Is a new institution, known for the buildings he has built, and the wives he has divorced. You dont want to cross him, though, because he likes getting even. And hes made it a rule that no one pushes him around ever. So how did he lose all his money and then get it back again . Donald trump, a very warm welcome to the programme. You say you cant make an omelette without breaking eggs. That sounds like a very destructive business philosophy, is it . Im not sure i have actually used those words. Generally, you had to shake things up pretty much in order to do something of consequence. And they have shaken things up, and ive had the best business use of my life, by far. How rough is business in new york . We hear a lot about its the roughest, toughest, the most ruthless business in the world. Is it . I think the business tends to be tougher than in other places, but im not sure its true. The Real Estate Business in new york is an amazing business. It is a great business. And any time you have a great business, you always have competition. Do you have to be a killer in business . I think you have to be smart in business. I dont think you have to be a killer, i think you have to be smart. That many have to have eyes in the back of your head, always looking to is going to get you, put a fast one you . One of the things i say in the book, very strongly, is you have to be paranoid. And the book is selling so well, well, and so people believe this. But there is a certain advantage to having a certain degree of paranoia. You can be a little bit careful. You watch what is happening behind your back. And i think that is probably very true in business. If you are paranoid, how much enjoyment is in that . How much can you actually sit back and say look what ive done, this is great . I think that there is great enjoyment. I think that paranoia cannot be carried to a large shattering crisis point. People are out there and they are looking and looking to three off your throne. Throw you. But i think success brings great enjoyment. It certainly has to me. Most of my business is the building of things. I get great pride that of Trump Tower Per which is on 57th 5th ave in new york, or the hotel in central park. I get a great sense of artistic enjoyment at those buildings. What are the Business Methods in the city . You have been in new york your whole life. I dont think that new york is that much different from other places. What i do think is there is a Greater Energy new york. There is a great verve, or to drive, maybe new york, than most other places. And really, than any other place i have seen. But i dont think the business itself is much different in new york than anywhere else. Greed, corruption, i mean, you say, it is as though a line in the book, but you see greed is good. Well, i dont think that greed is good. As you know, they did that famous film with michael douglas, wolf of wall street, where greed is good. But that is not the case. I think it is bad. I think you have to enjoy what you are doing. If you enjoy what youre doing, it will be successful. Generally. If you dont enjoy what you are doing, it is almost never going be successful. Rich men are always targets. The richer you get, i suppose, the bigger the target that you present to people. I think that rich men, i guess, are always targets. People always target you. I think there is a level of celebrity that my team that has become so prodigious that makes me an even bigger target. So was bothers me, but there is really not much i can do about that. Ridiculous in what way . Celebrity level . Well, it has just become tough to go out. It is up to do things. Its hard to be discreet restaurant, in a sense, because it is always shaking hands and signing autographs and things. It didnt used to be that is a symbol of success, is that . It is, but it is not a good symptom, necessarily. Because lots of problems. Because you go out and you would have dinner with a group of people are struck, the lender being a big event and there are people waiting at the entrance for you. It is just a very tough way to live a life, i find. You talk in book about getting even, the importance of getting even. Is revenge sweet . I believe strongly in getting even. If somebody has hurt you, if somebody has got out of their way to hurt you, if you have the opportunity, it is certainly go out of your way to hurt them. Ive had more criticism about that 17 in than any other statement. The clergy has called. Its a terrible thing to say. That is against our teaching. Others believe that. I believe in an eye for an eye. If you did turn the other cheek, as the clergy have presumably suggested to you, what would that do to your reputation in business circles here in new york . I dont know what it would do to my reputation. Ijust believe in instinctively turning the other cheek. Dont believe. So it isnt virtue, if they want to do a number on you, i really believe that you should just do a number on them, if you get the chance. Can you give me an example . Well, there were people that are really helped in business when things were very good in the 1980s, and in my company was going good. And they did not lift a finger to help me when i needed it. And there were a couple of them that could have very easily held me. Now i have the opportunity to do a number on those people, and i will tell you, and having a lot of fun with the opportunity. Who were the movers and shakers in this society . We get the impression in new york that power is in the hands of a few very, very rich people, yourself included. Decisions in smoke filled rooms . Is that still the weight business is conducted in the city . I think new york is very much run politically. We have a mayor, rudy giuliani, who has done an incredible job in new york. And just been re elected by a huge margin. I think it is the largest margin ever. He has been an incredible mayor. He has done an unbelievable job. He has just been great. And so it starts off with the mayor, the leadership, and the politicians. We have other people within the business community, obviously, that are very important, and are a lot of them. But the city has just become very, very hot. And i think it is due to rudy, and people in business, that have done such a good job. When you say hot, more focus . It has really got more focus. It is just a place where Everyone Wants to be. You want to come to new york. They love the city. They want to be had. They want the action. You know, new york has action. New york is unbelievable action. Everyone wants to be here. And i happen to be the biggest developer in new my company now has do much better than it ever did in the 1980s. What do you attribute that to . Well, i think one thing is perseverance. When things were tough at the beginning of the 90s, for me and every one else, the problem with me was i was getting all the publicity. The Great Depression, you called it . I called it the Great Depression in the early 90s, because we were really in a real estate depression. And it was real estate in retailing and airlines, and various other businesses, they were in a total depression. They went into recession. And i survived, and most people did not survive. A lot of my friends, a lot of good people and that people had go bankrupt. And you never heard from them again. And you probably never will hear from them again. But you know, i survived to a point where the company is much bigger now than it ever was, and much stronger, financially, then it ever was. Than. But in the early 90s, you face the possibility of losing a reading. In fact, on paper, you had lost that much of it in. In fact, on paper, you had lost pretty much everything. I faced the possibility of losing everything. I went back to work, focused. I focused my mental energies and all of my energy. You never thought of giving up . I think one of the reasons why a really succeeded and bigger than even in the 80s is the fact that, it is a work called perseverance. I didnt stop. It is a long word. It is a long would come to think of it. I didnt stop. I did persevere. I went up against a lot of odds. I had a phrase, survive till 95. That was in the early 1990s. And it turned out to be right. It is the world changed, the economy change, and there was a Survival Tactic until a certain year. And in 1995, things started changing. I refocus my energies. How desperate were you at that time . How depressed did you get . To start off with, i really played myself a little bit, because ive always been able to pick markets. And i really was not focused was into the 80s. I was having too good of time. I was enjoying my life too much. You dropped your guard . I did drop my guard. And it is no different from you if you do 15 great interviews, and in the 60s you can take it easy because. That happens in life. It is a human trait. I did drop my guard. I put my guard backup and put my defences and offences more than i ever did in the 80s, and worked harder than i did in the 70s and 80s. And actually became much more successful. You had to believe in your own abilities. Was there time where you thought i really cant hack this . There was a pretty depressing times. Because i owed billions and billions of dollars. 975 million or so was personally guaranteed. And that is a pretty big hole. When you are that deep in debt, you are mired in debt, and you are that deep in debt, that is a pretty rough situation to be in. And the vultures circling around you . You have plenty of vultures. You had plenty of bad people circling. And some good people, friendly, that wanted to get paid. But it was just, it was hunker down time, as they say in georgia. And i did do that. You learn some lessons about the people who were your friends and those who would your friends . I read once that i would love to sort of have a bad period, financially, just to see who my friends would be, and to my enemies would be. I will never write again, because it is not fun. It might be a self fulfilling prophecy . That was a true. I have done that period, and in that time, i learnt a lot. I learnt a lot about myself. They also learned that there was a very good friends out there for me, and then people who did not help. Tell me about the women in your life, because there seems a sense in which, you say in the book, you have measured the women by your mother. I have a wonderful mother. Great mother. I dont measure women by my mother, but they have a woman and my mother who is a terrific woman. And ive been married to very nice women, but itjust didnt work out. And i think part of that, one of the negatives to success is that there are lots of obstacles thrown in your way in terms of relationship. First of all, time. But even your own mental psyche. Im thinking about these great buildings all over, that i am doing, building the largestjob ever approved by the new York City Planning Commission in the west side. That is a thought process. There is a lot of things that i am doing a building. And think about that, maybe, as opposed to a relationship. And as opposed to a relationship. I must a netted a positive way, but almost in a negative way. Because it is very negative and has a relationship. And success may be great in terms of living and lifestyle and Beautiful Homes and of this stuff that doesnt mean very but success is not necessarily very good for relationships. Women are far stronger than men, you say. Do you really think they are . I believe that women are actually stronger than men. And actually say that they are not so much stronger, but i think they are more aggressive than men. Their sex drive makes us look like babies. I think the womans sex drive is as much greater than a mans. I have been witness to it, and perhaps you have, if youre lucky. But sex drive of women is extraordinary. And they like to betray themselves as the weaker sex, but the weaker sex does not exist. Believe me. I think that probably, they are certainly the more aggressive sex. And even a business, i have found that some women are just more aggressive. And that only that we know why. And i say this with respect. I say this was scorn or anything else. I say this out of respect. But i think the women, in many cases, are more aggressive than men. Youve seen that sex drive first hand. You talk about the woman of great social pedigree and the dinner party that you went to. Tell us about. Well, ive had a lot of circumstances where a womans sexual drive has turned out to be just extraordinary. And not necessarily anticipated by me. And i write about this in the book. And it is good stuff. There really was a specific dinner, though, wasnt there . What happened . I would rather let the book speak to it, because to be honest, it is was embarrassing talking about it in an interview. Because it really is mostly a business book. But i think that women have a lot to do with business. Theyve a lot to do the effect on your life and how they affect your life. They have a huge amount to do that. She embarrassed you, though, this woman. Your didnt give the name in the book. Somebody else wrote a book and named everyone. It was their feet under the table, was that it . Yes it was. It led to something interesting. There are so many instances like this. And i do talk about them in the book. And they are interesting. It is not what the book is all about. But the book is about success, and frankly, women are so influential, on you, at the world, and the world around you, they have devoted a lot of to women any book. You say that women have one of the greatest acts in the world. The smart ones very feminine and needy, but inside, they are real killers. It sounds as though you almost have a sort of Love Hate Relationship with women. Imight. I have mostly a love relationship with women, because they totally admire and respect and love women. I think women are incredible. But i really do. I feel that there is a the ones who go out and do it without waiting the banner of womens liberation. And if you look at the really successful women, those are the ones that are not had to wait that big banner. Theyve just gone out and done it. Two wives, that you have had, ivana and marla. What do you think of them now . I have good Relations Relationships with both of them. You have had fights. You were in an ongoing fight with one of them at the time the book was being written. I mean, well, see, iwould rather want to address the question sometime later because at this moment, umm, i have a very Good Relationship with ivana. I think i have a very Good Relationship with marla, but i will be able to tell you better later. We will find out. You stressed the importance of the prenuptial agreement, even to use this vicious document, and people who signed a 50 more likely to divorce than those who dont. But yet you stressed that this is the key to a happy marriage. Prenuptial agreements are ugly, vicious, terrible documents that you have to have. I mean, it is, umm, if you are getting married, and if you are a person of substance, man or a woman of substance, you have to have a prenuptial agreement. And the reason is the word certainty. You need certainty over your business. You cant be going on for ten years fighting over a divorce settlement. You need certainty. You just have to have a prenuptial agreement. And even if you do, you have had battles, as you have shown. It is not foolproof, isnt it . Even when you do, i mean, even when you have a. Well, prenuptials are pretty foolproof, but, they still fight. And people who will still fight over prenuptials, i know people that have fought for more than their prenuptial agreements they have given, they are legion. But, umm, you know, the prenuptials are very strong agreements and hold up. Does it take the romance out of it . Yeah, it does. Its always hard to go up to somebody and say, look, i love you very much, but if and when we get divorced, this is what youre getting. So, you know, would you agree to that . Its always. Its always really tough. Its a very unromantic agreement. Theres nothing nice about a prenuptial agreement. But from a practical standpoint, and living in this world, and living through a very difficult court system, and everything else, i think its absolutely necessary for somebody to have won. And at some point i actually devote a chapter in the book to prenuptial agreements. So, you think that if you can sort out the finances, that somehow the relationship will take care of itself . I think that finances and relationships are very, very, very different. I think that finances, that Great Success often leads to bad relationships are unfortunately. I think that the reason somebody becomes successful is they who focuses on success, his or her success, not necessarily this or her relationship. But, i think that there are times when both can work you to flee. Getting the right partner is a very important thing in life. Having the right partner can be a very beautiful thing in life, if you are lucky enough to do that. Taking a breakfrom romance now . I think so. It is certainly not number one in my mind. I am having a lot of fun doing what i am doing. Itsjust not number one in my mind. Do you like to be free . Yes. Available . Not that we are advertising. I think there is nothing like having a Good Relationship. I think having a great relationship is more important than deals and more important than everything else. I find that business comes very easily when you have a Good Relationship. I have just found that historically its been the case. Most people would say its just the opposite, its easier to have a relationship. I think that a relationship is based on so many Different Things that are adverse to business. And i think that having that great relationship does not necessarily go with having a good business. Most important to you seems to be your children, is that right . Yeah, i have Great Children and they are very important to me. That is one of the good things that came out of the relationship. And your parents, i used to very close to them . And your parents, are still very close to them . I am still very close to my parents. I have a great relationship with them. How did they inspire your business . Your father was a businessman. My father was a builder in brooklyn in queens. He built moderate income housing. He was really good at what he did. He was a real professional. And i learned a lotjust sitting on his knee, you know, listening to him from the time i grew up. And i just learned a lot about negotiating and i learned a lot about building, i learned a lot about business. And while he was at a different level in terms of the kinds of things he did, he still built, and he built, you know, some really good stuff. He built somejobs out in brooklyen, queens, and in the boroughs of new york, for low and moderate income people. And, you know, he did a really good job at what he did. Tell me about your friends. Some of the most important people in the world are among your friends. There was a dinner you went out with michaeljackson which you described in your book. Tell me about that, because he seemed almost lost when you took him out to a restaurant. Lost looking at the menu. What do you remember about that evening . Michaeljackson was literally just. He is a very good guy. And he is having a difficult time. But he was literally going to a restaurant. We went to le cirque, the great le cirque, with sirio. And michael was sitting at the table and he just sort of. It was like he was never at a restaurant. He did not know about manners, he did not know about things. And i said to him, when was the last you at a restaurant . And he said many, many years ago. And i believe that was true, because he was so not at ease in the restaurant. Did you have to orderfor him . I mean, he did fine. And saying that he was just not somebody was exposed to this kind of life. What i really thought was interesting was there are many great celebrities at that restaurant. People ask them for autographs. People were asking him for his autograph. That, to me, was the funniest thing about the evening. Sylvester stallone. Another friend of yours. And Frank Sinatra you fell out with at some point. What was all that about . I had a dinner. And i apologised at this point. I said so many things about Frank Sinatra in my second book. He is just a terrific guy. Over a lifetime. Well. How did you fall out . He was rough and tough at the table with somebody, not me, but somebody at the table, namely his wife. And i was really shocked that it. I was surprised that it. I was just amazed at how bad this particular incident was. And then i realised, you go outside and everyone is pulling at his coat strings trying to get his autograph, trying to break him down one way or the other. It really was pretty tough from all of those standpoints. And as i mellowed, coming into my third book, i said, you know, ifeel badly about writing about him. And i did the same thing with Malcolm Forbes. A great friend of mine. When i was having trouble with forbes magazine, i did not feel good about Malcolm Forbes. Then i realised he wasjust doing his thing just trying to do the right thing, and i apologised to Malcolm Forbes, because he wasjust really doing his thing. And Malcolm Forbes has since died. And new york city has lost a great guy and a great character. The impression from what you write is that you havent had a good press. You havent enjoyed relations with the press, you think the press has misled you, lied to you. Is that an Occupational Hazard . I think ithinka i think a lot of the press is dishonest, i think a lot of the press is really, really dishonest. Most people think i get great publicity. I happen to think i get terrible publicity. Do you mind what people say about you . Terrible publicity. Do you mind what people say about you . |j terrible publicity. Do you mind what people say about you . I used to mind much more. The one thing i have learned is that it is a one week phenomenon. Does not matter. Usually at the end of a week or even a it is gone. 0nce at the end of a week or even a it is gone. Once you get that into your head you can live with it. The lessons you have learned over your career. Nobody leans on you, do they . It is very, very focused. Career. Nobody leans on you, do they . It is very, very focusedlj think i help people, i like people, i have a Good Relationship with the ball, i have a lot of Good Relationships with people in business and generally. People. Do people try to lean on you . Everyone does. I dont mind being leaned on if it is to help somebody. I really enjoy helping people at high levels and at low levels and i feel that is very important to give to charity. I give a lot of money to charity, i try to give as much as i can. But, you know, there are times when you just have to say that is enough, that is all i can do. People might look at you and think yourselves, i wonder what it is like to have all of that money. Donald trump, what is it like to have all of that money . Well, again, money does not buy happiness ended it does not buy lots of other things, but it certainly makes life easier, and it lets me create what i want to do artistically. Because in a certain sense i am an artist. I built the greatest buildings in the world and in the biggest developer in new york city and i love what i am doing and i have put up great things. And having money and having the kind of access to money that i have allows me to do what i like to do best. Access to money that i have allows me to do what i like to do bestm someone me to do what i like to do bestm someone said i want to be donald trump, what would you say . someone said i want to be donald trump, what would you say . I would say good luck. Thank you for talking to us. Thank you. Hello there. Weve got a bit of a taste of winter for the new working week. The cold front is going south across the uk introducing colder conditions. So, through the week ahead, a chance of seeing wintry showers. Gardeners, take note, also some frosty nights over the next few nights too. We are already seeing colder conditions moving in across scotland with sleet and snow showers, mostly over the high ground, but some wintry precipitation getting down to lower levels. Further south across the uk, weve got quite a lot of cloud. A few outbreaks of rain. But still into the milded air. Looking at the weather for monday morning. 8am. Largely dry in southern counties. Some sunshine in the south coast towards london. A relatively fine start to the day. Heading further north, one or two patchy showers coming out of the cloud and the bulk of england and wales. Heavy rain in Northern England and Northern Ireland first thing as well. That is the Weather Front going south. But to the north of that, sunshine and wintry showers blowing in on that brisk northerly wind across goal. In on that brisk northerly wind across scotland. It will be wintry across the north of scotland. There could be accumulations of snow in the Higher Ground of scotland. Sleet mixed in even at lower levels and hail is possible. Further south across the uk, cloudy with outbreaks of rain on the frontal system. Some reaching the London Region later on. Temperature still around 14 15 degrees. Further north, struggling. At best, 7 9. Still mild in the far south late on monday. Getting cleared away and pushed away by the frontal system. That opens the door for cold air to work across all of the country into tuesday. Northerly arrows showing a bitterly cold wind. Across scotland once again on tuesday, further sleet and snow showers. Down the east coast of england, also some showers here. Some working further inland. Mostly falling as rain on lower levels. But there will be some sleet and snow mixed in. Some sunshine and dry conditions across much of southern and south western england. But temperatures at best around 7 11 on tuesday. A similar day on wednesday. Sunshine and scattered showers. A wintry flavour to some of these showers over the high ground in particular. And again, those temperatures will struggle. Just seven degrees in aberdeen. 12 in london. The latter part of the week, gradually things will start to turn a little bit milder and showers should ease the most areas. That is how it is looking. Have a good week. Im kasia madera in london. The french have voted in the first round of the president ial election. The centrist Emmanuel Macron wins through to the run off in two weeks. He said a page had clearly turned in french politics. Translation i want to become the president of all the people of friends. The president of the patriots in the face of the threat from the nationalists. Hell face Marine Le Pen of the anti Immigration National front who described the result as historic. Translation the time has come to get rid of all the arrogant people who wanted to dictate to the population what they should do. I am the candidate for the people. Im rico hizon in singapore. Our other main stories