for years. putin appears to believe the threat of his russian forces on donbas on, the donbas territory, will get president zelenskyy to the table. meanwhile, we've heard that he will be calling up reservists. he said for now there is no need for a more general mobilization and he has continued, jake, to downplay the russian threat, saying just today, that he does not believe there will be an all-out war. that there will be no russian escalation. of course, jake, his allies strongly disagree. >> thank you so much. let's talk about this with cnn's counter terrorism expert and officer for the cia and fbi, as well as cnn's analyst beth who se serve. some experts think putin's next move could be fast and heavy. others say it is more likely to be incremental and gradual. what do you think? >> i'm going to lay some money