Three dozen according to local then at Fordham University here in New York City earlier this Evening Police wearing helmets andce carrying batons arrested propalestinian demonstrators placing them in zip ties as they took down an encampment inside a campus building. This is all, of course, part of a larger Protest Movement spreading across dozens of colleges. And while the demands of each individual protest vary, theyre primarily focused on drawing attention to the Tens Of Thousands of Palestinian Civiliansni killed in gaza and calling for their colleges to financially divest from investments connected to israel. Protesters have been followed by dozens of counterprotests primarily in support of israel and against what supporters call rising antisemitism. Overall more than 1,500 protesters have been arrested in just the past two weeks. Many of those arrests have been brutal withar protesters forcedo the ground and forcibly removed. With a story this big its important not to paint all of this with too broad a brush. All of this is made up of individual acts. All happening on different campuses with different responses from administrators and different responses from police. Last night we saw two incredibly different examples of these protests and counterprotests and how theyve been haldled by local police. Heres how uclas student newspaper, theen daily bruin, described what happened on its campus last night. Fireworks, tear gas and fights broke out just after 10 50 p. M. On tuesday night and continued early wednesday morning as over 100 israel counter protesters attempted to storm the solidarity encampment. The way the daily bruin writes that story that group of proisrael counterprotesters tore down the barricades across the encampment, and once the barricades were down they started fighting the protesters. They shot fireworks into the encampment, Hit Protesters with sticks and used wooden planks and electric scooters at the protesters while chanting usa, usa. As far as the Police Presence wass concerned heres how the daily bruins Editorial Board put it this morning. For hours itucla administration stood by and watched as the violence escalated. Lapd did not arrive on the scene until slightly after 1 00 a. M. That was last night at ucla in los angeles. At Columbia University here in New York City it was a very different story. Here is now columbias campus newspaper, the Peckitator Reportedws it. Hundreds of new york police departmentyo officers entered campus andre cleared the hall. Minouche shafik authorized officers to clear encampments. If youll recall from last nights Footage Officers entered the building through a window on the side of the t building and began Clearing Rooms while some officers had what appeared to be their guns drawn. In total the nypd made 109 arrests at Columbia University last night. The departments commissioner of Public Information told the spectator that he commended the strength and position of his officers. Meanwhile the peckitator opponents out one Protester Wuthrown down a flight of stairs, another lay on the ground unmoving while police stood over there, and others were slammed with metal barricades and pushed to the ground. In This T First Batch Of Footag put out by the nypd the ratio of Police Officers to protesters appears to be very, very uneven. Its actually kind of difficult at times to even find protesters in thisd sea of police. And then there is the matter of the second video put out today by the nypd. Right now were inside the Hamilton Building of Columbia University. Were on the third floor looking for the Student Protesters that took over the building. Behind us conducting operations. Were checking each floor, checking each door. You can see theyve setup an encampt in the classroom, Sleeping Bags all over the place. Were on the campus at columbia in the tent city, which here is cleared. Just a remarkable plan and executionem by the nypd. This is not a tent city. This is New York City. Its our city, and if youre thinking about doing Something Like this,ki take a look around. See how fast we cleared it out. This could be you. Sort of a half promotional video for the nypd, half a warning shot to future protesters. Theres also a sound track you may have noticed and Situation Room footage as officers planned the columbia sweep like it was i dont know the bin laden raid. It was not what you might call a tool for deescalation. But it is worth noting that some colleges have actually managed toe do just that, to deescala the tension on their campuses this week. Both brown and North Western university reached deals with Student Eaprotesters this week with protesters leaving encampments. Whether or not thatin can be replicated elsewherebe at this point is totally unclear. This is happening across the country with lots of individual actors making separate decisions, and thatto makes the story complicated, and that is important to remember, because we have actors in our National Discourse right now who are very much trying to exploit this tension for very obvious political gain. Many of them arent even students, you know, and many of them come from foreign countries. Where do they come from . And they do come from other countries and they areco paid. Crooked joe is reportedly planning this is wonderful news for you people in wisconsin to bring massive numbers of gazans from the middle east. All live to your american towns, your towns and villages. Joe biden seems determined hes just determined to create the conditions for an October 7thor style attack right here i america. Its going to happen. Joining me now is jelani cobb dean. Professor dean, thanks for joining me. Fall, dean cobb wrpg youve been compare in the middle of whats happening at columbia. I talked on the phone last night and you described the situation as tragic. In thisd sort of cold light of day i wonder how you assess what has happened at that university, and also we heard reports you were threatened with arrests last night. Can you talk a little bit about what exactly went down . So i think the word tragic is probably the most Apt Descriptor for it. And even kind of looking out now the campus is eerily quiet. You know, its completely locked down. Theres elvery, very few people there. And sory as opposed to what wou typically be people at the end ofbe the semester, you know, seniors eager to graduate and much more joyous environment typically. On The Other Side its technically accurate to say but not really factual, i suppose. We were out there in a hallway, were in a doorway of the building as officers said if anyone comes outside theyll get arrested. We were talking to a group of our lkstudents, so i went to th doorway to say, hey, im the dean, these are my students, so on. So it was not a kind of threat of arrest impending or anything like that. But once that kind of got out, i got literally like hundreds of messages from people. Well, it is an incredibly emotionally pitched moment, right, people who saw that unfold. And there were no casualties, but it was an extraordinary picture to watch the police in riot gear go into Hamilton Hall and the arrests made subsequently. Peter, you tweeted, and i think this is worth calling attention to. I dontwo agree with every slog of the protests on campus and some i really dislike. If that happen i think thats probably a good thing for National Discourse. I do wonder when you see nypd video and hear donald trump spinning this into never neverland, joe biden is never inviting another october 7th here but it ratchets up unreasonable dialogue. I think inre Progressive Spas and especially the Democratic Party people are questioning why do wooio have unconditional support for israel. Before october 7th there was almost no member of congress except a few members of the squad who supported military aid. The question of divestment from colleges, whatme exactly that means we dont know. We theres a lot to be unpacked there. But why is It Universities should be supporting any companies that involved in Military Action anywhere around the worldry for that matter . People are now starting to talk about that. They werent talking about that. It may be many years before our system changes. Think about the occupy movement. It rose and diminished and people thought it was gone. Then it reappeared with Bernie Sanders campaign. It was that fervor. And then in 72 they nominated george mcgovern. The energy from this will change at least the Democratic Partys position. Thats ati really good point the way this is not a linear thing. Sometimes there are peaks anda valleys before real change comes. Jelani, in terms of the conversations, its hard to get an understanding of what exactly happened between students and administrators atnt columbia an whereni things go next. I think minouche shafik, the president noted today that, unfortunately, the protests our academic leaders spent eight days engaging over long hours in serious dialogue and good faith with ooprotest representatives p now theres not much information what happens now the campus is where it is. Iis cant really speak to th. But i can tell you thats true. We spent a lot of time all hours of the night through the day engaged in discussions in good faith on both sides. I think that the students are incredibly smart, thoughtful. They understood the issue. They were clear. And there was more or less ill be honest with you there was more or less on the University Side than i anticipated. The frustrating thing we didnt get tofr a kind of meeting plac in the middle, and we devoted a lot of time and energy trying to get there. Do you think the outside kind of political overlay changes thc contours of the discussion or absolutely. Can you talk a little bit about that . If i can take a little bit of context, when we look back at the congressional hearings where claudine gay and the president of mitt was there and people criticized them for giving academic answers and so on. Well, theyre academics. Theyre supposed to be thoughtful and give nuance. Thats what universities do best is get into this gulf of misunderstanding and provide information and data and analysis and history and all the things that we can give to help people draw firm conclusions about something. You cant really do that in a context where there are politicians breathing down your neck and where the discourse on your campus is being dissected not simply like whether people are right or wrong, are these ideas useful or not useful. But are these people treasonous, are these people dangerous . Are these people you know, in that kind of sense it makes it almost impossible for universities to fulfill our mission. Fu on that note the idea this it feels like and im paraphrasing my brilliant colleaguebr chris hayes here. It has become less about what we should doss in israel im seein this nationally, than a sort of Usefulis Cudgel to beat the lef with,ud an antiwoke. Its Law And Order running up against the woke liberal elites andke their spoiled children. And you know what part of that is because its actually now almost impossible to support the war. Even in israel people ipisraels military a are admitting this war is not going to destroy hamas, that thaconsequences of this warce is actually going toe bad for israel, its actually going to create a generation of palestinians more radicalized from israel then weve seen before. This is a distraction. People should be talking about why were all these people for months p upon month after month supporting this utterly catastrophic destructive war that willve make everyone less safe . How do you grade the Biden Administration on d that . Because they too have focused on the unrest on the campus without necessarily getting into the specific demands, for example, that protesters are asking of their college administrators. Yes, and the Biden Administration keeps sending more weapons to fight this war even thoughth i dont believe f a second they believe this war is going tobe make israel safer. And they know that it is producingat a catastrophe in ga that will haunt us for generations. It saw a u. N. Study that said the T War Ended Tomorrow Gaza would return to the gdp that it had in the war they started in 2093. Thats how long were going to be living with this catastrophe, and the Biden Administration did not need to go all in on this. They made the choice. Some of the people active about antiwokism are the same people who had dinner with nick fuentes. Theres no accounting for the reality of these actual Battle Lines Republicans have drawn. I think its curious these people have not seemed to notice the antisemitism in Virginia In Charlottesville where we saw the tiki torch out there. Or many of the other instances we can talk about. Theres just a curious absence there. I was going to say do you have an answer i for that . Because they dont really care about jews. Theyre using jews to attack the universities. And they hate the universities they hate the idea the universities are teaching things subversive to the founding myths of america they are so invested in. Its not a coincidence ron desantis is the same governor prevent from teaching about americas history and whiteea supremacy. I say this as a jewish person, it is not a good thing for us to be used by Elise Stefanik and donald trump and all these people to attack universities and people with a history of oppression in the United States who want to speak about their experience. We should not be in that business. That war on cancel culture is a selective war. Thank you so much for joining me tonight. Really appreciate it. Coming up we will speak to the Time Magazine reporter who sat down with donald trump to discuss what he has planned for a potential second term. Spoiler alert, it is not good. But first Speaker Mike Johnson continues Toke Weaponize Campus protests for political gain. Well talk about his latest effort andut whether house making the right move in saving the speaker from the rebels in his party. That is next. Ng speaker from the rebels in his party. That is next i mean this is right and wrong, this is good versus evil. Theres no gray area here. And, you know, were trying to speak with moral clarity. Were trying to use the responsibility of congress to address the issue in an appropriate manner. That was the republican Speaker Mike Johnson talking about a bipartisan bill that passed the house today called the antisemitism awareness act. The law would mandate the Department Of Education adopt the International Holocaust remembrance alliances, a very broad definition of antisemitism when defining discrimination laws. That defines antisemitism as a certain expression of jews. Under this definition opposing zionism or Holding Signs that oppose a revolution could cost the School FederalResearch Grants and its funding. While this bill passed the house overwhelming on a vote of 32091 it made very strange bedfellows among those who opposed it. Republican congresswoman Marjorie Taylor greene voiced her opposition to the antisemitism bill by deploying an antisemitic trope. Joining me now is congresswoman pramila jayapal. Thanks for joining me and helping me understand what exactly went down today. My first question is the language of this bill and why its so broad. Do you have a thesis as to why the scope was so large . Yeah, alex, i do, and that is that unfortunately i think republicans are trying to weaponize antisemitism. They want to bring bills to the floor that actually divide democrats. And what we really need to do if we want to tackle antisemitism, which i believe every democrat does want to do and many republicans, we would do a we would bring a bipartisan bill, and we would have a whole of government approach that involves educating people what antisemitism is and what it isnt and making sure were all speaking with one voice. I think its incredibly hurtful to the cause of eliminating antisemitism for republicans to weaponize it and to be hypocrites about bringing forward something that is about pure political gain, not about fighting antisemitism. I think thats why they brought this bill because they knew it would not get full democratic support because it doesnt get full support from the jewish community. It doesnt get full support from people who have looked at this issue and said we have to be very careful about how we define this and especially by the way this is being targeted and tied to educational funds that go to colleges. So it has incredibly important ramifications. Well, its sort of a dual pronged attack on liberals and Democratic Institutions of higher education. Speaker johnsons machinations have not been secret. He challenges President Biden to come up there, he makes this a moral litmus test from everybody at the same time hes under threat from the farright flank of his republican congress. It just seems intended specifically to shore up support among those rightwing rebels in his conference. And i just wonder democrats seem to have made a decision this week they will say, speaker johnson, if a motion to vacate is put on the house floor. Do you think thats the right idea . Well, i think this is as Leader Jeffreys has defined it, a very narrow singleuse get out of jail free card for democrats to vote some democrats to vote to table the motion to vacate the speakership. This would be a Marjorie Taylor greene motion if came, and then there would be a motion to table it. And i think there would be some democrats who will agree to save the speaker this one time in part because of the need to get that Ukraine Funding to the floor. I do believe this is directly tied the speaker finally after five months brought that bill to the floor and allowed us to have a vote on it. But i will say that Leader Jeffries has been clear and ive been clear to him and many of our members have been clear to him that we are not going to consistently save this speaker who is antichoice, antiimmigrant, antidemocracy, went down to maralago to kiss Donald Trumps ring and talk about how, you know, all these lies about how people are voting that shouldnt be voting, antilgbtq, and really using division, hatred, xenophobia, to drive a political agenda. I dont think we can be part of doing that again, but i do understand that this is a onetime opportunity to make sure that we continue the work of the house. We have a little bit more work to do, and the speaker did bring that ukraine bill to the floor. Im not going to be voting to table that motion, alex, but i know that there will be some in our party. And Leader Jeffries has said we should feel free to vote our conscience. Yeah, because on some level its congratulations youve got Ukraine Funding secured. Its a republican priority. Only in this strange bizarre Upside Down World where the gop is led by the likes of margery Taylor Greene is u. K. Funding even an issue. To that end margery Taylor Greene and her motion to vacate feels like the support has dissipated a bit or the bang for her buck for her lesson. Do you think the not governance governance is on the way out the door given just the chaos that has colored the last two years . I think theres been so much chaos on The Other Side, the republicans cannot govern the American People have seen that over and over again. Hakeem jeffries has essentially functioned as a shadow speaker. Democrats have to give votes for republican rules, alex. That is unheard of. The number of times rules have failed on the house floor because a majority cant pass their own procedural rules so that they can bring a bill to the floor is quite remarkable. And so i think Marjorie Taylor greene is trying to continue to create chaos over there. And i think that there are many republicans who dont want to go into a another session of weeks and weeks on end without a speaker. And i think theyre worried about that because of what happened last time. But i want to be clear that the house is still in chaos. On every major vote you and have have talked about this, it has been democrats who have had to come forward and essentially be the adults in the room to get a bill just about appropriations or about the debt ceiling, basic governance that the majority the republican majority has not been able to do. So i think she is losing some support here in terms of throwing the house into chaos. But let me be clear, her brand Donald Trumps brand even Mike Johnsons brand of extreme maga ideas from stripping away Abortion Rights from women to, you know, the extreme trans bans to cutting Social Security and medicare, that is what the Republican Party whether its mike johnson as the speaker or Marjorie Taylor greene, you know, as the inciter of a lot of chaos over there, they all stand for that. Democrats dont, and we just have to continue to make that distinction very, very clear. Yeah, margery Taylor Greene calls congress the uni party, but i beg to differ. Thank you for your time tonight. Thank you. Still to come this evening donald trump heads where does donald trump head . He goes back to court where he may face more punishment for violating a gag order. And a new Bombshell Interview reveals trumps vision for his second term. Were going to talk exclusively with the reporter who got so many of trumps highly controversial plans on the record. Stay with us. Ntroversial plans e record stay with us business. Its not a ninetofive proposition. Its all day and into the night. Its all the things that keep this world turning. The gotos that keep us going. The places we cheer. And check in. They all choose the advanced Network Solutions and round the Clock Partnership from Comcast Business. See why Comcast Business powers more Small Businesses than anyone else. Get started for 49. 99 a month plus ask how to get up to an 800 prepaid card. Dont wait call today. Because of donald trump more than 20 states have abortion bans. More than 20 trump abortion bans. And today this very day at the stroke of midnight another trump abortion ban went into effect here in florida. That was Vice PresidentKamala Harris speaking in Florida Today where that states near total Ban On Abortion has officially gone into effect. Florida has the third highest population in the country, but its not just the millions in that state who are now affected by this ban. Until today florida was among the last places in the south eastern United States where women could travel to get an abortion. Depending on how advanced their pregnancy is people seeking an abortion in the south will now have to travel as far as virginia or kansas or even illinois in order to obtain a legal abortion. In addition to a health care crisis, Florida Republicans have also created a political disaster for republicans nationwide. That same dynamic is at play in arizona where the state Supreme Court recently allowed a civil war era abortion ban too go into effect. Arizona republicansvise been all over the map on whether or not they support that ban. In just the past few weeks Arizona Senate candidate kari lake has taken multiple opposing positions on the ban, and donald trump himself has been urging arizona republicans to repeal the law he helped resurrect. That could be because abortion right advocates in arizona have been mobilizing to put Abortion Access on the ballot in arizona this november, a move that could drive democratic turnout in a critical swing state. And so today two republicans in the Arizona State senate sided with democrats to repeal the states 1864 abortion ban. Arizonas democratic governor, katie hobbs, is expected to sign the repeal of that law tomorrow. But arizona still has a 15week abortion ban on its books, and abortion right advocateerize pushing to enshrine Abortion Rights in the state constitution this november, so abortion could still very much be on the ballot in arizona this fall. And florida voters will also have a chance to overturn their states extreme abortion ban come november. This week florida man donald trump was asked how he plans to vote on the states Abortion RightsBallot Measure in a wide ranging interview with Time Magazine. This was his i guess you could say response. I dont know tell you what im going to vote for, i only tell you the states going to make a determination. We have an exclusive interview with the Time Magazine reporter who interviewed mr. Trump, an interview President Biden today called a mandatory read. Thats next. T biden today called a mandatory read. Thats next. Basically the states decide on abortion, and people are absolutely thrilled with the way thats going on, and its been an amazing process, and its something that was very important to get done. That is how donald trump views the current state of reproductive rights in this country where 21 republican led states have either banned abortion outright or severely restricted the procedure. Thrilled and amazing. As it happens this months Time Magazine cover story offers crucial insight into what trump plans to do as it relates to abortion and other key issues if he becomes president. Again, joining me now is the perp who conducted that interview, time staff writer aaron cortelesa. It is an essential interview, im not just paraphrasing joe biden, but its the first time we hear trump talk with any specificity about his policies. Trump has his line here which is let states decide, i have nothing to do with it, take it back to the states. As you were interviewing him, did you sense he was confident in that position, or did it feel like he understood his vulnerability there . I think donald trump understands this is very delicate terrain for him. He doesnt want to alienate his core base and white evangelical voters who most prize the fact he was able to install three Supreme Court justices who were essential to overturning roe v. Wade. But he also knows that a majority of americans support Abortion Rights for women. And so hes trying to thread a needle by making this a states right issue. And, you know, i asked him President Trump would you be comfortable with states prosecuting women who get abortions after the ban . He said its irrelevant whether im comfortable or not, i dont have to be comfortable, the states are going to do decide. And i said, President Trump, what about states monitoring womens pregnancies to know when theyve gotten abortions after the ban. He said they must just do that. He also said hed allow for states to have Abortion Laws in The Other Side of the direction, too. So President Trump is really staking out this states rights issue when it comes to abortion. Yeah, i mean, but you did paint a fairly draconian picture there that states monitor womens preg naepss. And by virtue of thought opposing that, isnt that sort of a tacit acceptance of that and do wonder he can get way with it, because joe biden certainly doesnt think thats a tenable position and has been saying that on the Campaign Trail. I think they made an act to that effect. You asked him specifically a Handmaid Tale like end times scenario. I didnt get any hesitation from trump at all. I think hes decided this is where hes going to be politically, and that is basically the way in which hes going to navigate this issue. You also pressed him repeatedly i might add on the subject of immigration where he has in the words of Time Magazine described kind of the imperial presidency. Ill read an excerpt. To carry out a Deportation Operation designed to remove more than 11 Million People from the country trump told me hed be willing to build Migrant Detention Camps and deploy u. S. Military both at the border and inland. You press him on the complications of this. Do you get the sense he fully has grappled with the law as it stands and the potential court battle that would ensue if he tried to do that. I think he understands many of the things he want today do on abortion would effectively engineer court battles, right . President trump when i asked him, sir, you say you want to have a massive Deportation Operation that will remove as many or more than 11 million migrants, how do you plan to do that, and his answer was he would rely on the National Guard to conduct this operation inland to find and haul away undocumented migrants. Hed be willing to use the military if he felt it was necessary. Hed also try to induce state and local Police Departments to participate by tying federal funding to their involvement in the effort. I think President Trump understands he mind face lawsuits trying to challenge him, but this is one particular matter where he plans to pursue his agenda with alacrity. Can i say, though, your sort of rebuttals or the fact you went you kept taking a bite of the apple asking him specifically how hed execute, and it felt like you had done more thinking about the execution of these policies than he necessarily had. Even on the issue of tariffs, right, because trump loves talking about trade. He agrees hes floated a 10 tariff on all imports. Hes agreed hes floated i think more than 6 tariff on chinese imports, and then he says it may be more than that, may be more derivative of that, he asserts tariffs dont cause inflation. Do you sense he actually understands Economic Policy . Because it felt like he was very much responding to you but did not have a sort of proposal that was clearly outlined even in this own head. Well, i think that donald trump operates on instinct, and i think he has a very specific kind of instinct when it comes to trade. And this is a trumpian fixation that dates back to the dawn of his political emergence. He thinks the United States is getting ripped off on trade arrangements. He thinks were on the losing side of Trade Deficits specifically with china. So he thinks of it much more as a business transaction. He may not be steeped in white papers on, you know, the implications of trade policy. He understands the vast majority of economists say that tariffs will increase prices because businesses will pass along the cost of the tariff along to the consumer. They wont just eat it. But President Trump sees it from a very specific framework of sort of transactional dynamic of kwaer on the losing end of this deal so we need a better deal. Yeah, he definitely sees it in black and white fashion. Eric, it is a really important interview to read especially in a year ewhere we have so few sit down interviews with either one of these candidates i might add, and we have not really had any debates. So its one of the few times we get a window into how this candidate would approach his second term. Thank you so much for your time tonight. Thanks for having me. Coming up donald trump spent the day campaigning in wisconsin and michigan, but tomorrow he will be back in court for day ten of his manhattan hush money trial. Were going to preview tomorrows Witness Testimony coming right up. Tomorrows Witness Testimony coming right up. Its fineeeeeeee [splash] before advil Advil Dual Action fights pain two ways. Advil targets pain at the source, acetaminophen blocks pain signals. Advil dual action. Youve got xfinity wifi at home. A take it on the gos with Xfinity Mobile. Customers now get exclusive access to wifi speed up to a gig in millions of locations. Plus, buy one unlimited line and get one free. Thats like getting two unlimited lines for Twenty Dollars a month each for a year. So, ditch the other guys and switch today. Buy one line of unlimited, get one free for a year with Xfinity Mobile plus, save even more and get an eligible 5g phone on us visit xfinitymobile. Com today. Donald trump will be back in Court Tomorrow for day ten of his mush money tile. The first witness on the stand will be Keith Davidson, the lawyer who represented both Karen Mcdougal and Stormy Daniels. Yesterday prosecutors revealed both Text Messages and emails exchanged between davidson and Michael Cohen discussing the 130,000 Hush Money Payment to Stormy Daniels a month before the election. We spoke on friday october 14, and you said funds would be wired today. No funds have been received as of sending this email. Daufb udson remembers cohen as replying my guy in five states today, theres nothing i can do. Im doing all i can. Davidson understood why guy to be donald trump on the Campaign Trail as a president ial candidate. He also believed trump was behind a hush money deal. Heres the prosecutor. Did you ever believe that Michael Cohen was going to be the source of these funds. Davidson, never. Never prior to funding, no. Prosecutor, where did you understand the money would be coming from . Davidson, from donald trump or some corporate affiliation thereof. Joining me now msnbc Legal Correspondent lisa rubin. Thank you for staying late. I know you have a busy day tomorrow. Is Keith Davidsons assertion its my guy is that sufficient to establish trump is pulling the strings here and that this is politically motivated . No. But luckily prosecutors are not depending on Keith Davidson alone. Theyre constructing a narrative so think about Keith Davidson as a piece of the puzzle as opposed to the puzzle himself. He corroborates much of what david pecker has told us, but he also had his own interactions most notably with dylan howard whos the Chief Content Officer of ami and sort of deputized by pecker to get the stuff done. Right, he was the action man. I do wonder how you look at the each sides defense and prosecutorial argument here because it feels like the prosecution is offering a lot of information. Theyre coming at it from a number of different angles and the defense is effectively playing catchup. We know that trump according to the the New York Times is asking todd blanche to attack witnesses, attack the jury pool, and attack juan merchan. Does that seem to be borne of frustration or feeling his defense is inadequate . I think its borne from going to the cohen school of law, which is not what i would consider an adequate or appropriate legal foundation. Donald trump is not a lawyer. Theres a reason why. What he considers an effective political strategy and not an effective jury strategy, attacking the witnesses, attacking the judge, being more aggressive than todd blanche has been i dont think will win the case and alienate jurors, and that at least i can tell that being in the room todd blanche, pardon the pun blanch is being that person, hes not that guy. And bovi if you want to attack a witness and dismantle him, hes your guy. It also seems blanche or whoever is going to be the attack dog here is going to be the replacement because trump is gagged. The judge is having another hearing on the gag order tomorrow morning. What is your expectation there, and sort of whats the longterm game here as far as judge merchan . Let me say two things. One, trump wants everyone to believe hes totally gagged. He has a lot more to talk about the case than he has let on. I do think judge merchan will find at least three or two of the alleged violations will constitute further instances of criminal contempt. However, because he didnt warn trump until yesterday that further violations would result in incarceration jail. I dont think that tomorrows which will add up to a total of lets say at most 13 or maybe a couple fewer would be the thing that swings the needle. I think were going to have to take one more crack at it or trump will have to trigger that other crack at it for prosecutors to eventually make the argument that trump deserves incarceration. Wow, just the fact that were there day ten were talking about him being incarcerated, hes also bringing some support support staff, if you will, into the courtroom. Can you talk a little bit about that. Yeah, i mean trump has sort of adjusted his courtroom behavior around the criticisms that folks in the media have lobbed at him. And so bringing Additional Support to the courtroom is just one more of those in the latest sort of call in response between trump and his court strategy. Youll notice yesterday not only suzy wild was there and ken paxton was there and even karen page but trump was there and looking at times to be uncomfortable discovering these documents for the first time. I felt for the guy just as a son and Family Member having to be the pawn in that political game and the jury game trump seems to be playing. That is our show for tonight. And a reminder you can listen to every episode of Alex Wagner Tonight as a podcast for free. You can search Alex Wagner Tonight wherever you get your podcasts. Way too early with Jonathan Lemire is coming up next. And some people are thrilled at the concept of exactly because everybodys basically wanted to get it out. Its wrong to be in the federal government. They wanted to get it out. The states now decide on abortion, and you go to the states, and the states come out, and they