Criticized as a country where harassment and supposedly terrorism around them all pretty much the same level as the air for example or in sudan well i dont know but ive been here before and i think i know enough about the country to think that. The fear is that you were well the the reason im asking about this is because there was a time when the Free Movement of people differing moment of capital. For a moment of Labor Services good. Was if not encouraged by the United States then ideologically supported and i think the trumpet ministration may be speaking against some of those things but i wonder if there is more to have been trying to do you think this sort of shift from a more global or towards a more. Isolationist if i may put it that way i mean taishan has a structural rather than political independence theres a lot of debate about that and different people have different views and i dont think we fully understand it. Quite clearly the nineteen or twenty sixteen election itself was strange in a number of ways including the fact that there were so Many Republican candidates that made a very strange choice situation so im not so sure as to what certain certainly. His supporters or and the people right around him. Awakened i think a degree of racism and what have you in the us that is in my view terribly unfortunate and i thought we were past it as did many others i think the polls are not showing that much support for it he has the lowest ratings of anybody after the short of time in the presidency at least from what i read in the newspapers so i think that. Its an open question the extent to which this reflects something more fundamental or whether this represents the short term. Now i know youve been along the influence of politics on the economy but i think particularly in the United States politics gets to be substituted for security and there are a lot of security concerns passing for. Politico the other way around political concerns passing for security concerns and when it when it comes to global trade regulations there are exceptions for security concerns dont you think that this claw clause of security is running a risk of being abused that the countrys president security considerations as a way to get a competitive advantage well theres no doubt that individual industries will push whatever they can push to try and get whatever special favors they think theyre they want if i were to worry about protectionism in the United States i would worry first and foremost about the those who are saying oh its the jobs that are at stake whether they are or not. But a company is not going to say gee were losing body we want to make money for shareholders theyre going to say look we may have to close the factory in the workers will lose their jobs and thats a more potent political argument in its use. Used at least as far as i know this for the political argument in most cases theres been the job loss whether its right or not more than the political and the political side there have always been i think in most countries some kinds of exceptions for National Security reasons we dont want to see Chris Snowden that kind of stuff and theyre over done of course to some extent in some cases but i dont think so far at least im unaware of anybody who saw that that was anywhere nearly as important as the job while i really give you one example my own channel has been r. T. Has been sanctioned because of its supposed that interference in the american political process and whats interesting about it i know you dont want to discuss politics but i think it has an interesting economic implication because if you limit the way those Companies Twitter facebook those big multinational multitrillion Dollar Companies operate not only in russia but around the world and if theyre seen as pliable to political interest american political interests whatever they are republican or democrat. I suspect that that may influence the way big global economies shaping out because its changing in this very moment dont you think so i certainly agree that there is a risk in that direction i certainly think the degree to which those things have been called upon is already very risky i hope that sort of very soon of course where that could become a more general kind of issue that pushes protection of more directions is the bigger danger and as i said i think it comes from other things worse than from the there is one more proposed sanction that was just the in relation to russia and that was switching off this country of this with Payment System which i think the race question about who controls the infrastructure for the Global Economy and that scared the whole lot of people not only in this country but also i know in other countries there are now very busy developing alternative solutions do you think that question may have an impact on the way Global Economy develops for. That who owns those platforms that facilitate global trade well i think given by background youd expect me to say the obvious answer is to get so some International Organization the i. M. F. Because this one system or the group or something controlling those things to a greater degree than they do now i think the alternative will be unfortunate in the sense that if we then end up with different Payment Systems it can create a degree of uncertainty for trade in for Service Transactions that would be unfortunate for all of us i think its a lose lose situation if we go that way youre giving me perfectly to my next question i thought that this kind of dynamic creates a competition not only over the means of production but over the means of trade and we havent seen that comp kind of competition before just such an extent you can. Essentially take the entire country out of the global system by just pushing the button and bad potentiality is very scary and many people i know youre not in favor of sanctions in general but i think also it creates a very interesting way of how effectively those sanctions can be implemented and my question to you is that we have the baton a good system that was designed to address some of those issues to ensure. Discriminatory treatment and such do you think that system of base day and age is capable of addressing the issues that were talking the u. N. The world bank the everything internationally is sort of subject to the what the political will of the owners of the system or in the owners of this is true of the nations of the world and in so far as they they fight it in their interest to agree on something i think they could do it whether they will be able to do it whether their political masters will want them to do it is is the important question i think by the way i dont think that any country can push a button and get rid of trade this is far too important to be farmers to political backlash protectionism to a point unfortunately perhaps even when its damaging yes but to talk about cutting off trade i think that is but if you ban banking transactions from a certain country thats effectively what youre doing obviously over time people will be able to find ways around it but that deliver such a blow that i think would be very significant for any given country money is a very fun jubal thing and i think it will be very quick before people found ways around it because as i say be damaging you might cut it back but the idea that you could do anything nearly. The south that is very unlikely i think for ways around it would be found very quickly just to mention an obvious one. Somebody here might find somebody in canada they can of the canadians could deal with the us and come back and you could be sure there are people but he says this is of many countries whod be willing to play that role well. Reach may not be a such a bad thing after all because at the end of the day what we want is a. System for all not speaking about the bretton of what system the soviet representatives did attend that conference so they had it in them to show up at the event but they did not ratify the final agreements charging that the institutions the conference created was. One of the branches over the wall street and i think that is the view that many in moscow still espouse your work both at the i. M. F. And the world bank do you agree with this assertion that which is very popular in moscow maybe even in beijing that the i. M. F. The world bank are essentially. Serving the improv western bias well i think the outcome certainly through the first sixty years of these intuitions is that they serve the interest of most of the world i dont think you could argue with that want to mean weve had you nervous Economic Growth unheard in the history of mankind most countries have benefited by it some where the know there is those who opened up more benefited more than those less i think thats a questionable so i dont think that its a question of that certainly the United States was very dominant it is creation it was after all the country the only could only large country that emerged reasonably prosperous right after the Second World War in that sense it had enormous role in setting up the system that worked as well as it did but in any event how long that will continue and how much it could be after all the u. S. Preeminence is going down i dont think is gone but its certainly less than it was other countries have a bigger say and they need to exercise it there but i still think theres a world interest and i served in both institutions and i am an american citizen no point did the americans ever come to me and say you used to say they do i was an International Civil servant i knew i was an International Civil servant they had an executive director just as russia does in their in the executive director was responsible for representing the u. S. Interests well professor take a very short break now but we will be back in just a few moments stay tuned. The new Global Economic war is unfolding in the realm of education the right to education has been supplanted by the right to access education low its High Education is becoming just another product that can be pulled out and sold but its not just about education anymore its also about running a business and what youre good models of the regime like on the soles. Of fellow they couldnt you. Want is the place of students in this Business Model before college i was born now in an extremely more Higher Education the new Global Economic war. Welcome back to worlds apart and kroger former first deputy managing director of the International Monetary fund and former chief economist for the world bank professor krueger. One of the issues that was prominent at the time that the back of the with system was created which is seems to be pretty divisive today is the issue of trade deficit of classes the United States has been on both sides of the debate theyre running a surplus before i believe the night and seventy is now running out five hundred billion dollars a year early deficit is that a problem that has a solution at this point of time well first off i dont think anybody worries or which they should not worry about trade they should if they want to worry about anything else from the current account deficit which includes trade in goods and services in the decisions especially important right now because the world shares the share of the worlds output thats in service this is it greece it is growing much more rapidly the trade in trade in services is going to American Services are growing that in deficit and its a mistake said the second point to be made is that by definition the difference between a countrys current account purchases and this current account sales is the difference between domestic savings and investment and current account deficit can be a very healthy thing if youre a rapidly growing economy if you need more productively use more investment then you have domestic say biggs south korea for example the one nine hundred sixty seven savings rate of fire a six percent g. D. P. And investment rate was twenty percent and it was borrowing the rest it was fast it wasnt a problem because it had many productive uses when that happens thats fine but either way it is not a problem for the world its a problem for the country now if you get the Exchange Rate very wrong which is where the i. M. F. Comes and the chances are its come about because of domestic measures that to. This imbalance between savings and investment and then the i. M. F. Comes into both parts of it but the important part is the domestic moment but. Just absolute figures. They seem to be stunning in the case of the of the United States and it is often the that the trade performance is. A reflection of the disagree with broom of the whole Global Economy as well as the. Balances for the American Economy domestically i guess what im asking is rather this disagreeably broom has already become an equilibrium of sorts that may stay in place the dressing of which may create more problems than it solves. I was going to graduate school in the one nine hundred sixty s. At the time when there was a dollar shortage and when all of those discussions and all news discussions were of the u. S. Dollar shortage and how other countries didnt have enough and how that was a permanent equilibrium now who are the other side of the court and i have no doubt that just about when everybody is convinced it will change yet again the American Economy is in disequilibrium in the savings there is not are not as great as its investments and so there is a problem there and the United States needs to take measures and the tax reform bill as i understand from what ive seen of what we could understand of it so far will make things worse better in that regard as i doubt but there is that on the other hand theres another side to that and then see other countries dont the chinese have gone some way to rebalancing their economy away from so many exports and thats probably healthy for the World Economy the United States and some other countries in europe need to do the same thing on the side or one side or the other but on the other hand the disequilibrium so far is not that terrible and there is still some time speaking about the dollar the United States there are a lot of benefits from the u. S. Dollar being the top reserve currency but it also makes American Goods and services more expensive and ultimately sustains this trade imbalance if you had to choose one of the other what would you prefer and can you really choose can you find here in your Economic Policy and expand when you dont have a desired outcome about the side effects for example aiming for increased Domestic Production and without strengthening your current well right now the United States economy is a very full employment the only way to get increased production without a lot of inflation will be together a greater rate of increase of productivity so the idea that you could do it through policy measures that would for example print more money or cut taxes will not have were given expenditures will not work except to be inflationary pressures and maybe in the very short run a little bit but the longer and consequences will be unfortunate so i dont think its a question of choice over the longer run the question has to be how do you balance the. And the real worry i think for the western European Countries for japan for china for the then states may be for russia but i havent looked at the numbers is that most of us are facing increasing costs of pensions for the elderly increasing the Health Care Costs because of the elderly many of which fall in the public purse must there are measures taken to cut fiscal expenditures or raise taxes tax revenue somehow we are all facing bigger problems as will be global disequilibrium not one or two countries now you mention the issue of savings and i think this is another factor that stains the current pattern of the american spending that you that people are encouraged to spend more than theyre earning that there is no other various the bush tradition of saving up money putting aside trump and his policy speech i suppose you know theyre great. Do you think any American Administration at this point can promote actively promote policies that would encourage people just band last and to save more saving more i think is they were hopeful problem sees in the spending less and that it doesnt want to presuppose another not necessarily their visions for example where you could indeed raise tax revenues in such a way that you cut the fiscal imbalance and thats cutting the deficit so no it doesnt need to be on the other there may be things on both sides then thats a choice variable theres still quite a question about that i think the question the real choice is not the one you made just at the real choice is whether we do something with the us do something in the near term to start correcting the imbalance or whether we wait until its even more pressing and we have to take more drastic measures now there are many truisms in Economic Science and one of them is that markets and economy likes predictability now i think i would agree that the trumpet ministration is possibly not the most predictable but the economy the American Economy is doing fairly well but for which trump is are going to be taking credit. Do you think its due. And so well because of him or despite him well the economy was picking up before he came into office in all the Twentieth Century is far from we further back whats happening to the economy this year is not a function only of policies this year but past there was momentum for the upturn ahead of time theres no doubt about that and we were already on the path to recovery and certainly nothing that happened in lets say the First Six Months of this year could very reasonably be attributed to that secondly policy which is the responsibility of the reserve is outside the control of the president we want to dependent it is reasonably so so that again its not probably there is a little bit of an uptick at the start line or more of an uptick in the stock market because of what the tax law and a few things like that but on the other hand i think there are concerns over the longer term at the moment the markets seem to be very euphoric and they dont seem to look either whats ahead but i think there are reasons to be a little more cautious than that. I dont know if you would agree with them but i think the American Economy. Especially be the starting of history of the American Economy poses a very interesting philosophical question of when your biggest weaknesses or biggest strength trade places so when your biggest weakness has become your strength. And then American Economy in that sense is unique i think in both its exposure and its reliance on the rest of the world and i wonder if you believe that it can still be treated as a purely National Economy should it be approached as an economy of one country or whether larger considerations always have to come into place well i think that all of us perhaps somewhat more small can economies the large ones put all of us have to take into account the International Repercussions of what we do because we are. Which is a bit is streaming kind is getting more and more independent not just the past hundred years despite what some people say but marco polo already was it greece is going to defend its way back when its been going on ever since and even before that well but i dont mean sort of neighbor policy is not taking advantage of. If your neighbor but i think whats interesting about the United States is that one appeared on the scene of his slogan putting America First it was very difficult for me to explain to my russian friends what he means because in many countries you are supposed to do that anyway youre not making that into your election slogan this is something that is presumed he will not be voted in if you are in my opinion we are the way we were putting America First with the old policies we are not with the new policies because i think the biggest losers if those are carried through for what he said are going to be the americans but how would you balance theres national and interest on the interest of. International Multinational Companies which i still think have a certain influence perhaps bigger than expected on their merit maybe in some political ways they do but strictly on economic grounds in the longer term i think there is no way that the kinds of protectionist measures that the president has advocated if they come to be will be in the American Interest in the longer term there be a few people who keep jobs a few days or a few months longer although even there a lot of that is a femoral we had the occasion i think it was last week or the week before walmart announced they were going to do something with raise the minimum wage to eleven dollars an hour which probably they had to do anyway and the next day they dont they really love i forgot a thousand people over here so that you know the saying that they dont see what these great food for the other thing gives out a little footnote oh by the way and of course people who dont some things that they think but i do think in the case of the kinds of protectionist measures that the trumpet ministrations so far and because if they come into being or to the extent that they do they are negatives for the entire American Economy and problem there are negatives for the world in two ways one of course the world gets a little bit hurt they could have export war but to unfortunately that is also giving aid and comfort to protectionism other countries who will seize a look the United States has therefore give us protection what are you speaking about a part of the u. S. Will be speaking about such protectionist countries i think russia could easily qualify. The need for Structural Reforms in this country has long been recognized but for just as long they have been sort of put off until a more opportune moment you published extensively on policy reforms and developing in transitioning countries have you developed any sound any intuition on how to identify that the right moment well i dont think you do identify it comes it normally comes this is in the countries where were had there has been at least a Significant Group of. Interest so he put it that way who have had a good plan sort of sitting there reading to be adopted they had a son in some of those countries theyve been able to do very well when the time came and a risk happened comes when infeed you dont have anything ready in then anybody who comes in with a plan. The leader whos a crisis conditions and so would seizes the baby reproductive would be so i dont think its a matter of recognizing it i think its a better be ready and have it in the meantime trying to avoid things that make things worse youre also famous for coining the term around sick and i think russia is especially prone to that kind of business and economic dynamic for all sorts of historic political and other reasons why do you think it takes to make that change from sticking around into more forward looking perhaps more risky but while for generating new wealth generating well i dont know the russian economy that well but i do know theres lots of oil and gas in that is both good and bad because it can lead to an economy where you sort of speaks it happily on what your good fortune of having it is sort of using it productively you know their activities and at least from the outside and based on what i know the russian economy has not successfully transition to reliance for growth other things other than the oil and gas as much as i would have thought a good for would and i think convincing people that would in my guess be the way to go because there is a future. For russia as everybody else does that just in the of those threats well i wonder if the United States is actually lending a helping hand in that persuasion warrant because you know that there is a new round of sanctions to be targeted sanctions to be introduced against powerful russian individuals and i think in russia it is a problem we have a problem of Privileged Access and. Certain individuals well connected individuals just sit on that cots and enjoy the status quo perhaps limiting opportunities for everybody else do you think. American factions could provide some Silver Lining in about sounds of sort of spurning being powers that be towards i dont know whos i dont know enough either about i have to follow that closely what the americans are talking about it in the last year there have been so many statements coming out from the administration that you dont know which ones to follow or which not to and so i tend to wait until they do things rather than what they say theyll do the second thing is i dont know enough here as to know whats going on but i do know is that a level Playing Field where the new start up where the guy has got something to go for what hes treated the same way as the big guys is the important part of getting the growth going and i just dont know how much that is my impression actually in the one nine hundred ninety s. Once they come with a bit of a state started there was a time when there was a lot of sort of grass do grassroots coming up and things look reasonably good and then not that much of that has happened the past ten years or so which tells me that maybe the young little this one guy has more trouble than the last guy getting a hold of the resources he needs and so i dont know that professor career have to live in fear really appreciate your time and to our viewers please keep the conversation going in our social media pages and i hope to see here again same place same time here on the worlds apart. What politicians do something to. Put themselves on the line. To get accepted or rejected. So when you want to be president or injury. Or somehow want to be presumed. To be like the press was a white woman for free in the morning cant be good that im interested always in the wiles of my colleagues. Young children have worked in bolivia for generations almost three quarters of a million doing so today. This culture led to the development of the livias new liberal and highly controversial childrens code in two thousand and fourteen which gave children as young as ten the right to work under certain circumstances what is and is seen as. These animals. Eat without having the end all. The things years. But there are hundreds of thousands of children in bolivia operating completely outside the local. Mining work is strictly forbidden by the children but its never in force and that means the school boy minus here continues risking their lives for the money they need to survive. Is. Going to fit into steve jobs is coming up with Innovative Products you know the electronic gadgets market is a little bit different in the car business because the car business is you know kind of bound by the highway system and youre bound by the whole infrastructure that is the Automotive Industry and the lobbying of the Automotive Industry so its a bit difficult to be disruptive in the industry in a way hes going to open up his charging stations with one nine hundred fifty style burger and shake joints with servers on roller skates ok thats thats an idea that might take off that might be a new like starbucks like. Place that people go to to have an experience that might work. You know listen. To a key demands the u. S. And its support for syrian could some of the spot between the two countries over washington trying to force. Hundreds of prison gone through the launch of french prison the store to be a whole bed for islamic radicalization strike over unsafe working conditions. Found a new leak from the front Hacking Group by o. T. Raises concerns about how doping cases were handled during the rio olympics twenty six the