Welcome to inside story. Im ray suarez. For a long time we know those that spend time behind bars are likely to get in trouble again. Advocates ask if we are serious about lowing recidivism rates, should we force people to disclose history at the front door of getting work. Crime rates are lower, inmate populations huge, creating conditions for a most to ban the box. Seattle. Reporter here is a peak inside one of the washington states largest turn Key Manufacturers in aerospace. Take a deeper look past the Assembly Lines of sheet metal and youll find former convict working side by side with original employees. There is a place for justice, we need a place for redemption as explains. This is a chance for change. Its been that way for 50 years. Lee was one of the most vocal advocates pushing for a ban the box ordinances. While they hire a large personnel of people that it trains, too many had a difficult time getting else. Oftentimes if you check the box, the employer takes the trash. They dont look at it. So we can tell our clients that the employer is not going to put your application in the trash, theyll look at it. Then our client has hope that theyll have the opportunity to tell the story and get the job. Work. Dick tells you its not been that simple. Is that an automatic entry that youll get the job . No. You still have to be qualified and demonstrate that you are the best candidate. It is designed to get the foot in the door so you have a chance to consider it. Conviction career, a non profit and here excons are taught what to do and say after they get a call for an interview. Thats when an employer can and will ask about a criminal record. You can tell if someone is likely to do the job. Most are looking at parliamentary issues. How do you fit in, will i need to monitor everything that you do, will you work independently, will you get along with everyone or cause trouble. We want people to demonstrate theyll be a great fit. The city of seatal cant say if more seattle cant say if more exconvicts have had more success. Investigators will do this by searching through job application forms and fielding complaints. Marquez taylor is a success story. He served time at 18 for robbery. Two years ago he got a job with year up, a Community Resource programme, after being denied for more than 100 jobs. When you fill out so many job application, and hear the same thing, it makes you want to turn back to a life of recidivism. Make you want to commit creams. He is still with year up, and believes the ban the box ordnants played a key role. It cost us 30 grand a year for someone to be ipp gars rated, and that doesnt include of cost of catching, and holding someone. It cuts recidivism by half. A similar bill failed in the washington legislature. Lee is not deterred. By having the law there may be an employer who says its the law, i guess well comply, and theyll change. The road to redemption starts with the opportunity to work. Joining me now from montgomery alabama, ms mitts and ms ricketts. After their time they cofounded a group designed to help people reentering the workforce. A lot of people probably dont realise how hard it is wowed ban the box, to reenter. Tell us your own story, was it community . Community. Yes, it was hard, almost impossible to get a job. When i applied. Theyd listen to me talk, then hire me and tell me they couldnt keep me because i had been incarcerated. Was lying an option . Yes, i could have done that, but i felt like i didnt answer the box. I said i would explain in person, but never got a chance to explain in person, because they knew. Melinda, how about you, did you find it diff to be honest about what you had been through. Yes, i did. When i first got out i ploied for a Training Programme at an automotive manufacturer and i went through the interview process, and they asked me where i had been, i was hon. They closed the interview down and total me thank you for applying, but we cape use you. Did you start the business because it was hard to get a job any other way . Why we start the business, we had to work. Prison. We had to eat, we had to clothe ourselves. We started the business to take care of ourselves. As it grew we wanted to give it back to the community and those coming behind us, giving them an opportunity to work. I want to assume that you dont have the box on your employment applications when rest. No, we do not. What do you want to know . I dont want to do anything, other than are they a hard worker, do they want to maintain employment and make a better place for themselves in society, because if they are ready to maining the change, we are ready to give ready to make the change, we are ready to give them employment. Are there just things about the work life that you are no longer as familiar with showing up on time. Getting yourself from place to place, because for years youve been told where to be, and when to be there. Yes, thats very debilitating for an individual. When i got out it was like i was afraid to go too far from my dwelling because i was taut to stay close to the building, not to what happeneder off. It made it very, very hard. Technology stands still inside the prison walls. When you get out and the technology evolves. You dont know what a kiosk is to ny for a job. It makes it difficult. It is mind boggling, thats the reason that we give life skills in training to help these people. To get the social security, use a cellphone, laptop, computers. Thats why we do this. If you are a home opener and hiring a cut above to put in a laup, do your hedges, redo the backyard, would you want to know if the men and women have been convicted for breaking and entering, convicted property . No. As a home owner, as long as you maintain my yard the way that we are under contract to do, i dont have a problem with you as a company. No one asked who are the people. Can i be sure if everything is going to be okay if i hire you . No, because myself and juanita are always there. If they have a problem, and its never a problem with our employees, but if they have a certain way they want us to do their hedges or whatever, they i is there a difference in work product, reliability, punctuality, honesty and willingness to put in a days work between those you higher that are not exoffenders and those that are. Im glad you asked that, yes theres a difference, exoffenders have to prove themselves, being late is not an possession. Its not proing that you want the job. Theres someone on line wanting the job. I dont play games with my people. I teach them well, how to perform their duties and expect them to carry out the task. Can people who come to work for you get trapped because you are willing to take them on, but then the next place they go after making a successful reentry, have got a couple of years under their belt. The next place still has the box and still will ask if theyve been convicted of a crime. I dont believe its trapped. If they dont ban the box theyll have to answer the question. If theyve got a reference ive worked for this person for out. Im applying to your company, will you give me app opportunity, we geoff letters of references to people that worked hard and do what they are supposed to do. It makes it easier if you have worked for someone, and you have a proven record. The majority of team do not want to reoffend. But without a job or a place to live or an acceptance into society, theres nothing to prevent them reoffending. Its the only way they can five. Has it been a bridge into other employment for people coming on to the streets . Yes, it has. First we were in huntsville, and now we have moved to montgomery, because we are opening a nonprofit at the montgomery. All the workers that did not want to move with us, we gave them letters of reference, and they all have employment with loan care companies, locally in huntsville. Now that we are in montgomery we are running a nonprofit. Founders and owners of a cut above themselves lawn service and landscaping join me from mont gomer i alabama thank you for sharing your soreies. The box made it tough. So you can see why they favour beening the box. Is that a one size fit all solution. Are there certain employers, service, where the customer would want to know if a wokker was incarcerated. Well hash that out on employers and employment law. Its snds. Its inside story. Tonight on nd, we are inside story, we are talking about banning the box, allowing convicts not to disclose their trouble with the law by ticking that bomb. I am joined by a that box. Im joined by a couple of guests. If we banned the box, would this allow exoffenders to permanently put that conviction into the memory hole, or just take it off the opening encounter, the first threshold meeting with a prospective employer. Rite, you know, i think what you are referring to is what is a misunderstanding. When people here ban the box, they are thinking i can never find out information about a conviction history. Its not the case. Its delaying the inquiry until later. The reason its important is because it gives job applicants a real fupt opportunity to show they are qualified so an employer can look at a person. Thats what this is about. Do we know. Is there any way to know whether that one thing, making it a second tier question, rather than a first tier one changes the outcome when n exoffender gets a job. Absolutely. It has taken off. There are 16 states, and over 100 cities and counties that had a policy in pleas. We sn see from evidence that it works. North carolina, there the coalition for social justice worked with the city and county and found numbers increased. That is good for the local community and economy. During the day your members probably interviewed thousands. Where does that fit . A persons record, in the range of things you want to know about job. It depends on the business and the industry. Ban the box policies are not good policies, because its the one size fits all. In certain businesses youll want to know the situation sooner. Ill give you the situation with the contractor, you are hiring a sheet rocker, you are sending someone into a home. Your business is on the line. If that sheet rocker goes in and steels something, i think you would want to know that sooner rather than later and have a candid conversation. In the knew of your members, this is a legitimate inquiry about someones pass. It is. Small businesses should have the same right to ask that question on that application that we want league. At a time when theres a lot of people unemployed and underemployed. Does it mean that youll go to the bottom of the pile . Absolutely not. I have talked with Business Owners willing to give conflicts, felons a second chance, because they may have had issues with the law. Your first two guests were admirable as to i love to see entrepreneurial success. There are members i represent in the same boat. They are willing to give the individuals a second chance. In Certain Industries and businesses, you need to be careful. If you run a charity, day care those employers need to know sooner, look at the job application and know its about. How about that . Well, a couple of things there. I want to point out that this is a problem that is tremendous. We have an estimated 70 Million People with an arrest or conviction record across the country. Thats what the National Employment law project estimated. We need to join toot about the problem. Is cant just be still rights, labour organizations, we need businesses come to the fore, i have seen small Business Owners point out in other states across the country saying small Business Owners support ban the box too, its the right thing to do for their community. They understand if we have an economy that works for everyone, people sentenced to a life sentence of joblessness, it is not good for anyone, small or big businesses. Thank you both how do you balance giving people who made a mistake with the misgivings of those who say a history of arrest and conviction shouldnt be hidden from an employers view. Banning the box tonights inside story. Welcome back to inside story. We are debating banning the box on employment, a box forcing job seekers to reveal past convictions or incarcerations. Melinda and Michelle Rodriguez are still with us. Crimes plot out on a broad continuum, a yesno gisent give you a chance to doesnt give you a chance to plot out that it may not be that scary. You are right. That is why a good job application will have a yesno, but room for an explanation. You know, what was the crime, when did it occur. When i talk with Business Owners i reiterate how important it is to make individualized assessments. You shut not discount someone checking off i have a convictio conviction. What is the crime . A lot of Business Owners like to have that conversation. Chance. They want to look the individual in the eye. Before the break, it was pointed out how many tens of millions have this problem. This is not just a recidivism lowering social welfare project. This is something with severe economic consequences. If the futures of tens of millions of people are hindered. I appreciate that. But to put this in the back of small Business Owners is asking too much. The candidates that comes with a one size fits all, and the liability associate with it. Some. Of the ban box policies gives a discrimination lawsuit right unless the Business Owner can explain why they decide not to hire the individual. I cant understand how a business loner can prevail, to say nothing of the defense loss. Theres liability concerns. Is the burden on your organization and organizations like it to show it work, to show the success rate is good enough to pass the sniff test of an organization like elizabeths . Fortunately, we dont have to be in that position. We can see what is tried and tested across the country. The fact of the matter is the policy has been in place for years. Ill name hawaii. It had a policy in place since 1998 and it applied to employers. What we see are benefit. The fear tactics that therell be litigation, this is on the back of businesses and they cant handle it, it hasnt panned out. Businesses have been able to make this work. We saw chambers of commerce come on board with this because its the right thing too do with business and all of our economy. Are we at a point where we are prepared and look at the treatment of sex offenders, to punish people after we are done punishing them. Right. You point out, i think, a key point here, and that is we cant punish people for the rest of their lives. It makes no sense to take individuals who are ready, willing to work, qualified people for the job, and make sure they cant have the opportunity. Theres one research that is an important one to keep in mind. A study showed in 2008, 5765 billion in losses to the economy was due to the poor job prospects of people with records. Thats something we all have o contend with. We have little time left. I want to give it one more shot. Is there a way short of a mandate that the arguments can Work Together and find a way that is palatable for members to start. We think its important, and for lawmakers to understand that hiring is different. Its the business opener you are asking to delay and review. Thank you both for joining us for inside story. Ill be back with final thoughts on crime rates, work and human nature. If you have an opinion about the topic or a story been banning the box that youd like us to share, share your thoughts. Follow me or keep in touch with luis suarez. Hist facebook. Tell us about your own experience, wed love to hear it. When youre on hold, your business is on hold. Thats why comcast business doesnt leave you there. When you call, a Small Business expert will answer you in about 30 seconds. No annoying hold music. Just a real person, real fast. Whenever you need them. So your business can get back to business. Sounds like my rides ready. Dont get stuck on hold. Reach an expert fast. Comcast business. Built for business. To discover the best shows friends together and movies with xfinitys winter watchlist. 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