Business slide. Good afternoon, welcome to todays episode of the Small Business commission. It is our custom to begin and end each meeting with a reminder. This is the only place to start a new business in San Francisco. The best place to get answers to your questions about doing business in San Francisco. The office of Small Business should be your first stop when you have a question what to do next. You can find us online or in person at city hall. Best of all, all services are free of charge. The Small Business admission is the official forum to voice opinions and concerns about policies affecting Small Business in San Francisco. If you need assistance with Small Business matters, start at the offers of Small Business. Thank you. First item. Call to order and roll call. Commissioner adams is absent. Commissioner dooley absent. roll call . Mr. Vice president you have a quorum. Item two. General Public Comment. Allows members of the public to comment generally on the matters that are within the Small Business commissions jurisdiction. Any members of the public wanting to comment . The item is closed. 3. Recognition of tracey teraoka, president , sacramento street merchants organization. This will be done by our director. Good afternoon, commissione commissioners. On our president Stephen Adams is away on business. He wanted to honor you. He is disappointed he is not here. I am going to do the honors. On this wednesday, may 29th, the Small Business commission is honored to recognize traci for her contributions. She opened the store that represents the electric spirit of San Francisco by featuring california artists with Fine Furniture andy core and mix of time periods andy sign styles and highlighting local jewelers. Through her spirit of community she revived the sacramento Street Merchants Association that transformed the street to a vibrant and neighborly place. Tracis spirit extends before her business on sacramento street with her nonprofit healing environments which transform sterile Healthcare Facilities into warm and inviting places. In addition, her service on the board of directors and interim director at my tree. For these reasons and more, the Small Business commission commends trace forter contributions. Say a few words and we will go up and take a picture. There is your certificate. Thank you, commissioners. Thank you everyone. I am so appreciative of my experience and opportunity to be a Small Business owner in San Francisco. I moved around frequently growing up through different parts of the u. S. I never felt at home until i moved to San Francisco. That was part one of my experience of city. Being able to be very involved with the community and as well as the business sectors and nonprofit sectors, my neighborhoods, a lot of different parts of community became my song and my way of thriving in the city. I was hoping i would stay here indefinitely, and it just worked out right now perhaps into the future that i have to leave. I am closing my business this friday. I will make a move to petaluma. I am hoping through the powers that be and Creative Time and landscape i can find new ways to have business in the city and i dont see myself as being solely an internet based enterprise. I work with and through people. I have been telling people i am not leaving forever. I think this is just a change. My heart and soul is here. I have learned so much and worked with great people. I am dealing with a change in my life right now. I have told the Merchant Association i am not leaving them. I am heavily invested in the good of all. It is a lot of different Business Owners who are so devoted to their work they seldom get up to do other things. I dont want to abandon our good efforts. I want to find ways to keep working with our people and our businesses and see if i can find new ways to help. I will be in petaluma. I have the same contact information. I will still have my various networks. Every form of communication open. I believe in the city and the people. I would never want to not be a part of the Small Business community here. Thank you for your good work and thank you for the special certificate of honor. Thank you for everything you have done for the city and your kind words. I have friends in petaluma. We will leave the light on for you. Any other comments . Thanks so much. We will do a picture. Any members of the public that would like to comment on this item other than just group applause and thank you. [applause. ] picture time. In if spirit of honoring great deeds and great people and great businesses, lets move to the next item. Item 4 approval of legacy business registry applications and resolutions. Discussion and action item. The Program Manager of Small Business. Good afternoon. Legacy Program Business manager. I have a powerpoint presentation. Before you are four applications for consideration for the ledge gas see Business Edge tree. They were reviewed and submitted. One on april third the other on april 17th and heard on may 15th. There are copies of the applications in your packets. 4a is distractions. A retrial store founded in jun june 1982 in the ash bury neighborhood. It featured clothing and gifts and cards and was known for the gallery openings focusing on young local gay artists. Jim changed the focus of the store catering to the grateful dead crowds and the youthful fans of electronic dance music. In 2010 it had more of a victorian look that was popular and began offering locally crafted goods countering to the festival communities. Item 4b i is the Village Grocery store founded in 1984 when the brothers purchased the existing market to change the name. They were joined by their younger brother to operate the store. In 1994, joseph became the soul owner. It features local and seasonal products at fair prices. Wherever possible they work to create a vibrant and Sustainable Food system by maximizing the ability of Small Farmers to sell food through the diverse food channels. There is a mural painted in 2003 as well as rooftop garden with towers and 12 bee hives. Item four c is scarpeli and Associates Physical Therapy. It is an orthopedic manual therapy practice in operation since 1985 in the castro neighborhood. The focus of the practice is to provide outstanding physical Therapy Service and Wellness Support Services helping thousands overcome pain and disability. It was founded as a partenrship. In 2014, lisa retired and liz modified the business name but continued with the same services to the community in the same location. Liz has been a therapist for 42 years and brings energy to the practice. They solve complex problems in a collab berrative setting and patients benefit by getting back to a more healthy lifestyle. 4d is verytible vegetable. It is the oldest produce company. It brings low cost foods to community storefronts. It is the peoples food system throughout the bay area as alternative to the existing corporate food system. Their tagline was food for people, not for profit. In 1974, four individuals began to focus on buying and selling produce. They were one of the first hole sale buyers to form direct relationships to bring organic produce to urban consumers in northern california. It thrived on its own. Over the years they shifted Ownership Structure several sevl times but continued to operate with Decision Making responsibilities. Today it operates in four sites and maintains the offices on Caesar Chavez street. After reviewing the applications and recommendation from hpc staff findings the businesses met the three criteria for listing on the legacy business registry. There are four draft resolutions for your consideration by the Small Business commission. One for each application. Your support should be as a motion in favor of the resolutions. In the resolutions, please pay close attention to the core physical features or traditions that define the business. When approved it must maintain the physical features to remain on the registry. The clothing store, for nobody hill it is grocery for physical therapy and senior vegetable i s produce. There are representatives to speak on behalf of the applications. Any questions before Public Comment . Okay. Do we have public that would like to comment . I hope there are people to sing praises of their businesses. Come on up. Hello, tom here. We are just here to support our nominee scarpeli and Associates Physical Therapy for nomination to the legacy registry. He said the reasons we are proud to nominate them and we hope to have your support for the business registry. Thank you for your support. Thank you. Next up. Dont be shy. You are on fsgovtv. Primetime. We are from supervisor peskins office. I will have joe get up here. For us. My acquaintance with the l le bu market. They were doing cleanup days too get a broom to clean up the neighborhood. This is more than a corner market. It is a corner Stone Community serving business in our district and testament to the roles these businesses play in a community and why it is important to preserve and help out our Community Cornerstone businesses like the market. When we talk about regulations that might imperial the businesses the zoning codes we have to think about the impact on the business or the corner laundromat or liquor store. They are fundamental pieces of the community. Come on, joe. Thank you, commissioners. We are truly honored to be recognized for the legacy business nomination. As we approach our 35th year procuring the best Nutritional Foods for the community i never expected to be here. When my brothers and i started in 1984, Ronald Reagan was president. The Detroit Tigers won the world series and that was the last time they won. The oakland raiddeshes won the super bowl. Now we are being recognized for surviving more than a generation. We owe a lot to the support of community, exceptional employees we have been able to attract over the years and my family who gave me the strength to continue the mission we started 35 years ago. My son has decided to keep the traditional live. He is interviewing some candidates for a cashier. That is why he wasnt here today. My hope is that the changing environment continues to value the goods and services so we can perhaps get another 35 years serving the nobody hill community. Thank you very much for your consideration. Thank you. All right. Next up. Thank you everybody. I am james siegel the owner o of distractions. Without richard all of all would not be here. He got us through every part of the process. I want to say thank you for this program. They say in a lot of magazine articles that San Francisco is losing the soul. Programs like this keep the diversthediversity and keep thel alive i came in 1972 at the age of 16. I arrived in hate ash bury when it was a boarded up slum. I fell into a good group of people called the switch board. I volunteered and worked for them. When i was 20 i opened up my first shop called the white rabbit. I was with partners. It didnt workout. Then i opened pipe dreams in 1978. That didnt work out. In 1982 i opened distractions. It was never about the money. It is the love of the Counter Culture community and what the Counter Culture community continues to thrive. It has evolved over the years. It is my honor to be part of the whole nominating towards the Historic District and i am working with San Francisco heritage and proud to be a member of the community and part of the colorful vibrant city. Thank you. Good afternoon, commissioners. I am karen sallenger, director of sales and one of three women owners of verytible vegetable company, the oldest produce distribution company. Thank you for your consideration of adding us to the legacy business registry. As a Second Generation native from San Francisco i am proud of this honor. We began operations in 19 1974 n 20th and alabama in the mission. We have moved several times over the 45 year history. We own our building and are proud to operate out of three weawarehouses in the same city block. We wan wanted to operate in the great city and are here to stay by providing hospitals and schools with Fresh Produce we impact what makes San FranciscoSan Francisco. I am proud to own and operate a company with values. We have been a Certified B Corp over five years. One way to demonstrate we are an instrument for social and environmental change. Our environmental initiatives include the zero emotion street of Truck Mission strucks. In 2006 we installed the solar panels. Our staff recycle training has led to landfill only 1 of the waste we produce. To further demonstrate commitment, we became a San FranciscoGreen Business in 2016. We have been paying a wage above the current mandated minimum wage for well over 10 years. The current starting wage in warehouse staff is 19. 50. We expect to bring it over 20 within the next six months. We maintain fourone ratio from c. E. O. To operations staff. People come from all over the world to experience the land cap in San Francisco. We are part of the foundation to make this possible. We carry every type and fruit and vegetable you can imagine from purple potatoes to corn on the cob. We provide the beautiful displays you see in the markets all over the city. We provide weekly produce donations to 10 schools within the San FranciscoUnified School District to educate youth on the importance of fruit and vegetables and to increase access to the diverse communities. I am honored to be part of the team to make San Francisco the environmentally friendly city that it is. Thank you. Next up. I am liz scarpeli, owner of scarpeli and Associates Physical Therapy. We have been in business 34 years at the same location. We came to the castro at the height of the aids crisis. Doctors told me they will not send patients. It was a tough environment. I believed the Straight Community needed to get some education from a straight person in the gay community. They werent listening to anybody. So we moved there and it was a struggle in the beginning. We are at the same location we are now. I wouldnt want to leave because i have seen the incredible compassion of the Castro Community when the aids crisis was at the apex. People were dying left and right. Watching these men and women take care of their own like straight people dont. I said this was an education how to take care of ill people and straight people need to take care of elderly parents and sick families and ill china away that was something that i had never seen before. I really wanted to work here. I wrote a paper when i had a patient that was at risk of blood clot and when i sent them over to the er doctor they said she is hysterical. I need a fullblown clot. If i had let him go he would have stroked out like his two parents did. What is really different about our practice. We have oneonone. It is not a dog and pony show. You dont come in with 20 people and do exercise. It is individuals. We have ms and spinal cord tumors on people not appropriately evaluated in the hospital or doctors office. We feel we have served the community really well. We want to keep serving the community. We are just looking for a place we can afford the rent. It is really tough in the castro getting something to afford right now. Thank you. Thank you very much. Do we have any other members of the public that would like to comment on this item. Seeing none, commissioners before we vote do you have any comments . Thank you all for coming today and sharing such compelling stories and narratives of your business with us. I am really honored to be on this end of the vote, and i believe this is an important project and bringing a lot of Small Businesses to the fold of advocating to themselves and our sector atlarge. A special recognition to the le beau family. Great family, great business. Thank you for being an example for the corner store sector in the city. Thank you to the supervisors who always come and advocate on behalf of your Small Businesses. We appreciate that. Thank you everybody else for being here. I would like to say first of all, we are all Business Owners ourselves in case you didnt know. That is why i am late today. I apologize to those i did not get to hear. I did review the material before i came in. I did want to mention in particular i had a couple years i couldnt walk and physical therapy was critical in my recovery. The work you do, elizabeth, is beyond meaning to the folks that need it, and in particular with great pleasure and pride to support your legacy business nomination today. Commissioners. Shout out to le beau. I think my wife has been going to your market for 25 years on nobody hill. Veritab le vegetable. I want to thank all of you for going through this process. Richard is often commended for his help in stewarding you through the process. I know it is a lot of work and for a lot of people it is hard to get over the first hurdle. What you get from it is a reflection on your business. As Small Business owners we are in the moment worrying what is going to happen tomorrow we dont reflect on the legacy of the businesses. It is a great opportunity to create a document to pass on to the next generation. Even if you are passing on your business or not, i have four children and none of them have expressed an interest in my business yet. Who knows . They still have time. Thank you for taking a break from your businesses to come out. This is our favorite time of our meetings. It is just a delight to see you here. Thanks for going through the process and coming out to see us. Do we have a motion to approve all four resolutions. Yes, i move to approve all four. Congratulations and thank you for coming. I will second. Motion to approve all four resolutions as legacy businesses. Roll call vote. roll call . Motion pass pass 50 with two absent. [applause. ] welcome to the club. And back to work. You do not have to it is around for the rest of the meeting unless you want to. Congratulations. Thank you so much. Clerk Assembly Bill 161. Solid waste, paper waste, electronic proofs of purchase. Commission to provide recommendation for Department Recommendation to the state legislative committee. Discussion and possible action item. Commissioners, i want to thank alex walker for being here and being available for questions. I want to walk you through a couple things. In your packet is there has been probably four or five amendments to the bill since i last brought it to your attention i want to walk through. If there is anything i dont get correct. Please correct me. The first item they hav they haa specific definition for Small Business. The last time i brought it to your attention there was a an exemption for businesses over 1 million. Now this is part of the california code. It deals with retail trade services, manufacturing, independently owned and operated is not dominated in its field. Small business does not include any of the following professions or business activities, financial institutions, so the key thing i want to draw down that is pernent to this. The retail trade. This definition the cap is the annual grocer gross receipts exd 2 million. This was in 2001. One thing to give consideration to just as with the crv and the california recycle buy back, what creates a convenience zone is a supermarket valued at 2 million. So when we capture a dollar value to a business either designating it large or Small Business, if there are no cpi adjustments tied to it, over time that value changes in terms of the type of business it was intended to represent at the time that the law was written. Some of the key changes that have taken place are that it is now it is not mandating the email to the degree that it was so what it is doing the regulations are that businesses on or after january 2022 would be prohibited from providing paper receipts except upon customers request. Then begins january 2024 it would require a business to the provide a receipt requested by the custom american in electronic or paper format. By 2024 it requires businesses who are not captured in the definition of Small Business to be able to have an electronic means of providing a receipt should a customer request it. The bill does go into specification around credit cards around marketing and capturing information and emails, but in terms of mandating. I am not going to elaborate on that. That follows current regulations if i am correct on that, alex, those are current regulations. It is affirming that. One of the highlights that the department of environment let me highlight. The bill would als specify the t and second violations would be 25 each day the business is in violation but not to exceed an annual total of 300. It is the attorney general, District Attorney or City Attorney that enforces the provision should it pass. For purposes of this bill, a business is defined as a company that accepts a credit card or debit transaction there by it does exempt cash only businesses businesses. A business must provide proof of business that does not contain bpa or bps. They must replace the proof of purchase paper with those that require the thermal heat with the bpa and bpsfree paper. There are other certain sorts of exemptions for businesses that are required by law to provide receipts. So the department of environment, they are proposing what i would like to do is get to a place where we can be in agreement with the department or have our office and the Department Come in alignment to make an official recommendation to the state legislative committee which makes the official recommendation to the Assembly Members office, the bill sponsor. Right now the department of environment is actually their proposal is to ensure. There is still some toxicity with the bpa and bps paper. Their recommendation is to mandate it is the nontoxic paper. Isnt that what the original bill asked for . How does our Citys Department of environment, how does their request differ . That is all we need to know. How does it differ from the proposed state legislation, specific differences . Their specific differences. We asked to have somebody here today. It is on page 2 of the review. It is on or after january 2022 proof of purchase shall not contain chemicals listed on the following list. California chemicals list pursuant to paragraph 1. That is different from state legislation . How is that different. State legislation aims to get rid of paper . Does the state legislation make reference to bpa and bps . Yes, it now does. The first definition didnt. The first draft did not. As i understand from the department. We have a representative. What is the state asking retailers to do about bpa and bps paper. That thank you for having me here. Alex walker from senator kings office. The amendment for the bill. A bit of background. This bpa and bps we are seeing 30 increase in levels of these chemicals in retail workers. 93 have bpa or bps in receipts. The amendments made in the Appropriations Committee this would not apply to retailers that had it limit maded from the systems. We have a lot of old paper. What this would doi do if you dt have the chemicals you are not covered. If you do that we are gradually reducing the amount of paper you will be using and we are hoping and my understanding is this would be the intent to kind of incentivize the market to phase out because there will be less use to give time for businesses to switch out machines if they so choose. I am looking at the particular section here where this was. We look at section. You have a copy of the bill in your packet, commissioners. I was looking to see where it well there are definitions in section 1. Section c and d. I want to go do section e where the state of connecticut banned this in 2011, eight years ago. You dont have any disagreement with the desire to get rid of this toxic element. The question i have is what is your timeline and is it different from our timeline . My understanding is that the only timelines for the bill are we dont have a timeline to get rid of bpa or bps. It is only if you have already gotten rid of it in your system. If you are currently using it . This would steer you toward giving out less paper you would offer as first resort electronic. Or convert to nontoxic paper. You are not covered at all then. It is marketed as nontoxic urea based paper. It is compatible with the systems today. The only Financial Impact would be the slight impact in paper cost. You could deplete your current pile of paper and move to nontoxic and not worry about the bill, correct . Correct. These are further back to a lot of years. That is to allow for the natural running out of paper andry stocking. The other question if i understand it properly, businesses covered by the state legislation exclude businesses defined as the Small Businesses as they are defined here. 2 million in revenue for retailer and some other qualifications. Yes, that references government code sections 11342. 510 to 11342. 610. Those came in effect in 2001. There has not been any change since the year 2000. I think that is the conversation to have under a different bill. We do understand that for San Francisco that could be consideration that Small Business and then people who are franchisees and the code doesnt speak per location or entire business. I would read entire business. With two locations you could be over 2 million pretty quickly. Back to the question. Small business as defined here is excluded from your bill, correct. That is correct. If you have a sing will store doing less than 2 million each single store and less than 2 million you dont worry . Correct. If you only take cash. I think it would be worthy of some analysis as to what a reasonable hurdle rate for Small Business in terms of revenue is. 2 million is a lot of money for a single store. Someone with multiple stores might exceed that but having done retail myself i would be delighted to do 2 million a year. Grocery seats gross receipts. Dont boil the ocean. This is not to change the definition of Small Business. This is legislation to address this issue. What i am trying to get at. I dont actually have i will let other commissioners weight in on this. I dont have objection to the state bill from my perspective and agree with the spirit of it. I want an understanding whether San Francisco is proposing something less stringent than you or a matter of agreeing both of these organizations are going down the path that we can agree on. I think San Francisco the department of environment is proposing a more you might say stringent in terms of ensuring the type of paper that is used. That is what you spoke of. They are more aggressive in assuring that if you are using paper that you use nontoxic paper. It is my understanding. The first yesterday was the first i had seen these considerations. These are both dealing with january 1, 2022 is that you get rid of paper receipts. Provide only in electronic form. A date that we get rid of chemicals. It would be additionally stringent. There has been some discussion and expression of potential hardship for a business that would be a great expense for them to go to an emailbased system. I think that someone mentioned that their business would cost them 100,000 to switch from the system they have to the system that would generate email receipts. This is not a pie in the sky number with a lot of hardware skews. If you are independent it could be quite expensive. That being said, i think that your legislation leaves open the option to provide one or the other, is that correct . That is why i am appreciating this. I have been with the merchants, the chamber, you know, just from me coming into this, well the terminal is 400 that is the cost out there. It would be interesting to hear from businesses from the cost of buying the terminal if there are additional costs. Not the equipment costs . That is the overriding process of converting the database. You may not have a database, creating a database of all of the skies. If it is 10,000 or 100,000. It could be a lot of money. We want to behind full of that. Is there any provision for a hardship . I like to leave an out. For the government and for Small Business to say, hey, this is the situation we did not anticipate. It is nice to have a clause that says in the event of undue financial hardship, a business may petition somebody for an exemption. Just putting it out there. Is point is welltaken. Legislation for this or anything else in the future. We represent potentially seven different business categories up here. How can we anticipate all of them and who knows what comes next . Just a thought. Absolutely. Not to speak for the authors intent. I think the exemption was a factor. If we see over 2 million in Gross Revenue that is a hard ship and something i will take to this to talk to legislative staff. I did connect with the capital staffer. Always happy to have conversations and take feedback amendments as the bill moved forward. If you could take to the powers that be, a desire to address if the Small Business definition needs refinement. Every decade is a good idea. We are at that milestone. Maybe we did get data and say this would be very easy data to get from the tax roles. What is 2 million a lot . I dont know that cpi is the right adjustment. We should look at the data to see wha what is the right number today . Maybe we can get remainment. If you can help us in sacramento. We are always grappling with the definition of Small Business, how many people, how much revenue . We find there are several different definitions in each dimension. You can see from your office and from the capital you have been talking to say your cohorts in los angeles how many businesses for all appearances would be small but cross the 23 million threshold. This is something we need to tackle as well. Polling a couple metro areas is where you will have the most Business Activity and highest retail prices, too. Commissioner la. The average retail price plays deeply into this. My business has an average transaction cost of right around 5,000. Pretty easy to cross over to 2 million with a staff in San Francisco we have like three people there. You know, slim margins on 2 million. It is not uncommon for folks to have 5 margins. 100,000 split three ways is Small Business. Under this definition it is not. I would guess your business is capable of generate g. E. Mail invoices and sales orders . We are talking about a condition here. The most likely businesses that would not be able to comply with this are going to be very, very small because they basically are mom and pop that has been in business so long. They are not going to use email. We want to be careful. Really, today, i have to imagine 95 of business busines businesl and ability to generate electronic receipts. You can take a paper receipt and scan it. Or switch to nontoxic. My comments are to expand. I think you are probably talking way out. They were not intended to reflect. We were going off on a sidebar for a minute. With respect to the legislation at hand do you remember the excessively long receipts that come out of the cvss of the world, is it the authors intention to revisit that or is it fairly constrained to the chemicals now . We are still, you know, the chemicals and paper and water that those receipts create. A recent amendment that we put on here was that it also exemptions retailers that dont include nonessential information. Saying if you are only putting purchase information on the receipts this does not apply. If you put on the coupons, this is going to affect you. If you are only putting onness information for a purchase you are amended out of this bill. It is like a ribbon parade . A mile of paper. It is outrageous. I dont think there is a lot to object to here. Commissioner yee riley. We are putting this on the merchant rather than the manufacturer that makes the paper. That is the point. The whilthe bill has not been mg it. I think this paper is being phased out anyway, i believe, or they are switching over to bps. Then i have to look to see. I think it is also kind much a cause and effect. If you have businesses ordering less paper because it is using less paper. Also if you are not using paper you are not in the bill so ordering the paper. I see your point and i would have to ask staff why it wasnt legislated about the paper. This is making incentives for the paper to be phased out as this goes into effect. Thank you for coming out today. A couple questions. To follow up on the manufacture piece and wholesalers like Restaurant Depot where retailers go to pick up supplies. Have you guys reached out to wholesalers in the state about this piece of legislation to make sure they are aware . Sure, i would have to ask the staff. Im not sure all of the conversations that have been had. By referring to the code that defines Small Business it is 9. 5 million is the cutoff to be considered a Small Business. Businesstobusiness if we are we choired to adopt required to adopt new types every seaofreceipt paper is it y available . Yes, it is available, more expensive. The annual cost of switching paper is minimal. Less than a penny worth of paper per transaction then increasing to a pen me plus a bit of a penny. The numbers are very small to convert paper. These are completely compatible with one another. Does this only include brick and mortar businesses. Is there any dimension with Online Retail delivery considering that is a pretty wasteful industry in terms of Paper Supplies and receipts. Like delivery. Online retailers have stopped putting packaging slips in. You know, i think that it goes back to the definition of Small Business under code because just for me looking over, it is a page and a half of the code that de nines Small Business nothing about brick and mortar versus online. That merits conversation. The thing is like are you a mom and pop . Online business with Gross Revenue under 2 million. You are getting an email receipt for online ordering. That would also kind of just to my thinking it through honor the intend of the bill that there could be a discussion about opting in and out of packaging. In terms of enforcement. There is a violation clause. Being in the retail industry. State enforcement is increasing. They need to go behind the register. Most of the time they use enforcement efforts in the form of sting operationses undercover. I am curious what the enforcement piece will look like. The bill only outlines it is enforced by the City Attorney, District Attorney or the torch general. I cant speak to the exact enforcement mechanisms. I think that would be an opportunity for locals to work out who would take this. I dont think we are prescriptive what that would look like. It would be a local. This is just my understanding. That would have to be a local because, i mean, unless it is a business that was. You can cost about multiple cities, statewide action