Transcripts For RT Going Underground 20240713

Anthem what happens to a russian fan who goes to lets say talk to support a team under a white flag or whatever whatever that flag is i dont know and the fan sings an anthem in the street where hes going to be taken to into custody by by the local police i mean how does this work is completed. I mean you got one point when john taylor brought his package and he said so what would happen if for example. If we go to cuss and he go no they wont win so this decision will not be changing cars how can you do that that sounds like an absolute dictatorship but if you go to court of law the highest court in sport the court of arbitration of sport youve had a case and say look these are all the points which we mentioned 26. 00 russian athletes had their cases overturned much to the disdain of lot of love the anti doping community because they presented no we did not fail test we did not do anything wrong looking. We. If you go to kos surely then its you and if you print the right ever since you are you sure you succeed knew you are creative hes already said here no you wont so what deal has been done behind the scenes it just seems wrong so its completely in force when i think a lot of times you take to talking to a different part of the body than most. Well found the wattle president lecture thing i think it was him repeating a number of times how important todays decision was for the future of antidoping do you think thats true i still cannot understand how letting a nation which is not 100 percent doping nation there are clean athletes there are so many of them how would letting them compete in different competitions and games across the planet and. Solve the problem of doping it does not its not a yacht it is just its doesnt solve anything it just puts a stigma on the nation on the athletes who many of the most of them had nothing to do with the aforementioned doping scandals and and tampering which is a disgrace we should be punished and im really expecting if you had to roll in the sports authorities in this country and i hope this will happen to be honest with you but how does this relate to athletes and how does this clean the world from from doping i mean even the guy who keeps screaming about the need for a blanket ban and all of this along the likes i mean they have so much going on in the backyard as well they have people dying off of steroids i mean that is much more serious than losing in the Olympic Games you know and yet they somehow believe that having enforced those rules having made such a strong decision for the 1st time this somehow resolves the problem of doping no it does not lets be real with it and i want to get your thoughts on that as well and the fact that bunco went on to say that this actually strengthens waters credibility. I think youd like to think and do you really want the world to believe it again you keep using the world word and that can move from disc. Morning. Its not a bomb it is not a ban they are not allowed to show like it was a bar in russia will be completely prevent and so on. If they turn around and said you know what you got your lympics you not go for any nation you go on for your sport for yourself because ultimately the us was meant to be there like you compete against the best of euro or athletes and you are your discipline ok if they said that were not were no longer tied to a state or to a nation is going to go on its a festival sport a new movie children just most important thing that it sort of be a step forward because suddenly the nations of nationalism couldnt creep into it before to doing is. Their 2nd for a massive fall because wants someone to federations like alex he said the. Royce hockey said no were not changing fief will turn around and there will your thumb their nose us out of the wall as well and theyll do what they want to do you have see are going to bring big events to moscow and theyll outsource sorceror theyre testing as well and theyre huge events washing around the world with tens of millions. Its not going to have water in the long run on a thing to use to clean up sport was lost long ago when they use russia as the beating. As it would be boy whipping girl they lost a fight because they started trying to play politics and play into the played into the hands of usada and you cant you are going to ultimately destroy the whole system guys im sure were going to come back to you again but we do want to talk about other points to this story now the scandal of course broke when water analysts found irregularities in the doping test database from the Moscow Laboratory there are discrepancies with data they had obtained earlier from a western blower and leading to the time period between 20122015 russia insists it never tampered with the database and complied with all water requirements and there hawkins picks up the story. Russia saw in limbo once again many of them are just taken the 1st step. Of their sporting careers when this whole doping saga began 5 years ago and back then the World Antidoping Agency accused the rush of a huge cover up they slammed risotto the russian anti doping body as being unfit for purpose and things escalated quickly i think it doping scandal after a ban on its paralympic athletes was upheld blocking the entire team from taking part in the upcoming rio Paralympic Games 15 of the 33 russian Medal Winners were part of a state when doping program the banned the harshest in olympic history hits officials hardest of the Russian Olympic Committee is suspended me no no no. But things seem to blow over moscow denied they had a state run doping program but admitted they had a problem the Russian Olympic Committee was reinstated and even now reformed other was given the green light subject to strict conditions. That we actively cooperate with the requirements that they should go to russia are fully implemented but there was no happy ending water required full access the russian of 3 data related to the field of doping testing after a brief deadline delay this was provided in generate 2019 fast forward to all time and things have gone wrong again this time water accused russia of tampering with the data while the 29 team copy of the Laboratory Information Management System elias database matches in many respects the 2015 copy of provided to wander by a whistle blower in 2017 hundreds of presumptive adverse analytical findings that appear in the 2015 copies have been removed from the 2019 copy and the related underlying real data and p. D. F. Files have been deleted altered or water havent named the mysterious whistleblower but one key witness at the very. Of this doping scandal is going to go rotting coffee before fleeing to the United States where he is now in a Witness Protection Program he was head of the moscow to borrow a tree for 10 years and it turns out his reputation is far from spotless the icy further find that at the heart of the positive drug test coverup is director rod chin cough he not only accepted brutha requested money in order to execute the concealment of positive test results which makes him equally responsible for incidents where coaches or officials extorted athletes even if he was not personally made aware of the extortion no wonder independent russian experts have doubts about the consistency and reliability of the data. Since november 28th 15 when the informant left our country till 2017 when the informants data set was handed over to the Water Intelligence and Investigations Department 6 data bank was at the informants disposal he could do anything to it but they allege the system was accessed hundreds of times from abroad and that rod chung cough who is wanted in russia for abuse of office and drug charges may have been complicit in tampering with the messages in the system independent forensic examination suggests that rushing of support Staff Members to my fisa bill if ski and let me get your remotely logged into the limbs in moscow on numerous occasions after they had detected abroad so they could have changed the zeros to ones both in their database copy and the one that remained in russia and the monies may need to know what is up but russia cut off access to its data base in 2016 while water claims data was being tampered with as late as january 29th team blaming russia further significant deletions and or alterations were made in december 28th seen and generally 2019 i. E. After the war the exco imposed a day to requirement these activities were. Backdating of Computer Systems and data files in an attempt to make it appear that the morse code data had been in their current state since 2015 furthermore the commands issued to execute the manipulations deletions and backdating what also deleted in the attempt to avoid detection of what had been done russian experts challenge the pause ability of the investigations findings claiming that such large scale tampering is simply impossible it was that and we cant do it we cannot deny that there were occurrences of copies of files being destroyed and other fast created but there were no deliberate manipulations this is the working condition of the database when every year the operator begins to work with this database to change delete and free memory there was a complaint to us the desert disk was reset but the entry was exactly 17 seconds it was impossible to completely delete information on the disk during this time so how do things stand now fortunately very much where they left off accusations of lawyers and get another cover up by water counter allegations by russian officials questioning the credibility of findings based on the testimony of a controversial informant while the fate of hundreds of athletes are supposed to be innocent until Proven Guilty hangs in the balance. We cross live now to martin dolls are a member of the Hamburg Parliament for the left party for life comment on this now what i says it made a balanced decision today what kind of balance do you think theyre talking about. Oh i can see youre you balance and that decision i think is a clearly political move to boot it decision. Exactly when we look at the justice. Of the right mood in one of the fundamental belief of modern societies the collective guilt is nothing which should be proceeded in a modern society know where there is the political conflict between western countries the new 2 countries and russia earth sports to my mind is misused term to bring forward political in this on the show this sport and of glitz meanwhile every individual atlas and as well nations should have the right to compete in sport because sport could be a means of friendship and dialogue in between people and between countries and if i may ask you while we see the situation is very sensitive in many ways because the accusations leveled against russia are pretty serious you know tampering with their database trying to sort of a raise the past of some sorts all right let me lets imagine this is the case and russia gets. A justified punishment of sorts but at the same time how can you rectify a situation like that under the premise of fight against doping by not allowing clean athletes have never done anything wrong to compete under a neutral flag not being able to represent the country do you think this is the right kind of punishment for the allegations that theyve put forward. You know its not the right kind of. Man to face if you look more clearly and another take at all the just of the dog being of course as nothing good. Damages you have alerts and it damages the reputation of those who do it of those actors who are doing it but a collective punishment like we see now never can be the way to rectify something if you want to overcome dorking you have to clear sports of. The. That only the one who wins is the one was a winner of sports splotch will be something where you compete and if your 1st or 2nd or it doesnt matter so much as long you can compete compete in friendship so there has to be a mental change and now i think this debate and what wedo has doing until now as far as i can see i did a bit of research and i could see that some of the leading person a lot of the rushing of the muscular authority were fleeing to the us and then theres an accused accusation that the money plead to data as far as this is not totally clear down to night and that situation there shouldnt be some kind of punishment and even if there had been Something Like. Lets say a. Systematic collusion then you can look to have done it and you can you see you can answer against a person who done it but not against one nation and not against the athletes with nothing to do and who have nothing to do with that schedule and so i think its not the right way we have some individual justice and national framed we have some going to do justice in the end of courts and the international a frame and this we can handle this problem very seriously but there shouldnt be Something Like that in the world nation of all the outlets from football championships Olympic Games the i. O. C. Has come out saying that they are in full agreement with wadas decision something that comes as no surprise to anybody i think now russia does say that it will appeal this decision and today the water panel said that they dont see a cast overturning it do you think that there is any chance for that appeal to have less success. I dont want to give a pre justice to prejudice but you know when i see you have the political situation in the moment we have a frame where the nations like the us a center you reinstates. Which are conducting a month and a 2020 in the next months and the beginning of next year is where they do a big money move of more than 40000. 00 salt i can just can appeal to the. Core which is sending the case to be independent and i hope that it is but i have to i have my goals. So martin you also believe that this decision is somewhat politically driven because i mean ive been trying to distance from politics for a very long time to know much of ale but this decision if you look at how its framed how you know were banning the nation from doing this but we dont even know exactly what were going to do with it with the different championships as to how russia team will go there under which flag under which anthem do you think after all this is a properly politically driven decision in the context of what you were just saying. Yes i think so and the context i think its clearly politically driven is to distribute to russia as a. Country which has the its own integrity and i think that is nothing which should be done on an international that if there is conflict on the office and needs to overcome the conflict and if there is. Sports sports in the you deal case it is just used true compete in a way of internationalism to compete in a way of friendship to bring people together to bring nations together to find ways of communication of the applets brings together populations like we have seen in the socalled want cold war there was room to games you know if the us lets didnt dont. d happen in dialogue and where for example the. Better a job d and the democratic german earth thats as well did a dialogue which tell the nations as well to come into a day or so to my might. Be used as that sport cannot be seen apart from politics because everything has a political d aspect as well but it shouldnt misuse to bring forward a political point to martin or their member of the home or parliament for the left party thank you for your time and for your comments thank you very much and thank you as well have a nice day now the alleged politicization of the matter is not the only criticism over the ban some sports personalities believe that it might demotivate a generation of future athletes. How can you. Not only ban a type of team and that entire supports for my country for 4 years its absolutely ridiculous its an overkill. Water should do its job and deal with claims concerning individual athletes not with the country as a whole but. It isnt fair that everyone pays a price 1st to athletes who are caught doping a 4 year disqualification for athletics who worked tirelessly and were desperate to take part in the olympics it is truly unjust. Any World Championship European Championship without representation from russia is impossible it is just not possible to do because russia is one of the most vivid representatives in any sport to have a dream. Today was 18 years old to go to their lives i will do whatever compete for their country for the love of their sport for the love of their country and try to be number one a poor the best dont want to deal. With. The sport is being dragged down by politics in a place where politics should be completely absent sport is becoming hostage. The influence of politics is intensely felt in this desire to disqualified the whole National Team why does decision to ban russia will affect everybody and it will cause a great shock. Concerning weightlifting i would say that the decisions either politicize or just incorrect sport in politics should remain separate just like we can clearly see that this is political pressure because the russian National Team is a leader in sports thats why everything is being done on the political field. What kind of message is that suddenly mean to our children and we all are talking. Our mission because that is tomorrow where we began the whole country from participating or. I think that 1st and foremost this will affect children and their interest in sports. Our children taken their future away with they want to do with a love away because of what a couple individuals did in the past. Doesnt make any sense at all. So water has just held a conference explaining its decision to ban russia from participating in major Sports Events just to remind you the World Antidoping Agency has banned the russian flag from the Major International tournaments for the next 4 years including of course the upcoming summer olympics in tokyo in 2020. 8 was about water press conference for us and she joins us live with more on this what else was. Well we had some clarity about what this ban will effectively mean its a 4 year ban as you pointed out they will mean that the russian flag wont be able to be flown with any of the major events during that 4 year ban we also know that government officials wont be able to attend any of those major events and we know the athletes wont be able to participate and russia for those events we also know that russia will be able to host all paid for any of it during that 4 year period meaning that because it. Could be a long time before russia is able to host any major sporting event but was also made clear is that this ban isnt taking place immediately in nuts because were sort of the russian Anti Doping Association agency house and accepted the findings by wada has accepted that decision and this will not go to a cool to ball patrician so it depends as to when that decision is taken by the court of arbitration. And of course if the court of arbitration backs up the water decision if this ban will be implemented which means it could affect next summers tokyo 2020 it could in fact also affect paris 2024 it just depends were not band starts and from that point it will be a 4 year period now we also heard from water. Russian athletes who have had no cloud of suspicion above them that theyll be able to participate in major sporting events and a neutral flag we also found out that what the say that theyve been able to pinpoint that it was a 145. 00 athletes who they do have suspicions over and they say that only a 3rd of those athletes are currently participating in any sport that means around 50 but despite that they say that all athletes will have to prove their innocence the fact that theyve not doped to be able to take part in any sporting events. This is a man against russia the protection of the right of russian each. Entry for major events. Able to demonstrate that they are not implicated in any we. Comply what is important thing todays decision is that we are really sanctioning those who are responsible for this many pollutions and leave those open for those who had nothing to do with. In russia clean. Plates. One of the other queries that its been discussed at the moment is the fact that russia says it is complied with everything that wada asked it to do its provided all the data to show that they will. And that this ban should not go ahead i put that to the president of water this is what he told me. So to says its going to appeal this decision russia says its rejected all of the allegations of data manipulation it says its provided you evidence to counter to show that it didnt delete the state it didnt modify the data what do you have to say to that and was that taken account in your decision well i wasnt part of the c. R. C. Discussion but i do know. Cooperation between the. True war conversations they had with for example the Russian Olympic Committee. But those people who are interested are entitle to under the standard to appeal and if he wished to appeal the of 21 days to accept this assertion or not and if they wish to appeal then we will be in cash. Well what maintains that its decision is the correct decision to take and meanwhile russia says that it has done everything to comply with water and restarted the russian anti duping agency is now appealing that decision over a 4 year ban what this will mean is that this is taken to the court of arbitration and it will be up to the court to make a decision as to who is right. Or to charlotte the reporting live from. The u. K. As Antidoping Agency has thrown its weight behind a want us decision saying its the only right one to take u. K. Agency has its own controversies though it cleared heavyweight boxer and white despite the presence of steroids in his sample justifying the decision at the levels were very low and not caused by any fault on whites part. Looks at how double standards appear to reign in the sphere of antidoping. For years you National Sports competitions have. Been hijacked by the russians for decades it seems that russian olympic athletes have been secretly doping to gain a competitive advantage labrat doping system secret labs Double Agents helping russian athletes cheat their way to the medal stand at the olympics this is now pointing the finger at a whole range of sports in a former what a staffer told us today you know this isnt a bombshell this is a Nuclear Warhead the russia doping investigation has become the leviathan of sports scandals its towering so high above Everything Else in fact its hard to notice other violations in its shadow bribery a secret doping society medics and coaches going rogue this year alone has seen plenty staggering revelations none of which could compete with russia there when it comes to the fallout and case one a kenyan olympic champion was caught at greasing anti doping offices palms to avoid being caught. Release any. One persons case unraveled years of large scale cheating a trove of documents suggesting Kenyas National Anti Doping Agency was helping the countrys team get away with it more than a 100 athletes caught red handed no not russia kenya but the punishment wasnt sweeping it was specific individual to each test and case or how wide a call did not institutionalised drug taking another scandal that snowballed olympics. Scheme it looked like parts pulled from the American Horror story script. So a doping cartel with the now infamous german magic has their ringleader a whole network concocting mechanisms to fool the agency keeping sport clean youd be shocked to know the sport you play all watch is swarming with drug cheats but the focus remains tight on russia those other scandals cost into the media archive and forgotten so reports of institutional conspiracy check and undercover doping that were check what about implicating 1. 00 of the giants of sport coat with its name in lights for promoting a group spearheading american Long Distance running with performance enhancing drugs. With the c. E. O. Apparently on top of the medical experiments within the companys brainchild its as close to institutionalize drug taking as it gets in the realms of business but you wouldnt expect anyone to banned nike and its billions of dollars from sports now were here because otherwise who is going to tailor team u. S. A. s olympic outfit. I think we have to look at the why that year political context anybody who has studied this in depth this whole. Story. Im afraid it would come to the objective conclusion the double standards are being applied here we are seeing a campaign to diligent to my eyes to russia on a number of fronts what people are saying quite rightly in russia and elsewhere is the standards must be applied equally thats what this is about its about standards being applied equally yes when there is evidence of individual athletes who may have consciously taken drugs in an attempt to get advantages over their rivals