some after-the-fact rationale for trying to make the next president look worse. but i mean i just, i think for the guy who wrote that horrible memo that has since been withdrawn about torture, you know -- consider the source. >> you have the american people in just about every poll saying we don't care what you do to bad guys, especially after 9/11. keep us safe. so there's a little bit of what you know power the people give government in this, but it's also raising real trust issues, because when you hear them saying yeah, that's not torture? that makes you think -- well can we trust the decisions that they're making? if they say this isn't torture, you know, what does that mean jeffrey in terms of whether we trust the process that's being applied? >> and you know, i think you put your finger on a very important point here. is that you know, i hate to be lawyer-centric. as you look at the whole controversy that's happened since the report has come out, a lot of it goes back to the lawyers. the lawyers at the beginning, the john yus, the jay bibys, who