defense than does mark meadows. bannon seems to have waived his defense. he wrote a book about it and he handed over thousands of documents. i don't know how you give over documents and say, here, you can have them but i can't talk about them. the federal courts have told us the executive defense doesn't hold here. i think it's a 50-50 call. >> does it potentially shut the door on actually getting meadows to talk? >> a criminal prosecution does not compel testimony, it's just meant to punish and deter. one thing that could happen, though, if doj agrees with this, they can bring a charge, and then if meadows agrees to