment and arrest of officer Darren Wilson who shot and killed unarmed teenager Michael Brown august 9th. Tensions are high again after new details about the investigation were leaked by a federal source to the New York Times indicating forensic evidence may mean potential civil rights charges are unlikely. U. S. Law enforcement sources told cnn browns blood was found on wilsons gun, inside wilsons patrol car and on his uniform. What that does is that tends to support any testimony that there was some kind of scuffle in the police car, and if so, that tends to support officer wilsons testimony and his justification f using deadly force. Reporter early on browns friends said there was a scuffle, but that wilson was the aggressor. He pulled up on the side of us. He tried to thrust his door open, but we were so close to it that it ricocheted on us and bounced back to him. I guess that got him a little upset as he was trying to choke my friend. And he was trying to get away, then the officer then reached out and used his arm to pull him into the car. Reporter cnn legal analyst says the newly released forensic evidence only goes so far. Ultimately that officer has to come up with justification not for firing his gun first time but for each and every bullet that came out of his firearm, whether at the car or away from the car. Reporter whatever happens, police tell cnn they are preparing, especially after hearing this time and again from protesters in the streets. If theres not an indictment, excuse my french, all hells going to break loose. Are you worried that theres going to be Serious Violence . Again, were constantly looking at those things. I believe it was five shootings in august. Reporter during the protests. During the protests that came out of that. Then also to protect businesses and the property and the citizens who live in the area. Reporter protesters also have plans. Everybody is planning for whatever the grand jury is decides. I think certainly there are lots of us who are planning peaceful protests should it not be indicted. Certainly there are other people who have other ideas at hand. Reporter sara sidner, cnn, ferguson, missouri. Joining me are anthony gray, attorney for Michael Browns family and criminal defense attorney mark omara who represented George Zimmerman in the killing of trayvon martin. This new information that sara just reported, that blood was found on officer wilsons gun, in his police car and on his uniform, does that change your contention of what happened that day at all . Absolutely not. It actually confirms exactly what Dorian Johnson said took place on that day. We always contended from the very first day, that there were two separate events. Each event deserves its own evaluation in terms of the amount of force that was used on each occasion. So the scuffle in the police car by the police car and then what happened afterward . Absolutely. And the inside of the car event is exactly as dorian had described it. You know, officer Darren Wilson, it sounds to me as though he assaulted mike brown jr. With his door and then after that he assaulted him with his hands. Imagine mike brown at this point, hes the one thats fearful for his life. You know, officer wilson youre saying that based solely on what on what his friend has said, dorian gray . And also on mike brown jr. s subsequent behavior. Once he broke loose from officer Darren Wilsons grip, he ran away. Obviously thats an indication of fear. I believe he was fighting for his life at the door of officer wilsons vehicle trying to get away. Right. And the proof of that is when he got away he began to run. So thats not a big speck la tory conclusion for me to draw based on what he said. Dorian johnson. Mark, what about that . Are there two separate and distinct events legally speaking . Quick answer yes. First of all, i dont like the notion that information like is being released piecemeal. But theres one thing that he said that i fully agree with which is that they are two somewhat separate events. What happened at the car certainly informed what was going to happen afterwards. If in fact there was an argument one way or the other, Michael Brown was inside that car. Dorian believed he was dragged inside the car. That has questions of believability in my opinion. But once there was an assault of a Police Officer at the car and once there was a shot fired, those two independent events required officer wilson to then get mike brown under control. So leaving the car certainly was justified by wilson. The shooting has to be justified in and of itself. If mike brown was, as mr. Gray suggests, was running away and not running towards, if thats the only fact that existed then he would have been shot in the back, and we know he was facing brown facing wilson, so we have to wait and let the grand jury do their job. And if it gets to a regular jury, theyll look at all the facts and speculating now is just a bad thing. Anthony, what do you make of the fact that information is being leaked from this grand jury . Well, it is disturbing. Its coming out, and it seems the way that its being postured to the narrative and to the media, this notion that somehow officer wilson was justified in his conduct. We said all along it was the final event, it was the final event that has the world in an uproar, not anything that happened at the vehicle, so now were isolating our attention to a part of this whole situation. So you thing the information already conceded to. You think the information being released is information which some people believe supports officer wilsons account . Just like your other guest just said, mr. Omara just stated, that somehow this fits into officer wilsons state of mind after he got out of the vehicle. When all of us know once mike brown turned around, six independent witnesses said he opened up his arms, he had his hands up to show that he was unarm and that he was not, had any weapon on him and yet at that point you hit the reset button. It doesnt matter what happened moments before that. When your hands go up, the threat is over with and Darren Wilson should have responded accordingly but instead he fired his weapon and thats criminal in nature. Anthony gray, appreciate it. Sorry for the technical problems, mark omearas satellite went down. We apologize for that. Breaking news out of iraq. Isis launching nearly simultaneous attack. A bold move as it tries to gain control of more country, more land. Monica lewinsky calling herself patient zero in the epidemic of cyber bullying. Big day . Ah, the usual. Moved some new cars. Hauled a bunch of steel. Kept the supermarket shelves stocked. Made sure everyone got their latest gadgets. Whats up for the next shift . Ah, nothing much. Just keeping the lights on. laugh nice. Doing the big things that move an economy. See you tomorrow, mac. See you tomorrow, sam. Just another day at norfolk southern. You know. Theres a more enjoyable way to get your fiber. Try phillips fiber good gummies. Theyre delicious and an excellent source of fiber to help support regularity. Mmmm. These are good the tasty side of fiber. From phillips e financial noise financial noise financial noise financial noise isis is renewing efforts to take control of kurdishheld territory in northern iraq. Today isis fighters launched 15 nearly simultaneous attack on forces. In Northern Syria two isis car bombers detonated their explosives inside kobani which essentially remains under siege. Today turkish officials cleared the way for peshmerga fighters from iraq to use their territory to launch attacks against isis. Chief National Security correspondent jim sciutto joins knee with the latest. Listen, they were massive and they were ambitious. 15 attacks near simultaneous happening without warning and using that unique combination that isis is capable of, military style assaults in some places and suicide terror attacks in others. This is what weve been talking about for a long time here. Its a group unlike any youve seen before. It operates like an army but also like a terror group. And its showing in effect that it has not been cowed by the u. S. Led air campaign. They have this very effective tactic in some places of driving a vehicle laden with explosives into a facility, exploding it, then sending one or two more vehicles in or suicide bombers in following to basically, you know, gain even deeper access and blow more things up. They have. And its a classic al qaeda tactic thats been used in other terror attacks in saudi arabia, in afghanistan, elsewhere. You know, even against western facilities as well. You gain entry and you kill a lot more people inside or capture them and a tactic theyve used with success against Iraqi Military installations in iraq as well. Its also interesting to me that theyre able to do 15 coordinated attacks. I mean, given, i guess its a sign of what little intense capabilities the u. S. Has on the ground in the region. I think its a sign of that. Its also a sign that, yes, you have an air campaign under way, but those u. S. War planes and Coalition War planes theyre not flying Close Air Support for all these kurdish units and iraqi units at all time. Ive been told by u. S. Military officials that isis has changed its tactics, the way it moves, communicates, moving in smaller groups, not in convoys that are as big because they know theyre being watched either by war planes or by surveillance planes. Knowing that, they operated differently here so they could get in in effect under the radar. Jim sciutto, thanks so much. Lets get the latest on other stories were following. Susan hendricks has a 360 news bulletin. The accused ring leader of the attack on the u. S. Diplomatic complex in benghazi, libya, pleads not guilty in a washington federal courtroom. He faces 18 charges including murder. Four americans were killed in that attack including ambassador christopher stevens. Pennsylvania state police say blood stains found during the search for trooper shooting suspect eric frein are not his, but they believe a woman spotted frein armed with a rifle and mud on his face in a wooded area in northeast pennsylvania while she was out walking on friday night. Also Monica Lewinsky is back. The former white house intern who famously had an affair with thenpresident bill clinton, joined twitter today, then gave an emotional speech in philadelphia vowing to end cyber bullying. She calls herself patient zero for online harassment. It feels like a punch in the gut, as if a stranger walked up to you on the street and punched you hard and sharp in the gut. I would go online, read in a paper or see on tv people referring to me as tramp, slut, whore, tart, bimbo, floozy, even spy. That, of course, Monica Lewinsky talking about what she went through in the aftermath of that affair. Also today britains royal family revealed that the duke and duchess of cambridge will welcome their second child in april. Fourth in line to the throne. In the next hour of 360, we have breaking news in the battle against ebola. The cdc revealing those new guidelines for Health Care Workers, but the new guidelines pretty much like the old guidelines for the groups working on this for months. Its monday. A brand new start. Your chance to rise and shine. With centurylink as your trusted technology partner, you can do just that. With our visionary cloud infrastructure, Global Broadband network and Custom Communications solutions, your business is more reliable secure agile. And with responsive, dedicated support, we help you shine every day of the week. Centurylink your link to whats next. The smartest or nothing. The quietest or nothing. The sleekest. Sexiest,. Baddest,. Safest,. Tightest,. Quickest,. Harshest. Or nothing. At mercedesbenz, we do things one way or we dont do them at all. Introducing the allnew cclass. The best or nothing. Good evening. Breaking news on ebola tonight from the centers for Disease Control in atlanta. New guidelips for prevents the spread of the virus. It comes on a very good day in a tough war. They passed that vital threeweek landmark without symptoms and an entire country knee ja ya was declared ebola free. Thats the examine news. For more on all of that, lets go to atlanta and Elizabeth Cohen. What exactly are the new guidelines . Because to me, my reading of them is they sound an awful lot like the guidelines Doctors Without Borders and other groups have been following for months now. When i saw them, i said, hey, this is what i saw when i was in liberia. Why werent we doing this all of the time . First of all, no skin exposure. The way that the cdc guidelines were before it allowed skin to be exposed. Rigorous training so as director tom frieden put it, like a ritual. Third, it should be supervised by a trained monitor. This is so important. When i watch people put on this personal protective equipment in africa, they were supervised by someone who would check and make sure that not an inch of skin was showing. Sanjay was showing us last week the original cdc guidelines about what you could wear, his neck was still exposed. When he took off all the stuff, he ended up with, you know, foreign matter on his arm and on his neck. Right. So that actually covers two deficiency, number one, that the neck was showing is and that the guidelines allowed for that in some cases. And when you take it awoff, you have to be careful because you have gowns that are splattered with i wont get too graphic, but all sorts of stuff. But ebola patients bodily fluids are coming out and at the people taking care of them. They need to be trained rigorously to take these off so they dont contaminate themselves. I would like to hear more from the cdc why they didnt come up with these sooner when defending their old guidelines. We bring in orrin redletter who lass behas been on this program. Dr. Fisher traveled to guinea. You were in guinea working with msf. The socalled new protocols, to you, they must look very familiar. Are you surprised that they werent adopted by the cdc early on . Not necessarily. I mean, a lot of organizations had been so focused on personal protective equipment and not as much on the process of wearing them and more importantly taking them off which is a key element thats not been part of the discussion. Im glad to see those part of the new recommendations. As far as youre concerned, taking taking it off properly is as important almost as what youre actually wearing . Thats exactly right. So we know that the basic mechanism of transmission of ebola virus is direct contact between either breaks in the skin and mucous membranes and infected body fluids. Things can prevent those body fluids from entering the body. One of the highest risks for Health Care Workers is removing those clothes. Because those clothes are soiled with vomit, diarrhea and blood. They have to be removed very carefully to avoid coming into contact with them. From the theoretic astandpoint, i understand the cdcs earlier guidelines, they were saying some people may have limited contact with an ebola patient, others will have more handson contact. But when you have nurses who are not that experienced with ebola or not experienced at all in a room, it seems like if theres fluids flying around, theyre going to go and try to do what they can to help. Well, first of all, this is a completely novel experience for the United States of america. This is not a country where this has been endemic at all. We have to understand theres a certain learning process that everybody is going through right now. Theres no particular reason to suspect that a nurse in dallas or anywhere else before we really started paying attention to this would actually know. This brings up the problem that we talked about before, having to do with we cut back all of our Training Programs for hospital workers in general for disasters, incluthis included. So it didnt really surprise me that the dallas hospital was taken off guard and we had some pretty untrained nurses dealing with this. They were the unlucky ones to have the first patient. Youre saying there are a lot of hospitals throughout the United States that if they had the first patient, they would have the same problem. No question in my mind. I think wed have similar problems with Emergency Rooms elsewhere. I dont think well ever see that again. The failure to admit him when he first came to the hospital, then having to readmit him, a lot of things were absolutely eye openers for most hospitals around the country. I dont think well see that repeated. The issue was why not sooner having the guidelines . As i said, this is just a matter of were now getting used to having a very exotic and extraordinarily lethal disease here in the United States. A lot of people have been critical of the cdc and i totally get the criticism. These are just guidelines. They cant force anybody to do anything. Its up to the state Health Officials and individual hospitals to actually execute them. Theres two big miss conceptions about the cdcs role and responsibility. Its a scientific body that issues guidelines but the actual implementation happens on a local level by two mechanisms. One is by what happens in the hospitals and the cdc has really no control over that and what is happening in terms of the Public Health agencies in dallas or any other place in the country. A national resource, the cdc, but its not the national implementer and thats really up to the local authorities. You were saying earlier that someone told you that they were doing their ebola training last week and you said how long have you been doing that and they said we just started doing that. I was so surprised to hear that because this was a large and well respected hospital. We just started our ebola training, now theyre doing it full force because of what happened in texas. Hospitals have a lot to deal with. And the chances that theyre going to get an ebola patient are very small. And i think that a lot of hospitals said are we really going to invest our time in in chances are that we continue have to deal with. Thats not an excuse, but thats the reality. For training, everybody says, you cant have one session. Its got to be repettive. It has to be long lasting. How much training is necessary . Are we talking about a week, multiple days every month . What do you think . I think it has to be repeated as in weekly. And the reason is with ebola, theres such a narrow margin of error. Its really unforgiving. Many hospitals and Infection Control physicians are actually used to donning barrier protection when taking care of patients with potentially Infectious Diseases. The problem is ebola is not just in the die radio arrhea and the but in every body fluid. You have to get used to wearing those dloclothes which can be incredibly restrictive in moving around the room. And you have to be an expert in getting out of those clothes. Dr. Fischer, dr. Redlener, and Elizabeth Cohen as well. Dr. Steven hatch is an Infectious Disease specialist volunteering at a clinic in liberia run by the intcharity International Medical corps. He said why he chose the toughest job in the world today. Why do firefighters run headlong to the fire . To put it out, of course. Ebola is not much different and its my fire. Like other colleagues, i go to put it out. Dr. Hatch joins from us the clinic. What is it like to treat patients, to deal with people wearing that full protective gear, i mean, not only physically for you but also just emotionally . So much of what a doctor does is physical contact with somebody, looking them in the eye. To have that limitation of this essentially like a space suit, what is that like . Its challenging. Patients cannot see our faces. Spr especially in the first 24 hours in the wards, thats a terrifying moment for them. Once they actually step outside and we have lawn chairs for them to sit out in the units, we walk to the area wrs we can see them and they can see us, so once we go inside and were anonymous behind those things, they hear our voices and they know what we look like when were not in protective gear. Ironically one of the things we do is we do touch our patients in the unit. The only place in liberia where theres no prescription against that. You can touch your patients when youre in protective gear and yet when were outside, and not among my colleagues, i dont touch anyone. Have you ever worked on a virus like this that has such a high mortality rate . I havent worked on a viral infection like this that has the potential to spread to anybody and with a high mortality rate, no i havent seen anything like this. Just a personal question. How do you deal with the level of fatalities that youre seeing, the death that youre surrounded by . One of the things thats been very gratifying about working in our treatment unit thus far is that we see survivors, and we do see a stream of death. What we havent seen thus far is a tsunami of death. And so when we see people die, its balanced by the fact that were seeing a lot of people on our Positive Side who we know have the virus and theyre living through it and living through some of the worst of it. You earlier described this as a war. Thats how you see this . Metaphors are always dangerous, but this does seem an apt metaphor in this case. And do you feel like youre winning . Today was a tough day. Youre asking me on a day where we admitted people who were relatives of our current patients. So it was a bit of a deep breathing exercise for us. I cannot say which way things are going right now and whether were winning the battle or not, but i think that this is something that we must do not only for the people of liberia but for all people around the world because this problem has the potential to spread and metastasize to every country on earth. Dr. Steven hatch, i really admire what youre doing. Thank you for talking to us. Thanks, anderson, i appreciate it. You can set your dvrs and watch 360 whenever you like and see more interviews like that. Millions of dollars are being poured into Ebola Research but tonight were hearing disturbing allegations about research for another deadly virus. How Promising Research for an aids vaccine turned into allegations that the researcher made the whole thing up with millions of taxpayer dollars behind it. R. Design cars that capture their emissions. Build bridges that fix themselves. Get more clean water to everyone. Whos going to take the leap . Whos going to write the code . Whos going to do it . Engineers. Thats who. Thats what i want to do. Be an engineer. [ male announcer ] join the scientists and engineers of exxonmobil in inspiring americas future engineers. Energy lives here. As the word tries to come to grips with ebola, the cdc releases new guidelines. Another shocker. Money that should have been used in the effort, in the fight. Its cautionary tale for now. Because the same way that hundreds of millions have been pledged for Ebola Research, billions have been spent over the years for hiv by private individuals, charitable foundations and the federal government. This report is about 14 million of those dollars and hope for a stunning scientific advancement in the search for an aids vacci vaccine. Instead its turned into a more stunning allegation of a 14 million fraud against the government. Once considered the best hope yet for a vaccine federal prosecutors are claiming a researcher in a University Lab made up his results and may have done it just to keep federal money flowing. Keeping them honest, the possible breakthrough cure not to mention your federal tax dollars are gone. Drew griffin. Reporter it was the kind of breakthrough that made headlines, an iowa state University Lab reporting it was on the verge of an hiv vaccine. Rabbits infected with hiv were showing an incredible reduction in the virus. It was a pathway to a cure says the university of washingtons dr. Ferris fong. This was in rabbits, but the hope was this kind of immune response and the way these scientists were preparing their vaccine could lead to a vaccine from humans. Reporter 14 million in federal grant money flowed to support the research. Then the shock. The excitement, the possible aids vaccines, the results in those rabbits, it was all a fraud. This man, Iowa State University researcher assistant professor had made up the results, contaminating the infected rabbit blood with Healthy Human blood, making it appear the rabbits were developing an immunity to aids. The alleged fraud uncovered in a scientific trap. Researchers trying to verify his finings were the ones that discovered human blood was mixed in with rabbit blood. The findings were secretly give to the National Institutes of health and iowa states top researcher and his boss, dr. Michael cho. It was cho who set up an elaborate trap trying to determine who on his staff was faking results. He asked for additional blood samples and the samples supplied by dr. Han was contaminated. 14 million of federal tax money supporting hans research has been wasted and the federal government has charged han with fraud. Just because somebody has a ph. D. Just because somebodys involved in the Scientific Community doesnt mean theyre going to be treated necessarily any different than anyone else who commits a criminal offense. Reporter Iowa State University fired han immediately and a spokesperson says the school is trying to restore a reputation for integrity that hans phony research destroyed. Its not the kind of headline that you want to see that this has occurred in your institution. The reaction here initially and even later on was disbelief, surprise, shock, disappointment. Reporter as a taxpayer, you may be wondering something else, wheres the 14 million in tax pair fu Payer Research money . Its gone. Scientists who Fake Research rarely go to prison and hardly ever are forced to pay back taxpayers. The doctor who now lives in cleveland supposedly with his parents issued is an apology before he entered a not guilty plea. I was foolish, coward and not frank, he writes in a letter. My misconduct is not done in order to hurt someone, but he remains elusive president at an apartment listed at his address, there is no answer. Contacted through his cell phone, the once respected dr. Han had little to say. Hello. Reporter dr. Han. Yes. Reporter this is drew griffin with cnn calling. How are you today . Im fine. Reporter i wonder if we could were doing a story on the whole incident that happened in iowa and trying to get comment from you for a story that were producing. Im sorry. I cannot. Im sorry. Reporter do you have any explanation for why you did it . Im sorry. I cant, sir. Sorry. Reporter the university of washingtons dr. Fang said fraud in Scientific Research remains extremely rare. Theres a good reason, especially when the research involves alleged breakthroughs in medical cure cures. The person who committed this act according to the information i had really didnt think things through. I completely agree. Once you get everybody excited about something that you have thats a breakthrough for Something Like an aids vaccine, the end of the road is going to mean that this vaccine is going to be developed and given to other animals, tested by other laboratories and given to people and if it doesnt work, it will all fall apart. This kind of fraud eventually had to fail. Reporter if found guilty on all four counts against him, the government says han faces up to 20 years in prison and a Million Dollar fine. This is so terrible, such a big case. Do we know how much of this fraudulent Research Goes on . Is this common . Its a good question. Its hard to tell because we only know what is being caught. By those numbers, those who are caught, its small. The number of retractions that have taken place for these grants, it adds up to about 58 million in fraudulent research that was caught. Thats just 1 of the nih budget for that time. So its not huge. But again, i caution you thats only what theyre catching. Good reporting, drew, thanks so much. You can find out more on this and more at cnn. Com. Coming up next tonight, fresh charges in the nineyearold case of the leading suspect in Hannah Grahams disappearance as authorities try to determine the remains found over the weekend. [ male announcer ] tomcat bait kills up to 12 mice, faster than dcon. What will we do with all of these dead mice . Tomcat presents dead mouse theatre. Hey, ulfrik hey, agnar whats up with you . Funny you ask. Im actually here to pillage your town. [ villagers screaming ] but we went to summer camp together. Summer camp is over. [ male announcer ] tomcat. [ cat meows ] [ male announcer ] engineered to kill. Its a fresh approach on education superintendent of public instruction Tom Torlaksons blueprint for great schools. Torlaksons blueprint outlines how investing in our schools will reduce class sizes, bring back music and art, and provide a wellrounded education. And torlaksons plan calls for more parental involvement. Spending decisions about our education dollars should be made by parents and teachers, not by politicians. Tell Tom Torlakson to keep fighting for a plan that invests in our public schools. Breaking news, new charges against Jesse Matthew in the disappearance of Hannah Graham. A Sexual Assault case that police say lynx him to another College Student that disappeared in the same area as graham. It happened in the city of fairfax in northern virginia. The charges one count each of abduction with intent to defile, Sexual Assault and murder. Authorities near charlottesville are working to determine whether Human Remains Found over the weekend are those of Hannah Graham. With us is the executive producer of inside charlottesville. The remains were found 11 miles from the mall where Hannah Graham was last spotted. What do you know about the area they were found . This part of the county is down lynchberg road. This is a twolane road that winds through the woods and up and down the hills. It is a remote rural part of the county just 11 miles from the mall where hannah graup was last seen in the early hours of saturday. This is a twoacre parcel on which is located a modest house, then nearby is a little 600squarefoot cottage. Both of these buildings have been empty for some time. Theyre rentals. Theyve been empty for some time. The property has been listed and delisted a number of times. The remains were found on saturday in the woods at the back of this parcel in whats been described as a dry creek bed. And ive talked to guys who were on the scene, anderson, and its just a gruesome, gruesome scene of skeletal human remains. I understand this is close to a home where Jesse Matthew, the man being held in hannahs disappearance, used to live, is that the case . Yeah, i can confirm that Jesse Matthew grew up in this part of albemarle county. His mothers house is a few miles up the road, he has a number of friends in the area. This is just five miles from where the skeletal remains of Morgan Harrington was found. Morgan was a 20yearold Virginia Tech student who came here to charlottesville to see a metallica concert at uva on october 17th, 2009. She went missing that night. Her remains were found on a farm in a field 7. 8 miles away on anchorage farm just south of charlottesville but only five miles from where we believe the remains of Hannah Graham were found on saturday. And also, as i mentioned today, Jesse Matthew was indicted for that 2005 Sexual Assault. Thats right. That took place on september 24th, 2005 just off of germantown road in northern virginia. Fairfax, of course, is a suburb of washington, d. C. , a 26yearold woman was jumped. She said that a large black man picked her up, carried her to the back of this small subdivision of townhouses into a wooded area where he brutally raped and raped her and was beating her to death. Jesse matthew today was charged with abduction with the intent to defile this woman. He was charged with raping this woman. And he was also charged with capital murder. Thats heightened murder. Thats murder that you attempt to commit here while youre also committing another felony, in this case, rape. Just a horrible development. Appreciate you reporting for us. Thanks very much. No official is discounting that Hannah Grahams disappearance, the 2005 incident and others may be part of an even larger pattern of tragedies. Randi kaye looks at that. Reporter Liberty University, october 2002, a female student calls police at 4 26 a. M. To report a rape. According to the report, she called the lynchberg police department. Reporter lynchberg prosecutor Michael Doucet didnt work the case but has reviewed the file. He says the male student named as the attack are is Jesse Matthew, the same Jesse Matthew accused in the disappearance of uva student Hannah Graham. Now 12 years later. Doucet says matthew cooperated with police, was never charged due to lack of evidence and no eyewitnesses here at the arena where the alleged attack happened. Until then Jesse Matthew had a good thing going here at Liberty University where he was enrolled from 2000 to 2002. He reportedly had a football scholarship. Why matthew left after the Rape Allegation is still unclear. What is clear is soon after that in january 2003, Jesse Matthew enrolled here, Christopher Newport university in newport news, virginia, about three hours from liberty. It wouldnt be long before he would face allegations of Sexual Assault on this campus, too. This time it was september 7th, 2003, just 11 months after matthew was accused of rape at his previous school. Paul tribble is the universitys president. A complaint was filed by a student. It was thoroughly investigated by our campus police. Reporter trible tells us the victim, a student, chose not to press charges, though she did take part in campus disciplinary hearings testifying against matthew. The school wouldnt divulge the result of those hearings but Jesse Matthew was gone soon after. A spokesman for Christopher Newport University Says he played here from august to september of 2003. He left the university about a month later. The school also says students dont usually leave the second month in the semester or leave the Football Team so quickly. And now matthews behavior is raising eyebrowse off campus at the Newport News Police department. The timeline, the proximity of when he was occupied here is about the only link we have. Reporter chief Richard Myers is revug all cases while he was a student here. Including the disappearance of autumn day. She was last seen shopping at this Food Lion Grocery store in 2003. Less than two months later, 31yearold Sophia Rivera also disappeared. Just five days after she vanished, september 12th, 2003, Jesse Matthew left the universitys Football Team. A month later, he was gone from the school for good. Randi kaye, cnn, newport news, virginia. Well, well keep following that. Just ahead potentially troubling leaks about Michael Browns shooting. I thought itd be bigger. dad theres nothing i cant reach in my subaru. vo introducing the allnew subaru outback. Love. Its what makes a subaru,a subaru. I lost my sight in afghanistan, but it doesnt hold me back. I go through periods where its hard to sleep at night, and stay awake during the day. Non24 is a circadian rhythm disorder that affects up to 70 of people who are totally blind. 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A grand jury has been hearing testimony in secret about what happened when the unarmed teenager crossed paths with officer Darren Wilson on a street in august. The details leaked contain crucial forensic evidence that the jury will weigh in deciding whether to indictment severe wilson. Browns family and others in ferguson have made clear they wont settle for anything less than an indictment. This new information about this blood inside the cruiser, whose blood was it and where specifically was it found, do we know . Reporter well, were hearing from our sources and basically they said that there were blood elements found on three different places. One on officer wilsons gun, and that was browns blood. Browns blood also found on officer wilsons uniform and inside of the police car. What this all tells us is that there was some sort of a struggle that went on inside that car, but divergent is there were witnesses who say that actually was because the officer was being aggressive towards brown and trying to pull him into the car, then you have wilson saying something else, that actually he was being attacked by brown. You have that difference in testimony there. But certainly this was forensic evidence that we hadnt heard before and we knew there was going to be a lot of evidence that this grand jury would take a look at and we hear that trickle out. What remains pretty much unclear is what happened outside the car, perhaps some some sort of second stage of the encounter. Some say Michael Brown may have been trying to surrender. Others say his hands were up at various levels. Thats right. And so that forensic evidence doesnt tell us anything about the other part of this, that everyone has been protesting about. You have lots of witnesses coming forward saying that he did surrender, that he was putting his hands up, that he put his hands straight up in the air and that he was still fired upon. However, you have others that say he was still coming towards the officer at that point. The officer also saying the same thing. Were seeing a lot of this. I apologize our light has just gone off. But youre hearing these different things. But forensic evidence doesnt lie. It has nothing to do with what happened afterwards and the grand jury has to look at that as well, anderson. Has there been reaction tonight about this new information thats come out, Community Reaction . Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. People are talking about it. There have been protesters here. We just saw two people who have been detained who were in the street and detained by police as well. We can also tell you that people are agitated by it. Very agitated by it. Because they believe that this tells them that there isnt going to be justice, and they think that justice is that officer wilson should be arrested. The Justice System has to go through its course but they believe this is an indication they will not see what they want to see, which is his indictment. Joining me now mark geragos and David Clinger at university of st. Louis. Does this support officer wilsons version of events . Splatter type evidence, whether its smeared. He being wilson could have Michael Browns blood on him. It could then transfer if he went back into the car and Michael Browns blood in the car or on wilsons uniform doesnt necessarily mean game over for one side of the other. It really will depend on what that blood looks like, whether its a blood transfer or whether its a direct splatter. That having been said, its certainly at least initially and the reason people are upset is because it would tend to support wilsons story and i think what youre going to have to do is youre going to have somebody like a cyril wecht or somebody like that who will analyze this evidence put it in kind of the terms of the story that wilson told and then say, yes, this makes sense or no, this doesnt make sense. Michael browns family, again, i talked to the attorney anthony gray in the last hour. They said whatever happened in the car by the car, that should be considered separately from the final shots that were fired when the final confrontation. Do you see a distinction between those two events . Should they be evaluated separately . Yes and no. The yes part is that if youve got a situation where deadly force is legitimate authorized, appropriate, whatever term you want to use, at any point during an encounter, that doesnt mean that you continue to use deadly force necessarily. So what happened in the vehicle is not germane to, not immediately germane to the shooting outside the vehicle. But it is germane to what the officers perception are. Let us say that officer wilsons basic story thats been told is that he was assaulted inside the vehicle, mr. Brown tried to take his gun, in selfdefense he fired. Mr. Brown left, then mr. Brown comes back at him. The Police Officer is thinking he already tried to take my gun away once, im not going to let him on me again. Therefore what happened in the vehicle is very relevant to the decision made to fire. Thats hypothetical. Thats conjecture. I dont know. What ive been saying from the beginning is we have to wait for the evidence. When people are upset because the evidence supports the Police Officers version of events, what they should be doing is wait a second, our job as citizens is to let the Justice System work. And if the evidence doesnt fit with our narrative, then we have to shift our narrative. If were not willing to look at what the evidence is showing, then whats the point of having a Justice System . What does it say to you that evidence is leaking out of the grand jury, which is supposedly secret . Its supposedly secret, but remember its secret and the prosecutors not supposed to let it out, but the witnesses can let it out. They can talk about it. They can talk about it to their lawyer even though their lawyers not allowed in there. Frankly, you always see grand jury leaks. Theyre not supposed to be, but it happens. I think this is one of the reasons that this never should have gone by way of a grand jury. I think that to some degree thats a copout, but thats what they decided to do. They think that theyve insulated themselves when i say they, the prosecutor has by doing it this way. Both sides will be dissatisfied no matter what happens. Because if it turns out that they indict, the officer will argue, of course they indicted, they have this star chamber proceeding, there was no crossexamination and there was so much overwhelming public pressure to indict, the grand jury had no other choice. If they dont indict, if the grand jury says they arent going to and that happens quite a bit with Police Officers because they get a certain edge, if you will, then youre going to have, unfortunately, great civil unrest because people are going to say, well, what the heck, we didnt see any of this evidence. We dont know what happened. This is ridiculous and there wont be any legitimacy to it. David, in a situation where it comes down to officer wilsons word versus the word of Dorian Johnson, do grand juries tend to give Police Officers the benefit of the doubt . I think they do, but theres a lot of other evidence besides the testimonial evidence of the two principals were aware of. More importantly is what is the nature of this blood evidence as mr. Geragos pointed out, back spatter, high velocity mist, low velocity drops, is it smear . We dont know any of those things. My understanding is that this isnt grand jury leak, this is a statement from someone in the federal government who is leaking, talking about theres not going to be a civil rights indictment or civil rights case at the federal level. I think thats very, very important because thats very different from a grand jury leak. David clinger, appreciate you being honest, mark geragos as well. The latest in the possible serial killer case next. Narrator these are the skater kid whoa narrator that got torture tested by teenagers and cried out for help. From the surprised designers. Who came to the rescue with a brilliant fix male designer i love it narrator which created thousands of new customers for the tennis shoes that got torture tested by teenagers. The internet of everything is changing manufacturing. Is your Network Ready . Come from all walks of life. If you have high blood sugar, ask your doctor about farxiga. Its a different kind of medicine that works by removing some sugar from your body. Along with diet and exercise, farxiga helps lower blood sugar in adults with type 2 diabetes. With one pill a day, farxiga helps lower your a1c. And, although its not a weightloss or bloodpressure drug, farxiga may help you lose weight and may even lower Blood Pressure when used with certain diabetes medicines. Do not take if allergic to farxiga or its ingredients. Symptoms of a serious allergic reaction include rash, swelling or difficulty breathing or swallowing. If you have any of these symptoms, stop taking farxiga and seek medical help right away. Do not take farxiga if you have severe kidney problems, are on dialysis, or have bladder cancer. Tell your doctor right away if you have blood or red color in your urine or pain while you urinate. Farxiga can cause serious side effects, including dehydration, genital yeast infections in women and men, low blood sugar,kidney problems, and increased bad cholesterol. Common side effects include urinary tract infections, changes in urination, and runny nose. Do the walk of life yeah, you do the walk of life need to lower your blood sugar . Ask your doctor about farxiga and visit our website to learn how you may be able to get every month free. Authorities in northwest indiana say they have found the bodies of seven women since friday led to them by a 43yearold man who is now in custody. He told police that he, quote, messed up by killing a woman in hammond, indiana, and that was just the beginning. Some of the cases may go back 20 years. Miguel marquez reports. Reporter Afrikka Hardy perhaps the last victim of darren dion vann. A man whose back page profile described him as big boy appetite. When hardys friend didnt hear from her, she got worried, calling and texting. When she finally heard back she knew it was not Afrikka Hardy responding. The female facilitator attempted to contact ms. Hardy and was provided suspicious text responses that she believed to be from the suspect while he was still inside the motel room. Reporter 19 years old found signs of a struggle. A broken fingernail on the floor. The beds moved away from the wall. Next to the toilets, a pillow with blood on it. Africa hardys mother in shock. She was my rock. She was my best friend. She was my everything. When i didnt have anything, she was all i had. Hardys death, those few Text Messages led police to a phone number for van and Surveillance Video of the car he was driving. Both led them to his home in neighboring gary, indiana. Mr. Van told the Police Officers at the scene that he had messed up by committing the crime in hammond and was surprised at how quickly he was located after the incident. Reporter van, say police, admitted killing africa hardy, whose escort name was octavia. He told police when the sex got rough she fought him and he strangled her, first with his hands, then an extension cord. He says he used white gloves during the murder, placed her body in the bathtub, then drove to his sisters home in gary. During a subsequent interrogation of mr. Van he admitted his involvement in the hammond incident and had expressed interest in notifying police of other criminal incidents he was involved with. Reporter those socalled other incidents were victims. Six of them. Van eventually led police to them, all in gary. Four locations total. All of them found in boardedup, abandoned homes. The search now on for more possible victims in indiana. And police in austin, texas, where van was convicted of aggravated rape in 2009, say they are now combing through cold cases and missing persons files to see if Darren Deion Van may have struck again. Miguel joins me now. This man has been charged in the death of the model excuse me, in the death of the model and more charges are expected. Are there similarities among the other excuse me, the death in the motel. Are there similarities among the victims aside from the locations where they were found . Well, it does appear that several of them if not all of them were advertising on backpage. Com, perhaps as escorts, and thats where they came across this individual. Sadly and shockingly perhaps, only one of those six individuals was listed as missing since october 8th. Police are only now starting to understand how most of them died. Two of them we know died from strangulation. The other ones it is still pending. Anderson . Miguel, thanks very much. Theres a lot more happening tonight. Susan hendricks has a 360 bulletin. Susan . Isis fighters launched 15 nearly simultaneous attacks on Kurdish Forces in northern iraq. The terrorist group controls more than a dozen cities in iraq. Despite ongoing air strikes by the United States and its arab allies. Well, the accused ring leader of the 2012 attack on the u. S. Diplomatic complex in benghazi, libya pleads not guilty in a washington federal courtroom. The suspect faces 18 charges including murder. Four americans were killed in that attack, including ambassador christopher stevens. And Monica Lewinsky is back. The former white house intern who famously had an affair with then president bill clinton, joined twitter today and then gave an emotional speech in philadelphia. Shes vowing to end cyber bullying. She also said all these years have been painful. It feels like a punch in the gut. As if a stranger walked up to you on the street and punched you hard and sharp in the gut. I would go online, read in a paper, or see on tv people referring to me as tramp, slut, whore, tart, bimbo, floozy. Even spy. So theres monica explaining kind of what she went through as a forbes summit. Anderson. Susan, thanks very much. Up next sad news tonight. Breaking news. We are learning that legendary Fashion Designer Oscar De La Renta has died. Well take a look back at his life and truly extraordinary career. Next. Want to change the world . Create things that help people. Design safer cars. Faster computers. Smarter grids and smarter phones. Think up new ways to produce energy. Be an engineer. Solve problems the world needs solved. What are you waiting for . Changing the world is part of the job description. [ male announcer ] join the scientists and engineers of exxonmobil in inspiring americas future engineers. Energy lives here. They all lost their lives because of preventable medical errors, now the third leading cause of death. Only Heart Disease and cancer take more lives. Proposition 46 will save lives with drug and Alcohol Testing to make sure impaired doctors dont treat someone you love. Safeguards against Prescription Drug abuse. And holds the medical industry accountable for mistakes. Im barbara boxer. Lets save lives. Vote yes on 46. Just getting sad word the reigning king of high fashion, a remarkable man, has died. Designer Oscar De La Renta enjoyed more than five decades in the spotlight, putting hot society into hot couture from Jacqueline Kennedy to most recently George Clooneys new wife, whose wedding gown he designed. According to multiple sources de la renta who was born in Dominican Republic 82 years ago, died this evening. He was the recipient of numerous cody awards, the fashion equivalent of the oscars. Joining me now on the phone is fashion journalist and editor at large at random house, alina cho. I knew him. He was an extraordinarily generous and kind man. In terms of his input, his impact on the world of fashion, what do you see as his greatest achievement . I mean, when you think of great designers who show here in new york, anderson, there are but a few. You think of donna karan, calvin klein, ralph lauren, carolina herrera, and certainly Oscar De La Renta. Youre absolutely right. He was a true, true gentleman in the truest sense of the word. A real bright light. And this is just a terrible, terrible loss for the fashion world. A child of the Dominican Republic, a man who loved that country, had a house there, and was really one of the proudest sons of that country. He was. But america certainly adopted him. Anderson, what was so interesting was just a week ago Oscar De La Renta named a new creative director for the house. A man by the name of peter copping. He was formerly of nina ricci. He will soon move to paris. He will show for Oscar De La Renta in february at new york fashion week. It had long been rumored that mr. De la renta had been ill. But we had heard those rumors before. And certainly when you saw his bright smile he always looked so happy and so healthy that i dont think anyone ever dreamed that we would find or see a day when this would happen. Its really just sad news. 82 years old. Our thoughts are with his family. Alina, thank you very much for joining us. That does it for us. That does it for us. Cnn tonight starts now. Captions by vitac www. Vitac. Com this is cnn tonight. Im don lemon. Exclusive, nurse amber vincents mother in her First Television interview. She is in voluntary quarantine tonight, watching for any signs of ebola. And shes defending her stricken daughter, saying she was in no way careless when she took a commercial flight. Im going to talk to her and to ambers pastor, praying for her and reassuring his Church Family that they are not at risk. Also, is the ebola crisis president obamas katrina . Were going to talk with a man who knows a lot about moments like that. Does heck of a job, brownie mean anything to you . Exfema chief Michael Brown is here. Plus Monica Lewinskys emotional first ever public speech. I was patient zero