whether they were nurses or shop workers or teachers, that people were carrying on through the crisis, going into work, often at great personal cost and risk sometimes in the case, i spoke to prison officers living separately from their families because they were worried about bringing the virus home. and everybody was thanking them at the time, but when it came to the pay round, a real pay cut, it's simply not sustainable. so is it your contention that one of the lessons that we as a society should learn from covid is we should rebalance the pay differentials and redefine what is essential and also what is value in terms of work? i think many of us did question that. for the first time realise how much people were paid, how valuable the work they were doing. i often say, people weren't out on their doorstops clapping hedge fund partners. they were clapping carers, nurses, key workers, people who were emptying our dustbins, people who were looking after us in the midst of that crisis. and i think it's only fair that they should be rewarded