And legendary strategist james carbo is standing by and he's coming up next. And another attempt from donald trump to jail his opponents. Michael tyler is going to join me with his reaction as well. And also today, andrew wiseman is here to talk about judge marchand's decision to delay trump's sentencing until after the election. What does it all mean. And later goldman on that department of justice indictment and at the center of it all. Okay, everyone, here we go. We're 58 days officially out from the election. We are two days out from the first debate between kamala harris and donald trump and as if we needed any more evidence of just how important that first face to face meeting could be, we got plenty more in just the past few hours this morning. A brand new poll out this morning shows the race virtually tied not a huge surprise. As we said many times on the show, national polls don't really matter. Battleground state numbers tell us a lot more than the state of the race than those head to head polls. We have some numbers in battleground key states as well. Here they are, michigan harris up 5149. Pennsylvania tied 50/50. Wisconsin harris up 51 to 49. Kamala harris has had an incredible summer. No one can deny that. That has brought a lot of democratic and republicans on board. In race is going to be really tight. It's tight right now. It's going to be till the end, it was always going to be. Which makes the stakes on tuesday pretty high. When harris and trump walk out on that stage, it's going to be the first time they'll ever actually meet in person. I know. When i heard that it kind of bends the mind especially when you remember a big reason they haven't met is because trump didn't show up to the peaceful transition of power after he wrapped up his attempted coo. When they do meet, there's going to be so many things to watch for. How is harris going to take to his attacks. We no many of his attacks will be false, sexist, racist. We certainly have an idea of how this goes, this is his seventh time in the debate stage. And how will harris react in realtime. We did get a look. He suggested you turned black recently. Questioning the core part of your identity. Same old tired play book. Next question, please. That's it? that's it. I mean, i love that response. It also fits into the smart strategy of shrugging him off and not giving him the time of day. It's making trump really small not building him up as this giant insurmountable guy. It's also different when the guy you're belittling is standing next to you and that's what happens on the debate stage. If there's one thing we have learned, it is that cutting trump down to size gets under his skin and that is a very powerful tool. People who really love kamala harris will love that. Will love those moments when she does that. It will trend everywhere. She needs to do more, she needs to gain. She needs more than her current level of support in order to win the election. Right now people still want to learn more about her. According to that poll i referenced this morning, 28% of likely voters said they needed to know more about harris. That's a huge opportunity for her. It means she couldn't just cut trump down in the debate. It's not the only thing she's going to be appealing to. She also has to keep introducing herself to voters. Locking people her way and bringing more on board. Part of that is introducing herself as a candidate who will bring change. She's got her work cut out for her there. That doesn't mean she needs to run away from all she's accomplished as part of the bidenharris administration. It means a lot. It's talking about her forward looking vision. Showing she represents something new, even joyful. Joyful is a good thing. The other guy is just a guy with the same dog with the same old tricks. One thing has remained consistent, the most thunderous sound in politics is the boom of a single page as it turns from one chapter to the next. Basically everyone wants change. This is a big opportunity to show the american people that she is that next chapter which she said yesterday in pittsburgh is her goal for this debate. One thing you want to get across? well there's a lot, but, look, it's time to turn the page on the divisiveness. To everyone paying attention, i think it's safe to say the contrast between these two candidates is already quite clear. We're going to be fine. We're all in this together. We are. I never met her, i never touched her. Are you in pittsburgh here. I'm looking at a woman and want to grab her and i start, just see her and making out with her. What are the chances of that happening? please, deliver a message. And say the vice president asked me to deliver this message. Thank you for being a teacher. I know you're going to say it's a terrible thing to say, but it couldn't have happened. It wouldn't have happened and she would not have been the chosen one. I mean, ick. Here is kamala supporting women and trump goes against them. She represents the future while trump represents the past and she's the prosecutor while trump is the convicted felon. That contrast, that choice is it. It has to remain crystal clear. Because every election has a choice. And there's a few moments that make a choice more clear than two candidates literally standing side by side on a debate stage. There are very few people who know what it's like to run a presidential campaign. Even fewer know what that's like to do that and actually win. First of all, i know lsu won yesterday so hopefully that puts you in a good move. Congratulations on that. Thank you for being with us. Always. You wrote a very compelling piece for the new york time. There are three imperatives. And one is to help trump hurt himself in the debate. Which means, get under his skin so he says or does something crazy. But what does that mean? tell us more about that. Well, it's certainly means that and it certainly means contrast with him. Just say this is me. I think he's made the money point. People know who trump and harris is. People know what trump is, they don't yet know what vice president harris is. If she could successfully fill out the what, she has some upside here. Some real upside. And i think that's very important. She can gain more or lose more. Trump is going to be 48 no matter what he does. All right. She can either be at 52 or 46. I mean it's a, kind of a choice. By the way, jen, i never try to predict thing. I said when it started it was going to be a tie. I was called a debby downer. And nobody is attacking me anymore. I think she's going to do well. She has the right people and the debate prep from everything i hear. And i think she's got great opportunities. I'm very encouraged bid what i'm hearing. And i have very high expectations. You should never say that, but i've just said it because i mean it. You want to be candid. I'm being candid. We love candor. I agree with you. She's a good debater. She has good, fierce, people prepping her for the debate. That's all true. And it'll be interesting to watch. In terms of what defines a good debate. And what debates an effective debate for her. Because as you have pointed out, i think it's important for people to know, it's not just about winning a debate but what helps her. I referenced this a little bit earlier. She largely avoided trump. I think that worked in that moment. Now part of her objective in this debate is to continue introducing herself. Like to the 28% of likely voter who say they still need to know more about her according to the new york times poll. How should she balance if you're advising her hitting trump which democrats will love. And people who already love her will love and focusing on her own message on this debate. Is it kind of the same thing. Is it over lapping. Is there a balance needed? my dad was a champion college boxer. He would teach me how to box. He would say, throw a combo and get out. Throw a combo and get out. And that's what she needs to do. Hit him and get out. Will people know who she is better wednesday morning than tuesday morning. It's not all going to be favorable. She accomplishing that, that's the biggest thing she can do. Go in, throw a combo, get out. Don't linger around there. I like the, it's a very harry reed reference. I'm into the boxing references. We would go to the fights together. Yeah. He would love that. This is a piece in your oped that i completely agree. Bill clinton and barack obama both changed candidates separate years apart. She has kind of a disadvantage in that poll in terms of presenting herself as the change candidate. Polls are imperfect. How does she do that while still in this debate. While still being proud of what she established but showing she's the turn the page candidate in this debate which is a big opportunity. Well, as you read the piece and i said you have to supplement the biden. You have to come up with some different ideas. And i think she's starting to do that. I think you're going to see some of it during the debate. And i mean, it's the old line, president left a record to build on not to sit on. I plan on building on that. I tend to want to be more aggressive here, less aggressive there. And just signal that you're kind of new and you're going to be your own person, your own administration. I'm most certainly going to do that. If they don't, they're pretty bright people to not do that but just be criminally politically stupid. She has to definitely do that. She looks different, she needs to do different. And someone new to watch. I didn't ever think we would hear dick cheney endorsing a democratic candidate for president. It's important to know how significant this is. Dick cheney was the opposite of any democratic candidate has run on. Here's something that liz cheney had to say. There's absolutely no chance that ronald reagan would be supporting donald trump. Donald trump doesn't stand for any of the things that ronald reagan did. She's been bold. She's been unafraid to be out there. Good for her. I think one of the questions i have for you on the political front is, who does the, who do the cheney endorsements appeal to. If you're the harris camp what do you do with it? first of all the combination of cheney and liz, a bunch of other. I think it's going to give license to some traditional republicans. Probably more formal areas who don't like trump. Who never voted for a democrat. Okay i can do this. And it's not going to be a huge group of people but it has a potential to be very helpful. I can see some of that on the main line. I can see some of that, you know in parts of phoenix. You know critical parts. I can see some of that in buckhead. I mean there's plenty of places where we might lose 63 to 37. We might lose 64. In a period of time that accumulates we know that. The theory that small changes lead to big results is absolutely true. Yeah, go ahead. There's people who are going to say, i'm going to hold my noise. I don't want to do this. And they will think, hey dick dick cheney, i can do it. I was just listening to nikki haley. She was talking about taiwan. And donald trump said i don't care about taiwan. James carwell, thank you for taking the time. Appreciate it. And coming up, i cannot wait to talk after the avalanche of legal news. And a threat to jail his political opponents. It was just another weekend for donald trump. Michael tyler is the communications specialist for the harris campaign. He joins me next. Being me. Keep being you. . . 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Common side effects were diarrhea, nausea, and headache. No matter where life takes you, biktarvy can go with you. Talk to your healthcare provider today. Power e*trade's awardwinning trading app makes trading easier. With its customizable options chain, easytouse tools, and paper trading to help sharpen your skills, you can stay on top of the market from wherever you are. E*trade from morgan stanley c1 the moment i met him i knew he was my soulmate. Soulmates. Soulmate! [giggles] why do you need me? [laughs sarcastically] but then we switched to tmobile 5g home internet. And now his attention is spent elsewhere. But i'm thinking of her the whole time. That's so much worse. Why is that thing in bed with you? this is where it gets the best signal from the cell tower! i've tried everywhere else in the house! there's always a new excuse. Well if we got xfinity you wouldn't have to mess around with the connection. Therapy's tough, huh? mmm. It's like a lot about me. [laughs] a home router should never be a home wrecker. Oo this is a good book title. F0 okay, the cost of child care is something that really matters to millions of parents in america. No kidding. There are very few issues that are more universal. Take a look at this recent poll, 89% of voters, 89%, 89% of people don't agree on anything. Want government to help parents afford child care. Makes plenty of sense that donald trump was asked about it. It's a pretty clear straightforward question but what made absolutely no sense was his answer. If you win in november, can you commit to prioritizing legislation to make child care affordable and if so, what specific piece of legislation would you advance. Well i would do that. And we're sitting down, i was, somebody we had senator marco rubio and my daughter ivanka were so impactful on that issue. But i think when you talk about the kind of numbers i'm talking about. Because child care is child care. It's something you have to have it in this country. You have to have it. But when you talk about those numbers compared to the kind of numbers i'm talking about by taxing foreign nations at levels that they're not used to but they'll get used to it very quickly. It's not going to stop them from doing business with us. But they'll have a very substantial tax when they send product into our country. Those numbers are so much bigger than any numbers that we're talking about including child care. That it's going to take care. We're going to have, i look forward to having no deficits within a fairly short period of time. Coupled with the reductions that i told you about on waste and fraud and all of the other things that are going on in our country. Because i have to stay with child care. I want to stay with child care. But those numbers are small relative to the kind of economic numbers i'm talking ability. Including growth, but growth also headed up by what the plan is that i just told you about. Okay. No one could possibly explain what he's talking about. Because it made absolutely no sense. Now, i should also tell you, in case you missed this that donald trump's running mate also talked about child care. And vance's answer was definitely easier to understand, we'll give that to him but also very concerning. One of the ways you might be able to relieve a little bit of pressure on people who are paying so much for child care. Make it so that, maybe grandma and grandpa wants to help out a little bit more. Or maybe there's a aunt or uncle that want to help out a little bit more. These people have never had to deal with child care in their life. 89% of voters want a candidate with a plan for child care. And donald trump is talking about tariffs and vance wants grandma to help out more. If trump says something as incoherent as that, how is vice president harris going to respond? well, thank you so much for having me, jen. Let's take a step back here and analyze these answers to the best of our ability. First you have j. D. Vance who blames the family for struggling with the chance of health care. And donald trump if you're able to sort through everything he said. His solution is raising taxes on the middle class with the across the board tariff. These two have never spent any time thinking about people's struggles. And you take the child tax credit for example which maga republicans strip ped away. She's going to restore it and expand it along with other policy solutions that she has laid out to lower tax. Lowering grocery cost, lowering housing costs. Mortgage and rental assistance for folks to bring down the cost of housing and of course making sure that we have a tax code that actually benefits working middle class families not those at the top as donald trump wants to do. Now just with tariffs but you look at his 2025 plan, it's nothing but tax cuts for wealthy people, powerful corporations. This is one of many contrasts that people will see both on the debate stage and for the final two months of campaign. I want to make it clear on the debate stage, one of the things that was interesting and i talked about in the new york poll earlier on the show. 25% of the people on the poll thought that harris would represent the change. More than 60% of likely voters said the next president, let me start this again. More than 60% of likely voters said the next president should represent a major change from joe biden. Only 25% of the vice president respected the clang. Represent the change. How important is that in terms of a goal in this debate on tuesday night? listen, i think the american people absolutely see the vice president share her vision for where she wants to take this country. She's been doing so since july 21st and continue to do so on tuesday night and the rest of the campaign. I think donald trump as that polling suggests he would bring about change. I think it's bad change. He would roll back the progress we've made. You look at his project 2025 agenda that we talked about earlier. It is nothing but banning abortion nationwide. It's about returning to the failed economic. Jailing his political opponents and consolidating power in the oval office. That's certainly change but that's not what the american people are looking for. The vice president understands that the american people are looking for a new way forward. That's why she's begun to lay out the plan where she wants to bring the country. We did so in raleigh, we did so in new hampshire with her plan to grow and boost small business across the country. That's what the debate will be on tuesday night. You have in the vice president a person listening to the concerns of every day americans. And donald trump who is going to be on the stage airing his personal grievances. But it's not going to be bringing solutions to the american people. I think that's going to be the fundamental contrast that people see on tuesday night. Again that we will present aggressively for the final 50 some on days of this campaign. All change is not good change. We could go back to the 1800s of project 2025. Let me ask you, after his rally yesterday in wisconsin, donald trump put out a long and crazy plan. This is something i want to get your response to. When i win those people that cheated will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law which include long term prison sentences so that the depravity of justice does not happen again. What do you say to that? i would say this is, another indication of the clear and present danger that donald trump poses to our tkphrobg democracy. You see in project 2025. He continues to google it and anyone can google project 2025. You continue to see the harris walz coalition expand and diversify. It's why liz cheney is coming on board. The former president donald trump makes it very clear not by his previous actions we all saw what happened on january 6th. But the rhetoric and the plans he has in place the danger he poses. I think that will be very clear for the remainder of his campaign. You will continue to see us do outreach to the american communities. Michael tyler, thank you for joining us. Rise up, go falcons. It looks like our next guest is still living rent free in donald trump's head. She's an andrew wiseman person. The other person plays the ref. True, and wiseman and the other people. The one and only wiseman is standing by to discuss all of the developments in donald trump's legal saga. He joins me here, next. Protect. I think it's a great product. It's going to help a lot of patients. Thursday night football on prime. It's on. Ready to have some fun? it's buffalo versus miami, as thursday night football is back. Stream thursday night football. Only on prime. [introspective music] recipes. Recipes written by hand and lost to time. Are now being analyzed and restored using the power of dell ai. ♪ okay, donald trump was supposed to be sentenced for his 24 felony counts just 10 days from now. But on friday we learned that is not going to happen. Marchand postponed the sentencing until after election day. Marchand said part of the reason for his delay was to avoid the slightest hint that politics affected his decision. In which the defendant is a candidate. He's never been in these waters before. Joining me now is our friend andrew wiseman. He's former general council of the fbi and part of the prosecuting donald trump podcast. It's great to see you. I know you visit with msnbc viewers all the time. Were you surprised by judge marchand's ruling. I was first going to talk about donald trump and his attack on. Oh, you. I should have asked you about that. Get it off your chest. The part that, it's so weird for me to say this to you. But it's so demeaning of the deputy attorney general lisa monaco to say that she's a puppet. Not only that there's no evidence, evidence wrong. But it's fundamentally sexist. She is capable, more than capable of making her own decisions and to me, it shows that he still has a problem with strong confident, honest ethical people. Particularly women. No question. Any way, that's getting it off my chest. No i love that. She is a legal, national security, fierce, bad as amazing public servant. The fact that she's anybody's puppet. Laughable. They've never met her. I'm glad you have taken that off your chest. I've never been attacked by donald trump so i don't know what that's like. People want to know, i want to know what you think of all of this. Were you surprised? we knew something. He had to at some point say whether he was going to delay it or not. Were you surprised by that. No. In fact, mary and i on the podcast. I'm behind on the podcast, i'm sorry. Oh my god. If you were following you know we both thought this would be put off. And the reason is, one the d. A. Had been nebulous of putting it on the scale of it could be put off. The reason is people need to know and remember. But it was before judge marchand was not just the sentencing day but also the pending motion with respect to immunity. And there's a tricky legal issue there about whether that's appealable before the sentence. Meaning that he, that the judge said i'm going to decide this on the 16th two days before the sentencing. And the issue that donald trump had raised is i want to have time to appeal that. And have the sentencing off. That actually is a novel like so much in this case is a novel legal issue. The judge by putting off both the sentencing and the immunity decision, i don't know if that was his intent. That kept this whole case out of the supreme court before the election. At a time when the supreme court otherwise would have every incentive to issue justice political decision with effect with the immunity. It would have had the same sentence to reach into this case and say no there has to be a retrial. But really put it off. Again i heard you talk about this a bit. But to dig into it further. If he had moved into the sentencing, it would have incentivized. I don't think the sentence would have happened. Because on the 16th he had to issue his decision on immunity. Donald was saying i get to appeal that before the sentencing was happening. So there was a good chance the sentencing wasn't going to go forward. And the supreme court would have weighed on immunity. Whenever we're in this situation in my view but there could have been a sentencing before there would be this appellate decision. And i think this basically just kicks it down the road and it gives the supreme court a lot less incentive to sort of reach in. Because if donald trump is no longer you know candidate, he's lost. The supreme court has less interest to be willing to reach in and show this case was improp proper so we can show the democrats were doing something improper here. It makes it more ethical. And it's on november 26. It's possible, we don't know what happens with the election, if harris win we know trump is going to challenge it some way. It's going to feel politicized then too. Can he punt it back. I don't think he will, i don't think judge marchand will punt it down the road. It's possible that the supreme court will still weigh in on the decision that will be reached now i think it's on the 16th of november which is on the immunity question. Butch it'll be before the supreme court at a time when we know whether donald trump is either won the election or lost. Or at least knock on wood. Hopefully we will know that whether it was donald trump you never know until it's over. I don't think judge marchand is going to kick this down the road any more. And the other thing if i were donald trump that i would not be so happy with, is sentencing donald trump after the election, if he loses makes it much more likely that you think you can send him to jail. You will know at that point whether he has lost or not. If he's lost, the whole idea of i can't sentence him to jail. Well you'll know if he's just citizen trump and he's not a candidate. It's a different time, andrew wiseman thank you so much. Nice to speak to you. Thanks for responding to the attack too. Coming up, imagine being on russia's payroll without even knows it. This next story involves the kremlin, maga influencers and big concerns around the 2024 election. We're back after a very quick break. Tion. We're back after a very quick break. I'll be honest. By the end of the day, my floors. . . Yeesh. But who has the time to clean? that's why i love my swiffer wetjet. It's a quick and easy way to get my floors clean. Wetjet absorbs and locks grime deep inside. Look at that! swiffer wetjet. So, they're beloved and right wing circles and they're among donald trump's most vocal supporters but it turns out they were being paid by russia. They were part of a covert kremlin campaign to influence politics inside the united states. Two operatives with russian state police that funneled laundered money into a tennessee based media outlet. Which is basically used as a front company to spread kremlin propaganda. That company fits the description of tenat media. While it may not sound familiar to you, the name of that company. Those they hired were already brand names in conservative media including right wing like tim pool and benny johnson. You have probably seen their names on twitter. One commentators contract required them to produce four weekly videos in exchange for $400,000 a month. Plus bonuses. That's about $5 million a year for those of you who don't own a calculator. Now to be clear, the indictment doesn't say they knew they were on russia's payroll. Two of the six commentators were deceived nor have they been charged with criminal wrong doing at this point. These folks were most likely just useful idiots who cashed paychecks and didn't ask enough questions. Since the indictments five of these six comentators have released statements. A lot of the damage has already been done. It's bad enough their political views are so warped. They were willing to deliver what is obvious lip prorussian propaganda on their own accord. This is psychotic. You crane is the enemy of this country. Ukraine is our enemy. The ukraine operation is clearly something that is being run to enrich our elites and also of course to give unaccountable mountains of cash to the worse people on earth. Awesome dudes, we're subsidizing useful businesses in ukraine. We should rescind all funding and financing, pull out all military support, and we should apologize to russia. I mean, given all those ideas it's pretty clear why russia would think of them as assets. Of course all of this raises a very possible question of whether other right wing pundits are on russia payrolls. Whether they know it or not. When it comes to russian interference this is the tip of the iceberg. The iceberg. (♪♪) i wish i had someone like evan when i started. Somebody just got their first debit card! ice cream on you? ooo, tacos! i got you. Wait hold on, don't you owe me money? what?! your money is a part of your community, so your bank should be too. Like, chase! ♪ [suspenseful music] trains. [whoosh] ♪ trains that use the power of dell ai and intel. Clearing the way, [rumble] [whoosh] so you arrive exactly where you belong. With bugs, the struggleisreal. That's why you need zevo traps. Zevo works 24/7 to attract and trap flying insects. For effortless protection. Zevo. Peoplefriendly. Bugdeadly. Is it possible to be more capable and more practical, be able to perform here and here? make a statement of barely making a sound and command the road as well as what lies ahead? how we get there matters. Get exceptional offers at your local audi dealer. Okay so this week we learned the kremlins spent $10 million on campaigns to sway public opinions to sway news in fraudulent websites. To secure a victory for our republican candidate. Namely donald trump. That's according to detailed russian memos attained by doj that outlined part of their plan in writing. Sound very familiar. Joining me is dan goldman of new york. I want to get to everything happening. It's significant i think the d. O. J. Is cracking down on this. In advance of the election. It does feel like and you studied this closely their tactics, the kremlin tactics are more sophisticated than in the past. How concerned and eyes wide open should people be in trying to differentiate in inaccurate information. It's important for people to see that the brazen. It's important for the public to understand that russia is trying to once again infiltrate our election for the benefit of one candidate, in this case donald trump. They did it in 2016 until a way that no one really expected. But the way that they did it was to use their own fake bots and their own fake news sites and social media platforms or individuals. Now, what they are doing is they recognize that it is a lot more effective if they can funnel their propaganda and their misinformation through trusted influencers in this country. And that's what is so startling about this case. Is you have these two far right novices who started a media company. They got paid 10 $10 million to parrot russian propaganda. It's yet to see what is going to happen to these social media. And it's still remains to be seen is going to happen to these people that were putting out $400,000 per episode propaganda. And putin is the enemy of this country, it's so preposterous. And i feel bad for ronald reagan for what is happening to his republican party. Do you believe that they were oblivious or is it possible that there could be another shoe to drop here. I think there could be another shoe to drop. Their entire funding was from russia and that's how they were able to pay these people. There's a lot more to learn about what that relationship. It is possible that these influencers didn't know where the source of the money. They were just getting paid by tenant media and they didn't know. But it's also possible there was communication about what messages they should be promoting. And that is what's scary. It's just the tip of the iceberg of the republicans efforts to under mine our democracy. To allow foreign interference for their own political gain. And so that they can then take down the rule of law, take town our democratic institutions, implement project 2025, which would allow donald trump to be a truly dictator without any kind of checks and balances. This is all part of the plan. This sub economy, the weaponnization sub committee. The purpose of that is to chill any committees from getting involved in any way, shape or form with social media sites. So that, russia can do this. We only have about 45 second, left. But there's so much going on. I want to ask you. There's a debate going on in two days what is your expectation and hope for what vice president harris does in that debate. What do you think people need to see in that debate? as a former prosecutor she can make the case. She can make the case about her. She can make the case about the danger of donald trump. And she's a very strong powerful woman who has a knack for getting under donald trump's skin. And i expect that to happen. But one of the things that we do want to know is, her policies and she's going to have to lay that out. But let's remember, we need to have a democracy in order to implement policies. And what you see from dick cheney and liz cheney who disagree on every policy manner with kamala harris coming out and supporting her because they recognize that this election is about a lot more than policy. It's about our future and democracy and i hope that they will make that clear on tuesday. That does it for me today. For now stay right where you are because there's much more news coming up on msnbc. Emplon they need instantly. This is how business goes further with tmobile for business. You can cashback 5% on travel purchased through chase with freedom unlimited and. . . Buy better plane seats. Switch to a king suite. 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In the past, he would not have been able to do any of those things. On this two hour one candidate is preparing while the other is rambling. And did vance