One hour this is B.B.C. Radio 5 it's 4 o'clock Good morning this is a full night on 5 Live from Dalton at a bar the main news on 5 Live prime minister Boris Johnson takes a tough stance from Crawley and in support Sterling's cause 3 S City trash West this is B.B.C. . B.B.C. News on 5 Live is Martha Newman or is John thin is announcing an expansion of police stop and search powers to tackle what he calls the space of violent crime on the streets in an article for The Mail on Sunday the prime minister says something has to be done He's also announced $10000.00 new prison places passengers stuck on cross channel ferries the support of diver upright the one ship in one ship out Paula C.G. To high winds paint a ferry say highly unusual gusts of delay crossings between diver and Kalai by up to 6 hours the US governments in the F.B.I. Are investigating the apparent suicide in prison of the millionaire businessman Jeffrey Epstein the convicted paedophile with the Whiting trial on sex trafficking charges to Malloy has written a book on EPSTEIN It was take about suicide watch 2 days ago he was dead within 48 hours something happened to him early on I'm not a conspiratorial guy at all I'm a reporter but it just boggles the mind how this guy is dead and it was so much he could have said and done not just apologizing and taking blades he could expose other people what dies with him it is possibly information other wrongdoing by high profile people 2 men have been charged with the public order offense connected to an Arsenal player they were arrested outside the north London Hi I'm of Mesut Ozil and science class in AK were targeted by contract has in north London last month. Gordon Brown is warning that sin the union of England Scotland Wales and Northern Ireland is sleepwalking into oblivion writing in The Observer he blames what he calls destructive nationalist ideology and says the U.K. Const of OIF an ideal BRACKS It's a police officer who was attacked with a machete has left hospital P.C. Stuart Townsend was stabbed in the head as he tried to stop a van suspected of having no insurance nice London a man has been charged with attempted murder. boris johnson has released a message to celebrate the muslim festival of the each the prime minister says british muslims the helping to make this country the exotic c'est is his today semei asked sal is from the muslim council of britain my thing we do run the risk some times of these kinds of messages being seen as quite superficial that don't ready oak knowledge smoke the realities on the ground for bitch british muslims with you know in respect to a request for an inquiry into some a phobia in the concept to off he which is a party the portions an obviously now leats dumbass be has the sport at guardiola says manchester city's 1st half against west ham with far from where we want to be a it turned out ok in the end those they thrashed the hama's 5 nil raheem sterling getting 3 harry came got to lay goals to add to deb each on tangay don't ballets open a as a spurs ever came aston villa 3 won billy sharp skordas newly promoted sheffield united earned a point in a want all giora bull miss it finish nil no between crystal palace an abbott's and and ashley barn scored twice has burnley bait sad hampson the strain ale with brian defeating wall for by the same score in the scottish premiership celtic came from behind to humble motherwell 5 to and experimental aisle inside defeated italy 2910 in their world cup warm up game but england's build up to the game against wales was marred by an altar cation involving bend teo and mike brown join that training cab it in italy had coach eddie jones has declined to comment castleford bade london broncos 20 points to sakes in super lee and some a said had beaten kenda by 55 runs in the t 20 blass came a torn to with it space b.b.c. Radio 5 live on digits whole b.b.c. Sounds small speak up some i'm more misty draw in the south with when slowly easing it the different story for the newell where rain will continue right the night the show i was will occasionally d. Head be especially across the northwest england north whiles than am halts of scotland it's sunday ruthie a more prolonged spell a brain in felled than and central scotland and northern england It will be less windy than what it was after day. Ha Ha Ha nearly full to anyone else the future of the coal industry to keep coming find life clearly Sunday the best counsel on still take off from sea mine safety United States called you shall save the E.C. Said this is 5 life. This is a full night of 5 love and also an attaboy coming up in this program in a moment. Any announcement from 10 Downing Street about what Johnson is to bring about incentives of fighting crime and whether it's really kind of indication as to where we're going forward as a country to general election around the was also read about how people have died and a 1000000 people have been forced to leave their homes because of Typhoon in eastern China will get the week's news from New Zealand where there have been emotional scenes for an important votes there and also they've been talking about farming and trying to change and their role in all of that and we'll hear about the fruitcake story from the south as well yeah a fruitcake story from the south oh and also we've got the phone interview with one of the great good saw heroes. Slick who play with the months of his David Bowie John Lennon and so many other people as well but 1st Jones has announced 10000 new prison places and an expansion of police stop and search powers in an article for The Mail on Sunday the prime minister says something had to be done to combat what he called the spate of violent crime on the streets that speech to a B.B.C. Correspondent Jon Donnison about this way exactly the same John. Well he's written an op ed in The Mail on Sunday this morning saying The time for action has come as he says we have the impression of a growing culture of insolence on the part of the thugs and he wants it to be the criminals who feel afraid so he's proposing basically 3 things he's saying that there should be tougher sentences he says far too many people who've committed violent or sexual offenses are coming out of prison too early he's proposing 10000 new prison places in order to deal with those people serving long sentences that's going to involve building new prisons as well as expanding existing ones that's going to cost 2500000000 pounds and he also says that he's going to expand a pilot scheme increasing police stop and search powers and he's proposing all of this to come majorly when. It sounds like it's going to come in pretty much immediately I mean I think what a lot of people will think is that this. Sounds like the sort of thing that you might get coming up to a general election now Prime Minister Johnson has said. That he will not call a general election before that breaks it deadline on the 31st of October but we've had big announcements recently on the N.H.S. Funding and also on immigration and I think this today will increase the belief among some people than an election could be coming once Parliament returns after its summer break next month John thank you very much John donors in the no doubt will follow the story later on today on 5 live and how to Dodo they'll be featured story throughout the week as well the death toll from a toy food which hit eastern China has risen to 28000000 people have been forced to leave their homes because of Lekima which brought swings 116 miles per hour to making landfall in show Jang before heading to Shanghai where a quarter of a 1000000 people have been moved to speak to Ken Moritsugu is a journalist with a pretty embarrassing Karen was the latest that we know in this typhoon. Well as you just said that the death toll is just raised this morning to 28 there's still 20 people missing in this one community that was inundated by a river I got backed up so the death toll could still rise the storm itself has been downgraded now to a tropical storm it's heading very slowly north up the coast of east coast of China so it's expected to bring a lot more rain to the northeast region in the coming days is it the floods that have tried the most lives and yes basically what happened was there was a there were several landslides and these summits landslides actually blocked rivers and backs them up and this does happen from time to time in China and in a very short period of time the river sort of becomes a lake they call the barrier lakes the barrier is formed and a lake emerges and the water just rose several meters in a matter of minutes and eventually broke through kind of debris that was on the side and inundated a small town I think it's only about a few 100 people maybe in the town but. You know took them all by surprise I'm sure and then you said the storm has been downgraded you know where it's heading now. It's heading up to the northeast China basically it's it's past Shanghai now moving very very slowly along the eastern Pacific coast of China and it will you know it will go back over a little bit of water and then make landfall again probably later today which is just northeast area which is the city of rounding which is still a still a big still touting that kind of thing so those areas were not expecting major major fatalities or desk but of a lot of heavy rain and some went. On is this kind of thing this kind of weather in China and they want to cope with it. Typhoon typhoons are quite common and that area that is the southern southeastern coast which is said yesterday by is often hit by typhoons I mean I even spoke to someone from Shanghai on Friday evening and they kind of shrugged their shoulders and said you know we happened we lived through them but it wasn't a lot of rain what was unusual this time as I mentioned earlier was. The blocking of rivers by landslides which then created this tragic situation when it actually became a. Flood level went over the barriers and killed at least 28 people at this point Ken Thank You can merge 2 good journalists with a fee in Beijing union leaders in food you call the voted to go ahead with an indefinite strike it's already led to few rationing for motorist tanker drivers who transport dangerous goods pushing for higher wages and better conditions long queues full potential say should be food the restrictions took effect at midnight local time on Friday the Portuguese court upheld a government ruling that minimum supplies must be delivered to hospitals and they pooled scenario I spoke to our reporter the Lisbon Allison Roberts who's been following events several days now and we've had to use in some cases quite long pulling at petrol stations up and down the country and in some places they have actually run out the old petrol diesel or in some cases by this I mean I should stress this isn't everywhere and there are places where they don't think the queue is cold so it's not you know it's not a matter of you know running low everywhere is really a matter. To put it bluntly panic buying on the call to some people they don't like the local people buying very large jerry cans and filling them up at petrol stations and then doing them at home we can cause the authorities have made. Point of saying is clearly illegal because it's dangerous but this certainly been quite the little guy going on as well nobody knows how long distraught to last not exactly it is indefinite really open ended its assault on Monday and the union to uphold it have said there is no date to and now of course there will be negotiations that forensically I'd say going on there already have been for several days it was only on Saturday afternoon that the 2 unions members voted to go ahead with the strike they have this mass meeting but of course the union leaders all always contactable and they say if it isn't too late the court itself. The employees the road toll has association representing road wholly as up and down the country come forward and give them what they want which is essentially back to pay and better working conditions how we go to this strange how we go to the stage when it is effectively a potential strike about jobs in Portugal Yeah it's a strike by drivers old dangerous goods lorries of all kinds but evidently as you say fuel is the one that's going to be felt most rapidly and most by ordinary members of the public this isn't actually because the time to strike has been called that was one in April by the same union that had a very big impact and it's essentially why people are panicking now when that was cool people did not react in advance of it it was only when the effect was felt very quickly even with talk of for example it's been Apple not having few available that the authorities realize quite how serious conditions could get in the public eye as well so this is why we seen. Something resembling panic now this time because we know the effect was felt very very quickly in the last. Right of the authorities are the 2 states saying in this case well they and they have already stepped in in the sense that they have announced a range of measures they formally announced on Friday what they call an energy in those and say I'm not being told I'm number of things one of which is creating or designating a network with cycling strategic network of filling stations all 320 around the country that are open to the public which will have to also supplies guaranteed and another smaller number which all and most for emergency services essential services including for example the vehicles that go around setting up A.T.M. Or something kind of machine so that made a run out of money because they will these knock on effects that could happen if the musical can't get around and do their job so that's the main thing the government is doing setting up this emergency network without well any work indeed the legally mandated minimum services that the even striking workers are obliged under the law to provide already provided in the union to said they will and so those services but they will fight challenging them in the courts because the government has said that they must be at least 50 percent old normal services in all areas and in some respects up to 100 percent and the union does unions assign Well that's really infringing on their right to strike because it's effectively saying in some cases they will be on strike a school so there is a bit of a legal wrangle going on with that the government is saying you know in a satellite base minimal with minimum service it's gotten services that you might get what it's much more than this kind of thing in this case has to be really quite expensive whereas if it was just a matter of a factory or 2 striking it wouldn't be the same because the effect is felt so so greatly and so immediately on. All of the fields of life and of course this is the height of the tourist season and Portugal has a very important to respect their rights in the middle of all because it's anything to put together these is the way this is the weekend when they either come back office 2 weeks away or they go away all for their 2 weeks holiday and it goes over the foreign tourists from Britain and many other places have been arriving in recent days and you know of course they'll many of them have been hiring calls or will be thinking of hiring cars will want to know whether they'll be able to fill up or not was with the reaction so far from domestic motorists. Well I mean obviously as we say many of them are rushing out to say a lot. And there were also I'm throwing petrol at home in some cases in jerrycans in that housing is that when they guarantees which is very dangerous and quite illegal but if you walk around looking at the other sort of pound shop the equivalent of tile shop say you'll see an orchard lots of these very cans being sold and indeed even that they've been running out in some places so the public is either with the you know doing what they can they're looking to the governments of course to take care with this one of the things I didn't mention is a fault of the emergency network or the 320 and. Strategic filling stations people will only be able to be seen lead to any be able to vie 15 leaders of those special sessions they can buy up to $25.00 leaders and others wherever they go they will be limited the amount they can buy so I think you know there's some of the tension around people looking for the government to ensure that things go OK I should also be mentioned that there's a general election in October as that goes as far as the government and the and the political fallout of this is that they're thinking about that as well people on angry that as people with knows if you will strike people very quickly go angry at the food court but as happening in Portugal Yeah you know I have been seeing people fighting you know there's been a number of videos taken of as these kind of thing is and very often it has actually been because people turned out ways these votes jerrycans and then have been standing this sending them all up you know with a big queue of coke behind them so that you know I was prostration in some situations so I think that's been the anger against that sort of thing I'm going against the drivers and the unions it's not something you hear a lot about I'm sure a lot of people ought not be frustrated it's no time great Isn't there is a feeling that. This is a group of workers that are in fact not particularly well remunerated for the work that they do which is of course. Not necessarily but certainly taking care to protect the public from dangers that would be very important that we that they would be well trained and experienced and that they take their dog very seriously at the unions are actually alleging that. The right Julio's have not to an agreement that was made in May in the wake of that previous strike so again there's a discussion going on about that and that only. The Communist Party which is quite strong here in Portugal which has links to the main trade union federation even though the unions that are called the strike you know not part of that trade union better ration and so the Communist Party in the trade unions are not backing them connect killed but they are saying that there were like a strike we don't need to be respected so this business about the minimum is being 50 to 100 defensive the regular normal that is there also have been well you know maybe that's not on because this is the government trying to limit the impact of a strike by getting a little bit of the law allows them. And a sort of in the capital of good news been if you like if I'm not trying to be clever but just listening to that recall the Phils Tri-Care was 19 years ago keep 19 years ago girls were getting younger. But I do remember the difference was that the fields Tri-Care was predicated by the increasing fuel prices not because of the drivers deserve a good wage Don't get me wrong and I remember the moment when I realized there's a fool's fuel strike I was on my motorcycle to try to get a foot suppressor the most I could I went from one station to Nauru through busy who've Huizi and then the funny trucks not it's a good job vetoed otherwise had been stranded anyway because catch up with the. e headlines in new zealand there we've call him pick up from radio new zealand hello good i didn't our year your yeah not too bad not to be at the all black scott threshed overnight his you might appeared so congratulations to a list as an whiles they now the citizens of the top per number one ranked world rugby country end it's not new zealand anymore woo of the when you were that sub you going to full at some point at the heart in the come the heart of a exactly crash enters the rugby world cup champions and we're hitting into a rugby world cup an oct looks like there is great penick going on a new zealanders there is that's 3 of 4 nations that i think would fain see their chances of beating new zealand and in the big tournament in japan and one of those of we destroyed leo who score be a world record a number of points against the or blix a last night so yes this is a nation of twitchy trembly rugby fall of was right now well you be did when the net bull woke up the the new start last of we were spoke at the isn't be a greedy and come we call with everything you learned of the tournament at the save me final stage when to affect it was a very close run things yes i withdraw in apologize for that but it has is every chance i think yeah every child's i think but another country will be the the next rugby world cup champions will champions are rugby come October and word with emotional scenes outside you a parliament Well inside and outside actually we've had a rather historic vote in parliament is the 1st reading of a law that will liberalize abortion in this country and not quite like the scenes you would have seen an island recently when they had that historic vote there was a referendum I think this one was a lot change to a law that actually stood for I think 42 years the contraception sterilization and Abortion Act and now the M.P.'s voted on the 1st reading of this new law which would change the law because currently there's a requirement that 2 doctors have to approve an abortion on physical or mental health grounds before they are sent to it so the new law would change the saying you women can make the decision themselves up to 20 weeks into a pregnancy beyond that one medical practitioner Woodhead have to agree to it so this is something that really does liberal liberalize the law and that we have 120 in peace in our parliament this was a conscience vote that could have gone either way no party lines on it all but 3 of them voted and it was pretty overwhelming in the end 94 voted in favor of the law change just 23 against. And there were the issues were this come up again as an issue though in New Zealand well because effectively it was part of the Crimes Act in the past and you know you could say I mean it sounds emotional to say that abortion was a fictive Leigh criminalised wasn't really seen as a health issue and this brings us right up to date but I mean 42 years since this law has been reconsidered and essentially no government has wanted to touch it because of all the emotion the religious aspects that come with it and the fact that it's a moral decision and the fact there's great uncertainty given that it's a conscience vote not one along party lines so no one really knew what what the outcome was going to be so those emotional scenes in the Parliament were. That way it had to be extended in fact for members of parliament to. Personal stories of why they had reached the station they'd done to either support the law or to reject it and one of those indeed was the deputy leader of. The New Zealand 1st party and it's one of the minority parties in a governing coalition and there deputy leader had some very personal stories Tracey mass and there had been illegal abortions effectively in her family history and her voice was breaking as she talked about this but she was forced to actually abandon telling his personal story because that basically the patty leader of the party Winston Peters who's a very conservative 72 year old man and a deputy prime minister in this coalition government he had announced that his party is going to push for a referendum on this issue next year when we have a general election so he completely pulled the rug out from under his own deputy and has really thrown a spanner in the works a there's not a lot of chance that they'll get that reference Ryndam they want in fact almost none but at the last minute with no warning he completely poured cold water on the squad find the balance to fit to change the laws so his name is mud at the moment amongst those who think he's he's really thrown his own personality into what's a serious national political issue it's an issue that the prime minister just send down is considered for 11 years during her time as a politician I understand well that's what she told the Parliament she said look when I when I 1st became an M.P. Back in 2008 I had always wondered what would be the right time to debate this because the laws been on the books so long she said how long a journey must have felt for those inside and outside the house for the state to come along is what she said during the parliamentary debate and she singled out those who had worked to support it one M.P. For example and Steve Chadwick. A woman even though her name is Steve she had a long campaign for that she stepped down. From the parliament decided to pursue another career she's a mayor of one of our cities in the north right now but it is an issue that I recall throughout her parliamentary Korea she pushed the said look we can't just leave this whole There are days of law on the books which which does effectively criminalize some people if they decide to take action and actually makes it very difficult for doctors to supply the right kind of advice to people and the position of requesting an abortion and she had absolutely no take up on the set all nobody really wanted to sponsor those law or have the debate but in effect it's gone through relatively smoothly they have been religious arguments put forward petitions presented to parliament and so on but in the end their vote it's interesting that almost margin of 70 members of parliament almost $4.00 to $1.00 the M.P.'s voting in favor of it shows that there is actually a lot of common ground and a recognition I think that the floor of 42 years of age was now out of date and I'm all or less serious note let's not forget that even war was a man even though if they was even and if my tribe as a male female names interchangeable mostly in any case they don't be surprised if you come across a female Dawson any time soon why is climate change and food it is shoot for New Zealand. Well it's a big issue that's in the background all the time but with the release of the international governmental panel on climate change report on food and land this past week the New Zealand farming lobby has been gearing up New Zealand's very vulnerable on this because of course we produce all the dairy products and meat and cultural stuff in our country and then send it a long long way away so what accrues a lot of carbon miles getting to the destinations around the world so this report was saying we need to eat eat less meat as a species and that this would be much better for us and of course the. Something for a lobby is very anxious about so they were delighted to see the Guardian in the U.K. Reporting. That the New Zealand produced agricultural stuff actually has a lower output of carbon and get greenhouse gas emissions then a lot of the stuff produced in Europe the States and Asia so even if you factor in the transport costs of getting around the world it's still it's still more efficiently produced in terms of greenhouse gas emissions so the key Farmers love to claim that their products some of the most efficient in the world and have the smallest carbon footprint but they were delighted to have a national newspaper in the U.K. a Sort of green green light that rubber stamp it but the fact is that some of this relies on reports that can be questioned I think the most recent is actually 10 years old things could have changed in that time and in the past 10 years we've seen this explosion in dairy farming and there it's not only the conversion of the land which causes problems and it's that the stock the cattle stock that creates methane which is also a greenhouse gas and the fact of the meat production and the transport of all the meat and dairy does all add up in terms of carbon emissions and it has to be said that for all that they think farming is relatively efficient in greenhouse gas emission terms the expansion has been increasing at and they haven't done a whole lot to investigate ways of reducing it so it may be that the rest of the world moves forward and that's faster than New Zealand and the kind of buzzword they talking about here is that with New Zealand being more dependent on agriculture and exporting our stuff a long way and also want to resume tourists coming from the northern hemisphere a long way that New Zealand could become stranded as it has once the carbon economy really kicks in how long does it take to. Produce from a farm to the U.K. Table for example how long's a journey. Well budgets could be as short as 4 weeks or even 6 weeks for the stuff that's not so spoil it all but there's a lot of stuff that goes by in our There's whole lights are devoted to that the transport that way and the phrasing of even quite small amounts of stuff for niche markets that used to be that thing that were transported and in great long loads and in fact if you wanted to supply a British or European supermarket chain a lot of New Zealand producers couldn't actually supply the volume but for example we have a national co-operatively owned dairy company called Fawn Terra and they can supply stuff in huge quantities arrange all of the just sticks and even and things like kiwi fruit production we have the national suppliers this pre but that one actually contracts growers in Italy and Chile and around the world so that the brand of the if you prefer to be supplied AROUND THE WORLD thank you got in peak of the let's go to date is 5 had loads now has Martin humans on digital B.B.C. Sounds must be. Very nice B.B.C. Radio 5 Live Boris Johnson is announcing plans that he says will crack down on crime These include an extension of police stop and search power as and 10000 new prison places passengers remain stuck on cross-channel ferry to high winds with tugs needing to be deployed the highly unusual gusts of delay crossings between Dave Ring Kalai by up to 6 hours. 2 men have been charged with a public order offense softer what was described as a security incident involving the Arsenal football a message ols Hill Police say it's not related to an attempted carjacking of those Dylan teammates Siyad collision at last month New York's mayor says the crimes of American financier Jeffrey Epstein must be investigated despite his apparent suicide he was a wasting trial on sex trafficking charges let's get the sport now with Don Busby the Premier League is back and so is this man to find the job was the transpired so it was serious there's a pretty good research to lay out a came goals antonymous 31 win against newly promoted Aston Villa new signing Tangay dumbbell A had earlier drawn Spurs level off the John McCain and given a shock lead elsewhere Manchester City made a flying start of their new Premier League title defense as rame Stillings hattrick inspired a 5 nil demolition of West Ham at London stadium it was going to be the right hope your team and you know today be the start of a good but then also stop it times in Syria she respects this you know so new season was though a bit rough you know once you go to our forward put us on to the United's belief shop said he had dreamed of scoring in the Premier League after his lady eagle eyes and his side appoint a ball miss in the blades 1st top flight match since 2007 Sharp who Dhoni be on the pitch for 6 minutes bundled home the ball from close range after only I'm a Bernese miss hit shot bounced off Nathan and into his path swapped on toss you know open the boys from point A performance and I just want a gun pressed the fault alone like sound OK Once again it's nice to get it all in the in the net but I'm very proud of the boys that I got shouted corner goodbye. But say Mark Warner found assessing what status is and elsewhere grandpa to made a perfect start to his tenure at Brighton with a 3 nil win at what Fed last Ashley bond scored twice as Burnley beat Southampton 3 nil Crystal Palace and Abbott's incentives goalless and in the Scottish Premiership Celtic followed up last weekend 7 of sin Johnston with a 52 humbling of Motherwell to the delight of manager Neil Lennon. Goals and soon. You know. The schools will go along as well it's all not the finished article by any means but on the edits were your and some of them and it's standing formidable Hamilton with the day's other win as you can find old results on the B.B.C. Sport website in or out a rugby union Island have kicked off their World Cup preparations with a 5 Try $2910.00 win. Dublin Australia have recorded their highest ever score against the All Blacks as they beat the world champions 4726 in the Rugby Championship in Perth it was the one of his 1st win over New Zealand since 2017 London Broncos remain 2 points adrift of safety in rugby league Super League after losing 20 points to 6 at Castleford the Broncos have just 4 more games to try and preserve their Super League status and Hayley Turner has celebrated another land bog by becoming the 1st jockey to twice be leading right at the sugar Cup this space B.B.C. Radio 5 Live on digital B.B.C. Sounds. The morning after they strong and in places damaging winds yesterday the area of low pressure responsible continues to pull away north and east which through the North Sea today say the winds it will be falling lighter but still quite a breezy if not windy day across some parts of eastern England and Northern and Western Scotland as well and we still got some rain in the forecast and with that in mind let's start a full concerts a day across Scotland particularly through the central belt and southern Scotland you can see some heavy and persistent rain we have a yellow warning from the Met Office for the heavy rain. From the station to station album now when Bowie needed a replacement for guitarist make roads in America with the sound of an X.-Man cold slick when John Lennon needed a guitarist he to turn to in fact a lot of people have called on slick serves his last 50 odd years I sprayed him ahead of his gig as a member of Jan met look in the tough cookies at the Balkan club in bulk and West Sussex now began by asking him how it's going flame with the former Sex Pistols Yeah it's good it's good when he broke through with the pistols you know there was a rejection of the old school slick good saw as life itself was a punk of rejection of good saw heroes and stuff. Do you remember that song and when I suppose in this sort of teenage rebellion was against the kind of guitar heroes that you grew up with. Absolutely I mean because. This clearly was not the fun thing though you go back especially if you've been a pistol you know this song structure and the riffs and everything well we're not really all that different from the rock N roll except for the fact was that nobody was really doing any what he would call solos per se the way I was doing them or Clapton or teeth or anything like that so yeah there was definitely that you know slick guitar guy. Is. Saying back to those good solid gold. Rediscovery if you like a great sours can put on record it no there is because you know I'm seeing it I'm seeing it in a lot of the really younger guys because you're listening to Jimi Hendrix to listening to cream it's bizarre you know these records came out when it fathers were 12 years a whole. So it's interesting to see that because to me punk never heard the guitar player the hair bands from Los Angeles hurt the guitar player. That's a nice. Guy could be not nice. Because you know when when they when those hair bands came out I was I mean close to being put out of work because those guys were. You know Newly you know guitar stuff and guys that played like me kind of write a fashion and then the Seattle guys started to come around then I was back in fashion so it was about a 5 year period it was kind of strange. How would you describe the way you play though and how did you get to play the way you do it's all blues all comes from American blues and American rock'n'roll which I was introduced to by the British bands because they basically took what the Americans paid no attention to or rejected repackaged it sent it back to us and then we became aware of it when you became aware of the lives of T.-Bone Walker Diddley. Very very. Engaged prevent that Fred McDowell Robert Dunn Howlin Wolf Buddy Guy all of it. And that's where my playing comes from. You know it still shows the influences are never going to go away how do wolves good Sawyer is was a 16 year old kid cool who did something right I meant huge here in London when. He would have been by then and I almost cried you know because those guys didn't get the respect. They should have gone but you know when you say that they the use of them then that lives forever if that makes sense yeah I mean it's. The C.D.'s Is it turns around it is a you know I was introduced to that primarily from the stones. I was very curious for some reason so when I got those early Stones right which were which are covers and all of that Solomon Burke road usually Howell Muddy Waters. So I went and investigated it and I sort of buying those records and really picked up a lot of stuff from them and all these years later about 5 years ago I met by the guidance club and I have since then sat in with him dozens of times. And to do that I wanted to guys that had so much influence on me and the early days when he invited me to play with him and was like that meant more to me to play with everything done. More to see them playing with. Yes more to them play with John Lennon Yes and really Yeah yeah well you know why because where do you think all it came from yeah yeah I mean David David had a big hole the mannish boys. Nick about it. Of course. Running so that it should cool runnings who would do the most he would. Venture right and you're right. When when you do you get because you're very much a guitar for hire is that is that polite can I describe you like. I don't know I'm going to run with that all. Yeah so when somebody brings you in for example to replace me grown son with David Bowie What do they tell you about the way they want you to play fighting was a. Didn't say damn word and I'm like OK one last post a doing here you know and I asked him straight out you know I said am I supposed to be copying Mick Russian were paid him and thank God he said no he said you just learn the structure of the songs and then do what you do I like the way you play so play that when you play and that was a relief because I let Very good I can't read music and I can't really sound like anybody but me so. You know when I get called in to do gun for hire stuff as a sideman I get called in because of what I do not because of my prowess as a guitar player. Well that's part of it again where you're saying it's not because they want you to show a few good saw were just they want you to be yourself yes yes because I can't work the other way we're where I meet guys are great at it where they can be chameleons and do all any almost any style relatively convincingly I can do that you know. I really want to either so. I was amused to see. You go to play with one of the great under Ray said great. Playing called The Great. Theory theory which you know I love I prefer to call Perkins version of Blue Suede Shoes by the way to Elvis's version but I've got a theory that you can be both you can be a great guitar player but then you can be a great performer at the same time in that the audience was you to do one all the other. Would you reckon. I think that that goes by individual case by case because I do both. Because I'm not what you would call the most professional guitar player in the world. I mean you are. Just wrong this point I think I am still playing rhythm guitar you know I love to perform and loved to play rhythm guitar and I mean I think Keith Richards thing too I'm a match was always what he did the best you know. I mean you know he just. All around has all of that stuff but you're right there are a lot of guys that do one of the other. Work disses a wreath Franken is known for singing brilliant piano playing you right yeah yeah and it's how it's perceived by the public and also. It could also have been an individual situations if you're aren't sure at any given time they're going to look at that. What about when you when you play with somebody who is decent guitarist like John Lennon like John. How do you communicate what's the cool and response between your guitar. What happens in those instances is that if you're on if you're in a room whether it be on the stage or in the studio with the right to charge. It happens all by itself you you automatically fall busy into a call and response with the right person which went in large unless it was extremely And the really guitar player. I was actually you know I mean knowing John from his albums or Beatle records you really can't tell from that but when I got a room with him I want you to very intense guitar player and I go more for the guys that can really play great rhythm and John can do that a lot of energy needs rhythm is that in a way because George Harrison became the lead gets ours and rightly so of the B. Because he was in the one doing the most of the song rising and he was the lead vocal is you know he was going to give you the whole country tying on the good side and that was the Beatles sound but once you get into John Lennon's rock and roll stuff you know the covers of his rock N roll stuff that you could hear was good. Coming out definitely the stuff that you did with John Lennon the was there a particular sound to it did you have to fit in to the sound of the album No No I yes I know. When you're working and in the right situation you want to medically fall into whatever it is it just is just there you know I didn't think about it I didn't tailor it at all we got in the room we started the play and we just fell into it that says to me and that's the best way. Because I you know I'm not very good at tailoring my whole being to something. If it happens naturally that's that's the best I am. Double Fantasy album to Lennon and Yoko does. The album there is a particular sound Yes but then she that's fairly earring is created over the course of recording the record where you just doing a basic trip down basic track then the overdubs go on in the mix and then a lot of that overall sound is really coming from the mixing. Will pull then do you. All for. Your solo. Even knowing to do it or and the case where Johnny would just shout my name out in the middle of the song some of which is on some of those recordings you could hear it. He just says Take it away yeah and do you know exactly what to do at that point yet and he fools about see in advance no notes you play or huge is no you know you just jamming it or you're just free styling it yeah I mean mostly almost everything I've done has been 1st takes for the moment no thinking. When I think I get in trouble. I. Think good. But then you play Lou I've had that you're going to be more or less like that doesn't it live is exactly what it is it's exactly what it is you know when I mean when I'm recording. You know. You know I've always just lines record I mean if we didn't sit there and do 80 takes to anything. You know even place through it are just to get comfortable and this shit is one of them feels good and doesn't have a virtue mistakes in it that's. Because their earlier that takes even if they have mistakes in that they tend to be the better takes because nobody's thinking everybody is playing from this guy and I have kept tracks that have had mistakes on them because they felt so good how does it feel for you when something feels good how does it has as the audience we I think great on a record just blows our mind and then we're thinking about every single note there's a bar arrow there but not thinking like that we I know you know yeah which is absorbed. But what about for you have how does it feel same thing I mean I hate conquers every night on stage or everybody does. You know it's not like it is like a train wreck but it sure is I was in Burbank and the idea is to. Go to a studio and record something and take every single note The only is doesn't know a goddamn difference if it feels good and it is the only you know if it feels good to us all and different from it. Because sometimes you go back in a kind of retro rock'n'roll feel at least you know the stuff you did with steam Jim Phantom and and leave for example that was a game back when it is the same. Old school rule corrosion resit would be you know the stuff that you've done with the new you. Yeah I mean very much so the stuff that. The perfectionist part comes in will be able or those sort of tap or Anchorage. Who are right I do wouldn't work on a record like that you know I said completed different genre entirely. And a lot of those really show for produced records that were coming out and they were really started in the in the late seventy's and then really continued on with a lot of those hair bands in the eighty's. You know those guys I mean I knew some of those guys they would do like 25 takes you know and go note for no intro it was perfect and I don't wish that my fans don't know that they know it or feels good. Talking of the New York Dolls I had the pleasure of knowing Johnny Thunders for yeah this would be good to go to be the early eighty's and towards the end of the came to live in Stockholm well was I was studying at the time and he was a cool dude you know run around with all young is because we were just not scenes that time but you know he wants to be part of the seeing come thing music out there as well and even though I'm sure you know challenges of heavy drugs he can still play that gets he could still play that good saw and I'm OK You heard it you knew it was Johnny Thunders. No doubt yeah yeah. What is it about the way you play the we would have to recognize instantly the. You know I'm not sure what that is because people have told me that but I'm not sure what it is that they're hearing that is causing that. But it's. There it's definitely there because I've had too many people identify what I do sometimes not knowing it was me until I heard it so I it is something there but I I couldn't tell you what it is. Always been. The lead guitar is music because you know I love this music now I don't need to tell you love the popular music good small electronic console still exist to space if you like is. The guitar is still the lead guitar is basically of a still these ultra defied that they once were you know I don't look at it so much as we get towards a rhythm guitarist because I mean I play guitar which means I do both. And I actually prefer to play rhythm you know to doing shows so it isn't all like if you know a lot of people concentrate on like Jimi Hendrix on the solos but I've always listen to the rhythms that's the really difficult part even more than the saws and I think a lot of the young guys I mean I don't guys that ever have kids that are in their twenty's that are pretty much doing very close to what we were doing. You know. The changing with the times too to a point but the roots of it are so all the same you can. Do you can to name any contemporary guitar that you respect. I you know it's whatever you think contemporary is you know because I don't know the names of any younger guys that are really rising to the top because I'm not sure if there are any right now I know there's a lot of guys that I'm playing that are really good that nobody knows because they really haven't had the opportunity to get to go really public. Because the damage injury to get them there is nonexistent You know we had artists develop developers you know guys like Arash relation guys that helped us you know that would shine us and stick with us for a while. As we got better so we were able to make a name but if you don't get it can't make a name with your Facebook page. So I mean you can. You know in the world of zeroes and ones. Sure you're a big shot in zeros and ones but can you play you know. I mean guys like Gary Clark Jr and they are wonderful guitar players you know but he's not 20 years old. And I know that 20 year olds are out there in the 25 year olds are out there we just don't know who they are because there is no infrastructure of record business anymore to help get to the public so the public doesn't get new guys anymore. So after this to log what projects have you got lined up. Right there oh. I think some things that I mean I've been pretty much on the road though as a couple years so I'm going to take a little time off for me and Glen will probably come back we're you know we've been doing some writing so thinking about making another record and we'll be doing some more dates down the line and I've got some other projects I do you know but I like come on we were good we we have a really good time we are really good brand image if you wish to I look at it like this I mean I have always start with every year doing live performances it's nice to be Lucian you need to have far and not every situation is like that you know this one is. Always a pleasure to come back and do it. With the find like that finds.