Bought from ukraine uh in this uh this uh um military operation, but what we will see is is if if there is escalation uh one if theres an escalation from uh the zionists and they go in on the ground there will be huge numbers of of Israeli Military casualties if theres an escalation uh uh which is okay david uh what you hold on uh to your thoughts and stay with us at the same time while we look at uh whats a massing on the border there between the gaza strip and the southern part of israel um where israeli tanks have been deployed in uh numbers there from what were looking at it looks like about dozen of them if im looking at it properly uh this uh is a further sign of the threat that the israeli Prime Minister had uh made public yesterday where he said that a ground operation um is underway of which uh as uh early as just few hours ago uh it was anticipated that that ground operation would have taken place um if if that this this is what it means but theres a number of tanks that have been massed uh in the border there of which uh the israeli minister of military affairs has said we ordered complete siege of gaza fuel food electricity supplies to be cut off okay so that it it sounds like they want to move in and it sounds like this operation is going to take place uh, one indication being what were looking at there in terms of the tanks being amast there, as the areal assault simultaneously is uh taking place, the number of air strikes to have happened and positions have been hit so far roughly around 500 to 700, which uh is consistent consisted of 1,000 tons of ammunition thats been uh dropped there on the gaza strip uh also reports indicating that uh israel has asked people on the gaza strip to leave their homes, but there are no bunkers in the ghaza strip from what we understand uh except for military ones uh of which we dont know uh from the palestinan resistance factions but where can they hide . You know this is very tiny sliver that were looking at here uh of which you have about two two and a half Million People who live in this uh area so where they can hide. And where they can go, thats uh unknown based on what israel has requested, so thats the situation there that were looking at now, so so so david, what do you think, are we looking a prolonged uh incursion into the gaza strip based on what were the facts that were looking at on the ground here, attempt to uh order Ground Invasion, it didnt happen uh at the last minute the. Thought better of it and that was healed by the resistance factions as a success against israel uh we dont know whats going to happen they will theyre under immense pressure guess from their side to to come to do invitation but if they do that thats going to really make things very difficult for them in addition if if the theres an escalation and the the us does any more than say that it is ordered its battle fleet to the area well that those kinds of escalations its already been said by his bolah and by um other resistance factions that if there is that kind of escalation it will mean that americans become legitimate targets across the whole region now if if the americans want that and we cant look inside the minds of american strategists but then that will be a massive escalation and that will mean hesbolah perhaps other forces come into play uh in in that in that process now do the israelis want to do that uh im not sure. Uh, but if they dont do that, then that will be a historic victory for the resistance as well, but if they do do it, then we will have huge fight on our hands and that its not clear that the uh israelies or indeed the americans can be. Successful in that struggle, so theyve got some very hard thinking to do, and well see in the coming days what their decision is, it sounds like a, but it sounds like a check mate, doesnt it, david, i mean uh, if you really think about it, if if hisbollah gets involved in this picture, im not too sure, not too sure how the israel can really maneuver out of that one, right . Well that thats the thing. I mean presumably, i mean we we dont know the thinking of a pass or of the pflp or i saw even the the dflp was involved in operations too, the Democratic Front for the liberation of palestine, along with of course Palestinian Islamic jihad, we dont know what the thinking is, but they havent done this without some planning and without some thinking through what the options are and what the consequences will be, its not just that they, i see that there are some zionists in in in the uk today saying in the in the in the taboid press. This is the arab blood lust and this is what the the the the the islamic lust for blood is all about and always has been all about, this is what uh palestinan will be free from the river to the sea means, it means blood lost, well no, of course not, this is this is something which has been planned meticulously planned and extraordinarily successfully planned, but we dont know what the rest of the plans involve, and we dont of course know uh how they will develop given the pushback that you get from the the various different opposition sides of the of the the game, this this kind of 5d chess if you like, its not that complicated though, but it the the israels do not have many options, the the they cant uh go in on the ground and expect to simply uh ethnically cleans and annihilate all the palestinians because they will face severe uh military opposition and it will mean probably an unacceptably high number of casualties from their side, theyve already theyre already in shock from the the hundreds whove so far been killed, mean that thats tally of of dead which they havent seen for many many years and of course as people have been saying the the the whats called the invasion uh from ghaza to to liberate Palestinian Land thats not happened since 1948 so we are in a totally new situation and you know three weeks ago, two weeks ago who would have said that we would be sitting here today with whats just happened over the weekend is an extraordinary turn of events, so youre saying that if they do. Go for a Ground Invasion that hisbul is going to react um and uh that also raises the possibility in two on two different fronts, one the us engagements maybe if uh hezbollah starts using uh its firepower and and its personnel right, its not just his, its also syrian resistance, its the iraqi resistance, its the ansara in yemen, we see we see all of these as uh as being uh, these statements have been made, they were made before you know the. That what they say is they the word just has to come from gaza and we are there and theyve made very serious statements and of course they they have been limited actions from hisballah to knock out israely intelligence radar stations on the northern border so yes of course and of course the unknown question in in this is is of course the the role of iran of the i rgc of the of kuts force and what role they are playing i mean its been said by British Intelligence that the tyran has planned the whole thing but of course that will uh thats British Intelligence doing their best to to spin what they can, but clearly its the case that iran supports the resistance. Yeah, ive also seen uh news reports indicating that uh, and we dont confirm this at all, but that it was uh iran that uh gave the green life for this. Stay with us while i introduce another guest to uh to this conversation, wesley seel, an International Relations expert joins us from cape town. Wesley seel, welcome to the. Program so looking at an unprecedented uh series of events that have taken place in the past uh almost three days now and uh what were looking at this point at this juncture is uh a possibility of a ground uh perhaps a possibility of a Ground Invasion by uh the Israeli Regime forces but uh what do you think what are your thoughts about uh how this is moving forward and uh basically what what are we looking at here . Well, thank you very much for having me and i think that our first message certainly to the Palestinian People here from cape town in south africa is that we support you, we support you, we support you, yes, indeed, occupation for 75 years has not been easy, and i think that what we are seeing, the resistance and the resilience of our brothers and sisters in palestine, must certainly echo, echo and that support within our heart. We are certainly with them at this time and and we certainly support them, but i think that one cannot, one cannot say that an Ground Invasion, troops going to ground is. And the 75 years of occupation, i think what palestinian brothers and sisters have endured for the last 75 years has that have lived under occupation can be worse that and so yes indeed i think that the the the the call from our palestinian brothers and sisters, the brave one is bring it on, and and we will certainly stand with them as the International Community. All right, david miller, im going to get to you, but id like to ask wesley seal since he made that statement, bring it on, wesley seal, when you when you say that, again, it sounds very optimistic and uh, im wondering if theres enough there on the table uh for the palestinian factions in this case and point the fighters uh to deal with the situation to achieve the victory that they are hoping to achieve uh, tell us whether they have what it takes in that regard uh to move to. Based on one uh statement to get alaksa or do you think that more players need to be involved here and again if you can expand on the fact that were looking at them having um thousands of fighters, they have uh lots of rockets in their military warfare, they have um the drones that we know and other perhaps uh offensive Type Military equipment and they have the ones that they have taken into captivity, these are the tools that they have in order to to uh one way or another achieve their goals and one of the ones thats not mentioned, which is kind of in sleep mode, but maybe itll come into the picture, are the number of palestinians that may rise up in the occupied palestinian territories and act against the regime forces, do you think that they have enough and what it takes in order to achieve victory, conscious of the fact that i am sitting peaceful. In cape town and i am not on in gaza or in the occupied territories at the moment and so it is easy for me to say bring it on, but i think that what is certainly the rallying cry of palestinians on the ground, on ground zero as it were, is for the International Community certainly once again to rise up, what we have seen certainly in the last few years, is is bombardment, is occupation, the continuous of occupation and and palestinians are saying to us that they are tired of this, they are tired of living in in a prison, in open air, the Worlds Largest open air prison, and so while it might seem from our viewpoint and from where we are sitting, that yes, they are facing the the might of the zianist regimes army, they are facing the the the the the the onslot of us aggression and us military all right, well. Sorry, um, your voice is distorted, even though i can make out what youre saying, but uh, ive been told that the distortion is too much. Were going to uh, continue with david miller. So, david, at this point, here we are, and uh, were looking a minute by minute as to whats going to happen over here, um, the uh, situation of uh, or the the idea of uh negotiations, you know, has been thrown, thrown into the conversation, but uh, what kind of negotiations can really, what would negotiations uh achieve, you cant go back to the status quo, you cant have uh what has happened in the previous wars, which israel calls operations, now theyre calling this one a war, where some kind of negotiated solution is reached and then and then go back to what it was, mean that just seems a far from reality, well when they just talk about um alaxa and making the trip. To alcuds, theyre talking about defeating zionism and theyre talking about the creation of new state of palestine uh in the territory uh of what is now called israel and thats a tremendous uh difference in in uh the thinking of uh those who talk about peace and the twostate solution uh there is no. Twostate solution, we are way, way way beyond twostate solution, in the united nations, just the other day, Benjamin Netanyahu held up map of israel which encompassed, the west by, dalcuts and the Golan Heights and that of course is call, you know, call for the genocide of the Palestinian People, and you know, no wonder there is this uprising. Breakout from gaza, so what what we see is the possibility, in the mind of the people who are directing this of victory, they dont so. Negotiated settlement would of course first of all mean freeing 500 palestinian prisoners, but it would certainly also have to men opening up the whole question about the nature of the state, and thats not something which the zionist regime is going to do unless it is absolutely forced to do so. We we see of course that the support, their the base of their support, which of course is the settlers uh are uh in accu, many of the settlements have been. Evacuated, the uh the uh flights out of bengian, many have been cancelled, the polish government and the bulgarian government, i see are evacuating their citizens from the country, including i would say a great many who were settlers and who will now not be settlers and they will go back home to where they came from, so that is the the sign that something is happening which will itself undermine the possibility of effective action by. The zionist regime and will will mean the possibility of the the foundations underneath zionis and crumble because of course always its been the case that zionism is is founded upon the ability to have enough people to steal the land and occupy the land. Now if that those foundations start to crumble, we see the beginnings of the collapse of the structure of dionism and that of course will mean that they may be forced into negotiations which would be much different to what all of the thinking about peace currently. Uh um proposes. Um, wesley seal, we have connection with you now. Um, id like to uh, throw in the last part of the statement made there by our guests. I dont know if you heard it or not, uh, if were looking a collapse of the Israeli Regime, uh, what form would that collapse look like, what would it look like based on how youre seeing things right now . Well, i think that i agree with david, that we must make sure. For that the zionist regime goes back to the negotiating table and i think that weve seen in the last couple of years that the only way to do that is through this kind of uprising by palestinians, we we the the collapse of a partit in south africa for example gives us many lessons and and i think that International Isolation is one of them, International Solidarity is another, i think that it is important for palestinians on the ground to stand up and to say that we will be our liberators, and so i think that to answer your question, yes, indeed, learning from the south african experience, it it needs that coordinated approach both between palestinians on the ground, through such uprisings as well as International Isolation and International Solidarity. How key is that, david, at this point in terms of the palestinian in involve. On this, david, are you with us . Yeah, so yeah, yes, we, i have your voice, i thought for for second we got disconnected, the palestinians there in the occupied west bank, i think that is key or one thing that needs to be enacted, that they need to rise up and ride the offensive thats happening in order to complement what the palestinian fighters are are trying to achieve, because without that, thats one of the key components, i think that would uh really increase uh the chances of success here. Well, i mean, it looks doesnt it, that um, the part of the strategy has been to cut sway through, whats called israel from gaza to the west bank towards hebron, and of course the there have been significant conflicts in the west bank in the last 48 hours, and theres been a call put out, i think this morning for all roads to settlements to be cut off by uh the resistance in the west bank, so thats of course key element of the strategy, and no doubt thats been planned from the beginning, but i detected Something Else in your question there, but International Solidarity, and i think that yes of course International Solidarity is very important, weve seen demonstrations all around the world, but i think also we ought to remember, and perhaps this is something which the Solidarity Movement in outside palestine. Needs to develop more is that the ability of the zionists to do what they do, ethinally cleanse, to demolish houses, to do incursions on alaxa, their ability to send idf forces into uh um easts and to uh to um the west bank, all of these things in part depend on the support that they get from outside palestine, from the Zionist Movement in in the uk and the us and germany and france, all around the world, everyone knows dont they that there are zist organizations all over the world. In the uk where i live, there are perhaps 5,00 zianist organizations. 5000 separate zionist organizations and they send millions and millions of pounds every year to the idf to the settlements to undermining axa to house demolitions and that money helps them to continue to do ethnic so the way in which the Solidarity Movement can help not just in terms of planning demonstrations but in directly targeting zionist organizations which are directly involved ethnic cleansing in palestine so that we uh end as not just in palestine, but also in the uk, the us and everywhere else, it raises its head, its a racist movement, and it is not able to devest itself of its racism, so it needs to be ended, designism as as movement and as set of organizations need to be dismantled, and that i think is the task for the palestine Solidarity Movement outside palestine as well as uh boycots um demonstrations, was the still are you still with us . I am, yes, yes, great, uh, you know, what were trying to understand over here is uh, the fragile state of this Israeli Regime, um, even uh publications now that uh, and im sure would have never ran headlines like they are right now, uh, are forced to do so, such as the one that says fight to recapture israeli towns, taking longer than expected, uh, showing the weakness of the Israeli Regime forces and it goes. To a little bit of detail as to the challenge that that is posing for israel, which uh is supposed to be such invincible power, of which were seeing that that just does not hold ground any longer, the past 48 hours have proven uh, proven that, so in that regard uh, when when israel is now going to from what we understand and based on the statements that its making going to go into um the gaza strip. Uh, what is israel going to achieve there . I mean, first of all, its going to endanger the lives of some of the ones that are captivity, israel is that are in captivity there, but aside from that, aside from uh, basically murdering palestinians, what, what can it achieve . Well, i think that again, its its as david says, what its what its seeking to achieve is genocide and and and ethnic cleansing of Palestinian People. Weve certainly seen this in the last 75 years and so i think that that is what the netanyahu regime is trying to do certainly to make sure that the mass killings and the ethnic cleansing continues with in the occupied territories, but i think that what what my suspicion is certainly is that theyre going to try and make sure that they control gazza and the occupied territories about. More and i think that theyre going to make sure that they dont leave gaza and that they make sure that their presence remain in those occupied territories Even Stronger this time to prevent this from happening, but certainly you are absolutely right that we have seen a weakening of. Okay, were just having bad luck with your audio for some reason now its distorted again, but we do apologize not only to you, but to our viewers, its a good. Time for us to actually look at uh some of the content of what was just discussed in terms of the firepower that the uh resistance groups do have uh right now were looking at the missiles as they are or as they made their way through uh the skies uh into the occupied territories uh this was probably hours ago here were looking at uh the missiles that uh again these are uh and its quite remarkable that these palestinian uh factions have been able to the resistance groups have been able to uh manufactured their own missiles and uh were seeing examples of it here uh when you see those missiles making their way through the skylines uh from the ghaza strip into the occupied territories that actually reach as far as tel aviv and even alqats well here you have it these are the images of some of the fighters that obviously uh conceal their faces uh but uh it shows how its done and how its executed and i think we have more footage. The capabilities that the resistance fighters have, here the drones are being displayed, number of them of which were looking at about dozen or so maybe and the fighters and how thats being used, so uh not the same picture of five years ago or even less, i mean these are military capabilities that have been amped up in terms of uh the expanded version now and the upgraded version of whats the. Palestinian fighters have, so you can see based on the firepower there, how they are uh executing pinpoint precision strikes uh, this probably was a military exercise that they held of. There was one that was held by the Islamic Jihad just in the past uh week, so this footage here shows the military capabilities overall of the Palestinian Resistance fighters, some of this footage actually is of their operation like this one, i think they made it through this socalled barrier fence, which shouldnt be there in the first place, and made it to this military encampment in Israeli Military encampment, i think this is from the actual operation if im not mistaking. I believe that that that uh is accurate, so uh here we uh can see light as day uh how they are able to uh put up very stiff fight if not one that uh can succeed uh militarily uh over the Israeli Regime forces here you can see from a drone shot of uh a missile being dropped into um and uh building there and a tank uh so these are things that um for before. Were not in the military arsenal of the resistance fighters of which here were seeing them in operation um in the past 48 hours as it was executed in some of the footage that you see here combined with footage from previous uh times where uh the military capabilities of the palestinian fighters is being displayed um david im going to come to you uh basic question after showing this footage is uh what do you think i dont if you saw it or not, but its really uh quite an upgrade and quite an expanded um arsenal that they have now compared to years ago, but the question is, how far will this take them . What do you think . Well, we dont do we the full range of the weaponry, which is the hamas have said that they some of the weaponry that theyve been using has come from ukraine, and the theres been footage, i think of soviet era missiles being fired missiles being. Fired um uh so we we know about that, but also you know previously the uh resistance factions have put out uh videos showing all sorts of weaponry held on the ground presumably in gaza uh and uh the question of where it comes from is of course uh an open one isnt it because its done in secret its uh covert his reported to be involved um but there are all sorts of weapon. Theres all sorts of weaponry uh just north of the border whichball has said that hizballah has 15,000 or maybe many more missiles than that uh and of course the uh the ansera movement in yemen has an extraordinary variety of weaponry and firepower which it is it says willing to put out the disposal of the palestinians there was just the other day a massive uh