conversations happened. obviously confused or hazy. now here he is in october against steve bannon. >> of course i talked to the president. i have been clear about that. i talked to him all of the time. i don't recall the number of times. >> was it before, during or after the attack. >> i talked to the president after the attack. >> so later in the hearing congressman jordan said "i may have talked to him before" i don't know. but i had nothing to do with any of this. still does not clear it up. but there is new reporting. what have you learned, paul? >> jordan's recollection of that