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"the beat" with ari melber starts now. >> thank you. i'll see you tonight. i want to mention to viewers nicolle was just reporting on the new u.s. air strikes in syria. we have more on that later but we begin with the big political news right now in america. so tonight i say welcome to "the beat" with ari melber, and welcome to "the beat" with james carville, one of our special leadoff guests as we track what is clearly a political earthquake in america. democrats surging to victories as these results poured a win for conservative ohio that's upending politics across that state and the nation today. it puts pressure on the republicans who are squaring off in tonight's debate as nicolle just mentioned. this was a moment that was supposed to go different little you're looking at live shots where they're supposed to be talking. it was a moment the republicans were hoping to discuss better news. but right now, the five remaining eligible candidates will take the stage in miami and try to pitch their answers to the setbacks from yesterday's elections. i say five not sixause the front-runner is skipping again. you should also note this debate is a nbc special. it's moderated by our colleagues lester holt and kristen welker along with radio show host hue hugh hewitt. they'll have to compete with other voices, the voices of the voters who turned out yesterday in that backlash to many issues, including the right-wing politics on choice. >> abortion access is the law of the land in ohio. >> it's unlike any other feeling i've ever felt. overwhelmed with joy for democracy. >> it was a victory that sends a loud, clear message, a message that candidates should run for something and not against someone. >> we're going to bed knowing that we own our own bodies. >> i think this is a resounding message that when you put abortion on a ballot, it wins. >> there you have it, listening to tpele, the voter who is inhi in trying to right to choice in the state's constitution. ohio is pretty conservative. trump carried it last cycle. we also saw voters choosing democrats in red kentucky, where women's rights were also a big issue, and in virginia, democrs winning both chambers where voters recoiled against republicans very public, well stated plan a strict abortion ban had they taken over, but they lost. the energy and turnout is clear even against head winds we reported on, includinglati and president biden and his future. but the new results show the durability of the democrats' momentum -- "the new york times" reported today clearly the issue of choice writes is the issue that best motivates democrats to vote. and that's not all. it brings out independents. this coalition that emerged stretched across many different red and blue states and basically every issue that's tested judicial issues since trump's appointees gutted roe have found the results which i got to tell you show the limits of d.c. narratives about personalities or politics. voters who we see here who turned out yesterday still focused on personal realities, freedom, and this a versele of longstanding rights in america by let's not forget, unelected judge who is all claimed under oath they would not just reverse precedent if they got on to the court, if they got power. justice kavanaugh being one of the controversial trump choices. he said that under oath. then they rushed in and over turned the first precedent they could that overturned 50 year of women's rights. now they're getting reversed by a far more powerful group than even those ninejustices, by the voters, who are putting roe v. wade level protections and enshrining them in constitutions in middle america in red states. in the process, pulling some elections farther away from maga republican who is remain unpopular. so, as promised, this is a special edition of "the beat" with ari melber, "the beat" with james carville, "the beat" with margaret carlson. these are the political veterans who are hard to book, but on the big nights we can get them. welcome. margaret, i go to you first. what is ohio saying to america today? >> ohio is saying what kansas said. kansas was a huge surprise a few months ago. you know that book, james, what's the mat we are kansas? nothing was the mat we are kansas this time as far as democrats were concerned. and glenn youngkin did a test of abortion and a 15-week ban, and it came back as popular, but it was only popular as compared to a six-week ban or no time at all. so he stumbled into this and he really put all his effort into this issue, went around the state, and i think any idea that he might come in and rescue republicans as a presidential candidate, i think, disappeared last night. >> james, what are the voters saying? >> well, i think voters said that they don't like being lied to. they did it in kansas. they tried to confuse people, change the wording. the secretary of state in ohio is one of the great liars that ever lived, and people were fundamentally didn't want a 50-year right taken away from them. they particularly didn't want to have a rigged system against it, and it backfired and blew up in their face, and i'm happy to say i'm going to be in cleveland with senator sherwood brown in january, and it may be cold in cleveland in january, but we're going to have some fun, and we're going to skewer these people and make fun of them, because they're you will idiots. >> there you go. well, you know, there are some idiots around. i always try to be respectful on the show, james, but if being an idiot means acting like an idiot repeatedly, that could be a factual claim, and we've seen idiocy out of the beltway as well as pockets of the far right who, it's fine if you want to say you believe something, you're going to run it into the ground, lose elections over it. that happens. that's a position. what we've heard is people say, oh, they're going to keep run a maga right-wing playbook and say it can win or work, or oh, look, trump hasn't disappeared and they do trump style campaigns, and it's wild, james, because that hurts them. the voters in places like ohio are rejecting that. i want to show some of the -- at least the freakout or initial concern from some conservatives on fox who are looking at the results. take a look. >> what an epic failure by governor youngkin. this is a huge loss. >> on the issue of abortion in ohio tonight, we continue to losing streak in the pro life moment. >> republicans can't keep stumbling and bumbling on abortion. >> republicans need to learn how to talk about abortion. >> but it's how we own this issue as a party. we will lose again and again and again. >> again and again and again, james. every statement i just showed you could have been deduced from prior information before yesterday. what do you see there? >> well, they keep lying. they say, well, glenn youngkin says, it's a 15-week ban. that's not what we talked about. no one trusts them on this issue. all right? glenn youngkin, no one could find him last night or this morning. i happen to know where he was. he was at the courthouse in appamattux trying to surrender. what an utter disaster. and they continually believe, well, we can adjust our position. people do not trust you. you lied in kansas. you lied in ohio. you rigged the system against people, and people have caught on to this and they caughten in virginia. they didn't buy glenn youngkin who had his g-5 ready to go to des moines on wednesday morning after the election if he won. well, like i say, he ended up surrendering to senator mark warner who's a real hero. you want to know a real hero in the election, senator mark warner of virginia. he got on the phone and got the resources in there to beat this back. hats off to you, senator warren. >> margaret, to build on james' point, we're talking about the reality filter. . we live in strange times. donald trump is facing all the legal accountability for different types of lies -- civil fraud lies, which just are punished by money, and maybe coup lies which could land him in a prison cell. he's legally presumed innocent. all these lies all over the place. yet, margaret, what we saw yesterday, particularly on this issue s the initial lie -- you can put in trump justices and they won't change roe. we were told it would be gradual. wasn't true. then okay, they did gut roe but it's going to be a moderate thing at a state level. you don't have to worry. no. it won't ever criminalize women's conduct, because it won't be pursued that theo catically. no, we have seen that happen in place where is republican politicians, that's what they want to do, or doctors, putting people in prison. all of that to james' point seems to be that people looked around, woke up and said, they don't want to live with that kind of government regardless of the other lies and noise coming out of washington. >> well, remember, all the moderate republicans that believed brett kavanaugh and others, how they believed in precedent. as you pointed out at the beginning and almost no one mentions, they perjured themselves, because they had no intentions. that's why they were chosen. that's why they voted the way they did, and republicans had all these years where the abortion as an issue was their issue. the pro life forces had all the energy, and now that's switched. and each of those fox hosts more or less said it was a messaging problem. oh, we have to learn to talk about how abortion. there's nothing they can say that's going to make them right on abortion with the voters that have said to them any number of times, we don't want what you're serving. it's not messaging. we don't want it. >> and margaret, as someone who's followed these issues and politics writ large for a long time, are we seeing again the limits of talking about red or blue states? i mean, are some states that consistently go for one party, and that's why we say that, but then there's all these other place where is as life gets complicated and different choices emerge -- ohio's not a red state. trump won it twice. is in good position to win it again. are we seeing a limit there, kansas and other places not being red or blue on certain big issues? >> well, in turnout, the energy on turnout is with the blue pockets in the red states. because ohio's not even purple anymore. james would be able to give the statistics. but it's more red than it is blue, and it's trending more so. but look at how the vote went. you can see that if you get your turnout based on -- these were really animated voters, and in -- was it ohio? yes, it was ohio, frank la rosa who tried to make it a 60% referendum, and then the day after he put that out there, he announced he was running for the senate because he thought it was such a winner. it's a loser, and there's no way to talk about it to suburban women and suburban voters and independents that's going to change that. they now know that. and i don't see a way -- when you have somebody said to be as smart as glenn youngkin, and they find of knew how to treat trump more or less because he kept him at bay. >> yeah, in virginia, yeah. >> there's just no way around it, glenn youngkin is as smooth as they come, and he didn't find a way. in fact, he embraced it and dlernt halfway through that it wasn't going to work. >> yeah. it's fascinating and again, it's why we follow evidence in the votes, not all the other stuff. margaret carlson, as mentioned, a special booking on a big political night. james stays with me. part of our election coverage. james comes back as we look at the wider impact on the wins and biden, stunting. we have a guest who's advised so many candidates, including obama, and the fraud trial i mentioned, news on that and strikes i mentioned internationally. we have our shorter break. back with you in 60 seconds. ave. back with you in 60 seconds. in a crisis caused by a terrorist massacre. warning civilians to clear out, while hamas forces them back. allowing in food and water, which hamas steals. we're following breaking news from overseas. we can confirm tonight moments ago the united states pentagon confirming it has carried out a. i'm going read to you what the crary of defense said. a quote, today at president biden's direction, u.s. military forces conducted a self-defense strike on a facility in eas syria used by iran's islamic revolutionary oups. corps and affiliated the strike was conducted by two s.-15s. it goes on to say it was a series of attacks against syria in response to a seriesf attacks against u.s. personnel in iraq and syria by irgc and quds forces. that statement crossing the wire from the pentagon. we have a lot going on and want to make sure we learn what we can about this. elise lavitt is my special guest now. with tensions in the region so high, what does it mean that we are seeing these surgical strikes that are called defensive strikes? >> well, that's right, ari, the u.s. did a similar strike on, you know, very similar targets, also in eastern syria, also against iranian-backed and iranian-used facilities by the irgc for the exact same reason, because iranian proxies in syria, in iraq, are hitting u.s. personnel, u.s. facilities in eastern syria and iraq, and so once again, president biden is trying to contain iran, contain this from spreading further and saying, we really don't want to get into a war. this is not a very big attack, but it's just to say, stop it. and you know, the whole thing is the iranians are not stopping. there have been a couple dozen attacks over the last week or so, even after the u.s. did those attacks in the last few weeks, and. and u.s. officials say they're getting more dangerous, they're using more explosives. and so the u.s. is really step up its defenses, and that's why you saw that on one hand, the defense secretary is calling it a defensive strike, but it's really retaliatory. >> you say retaliatory. it's also designed to, as you're saying, meet the public vows biden made as policy, that there will be deterrence. this won't be open season because at the same time they've said they have no intention to have boots on the ground, even in a widening war. final question at the end of the statement, it also says, the u.s. prepared to take further necessary mikaela shiffrins to protect people and facilities, and quote, we urge against any further escalation. what is the biden administration trying to say there at the end of all this tonight? >> what they are trying to say is they don't want this to escalate, but if you push us further we'll have to get involved. the whole show of support and deterrence the u.s. has, they have two aircraft carriers in the region, war planes. there's no shortage of u.s. manpower in the region, so the u.s. can really ramp it up if it wants to. again, these attacks are not big, and u.s. has to calibrate how big they want those to be. they don't want to do anything to further escalate it. when they're choosing the targets they have to be big enough to make a differencing but small enough not to escalate any further. >> as you say, that is a tough line to walk, but not one they're opting out of. trying to do that in a statement unlike furtive activity reminds us clearly they're trying to announce and message this to adversaries in the region, including the danger posed by iran. we'll be monitoring that all night. there's also other stories here. ivanka trump taking the stand in the fraud trial. that's coming up. the republican candidates getting ready to square off against a much more difficult political environment. their voters want to hear how they would do something different in the losses they were just dealt yesterday. james carville has by all accounts been having a really good day. i think he had a good night, woke up in a good mood. that's what we can tell from our cam, and he's back with me on the wider imply weighs and why biden is stunting when we come back. stunting when we come back ywith fewer medicines. that's why i switched to dovato. dovato is a complete hiv treatment for some adults. no other complete hiv pill uses fewer medicines to help keep you undetectable than dovato. detect this: most hiv pills contain 3 or 4 medicines. dovato is as effective with just 2. if you have hepatitis b, don't stop dovato without talking to your doctor. don't take dovato if you're allergic to its ingredients or taking dofetilide. this can cause serious or life-threatening side effects. if you have a rash or allergic reaction symptoms, stop dovato and get medical help right away. serious or life-threatening lactic acid buildup and liver problems can occur. tell your doctor if you have kidney or liver problems or if you are pregnant, breastfeeding, or considering pregnancy. dovato may harm an unborn baby. most common side effects are headache, nausea, diarrhea, trouble sleeping, tiredness, and anxiety. detect this: i stay undetectable with fewer medicines. ask your doctor about switching to dovato. the chase ink business premier card is made for people like sam, who make- everyday products, designed smarter. like a smart coffee grinder, that orders fresh beans for you. oh, genius! for more breakthroughs like that- i need a breakthrough card. like ours! with 2.5% cash back on purchases of $5,000 or more. plus unlimited 2% cash back on all other purchases. and with greater spending potential, sam can keep making smart ideas- a brilliant reality! the ink business premier card from chase for business. make more of what's yours. hi, my name is damion clark. if you have both medicare and medicaid, i have some really encouraging news that you'll definitely want to hear. depending on the plans available in your area, you may be eligible to get extra benefits with a humana medicare advantage dual-eligible special needs plan. all of these plans include a healthy options allowance, a monthly allowance to help pay for eligible groceries, utilities, rent, and over-the-counter items. the healthy options allowance is loaded onto a prepaid card each month. and whatever you don't spend, carries over from each month. other benefits on these plans include free rides to and from your medical appointments. and our large networks of doctors, hospitals and pharmacies. so, call the number on your screen now and ask about a humana medicare advantage dual-eligible special needs plan. humana. a more human way to healthcare. my most important kitchen tool? 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"wall street journal" discussing how these abortion results put reblicans in a bind. our own nbc news talks about how it's a liability that will continue into next year. abc says this was a punishing night for republicans. a different article in the post said the republicans could, quote, blame themselves for what happened, their losses on tuesda then their local paper where is so many americans continue to get their ne, which track voter preferences for democratic and reform minded policies. we heard about marijuana in the senator. marijuana did well in conservative ohio, which means it's out of step in trump states. before i bring james back in i'm going to do something we knows all about, which is maps can tell the story. many parts of ohio which voted for trump in 2020, trump counties, also backed abortion rights. 18 trump counties yesterday. democrats have also been able to change the turnout inside these maps. so more liberals said yesterday they vehicle coded in ohio than 2020 as a share of the electorate. for democrats that's a motivation. there's also a warning there, because a larger 2024 electorate may revert back to the mix that favored trump. but republicans' plans are also, we should note, oppose by independents. 64% of ohio independents going for that abortion referendum. let me put it like this before i bring james back. elections always boil down to decisions. you decide to vote for one side, the other, or just not to vote at all. but there's no other magical option. it's just those things. and america has been facing a lot of tough decisions in our current politics, and plenty of people will tell you they think the choices are lacking. there are reports that plenty of people had concerned about president biden. even partisan democrats don't say he is their perfect ideal choice to run next year. but that statement, that reality and isolation is not a decision. it's more of a mood. and then it gets amplified across media and the internet into questions about whether democrats are running the right plays and a general agita, anxiety, that whole thing, even as democrats overperform trends in biden's first midterm election and state races on women's rights we have been covering tonight and now in new races that are driving all this news and the headlines about democrats dominating even amidst angst over biden. the president for his part taking a blunt victory lap last night away simple statement. maga lost, voters vote, polls don't. now let's go win next year. joe biden has plenty of experience. he doesn't claim to be the youngest hippest guy on the block, but right he is very clearly stunting, taking another victory lap and daring his party and his doubters to face what the voters actually said. because again, at the end of the day, it's about decisions. james carville is here. your thoughts, sir. >> well, first of all, if you listen to what senator santorum said, it's so illustrative. he thinks abortion rights are -- he thinks women or their families don't want to participate in decisions about their healthle he actually said this is some kind of political stunt people came up with and it's -- i news for you, dude, it's not an't stunt. it's real to people. they're trying to tell you that. there is no chance -- remember, he's the first vest guy, went around with a red vest, right-wing theo cratic nonsense, and glenn youngkin caught up on that. these people work me like a rented mule, which rented mules work really hard, and i loved what andy did and what they did in virginia, but i'm still hurting about mississippi. but you know what? i'll get back up and go out there and plow again. but we had a good night. they don't understand. this is not a stunt. this is real to people. rick santorum will never understand that ever. >> hmm. i want to always be careful, because you do have an agrarian edge. sometimes we talk about a goat. people say a goat is greatest of all time. there are people who think their favorite politician is the g-o-a-t, goat. you mentioned the mule. i guess the question is, respectfully, is joe biden emerging as this labor powerful, resilient force? more mule like than show pony? and even you -- we've talked about on this program -- and others have said, i don't know. has he quieted the doubters today, or is this about something more than him? >> first of all, he's a very dutiful, hard working guy who stays focused. he's had a remarkable career. i really -- if you talk to these campaigns, i don't think he was a factor. they tried to run against him, and it didn't work. it was not what voters were concerned about. do doubts remain about the president's age? yeah. how can any sane person say that this is not an issue. the party does listen. people will rally behind it. but to say this does not make me into a bedwetter or whatever, loser. i mean, i understand all that. >> did someone call you a bedwetter, james? >> huh? >> has someone calls you that? >> i think yeah, they've called me a bedwetter on any number of occasions. i'm not offended by it at all. if you think calling me a bedwetter is going make me change my mind, i don't think you know who i am. you can't say there's not concerns on the part of voters and concerns on the part of democrats and the president's got to continue -- >> let me give you a data point on that. that's what we love about you. every time we have these conversations, they're about the facts. they're not about the wet linens, the wet sheets, whatever that would be. they're about the facts. here's a number. i saw this, i read this today. i'm curious where you're going to come down. the number is democrats outperforming historic biden numbers. so we'll put this up. politico had this in one after their breakdowns that was pretty interesting. compare to the 2020 victory by biden, democrat candidates in special elections this year had been running about 8 points better on average. so, do you read that as, a, they're outperforming biden and these are special electorates, or b, a kind of inoffensive kind of respectable kind of calm democrat in the white house allows democrats to do well. in other words, are they going to be doing this well next year? >> you know, the truth of the matter is i don't know. there's a doctrine that's out that's fashionable called political calvinism. everything is predestined. you're going to win this state, lose this state. this is what's going to happen. there are no surprises in american politics. it's just a straight line, and when you have a one-on-one choice of biden and trump, people at the end of the day are going to choose biden. maybe third parties, fourth parties, fifth parties, indictments, strokes, heart attacks. i just don't believe in predestination. i don't. i think events matter in politics. i think candidates matter. i think events matter. but i am not the trendy new person, i am told by people who are a lot more educated than me, you don't understand. this is what's going to happen. we all know this. if i express some doubt about uncertainty of politics and life, that's what i really believe. >> the calvinism, james, you know what the kids all that. >> what do the kids call it? >> they call it manifesting. you say you're going to manifest the white house re-election. you're just going to manifest it, and then it will be. you just make it into reality. you're reminding everyone that even the best data trend lines and everything else, there's a whole bunch of uncertainty but we're living through what's going on around the world. living through the trials. the president could beat a case, former president could beat a case and people could flock to that, or he could have two convictions and potentially incarcerated. as we take it in all together, going into the debate tonight, what do you see as the two parties' responses to these results? i said the president is taking an earned victory lapel republicans tonight have a challenge. boy, oh boy, are they aware. even on fox "even", they are hearing, hey, they lost. >> so, the biggest uncovered story is the pro-life people have quit. they've thrown in the towel. glenn youngkin said i'm for only a ban after 15 weeks with exceptions. okay, that's -- roe was the first -- that's three weeks more than the trimester. the problem is no one believes them. they have lied so much. frank larose, when i go to ohio, see me. i'm going to set up a camera so he can get me on tape talking about what a liar you are. so please come to cleveland january. i'm sure senator brown can put it out. have your tracker come up to me. i'll have full protection. there will be them, we'll be nice to them. >> you got to tell me what a campaign tracker is. >> so, it's a sendout people on the hope that somebody says something like, really stupid. famous guy in virginia with george fallon, you know, said something or -- >> said an epithet, yeah. >> they always send the tracker. don't be secretive. come to me. we'll put you right in the front row. we'll say, let's get this guy a seat right next to it. you're more than welcome to watch me call your boss a conniving liar, because that's exactly what he is. >> james carville coming in hot on the record. >> coming in hot, dude! >> mules, no bedwetting, and if you want to track james carville, come on out. we appreciate you joining us on the big night, sir. >> always appreciate it, ari. bye-bye. >> yes, sir. we got a lot more coming up. the fraud trial. ivanka trump under oath today. republican candidates have a lot on their plates tonight. we have a renowned debate expert. bar barnett with me in studio next. y, what's going on? 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(carolers) ♪ we tried to tell him but he paid us a lot... ♪ (husband) it was a lot... ♪ mhmmm ♪ (vo) this holiday turn any iphone, in any condition, into a new iphone 15 pro with titanium, apple tv 4k, and six months of apple one. all three on us. it's holiday everyday with verizon. hey, while you're there, grab more delectables. you know, that lickable cat treat. de-licka what? delectables. delickables? delectables. delickable delectables. yes, just hurry! hm. it must be delicious. got it. delectables lickable treat. ♪ deliciously de-lick-able delectables ♪ it is debate night in america with even higher stakes amidst these new republican losses. >> miami heat. five candidates taking center stage in tonight's republican presidential debate. >> if i were betting where the action would be tonight i'm watching the podiums between haley and ron desantis. >> the result of last night's election are going to come front and center in tonight's debate. >> how are they going to handle this tough moment for the gop? >> this third republican presidential primary debate takes place in miami. those are the lecterns. it's a smaller grown up of republicans than the last ones. five candidates qualifying. trump skipping. we turn now to one of the foremost debate experts in the nation. bob barnett coached ten campaigns on strategy from clinton to obama, played a key role in prep and played republicans like bush, cheney, and then sanders in some of those practice debates. you can see some examples there, which is why he's been on this and other channels many times. that history is relevant. as is a full disclosure, bob was also my literary author for the foreword i wrote to the january 6th report. thank you very much for coming back. >> glad to be back, and always glad to follow carville, which i have been doing since 1992. >> experience teaches wisdom. everybody had a plan for these debates. carville mentioned some politicians on the right thought they were going to do better than they did yesterday. what happens to those republican plans as they run into the disappointment for the republican party yesterday? >> i think we have three good moderators. and i think that they're going to cover what happened. that's the question. and they're going to try to force these five people, soon to be three, i think, to talk about how they deal with the abortion issue, because it's clear that is running very favorably for the democratic candidates, all over the country from kansas to ohio, and i think that they're going to have to reckon with the government shutdown, with the two wars that are going on. all these things, if the moderators are good, and i think they will be, these candidates will have to address. >> the mood in these debates, as you know, bob, is quite different than primaries because of this rare situation that you have, a former president front-runner skipping the debates. it's still a big deal. in all objectivity, whether we think these are great moderators or not, trump has tried to make these debates essentially less important. how would that change in your expertise the strategy of these candidates. >> he has made them less important. let's face up to that fact. without the front runner on the stage it's a very different debate. i think these candidates are going to have to make a fundamental decision. i'll tell you what that is and i'll tell you what i would do -- they could just dump on each other. cross the table, cross the podium, try to score points. i don't think people like that. i think people are tired of that. if i were advising them, i would say, talk about -- certainly draw your contrast with trump. you got to do that. otherwise try to say what you're for, what you'd do, how you would be president, and all this sort of quotable quotes and trying to, as the kids say, diss each other. i don't think that works. it will be interesting to -- >> bob barnett using the word diss. >> i got that from my grandchildren. >> you know what that comes from? >> tell me. >> disrespect. >> of course. i thought you were going to say greek. >> i'm not that fancy. so, yeah, you say don't just get into that dissing matching but they're also running out of time. the you're not a junky, not in it the way some of us are following it, you'd be like, is that a debate? don't we have a listening time. '24 is a long ways away. but on a political calendar we have nontrump presidential hopefuls face the ticking clock. that's how one outlet put it. this is interesting. only 68 days until voters start casting ballots in the republican primary. so while the country is busy with other things, this actually, this clock right now would favor the front-runner, no? >> yes, by a long shot. it will be very hard to knock off donald trump in the republican primary process, but surprises have happened as james pointed out. i think these candidates, these five people are going to have different motives. they all want to get the nomination, but there are some up there who would like to be the one alternative. there are some up there who would like to be vice president. there are some up there who would like to further their future political career, maybe be in the cabinet or whatever, and there are some up there who want to increase their speech fees. >> right. >> we're running out of time. the last question the hardest to answer because i know you love all your friends and clients, but i got ask you, who was the best at debating? not everything, but just debating, that you worked with, and of the five tonight who do you think has been the best so far? >> can i quote james carville? he used to say bill clinton was a thorough bred. that guy was unbelievable during the primaries, during the generals. i worked with a lot of them, and all of them have their own strengths, own abilities, but bill clinton was probably the champ of all time. >> among these on stage? >> nikki haley. she's a friend of mine. i don't agree with her much, but -- >> you seem to have a lot of friends in politics. >> i try. >> that's gone out of style. >> i know. >> you think even if you weren't someone who knows her, why has she been effective? >> i think ses experienced, she's smart, he's a woman, she has carefully walked the fine line trump v. nontrump, taking possessions with respect to where trump is, and of those, i think he's done the best over the course of the debates. i would think she would be tonight, but she's still way behind. >> yeah. bob, we always appreciate your straight talk and your experience. thank you. >> nice to be with you. >> good to have you. bob barnett. up next, we turn to the fraud trial where ivanka's under oath. . ride it out with the tradeoffs of treating? or push through the pain and symptoms? with ubrelvy, there's another option. one dose works fast to eliminate migraine pain treat it anytime, anywhere. without worrying where you are or if it's too late. do not take with strong cyp3a4 inhibitors. allergic reactions to ubrelvy can happen. most common side effects were nausea and sleepiness. migraine pain relief starts with u. ask about ubrelvy. learn how abbvie could help you save. get help reaching your goals with j.p. morgan wealth plan, a digital money coach in the chase mobile® app. use it to set and track your goals, big and small... and see how changes you make today... could help put them within reach. from your first big move to retiring poolside - and the other goals along the way. wealth plan can help get you there. ♪ j.p. morgan wealth management. 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[ting] ♪♪ live in the moment. ask your doctor about otezla. there's more news in the donald trump fraud trial today because his daughter, ivanka, took the witness stand. nbc reporting she seemed, quote, poised as she began her testimony. she was friendly and more willing to engage with the attorney general's lawyers than some other witnesses. also at times was described as soft spoken, indeed the judge had to ask her to speak up. a little different when he had to tell one of her brothers to slow down. but as the testimony went on, she followed a pattern that we told you about earlier,here she does talk but she doesn't always say much. it was a kind of evasive day on the stand. asked about documents shown to her, she said she didn't recal them. and that was her answer for documents that she herself wrote. she saidhe had no role whatsoever in financial statements. ote, i had no involvement in his statement of financial condition and don't know the valuations that were taken into account. she is not a defendant in this case. unlike those siblings i mentioned. the new york attorney general maintains that ivanka was involved with parts of what they claim, what they are trying as a fraud. and james mentioned that outside court today. >> this case is about fraudulent statements of financial condition that she benefitted from. the documents do not lie. the numbers do not lie. and despite the fact that she was very, very nice and very friendly, the facts basically demonstrate the truth. >> we have no reason to think it was on purpose, but the attorney general coming very close to the famous line, men lie, women lie, numbers don't. as she made the point that the underlying numbers are quite different than perhaps some of the fraud or lies that they think they've been basically shovelled by the trump org. we can tell you the judge is denying request from trump's lawyers to block ivanka from being asked about emails with her husband. they were sent from a work email account so they are not entitled to spousal privilege. now, the defense also cross-examined ivanka emotions got a little more heightened. we told you in these cases we have them going in and out of court. we don't have video inside. we're giving you the highlights. so there was some heightened emotion and ivanka tried to hold the line but the judge and the defense lawyers got a little more into it and the judge said one of the trump defense lawyers questions reached the point of being, quote, ridiculous. so, take it all together and what you have here is, one of the people who, according to the government, benefits from what is they say an alleged fraud. taking the questions, being quite frankly more sort of civil, even rhetorically cooperative than some of her brothers but ultimately trying to duck any really specific answers about why for so many years, so many things that the trump org was selling didn't add up. the attorneys on the trump side will begin their defense on monday and we'll be right back. monday and we'll be right ckba moderate to severe eczema still disrupts my skin. despite treatment it disrupts my skin with itch. it disrupts my skin with rash. but now, i can disrupt eczema with rinvoq. rinvoq is not a steroid, topical, or injection. it's one pill, once a day. many taking rinvoq saw clear or almost-clear skin while some saw up to 100% clear skin. and, they felt dramatic and fast itch relief some as early as 2 days. that's rinvoq relief. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. serious infections and blood clots, some fatal, cancers including lymphoma and skin cancer, death, heart attack, stroke, and tears in the stomach or intestines occurred. people 50 and older with at least one heart disease risk factor have higher risks. don't take if allergic to rinvoq, as serious reactions can occur. tell your doctor if you are or may become pregnant. disrupt the itch and rash of eczema. talk to your doctor about rinvoq. learn how abbvie can help you save. at humana, we believe your healthcare should evolve with you, and part of that evolution means choosing the right medicare plan for you. humana can help. with original medicare you're covered for hospital stays and doctor office visits, but you'll have to pay a deductible for each. a medicare supplement plan pays for some or all of your original medicare deductibles, but they may have higher monthly premiums and no prescription drug coverage. humana medicare advantage prescription drug plans include medical coverage, plus prescription drug coverage. and coverage for dental, vision, and hearing, all wrapped up into one convenient plan. plus, there's a cap on your out-of-pocket costs! 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