so as we're going to break, we were talking about the idea that from the shores of guatemala through mexico and over the u.s. border, a lot of those kids that you've been seeing in those detention centers ultimately end up before a federal judge or some kind of judge, but not always with an attorney. they're entitled to a hearing. it is a very complicated matter. so thank god jean casarez is here and is a lawyer. and you have just come from one of these federal courtrooms where juveniles are actually making these appearances. walk me through. >> i just got here. i didn't know what to expect because i had never been in a juvenile docket of immigration court. you step off the elevator, big sign, "pro bono room." if you as a juvenile do not have an attorney, you go to the left and you get an attorney. you cannot appear before the judge. >> but you don't get access to a public defender, right? >> it is a pro bono, someone that is volunteering to be an