women didn't collaborate earlier to break three, they had a kind of weird hold to castro, that he wielded above them and they responded to. what is your take on that? >> i think the stockholm syndrome has been overplayed on some levels. jaycee due guard is the one who taught me the most about how offensive for many victims it can be to consider that they actually fall in love with their captors. it's an adaptation process, there are components that we all understand that are in the so called stockholm syndrome, but really that's so important to remember that people do what they need to do to survive, and to call it love, anything like a maternal healthy or paternal healthy relationship is erroneous. that's my input on that. >> from all your work with jaycee dugard and many others,