tomorrow. you may know him as steve bannon but on monday trump's former campaign manager and chief white house strategist will become federal inmate 056- 3509. having already lost his case and first appeal bannon is expected to report to a federal prison in connecticut on monday morning. s that unless the supreme court intervenes which it could do at any moment. today the department of justice, formerly urged the high court not to intervene here. and to let mr. bannon face accountability for his actions but remarkably, the justice department isn't the only group that lobbied the court about steve bannon today. >> mr. speaker, i understand there might be a change in position regarding the house and their stance on the january 6th committee and it might be regarding steve bannon and it may have a big impact on his contempt case. tell me what's going on. >> yeah, we're working on filing an amicus grief on his apellate court there in his case. >> reporter: today speaker of the house mike johnson and several other republican members of the house voted to make the formal position of the u.s. house of representative the formal position that the january 6th committee did not have the authority to do the work that it did. and that therefore, steve bannon should not have to go to prison. to step back here for some context. remember that the reason steve bannon is heading to prison in the first place is because he refused to comply with the subpoena from the january 6th committee. that's despite clearly knowing a lot about january 6th and the plan to overturn biden's win in congress. just to refresh your memory. here was mr. bannon the day before the attack on the capital. >> tomorrow morning, look. what's going to happen. we're going to have president trump speaks at 11:00. we're going to be live at 10:00. we're going to have a lot of analysis. i'll tell you this it's not going to happen like you think it's going to happen. it's going to be quite extraordinarily different. and all i can say is strap in. the war room posse you have made this happen and tomorrow it's game day. >> strap in tomorrow it's game day. you might think that defying congress would not be something members of congress would support. you might think that helping a potentially key witness refuse to cooperate in an investigation into the gravest attack on congress since the war of 1812 that might be inadvisable for the speaker of house. but the republican leader of the house isn't just doing that he's boasting about it on national television. today we may have gotten a clue as to why. today the washington post and george mason university are out with new polling that asked voters in six key swing states who they trusted more when it came to protecting our democracy. joe biden on donald trump. somehow donald trump came out on top. 44% of voters in those six swing states trust trump over biden to protect democracy. in arizona, michigan, nevada, pennsylvania, wisconsin and georgia 44% of voters trust donald trump. the man who incited the attack on the capital, the man who calls the january 6th rioters hostages. and more to the point, the man who tried to subvert democracy and steal our last presidential election by force. i mean, trump lies about the last election so much to this day, that last night when he phoned into the conservative channel news max and started bragging about winning the most votes the network news max scrambled to run a matter that says, please note, news max accepts the elections results as legal. that isn't necessarily because news max cares about the truth but maybe because news max is being sued by multiple voting machine companies for defamation in and around the 2020 election. but somehow, somehow more voters in the swing states that will likely decide this election trust donald trump over joe biden when it comes to defending our democracy. that poll is confounding. but it also highlights a dark reality and one we have to wrestle with to understand what's happening in our nation's capitol right now. the big lie is working. not everywhere and not all the time. but donald trump and his republican boosters in congress and the right wing media they have all successfully sold a sizable portion on the american congress not just on the lie that the election was rigged but that donald trump and steve bannon are victims. and that they trump and bannon are the defenders. as preposterous as it may sound. >> i have the wounds all over my body. if i took my shirt off, you would see a beautiful, beautiful, person. but you would see wounds all over. all over me. i've taken a lot of wounds, i can tell you. more than i suspect any president ever. i suspect any president ever. >> not only is trump fund raising off of this by printing his mug shot on t-shirts and mugs. but he's claiming that when he had his mug shot taken in fulton county georgia he was tortured in the jail. now if you live on earth one, as i do, it is almost impossible to take trump's martyr act serious. he is getting special treatment everywhere including the highest court in the land where the supreme court has not ruled if trump has immunity and can do whatever he wants. but if you live on earth two, if the information you're receiving is from right wing media or donald trump on his allies and social media feeds, well then the lies really seem to be sticking. but, we are now less than 24 hours before november when the people of earth one and the people of earth two will see the very same thing at the same time. tomorrow night at 9:00 p.m. eastern, president biden and donald trump will face off in a televised debate that will be hosted by cnn but will also be simulcast. if you turn on a television tomorrow at 9:00 p.m. the odds are you will see this debate. and according to a new online survey from the associated press, four in 10 american adults said they are going to be watching live. it's almost half the country. so with this massive opportunity to pierce the bubble of these lies, what does joe biden do? joining me now is georgia democratic senator rafael warnock. serves as the senior pastor at ebenezer baptist church in atlanta. i can think of no better person to help understand this moment we're in. thank you for joining me. let me just first ask as someone who understands the state of georgia well, how and why is donald trump able to convince a majority of voters in your state that he is the real defender of democracy. that he is the champion of freedom. >> well, it's great to be here with you. thank you so very much. listen, i hail from the great state of georgia. and where the debate will happen tomorrow, i think it's appropriate remember that it was georgia after all that saved the day. i was on the ballot here in 2020-21, one of five times. and who would have thought that when the nation was at this critical place, that it would be georgia that would make the difference. sending its first african- american senator and its first jewish senator to the united states senate. in a state in the jim crow south. we gave the united states a chance. and at the end of the day i think georgia voters will do it again. because they see the difference. we're going to see these polls go up and down between now and november. forgive me for quoting the scripture but you asked to talk to the preacher tonight. i still believe as jesus said that you shall know the truth. the truth will set you free. dr. king used to say the truth crushed the earth will rise again. so we have to continue to lay out the contrast between these two men and tomorrow is a critical moment in that discussion. i think as tough as these times are, the thing about this election is that it's a binary choice and the choice could not be more stark. it's literally between a man who can only think about himself and is obsessed with himself with all of these criminal charges hanging over him. and a man who has literally dedicated his whole life to public service, a noble calling. and i think that our job between now and november is to preach the gospel which literally means the good news about the work that's being done and yet the great work that we have to continue to do. >> you know you bring up the gospel and scripture and i wonder if we can sort of extract any lessons from that. i think you're no better person, there's no better person to sort of try and understand the magnetism of trump than you reverend. i know you spoke about the moral and spiritual battle that the country is in and that this is really a spiritual crisis that america is going through that has been exacerbated by trumpism. i don't think it's lost on anybody the way in which trump sees himself as a sort of savior like figure. he was talking in that sound we played earlier if you took his shirt off you would see the wounds. and either explicitly or implicitly often invokes jesus and his struggles in his campaign. and i wonder, you know, a what you make of that. but also what you think it speaks to in terms of a deeper yearning that people who follow trump are looking for. >> donald trump is a plague on the american conscious and the american nation. i talked about the fact that when we were in the midst of this terrible once in a century pandemic, and we saw donald trump and those around him at work trying to divide the country, because that's what people like him do. they don't know how to lead us so they're trying to divide us. and georgia sent the son of immigrants to the united states senate in one felt swoop. i believe that martin luther king jr. and yeshell were in that moment giving a high five in glory because they were together marching. i have to tell you the next morning i felt great about how georgia had done. and everybody wanted to talk to me about how we won that election. but that next morning was january 6th. our victory lap was short lived. we saw a violent assault on our capital unlike anything we've seen since the war of 1812 driven by this big lie that you're talking about that the election was stolen. but what we have to remember is that behind that big lie is an even bigger lie. what they were really saying is this new emerging electoral, multi racial, multi generational doesn't get to decide the direction of the country. they're trying to take us backwards. joe biden is trying to take us forward and the choice this november is between the america of january 5th that has a place for kids like me and for kids appalachian kids, poor kids, and the america of january 6th. that sees our neighbors as enemies. and it couldn't be a more stark choice. i believe that at the end of the day, the people of georgia and the people of this country there's just enough decency in this country. if we keep pushing and keep laying out the truth, that the truth will prevail. >> you know, you talk about the power of the multiracial, multiethnic coalition that brought you and senator ossof into office again. and i do wonder, whether what you think about the strength of that coalition in your state coming up this november. because the polling shows, president biden is slimming among communities of color. i believe the new atlanta journal constitution poll says among black voters in georgia, 69% of them are going for biden. 9% for trump, 6% for robert f. kennedy jr. 12% are undecided. in 2020 exit polls had biden at 88%. if those numbers are right that's nearly a 20% drop. and i wonder do you believe it? what do you account? what do you hold to account for it. >> as somebody who's name was in the ballot five times in georgia in less than three years and who preaches every sunday from martin luther king's pulpit. i think i know a little something about black voters. i can tell you that black voters are not going to show up and vote for donald trump not in any appreciable numbers. we'll see the polls go up and down from now to november. most americans aren't really paying much attention until after labor day. so we'll continue to make the case that really we're talking, about the soul of our country. we are i believe in a spiritual battle. between those who want us to see each other as enemies, to turn on each other, and the forces in our country that would have us turn toward each other and build a nation that is strong enough, broad enough in its moral vision to embrace all of us. it is that nation that gave me a chance. one of 12 children in our family. i'm number 11 out of 12 first college graduate. how did it get there? pell grants, that's why i reminded him of his promise to do student debt cancellation to his credit he got it. and with one hand behind his back, he's canceled some $160 billion of student loans, helping some 5 million americans we hope that by the end of the year, it'll be many many more americans. i can tell you that i go in rooms with black people all across the state and i ask them, have you or anybody you know gotten student debt cancellation and i haven't been in a room yet where hands have not gone up. on top of that $16 billion of investments and historically black colleges. prescription drugs capped to $35 of out of pocket cost per month that's my bill which the president signed into law. my question is do we want to keep building on that p rogress. sure people are struggling. the whole nation is struggling on what i call a low grade fever after three years of a pandemic. prior to that 20 years of war. i think there's some days you wake up in the morning and there's just this numb feeling. and the question is, who do you want leading at a time like that? i think we want somebody who has been baptized in his own pain and suffering. has said goodbye to children more than once. has lived a life of service, not a perfect man but one who has been made better by struggle and who understands the struggles of ordinary people. that's joe biden. >> it's a pleasure to have you on the program. thank you so much for your time. >> thank you. there is much more ahead tonight. including donald trump's narrow list of vice presidential contenders which features a list of men who once said they didn't want anything to do with him. we're going to get into why it is so controversial. that's next. the cockroach. resilient creatures. true miracles of evolution. where there is one, others aren't far behind. always scavenging for food, the cockroach... well that's horrifying. ortho home defense max indoor insect barrier. one application kills and prevents bugs for 365 days. not in my house you don't. nature is wild. your home doesn't have to be. if you have generalized myasthenia gravis, picture what life could look like with... vyvgart hytrulo, a subcutaneous injection that takes about 30 to 90 seconds. for one thing, could it mean more time for you? vyvgart hytrulo can improve daily abilities and reduce muscle weakness with a treatment plan that's personalized to you. do not use vyvgart hytrulo if you have a serious allergy to 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the term the united states supreme court handed down two rulings this morning and then inadvertently they gave us a sneak peak into a third. reporters at bloomberg law got access to an accidentally posted copy of what appears to be the court's decision on a very consequential abortion case. according to bloomburgberg is poised to allow women in idaho to receive abortion in medical emergencies. on face this sounds like a good decision but the decision appears to be because of a technicality rather than the actual merits on the case. the justices did not decide whether state abortion bans can be overwritten by federal law requires doctors to provide medical interventions including abortion in emergency situations. in other words, whether doctors are allowed to perform emergency abortion if medically necessary. and that is very much a live issue in five other states where abortion is almost completely banned. as justice brown-jackson made very clear in her opinion the ruling is not a victory for pregnant patients in ohio, it is a delay. while this court doddles and the country waits, the doctors are kept in the dark about what the law requires. joining me now is eran carmone and the author of the book, being pregnant in america. you understand the complexities of these issues better than most. but the voracity of the decision does it smack of the decision. and brown-jackson is not mincing words about how upset she is. >> so many fascinating dynamics to break down here. the first thing is a court did say that a decision, or that a text of a decision was up loaded. we know it's a legitimate document. we don't know if it's a final document. it's funny how we're getting to peer back behind the curtains so many times and the court looks like a hot mess almost every single time that happens. it could have just been an error that seems like the likeliest reason. it's certainly reads that every single justice is itself. there's a small chance it was yanked because perhaps an outcome of a vote has changed. i doubt it. we'll find out tomorrow morning perhaps the next day when their decision is scheduled. >> what about brown-jackson that this is an appalling waste of court's time. we can't simply wind back the clock to how things were before the court injected itself into this matter with the dobbs ruling. it is too little for the court to take a mulligan and just tell the lower courts to carry on as if had not happened. as the old adage goes the court has made its bed so now it must lie in it. these are forceful words from the newest member of the court and she seems quite clearly upset about how this has been handled. >> this is very powerful comes from justice jackson. she's calling out barrett who's described herself about changing her mind about taking the case. just big picture something before we step back in all the different opinions what they mean here. what's at stake here is for the longest time on planet right wing fantasy there is no emergency abortion that is justified and if there is, we're not going to call it an abortion. that is the planet they've been living on. two years ago, that was put into practice. the reality had to intercede that in fact, there's plenty of reasons why somebody might have to go to an emergency room and need abortion care. and so, their answer in the beginning was oh no someone is misinterpreting the law. now we've gotten to the stage where their lawyers are in court saying, well no it really doesn't happen that way or it's the doctors making us look bad. now they're getting to the point where someone's organs fail. that's the backdrop that everybody other week someone is being medivaced in idaho. and women are being told that if they get pregnant they get insuranced into a medicav. there's not that many people in idaho and yet there's someone every other week that needs this care that we know of that goes to the hospital. the backdrop is the court jumped in on this so fast before the lower courts even had a chance to fully explore the issue. because they agree they took it face value, idaho's argument that the federal government was going to force them to suffer irreparable harm. they needed at least one justice to change their mind because it takes four justices to take it. in the end we ended up with a 3- 3-3 opinion. we had the three female democratic appointees. we had three quote unquote. >> i would put that until heavy quotes. >> we had three republican politicians. kavanaugh, barrett and roberts. they would rather wait for the trump justice department to resolve this than blow up this issue before the election. >> they see what's happening to the country in the process. >> they saw 2022. then you have the true believers, gorsuch, alito and thomas who wanted to burn this whole thing down. then you have jackson don't bother with this face justification of the procedure to say, we shouldn't have taken it so we don't have to decide it. we'll wave. because she knows there's a lot of other states that have to resolve this question. >> there's a case in texas that's the mirror imagine of that that is going to certainly go to the court. >> she's saying don't make this women in other states, idaho how about texas where there's another case. we saw the same thing happen with the mistropone case. what about all these other cases. are they just punting it because they know how bad, by they i mean the republican appointed justices. the trump justice department or potential future trump appointees could do their dirty work in the future. >> or the comsta ck act can take care of the work. it's damming to the court. it is a remarkable cynical view of the court. erin carmone, thank you. what donald trump is doing to prepare for tomorrow's presidential debate which apparently you're allowed to call anything but debate prep. but first, murdoch is letting it be known who they would want donald trump to pick for vice president. is donald trump even 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dealing with here my friend is a con artist. he is a con artist. >> those are the three front runners for trump's running mates. and murdoch made the case for bergum. that follows after the new york post. another murdoch owned paper. it's pretty clear who murdoch wants but is trump even listening. and here claire macaskell. thank you so much for join requesting us. tim, i wonder whether the murdoch empire matters to donald trump anymore. what resonance do you think this has. >> nope, maybe 0. slightly more than 0. but murdoch postput it like on page 32 and there's a banner on the front page that said local florida man makes announcement. the murdoch's were off the trump train, they were all in for de santis. they put all the weight of the murdoch behind de santis. all that amounted to literally nothing. donald trump crushed ron de santis so i don't know why donald trump would care what rupert murdoch thinks now when they've done nothing for him and he's strong stronger than ever at least within the republican party. >> that begs the question what exactly is trump looking for. i will read a question of burgum to get your thought on this. the governor has executive experience and was a successful tech ceo at microsoft which bought his company. managed to work well with trump which isn't easy. is that what don donald trump is looking for. steve balmer if you're out there sorry for the comparison to donald trump. >> yeah, doug is perfect because he will not upstage trump, number two he is great because they can get his hands on money. if they wrote it that way. i would advise them not to put in the editorial just look how well it worked out for pence. >> right. the more the editorial bear hugs him the more likely trump is to pick whoever it is they bear hug. >> how did jd vance go from being a celebrated author about how he was a never trumper to on his short list for surrogate son? >> that baby face is making a lot of sense in the intro. what happened to him if we could only bring him back. >> what did happen to him in. >> well, you know donald trump jr. is on his side right now. which i think is a much more important endorsement than the wall street journey. phu my view is what happened to him is what happened to a lotover these guys. the same thing that happened to marco. they want maga, they want trumpism, they want nationalism and then they back filled the policy rational to support that. and you know i think somebody like jd vance was always moderate on economic issues so he used that to argue that he's maga and that he layered on top of that. well i guess in order to be maga i have to suck up to trump and do vaccine conspiracies so he layered that on top of his i think more authentic populous economic and now he's here in the maga world. >> and trump wants to be alpha and therefor does that put j.k. vancely higher in the sweepstakes because of donald trump and his youth. >> you can look at it two ways j.d. vance was successful with a book. and was well thought of before he became maga by a lot of folks in a lot of different places. that's the problem that trump has. he wants someone who looks vice president -rbl, but someone who will never act intkpwepbtly. never ever take the shine off of trump and frankly will do whatever he asks him to do. that was pence' problem. pence thought the constitution mattered. pence wanted to follow the law as it applied to peaceful transfer of power in america. i mean all, i mean if you look at what donald trump did to marco rubio it's just sad that these guys are groveling. i mean they're falling over themselves to try out to get this job, to grovel at his feet. to kiss his feet. it's not a show of strength. what they're trying to show is they're weak enough to be the vice president that donald trump really wants. >> your thoughts on marco rubio at the appalling transformation of groveling at trump. >> you need weakness to get it. i think the rubio transformation a lot of it stems to bitterness. when i was writing about these guys like my former colleagues and a strategist said and the former right republicans i used to roll with, what i found in those interviews and i've interviewed marco but people who worked if him, thought they were mad. they felt judged by us. they felt judged by the media, by their friends. and some of them reacted to that very poorly i think that marco he feels aggrieved. he feels bitter and that has almost thrust him into donald trump's arms. he offers trump the most humiliating option. because if you picked marco as vp, he forces him to move from his state. >> what a role it is to be donald trump's vice presidential pick. let's hang with me on the next block because i want to get your thought on one more story which is on the eve of his first debate with president bite den. trump has set that bar at sea level. how much of that really matters? and i'm going to talk to eric cortalesa with inmate aka steve bannon who is due to report to 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or pharmacist about shingrix today. we're less than 24 hours away from the first presidential debate. president biden participated in at least one mock debate yesterday and another one today at camp david where he has been residing since last thursday. trump has been under going something called policy refreshers. trump has held half a dozen of these sessions each about an hour long involving a core group of top aids. just don't call that debate prep. it's a policy refresher. trump has also been devoting some of his time to the expectation game. if president biden does well tomorrow it means he's on drugs. >> a little before debate time he gets a shot in the as. they want to strengthen him up. so he comes out, he'll come out, okay, i say he'll come out all jacked up, right. all jacked up. >> back with mayor tim miller and former senator claire mccaskell. claire, this is not a new line from donald trump right. in 2020 he called for joe biden to take a drug test. 2016, he said hillary clinton was juicing. wanted her to take a drug test. is this truly the best he can come up with. given the past? >> yeah, he doesn't really know how to do anything but personally insult people. that really is his only, that's the only song in his hymn book. and he's gotten himself in a bind because he spent so long convincing someone that this guy can't walk or talk. i even noticed kevin mccarthy on fox today talking about how sharp joe biden is. and how he knew every detail of a policies coming back from the g7 meeting. i'm like going, wait a minute, wait a minute. you were just quoted in the new york times saying he didn't know where he was. >> yes. >> so they're kind of caught, you know. they can't really keep up that the guy is horrible because you know joe biden is going to come out tomorrow and he's going to be scrappy. it's going to be really interesting to watch how joe biden tries to take on donald trump with his lies and his meandering and his crazy talk. i will predict we will see state of the union joe biden and it'll be quite a wonderful definite -- debate. >> i wonder about these refreshers, because it's never ever debate prep. i think rubio and vance have been helping him with these policy refreshers. what do you think this merit is having anyone talk to trump before this debate given his performances prior. >> i also got a kick on the policy refresher from cavuto who got that tip. he can't admit that he's prepping because of his ego so they come up with this stuff. donald trump did improve before the first debate in 2020 and second debate in 2020. it didn't help in the end. joe biden ended up winning. but donald trump has a lot of flaws but he is capable of taking some feed back and and sanding down his rougher edges if he doesn't get triggered. that's president joe biden's job. because they're going to try to put out calm for trump. out cal presidential debate. coverage begins at 7:00 eastern and goes until very late. coming up a new interview sheds light on what steve in and plans to do while serving out his prison sentence. here is a hint, he will not be pumping iron, or so he says. that is right after the break. . kisqali is a pill that when taken with an aromatase inhibitor helps delay cancer from growing and has been proven to help people live significantly longer across three separate clinical trials. so, i have the confidence to live my life. kisqali can cause lung problems or an abnormal heartbeat, which can lead to death. it can cause serious skin reactions, liver problems, and low white blood cell counts that may result in severe infections. avoid grapefruit during treatment. tell your doctor right away if you have new or worsening symptoms, including breathing problems, cough, chest pain, a change in your heartbeat, dizziness, yellowing of the skin or eyes, dark urine, tiredness, loss of appetite, abdomen pain, bleeding, bruising, fever, chills, or other symptoms of an infection, a severe or worsening rash, are or plan to become pregnant, or breastfeeding. long live life and long live you. ask your doctor about kisqali today. shop etsy for thoughtful pieces made by real people to bring a little something extra to the ordinary. and long live you. find items that add wow to walls and make you fall in love with your family room again. when you want one-of-a-kind pieces to refresh your home... etsy has it. these underwear are period-proof. and sneeze-proof. and sweat-proof. they're leakproof underwear, from knix. comfy & confident protection that feel just like normal. with so many styles and colors to choose from, switching is easy at knix.com i love that my daughter still needs me. but sometimes i can't help due to burning and stabbing pain in my hands, so i use nervive. nervive's clinical dose of ala reduces nerve discomfort in as little as seven days. now i can help again feel the difference with nervive. when we're young, we're told anything is possible... ...but only a few of us go out and prove it. witness the greatness of anna hall on a connection worthy of gold: xfinity mobile. only xfinity gives you the most powerful mobile wifi network, with speeds up to a gig in millions of locations. and right now, xfinity internet customers can buy one unlimited line and get one free for a year. get the fastest connection to paris with xfinity. steve banman is days away from the start of a four month prison sentence for contempt of congress unless the supreme court agrees to his last ditch attempt to remain free while he appeals. for a man that could possibly be reporting to prison this monday he seems unfazed. in a interview he says i do not fear this at all, i am a political prisoner. been and is attempting to rally a audience he calls the rally of the awakened, by playing the mortar he hopes to elevate his brand of burn it all down populism. thank you for joining me. my first question is the understanding he has about being sidelined in the months leading up to the election given what you write about, the real leadership role he plays in the movement. unlike other personalities that follow trumps lead, he can claim influence over the movement. what are his prison plans? >> i think he sees his sentences a opportunity to fortify support for him as a martyr for the cause and he will capitalize on it as much as he can on the days leading up. he will try to lay the groundwork for the antiestablishment crusade he believes can help deliver the white house for trump where he can embark on the nationalist right-wing agenda he is promising. in prison he plans to spend his time in the library following the news, communicating with associates so he can have a role in shaping messaging going into the election. >> he told you, do you think i am coming out prison ripped? no. i have work to do. he will continue on with his messaging. talk to me about what you saw behind the scenes in his layer in terms of his consumption of media in his planning for battle. >> i spent time with him recently during a saturday morning recording of his podcast at his townhouse and it is a bit of what you would imagine. it is cluttered, it is full of all of these curiosities and tchotchkes including shrines to icons like peter navarro and a bust of himself. he watches msnbc religiously and he is really monitoring who he sees as the opposition in the information war to build up mag a as a social movement as much as he can so it can have the greatest influence throughout the next couple of months leading up to win voters cast ballots but also if trump is victorious he wants to see these kinds of ideas be imposed. hostility to immigration and free trade. a aversion to foreign integral man. he is trying to build the infrastructure for a trump revolution. >> what i think is a development if not surprising is the handshake between republican establishment leadership and the cause of steve bannon. i wonder what your impressions were of the work the speaker of the house did today on behalf of steve shannon effectively distancing congress from the work of the january 6 committee to vacate bannon's conviction. it is not the wing of marjorie taylor green. >> it goes to show how effective bannon has been at transforming the republican party into the political wing of the mag a movement through war room, his allied media personalities, he has created a fighting machine as a top aide to president trump, to go against republicans not in line with trump. he has built a ecosystem that can exert pressure and you have people that work in tandem to coerce republicans and try to dismantle the old guard republican establishment. it shows how effective he has been at doing that since january 6 where mag a as a movement has only grown in size and strength. >> it is a fascinating read, i guess i will say i am glad steve bannon is watching msnbc. i will leave that hanging as a question. thank you for the great reporting eric. that is our show tonight, now it is time for the last word. >> we have ginsberg joining us to answer a question i have been wondering about an

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