Sir michael, thank you so much for joining us. Sir michael it is a pleasure. Emily you wrote this book with another sir, sir alex ferguson, the legendary former manager of manchester united. He is one of the revered names in football, or as we call it, soccer. What drew you to this project as a journalist turned tech investor . Sir michael i always followed united. Not as a raving fan. But as a young boy, i started to follow them and i followed them through the years. But then, working in Silicon Valley, working hard to help build sequoia, i was very curious about organizations that had succeeded for a very long time, and performed at an extremely high level. And particularly those organizations that had been run by one individual. And there just are not that many of them. Emily you both, in your careers, have been tasked with taking undervalued assets and making them profitable. Sir michael he grew up in scotland, and i grew up in wales. Both of us sort of have an outsiders mentality. And also, i think, a fair amount of a big work ethic. Emily he is credited with transforming this faltering club into a 3 billion public company. What was key to his success . What are the lessons for men and women in business here . Sir michael i wish i had done this, or thought about all these topics 30 years ago. Because i know i certainly would have been far more effective. One is patience. Two is a longterm view. Three is developing people inside of the organization, particularly young people, and bringing them along. Because if you are successful doing that, you build great consistency, loyalty. In and it is easier to instill the sort of levels of performance that you want. Emily you boil down the traits to a distinctive leader to just two. One is obsession. And two, capacity for dealing with people. Sir michael you might look at jeff bezos, or larry page, or mark zuckerberg. These people are obsessed with, at the beginning, the products that they want to build, and then their company. And i think the very successful people are great at building teams around them. Microsoft, for example, in its heyday, had a very stable management team. The same has been true at apple. Emily you are so well known for your time chronicling the early days of apple. You spent time with jobs. You were in favor with him, you were out of favor with him. I wonder what you learned by watching steve so closely about what makes a good leader and what makes a bad leader . Sir michael for steve, the product was never good enough, whether it was a computer or a phone or a tablet. He was always thinking about the next thing. I think that is the distinctive hallmark of a truly great leader. Is that great is never great enough. Emily there were a lot of qualities about steve that, you know, are so controversial. Is the jobs model a good one . Sir michael i am a huge admirer. Was a huge admirer, am a huge admirer of steve. And it is very easy for people to sit and snipe. I am no psychiatrist or shrink, but i dont think any of us really understand the emotional consequences of being put up for adoption, and how that affects your life afterwards. And what people also do not see about steve and i am not trying to whitewash the fellow is that this was an individual, very capable, when he wished, of showing great empathy and compassion. Steve is the most remarkable person that i have met. Emily just out of curiosity, where did you leave it with him . Sir michael sadly, unfinished. Polite on business terms, but that was about it. Emily you wrote the famous time cover story about the and machine of the year. The machine of the year. And you were a journalist at the dawn of the pc revolution. I want to talk to you about some upandcoming leaders in technology. The sort of archetypes. Brian chesky. You are an investor at airbnb. And Travis Kalanick at uber. Sir Michael Brian exemplifies the wonderful traits of a leader. He is obsessed with his company. For him, there is always another hill, mountain to climb. He pushes his team very hard to do the impossible. He has a very longterm view of his business. And he has got a lot of energy. Hes got a lot of optimism. About the prospect. He is a fantastic leader. Emily what about Travis Kalanick . Sir Michael Travis is somebody i do not pretend to know well. Emily he is so controversial. Sir michael controversial have you met anyone who is not controversial that has done interesting things . Emily having known three decades of leaders in Silicon Valley, do you think you have to be arrogant to be successful . Sir michael four decades. Emily four decades. Excuse me. Sir michael lots of leaders have to make decisions about going in directions that may be is not popular in the organization. And sometimes, it spills over into arrogance. Im different from how i was in my 20s. Bill gates, who is in his 50s, is very different from what he was in his 20s. Everybody learns a lot in their pursuit. So, the understandable energy and enthusiasm sometimes spills over to arrogance, and some people in their 20s tend to get softened over time. Emily you wrote this book before jack dorsey was named ceo of twitter. And you say the only Silicon Valley company that grew from strength to strength, as you say, as it swapped ceos, was intel in their first 30 years. So, do you think twitter can become the second in history . Sir michael i think it is far better to bring a founder back , who still feels a real sense of dedication and ownership with the company then going out and hiring an outside hand. Jack has not been bashful about saying that the product of twitter needs improving. That is where his strengths lie. As the product improves, presumably, Consumer Satisfaction and the business will improve as well. Emily how do you see this playing out . Does this bubble burst . Or is there a soft landing . Emily as you said, you grew up in wales, and you somehow made it to Silicon Valley. What kind of kid were you, and how did you get here . Sir michael i got here through no grand plan. I went to college in britain, and this was the britain of the mid1970s. It was not a particularly enticing place, if you were a young graduate looking for opportunity. So, i came here, and was very lucky to get a scholarship to come and study here. And then, after that, was lucky again to get a job at time magazine, who eventually sent me out to Silicon Valley. Im a history major, knew nothing about technology. Eventually, through a stroke of great luck, a fellow, who had started sequoia, don valentine, took a risk on me. Emily what are the qualities that you think you had as a journalist that made you a good investor . Sir michael i am not sure that i am a good investor, because we always keep making mistakes. The Investment Business, the venture business, some of the other businesses we are in in sequoia, it is a very humbling pursuit. As soon as you think you are good at it, you get chopped off at the knees. Journalism, though, was very pretty helpful, because you are was pretty helpful, because you are often parachuted into stories that you know absolutely nothing about. You have to get your bearings extremely quickly. Youve got to deal with imperfect information. And then you have to have a point of view, if you are a journalist, or you make an investment decision, if you are investor. An investor. You are trying to read people. You are trying to gauge sentiment. I found the fact that i had been trained to make up my mind about a confusing set of information extremely helpful. Emily Andreessen Horowitz has really perpetuated this idea that good vcs need to be former founders or former ceos. Of which you are neither. Sir michael i think its difficult to tell from someones background whether or not they will be successful in the venture business. We have a lot of Company Founders at sequoia. But there is also room for lots of other people to succeed as well. Being in the Investment Business is also different from running a company. People like us, we are not running the company. We are trying to help these companies as much as possible. The other thing that people miss is that we are working very hard on building our own organization, because unless you have that at the heart of everything, you cannot make consistent investment. Emily you say in the book that the minute you think you are winning, that is dangerous. And sequoia may be the most successful Venture Capital firm in history. What do you do from within to evolve the firm and stay on the edge . Sir michael it begins with consistency. Showing up for work every day. I know emily a lot of people show up for work every day. They are not sequoia. Sir michael it is true, but it sounds simple. It is easy to start easing back and not working quite as hard. And not seeking the same level of success, not having the same hunger, getting arrogant, becoming complacent, believing that you are as good as your press clippings, which are never true. We still act like this in the belief that we are only as good as two things. One, the next person that we hire to become part of sequoia. And the second is our next investment. Emily if the headline of sequoias slide deck was r. I. P. Good times during the financial crisis, what would the headline be today . Sir michael gravity has not been repealed. Emily what do you mean by that . Sir michael that things eventually will fall down to earth if they are not properly constructed. Emily so how do you see this playing out . Does this bubble burst . Or is there a soft landing . Sir michael it is a more rational time than 1999, because i dont think there is a sort of universal feeling that every company is going to be a massive success, and people are a bit more discriminating. And some of them are going to come a cropper. Emily come a cropper. Is that a british phrase . What does that mean . Sir michael they will fail. Emily they will fail. Sir michael it is the law of corporate and business evolution. If people get too big for their britches, if the company is run poorly, if the money is wasted, the product or service does not really fulfill its promise, the companies deserve to fail. Emily how protected are late stage investments in this environment . Sir michael many late stage investments are not investments. They are just welldisguised forms of debt. Many of them are very well protected, because of the terms that investors have put around them. Emily the ratchets. Sir michael the ratchets, the liquidation preferences. These are not really equity investments, they are debt. Emily but is that a dangerous trend . These ratchets and the guarantee that investors will get a certain amount back . Sir michael if the companies do not perform, yes. It is highrisk poker. Emily what about the risk of down rounds and high ipos . And delayed ipos . Sir michael it depends on the performance of each company. But we have gone through this period where the valuations in the private market are far in excess of what they are in the public market, so you have one bucket of bubbling water and another bucket of fairly cool water. If those two buckets are commingled, the temperature will even out. Emily what kinds of businesses do you see will be the first to go belly up, and what trends do you see that will last . Sir michael the businesses that go belly up are the ones that are run by people who deny reality. And do not use the money that they have raised very wisely. And think that there are a whole bunch of shortcuts to success. Those things will come a cropper. But companies that are run prudently, that have got really good discipline about them, that have the right ethical compass from the top, and also that have very distinctive products. Those are going to flourish. Emily lets talk about ondemand economy. You were an early investor in webvan. Youre an investor in instacart. There are questions about the model. Sir michael the one thing we got right about webvan, although we made a lot of horrible mistakes, was the consumer demand for this service is just through the roof. Which is what young instacart is finding today. Instacart, for example, it does not have huge factories or distribution centers. It does not have its own vans. It does not have all of the Capital Infrastructure that was required to build webvan. And it can manage a workforce through these incredibly powerful smartphones. And it is incumbent on instacart and its wonderful founder and ceo to make sure all of the economics makes sense, which it will. But the company is providing a fantastic service to consumers, who just swear by it. Emily any concern about competition from uber . Sir michael we are always aware of competitors, particularly a company as successful as uber or amazon. But you cant define yourself by them, or run afraid. Because then you are following. Instacart is a very complicated business that is very difficult for any company to mimic. Emily how bullish are you now about alibaba and Chinese Internet Companies . Emily i know you were really bullish on alibabas ipo last year. How bullish are you now about alibaba and Chinese Internet Companies . Sir michael despite the bedlam that we all read about, i will Say Something that will strike you as odd. I dont think anything has changed about china. The underlying consumer demand is very strong in china. The Internet Companies there, their business is very good. It is strong. It is healthy. It is vibrant. And we have built our own business there over the course of the last 13, 14 years emily quite a robust business. Sir michael a very robust business, run by some wonderful people. And its no accident that seven of the 20 most valuable Internet Companies today are chinese. Because over the next 20 years, there is going to be far more Business Done between the Technology Companies that get started in china and get started in the u. S. Than there has been over the last 20 years. Emily what does Silicon Valley have to learn from china . Sir michael im always struck by how eager people running Chinese Companies are to learn about their american counterparts. How frequently they come to the united states, how jammed their schedules are when they come here. I wish that the ceos and founders of Silicon Valley companies did the same thing in china. Because i think we could learn a lot from them. And in mobile in particular, the products are different. The services are different. If any Silicon Valley company aspires to be a global company, china is going to be a very big part of their future. Emily now we are seeing airbnb start its own chinabased company with a chinese ceo. Sir michael and linkedin as well. Emily linkedin as well. What does it take for u. S. Tech companies to succeed in china . Sir michael we try not to make the mistakes that we watched others make. So, the first thing that you need to do is go there and admit you know nothing. You need to understand the market is different, and you definitely dont staff your company in china with people from america or europe. You also need to understand that there is a very different work ethic in china. People just happen to work a lot harder. So, its a whole new level of competition. Emily sequoia is very successful, but you have no women partners. What do you think your responsibility is there . Sir michael we think about it a lot. I like to think, and genuinely believe, that we are blind to somebodys sex, to their religion, to their background. We probably have more different nationalities working at sequoia than pretty much its a very cosmopolitan setting. The fact that we have embraced china, we have embraced india, we have operated in israel for a long time, i think shows that. The real question i think that you might have is why, for example, are there not more women . We have many more women working in our China Business than we do in our u. S. Business. Why is that the case . I think the issue begins in the high schools. And where women, particularly in america and also in europe, tend to elect not to study the sciences when they are 11 and 12. So, suddenly the hiring pool is much smaller. Emily so you think it is a pipeline problem . Because some would say, well, you are not looking hard enough. Sir michael oh, we look very hard. In fact, we just hired a young woman from stanford, who is every bit as good as her peers, and if there are more like her, we will hire them. What we are not prepared to do is to lower our standards. But if there are fabulously bright, driven women who are really interested in technology, very hungry to succeed, and who can meet our performance standards, we will hire them all day and night. Emily 2012, you took a step back from daytoday operations. How are you doing . We are seeing you taking on new boards. Sir michael yes, it is great. Emily what has it been like for the last two or three years . Sir michael ive enjoyed it. I did so for a variety of reasons. That i talked about at the time, which we dont need to revisit. And i act as, i hope, a helpful team member. I am not involved in the management of the business at all. I am involved in several companies, some of them very young. And whenever somebody wants some help, at sequoia, i am more than happy to do it. Go to india, go to china. We have a couple of investments in europe i am engaged with. But i also have a bit of time to do things like write a book with a wonderful man who managed a fantastic soccer team. Emily yeah, you could be sitting on a beach right now. Sir michael i cant imagine anything more boring than sitting on a beach. I think the vibrancy of life comes around new experiences and being around young people. Emily so, what is next for sir Michael Moritz . Sir michael i have no idea. [laughter] sir michael something will show up. Emily sir michael, thank you so much for joining us today on the show. It has been really great to have you here. Sir michael good. Thank you for having me. Emily thank you. Our world today is wealthier than ever but not everyone shares as well. Wealth. Changing the way we think about money. This is a new generation. This is the new philanthropy. You dont do things by half. His father is one of britains richest men. His family controls the worlds biggest Steel Company. We operate in 27 countries. 39, he is responsible for the finances of a global company. Were we willing to entrust our company to him . Yes, we would. Leading by example. I think he has it. He has his sights set on some of the world the guest, which he knows will require bigmoney and smart thinking to solve. Malnourished is the first thousand days of their life, they cannot achieve proper development. Company. He ceo of our i have been at the company for 17 years now. The ceo of the foundation you cannot have the modern World Without infrastructure. Cars, roads, bridges. Schools. She was beautiful in many aspects. I have a great example. If you historically look at the beam, it was rectangular. We realized if we introduce these curvatures, it is more versatile. Once we did that, we named it the angelina. It won a design award. Not only is it stronger. But if you ever go to an airport and see a roof with these rectangular structures, it is curved, it is painted, it just gives a better aesthetic. It is multipurpose. Steel is beautiful. I first met him in 1996, when he joined as an intern. Stories oftelling me when he was a child on a saturday evening in indonesia where his father had else a steel plant. His sister and he would play on the scrapheap outside the steel plant while his father was inside mending the machinery. Aroundily life revolves the activities involved around steel. When i was 203i had graduated and was working in new york. My father continuously was pestering me to join the business. I put all these conditions in front of him thinking he would never accept. One day, he called my bluff. Later, the Steel Industry had amassed even bigger what we were facing today because of the russian devaluation and the Asian Financial crisis. Industryf the u. S. Filed for bankruptcy. Our stock price had tanked and here i was. Going through that steel crisis was the best learning experience for me because we realized what you need in a Steel Company to survive the tests of time. And what are the Key Attributes of a good steel business in a downturn. Mittal had found themselves bidding against each other and when you find yourself with the largest players in the industry, you could find yourself saving billions of dollars. He was effectively the ringmaster. There had never been a transcontinental deal of this scale. Say he probably was the chief strategist in the deal. He had a number of countries involved. For aa lot of skill person that young to deal under potentially confrontational circumstances with political leaders. Little steel was created on the basis of globalizing and consolidating the industry. Not matching its customer requirements. Customers wanted to have one steel part of whether they were operating in china, a u. S. , or europe. That was the vision of our company. Steel provided the scale. It was a very long run. I think dealmaking is actually a lot of fun for me. I enjoyed tremendously. Very challenging experience, demanding experience. At the end of the day when you are trying to create is Something Better and bigger. The great thing about acquisitions is that you have this feeling of success. The bad thing is that it is momentary. , everyone in the organization had forgotten and the focus was how do we make it a bigger success. He is focused on the numbers. He has an instinctive grasp on the sense of value. That is very unusual. He is quick to identify the potential in terms of the synergies and the opportunity to create value. It is inherent for what he is doing. I think the catalyst of doing something was when i became a it is a hugeuse responsibility. It is just there. You realize you want to provide, care. There are millions of parents out there who have the same sentiment. Early 30s. In his when he created the worlds biggest fuel company. It was the culmination of a father, guided by his the indian steel magnate. But was born in india imovie out of india when i was one year of age because my father had a tiny facility. He was a startup entrepreneur with all the energy and excitement. As a child growing up in that house, we hear stories of failure and success and not being far from the facility, i would be seeing where he was going and later on in life had the chance to visit and see exactly what the plants does. I was blown away. Loud,t steel, it is very fiery, there are fireworks flying across. You are taking either iran or or ore or coal. The whole process was quite fascinating for a 12yearold child. I was drawn to the steel business from a young age. Mattel is a impressive individual. He got this business by taking risks that other people would never imagine taking. He would call me every other day or twice a week. He told me how can i deploy my business. That is a fascinating way to have a relationship. I know what i am doing and welcome to my business. It was how can you help . He has this level of crazy passion as well. I was always drawn to him as well as to the steel business. He was mainly buying businesses that were being privatized and mark in merging markets. One great example was kazakhstan. It was in such Poor Condition that he took it over simply by paying the next months payroll. Since then, he has put a lot of money into it and taken billions of dollars of cash flow out of it. That is a challenging thing. They have Mutual Respect and that is unusual. Often our experience has been with fatherson in business together, this kind of love hate relationship. Tell, it is not that at all. They each make space for the other. They each have a lot of respect for the other. I have not seen any signs of matter,l or, for that professional disagreement between them. Clearly my father has a tremendous impact on my business career. In ourboth strong views, very persistent in our views. So there is a requirement to convince. But that creates a better decision, not a weaker decision. You have to argue the pros and cons. Or there is frustration absolutely. Both of us understand we need to resolve that. Because i think at the point in time where we are, it is not an environment in which you make a decision without consulting me and i make a decision without consulting you. We share the same vision of the company. Traits they share our first of all tremendous drive. Second of all, tremendous focus on what they are actually doing, down to the most minute detail. The focus is unusual for people running such a big company. It is hard to imagine how they are able to keep that much detail in their minds. Third thing is, they perfectly prepared to take calculated risks. Leadership is to do something different. To change the game. To change the status quo. Today we live in a world that is all about technology and development and if you are on you really have to be passionate if you want to do something. You have to be crazy passionate. There has to be an element of craziness in you. You cannot be sane and say you are passionate. Around, looking for opportunities to expand the business. People thought we were crazy when we went to kazakhstan. We made that offer first. In the outside world, there is a crazy passion. It was thought through. It was very clear what our advantage was. We wanted to globalize and consolidate. We are very focused on creating something that was stronger than what it is to today. Time, what people may perceive as craziness becomes very same. Sane. He has seen property poverty firsthand. Wealth is not taken for granted. Of the plight are not assumed as given. He has therefore gravitated to the notion that it is important to support where he can, causes that are relevant to him and make sense. Living in london or being educated in the states, you cannot you are shocked and surprised by the level of poverty. You cannot escape it. It is very evident and becomes even more evident as you grow older. Mittal has devoted his life to his familys business. But he has been thinking more about dollars. His ambition is big. Childhood nutrition is a huge problem. Underter of the children five years old in the world is suffering from some kind of malnutrition. That has devastating longterm consequences on their health, education, life chances. It has a devastating effect on the economies of whole countries. In india, we are talking about an intentional a potential impact of the gross domestic onlyct, a huge impact not on the malnourished child but on the whole society and economy. Malnutrition is one of the Biggest Industries is of our time. Injustices of our time. In the first thousand days of a childs life, from inception to their second birthday, is absolutely crucial that these children receive the nutrition they need. If they do not, they will not only be at a low birth weight, that they will also be irreversibly damaged cognitively as well. One of the big things most refreshing is that he really applies the same logic to his philanthropy that he does to his business and trust. In any business, if you have a child, find the root cause and address that. We want to address root cause. The root cause is very different. We want to create the strong data and work on that data. Data is incredibly important. Bit of aink it is a boring subject, but data is crucial and it is something we have to invest in. Through the Data Collected in the survey, we were able to identify a high proportion of women were severely in the make anemic prepregnancy. Through pregnancy. We have seen an absolutely incredible drop in the rates of chronic malnutrition. That is 39 to 22. An astonishing drop in a short. Of time. Period of time. We have ruled out the same diagnostic study. 30 states inrs india, 200 million children, from the ages of zero to 18. Hopefully, we can further improve the Government Programs in improving Childrens Health. That is what we are trying to achieve. It is very expedient to spend money on tangible things, investing in a new hospital or food rather than putting resources into a study or a survey. That is as critical as spending resources on providing. We live in the u. K. , we are from your london. It is important to get back to where we are. Since our focus is Childrens Health care, the best to begin with is on the street hospital. It has big implications and a strong emotional aspect. If we look out here, you can see the two parts of the childrens medical center. The first one on our left is the one that is completed. Which is holding cardiac surgery operating rooms. The is the second half of structure which is currently being built. It is hard to overestimate the impact. Made a complete revolution for the patients who are in it. , each childe from had a small amount of space. Modern medicine has moved on to such an extent that they are often surrounded by a lot of equipment and their families, so vehement of space they need has grown. The building has made that possible and given back to the children their dignity and privacy and allowed some space for the parents to look after their children closely. Poor facilities historically, going back to the mid19th century. Being able to modernize our hospital and provide facilities appropriate for the 21st century amongst patients and staff has gone up. We are able to do our work in an environment that is appropriate for the modern era. Think it has changed considerably in the past couple of years and this new wave of philanthropists are really looking for a way to have deeper engagement and involvement with the causes they support. Not only in the monetary value but offering their business acumen and experience. Business life is extraordinarily busy. It is unusual at his time of life, the ability to find the causes devote to other other than his career. Yes, that is impressive. Think i like to work with steel but i hope i can relax. I spent most of my time in the sealed business steel business. Migrated to the point where you dedicate your life to such causes. I hope to one day. Bloomberg keeps you connected. On television, online, on the radio, and on mobile. Francine welcome to leaders. Santander is one of the oldest and biggest banks in the world. With a footprint in spain, brazil, the u. K. , and the united states, it is a truly global bank with more than 100 million customers. Recently, the spanish lender has undergone several big changes, most recently when emilio botin, the executive chairman, passed away in 2014. His daughter, ana botin, took over from her father and quickly implemented a share sale of 7. 5 billion euros. Well, in her First Television interview since becoming chairman, i speak exclusively to ana botin about her on