it's growing all the time. and that we are not set up to deal with it as a government or as a society or as a corporate structure if that's true -- then what is the limit to how often we're going to see this and how high it can go in terms of its disruptiveness? >> and that's one of the concerns we've had since 2003, when tom ridge and i released the national strategies to secure cyberspace. we basically called out there. we need better intelligence collection and sharing with the private sector. we need the private sector to sort of co-lens amongst themsselves. it's been a hit-and-miss thing almost the past 1 years now. so as a consequence, what we really have to do is sit down and say what does it mean to fix this? how can we make sure we prioritize it where it's the water and the electricity and the telecom is a higher priority than you know somebody doing online video watching. >> so one of the excuses for the