From our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. The judge is a new film directed by david dobkin. It features Robert Downey jr. And robert duval. Heres the trailer. The infamous hank palmer. A lawyer with no respect for the law. How does it feel, knowing every person you represent is guilty . Fine. Me. Cent people cant afford is there anything the council would care to ask . Is this the first time . First time. Grandpa palmer is dead, too . He is dead to me. Figure of speech. We can barely stand the sight of each other. Hank, thanks for coming. I am sure your mother would have appreciated it. Hank palmer. It is the sheriff regarding your father. The biggest mistake of your career, when you happened to run him over . I sat on the bench for 42 years. We need to establish a firm defense. I cant stay. He is your father. Im going to impale your client on the first degree charge and you will get a first row seat. Five father is a lot of unpleasant things. Murderer. Was i tough on you . Yes. I did what i thought was right. In my experience, sometimes you have to forgive in order to be forgiven. You and i are finally done. We are not done. Joining me now is the director and the films two stars. I am pleased to have them here. How did this film begin . Was it inspired by personal things . My father was a powerful attorney and i got in trouble a lot. There was that. [laughter] my mother got ill in 2005. We had had a tumultuous relationship. Negative. Being in the position of having to parent a parent was something i was unprepared for. And it kind of shocked me, took me by surprise. In 2007, after she passed away, i started to sketch out a story about a family who was dysfunctional and broken. The men in the family are left behind to fill in the vacuum. What happens after that. The father is here and the estranged son. These are them. Tell me about hank. He has no conscious understanding of the crisis he is in. He imagines all the worldly success has distance him from this strained relationship with his dad. He doesnt want to deal with it. He is going to go home for a day or two and then get back to his miserable life. Why are they not happy . Why are they estranged . I know of no family in the world, and any continent or city, where families are not complex. In this specific case. It is a very successful son. You are in a small town where you mean something, your morality and prestige. He is in chicago. Gets off a lot of bad guys. They pay better than the innocents. Its a complex relationship. It goes way back. David always said it is like a western. It is really about family, not the drama of the trial. It is a family drama that takes place in a courtroom. A specific arena for the law. Different points of view. One man, it is about honor and the other it is about success. Did you write this with these men in mind . Very much so. I had met robert a year before. I thought it would be exciting to see him in a role playing a normal guy. Just stripped down. He is one of my favorite actors. I have always loved bobbys work. I needed two actors who would not flinch or compromise. This is something that is not like the avengers or iron man. I think it is funny i have not been on the charlie rose show for five years. [laughter] i think theres a way and he has had the kind of career that demonstrates you can be in movies that are commercial and successful and still maintain a certain credit. You have been able to do that for as long as i can remember. The biggest movie i have been in since apocalypse now, 35 years ago. Days of thunder. Plenty of movies that have gotten a lot of attention. Thank you for that vote of confidence. Does it work at different muscles . Or in the end, is acting acting . There was something satisfying about this process with david. Getting as close as i have with you, the way we had to, because you are cohabitating in volatile situations. Then we are having lunch and dinner. Talking smack. This is the first production of team downey. Susan downey come my better half, has been a producer. They had worked together on a project. You know what happens. Actors get production deals and then they blow millions of dollars. We didnt take too long. There is plan b, these other companies that make it worth the while for studios. That is our intention. What is the hardest thing in terms of this venture for you . You had reluctance doing another courtroom drama. Bobby and i both initially sometimes i know im going to do something if i have a strong adverse reaction to it. There is resistance i dont want to say fear. If i am going to bare my soul, can i trust the environment . Can i trust that guy to have my back . That is a tenuous kind of sensitive thing to consider. Take a look at this. Heres a clip. Is that your new truck up front . Which one . Yeah. It is not an affirmation a man uses in court. Yes, sir. Would you give those to his exwife and escort him to his extruck. You will go down to the motors, ask for the father, and sell your new truck back to him for whatever you put down on it. One more word. Go on. You are standing in one of the last great cathedrals in this country. Built on the premise that you alone are responsible for the consequences of your actions. We didnt see them together except for the cutaway. The idea of creating chemistry. You dont know, walking in. Can you create it . Do things to make it happen . You can. We took a threeweek rehearsal process. It was unusual these days. We get to know each other. We help the chemistry build and when you are casting in your head, you hope you see with the dynamic is. What shows up is something that is altogether its unique thing. In some movies, the Christmas Tree lights up. And others, it is not. Frankly, this one did. Did it light up for you . If you Start Talking and listening, nothing more than that. See where that goes. Then you will be rewarded around the corner for Something Better and higher. If you do that on a basic level. It is easy to do that. Getting a sense of who he is as a human being. As people, as actors. Not out here, you get it here. You go from there. If there is chemistry, it will build. If it is pure in the simplest form. Did you feel it early . By the time he had bobby and vince and i, a great and exciting the young actor, bobby was running the rehearsal. I dont want to say running. David had set it up so he had to do very little, just look and watch. By the time the improv was over, he canceled rehearsals. We had hit the critical mass. We were acting like a family. 90 minutes. 90 minutes of improv. He cast the characters as us and saw where it went. It is kind of a bonding process. Here are the actors together in a breakfast scene. Hank, want some breakfast . Care to join . Saturday. Coffee . Lets go. Lets see you there, hank. I will be right along. Tell me about the scene in the bathroom. The scene in the bathroom. Everybody asks about it. Why do they . It is pretty graphic and a negative. Sometimes people dont like to see those things but you have to show them. I was a little hesitant, stepping in your own crap is not so enticing. What you decide to do it or commit, you have to just do it. All out, without intellectualizing. Watching these clips, i look at when the camera goes close on you, the whole story is told. I dont know how you develop that sort of skill. The bigger idea is what sort of risks are you willing to take. Are you a natural film actor . Are you brave enough to do something, if it does not go well, you could be ridiculed for . Like bobby said, it starts with incontinence and ends with a knock knock joke. By the end, it is the heart of the movie. It is him is like a theater piece. It is almost like a theater piece. Because it is a transition moment . I dont know. You cant hold to your side of the argument when you are so clearly in need of assistance. The way david said it up, i was shocked. This feels really real. It is not even lunchtime. I was taken aback. It was the first time they left together in 25 years. That is the beginning of their healing process. You have to find the humor in a scene like that. This is almost like a theater piece. The actors should have a chance to go big, but by going big, you have to do it within the confines of your temperament. You cant violate what your temperament says to do or not do. What were your objectives when he went to shoot this scene . There was an experience in my family that was close to that scene. That was probably the inciting incident of the movie. Having to get emotionally and physically close to someone you had a volatile relationship with was there was a short circuit that happened. People drop everything and get real. I wanted it to be offended and have integrity. Not have it feel like it is a movie. I directed it to be shot and 1. 5 hours. We did three quick three camera setups. It just happened. They were so brilliant and naturalistic. I know it was shocking for the crew. To kill a mockingbird was how many, 40 years ago . There is an Atticus Finch reference. That is one of the cultural references. We decided it was in there naturally. Bill was the one who crafted a lot of the dialogue. So smartly written. The line is, Everyone Wants an Atticus Finch until there is a dead hooker and a hot tub. Then you want someone like hank. You want someone who is going to win. If they are a snake, so be it. In terms of the evolution, did you come out of incarceration as a different actor . I wonder. I suppose not. The dumb way of putting it is it is like being stuck on the runway. Except that doesnt take a couple of hours, were there for days and days. Once you get off, you just had toward the destination you were going to. In the larger sense, every experience has shaped the kind of artist i have become. It allows the event you overcame or outlived, that becomes part of a reference. Bobby doesnt like talking about the stuff. There are a lot of different methods onset. It comes down to the experience you have had. I guess i would have to say yes. There is some bit of the great santini that came out of your relationship with your father . My father was very quiet. Your mother was the dominant force. He was an admiral . He went to the Naval Academy when he was 16. Theres another thing. You got on a scooter in salinas, kansas. There was a girl named stacy. I am sure she is still gorgeous. She jumped on the back of the scooter. We are in the middle of kansas and dad is making a movie with ralph macchio. I felt like steve mcqueen. There is a great scene in the book an opening scene just like that. Great writer. Some thought he might become another faulkner. That is the opening scene. On the back of a motorcycle. You are directing now. A movie . I directed a movie, yes. Are you finished . Yes. We are here to talk about another movie, but it was very for filling. Wild horses. James franco. He rides a horse. He didnt have to learn . He can vault and everything. We call him all sate. It was a great experience. You are developing at while we were shooting. Even when we were shooting, you are like, i think i have the money. We had to recuperate from doing this movie. Bobby went and directed a movie. Cant wait to see it. Does it give you the same satisfaction as acting . I thicket is a continuation of acting. I think they are linked. I have done it as an extension. Behavior. Would you put the apostle in terms of that . It was satisfying. I got a wonderful letter from brando on the wall. Brando enjoyed it and billy graham enjoyed it. The secular and the religious meet. You can do better than that. Do you like to direct . I will do it in the future. Right now i am seeing folks who have the energy, regardless of years, to do both. Susan has given me this great education in producing. After doing this with david, he is encouraging me to do it. I want to talk about the movie i havent directed yet. [laughter] assembling this cast, what were you looking for . A certain chemistry in terms of fitting the character you had in your mind . It is both. I put pictures of them on the wall. They matched your you slowly build the cast. There is something in the chemistry and the visualization of the characters. I am always looking for who somebody is. I dont cast people to become characters. I cast them for who they are and to reveal those aspects of who they are. I am looking for behavior. Were you looking for in your prosecutor . Fear. Billy bob, who is a lovely and sweet gentle man, can be an incredibly powerful performer. I wanted someone i thought could be totally toe with robert and in a quiet and unsettling way. We are talking about a trial taking place for a hit and run. The sun trying to help his trying to help his father in a bad place. Heres part of the dialogue between them. Stop the car. Stop the car. I need my walk. Leaving the scene. Blood, evidence, motive. Close the door. If the blood matches, and i have no reason to doubt it does i must have clipped him. I dont remember what happened. We need to establish a firm defense. We had to get the charges dropped and make it go away. There is no way here, henry. This was an accident. Any decent lawyer can argue this honestly. Somebody from here. With integrity. I wish i liked you more. [laughter] i do like you more. This guy is a great guy. Listening to all the characters and the back story, in terms of maybe there is a child that hank may have left behind, at the end of the film, where do we find hank . Where was he going to be five years from now . We want to delete that a little bit open for interpretation. So few films do nowadays. I think he went there trying to get out of dodge as quickly as possible. By being pulled in, it was his salvation. There is the idea that the sea does not only open but calling for him. The technicalities of a chicago lawyer becoming an Administrative Court justice in indiana are many. The interesting thing about your life beyond those remarkable moments and inflection points is friendship. I read an account of what you said about mel, who had been there for you, put you into a film when you needed to be in a film. Mel gibson. You stood up in a moment and said, we have to give this guy some understanding and a break. He made a mistake. He knows he made a mistake. I thought that said something about you. Loyalty is important. I believe it. Sometimes it takes a little more time. Things shift and change. Our industry can be very forgiving. You need people to rally around you. That is what i had. Ditching know you are going did you know you are going to say it going up to the podium . He was the recipient of the entire award. He turned his speech into a moment of saying, this guy behind me, it is time for you guys to drop it and move on. He was magnanimous. If you had and worked with him, would you still have said it . Even if we did not have a professional career, just knowing him as a man there was this time when we were leapfrogging over each other from one faux pas to the next. He would say, i thought it was funny. What can i do to help you . When things shifted and it can change like that for anybody i also think when you are dealing with alcoholism, if everybody was judged, if every drunk was judged by the worst place in his life, and that became the headline by which we were holding up a feather, my god. Alcoholics used to be the pariahs of society. Now we understand it is a brain disease. There is dna. I dont know much. I try to keep up on the stuff. Just to put anything on it regarding mel, he is a National Treasure of ours. Sometimes people are difficult and complicated. Because you are where you are. This is Robert Downey jr. Can you see your life that way . Im going through these, it is like a three act play. There may be three or four or five acts. Everybodys life, there is the story of their life. It is an interesting cover for a magazine i like to read. If sometimes i have to be the guy on the cover, you never read something that sums up the art of your life in a sentence. If you had a more troubled past, just imagine, you know to meet . What i mean . Well, no one found out. What you think that is true . Why did you get in and other guys did not in hollywood . Yeah. It is an important question. Perhaps helpful to people if they understand where you were. Ive done worse things than you did. Ultimately, runs on the letter going up. Runs going down rungs going down with exceptions to both. I have always had a good work ethic. Lord attenborough told me this, 20 years ago. When you find your ambition. You stop thinking about yourself as someone on the outside and think about what is possible. That is when he thought the stuff would clear away. It was something that was apropos, not just for me but a lot of other people he has worked with. Now that you are getting a shot at the title or you already won . I feel like cassius clay. He changed his name. Right after he won. Then i am muhammad ali. There is a time of gloating, accomplishment. That is another false thing. What is the next moment, right thing to do . That is what has helped me transition. People tend to crash when lousy things happen and when great things happen. You also found love. Yeah, right. Mama downey. She was an executive Vice President at a firm . What she was, she was the producers onset producer and we met in montreal. Only when you went back to l. A. Who pursued whom . [laughter] i was chasing her down hard. She is a very practical a nice jewish girl from the midwest. She did not want to get tangled up with me. But it worked. Of thewas a huge part process. Still is. We go out with this last scene. [sirens] punishment for blowing up the mailbox. I was 13. You remember that. You didnt come to my high school or college graduation. Why . Jailtime. Truancy. I graduated from law school. As opposed to what . Roughing out . Dropping out . I put food in your mouth. Who paid for your college education, your mother . That is one of my favorite scene in the movie. We get to see bobby he is a lawyer. Hank is trying to put him on trial for the past. This has nothing to do with the murder. He crossexamined him. You win that case and say you are right. In the middle, he is cooperative enough to throw me a Little Something and give me that towel. Best to all of you. Congratulations. Great to have all of you. Back in a moment. Lisa dwan is here. She is an actor performing three short one woman plays written by samuel beckett. She does not just uncover layers, she digs to the void between them. She speaks becketts text. She also listens and insists we listen to the quiet that surrounds them. A silence so profound that it feels like eternity. They are playing at the academy of music through october 12. I am pleased to have you. It is a pleasure to be here. It is my pleasure and becketts pleasure to have you there doing what youre are doing. How did this come about . Your own life circle, in terms of being introduced to beckett . I started off my life as a ballet dancer. I went to england as a ballet dancer on a scholarship. Knee injuries led me to fall into acting. I did tv series in ireland. I was acting in this one series with an actor who was part of the gate project. They were committing all of becketts plays to film. That was my landscape and bar when i came to theater. Was completely taken. You know what it was . Beckett does not preach. We spoke about harold pinter. They were friends. They were good friends. He is not standing over you with his hand over his heart. He is not trying to sell you anything or being sentimental. You are invited to bring your landscape. As an actor, these characters are more like creatures. A slice of life. That is a very expansive landscape. The first opportunity you had was a couple of years later, i was sent a script. It was written like you music. I had heard about the play with a disembodied mouth eight feet above the stage that appears to move across the auditorium. Because of sensory deprivation. Each audience member has a unique experience. He wanted the to be spoken at the speed of thought. It is written like music. You have three dots interrupting this beautiful poetry. Its hard to speak it so fast. You do want to stop and enjoy the beautiful imagery. I didnt hear just one stream of consciousness. I heard a kind of cacophony. I heard the nuns. The streets of ireland. I heard home. And then i was cast. Roll tape. This world. This world. Girl. Yes. Tiny little girl. Cold. No matter. Thin air. No love, spared that. In the home . No. No love of many kind. A typical affair. Nothing of any care. Wondering in a field. A few more stops. She found herself in the woods. Who . No. Found herself in the dark. She could still hear the buzzing in the years. Drifting in and out of clouds. Feeling so dulled. Kneeling, yes. What, lying, yes. A sudden flash. God. [laughter] quite the mouthful. Yes, indeed. I was listening for your breathing to see when you breathe. Have you make the decision about breath . I have no time to think about that. I think i circular breathe. I think if i was to start picking about start to get about breeding on top of everything else, i would hyperventilate and have a panic attack. The decision to bring these three, your decision or a producers . It was First Performed in 1972. Beckett went backstage. She did it in 2223 minutes. And said, you destroyed my play. And kept saying, you cant go fast enough. I want the speed of thought. She got it. It was maybe 14 minutes. She had several breakdowns trying to learn. I am only able to do it because, billy did. By performing it, she broke a psychological barrier, almost like the fourminute mile. Is it in part a physical thing . In order to stay in this pinprick of light, that just lights my lips, it is necessary for my body and head to be fastened into a harness. I have black makeup. And a blindfold. I am put into a hole in a piece of wood that only takes a third of my face. It is strapped in two places. I go like the clapper. Talk about these three plays. Someone said, they are located at the brink of death, the undiscovered country, that becketts characters yearn for. That is one of the great things about beckett. The universal landscape. Not i is a representation of thought. It is boundaryless. I think that is why it provoked so many panic attacks in the audience. It speaks to the core. Do these three compared to waiting for godot . This is late beckett. He is shaking off joyces influence. The verbosity. I have looked at what is pure beckett. He distilled and paired away the fat. You are left with something potent. It is so lean and tight. It gets people in the jugular. With footfalls, it is like a Chamber Piece of music. He writes like music. There are so many elements to it. Broadly speaking, it is an exploration of oppression. I play both roles. Mother and may. I suppose we always carry these, as in our heads. It has been interesting to play both roles. Curious sir trevor nunn talking about the genius of beckett. He is unique. A number of times, i have read a short story by beckett. It is really a prose poem. In the english language, the great tradition is verse trauma. Heightened language. The use of language is a rich ingredient. Beckett does exactly that in his very special way. Even though sometimes the plays are very short, even though the expression is very limited, the selection of language, the rhythm of language it is absolutely extraordinary. You find an echo of that in harold pinter. The use of silence and stillness. Just the one phrase that devastates you. I heard someone lecturing about beckett. Something that i think is a thing of genius. Somebody in the audience was complaining that beckett can seem to be so pessimistic. The lecturer said, i think in beckett, there is a pessimism that makes optimism look like sentimentality. I thought that was devastating and that is the elimination we get from him. That is what you were saying earlier. He realized sentimentality is the language of gangsters, emotional gangsters. Yes, it is hard and bleak. I suppose, without sounding too pretentious, it is the closest thing to a kind of truth i have ever felt. When i see audience responses, you know it works for that reason. Of the three, do you like one more than the other . Im beginning to understand footfalls. A lot of people say it is the difficult most difficult of his works. I think i am starting to understand it in a deep literal and personal way. To do that, i have to bring in my own landscape. His mother was may, and the character pacing outside the room was may. Becketts mother is everywhere. It was fraught. Maladjusted. That was a real wound. He said, maybe i should have been an accountant. He wasnt being glib. He thought maybe he failed his mother. It was hard for him. He couldnt tow the line. He left a decent position in trinity college. He took the difficult route. He was a courageous writer. His work was rejected. Interesting reading his letters, some of his rejection lectures letters. Iowas love to see the mind mindalways love to see his at work. He keeps talking about the unnameable. On a drive towards death. He wouldnt let me get past the first six lines. And then one day, he let me go. I felt like a glider. I felt like i caught this current. I felt like i needed this rhythm. To face one of the most difficult truths of all. Is it draining to do these . Is it cathartic . Is definitely cathartic. I dont want to be too indulgent with that. I am highly disciplined. It is a privilege. I play a country, a continent. I travel vast differences in age and time and scope. What other writer will ask that much of me . It is a privilege to be able to offer it. You hook the audience takes away what . I dont know. I am amazed 25 years after his death that it is selling out. With a young audience. People seem to be ready for beckett today. I dont know why there is such a renewed appetite. There is an urgency. In terms of his, appreciation. You had the amazing opportunity to meet his muse, billy. Tell me about the relationship. I had to come to the terms to terms with the role myself. Without seeing her performance, think god. I had to find my own access point. After i did First Perform it, the keeper of the state said, i think you could meet billy now. We greeted each other like longlost war veterans. She had never met anyone who played the role. Neither had i. A year after the meeting, she said, can you come around . I want to give you his notes. Id need to give you his notes. I need to give them. I expected her to take out his old rehearsal manuscript. But she started conducting me. Just as beckett had with her across the kitchen table. She set me free with the piece. I had been trying to adhere to his notes. No color, dont act. I was putting an artificial monotone on the lines. She blew that out of the water. She said, what are you doing . He wants it all. He once the guts, the real stuff. Wants the guts, the real stuff. He wants you. It is great to be here. Thank you. On the next charlie rose, walter isaacson. How a group of hackers, geniuses, and geeks created the digital revolution. Let me show you exactly what bill gates did. Steve jobs did. How the bell labs system led to something. I wantlooked to n a storytelling way. I wanted to do some real reporting and say, how did they make that Creative Leap . How did they do it as a team . Who was the visionary who helped make the leap . Live from pier 3 in san francisco, welcome to bloomberg west, where we focus on innovation, technology, and the future of business. Im emily chang. First, a check on your Bloomberg Top headlines. The dow, nasdaq, and s p are all down. The dow has erased its gain for the year and Global Equities at a loss of 3. 5 trillion dollars since hitting a record last month