There's a lot of pressure on her to bring up new names new people who perhaps are a rising stars within the party but the danger to reason May as always with reshuffles is that you end up creating enemies and of course she only has an a working majority of 12 we saw her lose of 8 before Christmas because she had rebels within her own party she can't afford to have any more rebels say a very difficult line for her to trade here more than 1100 patients have died since March 2015 while waiting to be discharged from hospital in Scotland the research obtained by Scottish Labor refers to people who were well enough to return to the community but did not have the necessary arrangements in place the Scottish government insists progress on so-called bed blocking is being made some of the U.K.'s largest retailers have agreed to stop selling code rules of substances to people under the age of 18 in an attempt to reduce acid attacks incidents have doubled in 5 years volunteer agreement was arranged by the Home Office minister for crime Victoria says the u.k. Government is still planning to pass a new law restricting seal of acids that our intention is to introduce a bill into course to prohibit the sell of these substances to under eighteen's to also make it an offense to possess these substances in a public place without good reason and to introduce mandatory minimum sentencing if someone is found carrying these substances repeatedly $32.00 sailors including 30 Iranians are missing after an oil tanker collided with a cargo ship off the coast of East China the tanker which is carrying more than 130000 tons of ultralight crude oil is on fire the crew of the cargo ship has been rescued Germany's Christian Democrats led by the Chancellor Angela Merkel are beginning 5 days of talks on forming a grand coalition and government with the center left Social Democrats Mrs Merkel has been trying to build a new coalition since September. Parts of the eastern United States and Canada are experiencing record breaking low temperatures as a winter storm sweeps across the region the moment Washington Observatory in New Hampshire says it was the 2nd cold this place on earth yesterday with a wind chill of minus 68 Celsius Peter Franklin as a cab driver in New York people think you know it's cold or it's rainy that's great for driving a care in the opposite is true because when it's cold and rainy and especially as cold as it is people don't feel like going out they stay home so yesterday and driving the market throughout the day because this is that we're getting a little bit of a vacation but you know losing losing the money on it and the forecast in just a moment but 1st the sports news journalist Good morning to you Bill English Premier League side Stoke City are looking for a new manager and the man the Scottish f.a. Want to become the new Scotland boss as early favorites Michael O'Neill the current Northern Ireland manager has yet to hold official talks of the safety and says he wants his future resolved by the end of January sent men in manager Jack Ross says a growing belief in his side that they can win the Scottish Championship the Paisley side extended their lead at the top of the table to 6 points after that one no win over and when asked how were doing in the soap done the United lost ground on the leaders though with their manager Shaba Laszlo calling their 61 defeat to fall cook and battered thing Little Pill say they're letting Philip continue continue to leave for a Barcelona with a heavy hearts the midfielder is finalizing his 142000000 prime move to the Spanish club and should be presented as a Barcelona player later today England close to 93 for 4 on the 4th day of the 5th Ashes Test the trailer still yet by 210 runs and Glasgow Warriors earned a bonus point as the by 40 points to 20 in rugby proof 14 more on the rugby soon here and more b.b.c. Sport Scotland websites thanks in on the forecasts aside from some green uncertain and most parcel of a giant great deal with plenty of crisp went. Sunshine it'll be called everywhere temperatures struggling to get above freezing rising to a maximum of 4 the Turner 5 past 8 and onto our panel discussion this week the former Labor leader Tony Blair used his interview with The Today programs John Humphrys to criticize his successor Jeremy Corbin's handling of Bragg's it. I will . I will be committed. To seeing a Labor government elected and Jerry Jerry Coleman is that as the leader he's elected as the prime minister however I want to put a qualification down it is going to be extremely difficult in my view the labor to deliver on its promises if it puts itself in exactly the same position as the Tory government are going to be all breaks it because it will find that it is less money to deal with the country's problems that it's distracted by deal with breaks it rather dealing with the health service and jobs and living standards and so on and therefore in my view if you end up and I've said this before if you end up in a situation where you do breaks it and then have a call the government this country is going to it's a very very challenging situation was unlikely the current leader will welcome this intervention but Tony Blair is following in a grand tradition of x. P.M.'s who offer their advice and opinion once out of office even if it's not asked for but 2 former political party leaders and prime ministers who their successors loyalty however that's defined should they place party over public interest or does being a former leader bring with it special responsibilities Well joining us now for the panel former Labor m.p. Tom Harris the journalist Peter Gagan And with us in the studio are with us here and Hanna McGill of the Herald is in Edinburgh Good morning to you all market morning good morning Tom let's start with you as it's your former leader who's breaking ranks and a man that you respect a lot what do you make of the intervention I mean I disagree with Tony on break so obviously I actually welcome or when any former prime minister makes any kind of intervention really I'm obviously for some time I think it's unfortunate that the parliament I was late through until 2001 when I 1st became an m.p. Was the 1st parliament says 945 not to include a former prime minister in the House of Commons and I think that's a shame and we will not situation over there is no former prime minister either of the Commons or the Lords I think that's an unusual situation historically and I think it's regrettable because I think people have held the. Iced office should be available publicly to pass comment if something is critical of the current leadership I think that's unhealthy I just think that we these people have a great deal of experience the careers behind them so the nothing to worry about in terms of claiming the greasy pole and we can get an honest perspective from others so if you accept this is done in good faith and it's not about the sort of score settling we saw with Heath and the terror that's your major if you accept that what does this actually achieve because this is not a small thing Tony Blair is saying Your leadership is so bad that we hit the direction of travel that Labor is taking at the moment is going to be disastrous not just for the country but for Labor because if they go into BRICs it when if the if there's a Labor government they're going to nothing to spend on public services so whatever way you look at it he's not saying this is a small kind of new aunts over policy he's saying Jeremy Corbyn you are heading in a disastrous direction arguably not the direction that cure storm or your own shadow bricks that secretary wants to take so what does this see to Labor voters about what they should make of Jenny Corben or are these a sort of voters who don't care what Tony Blair things anyway probably the latter and I think that's shame but no one knows particular surprise that Tony Blair is not a general carbon supporter in fact I would see that the criticism that both he and Gordon Brown have made of general carbon has been very lackluster and you know lackluster Yes you know because Tony and Gordon both come from a part of the party that is sought towards with everything to recover never stood for the Might as well be in separate parties and I think that for this you know to criticize them on breaks I think is legitimate but it's so then let them it's something that's happened today where Jeremy Corbyn has refused to sign up to this cross party let's stay in the single market push Brix it campaign that is now under way here Starmer I mean we're left in a position where g. . Are you absolutely clear about where Libor is on no no absolute no I never have you're not no no a tone I mean I don't I I think this is this is something that benefits really a populous use generalization cynical is that oh a completely utterly cynical I mean and the Lib party is completely Riven on breaks it but on the principle that former Prime Ministers and former leaders should be able to provide a running commentary I just think politically democratically that's not a bad thing because end of a Jew Political Pop just as important as the country Ok Well Peter proxy being overtaken by something else here when there's a confession about blatant cynicism a great thing at the moment but it within the Labor Party but you know children well what do you make of the fact that Tony Blair is actually out there and I'm curious time I would be a lot closer to where Tony Blair is is he doing the party in the country a service is the division between the service you give to the party and your country I mean what what's actually going on here in this dynamic Peter I think it's interesting is specially on the bricks of every living significant political leader of any party in the u.k. Has crimes again has been very vocal is going to was equally vocal John Major has been just as vocal on against Theresa May in some respects you know the big difference with Tony Blair. Is is how close they are in terms of the Premiership you're going to be the ships of the Labor Party you know Tony Blair's But in the last 10 years Jeremy Corbin was an m.p. On the Tony Blair exams you know they were very very far and I think that's what's so significant about this I don't think it's just that a former prime minister is saying something controversial or saying something against the current leadership I think it's more about the wider context in which this is taking place because of unique position and this is not unusual for the former leaders won't say something against the kind of person I mean the party or the person or a prime minister sometimes I think in. New Kerry was in great section with this I think it was because we look at United States so much because North States you have a very presidential system you know where you've got people kept on guard still called Mr President sort of rest their lives you know nobody calls for calm or maybe you don't need to play your role or call them Mr Prime minister you know so we don't we don't have that kind of system you know Star Morgan a parliamentary system which is are often public and it's not surprising that within the system the legacies of it is going to be central conflict over legacy and also new leaders will come in and take a changed direction completely you know the difference between Germany Corben until nuclear is almost in some ways in custody by Tom hers himself you know this is very very different very very different politics very very different views of what I think in some respects is not surprising with what's what is interesting is just. Starting is I'm just at the timing this is coming and this is just a worker heading into this big conversation of the single market and I think it's it's it's what's more almost more surprising is just that you're very but there's been an in some ways what the reaction has been to a few sort of very strong kickback against the just great German corporate book by lots of people who might be seen as in the labor camp and when you look at what's happening in Scotland specifically do you think it would be more helpful actually with a 2nd revising chamber if elder statesman as it were when able and when I went able to come in and fate look in my experience this isn't a good thing and that's not a good thing and why do you think it's not happening possibly with the exception of Alex Amen and Henry McLeish Why is it not happening more in Scotland you have had I think that you're talking about personality types as well as the the specific political setup that we have in Britain you're talking about the fact that people who have been and in a position of power have a particular investment in the future of the country that they have given a lot of their lives to trying to run and running and for some people that is never going to go away that is going to continue to be and nagging impulse in them that they have something. Contribute that they have something to give We do also recognise that within the system that we continue to make public funds available to its prime ministers to have a public voice and to do certain of the state whilst not as Peter said having the official status of you remain president until you into the die and beyond and back so I think there is that thing about we do sort of in shrine a certain role for them is a kind of there's a semi official role of us still entitled to comment and then you have the fact of particular people's personalities and in Alex Salmond and in turning Blair you have people who whether we like it or not still feel a strong strong strong personal compulsion to make their voices heard and then there's the element of the news agenda and the click but factor which is that certain people create so much response that it remains in the interest of the media to keep paying attention to what they're saying even if it's a lot of people saying we don't want this person to comment they are still saying that and that means that their comments will continue to receive a great deal of attention so I mean I think that if you once if you want people involved in politics who are deeply passionate and who are committed whether or not you agree with them there would be something strange about them switching off like a tap when they left office I mean I find a lot more suspicious that David Cameron seems to kind of gaily skipped away and doesn't really feel as if he needs to follow up on any of the things that he put into motion before he left the the Premiership I think that that says something a lot less commendable about his personality than those people who do feel an ongoing compulsion to keep putting their or in even if it is inconvenient so I think that yes it would be valuable to have more voices for of experience I think that we don't need to be so insecure that we feel as if every time somebody comments who we might have disagreed with about something in the past that everything is going to fall apart I think that what Tony Blair highlights and maybe what Alex Salmond highlights is that a party that is going to successfully govern is going to represent a broad coalition of interests maybe that's nowhere more obvious than within the Labor Party where you have an extremely wide range of beliefs that still broadly come under the umbrella of what we think of as Labor politics. I think it's completely natural and normal that people who have been in that position should still feel that they have something to say yet. So let's just go back to what you were talking about before we go back to this general thing again where you accept that Labor's policy at the moment on break that is wholly cynical and those you've used describe yourself why well the 1st point is that I don't know what the policy is and I for politics very closely and I can tell you what will be a part of policy on breaks and I think that's intentional I think a lot of people in the constructive ambiguity Yes I mean a lot of people in the general election last year as we have as we know knew from from research voted Labor because they thought it was anti breaks and a lot of m t breaks of waters the sage of devoutly of party because the thought that to resume was going to take the e.u. And that labor wouldn't know that as it has a completely different position actually the party actually had explicitly said in its manifesto that when we leave the e.u. Will leave the single market and freedom of movement will stop but it's very spokespeople to give the impression that actually were and were not really in favor of breaks or as far as I know their party I think generally of Certainly General Corben is in favor of breaks that so many of his own front bench are opposed to and they haven't reconcile that and I think they deliberately haven't because the if they don't want to lose votes in the benefiting electorate at the moment from not ambiguous what should they do then about this cross party group on staying in the single market what is clearly what you're Starmer say is an economic interest of the country yes I mean I mean my I can always be from a personal point of view you know I'm opposed to single market and customs union membership I think from a strategic point of view I think there's something to be gained from the labor you know if you want to be even more cynical Genack or has never supported Britain's membership of the e.u. But if you really want to be cynical if you really want to be everything head over his principles in order to become prime minister he would probably throw his weight behind this campaign. Tell you how long can you write these 2 horses before something disastrous happens not so very good question the family might have longer than I thought they would but I think beyond brakes south and March 21000 I think it's going very difficult and even if you manage to do I think at that point you stop having any benefit electorally Ok Peter if we go back to this idea but the comments that can usefully be made once you leave office if you get someone like Barack Obama who's been very tactful in the way he's handled things but being very clear about what he thinks about the new administration in the white ties How do you think people should conduct themselves in those ways to be most persuasive to party members and to the public before it becomes counterproductive for their own party I think it's interesting when we've probably got a point that's closer to home Alex salmon the Nicholas sturgeon you know in some respects. Yes and it's a big tent party like labor but it's a big tent city focus in so obviously which is quite unique and has tended to have a very very strong central message and it's tended to be very regimented we've seen a bit of a change over the last 2 years the kind say British we don't examine because 3rd world our excitement has times gone from being gone from somebody who was really quite a use for President Clinton sturgeon to come easier into the position of the 1st Minister to actually bring the time to the stop that implements been you know the light of the story whether it's on undertaking a show one or 2 you're doing very sort of things and I think that's that's an area where it can can kind of go from being yes what useful for someone who's able to kind of have a bit of distance but also say something sort of to been a pitch to a bit to stop this and I think that person better is about to do with this you know ego and kind of self belief something that drive someone to become a leader in the 1st place to put themselves up for election put themselves up to try to be in opposition but those very same motivational force that can become increasingly difficult. Someone leaves also you know we often think of people who we think of as very strong leaders or people who are still loved them home there's a kind of there's a there's a positional sense and this is what we're sensing with Michael because Gorbachev who we think of as a great leader for us or a very important Russia going to like you 96 he was only polling 0.3 percent in the presidential election versus 0 point as well well there's a kind of distance as well or we will look at a coincidence though that sort of the person must be seen as another statesman our country but they're not I don't think. And I had I do you think that somebody come be on the airwaves too often or you start to do you value the brand basically that you're interventions are always more powerful if you're only making them very occasionally on very significant matters I think that is certainly an idea that comes across and it's almost an idea of sort of being a little bit respectable untactful And you know John Major gets a lot of praise for being kind of quite delicate in his interventions even though as was mentioned he has also been vocal against drugs so have a bunch of other people who get a lot of respect from the the probe. People that you know you've had a wide variety of politicians making quite explosive comments about blacks Tony Blair gets a particular kind of attention because he's he's a sort of trigger point for so many people he's a problem for the left of the Labor Party because he distance labor from socialism he's a problem for the Tories because he's so successfully colonized that middle ground yeah and I think he also accepted posted today interview that he can sometimes be a bit of a toxic you know if he's advocating something then people you know have a kind of sense that they don't want to go there absolutely and I think that you know the legacy of the Iraq war is obviously a huge stain that allows a lot of people to just write off whatever he says so I think he himself recognizes that although he has this compulsion to keep intervening keep speaking he knows that there's there's a degree of damage that he but he has also said that if there was. I don't know if I believe him about this but it's a valid point that if there was a more cogent articulate voice coming from the Labor Party that was articulating the views of those many many people that substantial portion of the electorate who did not support rights then he wouldn't feel the need to keep making these arguments publicly I don't know if we you know knowing what we do about Tony Blair don't know if that's particularly persuasive because we know that he does seem to be unable to stop himself but the fact is that it's there to be listened to because he puts the case very clearly and while that is not necessarily being made within the Labor Party as it currently is Ok we have to leave it there with thank you all so much for that was Hannah McGill of the Herald and before that the former Labor m.p. Tom hours on the journalist Peter Gagan Thank you all very much indeed in the time of 22 minutes past it let's get the sports news journalist Well let's talk rugby Shelby Glasgow Warriors dominance in the pool 12 continued a pro 14 I should say continue with the 40 points to 20 win over in Italy all that followed Edinburgh's born us a points home went on Friday night against Southern Kings So midway through the season let's assess how things are looking for our 2 rugby club sides Geoff Webster has been speaking to b.b.c. Scotland's told main question former players Jason whites and Peter Wright he was 1st of all asked if he was surprised by what he has dominance under new manager David Rennie know how frank I think the expectations were pretty high but to be to be certain where they are in the league will be really really happy but usually players of the forty's a lot of young players and those guys are for you know you're my figures and you're my Smith's young Scot Commons these boys have really stepped up to the plate so I think so it just after the the year I think rainy gloss school and the Gloucester supporters will be more than happy and I think the difficult period comes ahead when the 6 Nations delusional but the players who selection for the oversea just picked up a number of injuries this week so that's going to be a vital time but I think they're still at this moment in time they'll be extremely happy with us Jason dilemma for the Warriors. That you know doing well in the league but Europe is still a hard nut to crack for them as they are I think a lot that goes down to their probably the age of the front row Jimmy batty going from playing club rugby to starting for the Warriors and then starting for Scotland's Fraser Broner who Kearns under figures and all 3 young men in the right the coalface historically that's those positions of need players with years of experience to compete at that level I think the not fantastically well in the league level they're just not quite managed to transfer that to the big win you need to just close down a game and then the European rugby and just. Forwards and it's not that they've been bad but maybe just like to experience the nice to do that at the top levels of European rugby against Exeter the English champions Mark Perry one of the top teams in France and vines their father had a tough pull in Europe and they will learn from the other group so when it comes to head coaches waters they seem to manage the transition well you think Sean Lennon going to great at times and times and going into Dave Ranney seems quite smooth and on an upward curve every time. Well yeah I mean it's you know Gregor Townsend did a phenomenal job the old all of them did it did terrific jobs. And Europe is the disappointment that the got to the last day of last season the haven't they haven't gone not the really in in as Jason says a very very difficult group but a very is kept on after the pro 14 they're in a dominant position in their in their group for them it's all about the pro 14 I think David Rennie whenever he leaves Glasgow will have taken Glasgow forward both on the pro 14 stage and the European stage I think he's not good he's a world class coach Jason Edinburgh be a completely different case altogether because the been in the doldrums for so long they were looking dead and buried in so many games they were losing games they're expected to win they were doing reasonably well in Europe at certain stages but domestically they couldn't get it right Richard Cockerill coming in what's he got that previous coach here haven't had a huge coup for ever he went from Leicester so much success there but couldn't keep bringing that success there went to to somehow manage to get them to the Top 14 final and then Richard Clarke we've got somebody who has the ability and experience the builder up because Peter what he seems to do is he gives players a chance and they don't seem to be letting him do I would look to the likes of Lee or king or Stuart McAnally who's come through your job box he's coming here season yeah you've got massive career Barclays playing at the top of his game and will bring an added dimension you can imagine you know Barkley and Watson in the same boat rule. Your world class for me I think Richard Cockrell brings to the to the to the team is that they're afraid that I could really do things right you know in a sort of negative way I think under Solomons it was the complete opposite I think they were frightened of them and that made them not do anything but I think cockles done is clear. An environment where if you do your job and you do your role properly you get all of the game it isn't any issues but if you don't do your job properly or you don't feel you're wrong to be should be he told you No nor uncertain terms I think you've not seen that improvement after another 18 months which is going to get better and better and better Finally this blamed Edinburgh Glasgow can produce a team for Scotland that goes on and does very very well in the 6 Nations they can if they just stop dropping like flies in terms of injuries like Scotland's 1st choice 15 is a match for anyone at this point I think the show that. The shorters against Wales and Ireland in the spring soon as you drop a couple of title props when you're in trouble you drop a couple of loose and props are in trouble Fraser Brown is out of the glass on others good quality replacements but the depth isn't isn't what other countries have but there's a lot of good players there's a lot of confidence if you just wish to Gregor towns ever go into the 6 Nations Championship but with more more of a full deck it's really disappointing because that the Scotland team close to full strength could achieve something well that's Scotland's Tom English the ending of that assessment of where we're at rugby wise that he was joined by Geoff Webster a former players white and Peter Wright and I have to tell you Isabelle was nodding along there when I suggest you know a couple of. Props are just trouble aren't they are my experience I don't have enough of them thanks very much know if you're wondering what's coming up after this program. Want to know more. Join me Richard Holloway after the 10 O'Clock News he's one of Scotland's greatest living artists and an extraordinary man I take a very special to repeat a host in the studio to discuss God masculinity mental health and we dogs and we look deep into the future and ask ourselves What will life for humanity look like in our 10200 or even a 1000 years we'll explore the moral landscape of living with robots transhumanism and a world without work that Sunday morning with me Richard Holloway coming up at 10 to mid day here on b.b.c. Radio Scotland. In. China just coming up to 830 and you're listening to Good Morning Scotland on Sunday with Bill White for it and Isabel Fraser Still to come this morning one last chance for Germany's politicians to reach a coalition deal as Angela Merkel opens talks with the Socialists What could all of this mean for us on the break that negotiations and we look at the Sunday papers with 2 of Scotland's most interesting reviewers to our long interview and baby boomers have produced the biggest richest generation that Britain has ever known today at the peak of their potent wealth they run their country and by virtue of their sheer demographic power they've fashioned the world around them in a way that meets all of their needs but they won't be here forever and the following generations it's been argued fish having to foot a steep bill for the eldest retirement which will cause strife for decades to come because of this and a generational divide and how to deal with it is the focus of David Willetts book the pence which is the subject of this week's interview the former minister of state for universities and science under David Cameron No heads up the resolution phone days. An independent think tank which seems to improve the standard of living of low and middle income families garden Brewer started by asking a lot of well that's how he would define the current generations the baby boomers are the people born between 1945 in 1965 which includes 2 years 1947 and 964 when we had more than a 1000000 babies born across the u.k. There were never fewer than 800000 babies born in that 20 year period and we've barely ever had more than $800000.00 babies born since it was a massive boom and after that there was a there was a very rapid decline in the birth rate and I mean we call that generation x. Extending kind of 966 to 1980 and then you've got the millennial born between 1902001 was there's no fixed definition but those are the type of definitions and how widely shared amongst people discussing all this right before we get entirely serious about this there are some quirks are there because you were born in $156.00 I was born in $1055.00 so you think we'd be right in the middle of the most but if we were American we would be being British were sort of not well if we were. The American Baby Boom was a bit different from ours theirs was a high plateau and it was my main very high all through the fifty's what we did have in the u.k. Was we had a dip and there were indeed fewer babies born in our kind of time 5556 than in meeting after the war or in the early sixty's but it was still fairly high so we have a kind of a more of a droop in the middle but it still overall a pretty high rate of number of babies born draft so we are still the guilty man we are still and and yeah and there were. There were still quite a lot of us I mean when I remember when I went through my primary school in Birmingham there were 48. It's in the class there were just a hell of all the kids now admitted there were even more a few years before us and if you ever afterward but nevertheless it was a generation I had about 50 and yeah that's what I want to ask you do was explain something to some of this is slightly counter-intuitive and when people talk about baby boomers they to think oh it's because they're all got rich houses and they're all going to get old and the only health care that you are crucial to your thesis is that simply by being a bigger generation than the succeeding generation the baby boomers will cost the the coming generations money and one thing you do is you take tracery estimates and we assume just for the sake of the argument that there's a balanced budget every year they just explain how moving through that the fact of a bigger generation costs future generations money. Imagine you've got a simple closed economy closed society and you can agree policy that we will fund education a certain amount of resource per school kid we will fund pensions a certain amount of money per pensioner and we will balance the budget and then imagine for whatever reason you have a few years when more babies were born so the 1st thing you notice is there's extra pressure on education spending because you need as you want to spend the same amount per school student you got more school kids extra spending on education and you found that by putting out taxes a bit because you're going to borrow so you have a higher rate of taxation to match this education commitment then this big cohort think of it as a kind of Python swallowing a pig this big both cohort work their way through and then they're all in the jobs market and there are lots of workers but they are in our example a big generation the rif you're ahead of them there are a few are behind them so you've then you've got lots of workers lots of taxpayers. This is declining the number of people at school because there are fewer births after them so they can save money on the education budget and you've got a very large number of taxpayers so you can cut tax rate and then that same big cohort grows old and they're all pensioners and you do all you're doing is maintaining a fixed amount of spending per pensioner and what you have to do is increase taxes on the generation behind them just because there's a big generation of pensioners so at no point have you done anything that was deliberately in favor or against one cohort but it is produced a world in which these people benefited from the same amount of education and pensions spend anything as anyone else and also enjoyed particularly low tax rates during the time when they were when they're all of working age Now that's assuming that the the begin the python have not done anything wrong they've just been just been there but you think the baby boomers have in fact behaved in such a way that is in addition to what you've just described penalizing the younger yeah I mean I actually do think generations care about each other but some of this was born of the experience that any person who has been an elected politician has of speaking at residence association meetings of good people who are active in the local community you turn of the residents to protest against a new housing development saying it's going to spoil a beautiful view we're going to build in more green fields when you perfectly well knew that the houses they lived in had been built in the 1970 is themselves and what before that green fields and the effect of that opposition to new house building is to preen to push up the price of housing it's meaning we haven't got as many houses built as we should have done so in the places where people want to live so it wasn't the direction we hate young people but they protected some think maybe those green fields at the expense of the younger generation need how is it that's one example. And the other example is what's happened on pensions when over the years again it wasn't a deliberate plot but over the years and I was part of this process successive political parties in government have legislated to make the company pension promise more and more generous and more and more Carstone and more and more got gold plated with inflation protection and right for we don't we do as a protection for the leavers and it made the pension promises that companies and other employers hadn't made us ever more precious and valuable but so expensive that companies have opted out providing so Church pensions for the younger generation and the younger generation to add insult to injury or work on the reasons why their pay isn't going up much is that having to work hard to generate resources for the company to plug the pension deficit in a pension scheme that they're not even members of so things like that it wasn't any point someone said we just hate younger people but we have done things like making it hard to get houses built or overregulating County pensions which have had the effect of benefiting us and sadly damaging the interests of our children and grandchildren Well let's just take the pensions issue one of the criticisms of you but when it came out I think you were still in government at the time was that there weren't too many solutions proposed all of the problems were described but let's just take the issue of pensions if you're a young person going into employment now you're likely to end up if you end up with any pension on what's called a defined contribution plan a bench and where you basically pay into it and it depends on how the stock market performs what you get at the end of the day as opposed to the boomers many of whom get the fine benefit pensions they can retire and get 2 thirds of the final salary that's a huge imbalance between the generations and the expectations but is there any way of going back to the old system or any way of giving some guarantee to the coming general. That we can give them all security Well look we are your 1st well let me say you're right my book was an attempt to raise people's awareness of the issue it was not a kind of 10 point plan of what to do about it except that and I wrote it because I just wanted people to think about the interests of different generations which I think it's been ignored and now Cherry need to generational commission here the Resolution Foundation and we are looking at what you might do it hasn't reached its conclusions yet but some of the thing ideas interest me for a start we've now got this nest a program this program in which for the many workers there's now there are automatically enrolled in question a cut in a defined contribution scheme it's not perfect but it's at least building up a pension pot for them with a bit of money from the government a bit of money from their employer and a bit of money from themselves you could say that the government will put more taxpayers' money more public money in to boost the value of the pension pots of people between a certain age you could say we're putting a bonus contribution for the under forty's for example which would have the effect of meaning that the pot they built up was worth a bit more it's not going back to the old system I think it can be very hard it will be very hard to get back the old system but it would be an improvement on what they're likely to get at the moment. Another problem perhaps with the thesis is it's not entirely clear to me how much it is actually strictly to do with generations for example the smaller generation coming along all other things being equal you'd expect there because this might lead to be able to demand higher wages just because of supply and demand they're finding it difficult to do that funny difficult to do that because of globalization but it's not clear to me that globalization really has any connection to the baby boomer intergenerational issue it's true that not all of this is just domestic and it's it is certainly true that when I left university in 1978 and went into the jobs market you were kind of competing perhaps with French people and German people and American people with those that was about the competition that the British economy faced I can still remember the sense of threat as Japan emerged on the scene and proved to be an effective export are affecting. Industries in Burma and where I was brought up now young people in the game to the jobs market are competing with a massively growing Chinese economy with very high performance companies increasingly So globalization has torn down a lot of barriers and they're competing with many more people and that has had that has exposed them to competitive pressures we didn't face so that's another factor but if you but. The fact is it's still the case that domestic policy has if anything made this worse not better I don't think it was because we were maligned but by the time you've looked at how we've regulated the pensions how we've made it hard to get new houses built indeed the unpredictable effect of But the world barriers to globalisation being torn down and you can add in some other things how we had high inflation when their generation were young actually taking out our mortgages and that meant that the burden of the mortgage fell very rapidly for 6 bad for a couple of years but it fell pretty fast because the cost. That debt was being eroded away by very high inflation when we get older and what we do we vote for political policies that bring down the rate of inflation and have a low inflation world for us when we're older whereas So now for young person takes out a mortgage its real value is going to be maintained for a long time if you just keep on putting all these things together yeah you end up with a picture where life has indeed got tougher for the younger generation another objection to your thesis was more philosophical it was that in your book you go to great lengths to say you're not a mouth mouth as arguing that. Higher population would inevitably lead to a shortage of resources to his era. Allegedly being that he too everything else other than population is being fixed now you say you're not that but in the last chapter of your book you do concede that look for reasons that perhaps we can't even imagine as yet it may well be that future generations are much more prosperous than we are but you claim we still have this duty of warre Yes and you can see that I mean I'm a believer in the power of modern. Capitalism to carry on innovating with new technologies. And I am and I'm an optimist about that but here resolution we just produce some work in the last few weeks was Jewish we've actually tried to dig into consumption is it the case that as a result of this younger people are consuming more and the answer is that they're not that the digital revolution is really big baby boomers are consuming as much and spending as much on the the all the innovations of the digital revolution their i Phones or whatever as the younger generation are if anything the transformation of international travel and international holidays is benefiting again the baby boomers more than the younger generation so while there are these powerful forces at work it looks as if at the moment there are some groups that are benefiting from the more than others. There are also class issues and equality issues to do with the baby boomers are there and another thing I wanted to get you to explain this cause a little bit of a fuss I seem to remember when the book came out is that one part of your previous was that the increase in popularity of higher education is leading to more inequality in society particularly because of the greater involvement of women in higher education just explain that yeah look I was just trying in the interests of truthful as I was trying to explain a phenomenon and. Let me try to explain is neutral terms as I can the argument was one Wesen why household inequality rises is in the if you have an increasing the number of men going to university but far more a far greater because they were starting from a lower base a big increase in the number of women going to university now let me make clear I am pro this development I'm pro people having objective education and I'm pro people going on to get good jobs but what then happens is well just when you say that let's forestall the complaint. I like to get when we talked about a balanced budget earlier that was purely for Illustrated fluff as we were actually advocating that you're all these thank you so much for a protector of all these bits of them so what you've got is this is a situation where I think it is just a matter of fact that there was a big surge in the number of female graduates as a whole person thing good thing but there is then this phenomenon which the sociologists have an ugly name for they call it a sort of tip mating but it basically means that these well paid well educated women marry well paid well educated men which magnifies the income gap between households compared with the world where you have one earner couples that doesn't mean I'm saying we should go back to World one of the couples I'm simply trying to explain the phenomenon and part of the growth in household inequality seems to be in this it's not the whole story part of it that you see that one again it's not an argument against your thesis but one other way of looking at it would be to say look the issue here is not just generations it might be even more about class or perhaps even new factors to do with class I mean let's take housing for just as one example there's a if you were. Born of parents who weren't necessarily that well off but happen to buy their own kind so in the 1980 somewhere near central London you stand to inherit probably hundreds of thousands of pounds if not more compared to someone from an identical background whose parents didn't buy their kinds of Sunderland or Cowdenbeath that somewhere you you you get an almost like a new type of class system is late to be created over the next 3040 years and look there are clearly differences in Britain long all those divides we're familiar with and there's been hundreds of books written about British society class distinction gender ethnicity all that but my organ was there's another big divide as well and actually a rather significant one between different generations as generations and. That nobody is reporting on or thinking about it's not the full story but nevertheless you can now have the situation where someone who in other respects looks advantage someone in their twenty's and thirty's who's had a decent education you parents themselves might be quite affluent but for whom the journey of just getting owning their own home and having a funded pension which was pretty straightforward for their parents is much tougher for that person in their twenty's and thirty's even if they're quite advantage and then of course when you move on to people with disadvantage it's even tougher but my view is that you can clearly see that the time when you were born is a relevant factor here and it was fascinating when I wrote my book and it came out in 2010 even getting the data breaking down the social statistics by a huge and timely burrs rather than religion into their ethnicity that just wasn't the data it wasn't being collected on that basis because people didn't think it mattered now 10 years on it is being in collected and we're using it at resolution but that it must be I think the I person it's a growing and increasingly significant kind of cleavage in society which we should look at with the same man the sensitivity of some of the other ones we're familiar with are I bringing all that together what exactly is the pens the pinch is that this generation born since 1980 are having a tough time and even though modern capitalism is carrying on inventing new technologies and smart ways of doing things and becoming more productive despite all that it may be that this generation unless we change policy will not enjoy the living standards and the opportunities that generations before them have enjoyed and that we hope will be enjoyed by generations after them although it could be a temporary thing because in fact we have if not if not a new generation of baby boomers something like that yeah and I I hope it's tempered and of course. Although it's not all under attack and troll some of it is on direct control and if I am an optimist I think people do care about future generations so for example in the last 5 years alone if you ask people should more houses be built in your area which is the tough question the number of people agreeing to that has gone from about 25 percent to over 50 percent so I think want people register what we are doing attitudes change and I hope we will increasingly see a recognition we've got to do more to help younger people build up a funded pension as well and then also look at giving a better job opportunities so I think people care about you know a generation but just kind of took it for granted that they were being looked after and now the evidence is sadly they're not health care one of the things you found in your book was that. We have this idea that because the as the baby boomers get older the costs of health care were good will go up but you see that's not the case that what overwhelmingly matters for the cost of health care is that it's the final year of your life not how would you happen to be when the final year yes and I think it's important again to be clear what all these issues benefit from just being very clear on the evidence. That we the health care system does indeed spend a lot of money on people in the last year of their life understandable it's completely human it's not the case that that per individual we having to spend a lot more on their health care than we might have done in the past what's happening is that when you've got a big cohort. A lot of people growing old at the same time then even if you're just saving about this spending the same amount per person you were and yourself spending more in total and of course I want to play as they're living longer and the costs are concentrated in the last year it might be that there's a bit of a delay in when this bill comes through but it will come through and $1.00 of my arguments addressed to my generation of boomers is if we want to be cared for that if we want the younger generation we then be at their peak political power to be in the middle of society running all of our institutions if we really want them to pay for our health care push up their taxes to pay for health care then they will be much more likely to do that if they think we've given them a fair deal now we help them get started on the housing that to help them get a pension what I wasn't clear on was where the figures that you had for health care includes social care I mean isn't it the case that even if the costs of health care overwhelm in the last year of a person's life the baby boomer generation because it's bigger could in and of itself create more social care because they're bigger Yes that all these costs will grow because they're a bigger generation now amongst people who are far more expert than me there is quite an interesting debate about whether the extra years of law. If expectancy as we live for longer to put it crudely x. Years of good health or extra years of ill health and the experts defer I think on balance the evidence is that it's at least proportionately x. Years of good health it's not the case that we just spend longer in in. The serious challenges of a growing very old but the people dispute that but the main argument for my book is anyways just as we're a big generation it is exactly the same amount of real spend it will cost more because there are more of us even if it's delayed and not more per person does not point to one way of them at least a 1000000 are eating these problems between the generations because the. Pensions is a huge cost to the state and that it will be the younger generation paying for the likes of you and I when we get older but isn't the evidence that if you put the age of retirement the age at which you can get a state pension are that there's a huge amount to diminish the costs yet and of course it is not linked to retirement conditional Morris' the pension age it's simply the age at which people stop paying attention and you're right and I would say it's one of the biggest and best reforms in the last few years actually to. I have a fair balance between the generations is that we've now got a structure for raising the pension age and we know there's a particular grievance amongst a group a group of women in their sixty's for whom it's been particularly rapid but the plan is now to raise the pension age on some kind of proportionate basis as life expectancy goes up and one of the other sort of accidental worries that the crucial thing that you see there is life experience because it hasn't necessarily been sold that well has it made if you say to people Look you're likely to live an extra 15 years in your work an extra 5 that's actually quite a good deal but it's not really been so I don't know I mean I think where you put it is a is a very good but it's again it's another example of how the boomers have dern well because in the old days when people didn't factor in improvements in life expectancy you were just promised things above the age of 60 or over the age of 65 so that group born in the 5th in the 1900 forty's fifty's early sixty's who who who got past that target age and then found they were living far longer than expected had a kind of uncovered and did unexpected benefit now finally the system is catching up and it's a not we kind of want to index some of these things with life expectancy not depriving not deprive people of the right to a decent pension when they're old but it should be 15 years or so may not go to 15 years in 20 years in 25 years and 30 years and so we've now got a process in place introduce you have to say by the Coalition for systematically indexing the pension age reviewing it and indexing it if and as life expectancy continues to rise now can I get you to support a Jeremy carbon because I would have thought if the baby boomers we want to do something to help the coming generation who may have all the problems we've been discussing giving them free higher education might be a very good investment. Well I want more people to go to university and I was course the universities minister I But the question is how you best ensure that the greatest possible number of young people have the opportunity of a well funded university education and when universities were another claim on public spending alongside schools and early years and everything they lost out and governments control the budget as they do in Scotland to this day by controlling the number of people going to university and my view is that is not in the interests of the younger generation what we've done in England is we've said you pay back if you are a well paid graduate not otherwise it's only 9 percent on your earnings above $21000.00 there are going to be $25000.00 so you don't if you're a low paid graduate don't worry when have to pay back but if you are well paid you pay back and because we're expecting the graduates to pay back we've been able to put more money into higher education because the graduate sort of a banker and we've got rid of the gap on numbers going you're making a very good case except it contradicts some of the things you say in your book because precisely that paying back is one of the disadvantages that the coming generation will have over agin Well when I left I would say that they scan that the way in which the rest of society does indeed have an obligation to help people university and when I look at the best way to do it one of the best ways we can do it is say don't worry if you are low paid or your earnings aren't sufficient during your working life you don't have to pay back and when I try to think of a progressive fair way of funding higher education it would be the following if as a result of your university education you have a lot you pay back if as a result of your university education you have a less don't much and can't afford to pay back out of what's basically an income tax arrangement Don't worry we won't collect it from you the generality of taxpayers will pay for your hard to gauge that is essentially the English model and I think that is fair between the generations what about why either in equality in education we were. One of the issues is whether reducing inequality in education is really an educational problem or whether you have to undergo and address the underlying social issues and when the problems become so vague what you do you're absolutely right and the fact is every person in their different bit of policy needs to do their bit and education is part of the story but it it's true and it actually it is a challenge and it's a this is a depressing worrying fact that what we found is even when they achieve exactly the same graduate educational qualification someone from the advantage background the person the advantage background then goes on and more in the jobs market and that's why we've just recently produced the my successor it brought a very good legislation into the Commons to enable us to say that one use of access money is not just to help the disadvantaged students get in but to help fund their in turn chips in to help get on the work experience so that when they move on into the jobs market what I want to join people why do you think that is I didn't know that so if you 2 people come out of university with identical degree and the one who comes from a better off families liable to do better in the job market right why do you then that is well with this isn't this is new and very worrying evidence but I'm reporting that you've actually correctly summarized it we think it's things like networks of contacts to help you find a good job your parents know someone they know where to point you they know where the good jobs are they know someone who's an employer and recruiting so that's its social capital that could be an important part of it it might be that because of limited funding people are less geographically mobile and that you need to move somewhere else in order to find the places where the good jobs are it's those type of factors and although government can't do everything it's why I'm a strong supporter of the idea that one use of the excess money in universities is that you know university budgets shouldn't just be used to help the disadvantaged kids get in. That should also be used to help them get the good jobs afterwards All right let's finish with a very broad brush question which is your fear for the generation which is now coming up. Coming into young adult who'd. Do you think in fact the slightly depressing focus in your group will happen or is there any sign that the older the elder among us are waking up and saying that we're going to try stop I think I have a lot to miss from them mentally I actually think the older generation do worry now I'm much more aware than they were 10 years ago of how tough things have become for the younger generation I do think there's a shift in attitudes on housebuilding and yet again it is and for me as a conservative what I know is that the younger generation what do they want they want to own a house there and they want a decent job to be able to send their kids to a decent school and hopefully save up for engine that is not Marxist revolution just a completely well established British aspiration which political party certainly I hope my party the Conservative Party ought to be able to deliver and I think there's an increasing recognition that we kind of took it for granted that the system delivered those things it's not at the moment for the younger generation and we're going to do something about it. That's Lord Willetts speaking there to God in prayer on digital radio $92.00 to $95.00 f.m. Each one will be dealing with b.b.c. Radio so. It's 9 o'clock you're listening to Good Morning Scotland on Sunday with a simple phrase and Bill White for coming up before 10 o'clock Germany is still deadlocked over who will form the next government last ditch talks between the biggest parties start today and we look back at the legacy of one of Scotland's most outspoken architectural commentators govern stump 1st the news from the b.b.c. To reason me will k.-i to reshuffle of her cabinet tomorrow with Junior ministerial jobs being reassigned on Tuesday reports suggest up to 6 cabinet ministers could be sacked or moved several newspapers are reporting that Justin greening will lose her role as the education secretary and a new 1st 60 of state will be appointed following Damian Green sacking they say Boris Johnson David Davis and the Rudd will also stay.