On balance. I think british folks should breathe a sigh of relief with bidens election in the sense that we will have again in the white house, someone who values partnerships abroad, who believes in the transatlantic relationship, who believes in a strong europe has a good partner. Does biden support brecks it know when he was Vice President . Did his boss, barack obama, go to the u. K. And argue against brecks it . Yes, and so there will be some tough conversations between Boris Johnson and joe biden about this issue. But i think, you know, listen, biden is a pragmatist. He will want to maintain a good strong relationship with the u. K. Im guessing his message will be twofold. One, try to keep as close a relationship to the e. U. As possible and to dont do anything that could upset the good friday agreement or somehow undo the peace that has taken hold in northern ireland. Bill johnson has been relatively clear. I know this new book isolationism goes right back into the u. S. A. s. And, arguably, when the usa was a colony, you can imagine there might be people here in westminster think and resent the idea of telling britain what to do. Well, listen times at times have changed. And i do think that going back in history, one can only believe that the special relationship were in will endure because it really does go back to the 19th century in the u. S. And the u. K. Have been each others best partners for well over a century. I do think that if this special relationship will need refurbishing, it will need investment because britain has segregated itself, its backing away from europe and europe aggregates. Britains power, that doesnt mean that i say that britain is going to drift off into the shadows. But i think it does mean that the government should come up with a program about projecting power about taking on new commitments about being a player in europe to make sure that it remains as as relevant and partner to the United StatesGoing Forward as it has been in the past, well, as you make clear in the book, fronts a 0 oldest ally, and of course those who supported brechts that they say this is segregation. This is making it an International Power when it comes to america 1st. I dont know how youve coped them with the way the Trump Presidency has been chronicled by socalled, Mainstream Media. You make it clear that this is much older than many of these journalists actually understand america. Yeah, i mean, i am not a big fan of donald trump. I think his presidency has been very difficult for those of us who live here very difficult for the rest of the world. Hes and some ways taken a wrecking ball to the world america made in cooperation with its allies after world war 2. But i do think its a mistake to see trump is some kind of bolt from the blue as someone who broke in a fundamental way with american traditions. Because as i discussed in the book trumps isolationism, his unilateralism, his protectionism, his racism, all of those actually buttes have very strong roots in american history. Going back to the founders, going back to the late 17 hundreds. And in some ways, i think trump has demonstrated himself to be a very acute politician because hes been able to tap in to that different narrative that different version of american except exceptionalism, america. And is the city on the hill that stands aloof from the world . Not a country that goes out to change the world. And so right now, i think, as biden prepares to take office, we do see the country going through a searching debate about the nature of its role moving forward. And my own view is its time for the country to find the middle ground between where it was in the pre pearl harbor era, which was doing too little and running away from the world where it has been more recently, which is drawing, trying to do too much particularly in the middle east, to find that stable middle ground to step back, but not to step away. Drove over as he did is, hes a racist, and things may be bad for you in the u. S. And the trump as far as you see it, but surely the rest of the world, a large portions of it have breathed a sigh of relief because trump was attempting to draw down on troops. He wasnt going to boehm syria, maybe the way Hillary Clinton would have done in 2016 if she had won. Well, you know, i think that there is agreement here in the United States and in many other parts of the world that the United States did overstep in the middle east. And that the wars in afghanistan, you know, iraq in syria and libya have not gone well. There are a few things. Democrats and republicans agree on today. I think one of them is its time to reduce the u. S. Footprint in the middle east. And so i think that the trend that trump started, which is to took get out of syria, pull back from afghanistan and pull back from iraq. That will continue where i think youll see a dramatic change is on the diplomatic front. Because the isolationist sentiment that trump demonstrated was coupled with a fierce unilateralism pulling out of pacts, dissing allies. And i think biden will do the opposite. Youll rejoin paris hill, rejoin the World Health Organization to try to renegotiate the iran nuclear deal. Hell breathe new life into nato, so the u. S. Will lead and diplomatically, even as it leans back militarily. And for me, thats exactly the right formula. Or is that actually a cover of a covert activity . Because obviously, there obama, there was, well, actually there was over activity, wouldnt africas resist because of the country was destroyed all but destroyed by obama. And we know the blood in the said he supports one in venezuela, the location of the worlds greatest fossil fuel resources. We know, he said he has to pay this, this. He was much tougher than anything trying to say, you know, i think that trumps relationship with russia has been very strange, very difficult to unpack. He has shown some affinity for a lot of mir putin, even in a time when putin has been interfering in, in american elections. And so i think what youll see is a tougher line from mr. Biden, but also a pragmatism, willing to engage a policy. There hasnt really been policy toward anything here in the United States. Theres been a lot of tweeting, but i dont think there has been a sustained approach to russia to china or to the other major issues. And you know, going back to being a multilateral player, doesnt in my mind, mean anything covertly. I think it needs that the United States will reclaim its, its reputation mantle of being a coalition builder. And it will do so quite openly. And you know, even though there are some countries out there, russia among them that may have supported trumps reelection. I think that in many respects the chaos that trump has created, the sense that the world is on edge doesnt do anybody any good. And that i think the russians and others that supported trump will find the world a more predictable and a more Peaceful Place when there is someone in the white house that people trust. Obviously putin rather than i any interference with foreign elections. So youre saying it will be tougher than him to trump, who was expelled, more russian diplomats. The other president in history, who put more troops on russias borders than any in recent times who has built exaggerated the forces and also put more forces in the South China Sea against china, is going to be more than trumpeted against china russia. Yeah, i think on russia there will be what i would call a very frank conversation. And again, i think, i think mr. Biden is, is a pragmatist and he will be open to a better relationship with russia, but it will take, give from the russians. I think particularly on ukraine, where mr. Biden is committed to seeing the conflict and on boss and, and that will take concessions by both ukrainians, but russians as well and the kremlin needs to be prepared to do some hard work on that front. I think also on this question of interference in western elections, theyll be tough conversations between mr biden and mr. Putin, it never happened under mr. Trump and china is, well, i think theyll be, and i dialogue that has essentially collapsed during the trump era. Do the underlying issues suddenly disappear. Now there are conflicts of interest over trade over security in the western pacific over human rights. Those arent going to go away. But i do think that there will be an effort to address these issues in a frank way between washington and beijing that really wasnt in place during the Trump Presidency. Joo new book writes about north isolationism, as it were, by the United States in so many countries that i cant even name them all from albania, guatemala, costa rica, syria, egypt, if you have you dont think the term presidency has led many in the global south. Let alone in moscow and beijing to think what gives the right of the United States to mess around in any, any world issues. Thats all it is. A country live is led wars that have killed wounded or displaced tens of millions of people just in the past decade. It has no right to do anything anymore. Well, you know, one of the things i want to expose in the book is that thats relatively new. And that from 1718 9 until the end of the 19th century, the United States was quite expansionist in north america. Right. It pushed right across to the pacific coast, took land from mexico, trampled on native americans, but then it stopped and it went no further. And it really did follow the guidance of the founders, which was we should have commercial connections with everybody by political and geo political connections with no one that starts to change with the spanishamerican war. And the United States becomes part, particularly interventionist in the western hemisphere. And that really does begin the era that continues after 941. 00 of our robust american engagement has the United States made mistakes in its foreign policy. Yes. Was the decision to invade iraq under george w. Bush, a mistake that we will be paying for for quite some time . Yes, and i think americans have realized that those mistakes have been made. And thats one of the reasons that were seeing the pendulum swing back toward a more selective brand, i think on the military front. And thats why i think youll see the retrenchment that began under trump continue under mr. Biden, particularly when it comes to commitments in the middle east. Well have to talk about the Defense Budget next time. Reza charles, thank you very much. My pleasure. After the break, the Progressive Left in the usa, self delusional about pushing biden to the left. When it comes to war in the quality of capitalism, we talked a great drange, lindorff, Rolling Stones and polish them all. Coming up about 2 of going on the ground there because well see will the oceans the driver who was seen through and through the movie i clowned border doesnt actually matter. Vegetable would have been murdered by hugo that one us because all of those going to use the word because those told me again we will see in the movie it is with the weve seen it all seen in more business, but is the most severe. Some of it is in your speech, come off, and it is the of the 20th century was thing in or of revolution, the Great Depression and world wars, the 21st century of mental illness. Those arent my words, thats what therapists and psychiatry tell us. The only question is, should we accept it as a fact or no. On election night, you may know whether the margin for the winner is so large that it is impossible for the defeated candidate to catch up. So there may still be 10000 votes to count, but the margin is 80000 votes and it doesnt matter if all 10000 votes went for the defeated candidate, they cannot possibly catch up and thats where we are today. Joe bidens margin is so large in of all of the states are being contested, that even though some of the states have not finished counting, they still know who won. And joe biden won a majority of the Electoral College votes. Welcome back. Well, we had a glimpse of what is in store for the United States in the world when or if biden assumes the presidency in january. But what does it mean for progressives fearing a return to obama era corporate bailouts and drone warfare . Joining me now from new jerseys Rolling Stones matt taibbi. Matt, thanks so much for coming back on. So im going to us from the top. If, if biden has one, why is socalled Mainstream Media and new liberal society in the United States . So angry about litigation just running itself out and getting the most accurate result for their candidate for a long time. Story line that donald trump would not may not willingly leave power has been such an appealing storyline for a lot of people in the news media. You know, his refusal to concede in to go through this legal process, which i think is just going to play itself out and use going to end up leaving. And its not going to result in anything. But you know, its like a lot of bombshell news stories in the last 4 years that they want to milk every bit of sensationalism out of it. And the idea that he might not leave is you know, thrilling to horrifying to consider a whole lot of what is in a hollywood men time. You know, we see 40000000, people in the United States will not be able to eat tonight without your snap food stamp program. Does that not concern these people of the country . This sort of political thriller on january the 20th. Again, the what leads the news is dictated by, you know, a handful of people in new york, washington and l. A. , who run the biggest news organizations as we saw once again with these results. You know, the press and the Political Class have a bit of a disconnect in terms of understanding where most people are in this country. Yet its not surprising. And when it comes to the existential threat, say, of climate change, all these people celebrating a biden victory. What do they think is going to happen if hes any fracking under a biden presidency . Well, the, the assumption that you get from democrats, when you ask about that issue is, well, no matter what, hell be better than trump, right . Which is, which is kind of the blanket response to almost any policy issue when you get get right down to it. But, you know, there isnt a whole lot of evidence in the background of this, this type of democrat thats, you know, thats octets, occupy the head of the party since the clinton years, that theyre really very strong on it are myron mental issues and theyre always going to listen to their donors, head of, you know, other people on issues like that. And it just hopelessly naive for any one watching from the global south. This interview that if biden was an african leader, he might be the i. C. C. For colluding in wars that have killed wounded on his place, tens of millions. And thats, thats, that could be the president of United States in january. But i think any american president could be, could be brought up on over issues like that. I think its only the preeminence the United States is a military power around the world to prevent that kind of thing from happening. Bidens role in a lot of those wars that we have had over the last couple of decades. Again to most americans. Its in consequential because the, the larger, the larger issue is, trump ok, more specifically, the drone strikes that obama biden and the reports of 90 percent civilian kill rate and we see a return to the kind of mass drone strikes. I know the trump also was a fan of drone strikes space, specifically in yemen, when obama was supporting the saudi bombardment of the wild, west humanitarian crisis. Yes, i wrote a couple of features about drones and i didnt really start doing that until the trump years because i was covering finance before that. But the drone strikes did go up under trump if the people who are rumored to be going back into the National Security establishment end up taking those places. I think we can assume that theres going to be some continuity with the obama era policies, which is where the drone program, the, you know, the Lethal Action programs as i like to call them. I think theyre probably going to continue. And we just want hear about them very much because the president not likely to pay a lot of attention. Charm clearly thinks hes won. Hes reshuffling things at the pentagon with one adviser who once said troops out from afghanistan from syria. I want to say maybe cooperation now belatedly with iran into being room and do you think say fred, julien, the son sure, is in prison just a few miles from this studio. His best shot is trump to release him before january, because biden called him a high tech terrorist. Yes, i dont know again why trump wouldnt have done that before the election is kind of a mystery to me. Trump, unlike his predecessor barack obama, who used the espionage act to go after i think it was 10 different leakers during his presidency. He really are only on holstered with, with julian and songe. And though he publicly flirted with the idea of pardoning at me, he never did it. I doubt the songes going to get a better deal under biden. Although it has to be said that the Obama Administration hesitated to prosecute a songe formally when, when obama was in office. And it was only only trumpet. Took that step right on a quest. Healthy manning was being tortured under obama. Right . Of course. Yes. What is this Progressive Left that is pushing biden, that we suddenly on right wing talking points. Michael moore, the great filmmaker has been tweeting about, kemal harris. Can we assume that Vice President , a Vice President harris will not now be advocating the locking up of innocent people for prison labor like he did in california . Well, if you remember who the president is, i mean, joe biden was one of the primary authors of the 1904 crime bill, which was a you know, a kind of signature moment in the history of mass incarceration in this country. He certainly didnt have the reputation of being any kind of advocate for criminal justice reform. Heading into this election cycle, the political winds of change somewhat, and both harris and biden have adopted the pose of people who are, are going to be on the side of criminal justice reform. But i, again, i think looking back at their history, it would be unwise to expect that to happen. Well, thatll depress a lot of progressives here in the pit of america. What are you to take thing from faith. People like kaohsiung saan, his shots across the bow as warning shots. Biden harris. First of all, i was just important in defense of new jersey. I dont think were the armpit of america. I love this place but. But, you know, look the major, some plot of what happened in the last election cycle was you know, the kind of dismantling and neutering of the sanders opposition. They were in position to win the nomination. Sanders was the leading fund raiser, which was a tremendous Political Development because it was a proof of a concept that nobody thought was possible competing without corporate money. And yet sanders in the end was beaten rather badly, and he performed worse than he did. And you 1016, which is taken a lot of the sails out of that movement. So, you know, i dont, i dont, we dont see a whole lot of evidence of that Coalition Putting pressure on biden, yet, they might but, but so far, were not seeing a whole lot of that. I should just, i meant competent. Pejoratively, i was thinking of industrialized labor, the patters until the strike year i had brain. And of course, black lies madam began with the atrocities against people of color. And by did they use the movement to get power, or will we see the funding of the police . I dont know. I dont think that joe biden is particularly offended. Defunding the police. I actually dont think most americans, frankly, are fans of defunding the police. I think, i think almost everybody agrees that there has to be significant reform of police. Are we going to see a whole lot of that . Its hard to say, but a lot of those issues are at the state level and not federal. So itll be difficult to enact it, you know, from, from the white house to the no, going to constitutionally change that you mentioned. I mean, i suppose when i only know about it from, from the journalists that are good enough to cover it. And im going to be the journalists have been good at covering the human rights abuses by the trumpet, ministration, when it came to immigration and so forth. How can we be that these elite china lissa going to be covering lation as of the u. N. Charter that are enacted by biden harris . I mean, i think its certainly that my primary worry about what, what took place in the last 4 years. And what we have to think about Going Forward is that the press has changed radically in the United States during the trump era. Weve seen a shift towards most Corporate News organizations essentially being proxies for the Democratic Party. And they justified on the grounds of we have to opposed all trump, but now the democrats are going to be assuming the white house. How do you go back to being a press that challenges people in power . I think its very, very difficult to take that step once youve taken, you know, the step backwards. Its a b. Into a more politicized media. Netanyahu trumps a best friend has a congratulated on his other best friend, arguably, joe biden, on winning the election. What is going to be u. S. Policy viz of me, israel and how will that impact on any possible biden policies on iran, on afghanistan, on syria . Crucially, again, i just dont think that theres going to be a significant change or deviation from the kind of standard neo liberal policy of democracy promotion, foreign based foreign policy. So itll be different to trump because obviously this company wiser is saying we should get out of syria. Well, the syria hawks are probably going to be much more empowered under a biden administration. I think the relationship with israel is going to remain preeminent there, although there is a movement, a Progressive Movement to you know, stand behind the palestinians. Somewhat in the democratic side. Its not enough that i dont think to tilt the policy, the Democratic Party, not yet. So i just wouldnt expect a major change there. I do think that syria, theres going to be a more aggressive posture toward syria than there was under trial. And trump, of course, we expelled russian diplomats. He destroyed the Stock Nuclear proliferation nonproliferation treaty. Hey, put troops on russias, boy, it is. And biden still said putin has to pay. So another existential question, arguably. What do you think biden meant by putin has to pay . Whats he going to do . I would expect the Democratic Party once they occupy the white house, undertake a series of measures that will be largely performative in terms of, you know, looking like theyre standing up to russia. Whether thats, you know, in ukraine, whether its expelling more diplomats in retaliation for you know, what theyre going to call election interference. But i fundamentally that the people who are coming back into power are the same. People who, you know, over the course of 20 years, or 20 or 30 years in, including a period when i was living in russia, you know, sought to have some kind of a relationship with, with rt, with russia often to combat terrorism. So i wouldnt, i dont think its to be excluded, that there will be a softening in relations. I think a lot of the tension with russia was largely based on the it was political as open as a means of getting at all of trump. And now that hes out of power, you know, maybe things will improve on that score. That score. Thank you very much. Thats. I mean, the show will be back on monday, 18 is a day since the 1st case of saucers, a quote in the Guangdong Province in china, known as the 1st corona virus pandemic of the 21st century. And its taken me 2 decades to reach the same number of deaths worldwide as co in 1000 as unless they had the will then join the on the ground by following us on you tube twitter, facebook, instagram, and join me every thursday on the alec simon show. And ill be speaking to guest on the world of politics, sports business, im show business. Ill see you then. This is a story of women, women with troubled history. The person that they considered the most dangerous of criminals. All the off, 23 hours of the day. Tell me that this look forward to talking to people like human beings, except when conflict with the 1st point is to protect its own existence. Headline stories are the armenian pain in the war with protests in europe over the signing of the new deal, which many russian peacekeepers have set up. Observation posts along the border peace agreement. Local Officials Say their arrival in the war torn region also ahead in washington d. C. Against the results of the 2020 president ial election