Twitter and at ali velshi at facebook. Com aj money. Youve been hearing a lot of noise about how obamacare hurts job creation. And today we got a new report from the Congressional Budget Office that would be used as fodder by republicans. Using for the Affordable Care act to get your vote this november. Democrats hope that it will go away by the time midterm Elections Come around. And thats why this deserves more explanation. So here goes, and you decide. Now, the cbo is nonpartisan. It advises congress. And when theres a piece of legislation, the cbo tells you what its going to be. Now, the cbo projects fewer workers in the labor force in 2017 with obamacare than if the law had never been passed. Lets be clear. The cbo projects that it will grow, but the growth will be less than it would have been without obamacare. Before the republicans start making too much hay with this, the reason why the cbo says it will be less workers, its not about laying off more employees, as some choose to obtain coverage, some of them might want to keep their income low to qualify for subsidies or medicaid. If that happens, the cbo projects that it will come down 1 . Equivalent to 2 million fulltime workers in 2017. And as that becomes complicated, that rises to 2 and a half million workers by 2024. The obamacare obviously doesnt want the president s signature law to be seen as a job killer, so the president s aids were quick to respond to the report. And mike has more from the white house. Reporter theres no question, ali, that the white house went into their version of defcon 5 when it came out. The chairman of the economic advisers, his basic argument is this. He disagrees with the methodology of the ceo, saying that the 2. 4 million jobs lost because of obamacare, thats the equivalent of 2. 5 million jobs, and they pointed that out. But the basic point is that people leaving the workforce as a result of the Affordable Care act are doing so because of their choice. Its all about the freedom, says the white house, and they draw the analogy between Social Security p if there were no Social Security, for example, there would be more 90yearolds in the work force, and there would be higher participation. Its not something that everybody necessarily wants. To the degree that the reduction in labor supply is volunteer and reflects the choice thats people are making, youre going to think about that very differently than if it was cutting back on jobs. Reporter so the argument from the white house, its all about the freedom and the choice, and thats what the 2. 5 million jobs are about. And fermen said the biggest concern, slowing the growth in the cost of healthcare. It has been happening in the last 3 and a half years, and that, they say, will lead to a stronger economy, which will lead to more jobs ultimately. Thank you very much, mike vikeerra thea the white house. She was et director of policy at the white house under president obama. And thank you for being with us. Thank you, ali. I made a promise to my viewers that we were going to separate the policy and get the facts, and i regret that, this is making my brain bleed. Lets get one thing out of the way. Were talking about a dollar value that the Congressional Office relates to jobs, and it doesnt matter that x number of jobs wont be eliminated or wont grow. Youre exactly right. Theyre projections as theyre called for the budget office. Want budget implications, and its not just the demand on jobs, but its exactly what you said. Its looking at the supply of labor, or as the white house put it, kind of whether or not People Choose to work or not. Does it seem strange to you, regardless of the numbers. Is, 2 million jobs between now and 2017, that people would comosen to work to keep their income low or medicare in. Youre right to react. But it seems strange. Something else added into this confusion, is that people might not work in a fulltime job because they might decide to take less hours or start a new business or do something different. So what were not 100 sure of, if youre not taking a fulltime job with benefits, are you doing Something Else that could be more productive. But potentially, more parttime, more freelance, more contract work. Its all a possibility. And something that i think has gone unnoticed, if you look deep into the Congressional Office report, which you and i have done, it states that the jobs that will get reduced, or at least the fewer hours, are going to be in jobs that have below average wages. So you know, we might be talking about a phenomenon where people are taking jobs that are not very well paid just to get benefits, but now they can get benefits, and maybe they can do Something Else that they can have higher wage earnings, so theres always that possibility. What fundamentally we have both looked at the report. And the difference is one of us understood it better, and that would be you. When designing obamacare, obviously the primary goal was not employment. But it was access to healthcare and coverage. And there was probably a secondary goal that was not achieved as well. And it was the cost of healthcare, but in theory, we should see costs decline, because america is a high cost place for healthcare. Buff the third goal would have been greater prosperity because of employment. And was there anything given to obamacare was supposed to create more jobs. Yes, youre absolutely right, but there are two forces around the job conversation with health reform. One was that we would see a productive Healthcare Work force, and in turn, that might have some effect on unemployment. And we might have more hospitals, but more primary care doctors, for example, and the second force, if we can find affordable ways to provide for healthcare, maybe you will see a growth in smaller businesses, small businesses, and growth in kind of what we have been calling the middle class for a long time, that we all know has been suffering. When you say productive, thats interesting. We know we have shortages of certain things, and a productive Healthcare System may mean that you have more people able to provide primary care that are not doctors, but we also know were short of doctors, but primarily, people bandi around the figure that healthcare in america costs twice as much as gdp in other countries. So if you want to reduce that cost, ultimately, it means reducing jobs, is that right . It does. We definitely think that part of the reduction numbers is the fact that we might not need as many specialists, and we might not need as many people that operate hospitals because we dont have as many hospital beds in this country, but i do want to point out, ali, that the Congressional Budget Office has been wrong on their numbers before. Todays news was that they revised their estimates on how many people would enroll in the Affordable Care act. So i would say to your viewers, stay tuned and well see how that plays out. Thank you. A couple of points out. The cbo report, the u. S. Deficit will fall sharply through 2014. This year, its projected to shrink to 514 billion. Or about 3 of the economy. That will narrow to 2. 6 of the economy next year, 2014. Thats not the detect, thats the deficit. The shortfall of what the government takes in and spends in the coming year. While the deficit has shrunk, it will shrink to 4 this year, and thats the highest since 2019 after which it will resume growing. The u. S. Senate voted to pass a farm bill today. Same bill won approval in the house of representatives last week, and it goes to president obama, expected to sign it into law on friday. The legislation was held up for more than a year because democrats in congress couldnt greet on cuts to food stamps. Up to 80 of the money in it goes to food stamps. In the end, both sides agreed to 8 billion in cuts over the next 10 year, and thats a lot less than the 40 billion that republicans have been demanded. What farmers get is subsidies but in a different form. It eliminates a fixed annual subsidy known as a direct payment paid to farmers even if they left their fields fallow. But instead, they have to report loonses on for crops before they collect money from the federal government. Farm subsidies are important to us all, because they affect the price we pay for foods and what markets. Coming up, a budget surplus, and extra cash and how they might spend it. And the new boss at microsoft, how he might make it relevant. Real reporting. This. Is what we do. America tonight, next only on Al Jazeera America. Start with one issue education. Gun control. The gap between rich and poor. Job creation. Climate change. Tax policy. The economy. Iran. Healthcare. Ad guests on all sides of the debate. This is a right we should all have. Its just the way it is. Theres something seriously wrong. Theres been acrimony. The conservative ideal. Its an urgent need. And a host willing to ask the tough questions how do you explain it to yourself . And youll get. The inside story ray suarez hosts inside story weekdays at 5 eastern only on Al Jazeera America heres a concrete sign that the economic deficit is real. Many of the states have extra cash, surpluses. This being america, not everyone agrees on what to do with the money. Mary snow reports the newfound money is good news for the states and the economy. Consider it a good problem. Among the states reporting a surplus is michoacigan with a billion in extra funds. It wasnt long ago that they were looking to make pay rom. Now the government is looking at stashing. Boom and bust is our lives. Increased tax revenues, improving economy and a good year on wall street in 2013 boosted state coffers. This is a good for the average person and finally therell be money going back into services that people care about. 43 states boosted germ funds spending. Education gains, particularly prekindergarten programs. Some economists say what is good for the states is good for the country. They are looking at Infrastructure Projects that have been shelved or six or seven years. All of those have multiplier effects. Theres caution. Aiming populationing, medicade costs. They dealt with the bullet wound from the recession. They need to think about longterm health and being careful about where they put the new money. With extra money debate across the country about what to do with it. So here is the upshot of what you heard from mary snow. In 2014, for the first time in four years, states will no longer drag on the economic growth. Instead, theyll contribute to it. Joining us from San Francisco to explain more of what is meant a senior director of the finance team. Thank you for being with us. What does this mean for the viewer. If the government is sort of money, its passed to another, you lose services or taxes go up. Is this actual real growth or is this just states making up for what they have lost in past years . Well, its true that its a little unclear at this time. The states are definitely in a better position than they were in in recent years. But a lot of it, as your setup peace referred to, it stems from the fact that the stock market reached record levels by the end of 2013. The states rely on personal income taxes and a big component to that is capital gains. So as we go forward, even though the states are coming into the new year in a better position, you know, we are watching closely to see what they do with the with the stronger fingerprints, that they have finances that they have now, and what whether the financial position will remain as strong as it is now, going forward. That was my other question. Most of these games, the fact that states are doing better, people in the states are earning more money, is that where it comes from . It comes back to the personnel income tax improvements. Now that the states are it in a position where they are balanced budgets. They are no longer in a position where they have to make cuts or increase taxes. Those actions are what really contributed to a negative drag on the National Economy in the earlier years that you referred to. Now that they dont have to do that. We think they may add back to employed levels and more spending for education, targeted investments. Theyll want to be careful. When a state had to cut back on service, it laid off people. Often they are recipients of state money. Is there going to be a strategic way to look at how they apply this money. Are they going to be careful about hiring people back, or do you think this will result in mire employment . I think they will be careful. Most of the states have ratings in the higher categories. Most are approaching the situation cautionly. If you a koushously. If you adjust for inflation, they havent returned to spending levels. Theyll be cautious about that and theyll continue to do that. Pressures are increasing. Theres a lot more political pressure to add back to services cut in recent years. Some people are used to it. The sequiming pool Swimming Pool is not opened as much, garbage is not collected. Some state governors may say, they didnt miss it that much, maybe well hold off. In some places the governors are proposing to give the money back to taxpayers by proposing tax cuts. In other cases the states are saying, look at it, easy come, easy go. Its better now, we could be back in the tough position if we dont manage the situation carefully. Great conversation. A senior director in u. S. Public finance at standard and poors. Coming up, the new boss at microsoft has his work cut out for him. I talk to a tech expert that says he has the right stuff, but questions whether anyone can rebot the company and make it better again. The stream is uniquely interactive television. Microsoft today confirmed Sacha Nadella will replace Steve Ballmer as ceo. And this opens a new door for the aging technology company. Nadella is the third ceo. He follows Steve Ballmer and bill gates who is also retiring, serving as a technology adviser. Many believe that microsoft has chosen the right person to lead it into the future. And nice to see you. They looked at malali, ford. And big names in there, and get used to saying the name. Satyad thatella. Most people didnt know Steve Ballmer and didnt care. What has this guy got . Hes been an insider for a long time. He knows how the culture works and he knows the company. And he gets how software is important. And he gets that mobile is important, which is also good. And i think that thats something that we mixed a little bit with baumer. Im in a tiff with what some of my coworkers say when i wanted to do microsoft. If i said other companies, i think that people would be enthused. And were not even enthused about microsoft. Should we be enthused . This is a big Important Company. Microsoft is an Important Company, and i dont think theyre irrelevant yet. Ill talk to you in the next five years, and well see where they are, but theyre very important. And they still innovate. Burr the problem is, they have not been able to execute on a lot of the things that they talk about. For years in the technology realm, when you go to technology conferences, they would be showing off cool stuff. And they never brought the products to market. And you had google or apple coming out with all of this stuff, and it was like what happened to microsoft . And they had a problem executing. They came out with the zoom, and it disappeared. And they came out with bing, which microsoft will fell you is better than google and people wont tell you you binged it. And this guy, nadella has no experience on that front. And does microsoft have to be a consumer facing company like apple is . Thats a good question, and it depends on where they want to go. We talked about it before we started. Cisco systems is an Important Company, is its not consumer facing, and theres money to be made, but thats the real identity crisis that microsoft has. Do they want to do that . It sounded like today, from what he was saying, that yes, there should be more of a blending between zoomer business. For a long time, microsoft is a very Important Company to businesses. Pretty much all of the software is microsoft software, but that business could be drying up. And really, a lot of whats happening and what is innovative is being propelled by consumers. Its consumers in mobile who are pushing things forward with devices and what theyre doing, and even when you look at the connected home, for example, and the connected everything, he has talked about that, and a lot of that is consumer faced. Maggie, good to see you, maggie reardon, senior writer, and stay tuned about microsoft. Aljazeera kicked off the discussion about the middle class, and you helped with that discussion. Deborah owens tweeted. Really glad youre focusing on the middle class. Pamela lane said today ive been asking you on social media to help us shape our future coverage on the middle class, and i want to know what issues you want real money to explore. Michael wants us to talk about Social Security and what it might look like in 20 years, barney asked us to talk about education, and something that we started to do in our rebuilding the green section on monday. And about the station on the u. S. Me. Thats our show today, and hope you join us tomorrow. Im ali velshi. Latest news online at aljazeera. Com. Imagination to come up with a more brutal execution. Also tonight, end of the line. The keystone pipeline. Enough already. When do we stop moving, when do we stop and turn and fight . These industries are cropping up all over the country, all over the world
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