Explore pluto about how high the stakes are when it comes to space all this more coming up in this lockdown edition of going underground but 1st lets go to portland to Gregory Mackell hes the vice chair of the Oregon Democrats black caucus gregory what on earth is going on in portland were seeing images all over the internet of tear gas of warfare not seen even in even in countries where the u. N. Is impose sanctions on. Yeah its really appalling to see in the streets of berlin its right downtown in the heart of our city and every night appears to look like a war zone we have troops in camouflage police deploying tear gas and flash bangs and its absolute chaos down town portland and its hard to see in a city that i love so much now you know the child was the boss of a department of Homeland Security says youre all violent and i casts on the streets of poland apparently they using george w. Bushs 2002 Homeland Security act 20. 00 to not change under president obama that allows the federal security Security Forces to attack what they presumably see as valid advocates yeah i mean im not a violent man i care if they have never committed violence at a protest much of what they say is violent an arche is actually graffiti. I know that many people are appalled to see that graffiti but i think that images such as george floyd getting the life choked out of him or even the flash bangs and rylan that weve seen at these protests as much more appalling than any graffiti that may occur at a protest and i also think it is a very small amount of individuals who may do that graffiti and it does not make sense in a country those host to be a free country that they would be deploying indiscriminate weapons against entire nonviolent crowds just because of the actions of some small amount of individuals while the nato nations are supposed to i dont know media in countries that washington may see as enemies the pictures of had to be on the internet mainly theyre not headlining the news what have you witnessed and what have you heard from the street level actions of Police Involved in because weve been seeing what seem to be u. S. Federal forces attacking protesters on the ground amidst clouds of tear gas. I think what youre seen is accurate but i think that part of the story that is missed is that this happened because a 50 days of protest before the federal officers came in and before it was federal officers to point here gas it was our own local Police Departments that were deploying tear gas and beating protesters and so its just continued weve seen terror for years with mayors in america as well as. The president himself not over what to do about pro test but rather who gets to beat up protesters who gets to detain them who gets to throw them in a unmarked bands who gets to deploy tear gas and so at some point the person deplane the tear gas might change the tenor on the ground in the. City of the protests i dont think its going to end until we see justice for people like Brianna Taylor and george floyd and many others that have been killed by police in portland while president jiang has previously been on the record as saying of course the likewise another Movement Began under obama not his presidency and hes saying that there would be no poor blood he would be burned it would be burned to the ground if it wasnt for those federal forces anything personally that said touch your mother demonstrations. Yeah i mean the effects of this tear gas i think are incredibly scary we were there in full protective gear trying to help people out of the gas you dont actually see it coming in it just in the air its not like a cloud that you can run from there was no warning your skin begins to burn and then eventually your eyes you can completely not see cant breathe and it completely immobilizes you so its not even a effective way for crowds to be dispersed rather it makes you have to stop you cant see you cant run away with it were. Stan exposes you to hits from baton and sent a rest in excedrin and i also think that there are long term effects as well as the short term effects of the tear gas that we dont yet know all of the details about you know for people around the world watching they probably dont know or cortland is i suppose there have been never reports that its one of their happiest most sought after places to live in the world to tell me just a little bit about poland because i understand even that story isnt true because it mosques are racially racist past yeah absolutely portland is a beautiful pristine city and there are a lot about it that i like and i think that we can see that many of our Community Members deeply care about our city and thats why weve been out protesting but portland and the state of oregon have a racist past or again it was not a slave state upon its inception but not because it did not. For any moral reasons but rather because it did the oregonian did not want black People Living in the state and whether they were slave or not and because of that blacks were excluded from the state of oregon for a very long time there are still deeds to peoples houses that say that they cannot be sold to people that are black that is obviously not enforceable because of interpretations of the constitution now but those deeds exist and theres a lot of races history here not just of exclusion but then also of a lack of infrastructure as black communities have flooded in there and thats because of that and then we see gentrification and disparate police scene that occurs in portland just as many cities in america. Well what do you think you are democrats nancy pelosi said that trump is turning it into a banal or a republic i mean i mean that and itself is a strange phrase to use i cant believe because it has redolent of us empire in that he or hemisphere with you he with. And then trump is suggesting that youre perry and they try and then you live in a Banana Republic thats what they see these pictures show thats all these federal forces in portland maine. Where i think its important to know that this is just a small part of. The entire city is not under siege but i do fear about what this could look like in other cities i do fear about what impact it can have on the election or even our ability to have an election as you know the city is definitely largely democrat and if cities are turned into war zones in the heart of their cities across the country come november it makes it a lot harder to especially at a time in which many places do not have mail in voting and so i do wary about the impacts but i do think that it is also still important to know d that this is not having a huge every day effect on every single persons life in portland but i do think that if elected officials both locally and at the National Level such as nancy pelosi dont do more to protect cities from this sort of envision that we could be in a situation that might not necessarily be a banana Banana Republic but does look a lot like fascism. Well a survey donald trump says of the mail in Voting System means that you might not even have elections in november you did you did imply that forgetting the. Trump stuff there is some state level responsibility that needs to be taken because ted wheel has been seen as some kind of hero he was hit by share gas himself the mayor there is he to blame partly as well because he said the state Security Forces were there before the federal troops and and they too were not policing the demonstrations as they should be mean. I think ted will is fully to blame because there are a lot of steps that could have been taken to prevent this sort of federal invasion as i said there were 50 some odd days of protests prior to dharma chums invasion in those protests had nothing to do with dharma jobs had to do with our local police and those protests where tear gas in and be in and arrested just the same as the federal officers had been doing so what i would have said is that if ted wheeler would have stood with his people from the beginning if he would have been al in the streets with his own people from the beginning we would have not been in this situation had he not d been trying to demonize protesters himself using the same rhetoric that we had talked about earlier about there being a mile an hour kiss and outside agitators and trying to quell protests himself we would not be in this situation and if he had just simply listened to the demands of the community and how we wanted to reform in the fire and in reallocate funds from violent policing into our community at a time during a pandemic where our Community Needs those files if he had done all of those things we would have seen 50 something days of protest and thus the federal officers would have not come in so yes he did stand and get tear gassed one single day his own Police Department threatened to use tear gas and against those same protesters once he had left that night and had also used tear gas and continue to use tear gas against protesters in conjunction with Donald Trumps federal officers well u. N. Permanent Security Council members china Russia Britain france then are raising this at the u. N. Security council and your top law officer in your country bill maher he said your fellow activists are using tasers pellet guns all manner of ammunition against Law Enforcement thats thats the view of your top law officer in your country. I would hesitate to think that he truly believes that and if he does he is having bad information. Ask him to maybe attend these protests and see how peaceful they are we see things like people cooking their 247 and feeding in our houses community we see people just standing there are signs and chanting in so incredibly nonviolent protest that has been cracked down on i think so that images of chaos can be seen in that bureau can then be used for damage charms reelection bid to say that this is the rylan democrats and this is what is coming if you vote for joe biden. But this is trumps america right now in the violence in the chaos that were seeing is being ensued by his federal police force as well as local Police Forces well theres finally joe biden the contender democrat contender in november presumed contender hasnt even been to paul and why should anyone in portland expect things to be different if joe biden is the president given well on racial issues hes known of course for opposing the segregation of schools in his background and his past. I think joe biden definitely has a lot of work to do when it comes to ration it but the thing is i believe that he is willing to put in that where can i dont know i think weve seen 4 years of donald trump in a way he is willing to do and i believe that his presidency is an existential crisis but again if the federal troops leave it doesnt matter if joe biden were to send them back or if donald trump were to send them back we will still see protests in cities across america because. Of these protests the death of george floyd as well as the reminder of all the deaths that have occurred in portland or in play in cities across the country and those usually were happening at state and local levels and they happened during obamas presidency that and during times presidency so theres something very broken with our policing system and regardless of who the president is we have a lot of work as a nation to reconcile that right mcalary stay safe thank you so much for being on the program. Thank you i appreciate it thanks for having me after the break the man who is leading one of the for this to explorations in Human History tells us just how high the stakes are when it comes to a lot being the secrets of the universe all this is all going on in part 2 of going underground. How can you explain love ive been to 82 countries i did in 12 but i came here and on those 3 days i just filled with hope. And. Sick. I made my decision to come here because d i felt and you i could build a new life. For god decided that this man is no good to be free. Then he sees. My one dream is that all my children d find the same kind of happiness i do. I love my home i love cold weather i like the culture i like the history i like everything about it. And i know that. Russian fama. Geysers financial survival. When customers go buy. Well we do some of our. Thats undercutting but whats good for markets its not good for the global economy. It. Has to come down to mars continues to perseverence of humanity want to get a generation of robotic explorers to the red planet. Welcome back well in the past few days while weve been on lockdown other people have been going to outer space joining me now from boulder in colorado is alan stern whos been working on a project to the farthest reaches of space alan thanks so much for joining us just tell us 1st about the launch and what the mission ends yeah and nasa launched its latest moores rover in the one twit perfectly and the spacecraft has already made contact with the earth and seems to be in good health and is on the on course landings in february and this is really different because this rover is going to cache samples around the surface of mars for another mission to curry. In return to the earth later in the twentys and how long is it going to take for all of. Well its probably going to take most of the decade because the return mission hasnt yet been started so theyll get that under way and i think now that this is their launch and whats it like as a scientist working these things out on such big time spans i mean i know you work with Jeff Bezos Blue Origin here he was testifying in congress there are you you work with so many Different Private Companies but youre working on time scales are 10 years 20 years longer. Yes or the mission stay for a long time to take a long time to get funded and then we have to design and build them and then fly them across these enormous distances the solar system so its all about delayed gratification and of course the usual questions and answers mean asked since its inception is it worth it whats the point maybe you better remind some of our audience about the side effects of what seems like as a terror Expert Missions to far off places well to the contrary of course the development of space and Space Exploration as probably changed our world countless ways me take your i saw. Your smartphone whatever it might be that Space Technology that g. D. S. That you use for location for mapping for knowing where you are now Space Technology and then look at the entire tech economy which is fueled by the inspiration of children who want to grow up and be engineers scientists largely because they get hooked on tech through seeing Space Missions that inspire you see anyone can say that it was a pride of the United States the Space Program by nasa do you think the miller less inclined towards it because of all the private funds seeping in there its less about the United States and more about these private companies and people every more suspicions of private companies being involved in space than that the u. S. As a nation. Well i think the introduction of private space flight has been a tremendous boon for innovation in for driving costs down and that lets us get more done and most of these private companies are after all currently in the United States were just beginning to see a european wave of private spaceflight launch companies eccentric and i cant wait to see that flower but i mean are there dangers in that there were some reports that when the Space Shuttle tragically blew up it was because of private outro acing of space flight i mean on this mission that youre working on presumably it all government funding theres no private elements to it. Well the new Horizons Mission is a nasa mission its fairly funded by nasa which is a arm of our federal government and why do you think that congress is mean reluctant to sign off on money that trump wanted to go i think i understand jumper made a request for 25200000. 00 for nasa the house not liking any is monday in political. Parties and issues on the hill that tell you scientists dont really concern yourself with but vaguely understand theyre going to impact your missions yeah well actually in our country Space Exploration is is supported by both major parties and theyre arguing about the last 10 percent of nasa budget not the basic 98 percent and in fact both president ial candidates have come out and endorsed continue tuman exploration continue Robotic Exploration studies of the earth are so important that we do from space and i think the level of disagreement is down at that its sales id like to see a higher budget but well have to see how that turns out and just your mind is also i guess why its important to actually go to these places rather than use radio telescopes arrays of telescopes here on earth or even space telescopes yeah well its simple he telescopes even the very largest ones really cant produce the kind of detail that we need in order to understand these worlds and its only by going there and bringing the cameras up close that we can understand it yalit gee if we can sample their atmospheres and we can search for signs of underwater underground oceans and evidence for astrobiology for life that may have arisen elsewhere in the city sustained yes i do know is has led him it and it has paid dividends before this kind of going to the place rather than using telescopes. Absolutely and you know probably the biggest did it is the inspiration that it its its really human beings at our best only human beings explore only human beings create new knowledge and i think Space Exploration is probably the best example of that you know time or some animals are going to wonder about me basically the big geopolitical stories involving space are about space forces dont try wanting to stop militarization of space worries in nature a nation press about china going to the dark side of the moon for the 1st time of course china and the u. A. E. Going to maz what do you make of these militarization stories i presume theres nothing military about this mission is absolutely nothing military about what nasa does in terms of Science Missions like new horizons but you know the militarization of space started in the 1950 s. And sixtys and. Early as the early 2000 the chinese and other countries were conducting any satellite weapons tests and its unfortunate that space is now with your eyes but like every other domain for seats away and its just another place as human beings operate and its a place where we need to have our differences at least yeah russia had to deny that it was involved in some kind of satellite warfare in the past few days but can you understand why people are going to be suspicious of missions like this and certainly do you realize that some of your future funding could be siphoned off to more military escapades rather than your pure scientific research. Or not very worried about that because to the contrary although that space is the notarized for decades the nasa budget has been stable if not growing over that time and i think that the public civilian Space Program and now the entree of commercial companies are are really showing that thats the way that humans need to become a multi planet species expand into the solar system for economic good for new knowledge for inspiration and frankly. In some respects because its what we do its its how human beings set ourselves apart from all the other species only earth we are explorers will you mention those private private entities but as i said you work for jeff bezos a Space Company for a while youve done a lot of private work actually the public all are arguably is more and more worried about these kweisi monopoly companies having dominance over markets here on planet earth and presumably the natural worry is that theyre going to start trying to monopolize space who knows mining for minerals in space why this emphasis and why your approval of private corporations who are being called out here on earth and call rest for abusing their positions allegedly why do you want them to go into space. Well let me say to begin that i dont know of any instance of. The United States congress that using private companies abusing their position in space that may be true on the earth and it may be true with for example the internet i dont know of any such instances space and what private space investment is doing is creating tremendous weight of innovation like we saw when computers went from rare and expensive to routine and inexpensive because the developer the p. C. Were seeing developing a small innovative satellite systems low cost reusable launch all of this is helping us explore do more science and extend humans into the cosmos in ways we couldnt when it was a little a government monopoly space for. Yeah you know that the pure science was done a publicly funded universities the peer or innovation fannys have been done to show that it is public funding that has created Core Research you mentioned the technology of an i phone its not me is private companies or anything a private company siphon off all that public taxpayer money funded research and try to privately capitalize off. Here i have to disagree with you and ill give you a specific example private companies are now launching large numbers of satellites to study the earth the climate Climate Change and nasa the premier space agency on the planet is behind datasets from those companies because they cant get it any other way because theyre the private companies are producing valuable datasets to the Scientific Community that the government satellites are not producing and i think theyre voting with their feet and showing that this wave of innovation and this explosion of new applications for space is curing. Time have a lot of money just vinyl and then the type of belt itself i mean people will know the one day plutos a planet the next it isnt why is there being so much confusion and will this Mission Clear up what is going on at that far end of the solar system that seems to from year to year decade to decade change the textbooks have to change. Well in fact new horizons as you really written a textbook from scratch on this most distant part of the solar system the 1st exploration of the pluto system the 1st exploration of the quaker belt a vast array of discoveries including the possibility that pluto even harder dast ocean larger than the earths oceans and you know were learning so much through ground based telescopes and Space Missions their view of what a planet is has changed at 1st we thought there were only the 9 and then we discovered so many more in our own solar system and then other Solar Systems around faraway stars the strong words got a little bit afraid of that thought that the numbers were too big we should legislate by coating what is and what isnt a planet but the real experts the people in my field in Planetary Science never really paid attention to that you can see that in the scientific literature at scientific meetings where planets like cluedo are referred to as planets by the experts every single day and i think the astronomers are a little bit still licking their wounds from that state. When he come back on about this mission if we get the images thank you so much that fit for this Long Television going on the ground what the next show on wednesday with legendary oscar winning film director all of 5 and faith faith. Thinking of getting abused coming once we got in our shells no problem was he didnt know until he was trapped in this tiny low wired how much we dont need a crate with him he will just start freaking out and she wont let us bring him anywhere near and thousands of leading dogs are caged in the into lane conditions on puppy farms i mean 67 years you know theyve been locked up in cages outside you see no protection from the weather the heat you know the courtier the rain the snow the funder nothing they have no protection. To get what you. Know its ok. Across the us cruel puppy mills are supported by dog shows and pet stores most of the puppies are coming from this large Scale Factory farming kind of operations are being sought and at stores even joined a good businesses are involved like cargill among santa there has been a shocking amount of organized opposition to efforts to increase the standards of care for dogs bred in commercial rating for so many most of that opposition is coming from huge agricultural groups and industries that have nothing to do with jobs dont buy dog on a routine. Ah no team no crow. No shots no. Action news well to be. Going to stress no 1st to. Point your thirst. For action. On september 19th 1977 she didnt you now a subsidiary of the likes corporation announced that it was closing down most of its campbell plant 5000 Steel Workers many of them skilled that are engines of 20 to 30 years lost their jobs its hard to believe that may have to work and you know many years ago i did believe they were put out on the street dont know what were going to do it really started in the late seventies when these companies were able to move their production off