Transcripts for BBC Radio Scotland FM BBC Radio Scotland FM 20170923 070000

To 90. 81 a medium wave and on digital radio b.b.c. Radio Scotland it's 8 o'clock you're listening to the weekend edition of Good morning Saddam with Bill white fur than Gordon Brown good morning coming up before turn the latest from Catalonia where spinners mobilizing more troops to stop next month's independence referendum on the eve of the Labor Party conference we hear from Jeremy carbon on the Scottish leadership and the prospects of working with the s.n.p. And we look back on the life and times of certain retailer who died this week at the age of 80 but 1st the b.b.c. News the French president Emmanuel McCrone says Britain must give more clarity about its negotiating position on Bracks it he's welcome to resume a suggestion of a 2 year transition period but Mr McCance says the talks can't move forward until there is progress on 3 key issues here's our political correspondent Leyla nothing after months of disagreement at the highest levels of government over how Bracks it should pan out to reason may appears to have done just enough with her Florent speech to broadly have won the support of both remain as and breaks it is within her own party but despite her appeal to those in Europe to show imagination and creativity the e.u. Sides remains concerned about detail last night the French president Emmanuel not call said there needed to be clarification on e.u. Citizens the financial settlement and the Irish border questions before talks could move on the real test of the impact of Mrs May's overture will be when the next round of negotiations begin on Monday the ratings agency Moody's has Don't gritted Britain's long term credit rating it's gone down by one level to not choose below the highest rating which Britain lost and 2013 business correspondent says on the streets are reports mood is fears the loss of tariff free access to the single market would weigh on growth saying it's no longer confident the guy. It will secure a free trade agreement with the e.u. To offset what it calls the negative economic impact of Brecht's it it is also predicts weaker public finances reflecting the increasing pressure to raise spending after years of cuts the government said it believed the assessment was outdated and insisted it had made substantial progress in reducing the deficit the b.b.c. Has found no major insurance policy will reimburse Ryanair passengers for Lost hotel bookings and car hire after the airline cancelled their flights the company's grounding more than 2000 flights over the next 6 weeks because of mistakes it made with pilots leave here's our reporter Alexandra Mackenzie these are so-called consequential losses and the majority of standard travel insurance policies don't cover you for associated or consequential Coast's if they do you cover you'll be for a very specific or limited reasons for cancellations and in this instance pilots holidays is not included in the. $2000000.00 couples are failing to claim our age allowance a tax break introduced 3 years ago that would save them up to $230.00 pounds a year the figure was revealed in a Freedom of Information request by the Royal London insurance company $4200000.00 couples who are married or in civil partnerships and pay the basic rate of tax qualify for the loans $1.00 of them has to earn less than their partner and have an income of no more than 11 and a half 1000 pounds. The Commonwealth War Graves Commission is appealing for relatives of 9 unrecognized Scottie soldiers who fought in World War one to come forward the commission was not informed by authorities at the time of the deaths therefore they were not commemorated as war dead the men will receive a commission headstone with the participation of direct relatives the names and details of the 9 men can be seen on the b.b.c. Scotland news website and Kenny Crawford is here with some swallow Kenny garden thanks very much good morning everyone and just under 4 hours time the farce told from Darby of the season kicks off I broke the venue for Met day kick off and Rangers goalkeeper waistcoat for the Ingham says his team have strengthened enough over the summer to go toe to toe with Celtic whose captain Scott Brown is naturally determined to silence that I broke scrape Premiership leader Celtic won 5 of the 6 meetings between the clubs last season and their 5 points clear of Rangers and the league as things stand later on at 3 o'clock in the top flight Camara play done deal Ross County who steps and seen Johnston welcome Hamilton then at 4 o'clock it's Partick Thistle hearts to fit bonus point one for Glasgow Warriors at home to Munster in the pool 14 last night Dave Rennie's men are top of the table after collecting the 3710 victory making it 4 whens from 4 Scottish go for a mark warden says patience has been the key to has good performance so far Portugal masters the score Braitman one shot to Hayne leader you know better as you know who's on 12 under water and starts this 3rd quarter past 1 today at the p.g.a. Tour's Tour Championship Ok see Justin Thomas and Webster and Simpson share the lead at the halfway point and the British Horseracing Authority is hopeful that the abandoned your Gold Cup can be reshaped you will speak to Gordon Smith about Rangers Celtic 830 but no Good morning to Teresa Talbot with the travel Good morning thank you Kenny we're not too much happening on that it's just some fancy news for you cannot target Port Authority. Ferry that remains suspended for technical reasons the Malaga lock boys deal is canceled for the rest of the day this is because of the weather Malak small aisles currently suspended with a view on this service admit day and a heightened possibility of disruption and several other services the passengers do check ahead you can call me if you like or 810295 double 8 and that's b.b.c. Radio Scotland travel Thanks reserve the weather summer issue at least as far as the temperature is the concern mainly cloudy and dry today but across the north staying brighter and warmer any rain lately to be confined to a few drizzly shows across the higher ground temperatures peaking typically at 17 degree cents and Centigrade but lifting to 20 on the Murray coast that's b.b.c. Radio Scotland news uncertainty reigns in Catalonia where the Spanish regions devolved government is still committed to holding a referendum on independence there's been a concerted effort by the authorities to stop the vote from going ahead Catalan officials have been arrested regional government offices raided and voting material seized Catalonia has its own police force a large number of Spanish officers are on board too huge ships docked in Barcelona support and reinforcements from Madrid apparently on their way well our correspondent Tom Potter just there and joins us know Tom what's the latest. Well I think where and so on chartered territory now I mean this is one week really until this this vote is still planned by Catalonia has devolved government I mean essentially they want to hold a referendum similar to that how do you stop them in 2040 but the Spanish government is still saying you can't do it and it's hard to say how things are going to pan out now as you say that the Spanish government has basically been using its power as sort of weighing down on the capital and also its ease and particular the pry independence movement here on Wednesday they they raided the Spanish place the offices of the devolved government seized a lot of election material the reports suggest that the cap lying government has thousands of. Box stashed away in a secret place in the cafe and government says it has a contingency plan but despite the action by the Spanish police it still can put some kind of referendum on the question is whether if whether it can actually hold a referendum that is legitimate and credible both here in Catalonia in the rest of Spain and abroad terms of the regional police force a Catalonian police force and there's the goddess of feel from control by Madrid and also all these officers on board ships that must lead to tension. Yeah it's pretty eye catching I mean you know look it's Catalonia as always you know for a long time has had its own police force muscle state you know they run pretty much all police affairs apart from borders here in Catalonia you know after the recent terrorist attack that they were running the main parts of the terrorist investigation. But there is also police here nephew now that Spain's national police force and Spain's Civil Guard also a sort of military wing of the police and both of those police forces operating Catalunya that's normal but what isn't normal is that the number of them has increased and there are these 2 slightly bizarre looking almost sort of cruise ship boats had Downing fascinating the port and they have been pictures photos of police Spanish police vans sort of taking offices on board and the port staff it working at the local port I kept around people have refused to kind of service the boat so it's a sort of strange dynamic I mean I think especially I think that that is Spain's insurance card if you like and I think what the Spanish government has is it's a difficult balancing act it doesn't want to antagonize the pro independence movement here Further it doesn't want to have to use more force if you like by the police or if it does it sort of risks antagonizing the pro independence movement and probably putting more people onto the streets in the demonstrations seem to have calmed for the moment a bit but there are pretty much demonstrations in Barcelona every day you know several 1000 people potentially key points related to this ongoing issue are 3rd still talks going on between the Catalan authorities and Madrid. And not that I'm aware of I'm pretty sure the talks broke down a long time ago I mean this this issue goes back a long way and you know you can trace it back to 2006 when a century there was going to be a new statutes a new deal for Catalonia more autonomy for the region particularly linked to the finances and the control of taxes but in 2010 Spain's courts rejected that deal that there had been a referendum in Catalonia the deal had been approved and Kaplan he was g. To get more autonomy 2010 the Spanish course struck that down because Spain's popular party the the Conservative Party which is now in power in Madrid didn't like the deal it thought that it was unconstitutional and then if you wind the clock on to 2012 that's when. Serious numbers of people on Catalonia as National Day on September the 11th poured on to the streets demonstrating in the wake of Spain's financial crisis so there was an element of sort of economic grievance but also a lot of the people that they were demonstrating in favor of independence and every year since then there's been a large demonstration in the independence movement here has been galvanized in the wake of the financial crisis it's tapped into this sort of sense that Catalonia gets a roar economic deal from the central governments in Madrid and what the Catholic government has done in recent years is is basically carry out local elections but all essential kind of convert local elections into a poll on it on independence all the pro independence nationalist parties form the coalition in recent local elections and said look we're only campaigning on the independence issue if you vote for us you're voting for independence they didn't they just didn't get a majority of the vote they got 48 percent but they did get a majority of seats when they went into coalition with a quite far left pro Independence Party in the parliament and they say that gave them a mandate to push forward their project so this referendum which they now plan in 8 days time but we've had a stalemate between the Madrid government the Spanish government and the capital and authorities for a long time and that stalemate I think is really now reaching a critical moment Ok to put it in fill in noisy bustle of the thanks very much well I'm joined now by Dr Daniel say train who's a specialist in nationalism and independence movements at the Scottish center on constitutional change at Edinburgh University. Well then you say to what do you think the game plan of the Spanish government is here do you think it is intends to try to stop this referendum taking place. Well I think what they are trying to achieve is to fulfill their promise that there will not be a Catalan referendum it will just not happen what they are trying to do is to stress the state authority the trying to show that they control the territory and they are simply treating this as a case of these are be the ins and now sedition and this is not what we were expecting we thought that the Spanish government would adopt the position they had up to 3 years ago when there was a symbolic vote on in the pendants in Catalonia and he was there were some technical problems but that was eventually permitted it was allowed to take place instead they've decided to a lot more radical stance this time which in my view is counterproductive because it is being perceived by wide sections of the Catalan population not necessarily supporters of in the pendants as an aggression and as an a 4 as a form of repression so it's politically many Catalans and it's bringing together those who are supporting the pendent with those who support the referendum or having a referendum the right of Catalans to the side under the common front of the fending at the loneliest Politico autonomy and freedoms and rights so in my view it is being counterproductive because they may well achieve the goal of preventing the referendum from happening but the political cost is very high and the emerge of the Spanish government and state and eventually its legitimacy in Catalonia where the Popular Party is almost irrelevant is also very important when you say they will try to stop the referendum taking place in practical terms what can they do are we talking about police moving in and seizing ballot boxes or ward. That seems to be one of the options so there are 2 options in my view one is that something will eventually happen despite all the technical problems that your reporter in Barcelona was just describing So something will happen and there will be some kind of vote and people will turn up and obviously this is not the referendum that the Gotham government wanted because the census is unclear ballots have been confiscated that there are risks off fines if school open so it really is not what we had here obviously 3 years ago and it's not a proper referendum and the legitimacy and the implications of the vote are unclear but that's an option that something will happen anyway the 2nd one is that as you are suggesting that this by the government really decides to prevent these vote physically removing ballot boxes are not allowing the schools to open that would obviously be the more radical choice that would definitely antagonize large sections of the population and would put. The political The constitutional crisis in Spain at the moment at a record low because this is the greatest constitutional crisis in Spain in 40 years so there are 2 options none of none of which look great in my view what it's clear is that we want to see an independent get along on the 2nd of October because it is not clear how this referendum can go ahead and can lead you to my Gotham government to implement such important measures you know I was going to ask you that some sort of referendum goes ahead no matter the attempts to stop it what does the Spanish government do next does it just say well it's illegitimate we won't recognise it that's what they did 3 years ago The nor the result they said this is unconstitutional you're doing something but this is not politically relevant and we're going to ignore it it seems like they are taking a different position this time so I don't think they will say I mean nor in good. Instead they are treating this as a case of these are billions on sedition and I think I suspect the role of the judiciary power on and treating these as a case of from the law perspective rather than the from a political perspective will will remain there are also some speculations that that got them government could try to call an early election to use the momentum if there is really the use of physical efforts by Spanish authorities to prevent the vote from happening again a very solid majority for independence and eventually perhaps for the your commission to get involved and try to see the 2 sides on the table and negotiate a Scottish like referendum these are just speculation that the moment but the 2 maintain areas seem to be this one none of which look great for both sides a very fragile and precarious referendum or simply no referendum at all because the Catalan authorities haven't they have said should they win a referendum that takes place that could be called meaningful in any sense then they would declare independence within 2 weeks yes they said that and they also didn't set the minimum turnout so. That is true but politically in my view it's difficult to see how this could be implemented it's very difficult to implement independence unilaterally in a liberal democratic context with all its difficulties in the 21st century and especially the turnout is slow and it's not clear the extent to which the Unionists got them and Unionists will turn out because they are aware that by turning up you know an illegal or out on constitutional referendum according to this party government they are legitimizing the bring the pendants cause so that's why here the role of the Spanish government's reaction is fundamental because just by looking these very radical stand which is very different from the 13 years ago I insist is being counterproductive in the sense that it will I mean made many. Bill to mobilize to turn up and vote they may not necessarily do it in super for in the pen the door in support for the No but it will be perhaps more like a mobilization against the p.p. In the fence of Catalonia as political rights and freedoms and this will for their own Tiger nice the Catalan authorities and the Spanish authorities to pull the sorry it's lost it does seem extraordinary in the 21st century as you've said yourself that in a liberal democracy in a country which is one of the most of both countries in the European Union we have this situation where there are boat loads of police in the poll or it's threats to physically stop a vote it's something you expect to hear about Perth for all areas in Putin's Russia no not in Spain. It is it is astonishing 3 days ago when I read the news and I saw that this was this is what was happening I was astonished because again we didn't expect this we thought the would Spanish government would adopt a low profile approach because that seem wiser and this is having some effect think that along the us so Roy is being accused of being an air gun like sort of. Leader for for adopting this position instead of negotiating the Got Talent what the got that on process has been about for the past 70 years has been trying to negotiate that in the pennant referendum with Madrid That's why David Cameron is a hero in Catalonia because people wish there were some kind of leader like that conservatively there in Madrid who would recognize that the man of the Catalan people and the majority of the Catalan parliament and government and would negotiate a referendum and accept the outcome this has not been possible but so far the Spanish government the than openly oppose certain measures done by the Catalan government and they just rip went to the judiciary powers to address this issue as a case of these are billions now. This is one step further this is a critical moment and I don't see this becoming. A solution to the problem I see the credit deepening in the in the next few days Daniel cetera thank you very much that incidentally Bill if David Cameron is listening in his new foreign Bowl share that should cheer David Cameron is a hero with a doctor laureate that must be the only country in the world. Development I'm sure you know. He's from the Catalan National Assembly who supports independence Mark what do you think the attention the intention of the Catalan authorities is is it to go ahead with this vote even if the police and. Military try to stop it happening with morning yes I think that the cattle in government wants to go ahead with with the referendum because they went to the election and they won this election with a clear popular mandate. They had the majority of seats in the Catalan parliament they would organize a referendum to know the opinion of Catalan people about the possibility that Catalonia would be coming in that and country. What's their response to what the Spanish government says is not only is this referendum illegal it's illegal under a constitution which the people of Catalonia themselves voted for. Yeah I think that is not exactly a friend them is not illegal the concept the Spanish constitution assess. To hold a referendum give a referendum has to be authorized by the central government the Spanish government so the Spanish government could authorize. This just referendum in Catalonia So it's not a matter of being a legal or illegal it's just a political a matter of political will now. Again the Catalan authorities have said look if we win if there is a meaningful referendum they would declare independence within 2 weeks then your sitter was very skeptical could happen what's your view I think and I mean the position of the Spanish government they disparage the moment when one's there from them to be successful so they will they are trying already to scare people of going to the polling stations and. And they weren't the turnout of the referendum to be very very weak so even if the Us is winning they will say that is not representative in so I think that at this point I mean the Catalan government said that they would declare So in that independent but at this moment I think that the Spanish government will have Barrie huge political problem on the table and at this point I think that it should be a negotiation between. The Spanish government and the Catalan government to try to find a political solution of these of the outcome of the referendum on political solution being what does it have to be independence for Catalonia or could it simply be that there is an agreement to implement. Further autonomy as was agreed several years ago and then stopped by the co if if people of Catalonia are boating Yes the implementation of this political deal with the implementation of the of an abandoned but the problem is that no one in Catalonia thing that the Spanish government now is able to offer any political. Any political deal. Even. Any political little within Spain because the problem is that. The Spanish government has been refusing to talk about any little for for 7 years and if they are going to agree to talk they're not going to agree to Talk of the assumption is that Catalonia will become independent yeah they might agree to Talk of the Assumption of the other might be some deal for further autonomy here and then I think that at this point. The European Union should say a word I think. We have been talking about. Liberal. Democracy but it will that a counter being part of the appeal and Cantor of their opinion is acting like that so I think that is the moment I think I think that maybe their opinion are equating for this popular money date that is for the outcome of our friend them if there is a clear. Yes there European Union have to have to try to make the Spanish government the seat and to talk to the to the Catalan government or I might call off thank you very much indeed for joining us a small victory where you can go far in Scotland before you see support for a separate Catalonia many parts of the poor independence movement here see that alias politics as a sort of get for a struggle here also resonates with for sections of the left in Scotland those who vent of the Scots who. A volunteer to fight in the Spanish Civil War many of them in Catalonia were Professor Willie Miller of Glasgow University joins us now and your father was an international brigades Yes My father fought in Spain 80 years ago he was captured that Arma favoring 147 and then him he was a prisoner of war he was Salamanca 8080 years ago so how does that color your view of what's happening at the moment I think it's complicated because you talked about the left the mean the left probably in Spain across Europe and Scotland is divided on the question of nationalism separatism as some might see or self-determination and other and so I don't think you find uniformity the Communist Party for example was anti e.u. And to Scottish independence and the and Britain so I think it is complicated but yes definitely has a cause of what was happening in 1930 s. When you think of what was an early 1930 s. With cattle on autonomy the way that was torn and snuffed though by Franco So I think the definite a coup is no and I think that people who were associated with an sas brigade would look at it and see that our parallels there what Ian in the start when you've got a Conservative government clamp and on what they would see as a right to self-determination so I think that that an analogy is about to think you would fain uniformity among foremen and tonight a biggie that you know we could because your father would have been an internationalist as a communist or is a communist party member wasn't it was an attachment to nationalise that's true but it's and as complicated because it went fate for the Spanish Republique that had been some compromises made in the air with our own can partly the process of as a dependent inevitably Or can the back compromise can a federal republic solution so I think there are lots of lots of peril as we score in the run very very deep and aim but I don't think you can even be simplistic about it because the latest as the v.a. Did or on the national question and has been for of that of a long term particularly in Scotland especially hearts of the radical. All left have gone towards independence as a means to ords social justice or whatever is the Fighting For Yeah that's true and I don't think you can say unionism equals conservatism in these cases where people would have the internationalist argument against nationalism as opposed to right of nation to self-determination which is an absolute principle and whether you're for or against Scottish or cattlemen and the pain and you look at the kind of serious misjudgments the Spanish government is making at the moment and you would see that's push and cattle Catalonia farther down the road to 10 dependents when my colleague Molly Pettit launched his book that would tend to paintings translated and cattle on in 2008 with Al examined Barcelona it was clear the roads converging and I think the positive thing is these have been peaceful 7 nationalisms peaceful slow progress on I would not seem rude there are differences but I think the actions of the Spanish government at the start being at the moment because and I and I think one thing they're also doing is but I'm going attention across Europe and across the world. To get to the right and principle that people should have a right to this aid from sale but one of Scottish nationalists and perhaps scholars radicals if you like on the left picked on Catalonia as a particular fight where there are lots of fights for self-determination and lots of parts of the world even even other parts of Europe even other parts of Spain or Basque country but why Catalan why why does that resonate when those others don't seem to so much. I think because they do have shield and Corman histories I think people made the connection to look to Europe and said. Because I feel like and I think that it's the very deep past that is invade a long and complicated has that he's the go back to the 1940 s. Back to the 1920 s. But certainly in the last 40 years post Franco the and and Scott and Scotland's case starting from the Med 971 I think there has been this convergence and I think Sam You could see as a conversation they've been reading each other they've been looking at each other they've been competing Nourse And I think again those of associations with what was the famous moment for the left and the 1930 s. And spin so I think there may be a rosy glow of both but I think there are also some hard comparisons and information here you see a rosy glow some would suit a month Yeah I think my father was the most unseen to main tunnel until romantic person you could ever meet one pit famous on crime she was fake and so my father was very unsentimental but it was was it a solution to toll you know in the fight. Actually towards the end of the Spanish Civil War of research to be for each other in the Communists were fighting the darkness of the costs and fighting the local nationalists and also Frankel's people really seem to follow the Torah that's true but my father was never afraid it would never succeed and he was never afraid of complexity so I think in some way you can see that's what's happening right no I think should be looked at in all its complexity not just in terms of simple comparisons simple headlines but in all its complexity the same goes for the Spanish Civil War because I think we're still writing that history so-called. I think we're still rating that history and living that history in some some some ways so I think brings out some with deference ease and complexities in the fickle trees which have been in particular in the latest of a long time has got to be a good thing Ok Thanks very much for joining us as well as for coming and I'm really. 1st of all I'm really from Glasgow University's 21 minutes to 9 it's 29 minutes to 9 as Bill says and this is Good Morning Scotland with Bill White from Gordon Brown the headline so far this morning the French president Emmanuel Micron says Britain must give more clarity about its negotiating position on Bracks following to reserve me speech yesterday the ratings agency Moody's has downgraded the U.K.'s credit level for a 2nd time blaming economic uncertainty caused by the BRICs in the Go see Asians the b.b.c. Has established that no major insurance company will reimburse Ryanair passengers for lost to tell begins car hire or other expenses after the airline cancelled some flights or his Kenny with more support Kenny Yes like scored in the 1st old farm Darby of the season is almost upon us 3 and a half hours away from the Met they kick off as you may expect Celtic captain Scott Brown says he's eager to silence that home support drones been playing in these fixtures for a decade now if you know the fifty's. Came up against because in some ways and we've heard some great that that is over there. You can't say we're going on their favorites I'm going to go they are composed and we need to go there what. Can . Make sure we play our own game so that Celtic captain Scott Brown in lights no heat if the farmer Rangers player and the rector of football Gordon Smith is entering the day with an optimistic mindset he joins us live now and good morning garden Good morning What reasons would you say that are for Rangers and their fans thinking they can take something from today's game well I don't I don't think there's any particular reason for that because I think those problems. Especially the injury problems noted they have been playing a bit better the only game is part of the 2nd game was it exactly but the up to see it all still to still up much stronger scored Yes shelter won 5 of the 6 meetings last season most recently and painfully for Rangers a 50. When I broke in a to go to keep her ways for getting him said yesterday he thinks ranges of strength and enough to go to to to a sale to Jackie was that I can see that particular no I think maybe they can keep and a better game by have to look at it and think that you know in terms of this that the defeats Rangers had last season with their own mainly I thought that the 2nd to the final 2 underpaid looks she knew what they're into the system and how we played the tactics is going to change that for today it cannot go again with a 442 as he did in both of those games and this fight as though that is their problems defensively obviously is going to have to I think you have to go with a 5411 system so that makes it clear they play one straight up front place for them at all but 5 at the back and that's only we think that Rangers can play in this game and can go toe to toe if they fail and they're well organized and they give their all then they can make it difficult for Celtic on 1st in a garden we saw in 1000 years old square from Motherwell called Alan Campbell really start a Nazi no win against Aberdeen and another 19 year old Ross McCrory looks like he could start against Celtic be a massive day from if that happens is that a good thing to have almost what Rangers would call one of the tour and playing the game absolutely I mean he's never played a league game so far so this would be League debut if you play City Well he did it to get an Old Firm game it's been anointed here in Boston in the past but as I say they came on and he did very well and again the League Cup game so I think that from the point of view they may have I think Dick offices fans like them but Africa needs support along save them and I think the you know with the you've not got some of the layout of is the not guilty Wallace another experienced player so it's going to be tougher for him to come in and that's why I'm thinking that the better frame just go with the Center bikes and young McCrory is one of them and finally Gordon thanks for joining us I imagine and obviously knew that Rangers fans would want the points got to go to a point Soledad where Linda season Noynoy are told the points in a bag are quite a big goal difference of skill to win this game today. Well Stanley No one really knows what I mean what the only looking for today is a performance regardless of this although what I formants and get closer to see if you. Know of a policy Ok Gordon Smith former Rangers player thank you very much for joining us commentary of Rangers versus Celtic is on b.b.c. Radio Scotland it one or medium wave it 12 of the ball will be on f.m. As usual. Is here with some travel you know every much earlier any more. You may have had other things to talk about I didn't want to interrupt you and ask him to those works continue this weekend with restrictions in both directions so do expect delays and do be of this in mind if you're using this trait to head for the Old Firm match because it could slow you down or cause some delays you don't want to miss the Kick Off segment they can like Tarbert part of add if area that suspended for technical reasons the Malak lock boys deal cancelled for the rest of the day this is because of the weather and the Malak small aisles currently suspended there will be a review in the service at midday with a heightened possibility of disruption in several other services so passengers do check ahead or 8995 double it is our number and that b.b.c. Radio Scotland travel thanks to Riza now the Labor Party conference begins tomorrow amidst great optimism after the party's relatively successful showing in the general election Westminster correspondent David Porter has been speaking to the Labor leader Jeremy Corban and David joins me now morning David good morning when you spoke to Jeremy Corbin what sense did you get of the mood in his camp it was really quite a chipper mood Gordon they were confident they were even Jews you know I've interviewed in the view generally called in a number of times and certainly in the past it has been perhaps a little bit more difficult to engage with the people around him now it may be they were just overjoyed when he was speaking to b.b.c. Scotland but I think there is more to it than that they don't think anything is taken but they think they are back in the political game at the moment they are not at the stage where they say they are. Measuring up for the curtains of Downing Street but they look at the opinion polls they see that Labor is doing well Jeremy Corbett had a very good general election campaign and there is certainly a confidence in the Labor team at the moment those surrounding Mr Corbett and I believe Mr Corbyn himself that they if there was to be a general election in the near future they would be in from their point of view with a very good shout now he has spent a lot of time in the summer in Scotland he realizes how important Scotland is to him the labor had a good election result in Scotland in June going up from one to 7 M.P.'s But the fact that they are making progress in Scotland shows just how much they have for all and the past few years if you go back to the 2015 general election before that they had 41 M.P.'s and went down to 4 to just one they are now the 3rd party Scottish party at Westminster and Holyrood So Jeremy called in is under no illusion quite what a big job they have got in Scotland but he also realizes if he is to stand a chance of getting into Downing Street he has to do a lot better in Scotland with a Labor leadership going on in Scotland I put the question to Mr Corbett the leadership election in Scotland was it a distraction or was it an opportunity for the party in Scotland. Scottish Labor. Well we've gaining members by election results since June of gone well for us and we did gain seats in the general election but we still have a lot more support to try and get so I think what we need is a leader who is prepared to get out there in all the communities all the time and this and to people as well as speak at public meetings and events and rallies and develop a radical economic agenda for Scotland does deal with issues of inequality poverty and injustice but above all of a decent hope he and people bricks David unavoidable at the moment was there any hint from Mr carbon that he might find some common cause with the s.n.p. Yeah this is interesting he was using the same phrases that we've heard from the s.m.b. About Westminster wanting to take part in a power grab taking powers from Holyrood potentially When breaks it goes ahead powers will come back from Brussels and initially they will come to Westminster and the argument Jim Westminster or the u.k. Government and Hollywood is whether some of those powers more power should go back to Hollywood Miskolczi made it very plain that he felt that actually there ought to be more devolution Holyrood should get more powers there is not much the s.n.p. Labor agree on this one on the brakes issue and all of the powers and giving more to Holyrood they do speak with the same voice on this is common cause with Scotland what we're saying is that powers that have been taken to Brussels which affect regional development anywhere across Europe which are Brussels powers at the moment will obviously be returned to the u.k. On breaks it those powers should go to Scotland to Wales and to English regions we will make sure that happens I want to see a process of strong devolution of those investment decisions and devolution powers going to going to Scotland. Now David there's been some equivocation hasn't there in the Labor Party here over Independence and the possibility of another referendum Hota Germany Corben respond to that yet and indeed God in the past German government sometimes give mixed signals on where he stands on the fault line in Scottish politics independent Some whether there should be a 2nd referendum when I spoke to him he was very clear that he did not favor there being another vote this is how he phrased it I'm not in favor of a Scottish 2nd Scottish independence referendum we had one which was meant to settle the issue for a generation I don't detect any great appetite for it what I detect is a great appetite for improvements in the Scottish economy and dealing with the issues of poverty in Scotland the number of children living in poverty and the number of older people living in poverty and huge levels of health inequality particular in Glasgow. David Luke thank you very much for that I know of people of you this week comes from journalist and documentary producer Stephen McGinty joins us in the studio Hello good morning how are you just fine what have you spotted I take it all the mean headlines are but recently Well they are indeed today on did and as you can imagine right across the spectrum of newspapers we've got their f.t. We can probably been the most can balanced and constructive about it's of the Clinton that's a construct of bricks but it wins again a guarded Brussels welcome and then we go across to the Daily Telegraph with them bricks that lead to 2021 which is the Telegraph perception of it and the Scottish Daily Mail have gone for a walk the tightrope and very balanced very can of your common Rushnell is the national me does not speak for eyes which obviously excludes the 1100000 people that they did actually vote for for leaving the e.u. But we'll save that for another time I know the papers are have been a bit really interesting in the Arctic or in on Tuesday means kind of handling of it effectively you've got the balance of the f.t. Who says that she's in the tapes but she's been rational and has done the right thing and you get the Telegraph you've effectively argued that if it was not for Boris Johnson's. So of introduction if it went to the people with these 4000 word to discrete last week then who are those 50 and what does doing all of the Living Through the Telegraph as well absolutely he didn't absolutely absolutely as you haven't mentioned him as you can imagine in their leader but what's kind of I thought was quite particular interesting about the telegraph was that we had Duncan Smith writing his take on this situation and given the situation with newspapers at the moment it's cut back his 1st sentences garbled effectively because he writes for years I have I fought tooth and nail against the e.u. I think I could then use a motto for it I have I thought to some sub somewhere is going to have to be for the. You need to. Have severely Now you've picked up a story in The Times of yes yes it's quite interesting that we've gone from the European Union and a whole kind of concept of where we're we're moving to and if it the evidence of the who's who say that we were right to leave the e.u. Would argue that we're heading to a brave new world and in the Times of course we are heading to a brave new world but it's not the one that people perceive and the mark or in the Times an interesting story about Grant Morrison who is the visionary graphic novelist and it's been announced that he will be writing a new version of all this Oxley's classic novel and it's going to be going out something the next couple years focused to the market in America and it will be as an interesting take on it effectively here you argue that the brave new world of George Orwell was there effectively North Korea which new was living in of the North Koreans a moment for which for that we are grateful and the reality is that we're living in a world where we get fit to be what we want to that's more closer to the whole this is a sleaze view says version yes just remind us of what his vision was what was his vision effectively was that. The future society would be people would be so addicted to drugs and so widely promiscuous So it's an interesting take on it and I think he's going to be expanding much more. All the different avenues in which the world has changed so was a population that was kept Yes supine absolutely as opposed to religion being the drugs the masses drugs were the drugs of the masses. The murder and the Scotsman have more on this story yes it's interesting because I'm with all this Huxley of imagine the future we could call a taxi Well then again they were probably doing in the 1930 s. Using rotary dial phones what we have here is to takes again on the situation in London where we have. The London transport to saying that it's not support for effectively are not a suitable company to be operating and the license is going to be revoked pending review or in the thought if of September. The Mirror have got some very good story . There have a very good story looking at the reasons why behind that they have exploited the drivers and they've not been taken passenger safety effectively but what we've got with a Scotsman is effectively saying the councils in Scotland are going to be doing any such review that reversal rates are safe until $21000.00 was interesting because. The obviously as a worldwide company here operates in slightly different ways doesn't as I understand it in different legislations different distinctions and in Scotland and particular cities like Glasgow all cars are fences hired to private have got a high clear higher license and that was the issue in London was that this is just going to allow the absolutely they don't seem to be in a position to be the and want to try producing to be incorrect to fight back on the fact that the hoping to negotiate a deal which the argument be a lot safer for for drivers find sort of passengers a passenger see if yes exactly the hands of drivers and finally Joan Didion great writer this government this is my God absolutely absolutely if anyone is wishing to spend a couple of pounds and have a great piece of writing this week then it would be would be advice to pick up a copy of The Guardian No I would as a newspaper man for many years I would argue you can buy the paper because it's much more pleasurable to start a rummage and ruffle it but I am obviously you can read it online thanks to the Guardian but she's written a wonderful piece which I did it was written in 1970 but it's hard on travelling down through the deep south it's. Taken from her notebooks which have been republished in a book but effectively it's a very pressing against this idea this theme of the past coming back into the future and its effects were the arguments of the South will come to dominate the politics of today. Thanks very much for joining us this morning nice to see you again Stephen begin to with people of you now on this program we often speak to correspondents from all over the world but. Was alike to cover an area like the Highlands and Islands of Scotland David Ross has just retired after 30 years as the Herald's Highlands and Islands correspondent and in this week's reporter's notebook he looks back at some of the big stories he's covered in the last 3 decades I'm reminded of 3rd base jokingly given to me by a senior colleague as they headed north to my new post your job he said is to explain choose to learn to the rest of us despite the inelegance of the world doing it was good advice the Highlands and Islands as in the area not always based understood but there is to Scotland my perch stretched in the last container in the south to the Shetland Island of Unst in the north and from St Kilda in the West to the quest country of space age in East. And the area bigger than Wales and almost the size of Belgium but with fewer people than Edinburgh. This waste of land a constant reminder of the sad history of Clinton's emigration and absentee landowners the area has long face big issues and locals and comers alike deeply but what happens to their place over they don't always agree no challenge has been greater than ho to the Teen People conic the population led to the creation of the Highlands Naome development port more than 50 years ago when the then state to state well it was told Parliament for 200 years the Highlanders being the man and Scotland's conscience they have alleged has been largely arrested in many parts but the motor communities can still see their people leave this has led to a constant effort to increase economic activity which in itself has frequently divided on the penny and and long before the 1st wind farm was ever proposed for example with the plans to create a nuclear waste dump and Keith Nace and those to remove half a mind to the hardest to create Europe's largest super Corey which would have been visible from the moon covering local campaigning and such as he has taken up much of the past 3 decades was recently the communities are in the climate the 1st I've been fighting plans to transfer millions of tonnes of crude oil between tankers one of the most important often states in Europe many of the campaigns were in pursuit of improved transport links the fight for the road to the 20 community of land to Galle and harvests have been fought and won just before I took a post but there were those for causeways to bed early and their skin obliged to Sculpey all ultimately successful help by European aid in the south it had been a great local to campaign for the return of a car ferry service from Campbellton to Northern Ireland to boost local tourism the publicly known car market was keen to do it but then to the government to the private sector operator one key importantly for 3 years and locals were open reach when it withdrew its vessel for more than half the month of June this for the look at a fork of taking it for traffic over to the Ala Monte t.v. Says. But for all the families they have taken the image of one Germany in particular means with me the last run of the sky fairy from Creil for caustically Larken the day the new tool budget opened in 1905 local people have come from all over the island to be on it and there was a subdued atmosphere history was be made to the island would never be the same again it was physically joined to the u.k. It would trump for the 1st team but there was a sense of grievance since the 1970 s. Both label into the governments had built bridges in the Highlands to a place for a sort of long road journeys Bella Coola she was the 1st in 1075 then the chroma to for crossing 4 years later case it can 1902 and Cayle skew in 1904 don't look 1901 all 3 real progress as it was understood only in Sky what Islanders in the 1st of the expected to carry on paying high fairly for years to fund the controversial private finance initiative many able to refuse to pay the tools another campaign was launched in went all the way to high court and the court to say sions another image that will mean will be that of the gathering in store plainly in Sutherland and those embers evening in 1902 the Highland play school was in the lock and availability Scottish fishing boats in protest against the European Common Fisheries policy had located the harbor which was being used by French boats but we have that have been an important development in the absence of those camping to buy the 21000 acre estate where they lived and worked but which seemed set to be broken up and sold off their leader the late on the cli address the gathering his great grandfather Tim clear from the land of the Valar to make way for the sheep farm put Should one supported 500 use his great grandfather had been cleared from the land to meet we for the sheep farm put Should one supported 500 Jews although there were none that evening he spoke he told a 100 crofters it Piers we have won the land his only regret was that their food bills wouldn't be there to share the moment they asked and Crofter successful campaign launched the Muslim community line but when. And both of a nonissue other than sky followed quickly then AIG No I don't and so many others within half a 1000000 acres of Scottish Land it's no wonder the community control including lot and 50 percent of the area of there are 2 trails it's been north to report such stories as it has been to cover the Highlands and Islands at all to me that I'm in Scotland's magical lands whose beauty can entrance the lungs of one of the moment but they can be dangerous tragedy attains frequently in the mountains that lords in the sea but there is a growing cultural vibrancy Teil in life no and garlic is still defying predictions of its ultimate demise as a spoken language through the have to lean effort of many activists Gallic me gym teachers nationally staff in the highly effective fission movement is to plane has been slowed hopefully arrested but more welcome resources will be needed it's hard for a guy like just to stand still saw many are needed to learn the language to the police those need to speakers who are dying off there's a project for somebody recently retired. Take a drug reporting there though this week saw the death of such Teddy Taylor at the age of 80 For years he'd been the voice of blue collar conservatism in the West of Scotland struggling to hold on to his Glasgow seat until he was dumped by the voters in 1979 a long career followed as a Tory member in Southend on Sea but the current m.p. For Glasgow South there sent peace Stuart McDonald's told me so Teddy's heart was always in Cathcart When you become when you empty your advised in your last speech it made speech to say nice things about your predecessor which I do we did. But during the 25th election my 1st run for parliament his name would come up all the time to the point where I feel as though I was running against him even though he had been in the constituency for decades. And I felt as though wouldn't it be right to not mention of so I did mention them and in particular mentioned his is what Catholic you know the must have been hardly a hoax. The Hutton help from a had help from Jesus time as the m.p. . On the back of that to me sent me a lovely 100 letter. Saying he was going to be in the Commons on on us. And we should meet for a cup of tea which had arranged through another piece David Amos who went on to be an m.p. In the south India where he went so he came in and we spent maybe about 90 minutes talking and he was he was just a genuinely nice person and he did you know he took a genuine interest in myself as a new m.p. And the constituency and how it's changed he didn't do the classic thing that so many old Them piece do which is to talk about themselves and he's a lot to talk about you know he had a genuine interest and host things have changed in the constituency he you know his old stomping ground. As Joe McDonald and people call in a car as a veteran Scottish political journalist I asked him about current leader Reese Davidson's description of Teddy Taylor as a tenement Tory the term tenement Tory is very appropriate for Teddy Taylor he was a populist m.p. He represented Cathcart which included Castlemilk which was one of the 3 huge Glasgow housing schemes at the time which were among the biggest council housing schemes in Europe and he still kept that vote because he was a populist he was very much in touch with his working class voters and of those very often seen as right wing then in many ways so were they on social matters and he touched a chord there and he also found people who agreed with him about his views on Europe but I think part of that whole being in touch the tenement Tory bit was that he had started off for a very short time in the Glasgow Herald as a journalist and then he spent 8 years writing a column for the last week Me citizen and that I think it was called Teddy Taylor talking remember that and that again his tuppence worth enough every Friday night sharpened his mind and he started using soundbites before people ever knew the meaning of the word and made him self very popular with journalists thereby But as you say he was sort of a conservative I think he himself believed that his views that he was out of step with a lot of other politicians but that they would come running to his way of thinking and so as proved on things like brakes or Absolutely I mean that that's something where. You know people wouldn't have thought at that time when we had the referendum in 1985 on whether to stay in Europe which we'd entered on the 1st of January in 1973. People thought well we're the poor people of Europe and Europe's rich we're better off being in and that was the general thrust of feeling at that time the economic climate was to change and with it the view coming more to the idea into a majority in the u.k. Vote. Good to come out of Europe in the referendum was exactly the sort of thing that Teddy had always been saying and that's that's the point about him being ahead of it on other matters think things social affairs I mean a lot of people didn't like his views on homosexuality but then again of the time that was a view that was very often held. Just playing a sort of counterfactual game and beloved of people who look back on political history then he was the only Tory I think to lose his seat in 1979 what would have happened had he held on to Cathcart and become perhaps as many people said Sect of State for Scotland Margaret Thatcher would we have had a very different Scottish Conservative Party through the eighty's I think that's a most interesting question because in the early seventy's during Heath's government he resigned as a Scottish Office minister over Europe and after fatter became the leader in 75 he became her favorite I mean she didn't leave everything he said but she was sufficiently confident in him that she made him ultimately shadow secretary of state and there is no doubt in my mind that he would have been the secretary of state for Scotland had he not lost his seat in 1979 which was a crushing blow and that could well have changed the landscape there were still a lot of sort of tough Tories in power and he was still out of step with many of them on all sorts of issues but when he did lose I remember Tory grandee saying to me when I said that's the end of an era he said oh good riddance and I thought no one who if you have a want to win in Scotland you've got to win the sorts of places that Teddy Taylor has been winning and not too many of your other people have been winning so I think it would have been very interesting to force a personality which would have pulled people behind he would have pulled the Tory Party towards a sort of populist attitude and I think. That could have made a big difference what was he like to deal with You mentioned the that he was very good with a court you always had something to hand and he had himself wrought but as a journalist what was he like to deal with when he was great to deal with because of the rent a court thing but also I remember one day and it really summed up Teddy to me I was sitting my office and co-captains on the phone rang and it was Teddy her orders to detail of your call and I want to talk to you but the Common Market and I said works fine to talk about it and as I listened and said nothing because you don't you just take a few notes and you get the tenor of what's being said and you certainly don't agree or disagree you just listen. Terry I think got slightly concerned about the fact that I wasn't saying anything and having started by saying I'm deeply what it meant to be concerned about the Common Market He said look this is not a to detail effect it's true. And at that point I dissolved laughter but it was typical of Teddy he spoke in that way he had a very dry wit So Dr Many people didn't recognize it as colonic I on Saturday Taylor who's died he defeated. 92 to 95 even eat one of the medium wave and on digital radio on b.b.c. Radio Scotland it's just after 9 o'clock you're listening to Good morning Scott them with their white fur in gold and broad coming up before 10 to reason May's Breck's it speech as she cleared the way for Britain leaving are put off indefinitely as Germany goes to the polls we examine the extraordinary political phenomenon that is anglo american and you are not a number are you why doesn't a peak series made half a century ago still have such a hold on the imagination a lot to come but no summary of the news the French president. Has called on Britain to give clear details about its negotiating position on brakes that he said he welcomed to these amaze offer in her speech in Florence yesterday to keep paying into the e.u. Budget during a 2 year transition period Mr Mike Ross said the issues of e.u. Citizens the exit bill and the Irish border question must be settled before talks could be held on trade the conservative m.p. Bernard Jenkin who campaigned to leave the e.u. Says he's not impressed by the French presence demands having made quite significant concessions in the speech the e.u. Welcomes and then once more really to listen to Emmanuel I just ask him how can we put money on the table when we don't know what the deal is how can we discuss the finer details of the Northern Ireland border should operate when the e.u. Won't even begin to discuss what the relationship is that they want between the u.k. And the e.u. . Britain's credit rating has been don't included because of the economic uncertainty caused by the brakes at negotiations Moody's one of the major ratings agencies believed the government's debt reduction plans were off course and that there was a strong likelihood public finances would become weaker u.k. Government says the research used is out of date economist Dr Linda u.s. Said the decision to downgrade seems to be political rather than economic if you look at the brakes in negotiations and the Treasury has already replied to say that this rating cut and happened before the Prime Minister's Florence speech yesterday Now others may disagree and say that the speech that was in chat wouldn't have been a game changer the b.b.c. Has established that nor major insurance company will reimburse Ryanair passengers for Lost hotel bookings car hire or other expenses after the airline cancelled their flights Ryanair is grounding more than 2000 flights over the next 6 weeks because of mistakes over allocating leave for pilots Elayne's offering refunds for tickets or alternative flights. And it has Grampian as offered cardiac patients treatment as far away as Newcastle amid local delays caused by staffing issues in May the health board said it was unable to meet the Scottish Government's target 12 week time skill for all patients to be given a plan subsidy Newcastle option is yet to be used but since July some Grampian patients have had their surgeries carried out played by Golden Jubilee National Hospital a spokesman for any tests Grampian said they are committed to ensuring patients are seen as quickly as possible occasionally offering the opportunity of surgery elsewhere. The 2 main parties in Germany will make their final appeals to voters literate before tomorrow's election the chancellor Angela Merkel and her min rival Martin Schultz will urge people not to support the anti migrant right wing candidates who have won support in the run up to the vote here so Berlin correspondent demean McGuinness according to the polls Anglo-American was center right c.d.u. Party has a strong king lead that means that angle Americal would actually be the next chancellor which would be incredible because it be a 4th term she's still very popular here in Germany partly because she seems a very stable candidate a very turbulent times of Brecht's it with Trump with various threats throughout the world so Germans really appreciate that sense of stability. Workers in Moscow have cut owed part of a monument to the Russian creator of the $47.00 assault rifle because a weapon depicted on the start 2 was actually a German designed firearm because the Coffs monument was opened this week to great fanfare by government officials but experts said a drawing on the base of the star to actually shoot a rifle used by the Nazis let's use Here's the sport with Kenny Crawford thank you Bill the former Rangers player Gordon Smith thinks their Frost McCrory starts against Celtic then the 1000 year old should be one of 3 center backs so he gets their pro-create support in such a demanding fixture just under 3 hours time and so the 1st old from Darby of the season kicks off I broke the venue at midday and Celtic captain Scott Brown is determined to silence the home crowd Premiership leader Celtic won 5 of the 6 meetings between the clubs last season and are 5 points clear of Rangers in the league as things stand later on at 3 o'clock in the top flight come on a plate and deede Ross County who steps unseen Johnston welcome Hamilton then at 4 o'clock it's Partick Thistle Versailles hearts today I think bonus point when for Glasgow Warriors at home to Munster in the pool 14 last night they've Rennie's Maina top of the table after collecting the 3710 victory making it 4 whens from 4 Scottish go from Mark warden says patience has been the key to his good performance so far at the Portugal masters these corporate man one shot the hay in the towel in with or you know but as you who's on 12 under water starts his thought draw and quarter past one to the end at the p.g.a. Tour's Tour Championship Paul Casey Justin Thomas and Webb Simpson share the lead at the halfway point more than 130 but no more travel with Phillies or there's can bridge those works continue this weekend the restrictions both ways to do expect delays and you bear this in mind if you use this trip to hitch Iraq for the match at 12 o'clock today a disruption on several ferries mainly comics Tarbert port of Adi ferry suspended for technical reasons the Malaga boys still cancelled. For the rest of the day because of the weather and the maliks small aisles currently suspended without If you on the 7th at mit that's b.b.c. Radio Scotland travel Thanks t.t. Here's the forecast many Clode enjoy today across the north sitting brighter and warmer for the majority quite a closely but dry day anyway unlikely to be confined to a few drizzly show hours across the higher temp just to typically peaking 17 but lifting to 20 on the sunny muddy course 7 minutes past 9 now European leaders have been reacting to the prime minister Three's a maze speech after she confirmed for the 1st time that she wants a transition period of a by 2 years after Brecht's it the French president Emmanuel Micron says Britain must provide more clarity about its negotiating position but last night the Tory m.p. Jacob Rhys Marg voice serious concerns that the prime minister was already offering concessions to the e.u. If you are current you would say that the prime minister has made a generous offer and has now put it to the or appearance to respond if you would unkind you would say there's been a series of concessions whilst the European Union has not made a single concession they want money we want trade and for us to be guaranteeing money which the speech practically dars so early on concerns me considerably Meanwhile Mr McCraw says the talks which are due to resume on Monday cannot move forward until this progress on 3 key issues including the border with Ireland will do Ted mint can tell us more. Well the speech was made yesterday Gordon that made in Florence in Italy talked about a transition period of about 2 years that during which access to the single market would continue along current terms in effect the very least still would change until after 2021 when it came to trade she said that she thought that both sides could do so much better than just adopting existing models that there really wasn't any need to impose tariffs where there aren't any now much more conciliatory from to resume a Yesterday we had to have often heard her talk Haven't we very stridently Breck's it means bricks in those kinds of terms this was a much more conciliatory speech talking of a comprehensive and ambitious new economic partnership between the u.k. And the e.u. In the long term and what sort of reaction has there been. Clarity really is the word of the moment the chief e.u. Negotiator Michel Barnier he's praised the constructive spirit saying there seemed to be a willingness to move forward but that did need to be greater clarity on a number of issues that was echoed by the French president Emmanuel macron Wells welcoming the offer to keep paying into the e.u. Budget during that transition period he said Britain has to clarify its stance on those 3 key issues that Brussels say are the sticking points that before they need to be sorted before any discussion can be held on trade those issues of e.u. Citizens the exit bill and of course the Irish border not just like the Europeans that the prime minister was trying to get on side she has a tough job to reunite those factions of her party doesn't she there remain as and the Breck city isn't having this transition period does seem to have steadied her own ship better reaction politically from Jeremy Corbyn that leader of the Labor Party saying the prime minister had clearly listened to labor and accepted the need to be this transition period the former you quickly do they Nigel Ferrars on the other hand saying the vision is that we leave the European Union but we do it in name only. Has this had any effect on the world of finance. Of course is not just the political world where all eyes are on the bricks it talks is it said the financial world has a huge impact on that and the ratings agency Moody's they've now downgraded Britain's long term credit rating by one level Now if you cast your mind back 4 and a half years ago that last happened in February 2013 the u.k. Lost the AAA grade held since 978 well Moody's has now downgraded Britain's debt one more notch says that decision is because of the economic uncertainty caused by the BRICs in negotiations and the likelihood that public finances are going to be weaker the government may hitting back saying they thought the assessment was out dated and wrong insisted and made substantial progress in reducing the deficit but one thing is for certain all eyes will be on these talks when they restart on Monday. Well I'm joined now by the Guardian columnist and the political commentator and editor of Scott was Bill Jemison Zoe are we any further forward in your view now I am sort of terrified by how little progress is being made here there's nothing in this speech that reason may couldn't have said the day after she became prime minister there's no there's no there's nothing of either concession or trenchant see or anything that she couldn't have said as soon as she was in charge so the very fact that she would say it and think it would be impactful is sort of petrifying she her I mean we have official confirmation which we didn't have before that there will be this 2 year transition period where you know this is there's some you know remember kids stars had this what 5 weeks ago 4 weeks ago so there's some lifting of Labour's stance which I guess is the only way to do it when your own party is so divided but there isn't really I mean you know it's one thing to say we cannot agree on the money until we know about the trade it's the only thing in our hand as the conservatives or some of the conservatives have been saying for the past 7 months but it's quite another thing to to basically give nothing give no clarity on anything well I wonder one of the fears of of bricks supporters will be that this could be the start of kicking the whole thing don't the road I mean it was interesting that Gina Miller the woman who took the court case in your paper The Guardian her reaction was that the reason the speech was that she thought breaks it might no not ever happen I mean. You know remain as would like to remain still that's a that's a fact people keep telling us to stop moaning and get on with it but the truth is that if you think it was a bad idea to start with there's very little in the execu. Of it to persuade you otherwise but actually it's it is did there's no scintilla of a strategy here you don't get a sense that to reason may is coming out with this speech in order to make something else easier down the line you don't get a sense that she's doing it in order to make it look impossible so that we don't have to leave after all you don't get a sense that she's doing it to placate her wing of her party you just get a sense of somebody completely suspended in kind of panic and indecision bill from your point of view was was it any more positive than the. I think there were 2 things that struck me about the speech for the 1st was the tone and I thought the thought was very conciliatory a bold attempt to try to break this deadlock this stagnation in the negotiations I think that has gone down well at Brussels but if you look at the content as though as though he points out it's pretty vacuous I noted that with several major concessions made with anything of course big problems from the from the Brussels and the Question Period extending to 2021 now it's 5 years after the referendum vote at that period we'll still have to abide by all the e.u. Regulations so the freedom of movement so we've got all the burdens of membership but without any of the privileges. She's promised what ups and what about its bills its rights what about Bill this this fear we sent me Nigel kharaj has been some of the Conservative Party seem to have as well that once you start this if it's put off for 2 years when I'm talking about 2021 we're only a year away from a a general election who knows what could have happened by then this could be part of maybe not a straightforward process of just staying in the opinion but watering it watering it down and who knows what will happen at the end of it. Absolutely correct. It's going to be a log slippery slope I fear. Being made of you know business and. Clarity but I've not sure if it does everything much for business confidence to be told that this period of transition. Is going to extend right through 2012 well a lot of persons would prefer something much up about I don't know if that's churchy of business because then main their main worry was the cliff edge right their main worry was that everything would be different and there would be no way of planning for what that difference would look like and that is a legitimate worry that we're in the middle of the negotiations nobody can say to the business community this will be in place but that wasn't off their backs it so if you can say to them at least for a period for your planning period during the negotiations things will remain the same that's incredibly beneficial to business but I dispute this idea that that reason may has in giving a transition period made a concession to the e.u. It's not their problem if we go off a cliff she's doing that for the nation and rightly but there's no reason for Europe to look at that as a as a carrot for them what about the politics of this so we do you do think that this will successfully send Boris Johnson and Michael Gove and their supporters into a prolonged period of silence Well apparently not apparently they're already divisions within the Conservative Party as a result of the speech. Which is of course the main problem the main the main reason why no progress has been made and we can't actually go to the e.u. With a hand is that there is that all the time that should have been spent negotiating has been is instead been spent on internal wrangling within the Conservative Party and it is extraordinary it's extraordinary to be shackled to this party as they fight to the death because none of them is. And to back down and. Specially when you've got a character like Boris Johnson who will choose a stance to suit his political ambitions there is no way of telling what kind of the final dominant character will be thinking Bill it is it is slightly extraordinary to tease always what isn't to to reason the event itself the fight to reason he goes to Florence I make some big points about Britain stands on breaks it a lot of people think hang on a minute hasn't David Davis been negotiating all this stuff for months haven't we got anywhere at all got very far I would also say that it's just a question of the entitled to push and when the Conservative Party though these are forget there's a wider picture here of. The British voting public which did vote last year to come out of the European Union many of them will be choking on the i.p.o. But we have not conceded to the European Union that we will pay I think 2020 1000000000 euros over the next 2 years whether any concessions at all having been given by Michel. 20000000000 may not be the end of it so I don't think that's going to go down very well atoll with the broader British public right we'll have a quick entry in the sweepstakes from both of you. Do you think BRICs it will actually happen. And I think it depends on know on how well the people who opposed the lights here on in because at the moment there's a huge sense that it's a catastrophe and we're all standing here watching but at some point the people who think they have to find a way to kind of politically iterate want a thing I think that's called hedging your bets. I think I'd like to optimistic with Zoe I was a of this I don't think the economy is quite good down the tubes as. Some might suggest we have a very good figures yesterday on the budget deficit much better than expected even the Guardian saying that Philip Howard would have a bit more wriggle room into that but who would who would appear to gaze at the got . Some very upbeat figures recently from c.p.i. Industrial trends surveys so somehow or another we are getting through this but it's a question now of a lot more specific about what sort of trade deal but the government u.k. Government is looking for it is ruled out the Canadian option is drooled out Norway but we're left kind of clueless as to what it is that the reason David Davis outgoing for rights he can only journalist for you are simply yes a nuance and they start talking about the public sector boring requirements though and thank you both very much Germany goes to the polls this weekend one of the ports for parties it seems lately the angle America will remain chancellor will look at her remarkable career and what she might do next in a minute but 1st to Berlin and correspondent demean McGuinness morning to demean good morning then how is it looking in terms of the state of the party's. Well as this quite rightly say Anglo American of the polls are to be believed looks that when the most votes that's her party would win the most votes in parliament that would mean she would remain chancellor for another 4 years which is in an incredible sign of assurance for her after 3 terms this would be her 4th term so her party looks strongest but what is unclear is what sort of government she would end up leading because she would not get a majority that means you have to cobble together a coalition and that's not necessarily going to be that easy because we have almost unprecedented number of parties entering the German parliament this time there would be 6 different parties 7 if you include angle Americal sister Bavarian party the c.s.u. And that means that actually hurt voter base has been really chipped away in particular by the arrival of a new anti migrant anti Islam party called the f.t. Or the Alternative for Germany so that means that although this election has been described as the dullest election campaign ever because Mrs Michaels you know she looks so so so sure in the polls what could get it things could get exciting after the election when we start trying to cobble together a coalition because the various different smaller parties that she could be relying on have very different views on Europe on the economy on migration and some of these parties going to find it very difficult to work together and one of the issues when it comes to campaigning one of the being one thinks of the migration crisis perhaps the economy even breaks. Appeared at all well actually having was probably more interesting to sort of say what hasn't appeared in the election campaign Bracks it hasn't really featured and that's mainly because for most German voters. There's a. Feeling that actually it's up to Britain and the European Union in Brussels to sort this out that's certainly the line of the government here so by. Lynn is very much of the opinion that actually this is between the commission and London. All German parties apart from the anti migrants a.f.d. Party support Anglo-American stance on this so the broad consensus in German mainstream politics that Michel Barnier is lying that should be no cherry picking that the single market is more important than trade with with Britain there is there is unanimous Afia feeling of support here in Germany so that means it's not a political issue that divides most parties and the other issue that hasn't really feet features interesting Lee is also migration Now as you know we've had more than one and a half 1000000 refugees and migrants coming to Germany over the past 2 and a half years the reason why it hasn't really been a big hot political topic between the mainstream parties is because over the past few years past 4 years in fact the center left s.p.d. And the center right c.d.u. Angle America's party have have run the government together so neither is in either party's interest to really make an issue on this because this migration crisis happened on their watch and the solutions that both parties are suggesting a pretty much the same namely to try and cram down on rejected asylum seekers deep or them but also to try and make good on Jim Germany's humanitarian record on accepting legitimate refugees it's a complicated long drawn out process which has no simple solutions the only party that has tried to make an issue of this is in fact the anti migrants they have Tea Party and they are catering to a number of voters who are nervous about this issue and that's why this party is set for the 1st time to enter Parliament could get double figures could get over 10 percent of the vote which would be a shock to many mainstream politicians but it won't tend to government and that's because this party is so controversial with some of its statements which are seen by many people here is anti minorities and even racist at times and their links to neo nazis. Roups So that means their power is limited but their influence certainly the Parliament if they get double percentage figures could be pretty big Ok doing McGuinness and Berlin thanks very much Saul buying an electoral earthquake Angela Merkel will be returned as chancellor for a 4th time she'll of low Germany and effectively the politics of Europe since 2005 what makes her tick I asked Constanza Stetson Miller senior fellow at the Brookings Institute and we began with the arrival of this is Judith paean in Chancellor calls reunification cabinet she was treated with condescension by her mentor then Chancellor Kohl he gave her a fair hand important job in his 1st reunification cabinet. And. People then started to become surprised at how purposeful she was how shrewd she was how intelligent What a fast worker she was and they were slightly by accounts cowed by her repetitive of comprehension and the occasional harshness of her style. And the moment when all of Germany understood what they were dealing with was the day that Angela Merkel when she was already general secretary of the c.d.u. Of the Conservative Party after meteoric rise over the years published a front page editorial in the Frankfurter Allgemeine a calling for him would cause resignation because of a party financing scandal and that was effectively indeed his political end so she could be ruthless how much of that was to do with her but and in the East as a sort of parson's daughter from there are we overplaying the I don't think we are there there is some disagreement about just how possible Nichelle. Nichols father was he famously went back to East Germany in the early 1950 s. Taking his family and his small daughter and go with him because he felt that his flock over there needed him. It's thought that he wasn't particularly communist but he also wasn't in the resistance but I'm going to was fiercely intelligent. By all accounts. A plus student and later on a very good physicist and in that kind of authoritarian communist regime if you had a purpose in life and if you felt diffident towards the regime itself you learned to cloak your purposefulness with bluntness. So she's By contrast with people like Blair and Clinton in those early years they were charmers and she was not home she managed to continue when they could I think that angle Markel found herself surrounded by people I suspect who she thought overrated themselves and their abilities particularly men. And Brits had that experience with Margaret Thatcher who I think also looked around at all the Tory toffs. And the British Tory party and thought God what a bunch of 2nd raters I'm just 2nd guessing this. And Merkel I think looked around at all these ambitious young men who had been operating in the deep dark shadow of the enormous Titanic figure of Helmut Kohl scrambling hoping to enter the line for succession and probably thought I'm as good as they are and her political path to power and in power for the 12 years that she's been in power until now is littered with the political corpses not the actual corpses of men who not just overrated themselves but under-rated her. A lot of criticism over her over the years has been she didn't do very much but when you look at the record I suspect history will see there were some very big decisions that she made and seemingly out of the blue on things like migration where she was effectively open the door and even on things and another things like Greece who is quite hard line on Greece. Would that be fair again to say that you know on a lot of issues she doesn't move quickly but when she does move as decisively. Let's take this apart she's certainly governed the country and she's governed her own party in fact. She is rightly credited with quite ruthlessly modernizing her conservative Christian Democrats who it has to be said badly needed some modernizing and following the example of Clinton and Blair you named earlier triangulated pushed the c.d.u. Into the political middle. With the consequence of squeezing out the center left Social Democrats and establishing her hold on power but also making some of the more ideological conservatives in her party very unhappy and arguably leaving an open flank a vacuum for the f.t. The extreme right wing party to flow into. Constanza stilts and a lot of the Brookings Institute know the end of last year following the breaks at the election of Donald Trump there was a feeling that populism particularly right wing populism could sweep Europe too but I'll turn it to for DOJ London Germany and fill those Peavey of sore far at least in Germany feel to Big through and then France Emmanuel Michaels or marsh movement chose the right wing from last year now so how did Michael do it and are we going to see newly invigorated centralist Franco German partnership ruling Europe Well Adam is former deputy editor in chief or false press and he's written a book on Michael's victory the French exception joins me know good morning good morning for us on the Paris. And typically Glee Glasgow said. Tell me what you think of Michael is he to sort of France 20 player. I think that Tony Blair is a politician that Emanuel macron is compared to most frequently and I think that is . It is justified to the extent that he represents a strain of center left politics. That is that's never really taken hold in in France in the way that it did in Britain if he did in the United States with with Bill Clinton so in many respects and how we his positioning on on these liberal on social issues he's a liberal on I can make issues. That something is familiar for for British voters something that's very new for French ones so that one of you contributor. To Margaret Thatcher a someone who would make people speak up listen and eventually she in this case or he would make up their mind. That's true and that's that's seen as as one of his his qualities I mean he's. You know he's a very despite his young age is a very experienced policymakers been involved in and passionate about about politics really even from from childhood and and I went through all of the the elite French universities and now which is really the finishing school for the French political elite. Because he has a lot of experience but I think one of his would seen as one of his qualities and some of the people I spoke to is that he's also somebody who's capable of saying you know what I what I don't know I really do want to know about so tell me about it and he'll sit and listen and read long briefing papers to to get up to speed on issues that he's not entirely comfortable. You see you mention disease and the one thing that many people nor But I'm even if you don't know enough of us politics is wife is so much older than her but also he's looked to lots of older people to sort of patrons in the personally. That's absolutely true and as I was writing the book it was it was remarkable he's almost a story of sort of how to turbo charge your your career and one of the ways he did that is that throughout his life he really even from his is sort of late teens with his with what was then his schoolteacher who came on to be his his came to become his wife Bridgette Michael but from that moment on he threw out the important times of his life he meets. Much older people businessmen or people are important in politics philosophy and he and philosophers as well and he each of them are sort of important for his his development his future development as a politician and he sort of brings each of them under his his charm and they then help propel him towards the position he's in now he's had luck though on his side as well as any. He certainly has and. I quote Machiavelli in the in the book and there was somebody that the Italian Roger a philosopher that studies is forced to learn he talks of. For fortune and virtue his sort of the idea of sort of luck luck and and surprise us all talents and there's no doubt that that matter Mike Ahlers as has benefited from from huge stretch of luck and fortune his 1st break in politics and then in the election campaign obviously earlier this year there were key moments when his opponents managed to rouse every describes in the book and trip over the shoe laces which are which which open the path up for him to or to claim the presidency I wonder you read then his intervention or his reaction to Season me speech in Florence yesterday he's been the 1st political leader in the us us to be covered on on this because he's he what he says he wants to give more clarity and saw in the negotiating position that's the 1st time that a political leader has broken cover behind the back if you like of the E.U.'s negotiators in the past have said what's up to the negotiators to do it no here's a politician do you think ultimately the whole breaks in negotiation will come down to he and perhaps angle Americal who holds the purse strings doing a political deal. I think certainly like so many issues that we're going to see in the in the years ahead if Angela Merkel is re-elected on Sunday which which looks extremely likely. Is that the Merkel partnership is going to be absolutely crucial I think it's going to be fascinating to see how much. I think in terms of his Micron's reaction to Teresa Mayes speech yesterday I think it underlines a couple of things one of them is that Emanuel Michael has a very big agenda a very full in-tray of things he wants to do. In the European Union he has a he's already taken a number of propositions and some of his more ambitious things about institutional reforms for the for the European Union he wants a much more integrated European Union he's a he's a federalist what he wants what he doesn't want he doesn't want BRICs it's monopolising talks in Brussels essentially he wants or it was a clean break he wants the process to be to go was as quickly as possible and I think that really explains some of his his comments yesterday about looking for more clarity I think the other thing that it that it underlines is that Michael's going to be an extremely hard bargain on the on bricks that he's described himself in the past as a as a hard director and I think there are there are a number of reasons to believe that that that's going to be the case Ok Thanks very much for joining us this morning Adam playwright who's the author of the French exception or book on a manual Michael disco does Storm Lee rise and risk It's 20 minutes to 10. 3 minutes to 23 minutes to 10 well done test. I'm amazed that I power I can read the clock this is Good Morning Scotland with Bill White and Gordon Brown the headline so far this morning the French president says the u.k. Still needs to give more details in several aspects of Breck said after 3 Zimmy speech yesterday China has announced it slashing its trade links with North Korea following Kim Jong un's latest nuclear test n.h.s. Grampian has offered cardiac patients treatment as far away as Newcastle and local amid local delays caused by staffing issues and he is canny with the last of the sport for the day thank you garden Celtic captain Scott Brown says say that aiming to silence the home support when they face Rangers at Ibrox later the old far much of the season kicks off a medic commentary on b.b.c. Radio Scotland it was no medium we've grown has a decade's experience of trying to keep Rangers fans quiet and that's what I tried everywhere were you go to. Go to. The in whatever go we always try and do that and we just try and play our own game says we press teams and we try and dominate the Bo pretty much every game Occleve the tried and the Champions League as well and sometimes that doesn't welcome to Talk. 19 year old defend the Ross McCrory is in line for a start for the hosts. Thanks Korn thanks for your input they're nice to hear from former Rangers player gardens Methinks he gets adequate support on the pitch well he did it to get an all star game is going on even the bottom in the past but to see that it came on and he did very well and the game really took him so I think that I'm not one of you I mean I think the office of fans like them but I think you need support a long straight up and I think you know if you've not got some of the way out is the not guilty Wallace another experienced player so it's pretty tough for him to command me and that's why I'm thinking that the better ring. Yes go with the center bikes and you're McCourty is one of them that was Gordon Smith or just after a cameo from Gordon Brewer later on at 3 o'clock in the top play Come on it played on the Ross County who steps and seen Johnson welcome how Morton then at 4 o'clock at Partick Thistle hearts also Scottish Cup Force drone day I'm head and don't tickle and often athletic against 3 the Rovers last night Spartan be Vale of with and 3 no rugby No And this is a sign of success for Glasgow Warriors players who again of going to church it was a credible was I would. Be to say yes I thought the $710.00 bonus point went over a month stuffer warders top of the pool 14 with 4 wins from 4 years head coach Dave Rennie He said we're going to be brutal We see we're going to try might displace a fortress and we'll lose lots of talk about months turn us 4 times last year and we thought we had a game plaintively played a price that made him uncomfortable and a saw I think we took a lot of boxes and it regard but you know we're only 4 weeks into it so I will give him a pat on the back can will be working how do you know Monday Scottish girl from Mark Wharton says patience has been the key to his good performance so far at the Portugal masters these go brave man as 11 under one shot off the lead and once you get to the weekend as well as is easier to trying to head yourself and try and force and make bodies and you know I thought I was very good to foster there's a pain patient and you know if I feel comfortable going for a fight go for half an hour then put a medal the green and which is tough to their own you see everyone making buddies but hopefully same attitude over the weekend stomach gets that Italian you know pertussis you leads and the Algarve on 12 under one starts to start going to quarter past 1 and finally at the p.g.a. Tour's Tour Championship Paul Casey Justin Thomas and Webb Simpson sure they'll eat at the halfway point that's always worked for me thanks Kelly. Mortified I should promise not to interrupt the reasons travel please do I would like to. See a few people talk to me and. There's going to bridge those works and in you this weekend so there are restrictions in both directions so do you expect delays no last weekend there were delays of up to half an hour so bear this in mind as a match on it I brought the Old Firm's on Iraq's at 12 o'clock kickoff to do business mind you use the asking bridge to get to Iraq's destruction to train services to because of engineering works there is replacement buses between Glasgow central level and on Bart and central Mongolian Partick So this could affect passengers again travelling to if you plan to get off the exhibition center and likewise the Clyde built festival is on in Glasgow harbor this weekend so people again would be getting off the exhibition center so that our buses replacing the trains today and buses replacing trains to between Glasgow Queen Street and Anniesland via midi hell so that will take longer and that's b.b.c. Radio Scotland travel it takes a village to raise a child so the saying goes in done deal a $1000000.00 pound scheme launched this month to harness a citywide mentoring network to support and encourage vulnerable young people including those who've had experience of the care system idea of breakthrough turn to use to give them the tools to beat the odds which can be stacked against them doing Sharp has been for any more than waving my homework what if what if you look in a kind of 1000000 done d. And the realities of homework are being brought home it's the 1st school in the city to be involved in the new scheme some of our young people that we have spoken to have said that it's that instability because some of them could maybe half 3 or 4 different killers and 3 or 4 different homes in a very short space of time the maintenance coming in is a constant just see my school is a constant opened their eyes to what they can do to be that supporting pair so that's the year just. To give them to me not every now and again Fiona Lowe the deputy head of Morgan Academy the school has a high proportion of looked after children although the project is aimed at a wider group too it's been inspired by a similar scheme in Glasgow and it was a visit there which convinced Fiona Lowe that one to one mentoring could be really valuable I spoke to 2 young people who had mentors and I merely just said to them so tell me about it and put deference has it made to you and the board say if it wasn't for the mentor the probably would be in school because they were coming to school night because their mentor had let them go up to them and had been supporting them had been pointing them in the right direction and they could see the benefits of actually attending classes and gain are sometimes young people just think well you know it's my kid or it's my peer not as a teacher put to the new but when someone else that not associated with school then definitely I think more credence to what they're saying. This project targets the 500 k. Or experienced in other vulnerable young people across the city secondary schools that fills a big number this we're sorting but small enough for us to be able to so or 500 so it's a small subset but every one of those one lives could be incredibly positive Likewise they could be quite destructive for them and those that they touch if they don't have that potential So every single one of our 500 is important but if we get this right then collectively that 500 should make quite a big difference for a city Ellis Watson executive chair of d.c. Thomson publishing is also chairman of breakthrough done d. The company supporting the project with mentors office space and other logistics finance for the next 3 years comes from the north with charitable trust and then depending on results the city council takes over for Alice Watson developing the project has a personal side to his 15 year old mother gave him up for adoption He's met her since and while his own life experiences have been positive it's made. Where that that's not the case for everyone I wanted to make sure that other people have the opportunities I had it sounds a bit holy The now it's not I was just well aware living in Scotland that we're quite a polarized cities of haves and have nots and I want other people to get those sort of positive role models that I had when I was growing up my mum funny enough now about the most positive role model going to my part of my life but had I stayed with you not on that brave thing I'm not sure I would've had those same chances so it's that sort of personal frame of reference that you have that I actually got lucky myself and I want to make sure that other people have that good fortune and lower proportion of looked after children and 2 water known as positive destinations all the cap has narrowed figures for school leavers in 201520164 instance so something like 5 percent going on to higher education as opposed to 40 percent of general school leavers Susan Duncan chief executive of breakthrough done d. Says they're hoping to change futures we need taxi drivers we need politicians we need policeman we need Next we need people who work in offices who work in building sites because these are the careers our young people are looking for and we very carefully profile them and profile young people from s 3 onwards and we try to find something that's going to find a spark in that relationship whether it's a common interest a Hopi whatever the connection is and we carefully much to look to the young person and then that mentor comes into school once a week every week for at least a year ideally 2 to meet their mentee for an hour a week and they basically go to relationship supporting relationship where that mentor listens they turn up their reliable so it's about providing that bridge. To get. Outside the city's Abertay University at lunchtime thoughts of young people around from all sorts of different backgrounds to come to my perspective mentored clear Brennan who is a curator and lecturer Why does she feel it's a volleyball thing to be involved in these on such air to jet to. At the moment it's seems that everybody should have the opportunity to be part of that journey that this is take and skinny and really to you know to think that you can maybe have some sort of life change an impact on someone else but for me you know if I think back to my youth in my career I've had so many mentors along the way maybe not in an official capacity you know but none of us able it it by ourselves we all need those relationships in that guidance and so I just hope that yeah that I could give that back and that I could care give the hand up that I've been given over the years as well and that report on breakthrough 20 from Jillian shop Well it's 50 years since this had our television screens. Broadcast on both sides of the Atlantic in September 1987 the prisoner remains one of the most drama series Patrick McGoohan plays a former Secret Agent known only as number 6 kidnapped and imprisoned in a coastal village he struggles with his unnamed captors on a weekly basis attempting to escape or fight their attempts to learn why he resigned in the something very strange already happening in the studio here lasting just 17 episodes the show's cast of eccentrics dream right plots and counter culture paranoia made it a must watch tale must watch telly at the time and its impact is still felt today but the show wasn't alone the mid sixty's was a proper patch for ingenious drama that remained household names the day Star Trek Mission Impossible The Man from Uncle and the Avengers all a man is joining the same period but where did this bust of creativity come from and why we still fascinated by a show like The Prisoner 50. Years on here to discuss this now is the broadcast and television historian Samir Ahmed and the Guardian critic Graeme virtue Simoneau one of the things that is possibly as strange as the prisoner is why we're still thinking about it 50 years later when I think it reveals how amazing it is that we are it doesn't matter when you discover it and I'm like a lot of people I only discovered it in the early ninety's when Channel 4 was repeating it but it has itself contained dream like reality so it in a way it's timeless even though you can pin it down to the mid sixty's but also it's full of as you hinted that moment in time the counter culture where people were conscious of being manipulated by advertising in their own governments and that sense of the brainwashing of the Cold War still was at the Manchurian Candidate and you. Know what it really kind of put it all together plus the budget and the artistic freedom the idea that the prisoner makes a Casablanca did not know when and how this series is going to end and you think of the control we have now and how you have to have everything mapped out it's that combination of ingredients a level of artistic trust and the other example I gave is Warner Brothers wanted a piece of the counterculture and they were commissioning films like performance and then was shocked by the results as indeed I think the commissioners of the prison Graham Potter Are you an unlikely hero really I mean he seems to have been a not entirely pleasant chap including in the way behaved on say well let's just say that he had a very clear artistic vision for the show I mean he was coming of Danger Man where he played a kind of James Bond style secret agent for years he was kind of fed up with that and wanted to do something different wanted to interrogate this fascination we have for spies and spy fiction and this is what you landed on and you know we talk about show runners today but patch me going he was the star he wrote a lot episodes he directed some episodes he produced it. I think if you if you watch it again now you might be surprised at how unlikable he is at the center of. The show I mean he he is a man under siege but he is extraordinarily techy and has no time for anyone in the village and it is a very very prickly performance but you know it feels quite modern in a way and. On you go in just about my do so right introduce my children to it because they loved it but my duty told me last night she said Just let us say Graeme you know something about him you know he didn't want to kiss and he won't give his religious views he never fired a gun which in some ways is interesting as the end to James Bond but the violence and sheer You remember that when someone in the prisoner he tended to really punch them people got injured. And there are those who say he was having a nervous breakdown on camera on the other hand I don't you excuse that that sense of anger is so real I brought on that he wrote the letter he wrote in his own nervous breakdown yet and I think the other film I compare a film I compare this to is privileged to be to what kids film made the same year with Paul Jones is all about the manipulation of pop music and the idea that you know we mass media was kind of hoodwinking us and I think we both have this real sense of anger and yet this stunningly beautiful to look at and that's again why it's still fascinates endlessly watchable now a fact that will be very familiar to those of us who work for the the balloon which is but perhaps the most famous thing about the program bubbling away in the sea was there because they could afford it and they offer you different ideas for what rover which is the kind of security in the village if you like Yeah I mean when it's interesting that when it was remade by m.c.a. In 2009 they couldn't really come up with a better idea you know they they changed everything else but they seem to quite like Rover and yeah and also if you ask people who watch it the thing that people watch it just kids they still terrifies them is that sort of rubber stretched over the face it's. It's again it's on the one hand has this massive budget on the other these old restrictions on it show the kind of creative. Power that we come up with something that actually ends up being better and the other thing about prison and that it really reminds me of is and the Avengers the t.v. Series which again was you know it's i.t.v. I think is a golden moment when they're doing really daring so and it takes the imagery of ordering Lucia like near the village and the event to have a nanny is pushing the best that we can of machine guns in them that you can't trust Englishness because it might be the other side I mean we didn't do that in the same way has anything else have gray in the same sort I mean the thing that occurs to me when I think about it is the 1st series of 26 back in 1990 it's all very odd it's all very new they're right to get as they go along so no one no one no one knows how it ends in fact some people would argue never dead Well I think it's interesting that we've just had the return of 20 peaks and you could draw a lot of parallels between these 2 shows I think particular that that dreamlike kind of waking nightmare a sense of the paranoia and you're just not sure of what's what's happening so yeah that would be a pretty mind bending double bill if you try to watch all 17 episodes of The Prisoner and then all Twin Peaks in one go the other thing about the impact of the prisoner Samir is of course by then there were 3 television channels and everybody sat down over every night and watched and watched the telly so you could have an impact in a way that would perhaps be almost impossible Well there's 2 other things about this is one it's Friday night t.v. You know is that the rescue suite right colleagues in later in that slot was play your cards right kind of entertainment so I think the audience is got more highbrow stuff and it was more maligned also I think there were any 3 commercial breaks on t.v. You can see by the way it's structured it's structured in 3 acts and of course I think the way that t.v. Commercial t.v. Now unless you're watching these and streaming networks. You know you just didn't have the impact of being completely submerged in this Technicolor lush world but perhaps you know you could now in the days of Netflix and Amazon be making something which has the power of the prisoner again you know you do you could ever make a sequel in the way that you did. I don't think you could stretch it on forever you have to just live in repeating the bubble of the 17 states growing Could there be something with a similar sort of similar sort of effect today or have we been shocked by new things as we're likely to get what I think a lot of the t.v. Creators they have already absorbs the prisoner and you know you see that reflected in their work so it would be very hard to come up with something as striking I would say maybe the early season of Mr robot that was another series where you had one creative voice behind it and there was a lot of paranoia in it and it was very strikingly shot so unfortunately just seem to go a little bit off the boil in season 2 so maybe just stick to one season we'll leave it there green virtue and similar Ahmed thank you both very much indeed for young people in recovery from cancer just finished tuna high for nearly 200000 mile ceiling really challenge and in the u.k. The Ellen MacArthur Cancer Trust is behind the adventure the yacht moon spree has just crossed the finish line in Lark's and at the helm was 22 year old Ryan Campbell who joins us now along with Tom Roberts who started as a young person in recovery and has know an adult help our morning to both ride him . High What was it like helming into larks this morning. At all unknowns. Words can't even explain. Tell me something about your journey not just on this special but. In your onus. Was diagnosed last 2 Asako month. When 3 year came with their. Guns. And just after a couple was approached by the trust. That 1st I was quite as. You know. Can see us. You know New Zealand. Publishes what. You have. So it was a what do you track you know so intimate and they don't all there it was just fantastic because there's there's nothing like oh it's just the perfect place for you get. Up on things and. Just. Come and see the field again. Very well off and we get in that sense of adventure. Is Tom Roberts there with you told me you're listening yeah. Yeah hi I just sent typical to you what Ryan's done in terms of increasing his confidence and so on. Absolutely definitely right in the front so I've been involved with a trust for about 8 years now and him and talk talk and talk again I'll come on trips and see the difference just a full day saving trip to make young people like Ryan and all those they've been through and through some horrific treatments and surgery and like you know. Because the u.s. Itself has been on this very long journey to not those most nearly But as you see each individual youngster is only there for 4 days is not long enough to to change that outlook Absolutely yeah I mean the relay nature of the void just as men everyone has contributed to this amazing achievement and I'm done that together but rather than absolutely the holidays as soon as people come on board there's a an incredible atmosphere that's great that the shared experiences and everyone's you know we got everyone feels like they've known each of the years in a very short amount of time because there's a lot of. Conversations that need to go. You know often because i Frogz in a similar mindset Yeah I can hear is that you can hear that and that by going to actually can hear the child going on Ryan if you know you made of you made friends that are going to stick with you do you think. Yes Fred friend says leaving the card somewhere like i want i know. It's not it's absolutely on the p.c. Everyone said oh don't like what they see their own limitations are things he thinks he said.

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