culture war. >> he does say we lost the culture war. when you think about it, gay rights, the sifl supreme court be decide on proposition 8 in california i think anderson and the board of, sorry, allen and the board of exodus started to think, well, what side do we want to be on, on this civil rights issue? >> it's interesting that in one of his statement, he was sake he feels their world view has not been fire to our fellow human beings, to quote him andals has not been biblical. it sounds like he wants some sort of an organization that is more welcoming, whatever that may mean. >> so, allen, i don't know that they can even define what the next chapter is going to be for them, but he has mentioned to me that there is a place or there are people who are struggling who may want to remain sell celebate or work on relationships with their spouses even though they have same sex