Transcripts For ALJAZAM Inside Story 20131123

Sweeping reform tied up in one big package is not going to happen. With only eight days left on the legislative calendar before congress breaks for the holidays this issue moves until 2014 an election year. On this edition of inside story well dig into the immigration issue in detail, the dueling goals and legislative strategies. But first this background. Immigration reform dead . Absolutely not. Ive made clear going back to the day after the last election in 2012 that it was time for congress to deal with this iss issue. Reporter House Speaker john boehner spoke optimistically about the issue of Immigration Reform thursday, however he didnt offer a deadline. I was encouraged that the president said he wouldnt stand in the way of a stepbystep Immigration Reform. As you know thats the approach the House Republicans have tak taken. There are people who are skeptical of big comprehensive bills. Quite frankly, they should be. The only way to make sure that reform works this time is to address these complicated issues one step at a time. Reporter boehners stateme statements were spurred by president obama commenting on the reform broken in separate bills as long as it contains certain elements. Theyre suspicious of comprehensive bills, you know what, if they want to chop it into five pieces, as long as five pieces get done, i dont care what it looks like as long as its delivering on those core values that we talk about. What we dont want to do is carve out one piece of it, lets say agriculture jobs, which are important, but is easier, frankly, or the highskilled jobs that many in your audience would immediately want to do. But leave behind some of the tougher stuff that still needs to get done. Reporter this renewed effort for Immigration Reform comes nearly five months after the Senate Passed a bipartisan comprehensive bill called the Border Security Economic Opportunity and immigration modern ization act. It is now in the hands of the house. The Senate Version includes Border Security, it doubles the size of Border Control with the mandatory force. A path to citizenship for millions of undocumented immigrants, and worker visas, more high tech and lowskilled worker visas requires a workplace verification system for employers. And Law Enforcement detailing protections for workers, refugee provisions and what happens if an immigrant breaks the law. Chanting we want reform ] democrats have put out their own version of reform. Only four republicans support it. The challenge with this bill is that there is no deadline. There is no fiscal cliff. There is no debt ceiling day that we run out, not like the farm bill where milk price gas through th prices gothrough the roof next. Reporter paralleling its drafting process to the Affordable Care act. We dont want a repeat of whats going on now with obamacare. That bill constructed as it is with the senate lastminute ditch effort to get it across the finish line. I think there is a lot that could be done, a lot better in that bill. Reporter but on the whole key limits House Republicans say they absolutely want to pass include Border Security, worker i. D. Verification, guest worker and agriculture work programs. The immigration debate moves t to 2014, an election year. Joining us now to discuss the path forward for Immigration Reform, executive director of National Immigration forum, a group that advocates for Immigration Reform. And the director of the center of the immigration studies, and the director of Civic Engagement and immigration at the International Council of la ra la raza, and clarisa, it wasnt that long ago, about a year ago when coming out, bursting out the results of the last election people are saying this is going to get done. All kinds of inexpected people who would oppose any kind of reform was saying, yes, something is going to get done. Its a year later, what happened . I think that was a pretty seismic shift, and there were two political moments in 2012. Most of us focused on the november moment, which is when republicans and conservatives started weighing in on the need for Immigration Reform. But it was proceeded in july when democrats heeded that call as well in the administration finally moved forward doing relief for youth who are undocumented. Two very important political moments. Obviously the forces for reform are diverse and growing. It takes a while to get people to the promise land, and right now i think that we have to remember that theres a whole other year where the ticket to a solution that the senate has given through path through immigration through chamber, we have another year to make sure we get through the dance and the finish line. Its a year later, and the landscape looks different. Were you worried coming out of november, listening to people who you professly thought of as allies going a little wobbly at the knees . There were not that many allies going wobbly. After the election those people on the right who are always for increased immigration and amnesty using it as an excuse to panic or stampede those who were skeptical. But the basic problem, the core political problem remains, and thats why nothing has happened this year. And that is a complete lack of trust that the enforcement promises that are being made will actually be honored. In other words, that if we legalize the Illegal Immigrants who are here now, that Going Forward there will be real enforcement that wont result in another 11 million Illegal Immigrants being here. The Public Opinion data that organizations tout in showing Popular Support or resignation for legalizing Illegal Immigrants are real, but theyre premised on the idea that we wont have to do this again. And no one believes the enforcement promises being made will be honored. We saw this in 1986 where the same promise was made, and it wasnt kept, and this is why essentially Congress Needs and administration need to close that trust gap. Unfortunately what the president has been doing is widening that trust gap even more than before. Ali, when the new congress came to washington, didnt it look like the stars were aligned in a new way . Can you imagine being where we are today in november . Absolutely. We passed the senate bill. The house has five bills that have gone through committee. There is an incredible amount of momentum in the house of representatives to move reform, and as clarisa said, we have another entire year to move it through the house, through the committee an to the president s desk. Yes, would we have liked this process all tied up with a bow, sure. But realistically where we are right now is a very good position. When you look across the country what is difference is that its not only the latino, the asian, the liberal community, but its conservatives at the local level who are saying, now, we want Immigration Reform because its important to our faith, our local economy, our local security. The debate is fundamentally different from what weve seen in the past. As you say the senate bill has passed. The house bills contain things that to your movement and others of your allies. Has the moment been lost for getting a lot of what you went into battle for . This really rests on the shoulders of Speaker Boehner. Is he serious about solving this problem . He said so the week after the election. He said so earlier this week that he wants to get this done. In order for Speaker Boehner to pass this bill, even if its the worst bill that you can imagine he still wouldnt be abled to to do it because there is a part of his can you success which is the donothing a cuss. They dont want to see any immigration bill passed period. If Speaker Boehner is serious about getting anything done, he will have to bring in a number of republicans and democrats to do that. And theyre working hard on that. Later in the program well hear from the leader in the campaign for Immigration Reform, and well be back with our studio guests in just a moment. This is inside story. While you were asleep, news was happening. Here are the stories were following. Find out what happened and what to expect. International outrage. A day of political posturing. Every morning from 5 to 9am Al Jazeera America brings you more us and global news than any other American News channel. Tell us exactly what is behind this story. From more sources around the world. The situation has intensified here at the border. Start every morning, every day, 5am to 9 eastern with Al Jazeera America. Welcome back to inside story. Im ray suarez. On this edition of our program were talking about Immigration Reform and the dueling legislative approaches and goals on the issue. Still with us, our guests, i want to turn to mark and clarisa at this point and talk about spending the year changing perhaps what you would accept when this process is over. One way or another. Is there a different spot at which you are ready to countenance ending up . The question is what are the results supposed to be, and the result for the pro amnesty side is legalizing the illegal population. Thats the goal and Everything Else is designed to serve that. For my purposes the goal, the end point is make sure that were not in this situation again. At which point we can then discuss possible options for legalization, but thats kind of a follow up thing. The goal is to have in place the kinds of enforcement systems like Something Like everify who make sure that their new employees are not lying when theyre hired. And following see i is visas when theyve expired. Many came in legally wit that way. Cl larissa is this become something that you would be willing to accept at the end of the process . I think its an incredible year to make it clear what the country needs and how we move to get there. What the country needs is a functioning Legal Immigration with smart enforcement in a way to address the population that is currently documented as a result of having a legal u immigration system that has not worked. We need to peel away at those excuses that prevent us from getting where we need to go. We cannot spend another 20 years saying we cannot fix our Legal Immigration system because we need to do enforcement first. Guess what, these things work together. Right now the Legal Immigration system is actually fueling the undocumented population. It sounds like just a slightly different way of saying what mark said earlier, that we dont want to end up with 11 Million People out of status again. You absolutely. Weve been doing enforcement. Weve been doing that for 20 years. That alone has not worked. The proposal here, luckily this is the biggest irony is this is one of the few issues where the economic, the political, and the moral imperatives are completely aligned. We have support from across the political spectrum. Every section is represented in forum voices. We feel these issues deeply, personally, but the issue that america has been clamoring for. Have we gotten the policy right . Everyone has concentrated on the politics, but can we move forward o on the politics before we have common wisdom on the policies. I think the policies are there. The policies put forward in 2006 and 2007 and what we have now, the politics have had to change. We need to do more enforcement. The reality is we have a current immigration system that is enforcement only. Thats not serving anybodys needs nor the countries. We are he spending millions of dollars on the enforcement system. At some point the members in congress have to say, this is not a great idea. The the policies are there, and the politics are getting there. Can you meet marks concerns, and some day were going to be creating lots of jobs again. One of the reasons why were at net zero right now is because there is anemic job growth in this country. Which is why this is the moment to fix it. Not when we have the pull factors from the economy requiring workers, but right now where that is not the case. Again, we can create a lot of excuses in about why this is not the right time, this, that, or the other 20 years of doing what mark says. First of all our enforcement is laughbly inadequate. Just the Border Patrol is smaller than the new york police department. Thats just one part of it. This is the time to put in place the kind of enforcement infrastructure we need because we now have 20 million americans who are looking for a fulltime job and cant have one. The idea that corporations that are pushing this, really the force behind this are saying we have a labor shortage, they dont have enough workers does not stand up to the smell test. Its already here. There are 13 months left in the congress. Let me hear briefly whether this has a shot before this congress is over . Absolutely. Absolutely. There is a possibility, but its not going to happen, no. Guests . Its great to see you all. Thank you. Thank you, ray. Were going to take a short break. When we come back the view from the hill with congressman gutierrez this is inside story. The stream is uniquely interactive television. In fact, we depend on you, your ideas, your concerns. All these folks are making a whole lot of money. You are one of the voices of this show. I think youve offended everyone with that kathy. Hold on, theres some room to offend people, im here. We have a right to know whats in our food and monsanto do not have the right to hide it from us. So join the conversation and make it your own. Watch the stream. And join the conversation online ajamstream. And now a techknow minute. Every sunday night, Al Jazeera America presents. Eye opening films from the worlds top documetary directors. Tomorrow, theres probably about a hundred People Living in the extreme tiny houses. Is going small part of a big movement . Part of the reason for moving into a tiny house is to get rid of all this stuff. What you gain by having less. Lets think about giving up mcmasions. A tiny american dream, Al Jazeera America presents. Tiny a story about living small premiers tomorrow 9 eastern. Welcome back to inside story. One of the house leaders in the campaign for Immigration Reform is Luis Gutierrez. As Immigration Reform has dimmed he has refused to give up on an immigration rewrite during this congress. The session does not end until january 2, 2015. We have another 13 months and a few days to get it done. Im still very confident that well get it done. The speaker said there was no time on the agenda. A couple of hundred kids, a couple of hundred young adults, immigrants, dreamers, as theyre called, showed up at his residents and amazingly today hes saying its not dead. There is still a path forward on comprehensive Immigration Reform. The only one who are going to call an end to this are the very people fighting for it, and guess what, weve got a lot of energy, spirit and determination. This is far from over. Eric cantor is circulating a version of the bill that would start to break the initiative up in pieces and try to pass it one at a time. Why do you oppose that approach . I actually i dont. I have said early on we got to get over the fact that democrats are not in the majority in the house, and we dont dictate how the movement and legislative collar and the legislative movement. The president said a couple of days ago on the wall street journey saidwall streetjournal w many piece as long as all the pieces wind up giving you had the whole. I agree with that method. I look at it like courses of the meal. As long as in the end you got a full dinner and you served the full menu i really dont care if you serve the dessert or the salad, main course, just one caveat, no part of that meal can cause me indigestion. No part that have meal should cause me food poisoning. If the republicans want to do it piece by piece as long as in the end we make up comprehensive Immigration Reform. Great. Its an bill for the high tech industry, its a worker bill and a bill with components of work verification, everify, Border Security bill. If you want to take it in parts, but remember one thing, one caveat. Give us the main plate we want 11 million lyleizeed. To go further with your dining metaphor, dont the courses have to go with one another . When you pass something as comprehensive as Immigration Reform dont the pieces have to go operative. E verify , going along with taxpayer identification or Social Security numbers. Isnt this better done as one bill than several . Sure. But guess what, ray, when we controlled the senate and the white house, my party didnt take the matter up. Thats the fact. The fact is that we had a referendum on immigration, republicans lost that referendum last november 6th. They should understand that. And democrats have come to the realization is that the reality is theyre going to set the agenda. I want to get immigration done. In the end, they have to coordinate with one another. We can do that in parts and pieces as long as in the end there is a full menu. We need the full menu. But if they want to do it in part. When i talk to my republican friends and allies on this issue, they say all of the parts will lead to full package. Final question, congressman, but aspect of your proposal along with our allies on capitol hill is a path to citizenship. One thing the delay has allowed is for some members to say out loud, you may, i might be able to go with this, but i cant do path to citizenship. Is that still part of your bottom line . Let me put it this way. When i go out to talk to people each and every day, they tell me, get me my papers. I want to be free from the fear and threat of deportation. 1100 people deported today. 1100 yesterday and tomorrow. Under the Barack Obama Administration 2 million very soon we will reach that number. Thats a tragic number of deportation. People want to be free from deportation so they dont leave their wives as widows or their children as orphans. In the end theyre all going to have a pathway to citizenship. Its not a question of whether theyre going to have one. The question is how long its going to take. Look, lets understand something. This is going to be a tough road, but im not going to give up, were going to get them all. Right now i think we can come with a proposal that does this, ray, that stops the deportation for all of them. Give citizenship to millions and legalize in the problem. Congressman Luis Gutierrez from illinois. This brings us to the end of this edition of inside story. The program may be over but the issue continues, you can looking on to our Facebook Page or send us your thoughts on twitter. Our handle is ad aj inside story story. See you for the next inside story in washington. Im ray suarez. Welcome to Al Jazeera America. Im richelle carey. Here are the top stories were following for you. 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