i personally think that if the president believes firmly, as he does, that he did nothing wrong and this is a perfect call, then join the issue on the merits and let the witnesses testify and let mulvaney and let bolton and let all of these people who have substantive direct knowledge of what went on testify. then the american people can determine who is right. >> can i ask you real quick, michael? the second call which is actually the first call apparently if you look at the time line. do we know anything about it and what we expect? will there be anything significant? a phone call to the president of ukraine that got us where we are. >> right. as i understand it, this was a call in april. it was more of a congratulatory call than a substantive call so i don't think there is much ins the july call. we have to see. it won't be a transcript. it will be a summary and hopefully, the summary will be complete where the july summary