To discuss these issues and more and joined by my guess martin j america. Shes an Award Winning journalist, and commentator, and in budapest we bought the door to samuel 8. Hes a pod cast or at the gabble, which we thought on youtube and levels or gentlemen, costs up rules and effects and music and jumping in time. You want that. I always appreciate or its good george in budapest its, its really remarkable watching the course of this conflict and how the west has changed its rhetorical focus like narrative of every Everyone Wants as a board. You, great, of course is going to win a because it has um the, the moral spirit, you know, the current job because of the ukrainian soldier in society. Oh, the responsible states have had a lot of books. Ukraine is already was the 1st few weeks ago. Okay. And then, and, you know, as long as it takes, okay. And now over the last guy would say 2 weeks ago. Well, you know, the of the premium, so just follow up there on the borders that nato gave them in the training, you know, and then biding, says, well, the book is already lost. You know, the, theyve already lost what so theyre trying to book and now say to me, whatever happens, i love people. Its not as false. George . Yes. The question thats, thats always the american motif. The only one of the ally, you know, who was, who may have the United States. The pictures is why, again, it always turns out that were just not really worthy of, uh, american, the health and supposed to be, you know, we have that the south in the me is where it goes to useless. You know, and then you know, we had the great is a, in the, in the 1st of will were useless. The ass counties we used was everybodys always useless. And so there is the same. Um, now if i were you bring it in, i think, well, its a little bit much. I mean you have a photo of it is anybody is but 70 is a and youre telling us that were not fighting properly. You know what, you know, you, you know, driveway bravo, gun in the back, back and fight alongside those. But it doesnt work as a well, we dont really want to do that. So yeah, i mean, the, the visible sorts of, uh, confusing messages that are coming out from uh, the administration. But there are also these confusing messages. But other coming out about the some go to negotiations that are going on. Um, in the background um no into that. Thatd be in the number of stores the stores and like nbc, about these negotiations, x u. S. Officials talking to ty level uh russians and then um we, we, we, we now have another story about this. Uh, and the go to i, i know buying it. I dont think this is and these are serious because ultimately the rule that is going on is good for the United States. The United States isnt losing anything. And, and it is, the russians are dying ukrainians of mine. I dont see any incentive to be honest. Um, for the United States to the, to bring it this doing in so doing the, the, the, the stories that ive got a wishful thinking. Well this is what i would do if i were a rational person, which is true. But i dont think that thats necessarily how the, by the administration is thinking its such an interesting way to phrase it because the ultimate goal is okay, maybe ukraine isnt going to win, but it can still keep fighting martin. I mean its, its an interesting thing here is that is what you know is a man. The outcome will there be, will be a negotiated outcome. Thats a new thing to, thats making it into the narrative. But in the meantime, in the meantime, the us is not going to pursue any kind of negotiations or whatnot just for the reason that george said, i mean, even though its been a lot of money, a lot of taxpayer money. I mean, this is a, a conflict against russia on the cheap learning guys, im going to disagree with both of you. Im really, im really sorry. I think, i think joe just wrong. I think that arisen incentive to buy and 6 to to stop is will i think hes starting to wake up to the realities that he called wrong in the, in this is re election campaign. Im starting from next on may just call it face voters, particularly blue complexes and have this but mine the living experience in the non here hang on here is i think its pretty obvious that the drum base may agree with that. But i think you would still agree with this is very much a bi partisan endeavor. I mean, getting an inspector general. I mean, that was by far to sit in the senate. Okay. No, were not going to happen because the price of the buying doesnt want it. That was bipartisan. Ok, they keep going. You, but i say were living in a, were living in a scenario to our no realities. Were living in a truman show kind of a movie says web i, you know, on the, on the face of it, do you have officials like could be, and others who us thing you know, it in the most ancient and then when they knew it, tons of law suite, there was some backpedaling, there was some admissions that was not going very well, but then we should hang in there and we should push all reserves as though you came was up to the front line, a disaster, this tax exempt. But in the same token, youve lost the war. How many people actually bull into the, you know, think whats going on on the power though to, to tackle georges assertion, had only thing was going on on a power level and secretaries, i think there are tools going on because i think the light and does want to get out of this well, i really do think he does and i think, yeah, one of the things been troubling me about this. Um this uh this, that in this scenario, all of your findings or an addition, you know, think about that. How does that happen . How do we get into that situation . The 1st place out of the best miniature brands in the pendulum in january of this year or december did not clam the scenario and say, hey guys, whats going to run quite low and about may of june. Should we not make preparations for it now . Im sure they did, im sure they contacted the button administration and they didnt get very clear on so from the buttons administration. But to tackle this, if you want, just supply the things with the munition even to the very easy you dont even need to use your own. American stokes are plenty of allies around the world. Theyre playing stuff, pulse around the world. Yeah, it doesnt even need to be american where you could, i didnt buy chinese on sooner, isnt it . So i dont, i dont buy into this. Youre going to run it. Im going to should. I think they will let, i think, i think they were allowed to fall into this pit because i really believe the board and bought some of the role and i really do believe in the leadership of the school commentate. Uh oh. Yeah. It is. Okay. And it does the fact that they couldnt plan for this doesnt surprise me. I think they believe that the sanctions would have done the job. And them, you know, and good story here. But the kind of go and go back to george. But george, it doesnt really matter because as you rush has already lost a more of thats the new narrative. Okay. So, i mean, you know what, we did everything we could do. You just as you said, you know, its liskey and his people. I mean, we, you know, we, we, you know, nothing about your brain without your brain. Theyre doing their own thing here. I think that, you know, the business going on the cheap here, and then of course, blame the use of it. And then the really the europeans that to step up george, they just didnt do enough. Ok. I think theres plenty of ways for them to rationalize, which is like the hunter bite and story if they got had that a agreement go through this book and it is over no more investigations. We dont have a they live in the pseudo reality, george. But i think so, i think that the, this provides them with an escape hatch that if things go wrong, then to say what it was really the brand is sold, but for the pool or they didnt take our advice. And again, they, they misuse the, the web and really we gave them, you know, a by 5 to many shells. And it was around a, i, a, im actually not buying into the story that theyre running out of shows. I mean with this happens in every will, every what we hear about, oh, the sure theres a shortage of a tillery shows a show to do my music at this during the world will one that was a big, big issue and well, well, well, hey, were running out of, um, uh, auto rate what, what are we going to do about this . So the, the question is, is whats the incentive for the United States to, to bring this to an end. Im not buying this thing about the, the us, the likes of the us selection is like its a long way off. Yeah, im really ways, its the domestic issues that the privilege there is more or less a consensus among most the candidates that, hey, this is a good rule and then we should keep it going with true about with trump. So i, you know, i dont think biden is worried about the lecture by the, is worried about getting into a direct shooting hole with russia. I think thats a different issue. So inviting said no to nato membership or ukraine. I mean, he did it because a, if you brain is joins nature, where on the, which would you really just reinforces that this is the way that they buy ministration. Just by doing this work, were going to let them do all the fighting for us in, in the, in the dump the market. It says they get not having ukraine in nato and get, get, gets the knotted states again off the hook. Ok, were not responsible for that country security. Okay, just let me explain. I have the best of all possible worlds here, which in the den means the destruction of ukraine. The very purpose of this policy was the policy for us. It not ukraine, mark. So theres another theory which spring founded about which i comp claim credit for, which is another reason why i didnt refuse to let you claim. And so nature is to keep that as a bargaining chip. So when you finally do, when do funding negotiate with the russians . Youve got something quite strong on your side, but to take georges point, i dont think its exclusively of things. Only the button is worried about elections and how your cells this massive, unprecedented amount of memory spending in a country that probably 99 percent of americans call signs. And a map of the well, i think is more than that. I think its getting increasingly worried about china and i dont think you can handle china new crime both on the same plate with storm policy f ups. You know that a bomb a used to was used to critics him with, you know, we should never forget that quote from, from above. I dont have never underestimate, binds ability to f things up. I think its talking about foreign policy. So i think the with china threat with cheese, you know, sounding else um, delivering signals which are more robust and mobility codes every single day and basing on the drum and the tension building up the tile. Stating there is a, a need for the bug, the ministration to look for an offer on. And i think theyre all to whats going on. I think i wouldnt be too surprised. I think that this is deliberate. I think since about december or january they were the things were deliberate, the allowed to run out of them initial to create this low because you call them negotiations with the russians when you also rent a 1000. 02000, a 155 millimeter shows after you have to, you know, look for a natural pool, is a natural impact so low in the war. And i think thats from the the moment right now to do that. So i think we should, we shouldnt dismiss. All right, were in jordan, all by triple. Why would the russians in a meeting gauge in negotiations at all . Any other than a back channel thing that were not gonna use nukes, we can all agree. Were not going to do that, but other than that, what would the russians be interested in . Go ahead martin. Well, i think um, uh the comments, but it would look fuck, recently were very interested in his theory. The of the great job. But lets go, let us know that his theory is that the Russian Central Bank government has set to pitch in look, thinks of where to go to the moment. Weve got inflation on the control. Weve got inflation at a so dream level. But most europeans cannot even front as low as about the countless river. So theres an economical aspect to this whole thing, which is the, you know, the situation that pretends and which is quite comfortable, is not something that you can, you can banks, you can bank on forever, that has to be a longer strategy. So there are incentives the same for russia to look up some of the issues that i saw, the same video you did. I found them seem to be utterly completely convincing. Deal with your as losing phrase the the key is that the, the was possibly some sort of but general communication going on between buns and noticing that. We have to go to a hard break. Were going to talk about the, the back channel in the 2nd half of the program. Gentlemen, im going to jump in. Were going to come right back to stay with our team, the, [000 00 00;00] the number you need use visa, stupid loyce law here. Nancy, nancy. No look terms in the book. The initial is just me very the its the only showcase use the skinny to the boys at the boys the, the most new. And thatll be for them. Imagery of us to florida doesnt want that extra them put the notes up under that choose 2060 humorous moments to serve you as soldiers in poland. Ukraine and the Baltic States have been destroyed all vandalized fish their stuff, but it must be deposited only within. Yeah. Unless or even some others could, i skip everything. So thats the most on whether its its special or just bring it to police. Government denies the rule of soviet sonya is in the victory of a naziism. And is it raising historical memories of world war 2 . It is the 4 cases from your story. Although it did seem the non c regimes, the trustees would remain think since peoples consciousness, but have a but as long as the rest of the be a is profitable and brings dividends, you are willing to have a to rewrite the cost. Yes, it is. Dont take up the provides too much susan. I need the seats in the car to tax. Do i need to be ready at the a welcome back to kind of stuff. Were all things are consider 90 little this is a home addition to remind you. Were discussing some real notes the lets go back to george in budapest. Okay. George, lets look at it from the other side. You know, because like if i, i see these western, the leads that theres always kind of this fantasy unicorn wish list, you know, is a, you know, and the zip here, well, probably hispanic more theres, theres an instability in broad signal which is like, i dont know where they get this information from and how they draw these conclusions because, you know, you and i believe in with martin, you know, were, were avidly covering how people cover russia. And its a self fantastically wrong. Most of the time is that only really pay much attention to it. But now lets get down to brass tax something important, this conflict in ukraine. I still to this point, irrespective of the interest rate. Okay. I dont see why russia has any incentive at all ever. Well have a couple of sites in the dumbass, you know, and brush will have to do, but the crime media its and it will have to accept when you have a form of nato membership of why would run rushing the initiated discomfort because it wasnt getting any of those things, why wouldnt change its mine now . George . Exactly. Now ive seen the incense is the tool and um, in fact, if it was to be a settlement now on the terms of which um, local act advocates and that interview referred to by nonsense um this will be a complete failure for russia because essentially uh, russian would have to be giving up things that it actually had prior to the start of the, um, of the, the several special milledgeville operations that goes down that have to agree to holding plebiscites. And, you know, we know how the way these plebiscites work. I mean the, the, that its always very questionable once nato gets involved in a plebiscite. So roughly what happens the giving up is going to end up with less then it had the 18 months ago. So i dont see any reason. Certainly built in conduct survive. So if were talking about the bite and then the electron, i mean open conducts of, i a such a such a accumulation. Um, but there is an agenda always with, with this kind of talk. And its particularly with somebody like look like, look, track, essentially once a week is trying to, i mean the, you know, that, that stays obsession. I mean, hes always been an obsessive sort of fellow, and hes not his new obsession. Is china. And what, how does it, how do we find china . Why . Because why did using american boys, i mean, thats literally plan of any of the neo cons, what were going to use russia. And thats way to the agenda behind this as well, although, so i mean, this guy, colby, is a ubiquitous presence on, on fox news. Also china, china, china, on the plan here is alright, lets bring this thing in your brain. So and, and now lets use russia against china. This is going to be all kind of father against china, much as it was originally when the nato expansion, the idea behind it. And george cyrus explained that they were going to use the spirit bins as count on father against russia, and how were going to use russia as gone father against china. Why i am assuming russian understands that thats the plan thats in, in the works. And the other thing to go to by of course, the bar, let me again, were just kinda looking at western fantasies. Okay. I mean, there, there is no evidence whatsoever that kind of scenario can possibly play out in a storage. Riley points up. Why do you, why do you have, why would russia give up anything that it doesnt have to give up . Okay . It may and, and, and plus, if you look at the long term, the impact of this war as having other than the, the, the, for people of ukraine and, and the, all of the soldiers that are dying is it in europe its, its being the industrialized. Now considering everything thats been said and done, but since the end of the cold war, so i would have rush it, throw anyone in the west, a lifeline. I mean i, i just dont see it. I mean, theres so many things that have been said the cant be on said. And what about the sanctions and all of that . Do you think the americans will ever retract anything so . Oh, its very well under any circumstances. So what is rushing, get out of its own has gotten, is about a pack of lies and deceit. Sorry, thats my opinion. Go ahead more. But if were going to dismiss, lets, lets comments about russian inflation. Then theres not much left on the table in terms of what could be attracted to the region policy, which is, is an international state. It does state, but he thinks of the well doesnt think of the region when he did an applicant of the last week was really interesting. But we didnt get too much attention from west of me to read a whole lot of did that a lot of did a condescending commentary, which was completely unfounded. Okay. I, i thought i would get totally smooth speed, inability to read the room. Okay. They dont have read the room. Im sorry martin, go ahead. I think thats a good to does one piece. I think the other the does. I dont think wants to even envisage inviting them about the grant is, i dont know if youre not interested in the, in the Eastern European soviet model, which didnt work. Just as the British Colonial model. It didnt work and people failed. So on this down on the bill to acknowledge it, all right, in history, one of the Pretty Simple i flips just because it couldnt afford to run anymore. It was like owning an expensive jagger a call that you couldnt afford to fill out, you know, and i think the same argument applies to the end of the soviet union. And those countries, he doesnt love that. So relationship, thats a resentful this from the kind of people hes not interested in, in, in with the baby. But i think he thinks of a bigger picture, you know, and um, to go back to the light at, on button side there. There was the other issue about but, well, i think he would like to end the war and maybe concentrate on the china threat. Not necessarily going to what would china, but the use of china is a massive deflection. Is because he, it kind of emotions ever, that his son will be so stupid tablets, laptops. Sure. He couldnt imagine the meetings he had in, in camp in 2015, 2016 with the um, the rest of the present to discussing the money and the bribes. And im about now to get this Ukrainian Energy company. Um, uh, you know, teamed up with an american bonus so they could have like ago ill buttons, Vice President , courage. I have the chief prosecution. Ukraine kicked out, which he did it. Couldve imagine any of this coming out. And you know, and its extraordinary how is just continuing, you know, just this week. Its now being sanitized. Now were kind of being a western media is kind of shrugged his shoulders and say, okay, all right, well go to the report and we believe the source is strong. And there was study discussions about the 5000000. 00 a bribe to each of them. We havent got a smoking gun. We havent got the receipts from the bank with mark. Dont you think it is kind of interesting. Its actually in the bring that out because, you know, the, because of this growing scandal here, the, by the administration to say, well, which is already lost of all, or, you know, whats the page move on . Ok, thats what theyre doing. Theyre trying to, you know, this is a success. We are, our policy has succeeded disney, right . I mean its, it, but test that goal to, to say it out loud, but thats what theyre trying to convince people to do. Stewart this george make it these, which its, its interesting is that they, they want is that they still continue to think that they can bleed russia. We have to remember everyone. Victoria millen was temporarily promoted. Ok. I mean, for the space those looking for an offer, is that the right person to go to george . Well, thats an excellent point to be the executive. Thats why im not buying the story of the, the, the, the back channel negotiations. Because this is the person who is not only the most illogical in the state about the but she has been the driving force. All the obama buying policy toward ukraine obviously was a central figure. It was never blinked. And i mean, it was for, so to make her, i actually did a secretary of state that, that is a signal that there isnt going to be any change g as in go to a preside over any change or a policy as low bidens domestic problems. Well, we are, you know, what, what do leaders do when they have major domestic problems . They huge saw, the escalate was escalate complex and thats up there. Nobodys talking about the button when way weve got something bigger to talk about. But we had a whether you praying maybe even from the syria. Theres the downside of that is if you did you craig inside of the huts where bidens domestic problems, the unfortunately were rapidly running out of time. But i want to bring up something that i thought was interesting. Is it responsible . Statecraft . Um, id like to just um, sell themselves as a cut above, i would say, and im not going to mention the authors name because its not really important to my point. But in one of their articles the last few days at the very end, it says like every one, once you praying to win in russia to lose coconut, come from a think tank, you know, the quincy instead. Yeah, i thought they were a lot of smart people. I just want you crazy with aflac part of everyone. What kind of arrogance is that more . Its unfortunate as the subs poignant reminds of the times that were living and it is a detachment from the inside democratic process of western countries. We dont care anymore about what our citizens think we barely eat for. Consider that is even once every 4 or 5 years at the elections and the situation that we have in person with the labor and conservative. While youre having america, we, republicans and democrats and us, people are finally beginning to wake up. It doesnt matter which party you work for anymore. You know, its all part of the corrupt religious system. And their main purpose is to fold keep themselves in positions, getting this open jobs. And secondly, computers and disrupt the public away from ever asking any remotely intelligent questions. And i, im getting sick to death. Im reading articles and the British Press of them the Daily Telegraph about whats going on and ukraine, and the been a russian dictate to kidnapping sounds, the children you know. And then the so essentially to read what was expected or could, when general is read other articles and they see those words in the 3rd paragraph. You know, youre working on a b, s of not b s or somebody also. Oh, certainly its really interesting to george right now. Well, so when it comes to russia they, they never use the word alleged anymore. The website just, i just assumed. Okay, so according to the report this assign him is no, no, its just, its a, its a stablish fact. Ok for the source the, its always given as a, as a question on question. Fact the rest of this roster, blue up way dialing some civilian of the sides. Um and but when they report a russian denial, then they say um, when you times it was, it was unable to independently from the russian play. And so theres always, you know, whatever the rest to say anything but we were not able to confirm this claim, but apparently the brain is going to complain whatever they want, then theres no need to verify anything. But its, but those are then brought in this idea of the, whenever boot is, isnt it . They put in full slee claimed, so it is likely the journalist just inserts his own opinion, full sleep claim, because they were at the light was full. So what, what, what do you, what are you basing this on what the only western media has in real time Fact Checking things in the back, checking as their riding. Right. To just go to your martin, go ahead. The other one is the lensky sense. When you leave here, those 2 words from the bbc or into the mainstream, British Press, you know, you know, your into the truman shows on where, but so really very little. We have enough to stick to, you know, why would you let facts done in the way of a good story . Thats been the policy for so long now. You know, people dont know. They dont know the Propaganda Machine thats been created by the americans. A kid, they dont know that most of the stories that were seeing completely fictitious and this, this has no effect to relieve those checks. The company, ive always said they have a white board and they just go from the next story. The next story is all planned in advance. Gentleman, thats all the time we have one, i think my guess americans and booted as the one thing our viewers for watching us here at our teach. The next time we member press that the a started in 1983 with my father on a young man, a site thats all exactly the same as a kid does when he goes out in the lake and the communities cushion for parentage with ry real families. And allocation for a really long time. My mom was pregnant with me still long winding. And i grew up on long island. Ive been having this issue since probably 1970. Its my 1st year that i seriously pointed to the explainable biomass is near historical levels. Growth rate have dropped falling when its done and its worse form has of leveling effect. And it has a tendency to really just sort of strip away everything thats there. The wave fisheries are changing. Its the way our country is sending. Its increasingly hard for Small Businesses to make it abundant. Stocks are important. I mean, who wants to fish the last bit . The message i would leave to you is the importance of not giving up the importance of working together and also the importance of taking care of your corner of the ocean. The new jersey who government is open to dialogue with echo one says its 6 to resolve a stand off with the block and put an end to escalating tensions in the region. Also this hour, the and r t crew gets expensive access to the front lines of the gas for public for various battles are underway. First hand report from the ground coming up in a few minutes. Plus. This is a piece of mars here. The martian nothings and it was southeastern pork city of