exposed because they're unvaccinated. they're likely to turn positive. >> so larry, in the intro, i mentioned that the president said that he was accusing the west, basically, of hoarding vaccines, but in south africa, at least, the vaccine shortage doesn't seem to be the real problem. it's vaccine hesitancy. and you were mentioning a bit earlier that the u.s. actually has a role to play, even in that. >> that is correct. there is some significant amount of misinformation that has spread in this pandemic. here in south africa and across africa, to be clear. i spoke to one pharmacist who told me over the last year and a half, misinformation and conspiracy theories won and science lost. and you see this growing crowd of anti-vaxers who believe what they hear from conservative u.s. commentators, right-wing opinion hosts, and they have a following here. you hear people like joe rogen and his very influential