the rise of antisemitic incidents in the u.s. since the start of the israel-hamas war, hosted by jacob sal soboroff, watch epidemic of, hate antisemitism on the rise. that's tonight's reidout. all in with chris hayes starts now. >> tonight on all in. >> i often made money. offered the power. i don't care. >> as antisemitism and hate grow around the country -- >> i'll say what i want to say, and of the consequence of that is using money, so be it. >> tonight the dangerous implications of the world's richest man suggesting jews stoke hatred of white people. then -- >> i indulge you this. i discovered with the only i discovered what onlyfans just a few weeks ago. >> george santos gets -- in the wake of the devastating ethics report. >> most people lie on the reserve resumes. unfortunately it's a reality. >> yeah you lie about everything. >> plus, how the judge of the stolen documents case is once again delaying justice and by national security spokesman john kirby on what we know about the israeli raid on sheila hospital. when all in starts, right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. one of the most distressing elements of these anguishing passed 41 days is the horrific events of october 7th and the start of the brutal bloody war between israel and hamas is the march rise in antisemitic incidents around the world and right here in the new u.s.. the anti-defamation league centered on extremism documented 832 antisemitic incidents of assault, vandalism, and harassment in the u.s. in just four weeks following the attack. it comes out an average of nearly 28 incidents per day. it represents a 316% increase over the same period last year. you could just see it. in any city you live. just here in new york city antisemitic hate crimes surged 214% in the month of october. across the country we have seen synagogues and jewish schools, jewish centers, even a jewish cemetery, defaced, vandalized. people have torn down flyers bringing attention to the more than 220 hostages kidnapped by hamas on october 7th. a lot of these incidents have taken place undercover of nighter behind the relative anonymity of the screen. but yesterday the wealthiest man in the world made one of the most shocking public pronouncements of antisemitism i have seen, and he did it on the platform that he owns. speaking of course of elon musk, the founder of spacex and tesla, who purchased twitter last year, changed its name, and probably managed to lose 25 billion dollars on it. musk brought his hard right views to the platform, where he elevated the most loathsome offensive bigots. he welcomed avowed neo-nazis had been banned who had been banned from website. he's defended white supremacists, complained about racism against white people. he compared to his billionaire george soros to win jewish moral marvel super villain. with elon musk's intention and encouragement, those with most despicable views have essentially taken over the platform now known as acts. this is a man with enormous power and influence will be on the internet. when the most powerful private citizens in the world. just yesterday he attended a cocktail hour chinese president xi jinping that followed bilateral meeting with president joe biden. musk also has the ear of top u.s. officials, who welcome him like royalty anytime he descends on washington. and so it's this man who took to his website yesterday to endorse the most violent dangerous antisemitic conspiracy theory. it'll be a with person describes himself as a jewish conservative expressing his anger about that recent rise of antisemitism. he addresses the quote, cowards hiding behind the anonymity of the internet and posting hitler was right and calls for them to step out of the shadows and, quote, say it to our faces. that prompted a reply from another user who wrote, okay, expounding okay, sitar faces? okay. i'll talk to you. jewish communities have been pushing these that kind of dialectical hatred against whites that they claim to want people to stop using against them. you want truth said to your face? there it is. i wish i could say this was a fringe view, but as a vial over century old antisemitic conspiracy theory, basically that jewish people in coordination with people of color are a kind of conspiracy to assault whiteness. and in fact jews are behind this conspiracy. this same conspiracy, which has come to be known as the great replacement theory, that jews are the sort of puppet masters manipulating american immigration policy to replace white people, this has permeated into a large swath of the american right. we saw it in charlesville, most infamously, when the marchers chanted jews will not replace us. it was this view that was the inspiration for the perpetrator of the horrific antisemitic mass murderer at the tree of life synagogue in 2018. the killer said so himself. so elon musk, the richest man in the world, one of the most powerful and influential men in the world, the owner of this platform, replied to the post espousing that vial theory, replied to someone calling out those that think hitler is right and saying okay, he says this to the guy that said that theory. you have said the actual truth. the actual truth. jews coordinating this assault on whiteness. so shocking and repellents that elon musk, a man of highest echelons of our society, we're not just something like that but i actually believe it. it's a reminder that antisemitism is dangerous and enduring, even at the very highest levels of american society. and we should be clear. there's a real history of this in this country. many notable powerful american figures through the ages were just rank antisemites. probably the most notorious examples are actually a man who was probably the closest historical analog to elon musk in many ways. henry ford. of course ford was the founder of the ford motor company, the prefecture of assembly line production, one of the wealthiest and most influential men of earliest when the century, one of the great industrialists of the world history. and he was also, as many people know, an antisemite. but the zealousness, the viciousness with which he pursued that cause of hating jews, but cause of global persecution of jewish people, that, i think, has been a bit under emphasized in our collective recollection. it's not an asterisk to henry ford's legacy. it's right at the center. in fact, before the rise of adolf hitler, henry ford was probably the most powerful antisemite in the world. this is a topic of rachel maddow's remarkable book prequel, and sympathizers of fascism around will return those who defeated him. this past week and they get a chance to speak with reva for a live episode of my podcast, why is this happening? and she read is an excerpt about henry ford's story. >> he was one of the most successful and celebrated industrialists on the planet. his antisemitism was rank and it was unchecked. he spewed it freely in private tirades among friends, family, coast business cohorts, newspaper reporters, or pretty much anyone within earshot. ford was hardly the only radical antisemite in 1920 in the u.s., but edition to his fortune and his famous name and iconic company, he had a megaphone your average crazy article lacked. he had twitter. sorry. [laughter] it acts, i'm supposed to say, i forgot. he had a newspaper. it was called the dearborn independent. every week for 92 weeks headlines like these, the international jew, the world's problem. and jewish jazz, more on music becomes our national music. and this one, the perils of baseball. too much jew. his headlines were spat let over the headlines of fords paper, which was established for dealerships across the country. he's out the publications series in book form. who's got the international jew. iran to four volumes. the german addiction affords book had landed in the hands of one particular gifted propagandist, won eight of hitler's book, mein kampf, was published in 1925. the author appeared to lift not just ideas but whole passages from for its own publications. mine comes first addition called forward by name. when a reporter from the detroit news showed of an anti party headquarters in munich in december, 1931, to interview hitler, she had a series that was called five minutes with men in public eye. she had her five minutes with hitler. when should hitler's office she was surprised to find hanging on the wall behind hitler's desk a large framed portrait of a very famous american. hitler explained to the newspaper woman, i regard hanley forward as my inspiration. >> wild, right? didn't know it till i read the ok. that was just part of her wide-ranging to our conversation. if you want hr more, you're like. the incredible episode will be airing on peacock november 17th. to be clear, elon musk is not at the henry ford level yet. there are real warning signs emanating from of the world's most powerful man in from society at large. antisemitism is on the rise. it's real. it's dangerous. in the case of elon musk it is just staring us in the face. this is a staff writer's atlantic where he wrote about elon musk's disturbing truth and he joins me now. i suppose you are sort of a reporter who lives on the antisemitism beat. and so at some level i suppose not much can chakras or price you. and i think also, given elon musk's trajectory last few years, one could say it's not shocking or surprising. but i have to say, i was shocked. i was genuinely shocked that this man wrote, you have spoken the truth to this. what was your reaction? >> like you said, we have witnessed elon descend a radicalization spiral on the internet, which is something something we can relate to in different ways. we have seen people like friends and intellectuals mentor sometimes who gets sucked into a particular spot on the internet and if it's a conspiratorial or dark place they can start echo those things. on one hand it's not unexpected, but on the other hand it's a devastating thing to have the wealthiest person on the planet, a person looked up to by many as an icon, a person who has done a tremendous amount to advance many fields of technology and industry, to say this same, to affirm the words that were basically the justification for the greatest mass murder of jews on american soil. >> you write this, and i thought this was a really profound insight. you said the fate of a tiny jewish community rests in the hands of non jewish society. whether the anti-jewish ideas of musk and others become the new normal is not of jews, it's up to everyone else. there is obviously just an incredibly intense set of conversations happening around antisemitism, around bigotry, about anti-muslim bigotry, also documented beyond the rise of hate incidents. but this idea that this sort of most pernicious aspect of all antisemitism is the conspiratorial notion that this tiny sliver of the population is controlling things when in fact it is a majority of americans who are going to decide whether they're going to be a decent country or not. >> the deep and profound irony of antisemitism is that it's an inverted world picture. it says that there is this tiny stream pulling jewish minority that controls the massive non jewish majority. but throughout history, if you actually look, as logic would dictate, it's not the 0.2% of the world that's jewish the runs the show. it's the 99.8% of the world it's not jewish that makes the decisions and decides what happens to minorities like the jews. and how and whether they will flourish or whether they will suffer. in our societies. that's part of what is frightening about this moment. you have someone like elon musk who is pushing a particular way of thinking about that, who was amplifying that narrating that. he's not creating it. he's actually reflecting something going on in our society today. >> when i saw this yesterday i was brought up short. i was pretty enraged by it. but i also thought, is everyone gonna be okay with this? not like public condemnation is the be all or and all of these discussions, but it does seem to matter. and i think what we saw happen with conway, where we had someone who started validly reciting enunciating the most vile antisemitic bile, praising hitler and all the stuff, there's a point at which public condemnation and bring up business relationships happened, and i think that was an important step. today there's some announcements. i think he's not gonna speak at aipac. there are advertisers on x who are saying they're withdrawing, i think ibm i think is one of them. are you heartened by seeing the reaction today, which is a reaction? it's real. and how much do you think it matters? >> i think the reaction is warranted. i think we are facing a really difficult question, a sort of question we didn't fists face with kanye, because kanye had sneakers. but elon musk has invested himself and insinuated himself into the most important technologies around the world today. you wanna deal of climate change, you have to deal with its cars. you and don't talk about, aota akhter was companies. if you wonder what satellite into lead in internet in ukraine and other countries, you need to talk to him. in industry after industry it's important to the future of humanity, space travel, he's been very important. that's part of the tragedy. many of those things are good for humanity. but does that also make one person too big to fail, in a way? the no matter what he says or does he we can't disentangle or cells from. i don't know the answer to that. >> a really good point. yair rosenberg, thanks for making time for us tonight. >> thank you for having me. >> coming up, the house ethics committee releases its report on serial fabulist george santos. and it's everything you can expect a more. the details, next. details, next. ll seeker. the soul searcher. and - ahoy! it's the explorer! each helping to protect their money with chase. woah, a lost card isn't keeping this thrill seeker down. lost her card, not the vibe. the soul searcher, is finding his identity, and helping to protect it. hey! oh yeah, the explorer! she's looking to dive deeper... all while chase looks out for her. because these friends have chase. alerts that help check. tools that help protect. one bank that puts you in control. chase. make more of what's yours. why didn't we do this last year? before you were preventing migraine with qulipta®? remember the pain? 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what is the methodology here? what did you guys actually do? >> thanks so much, chris. really appreciate being on your show tonight. so the ethics committee, one thing that's really important for the american people to know is that, the ethics committee and the united states congress is a fully bipartisan committee. it doesn't, it's not reflective of the percentage of republicans and democrats in the house. it's an equal number of republicans and democrats. we have a nonpartisan staff and sometimes we get referrals from the office of congressional ethics. sometimes we get referrals or complaints from members of congress. and sometimes we see what is out there in open source in news reporting and it picks our curiosity and we investigate. we are a very secretive committee because we want to protect people who have been accused of wrongdoing. we want to make sure that we are thorough. and that is why i think some people think that our process takes too long. and i agree. it takes a really long time. there's not a lot of information that is provided to the public in order to protect the integrity of the investigation and the individual who is accused, but we are pretty methodical and we go through documents, we sometimes subpoena people, we collect evidence, and we allow the person who is accused the opportunity to participate in the investigation. in other words, to defend themselves, to come before us or to provide documents. so all of this takes a very long time. but it takes a long time so that we can do the right thing. >> yeah, so this bipartisan point, i think, is really worth emphasizing. it's not a majority committee run by republicans and it can't be sort of wired the way the others are. the rules committee is dominated by the majority. they kind of get their way. this has to be a consensus product. so what you are saying is this is the consensus product, the consensus bipartisan product of the committee, and all the language of this report, 56 pages, the itemization of the ethical breaches by george santos, the full committee republican democrats stand by. >> that's right. in this case, and in some cases, there is a subcommittee, and investigative subcommittee that has created in order to really drill down on the details. that's what happened in this case. and so the investigative subcommittee or the i.s. see, is a subset of the full committee, and the nonpartisan professional staff who are exceptional professionals, they are just really great people, just come to work every day to do their job, they really perform much of the function in terms of evaluating the documents, reaching out, et cetera. and once the investigative subcommittee is done with their work product, that it is presented to the full ethics committee. so i was not a member of the isc. i have chaired on the isc in the past, but along the way the full ethics committee, of which i am a member, we get briefed throughout the process. and we got a copy of the full report, the draft report, obviously before it was presented to representative santos and before it was made public, so we all knew what we were voting on when we met this week. we >> just know the details here. from the ethics report it is he sustained all of this purchases through a concert series of lies to his constituents, donors, and staff about brechin experience. member's on his staff viewed him as a finalist, he was encouraged to seek treatment. just the details of the personal spending, which is a big theme runs throughout this, that he dropped 6000 at for our grandma, some of that on the redesigner speakers he later wore to the marble halls of congress. then he withdrew $800 in cash attacks you know worried city like to play real lead. he paid off hisrandy pulled another thousand dollars of spending money, all illegally funded by mr. santos's congressional campaign which wired him $20,000 just after thanksgiving without telling donors. there's an independent basis now that is not the sort of standard of a federal criminal conviction, that has been produced by congress's own committee. to your mind, it is a change how you think about the possibility of expulsion? >> absolutely. and just for reference, those of us on the ethics committee, we had an opportunity, obviously, to vote on the expulsion when it was brought to the house floor. we voted present because we did not there to be an appearance of impropriety or that we had already -- >> pre-judging. >> had already made up of our minds, exactly, before the isc had completed its work. when this comes to the floor, because the chairman of the ethics committee, michael guest, tomorrow he has announced the tomorrow during the performance session he will file a resolution in order to expel george santos or for the vote to be taken on the house floor. i will be voting in favor of expulsion. >> i don't think it'll be. long will be interesting to see how that plays. out congresswoman veronica escobar, thank you so much. still ahead, donald trump's handpicked judge does have another solid. why the chances of reelection diverting the classified documents case are slipping away. next. away next warning civilians to clear out, while hamas forces them back. allowing in food and water, which hamas steals. giving tuesday. giving tuesday giving tuesday giving tuesday is a global effort that encourages people to do good. this year, when you choose shriners hospitals for children® you're choosing kids like me and me and me. this year please support shriners hospitals for children® because when you do, you're not just giving to the hospital. you're helping change the life of a kid like me. and to me and me. i give to shriners hospitals for children® because i want to be a part of something amazing. i know my gift to shriners hospitals for children® makes a difference in the lives of children. our support gives kids a bright future. when you support shriners hospitals for children® you're joining thousands of other caring people like you who have helped kids like me do amazing things. thanks to a generous donor, your gift will go twice as far and help more kids just like me. your support helps us do amazing things we never thought would be possible. and this is how we say thank you. thank you! thank you. because of your support, we can say thank you by having the life we wouldn't have had without shriners hospitals for children®. yay! shriners! yay shriners! with your monthly gifts, we'll send you this adorable love to the rescue® blanket as another way to say thank you. plus, it's your reminder of all the children who now have hope because of your support. go online right now to loveshriners.org give your monthly support. thanks to a generous donor, every dollar you give can help twice as many kids like me and have double the impact. please call right now to give. if operators are busy with other caring donors, please hold patiently or go to loveshriners.org. and when you do, your gift will have two times the impact. if we want a more viable future for our kids, we need to find more sustainable ways of doing things. america's plastic makers are investing billions of dollars in new technologies and creating plastic products that are more recyclable. durable. and dependable. our goal is a cleaner, healthier planet for generations to come. for a better tomorrow, we're focused on making plastics better today. ♪♪ we're not writers, but we help you shape your financial story. ♪♪ we're not an airline, but our network connects global businesses across nearly 160 markets. ♪♪ we're not a startup, but our innovation labs use new technologies to help keep your information secure. ♪♪ we're not architects, but we help build stronger communities. ♪♪ we're not just any bank. we are citi. ♪♪ i could use a little help. yeah, there's a lot of risk out there. huh ♪♪ hey, is this thing hard to learn? 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what is the motion of the nature of dispute in which the judge has ruled against the special counsel's office? >> she is ruling against them again and again just on scheduling things. but you know, chris, it is and it isn't, because trump is charged with taking classified sensitive documents, but it doesn't turn on the content. nevertheless, in any case involving cepa, there's a chance for a defendant to say i want to use this material and possibly it will be too sensitive for the u.s. and they will have to wrangle about it. so the reason brandon van grack says accurately this augurs a real delay is because it is two months, yes, but it is two months that start with both the united states and donald trump fighting about what could be used as far as classified documents go, and you can be sure that the sensitive documents have let you do with the charges against him, or just the fact of. it he'll say i need this material in order to make my defense, and that's when the fight will ensue, and from everything we have seen about aileen cannon, that is going to take months to resolve. that's why we now and of course she put off everything for three months but declined to do it with the trial date itself. but that's how we can be confident we have a very big delay ahead of us. >> i don't want to make sure i understand. what you are saying is, litigation of this question of what documents can and can't be used in the trial itself is not going to start until march 1st, and because we know that that will be time consuming itself, then that is why we think it will push? >> march 1st, at the earliest. in the united states we have a very routine motion that she denied with no reason summarily. just have trump identify when he is going to do that. and as she has done repeatedly now, not just denying it but there's an element of peak toward the u.s.. and i think there's something even worse here. there's a kind of kgns about it. it's very telling to me that she made these interior delays but didn't change the trial date because it keeps her from having any really kind of blatant thing for the u.s. to challenge. so it all sounds just like process and scheduling, and they don't really have the opening to go to the 11th circuit. and remember, she came into this case with a miss adventure in the search warrant litigation that means she has a strike against her. if she does something really out there, the u.s. can go and recuse her now, 11th circuit. but what she is doing instead is going to the edge of delaying things but not pulling the -- on it, and that doesn't give the doj great fodder to fight her. it's not just she is continually going for trump but that she is now doing it almost strategically. so there's a brooding question. is she in the tag for not -- i don't even think it matters. i think she is regularly calling it in a delay that he wants and all indications are she will push it at least many months now. >> that question about whether this is good faith or bad faith, fundamentally, i think the question was opened by how bad that first ruling was and how it was evisceration by the appellate court. that's the thing that colors all of this. but what is clear, and what is clear in all these cases is, d'entremont to push these until after election day. and i think there is an obvious public interest in a very unique set of circumstances for any judge of any ideological persuasion or appointed by whoever to believe wholeheartedly that the public has a right to know and see this actually litigated in a constitutional fashion before them before they vote. >> and look at judges around the country who are saying just that. aileen cannon, when she said this last ruling, she said there's a public right to this trial. that's why i'm not moving the current trial date. but she is good as did it. that is what i think is particularly troubling. she's giving lip service to that same notion, but nevertheless, when push comes to shove electoral ruling, she is doing what trump wants and pushing the date significantly. >> a good point. harry litman, thank you very much. still to come, as president biden juggles a summit with the chinese president and war in gaza, white house national security spokesman john kirby joins me, next. kirb joins me, next hi mom! i called my mom, "i have this gene and i think you need to get tested." she feels like it was truly lifesaving. i have moderate to severe crohn's disease. now, there's skyrizi. ♪ things are looking up, i've got symptom relief. ♪ ♪ control of my crohn's means everything to me. ♪ ♪ control is everything to me. ♪ feel significant symptom relief at 4 weeks with skyrizi, including less abdominal pain and fewer bowel movements. skyrizi is the first il-23 inhibitor that can deliver remission and visibly improve damage of the intestinal lining. and the majority of people experienced long-lasting remission at one year. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine or plan to. liver problems may occur in crohn's disease. ♪ now's the time to ask your gastroenterologist how you can take control of your crohn's with skyrizi. ♪ ♪ control is everything to me. ♪ ♪ learn how abbvie could help you save. ( ♪ ♪ ) start your day with nature made. the #1 pharmacist recommended vitamin and supplement brand. this week, israeli forces enter the al-shifa hospital complex, which is the largest medical facility in gaza. the hospitals in gaza city, which is -- a part of the territory, in the northern part has been the most heavily bombarded area since the conflict began, following the october 7th hamas attacks. the hospital has served as the center of the war, in many ways, both in flesh and blood, life and death terms, and in symbolic terms, representing what the conflict is about. it's a large complex, made up of multiple buildings and courtyard's, and medical staff in the hundreds. as the israeli bombardment began, thousands and thousands of people were coming, through shiva, to be treated by doctors working in increasingly dire conditions. as fuel, and other crucial supplies like medicine and anesthesia ran out. around 7000 people, just gazans who were displaced by the -- then made their way to she foot to, making the hospital grounds a bustling de facto refugee camp, 24 hours a day. the israeli government says that chief of symbolizes the depravity of hamas, because they contend hamas has a command center underneath the hospital itself. john kirby, the u.s. national security spokesman, who i will speak to in just a moment, has said the u.s. has evidence that hamas uses chief, along with other hospitals, for command and control purposes. yesterday, president biden backed up that assertion publicly. >> it appears the situation, you have a circumstance where the first war crimes appear to be committed by hamas, by having their headquarters, their military hidden under -- and that's a fact, that's what's happened. >> that's a fact, military -- hitting under hospital. now, hamas officials and doctors at shiva strongly denied those allegations. but that description of the hospital as a hamas stronghold has been the justification for the many instances of military strikes around and in the hospital complex. earlier this month, the israeli military struck an ambulance that it says was harboring hamas agents right outside of the hospital, th washington post reported quote, the dead and wounded visible in the videos reviewed by the post included women and children, and no weapons or individuals wearing military clothincould be seen. hours after a bombardment at the hospital earlier this week, explosions, israel blamed mid misfired palestinian rockets, although an investigative analysis of the new york times determine at least three of those were munitions that were israeli. now, the israeli military has -- although they are, there they have effectively taken control of the hospital, with troops on the ground. they have been releasing what they say is evidence of their claims, that hamas used the hospital as a command center, including images of guns behind an mri machine, as well as this picture of what the idf says is the entrance to a hamas tunnel. now, and bbc news has no way of independently verifying these imag or the claims from the israeli military. the investigation byhe new york times notes that as of, now the images coming from the idf, quote, still have not proven the existence of these sprawling hamas's operations that it said the hospital conceals. but there's also a larger ongoing debate about the targeting of possibles by israeli military forces. that practice, has been considered a war crime. it is been largely condemned by the international community, including the united nations. one official saying, quote, hospitals are not battleground. the protections of, newborns patients, and medical staff and all civilians must override all other concerns. notably, israel says it is not a war crime in this instance, because they insist the presence of hamas in these facilities makes them legitimate military targets, that their hand has effectively been forced by hamas to target civilian infrastructure, including this one. the president of the united states claimed last, night the u.s. is not a neutral observer in this very important and incredibly high stakes dispute. our president has pledged that israel has its full support. and, whatever feels the need to do to defend itself. the president defended the incursions on the hospital last night. -- national security spokesman john kirby about that, next. about that, next. gital money coach in the chase mobile® app. use it to set and track your goals, big and small... and see how changes you make today... could help put them within reach. from your first big move to retiring poolside - and the other goals along the way. wealth plan can help get you there. ♪ j.p. morgan wealth management. i was on a work trip when the pulmonary embolism happened. but because i have 23andme, i was aware of that gene. that saved my life. honey... honey... nyquil severe honey. powerful cold and flu relief with a dreamy honey taste. nyquil honey, the nighttime, sniffing, sneezing, couging, 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cooperation summit in california, following his meeting yesterday with chinese president xi jinping. the white house is touting a number of concrete deliverables from that meeting, including a new deal of restricting the flow of fentanyl, and it's precursor chemicals. the resumption of military to military communications between washington and beijing, which had been suspended. and even, perhaps most crucially, progress on a deal to bring new pandas to america's cities. but of course, the summit takes place against the backdrop of the ongoing war, and humanitarian crisis in gaza, which the president was once again facing questions over during a press conference last night. >> john kirby, served as deputy assistant to the president, as well as coordinator for strategic communications at the national security council, and he joins me now. it's great to have you on the, program thanks for joining us. >> thank you chris, good to be with you. >> i want to start with that, a claim that the president made last night, during that press conference. we played it earlier, in which he said that hamas had hidden a headquarters underneath a hospital. obviously, that is a contested, claim an intensely contested claim, and a high stakes one, because it gets to whether that's a legitimate military target. and i wonder, since it is such an important and contested, claim if we can expect some proof will be furnished by american or israeli officials? >> well, the israelis have already, as you have seen, and i think you just went through before the commercial break, talk about how they have made public that their findings in the hospital. i can't speak to specific intelligence, other than to say that based on our own assessment, on our own collection and analysis of what we have seen, we believe that it is true, that the command and control -- was underneath a hospital. and, that hamas has used that hospital not only for storage of weapons, but also to house some of their fighters. so, we have no doubt in our mind, just from our own intelligence analysis, that hamas was using this. hospital and look, that's out of their playbook, this is what they do. they find ways to headquarter themselves in civilian infrastructure, digging tunnels under homes, placing innocent civilians in the cross fire between them and the idf. >> just a follow-up on that, and, obviously sometimes intelligence can be, wrong, notably i remember covering of course the strike after the brutal suicide bombing outside of the -- the kabul airbase in which, someone who the u.s. intelligence believed was an i.s.i.s. fighter was actually just an innocent civilian. and, it does seem important i think, just for global public opinion particular, that people do furnish some sort of tangible proof. i mean, independent of whether the u.s. government believes it, the isn't really govern believes, there is quite a bit of global public attention being paid to this conflict, particular the plight of the folks that were in the hospital. >> yeah, there is indeed, you are absolutely right about that. and as i, said the israeli defense forces, this is their operation. , and while they are on the ground, they have been releasing imagery, they have been taken camera crews in there and showing the things that they have been finding. again, it perfectly corroborates our own intelligence. now i don't have anything to announce tonight, in terms of the release of any particular u.s. intelligence. i can just again assert that our own analysis corroborates the claim that hamas was using this as a command and control note. and again, i would remind, is that common tactic for. the this is a page out of their playbook, they are deliberately patient patients and hospital staff at greater risk. >> and i want to ask one more question on this, and particularly on hospitals, but it applies to the broader -- source of the conflict. as you said, israeli officials have said there are tunnels underneath gaza, there are civilian infrastructure that has been utilized for hamas fighters, there are videos the idf has released, from schools, where they say they have found rocket launch sites. i want to play this clip, because it has got a lot of attention about the targeting of civilian structures, and it is by antony blinken. and he is talking about the russians, in ukraine. and, you will probably, seen a citizen circling a lot on social media, where he is condemning the targeting of that civilian infrastructure. please take a look. >> bombing schools and hospitals and apartment buildings, that is not normal. stealing ukrainian children from their families, and giving them to people in russia is not normal. we must not let president putin's calla callous indifference to human life become our own. >> i guess the question becomes, if there is hamas military infrastructure embedded in civilian infrastructure, whether the u.s. has communicated to israel what lanes they have to go to, or what the lines are forward make a piece of civilian infrastructure a legitimate military target? >> well, i don't think there is a single conversation that we're having with our israeli counterparts, where we don't talk about and urge them to be as cautious and deliberate and careful as they can, with respect to civilian infrastructure. and of course, civilian lives. urban warfare is difficult, and we had experience with this in our own, in iraq and afghanistan, and we have shared our perspectives and our lessons learned. and we urge them again, to be as deliberate and careful as they can. i want to make two points here though. one, every civilians killed, every civilian wound, that is a tragedy. and we know there is a whole family that is grieving as a result. and now, there are many many thousands of families that are grieving and hurting right now. and we want all of that suffering to stop. that is why we are going to continue to talk to our israeli counterparts about being, careful and being deliberate in their targeting. the second point i want to make, is on like the fight in ukraine, where the destruction of civilian infrastructure, and the taking of civilian lives is actually a worry of president putin, he wants to wipe out ukraine's culture, history. and not just mentioned their cult country. that is also a name of hamas. that is what they did on october 7th, paragliding into a music festival, slaughtering innocent people in front of their family members. they want to wipe israel off the map. it is not a -- of the israeli defense forces, to kill innocent civilians and to destroy civilian infrastructure. they are going about this, in a very aggressive way. and we are talking to them again, about the way they do it. but it is important to remember the distinction here, hamas is actually committing war crimes by headquartering in hospitals. the israeli defense forces are not making a war aim to kill innocent people. >> let me ask you a question on china, since that was the subject that was of huge news yesterday. and just about, for folks, we talk to john brennan yesterday, that would understand what military to military communications. me in, particular the what normalizing the means, and what their significance is. why is that significant, that those have been restored after being suspended? >> oh man, it's a big deal. i mean, to have two of the most powerful militaries on the face of the planet in the most consequential bilateral relationship in the world, having aircraft operating in proximity, ships operating in proximity, and not have an ability to pick up the phone, and call somebody on the other side, and explain what you are doing and why you're doing it, to try to deconflict? that's a real dangerous precedent, and the president has said that very clearly yesterday. and, it could get into big trouble very very quickly. and, so those communications have been shut down, since speaker pelosi's visit to taiwan. and, we are obviously glad now that process is ongoing. and the thing about, this chris, is that it goes from the commander in chief down to a lower level. and that's really important, too because not every potential conflict or every potential operation should go all the way to the leader level. so down at the theater command, level and even lower now our two militaries are going to be able to communicate. that is a good thing for stability, and security in the indo-pacific. >> all, right john kirby, national spokesman, national security spokesman for the, white house every briefing you take your, time come back anytime. >> yes sir, thank you. >> that is all in on the snow, tonight alice alex wagner tonight starts right

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